Woman and child kicked off bus because of child's crying

IAmTheCheapestGamer

IAmTheCheapestGamer

Banned
http://abclocal.go.com/wls/story?section=news/national_world&id=8378287

October 4, 2011 (PORTLAND, Ore.) -- A driver in Oregon's largest public transit agency berated a woman and her crying baby into getting off a bus in a Portland suburb, saying "I can't drive with that noise," another passenger said Monday.

Over the loudspeaker, the female bus driver told the woman to distract the baby to quiet it down, passenger Jennifer Chapman said. Other passengers muttered that the driver should "just drive the bus, just do your job," she said.

When the mother and the baby got off the bus at a stop in Hillsboro, other passengers also left en masse in protest, she added.

Mary Fetsch, a spokeswoman for the agency that runs mass transit in the Portland metropolitan area, said TriMet's policy is not to remove people such as women with children from a bus. The driver, who was not identified, has been placed on administrative leave while the agency investigates the complaint from the incident Thursday, Fetsch said.

The Portland area prides itself on its environmentally friendly transportation options, such as miles of bike paths for commuters and a booming public transportation system. TriMet said it carries more people than any other transit system of its size in the country.

Chapman said the child was younger than 2 and was fussing around in her mother's lap at the time. The woman spoke only Spanish, she said.

The bus driver pulled over at a scheduled stop, walked to the back of the bus, pointed at the mother and then the baby, Chapman said. The woman then walked off the bus with the child, followed by the other passengers, she said.

In a conversation with a dispatcher immediately after the confrontation, the bus driver described the baby as not "just crying."

"It was screaming all the way from Beaverton, and I just finally stopped the bus," the driver said. "I said we need to get the baby to stop screaming because I just can't drive with it screaming ... that is not safe."

The conversation was recorded by Al Margulies, a fellow bus driver and blogger who monitors scanner traffic. Marguilies played the recording to The Associated Press, and TriMet has confirmed that the accuracy of the recording.

The driver told that dispatcher that when the woman and child had gotten off the bus, four or five passengers insulted her, so "I said you guys can get off too."

The dispatcher told the driver: "In the future, if there is a baby crying on your bus there really isn't a whole lot you do. It's public transit."

Fetsch said drivers can take steps if they believe their safety is in jeopardy, but policy prevents them from removing people "of a "vulnerable population." The driver has been working for TriMet for 10 years, she said.
Click to expand...
Now maybe I'm gonna come across as an asshole here, but I've put up with people letting their brats run around a store or cry their frickin' heads off w/o even trying to calm/quiet them before and it is fuckin' annoying. So I know where this driver was coming from.

If you can't/won't at least try and quiet your kid, then you do NOT deserve to be a parent imo. Just like the beating incident in McDonalds where the bitches jumped the counter and the cashier beat their asses with a metal rod, I feel the driver of this bus was justified in their actions.
 
A screaming child can reach over 110 dB.
OSHA guidelines only allow an individual to work in conditions of 110 dB for half an hour without ear protection.

Again, at what point does a screaming individual get to risk the safety of the other passengers?
 
This is one of those no win situations for the bus driver. Although it does indeed look bad for to kick a mother and a kid off a bus...you have to give them the benefit of the doubt it was for a good reason. After all she has been there for 10 years.

Most people wouldnt just boot someone off for the hell of it so if the bus driver really felt that it was comprising the safety of the bus then off she has to go. Period. Its not the driver job to be PC its to keep the bus safe.

Also, lets not be a dick and forget that the bus driver said the baby was not "JUST CRYING" but was screaming the entire time.

I never understand why we have to pretend that kids do not cause legit problems. No one is saying punch the kid in the face but if its acting in a way that is deemed dangerous then you have to handle it accordingly.

Maybe the driver could have called a cab...or something but thats about it.
 
[quote name='eldergamer']You're right, you're an asshole.

Kids cry. It's what they do. Part of being a bus driver is putting up with a bunch of crap. If you can't handle dealing with the public at it's worst, you really shouldnt be in a public service job.

The driver has been "discplined". But of course her union won't say how.

http://www.oregonlive.com/hillsboro/index.ssf/2011/10/trimet_disciplines_bus_driver.html[/QUOTE]

You sound like a bad parent.
 
