Battlestar Galactica: It's Frakking Over; The Plan coming this fall
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sendme
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Yeah I wish they had an explanation for them also. However the ones of Caprica and Gaius they do somewhat say what they were. I could have done with out that of the future. I at first wanted to see what the future was but now I almost wish I didn't.
[quote name='bigdaddy']Not even close to the best finale ever.
They were angels played by God. The ending should have had only Six walking around and then you see a nuke go off.[/QUOTE]
Why the hell would you want that. The ending was great but like I said I think I could have done with out the future. However I also think had they not shown that I would be saying I wish they would have.
[quote name='bigdaddy']Not even close to the best finale ever.
They were angels played by God. The ending should have had only Six walking around and then you see a nuke go off.[/QUOTE]
Why the hell would you want that. The ending was great but like I said I think I could have done with out the future. However I also think had they not shown that I would be saying I wish they would have.
bigdaddy
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Well I'm glad they didn't explain God because no one knows what God is, and I think that is the point.
And if the nuke went off in the future all this has happened before and all this will happen again. Plus it would have made more sense because then Kara would have lead the humans 150,000 years ago to their death in our time.
However I was expecting worse, so it was a fun fun ride!
Still, Six Feet Under, TNG, and West Wing beat BSG for finales.
And if the nuke went off in the future all this has happened before and all this will happen again. Plus it would have made more sense because then Kara would have lead the humans 150,000 years ago to their death in our time.
However I was expecting worse, so it was a fun fun ride!
Still, Six Feet Under, TNG, and West Wing beat BSG for finales.
What a great episode. We got some great highs (one last space battle SFX extravaganza, finding Earth and spending time on it), some really sad and touching moments (Laura dying, the fleet flying into the sun) and a very memorable ending.
I never expected the head people to actually be angels. I guess head Six wasn't lying when she was always telling Baltar she was an angel of God.
I never expected the head people to actually be angels. I guess head Six wasn't lying when she was always telling Baltar she was an angel of God.
bigdaddy
Banned
I just posted this elsewhere but it would make for a great miniseries!
BSG 2010! John's (Cavil's) Forces finally reach Earth after 150,000 years and is still REALLY pissed off and blows Earth to hell, thus starting the whole thing over! This time through there will be time travel and flying motorbikes.
BSG 2010! John's (Cavil's) Forces finally reach Earth after 150,000 years and is still REALLY pissed off and blows Earth to hell, thus starting the whole thing over! This time through there will be time travel and flying motorbikes.
TruthinessFC
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Great finale overall, I liked how they got to Earth and all in the end. Didn't care for how Bill Adama and Galen basically went off to die alone.. in some ways it makes sense because of what they went through, but I just didn't like that ending for those two. Also wasn't a huge fan of how they left all their technology and stuff behind.. but whatever.
We're probably lucky something this good wasn't cancelled early on the way tv is going.
Also, that Caprica preview did not impress me much.. I'll probably give it a chance anyway but it looks kinda boring by comparison.
We're probably lucky something this good wasn't cancelled early on the way tv is going.
Also, that Caprica preview did not impress me much.. I'll probably give it a chance anyway but it looks kinda boring by comparison.
[quote name='bigdaddy']Was he the last Cavil?[/quote]
I doubt it but he was the leader who had been giving them problems throughout the series.
Of course a number of basestars were away from the colony and I'm sure they had some forces on the 13 colonies and Kobol but I would imagine the majority of the Cylon population died when the colony was hit with all those nukes and the rest died of old age since they never got ressurection technology.
I doubt it but he was the leader who had been giving them problems throughout the series.
Of course a number of basestars were away from the colony and I'm sure they had some forces on the 13 colonies and Kobol but I would imagine the majority of the Cylon population died when the colony was hit with all those nukes and the rest died of old age since they never got ressurection technology.
[quote name='bigdaddy']^ They did get part of it, maybe they figured out the rest. [/quote]
The fact that they had resurrection ships for 40 years and never figured out how they worked gives me doubts the survivors could figure it out even with part of the data.
[/quote]The fact that they had resurrection ships for 40 years and never figured out how they worked gives me doubts the survivors could figure it out even with part of the data.
sendme
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[quote name='TruthinessFC']Great finale overall, I liked how they got to Earth and all in the end. Didn't care for how Bill Adama and Galen basically went off to die alone.. in some ways it makes sense because of what they went through, but I just didn't like that ending for those two. Also wasn't a huge fan of how they left all their technology and stuff behind.. but whatever.
