SMT series (DigitalDevilSaga 1&2, Nocturne, Persona 3,4) $19.99 on Amazon.com

DuffHomer

DuffHomer

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I'm going through a PS2 phase right now.. If I were to purchase just one of these games, which one should it be? I know nothing about them but I love RPGs.
 
[quote name='johnoralex']For those of you who want devil summoner, this may not be the same they announced a remake for devil summoner: soul hackers for the 3ds with full voice acting today though it hasn't been announced for America yet. Read all about it - http://www.siliconera.com/2012/04/2...-remake-coming-to-3ds-with-full-voice-acting/[/QUOTE]

Not the same game we're talking about.

darkskill - Nocturne, if you can only get one. I'd suggest picking up the Digital Devil Saga pair while they're cheap, too. All three of those at one point were rare gems where even used copies sold for $60 or more. The Persona games seem to get a new port or remake every few months so pick them up whenever and in whatever form you like.
 
I didn't realize Devil Summoner was so hard to find, I'm pretty sure I have a copy of it somewhere around here.

I think I'll pick up DDS1 and 2 from Amazon, those are the only games I've never played. Thanks for the heads up.
 
[quote name='Josh1billion']I disagree. I put both DDS1&2 far above any of the Persona games.[/QUOTE]

Persona 3 and 4 are by far the better games. So much more polish, content variety and humor.
 
I went ahead and put DDS2 on order to go with my Fate/Stay Night Unlimited Blade Works preorder. It gives me until June to decide if I still want it.
 
[quote name='darkskill']I'm going through a PS2 phase right now.. If I were to purchase just one of these games, which one should it be? I know nothing about them but I love RPGs.[/QUOTE]
It really depends on what type of RPG you like because most of these are variants on the main SMT series.

Digital Devil Saga is the most straight forward of the bunch and pretty similar in system to FFX. You don't recruit monsters and are only responsible for managing your teams' skill growth via a Sphere-grid like setup. You have a 3 man team and the overall story is very linear.

The main SMT series and its primary spin-off, Persona, share similar party management (monster recruitment) and growth paths akin to Pokemon. The main SMT games (of which Nocturne is the 3rd) are very open ended and your conversations with the NPCs (through the story) affect your recruitable monsters the end game result. Persona 3 & 4 modified this a bit with the Social Link element which revolves around your conversations and interactions with characters when you're outside of battle and affects recruitment and skills but the story is more linear than SMT.

Battle system wise, all the games utilize the Press Turn system that was introduced in SMT3. Basically each side alternates fighting and each side's party member gets a turn (denoted at the top of the screen.) If the acting party member exploits an opposing side's weakness, their team gets another turn; likewise if they miss or the opposition is immune to the attack, the acting team loses a turn.

All in all, they're all a pretty fun set of games but the difficulty and complexity differ greatly from game to game.
 
Persona noob speaking here. I have none of these games. Would it be in my best interest to order all of them while they're available, or are these going to be available and affordable moving forward?
 
All of those are great games. I wouldn't mind playing Nocturne again which I don't have but I'm hoping it comes to PSN like FES just did recently.
 
I've decided to trade some shit into BB so I can grab the DDS 1&2 and Noctrune. I am weak :p once I have all 5, what order should I play them in?
 
[quote name='KtMack23']I've decided to trade some shit into BB so I can grab the DDS 1&2 and Noctrune. I am weak :p once I have all 5, what order should I play them in?[/QUOTE]

If you're completely new to the SMT games, I would start with DDS or one of the Personas. DDS is pretty straightforward and it'll introduce you to the vocabulary of the SMT games, the monster types and the battle system. Persona and Nocturne both require you to recruit monsters as your allies, though in Persona it's only for one slot, in Nocturne it's to fill the entire party. Nocturne is initially the hardest of the bunch and won't hold your hand at all (and you will likely repeatedly die at the first boss.)
 
[quote name='Curufinwe']Persona 3 and 4 are by far the better games. So much more polish, content variety and humor.[/QUOTE]
Persona certainly has the upper hand in the three categories you stated, but to make the leap from that to trying to objectively state that they are better "by far" is quite a leap.

I found DDS's story to be much more to my liking, being much less cliched (Persona's "group of optimistic youths off to save the world from complete destruction" versus DDS's story which is very untraditional and fresh).

Beyond that, I found it to be paced much better. A moment is hardly uneventful in DDS, with the story arc constantly moving forward, while it can take in-game months for anything of overall significance to occur in Persona (social events are always occurring, but these are minor events -- meeting a dog and bringing him back to your dorm to join your party does little to further the grander, overarching story).

