From Digg.com Sony loses patent lawsuit PS2 dead?

Voice 1:

Not my words. Didn't put it in a quote because that would ruin the formatting.

Source: http://www.mlgpro.com/forum/showthread.php?t=54225
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http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2006/03...l_shock_patent

Reports are trickling through this evening that Sony has indeed lost its patent case against Immersion technologies and will be forced to halt sales of its PS2 console.

Immersion last year sued Sony for infringing on its patents. Immersion claims that it owns the technology that powers the rumble in Sony's Dual Shock controllers. It also sued Microsoft for its rumble features in the Xbox, but the boys from Redmond settled out of court.

Sony fought on, and lost a case last year. However, it's been allowed to continue selling the PS2 pending appeal. If the latest reports are verified, it's lost that appeal today.

This means that Sony not only has to pony up and awful lot of cash to Immersion Technologies, but it has to stop infringing on the patent - that means stop selling kit which includes Dual Shock technology, and that means pulling the PS2 off the shelf.

Commentators are wondering if this case is the reason for the PS3 controller redesign that we've seen - it's possible the horrendous boomerang monstrosity doesn't infringe on patents.

Interestingly, Immersion is owned in part by Nintendo. The next-generation battle just took another twist...

Love the Dual Shock? Can't believe Sony will pull PS2 from the shelves? What exactly is Nintendo's game here, letting Microsoft settle and taking Sony to the cleaners? Let us know your speculation over in the forums, and we'll try to back up the reports we're seeing.


http://news.com.com/Sony+loses+round...3-6049177.html
(more info)


What does this all mean?


Sony's playstation has been virtually keeping the entire company above water. They don't have the revenue coming in to deal with such a loss. Sony isn't poor by any means (Nintendo is the smallest of the 3 giants, holding about $12 billion), but not only are they losing money on every year, not only do they have OTHER legal problems to deal with*

* http://www.businessweek.com/technolo...128_573560.htm

They have been doing better than they have been lately, but read this article carefully:
http://www.businessweek.com/technolo...109_265301.htm

-blu-ray is a crucial part of reviving sony, and is expected to lose $86 million by March 31rst
-blu-ray is also a crucial part of the ps3, another crucial part of reviving sony

They have already had to push back the PS3 launch to November (http://www.nni.nikkei.co.jp/), so things aren't going well for them. Why?

TOKYO (Nikkei)--Sony Computer Entertainment Inc. will delay the release of its PlayStation 3 next-generation video game console until early November because the copy protection technology for the Blu-ray Disc has not been finalized, The Nihon Keizai Shimbun learned Tuesday.


These lawsuits have been going on for years. Nintendo and Microsoft have both paid, settled, and signed contracts. Sony has just told Immersion, the company with the patent, "screw you".

Immersions standard rate is 5%, sony currently paying 1.37% due to a judge's decision, and due to the way the court battles have gone (Sony has lost everything in every aspect so far), Immersion could possibly double or even triple what they normally charge and get away with it.

Not only will sony have to pay, Immersion chooses whether or not the PS2, and any periphials using the technology (including games) could be released. There would have to be a worldwide recall, repackaging, and reshipping of all of the ps2 consoles.

It could end up costing Sony around $1 billion, at a time that they are trying very hard to to introduce both blu-ray and playstation 3, and right in time to compete with nintendo's revolution.

If playstation 3 IS going to be taking 50% losses as rumored, that will be a HUGE hit to sony. If they don't allow those losses, they would have to sell their system for a good $700 at the least. Compared to revolution's proposed $199-$249? That's a pretty steep buy.

Interesting. I wonder how this will effect the PS3. This could get really, really interesting.

I'll have to keep up with this news.

I think microsoft plays dirty..i think they push storys like this along..i think they spread rumors and I think they throw there money around a lil to much.

I hardly play my ps2 anymore I love my xbox live but im not buying a buggy slow 360 goodluck to sony if this is realy gonna hit them as hard as the article claims.

Interestingly, Immersion is owned in part by Nintendo.

Click to expand...

[quote name='Skelah']I think microsoft plays dirty..i think they push storys like this along..i think they spread rumors and I think they throw there money around a lil to much.[/QUOTE]

Do you have any evidence at all to back up something like this?

This is really interesting news, though. I wonder what, if any, impact it'll have on the next-gen console war. Things just aren't going right for Sony at the moment--if Microsoft and Nintendo can capitalize on that, Sony may finally lose the #1 spot.

na ..im just saying my opinon i mean i read these storys lately its been blue ray storys price problem storys..and the timing with it all ..it almost seems like someone just is out to scare people into not waiting on ps3.

