For those of you that forgot the anniversary of Che getting what he deserved...

[quote name='Koggit']If I had to characterize that piece I'd go with "myopic, ugly, and needlessly hateful"[/QUOTE]

but not false ;)
 
I'm gonna pass on the article ("american thinker"?) but you'll get no defense of Guevara from this Democrat. One of my favorite t-shirts has a picture of his face with a tiny caption that says: "Brought to you by capitalism."
 
[quote name='trq']I'm gonna pass on the article ("american thinker"?) but you'll get no defense of Guevara from this Democrat. One of my favorite t-shirts has a picture of his face with a tiny caption that says: "Brought to you by capitalism."[/QUOTE]

I'm sure you'd approve of a similar shirt with Osama Bin Laden then.
 
Because Communism, by nature, depends on squashing individualism. Everyone has to be on board, and the only way to ensure that is to get rid of those that aren't.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']Because Communism, by nature, depends on squashing individualism. Everyone has to be on board, and the only way to ensure that is to get rid of those that aren't.[/quote]

And socialism?
 
Che was no saint, probably would have been a run-of-the-mill dictator. However some of the points in that article are funny, coming from "AmericanThinker"

"Executions?" Che Guevara exclaimed while addressing the hallowed halls of the UN General Assembly on Dec. 9, 1964. "Certainly, we execute!" he declared to the claps and cheers of that august body. "And we will continue executing as long as it is necessary! This is a war to the DEATH against the Revolution's enemies!"
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Wasn't one of you cats (I think it was you Thrust) just calling for a mass violent uprising against DC/NYC a week ago? Weren't some of the writings and speeches of our revolutionary forefathers equally as hyperbolic (Hint: See the writings of Thomas Paine or Thomas Jefferson)? Aren't executions codified in our lawbooks as criminal punishment?

In 1959, with the help of Soviet GRU agents, the man celebrated on that T-shirt helped found, train and indoctrinate Cuba's secret police. "Always interrogate your prisoners at night," Che ordered his goons. "A man's resistance is always lower at night."
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Secret police? Abhorrent in America. Glad no shadowy organization is monitoring my calls or communication without oversight from elected officials.

And interrogations at night? Heavens no!

BTW wouldn't it be ironic if the same conservatives making these points supported an American torture center. And to top it off what if the torture center was in Cuba - nahhhhh WAY too crazy - after all these same pussycats think interrogation at night is cruel and unusual.
 
[quote name='fatherofcaitlyn']And socialism?[/QUOTE] Just a less violent version of the same thing. I think we are in a pseudo-socialist state now. The government is socialist, but they haven't started executing people that don't want to be.

[quote name='camoor']Che was no saint, probably would have been a run-of-the-mill dictator. However some of the points in that article are funny, coming from "AmericanThinker"



Wasn't one of you cats (I think it was you Thrust) just calling for a mass violent uprising against DC/NYC a week ago? Weren't some of the writings and speeches of our revolutionary forefathers equally as hyperbolic (Hint: See the writings of Thomas Paine or Thomas Jefferson)? Aren't executions codified in our lawbooks as criminal punishment?[/quote]
Yes it was me, but I never said "violent". The fact that we are not willing to march on Washington and toss them all out on their asses, when they do things almost everyone doesn't want (bailout) means we deserve what we get. That doesn't assume violence.

Yes you are right about our forefathers. But there is a stark difference between a revolutionary and a murderer. It's pretty clear che went around putting bullets in peoples head that simply disagreed with him, but weren't a direct threat.

Executions are codified, yes. But a legal execution comes after a trial. Che didn't believe he needed a trial, jury, or judge.

Secret police? Abhorrent in America. Glad no shadowy organization is monitoring my calls or communication without oversight from elected officials.
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Can't argue with you there.

BTW wouldn't it be ironic if the same conservatives making these points supported an American torture center. And to top it off what if the torture center was in Cuba - nahhhhh WAY too crazy - after all these same pussycats think interrogation at night is cruel and unusual.
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The interrogations at night quote, in the article, does seem out of context. I guess they were just trying to further paint a picture of who he was, and what he focussed on.

Yes, waterboarding is a bad thing. Luckily it hasn't happened in 5 years, and when it did happen, it happened two maybe three times at guantamano. Labeling such a place a "torture center" is a little over-the-top, don't you think?
 