We're probably lucky something this good wasn't cancelled early on the way tv is going.
Also, that Caprica preview did not impress me much.. I'll probably give it a chance anyway but it looks kinda boring by comparison.[/QUOTE]
At first I didn't like the bit with the technology and how Lee was left with out his father and Starbuck. However I'm glad they did what they did with the technology and I think it was good what they did William Adama. I'm also glad they did explane what Starbuck was after she went to the first earth. I still don't get what the harbiter of death thing was all about.
As for Caprica I will check it out but I too am not impressed by it much at all. I do want to see Battlestar Galactica: The Plan and from what imdb.com says it will be out in June.
We're probably lucky something this good wasn't cancelled early on the way tv is going.
Also, that Caprica preview did not impress me much.. I'll probably give it a chance anyway but it looks kinda boring by comparison.[/QUOTE]
At first I didn't like the bit with the technology and how Lee was left with out his father and Starbuck. However I'm glad they did what they did with the technology and I think it was good what they did William Adama. I'm also glad they did explane what Starbuck was after she went to the first earth. I still don't get what the harbiter of death thing was all about.
As for Caprica I will check it out but I too am not impressed by it much at all. I do want to see Battlestar Galactica: The Plan and from what imdb.com says it will be out in June.
[quote name='sendme']Well they did say that Roslin would take them to Earth and she did. However if I remember correctly they also said she would die before they got there and she died after they got to Earth.[/quote]
That could of meant the Galactica itself, which pretty much died when into jumped into Earth's solar system.
That could of meant the Galactica itself, which pretty much died when into jumped into Earth's solar system.
Revenantae
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My only real complaint is that I wanted to see the Galactica go down in a fight, as a warship ought... she deserved better than a trip into the sun for her final flight.
Dante Devil
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I didn't think they could pull it off, but I loved it.
[quote name='Dunvane']Starbuck wasn't a head person; if she were, she couldn't have killed people in all of those episodes where she was running around with a gun.[/quote]
Since it turns out that head people are actually angels it's not that hard to believe the could interact with the world if they wanted to.
Earlier this season they showed head six picking up Baltar after he was knocked down by marines and moving him towards the marines, so we know they can interact with the world if they want to, but they rarely do.
Of course Starbuck didn't seem to know what she was, so she was constantly interacting with things. I'm guessing that when she died her soul was basically resurrected into an angel body. The reason she just disappeared was because he job was done.
Since it turns out that head people are actually angels it's not that hard to believe the could interact with the world if they wanted to.
Earlier this season they showed head six picking up Baltar after he was knocked down by marines and moving him towards the marines, so we know they can interact with the world if they want to, but they rarely do.
Of course Starbuck didn't seem to know what she was, so she was constantly interacting with things. I'm guessing that when she died her soul was basically resurrected into an angel body. The reason she just disappeared was because he job was done.
thrustbucket
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Guess we all kind of expected that we wouldn't get a full technical explanation of Starbuck. It would have been nice to know exactly how she came back, complete with new viper. It also would have been nice to know if she was "special" before she died, in any way.
I read an interview with Katee Sackhoff where they asked her if there was anything she didn't like about the way the series ended. Her answer was that she felt Starbuck and Leoban's relationship was never really concluded. After seeing the finale, I can agree. It just fell by the wayside.
Everything else seemed just fine in the finale. I was very happy to see them tie in Earth.
So, just so I know I'm on the right page though, Six and Baltar in Manhattan at the end were the "angels", right? I didn't quite get Baltars comment that "God" didn't like being called that. -- I think RDM really just wants the fans to conclude, on their own, who the angels/gods are. Likely related to the lords of kobol. But in a way, it makes sense they didn't explain it any further, as the series, and especially the finale, was all about the characters.
Oh and seeing RDM holding the national geographic at the end was a bit jarring, but amusing.
Edit: Oh and it's worth mentioning that Bear McCreary did an outstanding job with the new music this episode.
I read an interview with Katee Sackhoff where they asked her if there was anything she didn't like about the way the series ended. Her answer was that she felt Starbuck and Leoban's relationship was never really concluded. After seeing the finale, I can agree. It just fell by the wayside.
