3rd parties are deathly afraid of Nintendo

[quote name='dmaul1114']Final Fantasy X was very quick paced, XII looks even more so but I've not given it ago yet.[/quote]
FFX was quick paced because the game was entirely linear and tossed out the overworld map. FFX was usually poo-pooed on by those following the franchise as it started to mark the fall of it.

Besides, that game left me wondering why the hell I bothered to play if I was gonna find out that the main character was really just a dream (wtf?) and that the final boss was a ball that took over my summons' bodies.
 
Linearity never bothered me. Generally not a fan of open-ended, sandbox type games.

Guess because I grew up on simple 2D sidescrollers. Doesn't get any more linear than "Start on the left, go right until you reach the goal." :D
 
[quote name='io']Well, holy crap, that is a great deal. I feel ripped off paying $480 for an Elite with no games :cry:. And that makes me mad at MS. See, at least Nintendo stuff holds its value ;). But this strengthens my resolve on not buying a PS3 any time soon - I'll wait for some similar type bundle.[/QUOTE]


Well, if it makes you feel better, there's a good chance a lot of orders will get cancelled it seems.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']Well, if it makes you feel better, there's a good chance a lot of orders will get cancelled it seems.[/QUOTE]

Forgive the perpetuation of a thread hijack, but why would they be canceled? Are people ordering more than 1 to resell piecemeal for a tasty profit, or was this a price mistake?
 
[quote name='Mookyjooky']Nintendo is a juggernaut in the gaming industry, and hell they got grandma to play games. But Nintendo kinda did this to themselves. In the past they always set the standard for brilliant, innovative games... but lately stuff like Wii Sports, Wii Play, Donkey Kong Barrel Blast... it all is pretty... bland. You cant say Resident evil 4 sucks cause its a port, when Zelda and Super Paper Mario were as well. And even though Zelda and Super Paper Mario are fantastic games, they really didnt require Wii interactivity, or used to innovative control scheme primarily. (Meaning not there, or not tacked on as an after thought)[/QUOTE]

Why does everyone keep ignoring Corruption?
 
[quote name='mykevermin']Forgive the perpetuation of a thread hijack, but why would they be canceled? Are people ordering more than 1 to resell piecemeal for a tasty profit, or was this a price mistake?[/QUOTE]

Some peoples showed up as backorderd, and someone on slickdeals called and was told that all backordered ones would be cancelled.

Mine apparently has shipped though, so I should be good to go. :D
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']Well that problem is solved. Couldn't pass up the offer from Frys in the deal forum for a Pro 360 w/HDMI, Marvel:UA, Forza 2, Orange Box, Bioshock and Two Worlds for $399.99. Three $60 games for $50? That's a smokin' deal. Especially when Bioshock and Orange Box were among my most wanted 360 games. :D

Well, problem solved pending the orders not being canceled. But I've never had that problem with Frys.com[/quote]

Amazing deal...

A friend of mine was saying the PC orange box had vastly superior online than the 360 version.. who knows?

I still think after the first really huge Capcom or Squeenix title, the Wii will get a lot more third party software.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']Oh, bullshit.[/QUOTE]

Okay, so they do buy other kinds of garbage like Mario Party, but honestly, the original Xbox Madden beat the Wii version this year in sales.. The traditional "hot gotta have it MTV said so" type games just don't sell on Nintendo systems.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']Linearity never bothered me. Generally not a fan of open-ended, sandbox type games.

Guess because I grew up on simple 2D sidescrollers. Doesn't get any more linear than "Start on the left, go right until you reach the goal." :D[/quote]
That kind of thing typically works with sidescrollers, obviously. It generally doesn't go well with RPGs.
 
[quote name='Tsukento']That kind of thing typically works with sidescrollers, obviously. It generally doesn't go well with RPGs.[/QUOTE]

Depends on what you like, I guess. Of couse they can't be that linear, but they can be linear to the extent that you always know what you need to do/where you need to go next.

And for that I'll take a game like FFX over a game like Oblivion anytime. I don't have the attention span for open ended games.
 