And while there is certainly more variety of content in Persona, with the many different routes a person can take in following sub-stories which bring about social relationships, there comes a point at which it all seems largely formulaic and repetitive. The dungeon-crawling half of the series is especially noteworthy for this (I shouldn't need to explain why), and even the social links eventually amount to little more than walking up to somebody after school, pressing X, and watching a cutscene.

If you enjoyed Persona 3&4 more than you enjoyed DDS1&2, that's fine; opinions are subjective. But to word it in such a way where saying they are "by far the better games" implies that they are of a much higher objective quality (insofar as quality can be objective, which is limited, but I'd say there are certain factors for which we hold a more-or-less universal appreciation, if those factors are the ones to which you seek to appeal; for example, we could come to a virtually-universal consensus that Metal Gear Solid is "by far a better game" than Atari's E.T.). In that case, I would have to retort that no, there is not a consensus to say that they are "by far the better games."
 
Confession: I have a sealed copy of PS4 from when Gamestop had a Games Day sale and it was $14.99. Still sealed.

... >___>;;;
 
[quote name='Josh1billion']
If you enjoyed Persona 3&4 more than you enjoyed DDS1&2, that's fine; opinions are subjective. But to word it in such a way where saying they are "by far the better games" implies that they are of a much higher objective quality (insofar as quality can be objective, which is limited, but I'd say there are certain factors for which we hold a more-or-less universal appreciation, if those factors are the ones to which you seek to appeal; for example, we could come to a virtually-universal consensus that Metal Gear Solid is "by far a better game" than Atari's E.T.). In that case, I would have to retort that no, there is not a consensus to say that they are "by far the better games."[/QUOTE]

The Persona series is more critically acclaimed than the DDS series, has a larger fanbase, and is far more highly recommended a series than DDS. I think it's pretty easy to say that there is a consensus the Persona series is better than the DDS series.

From personal experience, I couldn't even bother finishing DDS1. The characters and gameplay did nothing for me. I sold my copy two years ago (and picked up a new one at this sale). But Persona 4 is in my top 5 games of all time.
 
[quote name='DarkSageRK']The Persona series is more critically acclaimed than the DDS series, has a larger fanbase, and is far more highly recommended a series than DDS. I think it's pretty easy to say that there is a consensus the Persona series is better than the DDS series.
[/QUOTE]

Because 'popular' opinion, especially that of 'Game Critics', always dictates quality & accounts for personal preference.

I think his point was that trying to disuade or encourage purchasing one series over the other is purely a subjective practice. Saying there is a 'consensus' is just a logical fallacy. People who prefer the Persona games will certainly have a 'consensus' that the series is superior, but that doesn't necessarily speak for everyone who plays JRPGs, Atlus games, etc. Although, I suspect that there ARE quite a large numbe of folks out there that like to pretend to be Japanese schoolkids, so maybe that's what accounts for it lol.

I dunno, it's honestly really not a big deal or anything. For some reason what you said kinda rubbed me the wrong way. So yeah, nothin' personal, just wanted to get on a soap-box for a second. ;)

Anyhooo.....In for Digital Devil Saga 1 & 2, always wanted to check those out. Thanks OP.
 
[quote name='NuclearPorkchop']Because 'popular' opinion, especially that of 'Game Critics', always dictates quality & accounts for personal preference.

I think his point was that trying to disuade or encourage purchasing one series over the other is purely a subjective practice. Saying there is a 'consensus' is just a logical fallacy. People who prefer the Persona games will certainly have a 'consensus' that the series is superior, but that doesn't necessarily speak for everyone who plays JRPGs, Atlus games, etc. Although, I suspect that there ARE quite a large numbe of folks out there that like to pretend to be Japanese schoolkids, so maybe that's what accounts for it lol.

I dunno, it's honestly really not a big deal or anything. For some reason what you said kinda rubbed me the wrong way. So yeah, nothin' personal, just wanted to get on a soap-box for a second. ;)

Anyhooo.....In for Digital Devil Saga 1 & 2, always wanted to check those out. Thanks OP.[/QUOTE]

Good thing we got the Digital Devil Saga anime, a fighting game spin-off, and both versions turned into PSP/PSVita games. Not to mention all that Digital Devil Saga merchandise -- t-shirts, trading cards, plushies, etc.

You can believe all you want that the series are on equal grounds, but they're not. One of the franchises has a huge following and the other doesn't. Hardcore dungeon crawlers may not like it, but the market has spoken.