[quote name='Skelah']I think microsoft plays dirty..i think they push storys like this along..i think they spread rumors and I think they throw there money around a lil to much.

I hardly play my ps2 anymore I love my xbox live but im not buying a buggy slow 360 goodluck to sony if this is realy gonna hit them as hard as the article claims.[/QUOTE]
Yah i even heard M$ (lololololoo getit) has a majik time machine to make sony look bad lol

[quote name='Skelah']na ..im just saying my opinon i mean i read these storys lately its been blue ray storys price problem storys..and the timing with it all ..it almost seems like someone just is out to scare people into not waiting on ps3.[/quote]

Not necessarily. The problems between the division of the next round of data via HD DVD and/or Blu-Ray as far as formats go was almost old-hat in most discussion groups (particularly those in the movie industry) as far back as a year or so ago. I think news regarding the problems and the various "we'll only back this format!!" sabre-rattling pretty much kicked into gear around two or so years ago while the technology was still being developed and information was starting to leak out.

Only recently, with the onset of this next generation of consoles, has it even become an issue and, since the PS3 is obviously going to be backing Blu-Ray and Microsoft opted for DVDs with HD DVD support in the future, all that's really going on is the furthering of the great HD DVD/Blu-Ray debate. I highly doubt that anyone other than the major tech companies that spent an astronomical amount of money in R&D particularly care about the argument enough to start bashing the other outright, although this has been a very vicious battle from the start with the whole "there can be only one" argument raging on.

[quote name='Scorch']Interesting. I wonder how this will effect the PS3.[/QUOTE]

I think I might know what that controller will look like,

[quote name='Pylis']Do you have any evidence at all to back up something like this?[/quote]

M$oft plays real dirty - I know that in the Linux case, they were one of three companies who significantly bankrolled Sco's ongoing fight to kill open-source Linux (the other two being Sun (Unix) and a VC firm that thought Sco could win two years ago)

I didn't hear that M$soft was involved in this patent case but it wouldn't surprise me, the American patent system is broken, and it just makes it easier for unscrupulous companies with a huge warchest and army of lawyers to bully their competition out of existence. I really haven't kept up with this particular case, but have seen plenty of unfortunate patent lawsuits (such as RIM vs Blackberry) threaten cool technology and the competitiveness of technology industry niches time after time - lawsuits that could have been avoided if the patent system was overhauled, the patent office was reorganized, and the entire government side of the patent process was sped up.

Guess what? Sony has just shot themselves in the foot. If you read the articles about this like I have they could have settled out of court but just had to fight it. So, if MS was smart enough to settle out of court good for them. You see they are still able to use it but Sony always trying to be bigger than everyone wouldn't listen so know they have to pay the cost to be the boss and it is going to cost them a lot.

[quote name='Graystone']I think I might know what that controller will look like,


[/QUOTE]

Graystone, it can still have the analog sticks but it just can't have the rumble feature.

Theyre not gonna take the PS2 off the shelves. Sony will probably just settle now for alot more than they would have if they hadnt fought this in court.

Who knew you could patent taking cell phone vibrating motors and sticking them into game controllers?

If worst comes to worst, Sony should develop a wireless dualstick controller without feedback (ala wavebird) and make that the standard pack in controller for the PS2...

[quote name='Puffa469']They're not gonna take the PS2 off the shelves. Sony will probably just settle now for a lot more than they would have if they hadn't fought this in court.

Who knew you could patent taking cell phone vibrating motors and sticking them into game controllers?

If worst comes to worst, Sony should develop a wireless dualstick controller without feedback (ala wavebird) and make that the standard pack in controller for the PS2...[/quote]

You really don't get a do over after you lose a court case. Yeah you can appeal, but unless they get another injunction, they just might pull PS2s off of the shelves until they pay in-full to Immerson(or whoever it was that is suing them).

It is sad people always trying to look for the easy way to make money, if Imersion had their patents done correctly this would not be an issue, no company microsoft/sony etc will blantantly rip off a patent and their Army of Lawyers would be able to decern the fine line between their respective companies "new idea" and old patented ideas.

I have a great idea that I wish people would steal from me and use. It is called a belt and it is used to beat the bottoms of the loud kids in public areas who don't follow the old rule of "kids are to be seen and not heard" (I prefer not even seeing the kids, keep them on you property until they reach legal working age) and "only speak when spoken to" and "to respect their elders".