I think it's all pretty obvious how things look to third party developers. If madden on the regular xbox really did sell more then the Wii version, the casual fans we've known for years aren't really into the Wii. I think it's safe to assume a new breed of casual gamers are into the Wii. Now, third party companies don't know the buying patterns of these new fans yet so they are taking a cautious approach.
 
[quote name='seanr1221']I think it's all pretty obvious how things look to third party developers. If madden on the regular xbox really did sell more then the Wii version, the casual fans we've known for years aren't really into the Wii. I think it's safe to assume a new breed of casual gamers are into the Wii. Now, third party companies don't know the buying patterns of these new fans yet so they are taking a cautious approach.[/quote]

I dont consider the Madden players as 'casual' gamers. I think of those people as 'mainstream' gamers. Guys who play Madden, Halo, and GTA games, along with other sports titles and maybe the odd GTA clone.

To me the 'casual' gamer is someone who likes puzzle games, and easy to pick up and play stuff. Thats the gamer Nintendo is going after, the person who plays Freecell and minesweeper at work. The person whos last console experience was playing Tetris on the original gameboy that belonged to their little brother. Girls who like Ms. Pacman and the Sims.
 
Current generation: The [Adjective] Gamer Wars.

Subcurrent generation: The "True" Gamers try to think up every possible [Adjective] Wars.
 
[quote name='Puffa469']I dont consider the Madden players as 'casual' gamers. I think of those people as 'mainstream' gamers. Guys who play Madden, Halo, and GTA games, along with other sports titles and maybe the odd GTA clone.

To me the 'casual' gamer is someone who likes puzzle games, and easy to pick up and play stuff. Thats the gamer Nintendo is going after, the person who plays Freecell and minesweeper at work. The person whos last console experience was playing Tetris on the original gameboy that belonged to their little brother. Girls who like Ms. Pacman and the Sims.[/QUOTE]


Semantics issue, but that's probably fair. The mainstream gamers who made the PS1 and PS2 raging success don't seem to be into the Wii if Madden is selling that poorly.

In the long run, that doesn't bode well for getting "mainstream" third party games, as they will likely keep focusing on "casual" games if that's what's selling well.

If that makes money for Nintendo, then that's great. System may definitely end up not being for me--or only being kept around for the 2 or 3 big Nintendo franchise games a year. But that bother's me less now that I finally have a 360 on the way to give me a more steady supply of real/mainstream/hardcore games.
 
If 3rd parties make crap that don't sell. Their fears are not justified. If you make crap, more than likely, they will sell like crap.
 
Just for fun, listed below is the Wii scheduled releases for the next 2 months. I do see alot of crap, but there's more than just one or two solid 3rd-party releases. I've put those in bold, a strikethru on 1st-party titles, and put what I think is crap in italics. Good but unremarkable games and questionable titles I have left normal.