As for consensus, among J-RPG fans, nearly all of them will say Persona 3/4 are great games. The same does not hold true for other SMT games (though there is a very vocal minority that loves the other SMT games).

Persona 3/4 are simply better buys for nearly everyone. If people want to dip their toes into other SMT series after that, that's fine. But as you're going to find out, they're quite different from what you may be used to with Persona.
 
Just a hint: because something is popular, doesn't make it the best. In fact, "best" is subjective based on what you enjoy.

To be honest, when I got my PS2 a few years back, I had no clue about any of the SMT games. They all had a relatively equal level of obscurity. Persona 3 FES was a blind buy and it happens that I really liked it. Is it better than DDS? I don't know, I haven't cracked open my copy of DDS.
 
[quote name='DarkSageRK']Good thing we got the Digital Devil Saga anime, a fighting game spin-off, and both versions turned into PSP/PSVita games. Not to mention all that Digital Devil Saga merchandise -- t-shirts, trading cards, plushies, etc.
[/QUOTE]

I think perhaps you should voice the reasons why YOU THINK the Persona games happen to resonate better WITH YOU (rather than DDS), instead of just going on about "fan quantity=game quality". I'm talking game mechanics, character development, etc. I know I'd much rather read that, personally. "Didn't do it for me" doesn't really paint a very clear picture, given how vocal you are on the subject.

It just seems you have a hard-on for the Persona games, which is totally cool btw, but I'm just not seeing much in the way of actual reasons why someone should pick those instead of the other games.
 
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I have not played the DDS games, but I have played Persona 3 and Nocturne. So I can compare those. I'll start with the use of time in the Persona series. Time management makes sense for an rpg, as rpg's are all about choices. Choosing how to spend your time adds to the level of choice that is given to you. One of the ways you will use your time is strengthening the characters social links. The different social links fuse story with gameplay mechanics. As you get involved with a certain character's storyline you also earn the ability to fuse stronger persona's based on that characters arcana. That's highly rewarding from an rpg perspective, as it fuses narrative with battle incentives. Based on how many social links there are, players have a wide variety of choices available to them. Also in FES, they expanded even further on what players can do with their time, which revolve around making battles easier. increasing persona's stats, copying skills, etc.

I could go on for a while here, but I'll skip straight to the battle system.

They both use the press turn system, but I prefer Persona's press turn system. In Nocturne your party members are the demons, whereas in Persona they are summons whose affinities you take on. That to me is a lot more interesting and strategic than just having demons in your party. Because you are switching personas on the fly in the heat of battle, so you have to weight the benefits and detriments of switching personas. It's most interesting when you come across a shadow you haven't come across before, choosing the right persona just makes you feel awesome. When you come across opponents you know you can only beat by exploiting their weakness, it is also a very rewarding feeling to map out the exact way to do it and avoid getting hit at all. this is especially important in persona, as if the main character is knocked out it's game over. So you are just one powerful attack away from being wiped out in the persona games, so strategy is key and skillful use of the press turn system will keep you alive.

If you're only going to get one I'd recommend the Persona series. I haven't played a SMT I've disliked yet, though. I don't think there's a bad choice among the options.

As for P3 vs P4, if you want to play multiple games in the series, start with one of the 3's on the ps2. Or you could start with 4 on the ps2 and move to 3 on the psp. Moving from 4 to 3 might feel like a downgrade based on the improvements made to the battle system in 4. Those improvements were transferred to P3P. However, P3P also had to remove some things(animated cutscenes, ability to traverse most of the in-game areas on foot) so there isn't really a perfect version of Persona 3 to recommend over all others.
 
You gotta be kidding me, I traded for P3/4 & DDS1 a few weeks ago! About $20 a piece, but not new... fml. Okay so I guess I'm getting DDS2 new and I'm considering Nocture. I'm loving P4 right now and the darker story of DDS sounds fresh to me so should I get Nocture?
 
[quote name='doodofdoods']Quite a lot of useful information.[/QUOTE]

Oh excellent, that actually is quite useful information. Thanks for the in-depth game impression, it is much appreciated. :applause:
 
I don't know why people are over complicating things.

All these SMT games listed are fantastic and should be played by anyone that's ever played and liked JRPG in the past.

Persona 4/3 should at least be tried by all gamers in general due to their accessibility and wider appeal.
 
Buy Nocturne people, it truly rocks & will kick your ass.

Buying one to keep sealed just for the hell of it, thanks OP!
 
Just picked up DDS 1 & 2 and Nocturne. I've already got P3 and P4.

I just got my new white PS2 slim and I've been looking for something fun to break it in with. Thanks!
 