Everything else seemed just fine in the finale. I was very happy to see them tie in Earth.
So, just so I know I'm on the right page though, Six and Baltar in Manhattan at the end were the "angels", right? I didn't quite get Baltars comment that "God" didn't like being called that. -- I think RDM really just wants the fans to conclude, on their own, who the angels/gods are. Likely related to the lords of kobol. But in a way, it makes sense they didn't explain it any further, as the series, and especially the finale, was all about the characters.
Oh and seeing RDM holding the national geographic at the end was a bit jarring, but amusing.
Edit: Oh and it's worth mentioning that Bear McCreary did an outstanding job with the new music this episode.
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thrustbucket
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Here are some answers, found here, directly from the creators:
What was Starbuck?
Moore: Kara is what you want her to be. It’s easy to put the label on her of “angel” or “messenger of God” or something like that. Kara Thrace died and was resurrected and came back and took the people to their final end. That was her role, her destiny in the show… We debated back and forth in the writers’ room about giving it more clarity and saying definitively what she is. We decided that the more you try to put a name on it, the less interesting it became, and we just decided this was the most interesting way for her to go out, with her just disappearing and [leave people wondering exactly what she was].
Are there still Cylons left on the colony? Did the Colony survive?
Moore: The final [cut] came out a little less clear on that than I intended…. It was scripted and the idea was that when Racetrack hits the nukes—the nukes come in and smack into the colony—it takes the colony out of the stream that was swirling around the singularity and [the colony] fell in and was destroyed. I think as we went through the [editing process], when we kept cutting frames and doing this and that, one of the things that became less apparent was that the colony was doomed. The intention was that everyone who was aboard the colony would perish.
In the last scene, are “Six” and “Baltar” angels or demons?
Moore: I think they’re both. We never try to name exactly what the “Head” characters are—we called them “Head Baltar” and “Head Six” all throughout the show, internally. We never really looked at them as angels or demons because they seemed to periodically say evil things and good things, they tended to save people and they tended to damn people. There was this sense that they worked in service of something else. You could say “a higher power” or you could say “another power,” [but] they were in service to something else that was guiding and helping, sometimes obstructing, and sometimes tempting the people on the show. The idea at the very end was that whatever they are in service to continues and is eternal and is always around. And they too are still around…and with all of us who are the children of Hera. They continue to walk among us and watch, and at some point they may or may not intercede at a key moment.
What was Starbuck?
Moore: Kara is what you want her to be. It’s easy to put the label on her of “angel” or “messenger of God” or something like that. Kara Thrace died and was resurrected and came back and took the people to their final end. That was her role, her destiny in the show… We debated back and forth in the writers’ room about giving it more clarity and saying definitively what she is. We decided that the more you try to put a name on it, the less interesting it became, and we just decided this was the most interesting way for her to go out, with her just disappearing and [leave people wondering exactly what she was].
Are there still Cylons left on the colony? Did the Colony survive?
Moore: The final [cut] came out a little less clear on that than I intended…. It was scripted and the idea was that when Racetrack hits the nukes—the nukes come in and smack into the colony—it takes the colony out of the stream that was swirling around the singularity and [the colony] fell in and was destroyed. I think as we went through the [editing process], when we kept cutting frames and doing this and that, one of the things that became less apparent was that the colony was doomed. The intention was that everyone who was aboard the colony would perish.
In the last scene, are “Six” and “Baltar” angels or demons?
Moore: I think they’re both. We never try to name exactly what the “Head” characters are—we called them “Head Baltar” and “Head Six” all throughout the show, internally. We never really looked at them as angels or demons because they seemed to periodically say evil things and good things, they tended to save people and they tended to damn people. There was this sense that they worked in service of something else. You could say “a higher power” or you could say “another power,” [but] they were in service to something else that was guiding and helping, sometimes obstructing, and sometimes tempting the people on the show. The idea at the very end was that whatever they are in service to continues and is eternal and is always around. And they too are still around…and with all of us who are the children of Hera. They continue to walk among us and watch, and at some point they may or may not intercede at a key moment.
[quote name='sendme']Well I have to say this is the best series final I have seen.