Oct. 15: Sea Monsters from DSI Games
Oct. 16: Thrillville(R): Off the Rails(TM) from LucasArts
Oct. 22: EA PLAYGROUND from Electronic Arts
Oct. 23: Backyard Football from Atari, Inc.
Oct. 23: The Sims 2(TM) Castaway from Electronic Arts
Oct. 23: Rockstar Games Presents(TM) Table Tennis from Rockstar Games
Oct. 23: The Legend of Spyro(TM): The Eternal Night from Sierra
Entertainment, Inc.
Oct. 23: NARUTO(TM): Clash of Ninja(TM) Revolution from TOMY Corporation
Oct. 25: M&M'S(R) Kart Racing from DSI Games
Oct. 28: Guitar Hero III(TM): Legends of Rock from Activision
Oct. 29: Battalion Wars(TM) 2 from Nintendo
Oct. 30: Ben 10(TM): Protector of Earth from D3Publisher of America(R)
Oct. 30: Showtime(R) Championship Boxing(TM) from DSI Games
Oct. 30: NEED FOR SPEED PROSTREET from Electronic Arts
Oct. 30: THE SIMPSONS from Electronic Arts
Oct. 31: Manhunt 2(TM) from Rockstar Games
October: Spider-Man(TM): Friend or Foe from Activision
October: Bee Movie(TM) Game from Activision
October: Tony Hawk's Proving Ground from Activision
October: Ultimate Duck Hunting(TM) from Detn8 Games Ltd.
October: Mercury Meltdown Revolution from Ignition Entertainment
October: Namco Museum(TM) Remix from NAMCO BANDAI Games America
October: Code Lyoko: Quest for Infinity from The Game Factory
October: Avatar: The Last Airbender(TM) - The Burning Earth from THQ
October: Bratz: The Movie(TM) from THQ
October: Cars: Mater-National from THQ
October: Nicktoons(TM): Attack of the Toybots from THQ
October: SpongeBob's Atlantis SquarePantis(TM) from THQ
Nov. 5: Fire Emblem(R): Radiant Dawn from Nintendo
Nov. 6: DanceDanceRevolution Hottest Party from Konami Digital
Entertainment, Inc.
Nov. 6: LEGO(R) Star Wars(TM): The Complete Saga from LucasArts
Nov. 6: Mario & Sonic at the Olympic Games(TM) from SEGA
Nov. 12: Super Mario Galaxy(TM) from Nintendo
Nov. 13: Dragon Ball Z Budokai Tenkaichi 3 from Atari, Inc.
Nov. 13: Godzilla Unleashed from Atari, Inc.
Nov. 13: Lara Croft Tomb Raider: Anniversary from Eidos, Inc.
Nov. 13: BLOCKS from Electronic Arts
Nov. 13: MEDAL OF HONOR HEROES(TM) 2 from Electronic Arts
Nov. 13: LUXOR: Pharaoh's Challenge from MumboJumbo
Nov. 13: Geometry Wars(TM): Galaxies from Sierra Entertainment, Inc.
Nov. 19: Link's Crossbow Training(TM) (packaged with Wii Zapper(TM)) from
Nintendo
Nov. 19: SMARTY PANTS(TM) from Electronic Arts
Nov. 20: Jenga World Tour from Atari, Inc.
Nov. 20: Puzzle Quest: Challenge of the Warlords(TM) from D3Publisher of
America(R)
November: Trauma Center(TM): New Blood from Atlus USA
November: Star Trek: Conquest from Bethesda Softworks
November: Disney Princess: Enchanted Journey from Disney Interactive
Studios
November: Hannah Montana: Spotlight World Tour from Disney Interactive
Studios
November: High School Musical: Sing It from Disney Interactive Studios
November: Garfield Gets Real from DSI Games
November: Furu Furu Park from Majesco Entertainment
November: AMF Bowling: Pinbusters! from Mud Duck Games
November: Ghost Squad(TM) from SEGA
November: WWE(R) SmackDown(R) vs. Raw(R) 2008 from THQ
November: Brothers in Arms: Road to Hill 30 from Ubisoft
November: CSI: Hard Evidence from Ubisoft
November: My Word Coach from Ubisoft
November: Petz: Catz 2 (name not final) from Ubisoft
November: Petz: Dogz 2 (name not final) from Ubisoft
November: Petz: Horsez 2 (name not final) from Ubisoft
November: Rayman Raving Rabbids 2 from Ubisoft

That's a total of 61 titles on this list, and only 4 are 1st-party games.
Sooo....to break em down...

Activision: 4 games; Guitar Hero 3 should sell well; Spiderman, Bee Movie, Tony Hawk all seem "meh" but not necessarly shovelware
Atari: 4 games; most are "meh"; Jenga may be fun if done right
D3Publisher: 2 games; Puzzle Quest is good if you don't own DS or 360 version; Ben10=more liscenced crap
Disney Interactive: 3 games; all very "Disney" and uninteresting to most CAGs
DSI: 4 games; all are shovelware; these are the Chicken Shoot retards; don't buy this crap okay?
EA: 7 games; most are "meh, rent it"
LucasArts: 2 games; Lego Star Wars=good but just an upgraded port; Thrillville?=pass
Rockstar: 2 games; Table Tennis only if control is responsive; Manhunt 2 should sell very well
SEGA: 2 games; both solid titles; Mario & Sonic Olympic game should sell very well; Ghost Squad is looking good
Sierra Ent: 2 games; Spyro is "meh"; Geometry Wars is a port
THQ: 6 games; 5 are liscenced crap (Avatar, Bratz, Cars, Nicktoons, Spongebob); WWE if you like wrestling
Ubisoft: 7 games total; 3 crappy Petz games; Raving Rabbids sequel; 2 questionable (Bro in Arms & CSI); Word Coach=brain training-ish