More or less agree with you here Thrust, just a few clarifcations of my position

[quote name='thrustbucket']Yes it was me, but I never said "violent". The fact that we are not willing to march on Washington and toss them all out on their asses, when they do things almost everyone doesn't want (bailout) means we deserve what we get. That doesn't assume violence.
[/quote]

OK - but you can see where I would read "march on Washingon and toss them all out on their asses" and not even taking it literally assume some sort of physical force is implied or hinted at.

[quote name='thrustbucket']Yes you are right about our forefathers. But there is a stark difference between a revolutionary and a murderer.
[/quote]

Yeah - success ;)

[quote name='thrustbucket']It's pretty clear che went around putting bullets in peoples head that simply disagreed with him, but weren't a direct threat.[/quote]

I agree here - a run-of-the-mill dictator in the making

[quote name='thrustbucket']Executions are codified, yes. But a legal execution comes after a trial. Che didn't believe he needed a trial, jury, or judge.
[/quote]

The Bush administration doesn't believe in a trial, jury, or judge for certain prisoners. Oh no that's right we're at war against terrorism. Hey - we're at war against drugs too, can we lock suspected drug dealers up with impunity? I don't like loud noises late at night - can we declare war on that too?

[quote name='thrustbucket']Can't argue with you there.

The interrogations at night quote, in the article, does seem out of context. I guess they were just trying to further paint a picture of who he was, and what he focussed on.

Yes, waterboarding is a bad thing. Luckily it hasn't happened in 5 years, and when it did happen, it happened two maybe three times at guantamano. Labeling such a place a "torture center" is a little over-the-top, don't you think?[/quote]

How do you know. Because that's what the govt told you? Hell, they were willing to waterboard a Fox news reporter on camera for jollies, what makes you think they have any restraint against terror suspects with essentially no rights.
 
It is somewhat ironic that his likeness is now an icon for capitalism and consumerism.


He's just another South American mass murderer to me, no shortage of those. I think the photo is the only reason why he's been so romanticized, Pol Pot's face just doesn't have the same appeal.
 
Last I check in Latin America, human rights abuse knows no ideology. Not to mention the amount of people that were killed in the proxy wars between the USSR and the USA in those countries.
 
[quote name='dafoomie']
He's just another South American mass murderer to me, no shortage of those. I think the photo is the only reason why he's been so romanticized, Pol Pot's face just doesn't have the same appeal.[/quote]
Also not helping: this and this
 
[quote name='camoor']
OK - but you can see where I would read "march on Washingon and toss them all out on their asses" and not even taking it literally assume some sort of physical force is implied or hinted at. [/quote]
Sure. I can see why clarification is needed.

The Bush administration doesn't believe in a trial, jury, or judge for certain prisoners. Oh no that's right we're at war against terrorism. Hey - we're at war against drugs too, can we lock suspected drug dealers up with impunity? I don't like loud noises late at night - can we declare war on that too?
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While I don't agree with the Bush administrations views in this matter, I also acknowledge you have to draw the line somewhere. I guess this is where criminologists come in. It can be debated ad-nausium what is and isn't appropriate use of force and when. As we saw in the thread about the Texan shooting his neighbors robbers....

How do you know. Because that's what the govt told you? Hell, they were willing to waterboard a Fox news reporter on camera for jollies, what makes you think they have any restraint against terror suspects with essentially no rights.
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Well I can just as easily ask how do you know otherwise? Because disenfranchised CIA officers and soldiers say so? Or just because you assume, from Bush hatred, that there has to be torture going on there?

I will admit, though, that if you define unpleasantness of any kind as torture, then I can see how you could claim torture in a prison camp (I know people who do). It isn't a Hilton. But then again, if that's how you define torture, we'd have to have Msut77 arrested as well.... ;)
 
I totally agree with this article. The ultraliberal MSM doesn't do enough to cover a man who was executed 41 years ago.

And a smattering of celebrities saying mildly nice things about him? And the rumor that Angelina Jolie has a tattoo of him? OUTRAGEOUS!

And while we're at it, where's the MSM's coverage of modern American Hero John Brown? It's just another plot by the ultraliberal MSM to avoid coverage the successes of the abolitionist movement, I tell you.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']I'm sure you'd approve of a similar shirt with Osama Bin Laden then.[/QUOTE]

Way to miss the point.

[quote name='dafoomie']It is somewhat ironic that his likeness is now an icon for capitalism and consumerism.[/QUOTE]

Yup, that's it. That was the point.
 
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