. Only thing I don't get is what was all that about starbuck being the harbiter of death. Nothing as of now seems to have had anything to do with that.[/QUOTE]
Maybe she was called that because she ended the cycle. I'd have to say they dropped the ball there
I like how they did make it to earth and that it was the earth from the past
Maybe she was called that because she ended the cycle. I'd have to say they dropped the ball there
Few random complaints.
The whole Starbuck as harbinger of death bit seemed to go out with the bathwater unless one makes a very liberal reading of that phrase. And her Batman exit was trite and unfulfilling.
The montage of robots at the end was rather corny. As were Head-Baltar and Head-Six bashing the audience over the head with the moral of the story. In fact, their attitude of "we're bound to get it right sooner or later" pretty much undercuts the whole point thereof: God, it would seem, is playing dice with the universe.
Tyrol just can't help but make things worse as usual. And the payoff of Cally's death was contrived at best.
Also, if it were so easy to
ing negotiate you think they would've tried it before the hugely unneccessary military operation.
That said, the sentiment came off well and everything wrapped up nicely more or less. A satisfactory ending, if there is such a thing.
The whole Starbuck as harbinger of death bit seemed to go out with the bathwater unless one makes a very liberal reading of that phrase. And her Batman exit was trite and unfulfilling.
The montage of robots at the end was rather corny. As were Head-Baltar and Head-Six bashing the audience over the head with the moral of the story. In fact, their attitude of "we're bound to get it right sooner or later" pretty much undercuts the whole point thereof: God, it would seem, is playing dice with the universe.
Tyrol just can't help but make things worse as usual. And the payoff of Cally's death was contrived at best.
Also, if it were so easy to
ing negotiate you think they would've tried it before the hugely unneccessary military operation.That said, the sentiment came off well and everything wrapped up nicely more or less. A satisfactory ending, if there is such a thing.
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deszaras
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[quote name='SpeedyG']Am I the only one disappointed in this?[/quote]
Nope, I'm with you on it. Considering how shaky this whole season felt, the finale was relatively good though. That's not saying I don't have any complaints.
-The importance of Hera still seems tacked on with little emphasis except for a reason for the final battle.
-I didn't like the resolution between Lee and Starbuck. I had been wanting them to get together for good for most of the series and the ending really left me disappointed. I agree it seemed the whole "harbinger of death" thing got totally swept under the rug.
-The resurgence Caprica/Baltar thing seemed rushed as well.
With those complaints, I thought how the incorporated the musical notes was awesome and what happened to Tori was a great payoff.
Nope, I'm with you on it. Considering how shaky this whole season felt, the finale was relatively good though. That's not saying I don't have any complaints.
-The importance of Hera still seems tacked on with little emphasis except for a reason for the final battle.
-I didn't like the resolution between Lee and Starbuck. I had been wanting them to get together for good for most of the series and the ending really left me disappointed. I agree it seemed the whole "harbinger of death" thing got totally swept under the rug.
-The resurgence Caprica/Baltar thing seemed rushed as well.
With those complaints, I thought how the incorporated the musical notes was awesome and what happened to Tori was a great payoff.
bigdaddy
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[quote name='Kaijufan']I'm thinking that it meant that she would destroy their way of life. After all prophecies rarely have a literal meaning.[/quote]
No, the writers didn't have anig clue what they were doing and just didn't bother bringing it up.
Just look at the interview with Moore. "Kara is whatever you want her to be", that's a lame ass way of saying "weed the whole show up so badly we didn't know what to make her, so you decide".
No, the writers didn't have a
nig clue what they were doing and just didn't bother bringing it up.Just look at the interview with Moore. "Kara is whatever you want her to be", that's a lame ass way of saying "we
ed the whole show up so badly we didn't know what to make her, so you decide".thrustbucket
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Many of you complainers just flat our haven't been paying attention.
From Kara Thrace Wiki.
A Cylon Hybrid, speaking to Major Kendra Shaw moments before their deaths, warns her that Thrace is the herald of the apocalypse and the harbinger of death (which she was, for cylons), that she would lead the human race to its end (which she did, to our Earth).
From Kara Thrace Wiki.
A Cylon Hybrid, speaking to Major Kendra Shaw moments before their deaths, warns her that Thrace is the herald of the apocalypse and the harbinger of death (which she was, for cylons), that she would lead the human race to its end (which she did, to our Earth).