The rest just have 1 game being released in the next 2 months. Some that stand out are: Tomb Raider: Anniversary (which is a port) & Trauma Center 2 (which should sell well).

Of all the 3rd-parties, it looks to me that EA has the strongest lineup, but almost all of those are multi-platform titles. THQ and Ubisoft are the only others that are releasing as many games, but most of theirs are liscenced crap.

In my opinion, over 75% of all these games should retail at under $20, but we all know most will not. I do like that corny Ghost Squad Japanese trailer...it made me lol when they started hiding behind the sofa:lol:

There's not a huge amount of exclusives on that list, but when you look at the 360 & PS3 lists for the next 2 months, there's not any more for them either. If anything, I think there's more solid Wii exclusives coming (if you count 1st party titles) than the other major consoles. But that's just my opinion.

I do think its important to note that 3rd-party developers will be watching console sales VERY closely this holiday, and when it comes down to it, the highest install base is the console they'll be supporting the most next year despite their fears for the future. And if the PS2 is anything to go by, the highest install base will get the most shovelware, and there's nothing anyone can do about this.
 
And just to show that these things are not absolute, I would take a few of your "crap" titles off that status for sure. For example, Mercury Meltdown Revolution is a $19.99 title that has gotten solid reviews from European review sites. In fact, it is the 13th best-reviewed title on Metacritic for the Wii (at a 75 average). I'm not sure why you put it in that category. I would make that a solid 3rd party release on your list!

Also, things like EA Playground have potential (I'd put it in the wait-n-see category). Sure, it is a "casual" game, but not necessarily a crap one. Also, I'd move Rayman Raving Rabbids 2 into the solid category (way more than that overhyped POS Rockstar Table Tennis at least).

In any case, the 3rd party release schedule is not as bad as I thought it was and certainly not as bad as everyone here makes it out to be...
 
[quote name='io']
In any case, the 3rd party release schedule is not as bad as I thought it was and certainly not as bad as everyone here makes it out to be...[/quote]

My point exactly. I saw this list after reading through this thread and was surprised myself. I think its a pretty solid holiday lineup.
 
for me the problem, is there just isnt much that i HAVE to buy.
and its really not that big of a problem at all.
i would like to see more games that interest me but im not everyone.

one thing id like is to stop seeing the shelves lined with retarded petz, bratz, and chicken shoot games.
 
[quote name='io']And just to show that these things are not absolute, I would take a few of your "crap" titles off that status for sure. [/QUOTE]

And to go the other direction, there are many not marked as crap that I would mark as crap.

Only Super Mario Galaxy is a must buy from that list, and probably only another 3 or 4 games I have any interest in renting or checking out when they hit $20 or under.

So, as with anything to do with games, it's entirely subjective.
 
[quote name='The Crotch']Not wanting to check GameRankings, I'll give you point B, but point A is ludicrous. Of course there's a huge amount of filler on Sony's previous consoles: they've been out a billion years longer and dominated the market to a much greater degree than the Wii has thus far.[/QUOTE]

Okay, sure. I wasn't suggesting that it would never happen, or even that it's really all that big of a problem.

[quote name='Krymner']Just for fun, listed below is the Wii scheduled releases for the next 2 months. I do see alot of crap, but there's more than just one or two solid 3rd-party releases. I've put those in bold, a strikethru on 1st-party titles, and put what I think is crap in italics. Good but unremarkable games and questionable titles I have left normal.[/QUOTE]

Well done with the list. It also excludes some random games, like Victorious Boxers, Zack and Wiki, and presumably others, which is weird, because I know that's straight from Nintendo.