[quote name='camoor']You sound like a bad parent.[/QUOTE]

Maybe I am. I still wouldnt kick a mom and a screaming kid off the bus in the middle of the night. Especially when the lady spoke little to no english to begin with. (Each time she's been on the news she's answered questions with an interpreter)

Regardless, she was a pretty poor bus driver. She left the bus, and told the other passengers if they didnt like it they could get off the bus as well.

TriMet said investigators "found that the driver responded unreasonably to the crying child, inappropriately left her seat, exited the bus to interact with the mother, and also did not contact dispatch to request assistance when she first had concerns about operating the vehicle with the crying toddler on board."
 
[quote name='eldergamer']Maybe I am. I still wouldnt kick a mom and a screaming kid off the bus in the middle of the night.[/QUOTE]

K.

To be honest, I don't give a shit what kind of parent you are, just make an effort to keep your kid quiet. Nothing irritates everyone else when a parent just shrugs and says "Kids cry. It's what they do. Part of being a bus driver is putting up with a bunch of crap."

That's fucking bullshit.
 
[quote name='UncleBob']A screaming child can reach over 110 dB.
OSHA guidelines only allow an individual to work in conditions of 110 dB for half an hour without ear protection.

Again, at what point does a screaming individual get to risk the safety of the other passengers?[/QUOTE]

I think you have a point when it comes to the driver more than the passengers.
 
[quote name='willardhaven']I think you have a point when it comes to the driver more than the passengers.[/QUOTE]

The safety of the driver directly effects the safety of the passengers though. A distracted driver is never a good thing.
 
[quote name='UncleBob']The safety of the driver directly effects the safety of the passengers though. A distracted driver is never a good thing.[/QUOTE]

I thought you were arguing for hearing protection for the passengers.

I think the driver made the right call. If someone is causing a disturbance during transit, they should be asked to stop. If they do not cease disrupting the operator or other passengers, they should be asked to get off.
 
[quote name='UncleBob']The safety of the driver directly effects the safety of the passengers though. A distracted driver is never a good thing.[/QUOTE]

If this was more of a safety issue the union or Trimet would have backed up the driver. This was more of the driver being annoyed and not wanting that person on their bus.
 
[quote name='eldergamer']If this was more of a safety issue the union or Trimet would have backed up the driver. This was more of the driver being annoyed and not wanting that person on their bus.[/QUOTE]

I guess we'll never know for sure, as we don't know how, exactly, this driver was disciplined, but, my guess is that the driver was disciplined for the way she handled the entire situation (i.e. telling everyone to get off the bus, etc.) Also, it's possible that the driver was simply given a slap on the wrist due to the public outcry over the entire incident from people who don't understand that driving a large, over-sized bus takes a bit more concentration than driving a station wagon.
 
[quote name='UncleBob']I guess we'll never know for sure, as we don't know how, exactly, this driver was disciplined, but, my guess is that the driver was disciplined for the way she handled the entire situation (i.e. telling everyone to get off the bus, etc.) Also, it's possible that the driver was simply given a slap on the wrist due to the public outcry over the entire incident from people who don't understand that driving a large, over-sized bus takes a bit more concentration than driving a station wagon.[/QUOTE]

Yet somehow, people do it every day without flipping out.
 
[quote name='depascal22']Yet somehow, people do it every day without flipping out.[/QUOTE]

Somehow, people work at FOXCONN every day without flipping out. I guess because one or two people do it, it's no big deal. Those people must be the outliers.
 
I worked as a bus driver for a couple years in college; first as a driver for the school's bus system and then as a driver for the local school district. I had to put up with whiny fucking kids on both.

I gotta say that a loud-ass child (or anything loud, repetitive, and abrasive) can be pretty distracting. The noise, itself, didn't really affect my ability to control the bus or delay my reaction times, but it did directly contribute to safely operating the bus. If I had to focus my attention on calming a kid down or even stopping the bus (as we were taught) to attend to the child, it meant that less attention was being paid to the road or drivers around me. It also meant that I might not be able to hear the CB radio or notices from dispatch. No matter how loud my radio went, 2nd graders could always yell louder.

In short: children are stupid and I hate them. I side with the driver.
 
[quote name='UncleBob']Somehow, people work at FOXCONN every day without flipping out. I guess because one or two people do it, it's no big deal. Those people must be the outliers.[/QUOTE]

Bad example. The rate of Chinese Foxconn employee suicides is lower than the overall Chinese suicide rate.
 