[quote name='thrustbucket']Many of you complainers just flat our haven't been paying attention.
From Kara Thrace Wiki.
A Cylon Hybrid, speaking to Major Kendra Shaw moments before their deaths, warns her that Thrace is the herald of the apocalypse and the harbinger of death (which she was, for cylons), that she would lead the human race to its end (which she did, to our Earth).[/QUOTE]
There are plenty of Cylons still alive at the end of the series doing the exact same shit they were doing before, so I don't see how that an apocalypse makes. And, again, it takes a very specific reading to divide the phrase like that and apply only part of it to humans; yours ignores its explicit meaning in favor of a metaphysical one that's a bit tenuous.
From Kara Thrace Wiki.
A Cylon Hybrid, speaking to Major Kendra Shaw moments before their deaths, warns her that Thrace is the herald of the apocalypse and the harbinger of death (which she was, for cylons), that she would lead the human race to its end (which she did, to our Earth).[/QUOTE]
There are plenty of Cylons still alive at the end of the series doing the exact same shit they were doing before, so I don't see how that an apocalypse makes. And, again, it takes a very specific reading to divide the phrase like that and apply only part of it to humans; yours ignores its explicit meaning in favor of a metaphysical one that's a bit tenuous.
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[quote name='evanft']It isn't a stretch to say that harbinger of death has more than one completely literal meaning.[/QUOTE]
Yes, it is. I think you're confusing literal meaning with metaphorical meaning.
Excellent example of the pot calling the kettle black. I'm not arguing it means or should mean anything specific, I just found the above parsing of the phrase contrary to the very "doom and gloom" tone that had surrounded it for most of the series.
Put simply, the concept of an end/apocalypse doesn't really fit with the whole "grand cycle" motif that pervades the rest of the series and becomes its ultimate resting point. They just don't mix. So, to try to reconcile them just doesn't work, which is why I say the concept of Starbuck as the end seems to have been abandoned somewhere.
Think of it this way: What, if anything, would have been lost thematically without the hybrid's prophecy?
Yes, it is. I think you're confusing literal meaning with metaphorical meaning.
To bitch and whine about it because it doesn't fit exactly what you want it to is
Excellent example of the pot calling the kettle black. I'm not arguing it means or should mean anything specific, I just found the above parsing of the phrase contrary to the very "doom and gloom" tone that had surrounded it for most of the series.
Put simply, the concept of an end/apocalypse doesn't really fit with the whole "grand cycle" motif that pervades the rest of the series and becomes its ultimate resting point. They just don't mix. So, to try to reconcile them just doesn't work, which is why I say the concept of Starbuck as the end seems to have been abandoned somewhere.
Think of it this way: What, if anything, would have been lost thematically without the hybrid's prophecy?
[quote name='Magus8472']There are plenty of Cylons still alive at the end of the series doing the exact same shit they were doing before, so I don't see how that an apocalypse makes.[/quote]
There might be plenty of them left in Colonial space but they don't have resurrection tech and can't biologically reproduce within their own group, so I'd say they're pretty finished, even if it might take several decades for all of them to die off.
One thing I was left wondering after a few hours of contemplation, what do the free Centurions end up doing? They're presumably immortal and appear to be at least partially sentient so surely they'd come up with some interesting things in 150,000 years.
There might be plenty of them left in Colonial space but they don't have resurrection tech and can't biologically reproduce within their own group, so I'd say they're pretty finished, even if it might take several decades for all of them to die off.
One thing I was left wondering after a few hours of contemplation, what do the free Centurions end up doing? They're presumably immortal and appear to be at least partially sentient so surely they'd come up with some interesting things in 150,000 years.
[quote name='Magus8472']Yes, it is. I think you're confusing literal meaning with metaphorical meaning.[/quote]
Ah, I must have worded it incorrectly. I meant there can be multiple meanings, not necessarily just one literal one.
[quote name='Magus8472']Excellent example of the pot calling the kettle black. I'm not arguing it means or should mean anything specific, I just found the above parsing of the phrase contrary to the very "doom and gloom" tone that had surrounded it for most of the series.