[quote name='NuclearPorkchop']I think perhaps you should voice the reasons why YOU THINK the Persona games happen to resonate better WITH YOU (rather than DDS), instead of just going on about "fan quantity=game quality". I'm talking game mechanics, character development, etc. I know I'd much rather read that, personally. "Didn't do it for me" doesn't really paint a very clear picture, given how vocal you are on the subject.

It just seems you have a hard-on for the Persona games, which is totally cool btw, but I'm just not seeing much in the way of actual reasons why someone should pick those instead of the other games.[/QUOTE]

I was originally responding to "In that case, I would have to retort that no, there is not a consensus to say that they are 'by far the better games.'" where the argument was for consensus.

DDS1 failed for me because despite all this talk of a cool environment and plot, the characters were flat, boring, and dull. They had no personality. I can remember their faces (because the art style is unique), but anything beyond that, I really can't. Actually, the plot
revolves around them not having any emotion
so this is pretty much as objective as it gets.

As for the gameplay? I recall during one dungeon, I just looked at the screen, thought "Why am I wasting my time?", then turned the game off and never looked back. It's dungeon-crawling without any fun or purpose.

Persona (referring to it singularly here, but I mean 3/4) was great because of the time-management portion that was handled exceptionally well. You always pushed yourself to do the best you could every day because you had to. You were able to craft your own experience with a rich cast of characters and an overarching plot that, IMO, was better than DDS1's (I wiki'd the plot after I quit the game so I had an idea of what would have happened).
 
Picked up DDS 1 and 2 for myself. Have the rest. My backlog is huge, but I know when I get to these i'm sure they wont disappoint.
 
[quote name='Starky27']It really depends on what type of RPG you like because most of these are variants on the main SMT series.

Digital Devil Saga is the most straight forward of the bunch and pretty similar in system to FFX. You don't recruit monsters and are only responsible for managing your teams' skill growth via a Sphere-grid like setup. You have a 3 man team and the overall story is very linear.

The main SMT series and its primary spin-off, Persona, share similar party management (monster recruitment) and growth paths akin to Pokemon. The main SMT games (of which Nocturne is the 3rd) are very open ended and your conversations with the NPCs (through the story) affect your recruitable monsters the end game result. Persona 3 & 4 modified this a bit with the Social Link element which revolves around your conversations and interactions with characters when you're outside of battle and affects recruitment and skills but the story is more linear than SMT.

Battle system wise, all the games utilize the Press Turn system that was introduced in SMT3. Basically each side alternates fighting and each side's party member gets a turn (denoted at the top of the screen.) If the acting party member exploits an opposing side's weakness, their team gets another turn; likewise if they miss or the opposition is immune to the attack, the acting team loses a turn.

All in all, they're all a pretty fun set of games but the difficulty and complexity differ greatly from game to game.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for the great explanation, extremely helpful.

I finally opened and started playing Nocturne the other night and I am really digging it as it's similar to pokemon but with demons.

I'm actually now on the fence on buying most of the rest of them.
 
[quote name='Substandard']Just picked up DDS 1 & 2 and Nocturne. I've already got P3 and P4.

I just got my new white PS2 slim and I've been looking for something fun to break it in with. Thanks![/QUOTE]

Where did you get your white PS2 Slim?
 
[quote name='LLeopardGGecko']Where did you get your white PS2 Slim?[/QUOTE]

Ebay.. I've wanted one for months and lucked into a deal. It's just great to me that an SMT deal happens less than a week later!
 
[quote name='Pck21']Stupid question...are the DDS games reprints? I know Nocturne is, but I wasn't sure about the rest.[/QUOTE]

The copies of Nocturne/DDS1/DDS2 I got from this sale were all in flimsy plastic packaging. So I'd say yes.
 
[quote name='DarkSageRK']The copies of Nocturne/DDS1/DDS2 I got from this sale were all in flimsy plastic packaging. So I'd say yes.[/QUOTE]

Agreed. P4, DDD and DDS 2 didn't come with the ps2 stickers that sealed them. Just shrink wrapped.
 
It seems that I haven't posted in this topic. Anway, I have all of these, but P4 is the only one I bought brand new, so I was thinking of getting the others new. They're all amazing games, but the price should stay like this, so if you can't get it right now, it shouldn't be a problem.
 
[quote name='scottc1s']If only I wasn't a father with two kids... These games are all awesome I really hope there would be an hd collection for the PS3[/QUOTE]

Some upscaled bs wouldn't be good enough for me and Nocturne, I would pay $60 bar none for the game completely upgraded to HD as I love the way the art styling looks in game context.
 
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