[quote name='dmaul1114']And to go the other direction, there are many not marked as crap that I would mark as crap.

Only Super Mario Galaxy is a must buy from that list, and probably only another 3 or 4 games I have any interest in renting or checking out when they hit $20 or under.

So, as with anything to do with games, it's entirely subjective.[/QUOTE]

Fair enough. But then the problem isn't "the console doesn't have enough real games to keep me satisfied," is it? There are absolutely more "real" games on that list than anyone could play in two months. It's like saying the 360 doesn't have any good games coming out in the fall, to which someone responds "Halo 3, Call of Duty 4, and The Orange Box." "Yeah, but I don't like shooters." Well, there ya go. Someone with a Wii and a broad range of interests in games has at-least-reasonably-good WWII shooters, strategy roleplaying games, minigame collections, wrestling games, puzzle/RPGs, arcade sports games, adventure games, racing games, action games, music games, and platformers to look forward to. If you don't care for those genres, no problem, but that's not really the point you've been making.

I'd still love to know what must-buys on the 360 are going to be picking up the slack for you, because this fall/winter, I've got the Wii and the 360 in a deadheat for games (In descending order from "sure thing, must have" to "I'll probably buy it, assuming the reviews hold up," I'm planning on Galaxy/Mass Effect, Call of Duty 4/Zack & Wiki, and Assassin's Creed/Umbrella Chronicles or Moh2).
 
[quote name='trq']
Fair enough. But then the problem isn't "the console doesn't have enough real games to keep me satisfied," is it? There are absolutely more "real" games on that list than anyone could play in two months. It's like saying the 360 doesn't have any good games coming out in the fall, to which someone responds "Halo 3, Call of Duty 4, and The Orange Box." "Yeah, but I don't like shooters." Well, there ya go. Someone with a Wii and a broad range of interests in games has at-least-reasonably-good WWII shooters, strategy roleplaying games, minigame collections, wrestling games, puzzle/RPGs, arcade sports games, adventure games, racing games, action games, music games, and platformers to look forward to. If you don't care for those genres, no problem, but that's not really the point you've been making.
[/quote]

Fair enough, I could have worded it better. My main issue is "The Wii doesn't have enough games I consider to be AAA in genres I like to keep me satisfied." I've never said it doesn't have any games, just not enough to float my boat. Factor in the non-HD graphics ruling out any multiplatform games, and it's pretty thin. Just Mario as a must buy this year with Smash Bros slipping, and just a few games like Zak and Wiki that I may rent if I have time.


I'd still love to know what must-buys on the 360 are going to be picking up the slack for you, because this fall/winter, I've got the Wii and the 360 in a deadheat for games (In descending order from "sure thing, must have" to "I'll probably buy it, assuming the reviews hold up," I'm planning on Galaxy/Mass Effect, Call of Duty 4/Zack & Wiki, and Assassin's Creed/Umbrella Chronicles or Moh2).
Click to expand...

In no particular order, here all that interest me in the two consoles libraries from launch through the end of the year.

Wii Must Haves through 2007: Zelda, Metroid Prime 3, Mario Galaxy
Wii Possible buys/rents: Zak and Wiki, Wii Zapper with Zelda, Resident Evil: UC, Warioware

360 Must Haves through 2007: Gears of War, Oblivion, Halo 3, Bioshock, Orange Box, Mass Effect, Sports Sims (NCAA Football, Fifa etc. will buy here for HD Graphics), Call of Duty 4
360 Possible buys/rents: Virtua Fighter 5, Viva Pinata, Assassin's Creed, Rock Band (and possibly GH2 & 3 if I decide to sell the PS2). I guess I'll throw Forza 2, Marvel: UA and Two Worlds in here as well, since I'd have put them here if the weren't already bought via the Fry's Bundle.