Put simply, the concept of an end/apocalypse doesn't really fit with the whole "grand cycle" motif that pervades the rest of the series and becomes its ultimate resting point. They just don't mix. So, to try to reconcile them just doesn't work, which is why I say the concept of Starbuck as the end seems to have been abandoned somewhere.
Think of it this way: What, if anything, would have been lost thematically without the hybrid's prophecy?[/quote]
Starbuck lead them to the end of their journey, their way of life, and the end of Cylon civilization. Each one of these can be taken as her being the harbinger of death. The end/apocalypse is ambiguous enough that it can be any number of things. I mean, if they had found earth, started over, and then you see in a flash forward that they rebuilt Cylons which then bombed the out of them all over again, you could interpret this as being due to Starbuck taking them there, thus making her the harbinger of death.
Ah, I must have worded it incorrectly. I meant there can be multiple meanings, not necessarily just one literal one.
[quote name='Magus8472']Excellent example of the pot calling the kettle black. I'm not arguing it means or should mean anything specific, I just found the above parsing of the phrase contrary to the very "doom and gloom" tone that had surrounded it for most of the series.
Put simply, the concept of an end/apocalypse doesn't really fit with the whole "grand cycle" motif that pervades the rest of the series and becomes its ultimate resting point. They just don't mix. So, to try to reconcile them just doesn't work, which is why I say the concept of Starbuck as the end seems to have been abandoned somewhere.
Think of it this way: What, if anything, would have been lost thematically without the hybrid's prophecy?[/quote]
Starbuck lead them to the end of their journey, their way of life, and the end of Cylon civilization. Each one of these can be taken as her being the harbinger of death. The end/apocalypse is ambiguous enough that it can be any number of things. I mean, if they had found earth, started over, and then you see in a flash forward that they rebuilt Cylons which then bombed the
out of them all over again, you could interpret this as being due to Starbuck taking them there, thus making her the harbinger of death.
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thrustbucket
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[quote name='Pirate331']There might be plenty of them left in Colonial space but they don't have resurrection tech and can't biologically reproduce within their own group, so I'd say they're pretty finished, even if it might take several decades for all of them to die off.
[/QUOTE]
Correct. The Cylons were finished, as a race. The colony was destroyed and the Cylons on earth couldn't reproduce and died. Thus, Starbuck certainly was the harbinger of their death.
What the hybrid said was most deffinately split into two parts. One for cylons, the second for humans. Cylons death, Humans end (which can be taken a number of ways - not just that they all go extinct. It was the end of their civilization, end of their journey, end of their way of life).
It's stretch to say what the hybrid said should have meant anything differently.
[/QUOTE]
Correct. The Cylons were finished, as a race. The colony was destroyed and the Cylons on earth couldn't reproduce and died. Thus, Starbuck certainly was the harbinger of their death.
What the hybrid said was most deffinately split into two parts. One for cylons, the second for humans. Cylons death, Humans end (which can be taken a number of ways - not just that they all go extinct. It was the end of their civilization, end of their journey, end of their way of life).
It's stretch to say what the hybrid said should have meant anything differently.
[quote name='thrustbucket']Correct. The Cylons were finished, as a race. The colony was destroyed and the Cylons on earth couldn't reproduce and died. Thus, Starbuck certainly was the harbinger of their death.[/QUOTE]
I guess I missed the part where all the Centurions they let go at the end need to sexually reproduce. If so, fair's fair.
How can it be the end of anything if everything is cyclical? The whole point is how civilization repeatedly hitting this moral and technological tipping point which leads to cataclysm...and then starts again. I don't see how that reconciles with the concept of an end.
It's an awfully technical explanation to say that it's over for human civilization because the new race is half-cylon. The new civilization is effectively indistinguishable from the old ones, not only in the form of its vices and impending downfall, but certainly in other ways as well. If anything, the thematic point of the entire latter half of the series has been the degree to which cylons and humans are effectively indistinguishable. It seems a preposterous assertion, then, to say that the old civilization is dead and gone and the new one different given the entire point was that so little has changed.
Moreover, focusing on the "hybrid" nature of the new humanity would expressly contradict the notion that Cylons are dead, for not only would the population of Earth be engaged in building a new race of pure Cylons, but they'd be part cylon to boot. So, again, I think the notion of anything having "ended" here contradicts the explicit and implicit thematic meanings of the finale. And for no reason, as the "Starbuck prophecy" adds exactly nothing to the series in the long run.