[quote name='PohTayToez']Bad example. The rate of Chinese Foxconn employee suicides is lower than the overall Chinese suicide rate.[/QUOTE]

Actually, I'd say it kinda helps prove my point better. ;)
 
[quote name='danielisawinner']In short: children are stupid and I hate them. I side with the driver.[/QUOTE]

:lol:

People used to keep a tighter leash on their kids. These days the lazy parents have the attitude of "Kids cry deal with it" I'm so sick of that shit.

Thanks to the good parents who know how to discipline, its no easy job and I salute you.
 
Ever try to discipline a kid with an ear infection? They don't stop crying and develop severe trust issues when you beat them for being sick.
 
[quote name='UncleBob']Actually, I'd say it kinda helps prove my point better. ;)[/QUOTE]

I'm sure you would, but that doesn't make you right. Citing some little bit of irrelevant anecdotal "evidence" and then acting smugly doesn't mean that you actually have a valid point to make.
 
[quote name='depascal22']Ever try to discipline a kid with an ear infection? They don't stop crying and develop severe trust issues when you beat them for being sick.[/QUOTE]

Special cases always exist and I feel sorry for the parents and kids going through that. If that's what happened here I'm sorry for the mother.

I was responding to EG's attitude of 'kids cry, deal with it' fuck that - it's your rugrat - you deal with it. I'll put up with some screaming and crying (it's part of life), but a good parent would be trying to 1. find out what's wrong with the kid and 2. shut him up/remove him in respect for others (in that order) Not saying 2. was possible here, but I've seen plenty of cases where it was and the parent did absolutely nothing.
 
What if she was trying to get the kid to a doctor? What if she couldn't afford a doctor and was just hoping the kid would get better? We don't anything other than a screaming baby, a driver that stopped everything to kick the woman off the bus, and a few riders getting off in a show of solidarity.

Now why did they riders get off as well? If the baby was really so overbearing, don't you think they would be relieved to have the baby gone?
 
I'm backing camoor and the bus driver up here.

The fact she didn't know English doesn't mean you should be an apologist for her, it means she should KNOW English if she wanted to work in the U.S. Changes are she's an Illegal and is able to make it with all the bullshit accommodations we give them not to learn English.
As for depascal I'm sure that could've been the case but why are you giving her the benefit of the doubt to absurdity. People like you are part of the reason WHY I don't call myself a Liberal anymore. I'm not a Neocon either mind you.
I can have sympathy for people but what the fuck happened to common manners across the board? That woman was showing the bus driver no respect and it ties into camoor's second point. Shit the woman probably was frightened because she couldn't follow what the bus driver was saying because she couldn't SPEAK ENGLISH!!!! X-(
 
[quote name='depascal22']What if she was trying to get the kid to a doctor? What if she couldn't afford a doctor and was just hoping the kid would get better? We don't anything other than a screaming baby, a driver that stopped everything to kick the woman off the bus, and a few riders getting off in a show of solidarity.

Now why did they riders get off as well? If the baby was really so overbearing, don't you think they would be relieved to have the baby gone?[/QUOTE]

I don't agree with the bus driver, IMO it was a bad call.

I was just saying that people like EG probably led to this happening. The guy sounds like he doesn't give a shit if his kid is screaming, he considers it a bus driver's duty to put up with all the shit that his kid can dish out. I ran into his kind back in the day when I was lifeguarding, and I finally got the pool to perma-ban two families because they couldn't understand that paying for a service didn't entitle their kids to treat me and my lifeguards like shit (boy were the families mad too, that was a sweet day)

And thanks Sarang - that's a good point. IT reminds me of a great post Dmaul made the other day about being a hard-nosed liberal.
 
[quote name='Sarang01']I'm backing camoor and the bus driver up here.

The fact she didn't know English doesn't mean you should be an apologist for her, it means she should KNOW English if she wanted to work in the U.S. Changes are she's an Illegal and is able to make it with all the bullshit accommodations we give them not to learn English.
As for depascal I'm sure that could've been the case but why are you giving her the benefit of the doubt to absurdity. People like you are part of the reason WHY I don't call myself a Liberal anymore. I'm not a Neocon either mind you.
I can have sympathy for people but what the fuck happened to common manners across the board? That woman was showing the bus driver no respect and it ties into camoor's second point. Shit the woman probably was frightened because she couldn't follow what the bus driver was saying because she couldn't SPEAK ENGLISH!!!! X-([/QUOTE]
:applause::applause::applause: Amen to the Nth power. I'm sick of seeing everything in multiple languages. What happened to the days when immigrants came to this country for a better life and actually tried to fuckin' assimilate instead of expecting people to cater to their asses?