Guess I could also add that XBLA excites me more than the Wii VC as the latter is overpriced IMO. Especially since most that I'm interested in replaying I could legally emulate since I still have the carts boxed up somewhere.

So there's just more "must buy" type games on the 360 that excite me (in large part from being out 2 years and me just not getting one). Nothing wrong with the Wii library on it's face really, it's just not sufficient to be my number 1 console.

The Wii will either stay in my home theater just to play the big Nintendo games and the very infrequent third party game just like the N64 and GC, or I'll sell it and go 360 only (tempting since this year will have already seen a Zelda, Mario and Metroid which are my main Nintendo franchises).
 
I hope dumbmaul does sell his Wii after Galaxy.

Then he wouldn't be around in here anymore to end every post with some whiny emo "I'm going to sell my system" cliche.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']Fair enough, I could have worded it better. My main issue is "The Wii doesn't have enough games I consider to be AAA in genres I like to keep me satisfied." I've never said it doesn't have any games, just not enough to float my boat. Factor in the non-HD graphics ruling out any multiplatform games, and it's pretty thin. Just Mario as a must buy this year with Smash Bros slipping, and just a few games like Zak and Wiki that I may rent if I have time.




In no particular order, here all that interest me in the two consoles libraries from launch through the end of the year.

Wii Must Haves through 2007: Zelda, Metroid Prime 3, Mario Galaxy
Wii Possible buys/rents: Zak and Wiki, Wii Zapper with Zelda, Resident Evil: UC, Warioware

360 Must Haves through 2007: Gears of War, Oblivion, Halo 3, Bioshock, Orange Box, Mass Effect, Sports Sims (NCAA Football, Fifa etc. will buy here for HD Graphics), Call of Duty 4
360 Possible buys/rents: Virtua Fighter 5, Viva Pinata, Assassin's Creed, Rock Band (and possibly GH2 & 3 if I decide to sell the PS2). I guess I'll throw Forza 2, Marvel: UA and Two Worlds in here as well, since I'd have put them here if the weren't already bought via the Fry's Bundle.

Guess I could also add that XBLA excites me more than the Wii VC as the latter is overpriced IMO. Especially since most that I'm interested in replaying I could legally emulate since I still have the carts boxed up somewhere.

So there's just more "must buy" type games on the 360 that excite me (in large part from being out 2 years and me just not getting one). Nothing wrong with the Wii library on it's face really, it's just not sufficient to be my number 1 console.

The Wii will either stay in my home theater just to play the big Nintendo games and the very infrequent third party game just like the N64 and GC, or I'll sell it and go 360 only (tempting since this year will have already seen a Zelda, Mario and Metroid which are my main Nintendo franchises).[/quote]
Again. The same post from all year round. I could find six different threads where you post the exact same content. You must really like reading your own posts and you're really coming off as a douchebag. I almost want to say you're jollydwarf with a different name.
 
I don't like reading my posts, but I like annoying the hell out of you guys.

Mission accomplished. ;)

Aside from the occasional worthwhile deal in the deals section, about the only purpose this site serves is to entertain me at work (yes stuck in office on a Sunday) or during other down times (i.e. on the laptop during commercials during Red Sox game last night) by riling up the fanboys. What can I say, time goes faster by being a douchebag online, especially when loser fanboys and hardcore gamer nerds are involved. :D
 
Number of times dmaul reads my posts despite me being "on ignore": 3

Suspicious I'm actually ignored: very low.

Chance of dmaul being a baby: Absolute.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']I don't like reading my posts, but I like annoying the hell out of you guys.

Mission accomplished. ;)

Aside from the occasional worthwhile deal in the deals section, about the only purpose this site serves is to entertain me at work (yes stuck in office on a Sunday) or during other down times (i.e. on the laptop during commercials during Red Sox game last night) by riling up the fanboys. What can I say, time goes faster by being a douchebag online, especially when loser fanboys and hardcore gamer nerds are involved. :D[/quote]
As I've said before, basically you're trolling. You add nothing to any thread you post in and then just admit that you're doing it to piss people off. I have half a mind to report you to the mods.
 
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