I guess I missed the part where all the Centurions they let go at the end need to sexually reproduce. If so, fair's fair.
How can it be the end of anything if everything is cyclical? The whole point is how civilization repeatedly hitting this moral and technological tipping point which leads to cataclysm...and then starts again. I don't see how that reconciles with the concept of an end.
It's an awfully technical explanation to say that it's over for human civilization because the new race is half-cylon. The new civilization is effectively indistinguishable from the old ones, not only in the form of its vices and impending downfall, but certainly in other ways as well. If anything, the thematic point of the entire latter half of the series has been the degree to which cylons and humans are effectively indistinguishable. It seems a preposterous assertion, then, to say that the old civilization is dead and gone and the new one different given the entire point was that so little has changed.
Moreover, focusing on the "hybrid" nature of the new humanity would expressly contradict the notion that Cylons are dead, for not only would the population of Earth be engaged in building a new race of pure Cylons, but they'd be part cylon to boot. So, again, I think the notion of anything having "ended" here contradicts the explicit and implicit thematic meanings of the finale. And for no reason, as the "Starbuck prophecy" adds exactly nothing to the series in the long run.
thrustbucket
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I guess you are allowed those opinions. I just don't share them.
Another thing to note -- at the beginning of the Finale, Head Six tells Baltar that he will lead the Humans to their end. He responds "What do you mean by 'end?'" and then they are interrupted.
I can't say off the top of my head when, but I'm pretty sure that has been mentioned several times in the series like that.
Another thing to note -- at the beginning of the Finale, Head Six tells Baltar that he will lead the Humans to their end. He responds "What do you mean by 'end?'" and then they are interrupted.
I can't say off the top of my head when, but I'm pretty sure that has been mentioned several times in the series like that.
[quote name='thrustbucket']I guess you are allowed those opinions. I just don't share them.
Another thing to note -- at the beginning of the Finale, Head Six tells Baltar that he will lead the Humans to their end. He responds "What do you mean by 'end?'" and then they are interrupted.
I can't say off the top of my head when, but I'm pretty sure that has been mentioned several times in the series like that.[/QUOTE]
Works for me. Ambiguity is ambiguous, after all.
Another thing to note -- at the beginning of the Finale, Head Six tells Baltar that he will lead the Humans to their end. He responds "What do you mean by 'end?'" and then they are interrupted.
I can't say off the top of my head when, but I'm pretty sure that has been mentioned several times in the series like that.[/QUOTE]
Works for me. Ambiguity is ambiguous, after all.
[quote name='Pirate331']
One thing I was left wondering after a few hours of contemplation, what do the free Centurions end up doing? They're presumably immortal and appear to be at least partially sentient so surely they'd come up with some interesting things in 150,000 years.[/quote]
I doubt they're immortal. They'll break down eventually unless they're able to create spare parts, and since the basestar is part biological it stands to reason the biological part will die eventually.
One thing I was left wondering after a few hours of contemplation, what do the free Centurions end up doing? They're presumably immortal and appear to be at least partially sentient so surely they'd come up with some interesting things in 150,000 years.[/quote]
I doubt they're immortal. They'll break down eventually unless they're able to create spare parts, and since the basestar is part biological it stands to reason the biological part will die eventually.
[quote name='Kaijufan']I doubt they're immortal. They'll break down eventually unless they're able to create spare parts, and since the basestar is part biological it stands to reason the biological part will die eventually.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, but they've got the Basestar and whatever is left on the colonies to figure out how to manufacture themselves. Theres presumably a lot still there since the Cylons tried to live on Caprica at one point.
I didn't like how they abandoned technology and scattered to the winds across the planet, I don't like how they abandoned their legacy and let their civilization be completely forgotten. I know I wouldn't go along with that shit. But it wasn't a bad ending at all, the battle was great.
Yeah, but they've got the Basestar and whatever is left on the colonies to figure out how to manufacture themselves. Theres presumably a lot still there since the Cylons tried to live on Caprica at one point.
I didn't like how they abandoned technology and scattered to the winds across the planet, I don't like how they abandoned their legacy and let their civilization be completely forgotten. I know I wouldn't go along with that shit. But it wasn't a bad ending at all, the battle was great.
bread's done