Don't wanna speak English, there's the proverbial door. Don't let it hit ya in the ass on the way out.
 
[quote name='Sarang01']I'm backing camoor and the bus driver up here.

The fact she didn't know English doesn't mean you should be an apologist for her, it means she should KNOW English if she wanted to work in the U.S. Changes are she's an Illegal and is able to make it with all the bullshit accommodations we give them not to learn English.
As for depascal I'm sure that could've been the case but why are you giving her the benefit of the doubt to absurdity. People like you are part of the reason WHY I don't call myself a Liberal anymore. I'm not a Neocon either mind you.
I can have sympathy for people but what the fuck happened to common manners across the board? That woman was showing the bus driver no respect and it ties into camoor's second point. Shit the woman probably was frightened because she couldn't follow what the bus driver was saying because she couldn't SPEAK ENGLISH!!!! X-([/QUOTE]
Now THAT is the Sarang01 I remember!:lol:

And doesn't your name mean "love" in Korean?;)

Also, the whole english thing is a bit unreasonable. Especially when she probably works a low-paying job with shitty hours and obviously has a kid, so it would be Very difficult to take and ESL class. I mean seriously, have some compassion.

I'm sure that if she could afford to drive to work in her own car, she wouldn't have needed to take public transportation to get to where she needed to get that day.

[quote name='camoor']I don't agree with the bus driver, IMO it was a bad call.

I was just saying that people like EG probably led to this happening. The guy sounds like he doesn't give a shit if his kid is screaming, he considers it a bus driver's duty to put up with all the shit that his kid can dish out. I ran into his kind back in the day when I was lifeguarding, and I finally got the pool to perma-ban two families because they couldn't understand that paying for a service didn't entitle their kids to treat me and my lifeguards like shit (boy were they mad too, that was a sweet day)

And thanks Sarang - that's a good point. IT reminds me of a great post Dmaul made the other day about being a hard-nosed liberal.[/QUOTE]
I still say it's different when taking a bus somewhere. At 2 years old, I can still muster up some sympathy despite any deep annoyance and I really don't like kids at all(I know, self-selection bias...heh).

Sure, some liberals can be insufferable, but there are know-nothings on both sides. It's easy to go back to old patterns and just go PERSONAL REPSPONSIBILITY11111!!1!, but we have to remember that we're better than that and that we're not conservatives because we don't take soundbites at face value.
 
[quote name='dohdough']I still say it's different when taking a bus somewhere. At 2 years old, I can still muster up some sympathy despite any deep annoyance and I really don't like kids at all(I know, self-selection bias...heh).[/QUOTE]

Yeah it's probably ironic I'm in this at all considering I generally give parents the benefit of the doubt. As a lifeguard I made sure that the weak kids didn't get picked on and the punks didn't get away with dangerous stunts or dropping the f-bomb, and most parents liked me.

It's just... something about EG's post really irked me. Reminded me of the bad parents who thought their little Johnny Rotten was an angel who could do no wrong. Oh and those kids were devious. Throw glass bottles over teh fence when noone was looking, now there's broken glass in the pool, the pool needs to be evacuated, and the cops can't do shit. Bad fucking apples.

Contrary to what you might think, rich kids were the worst...
 
[quote name='IAmTheCheapestGamer']:applause::applause::applause: Amen to the Nth power. I'm sick of seeing everything in multiple languages. What happened to the days when immigrants came to this country for a better life and actually tried to fuckin' assimilate instead of expecting people to cater to their asses?

Don't wanna speak English, there's the proverbial door. Don't let it hit ya in the ass on the way out.[/QUOTE]
In case you don't remember your history, not everyone was allowed to assimilate. As in there were literally laws against miscegenation that extended into the economic sphere as well. It's not as simple as just LEARN ENGLISH YOU DIRTY IMMIGRANT!!1111!!
 
[quote name='camoor']Yeah it's probably ironic I'm in this at all considering I generally give parents the benefit of the doubt. It's just... something about EG's post really irked me.[/QUOTE]
I agree with you in that any parent should make some effort to quiet a screaming child in public no matter the age of the child. Whether the effort is successful or not, well, I'm willing to forgive as long as there was some effort. Hell, I wouldn't doubt that the mother was more than a little uncomfortable about it and it's a damn shame that she got kicked off the bus without trying to help get her alternate transportation. And THAT is the part that's the most fucked up to me, but it isn't Boston and I don't know if Portland has a program for passengers with special needs.
 
[quote name='dohdough']Now THAT is the Sarang01 I remember!:lol:

And doesn't your name mean "love" in Korean?;)

Also, the whole english thing is a bit unreasonable. Especially when she probably works a low-paying job with shitty hours and obviously has a kid, so it would be Very difficult to take and ESL class. I mean seriously, have some compassion.

I'm sure that if she could afford to drive to work in her own car, she wouldn't have needed to take public transportation to get to where she needed to get that day.


I still say it's different when taking a bus somewhere. At 2 years old, I can still muster up some sympathy despite any deep annoyance and I really don't like kids at all(I know, self-selection bias...heh).

Sure, some liberals can be insufferable, but there are know-nothings on both sides. It's easy to go back to old patterns and just go PERSONAL REPSPONSIBILITY11111!!1!, but we have to remember that we're better than that and that we're not conservatives because we don't take soundbites at face value.[/QUOTE]

I agree dohdough but in some respects maybe these Liberals get too much respect automatically as compared to Conservatives and Republicans but maybe I feel this way because I started at Liberal. Honestly though Neo-Liberals, as seen in unflinching apologies towards illegal immigrants I have issues. I should know as a member of my family I love suffers from this.
A lot of these Neocon's also disgust me as well.
At least with the past party stuff you could choose from column a and b now it seems you have be all Socially and Fiscally Conservative to be a Republican. If you're a Democrat you're expected to be the opposite and it's extended into ideologies to some extent.
Frankly I find it really disgusting as I've constantly crowed how I'm a big gun rights advocate, anti-Death Penalty, for Gay Marriage and am Fiscally Conservative. I consider myself an Old School Libertarian in the vein of our forefathers. Now tell me where I could get elected.
My favorite state would probably be an amalgamation of Oregon and New Hampshire.

Maybe I should flee to a state with a lot of like-minded people and take it over, like the Mormons took over Utah and the Liberals took over California.

Dohdough I'm all for helping people learn English and I would be willing to do it myself but you must admit it doesn't help or encourage them to want to blend in when you have either Spanish dubbed or subtitled versions of most, if not all popular American TV shows. Instead of SAP being used for subbing for Anime and other foreign language thing I never hear about it used except for Spanish. If someone would tell me otherwise I'd be elated as I find this a complete waste of it. Anyway, I mean this as part of a greater problem as well, like having voting ballots in other languages.
Also I know what my name means in Korean and I'm learning it. The catch is everyone else, including Koreans and Japanese try to learn English and most Hispanics who are illegal don't, citing my above point. I think this might also contribute to more subpar English from even first generation Hispanics who do know English.
Oh and camoor on your parents point, yup, these are the same types of parents who don't mind their kids usually and are likely the same type who expect teachers to babysit and complain to them when they don't do it. That last part applies to your lifeguarding as well.
 
[quote name='Sarang01']I agree dohdough but in some respects maybe these Liberals get too much respect automatically as compared to Conservatives and Republicans but maybe I feel this way because I started at Liberal. Honestly though Neo-Liberals, as seen in unflinching apologies towards illegal immigrants I have issues. I should know as a member of my family I love suffers from this.
A lot of these Neocon's also disgust me as well.[/quote]
Neo-liberalism is actually born out of conservative philosophy. It's basically a philosophy and theory that makes economics the main means of self-determination in which everything is examined through that framework.

At least with the past party stuff you could choose from column a and b now it seems you have be all Socially and Fiscally Conservative to be a Republican. If you're a Democrat you're expected to be the opposite and it's extended into ideologies to some extent.
Frankly I find it really disgusting as I've constantly crowed how I'm a big gun rights advocate, anti-Death Penalty, for Gay Marriage and am Fiscally Conservative. I consider myself an Old School Libertarian in the vein of our forefathers. Now tell me where I could get elected.
My favorite state would probably be an amalgamation of Oregon and New Hampshire.
Click to expand...
You're describing something that's related to the Overton Window, but how Democrats are framed is completely devoid of reality. Todays Dems, except for a relative few, are basically the same as Republicans from 20 years ago. If you look at Democratic legislation starting in 08, and maybe before, they're all old Republican ideas...such as cap'n'trade, PPACA, and a few other things I forget right now.

Also, the "founding fathers" weren't really libertarians; they were mostly the wealthy and educated elite that wanted to keep power and wealth within that group, which meant that you were a property owning white man. You had soldiers that weren't paid, poor treatment after, people passed-over, all sorts of the same shit we deal with now.

And rather than thinking of political identification through a spectrum, it's probably better to view it as intersecting interests instead as it's more accurate, but .

Maybe I should flee to a state with a lot of like-minded people and take it over, like the Mormons took over Utah and the Liberals took over California.
Click to expand...
This is nice and all, but "the Liberals" really only took over San Francisco, LA, and a couple other small spots. Area-wise, those are 2 blue spots in an ocean of red. Kinda like Austin in Texas. You're point is somewhat valid though, but you really need to understand the history behind the ability of those two "groups" to "take over." It's not as simple as just having a bunch of like-minded people move to a certain place.

Dohdough I'm all for helping people learn English and I would be willing to do it myself but you must admit it doesn't help or encourage them to want to blend in when you have either Spanish dubbed or subtitled versions of most, if not all popular American TV shows. Instead of SAP being used for subbing for Anime and other foreign language thing I never hear about it used except for Spanish. If someone would tell me otherwise I'd be elated as I find this a complete waste of it. Anyway, I mean this as part of a greater problem as well, like having voting ballots in other languages.
Click to expand...
That's because most immigrants are relegated to shit jobs with shit pay and shit hours that isn't really related to their ability to speak english when they don't have "professional" skill sets. And because of those shit jobs, they have no time and no resources to actually take those classes to gain more proficiency. Not to mention that school costs time AND money. When you're making shit pay on a work-visa or are undocumented, you get no federal or state financial aid grants.

If drive and motivation were an issue, some racists would say that the culture just doesn't value education, they wouldn't be working themselves to an early grave doing the work that they do.

Also I know what my name means in Korean and I'm learning it. The catch is everyone else, including Koreans and Japanese try to learn English and most Hispanics who are illegal don't, citing my above point. I think this might also contribute to more subpar English from even first generation Hispanics who do know English.
Click to expand...
Ah yes, the model minority. The problem when you bring up the Korean or Japanese immigrants is that they are more than likely already educated before they came here and had the resources to immigrate using "proper" channels. They're not refugees and if you looked at that population of SouthEast Asians, you'd see that they have similar socio-economic conditions as the black and Latino communities.
 
I read that the mother does speak some English, and she's taking an English class at a community college. She actually takes the bus to her English class.

Sarang01 - my political viewpoints are pretty similar to yours, except I don't have many problems with illegal immigrants (other than criminals, of course). That's not to say that I don't have a problem with illegal immigration, though. I put the blame on the the people that employ illegal immigrants.
 
Doh I don't have a problem with those courses being subsidized to some extent because if we're honest it hampers their assimilation not learning English and it also is an economic hindrance in doing commerce here.
I realize it's not as easy as moving to a state and taking over Doh but I want somewhere I don't have to pretend I don't believe what I believe to get elected. I don't think there's anything wrong with what I believe and a lot of people would likely fall where I believe.
When I say Old School and Daoist Libertarian what I mean is the following: I don't believe in mergers as they hinder competition and everyone, short of big shareholders and the winning CEO lose. I forgot to add it helps see infrastructure constantly revitalized. Imagine the extra 4G infrastructure that would be built if AT&T would have to create their OWN instead of buying T-Mobile's.
I also believe in a Corporation only being allowed to exist for 30 years, 35 at most if a Public Works project is being done. After that the assets would be sold, the stock liquidated and money given to shareholders according to the amount of shares they held.
Having a Corporation allowed to exist indefinitely violates nature and in this violation of such a big and mobile entity(unlike trees) we see a great malignancy. When people have Cancer, a pervasive malignant sort, they live, for a while, but eventually they die unless a cure is found. These everlasting Corporations are a giant tumor on this nation and so are these giant banks.
I also have an Albatross theory on what happens when an industry gets way too big and what it does to a nation in the process and why a successor must always be risen to compete with it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
bread's done
Back
Top