Any Cheap Ass Parents Here? The CheapAssParenting Thread!

[quote name='Dead of Knight']This. That sounds really unnecessary and they may even just be putting on a show for touring parents. Though the price quoted in the OP, $170 a week, doesn't sound like he's getting totally hosed either depending on which part of the country he lives in.

The reason why I say it might just be for show is because my friend used to work in a daycare/preschool as an art teacher and they would do stuff for show there as well. I asked her about this and she said, "When we had a tour, someone would go and tell all the rooms so they could be on their best behaviours and make it look like we were 110% involved. Not that it affected me since i did my job, but it definitely changed how other teachers acted."

So yeah, buyer beware, but like I said, I don't think $170 a week is really getting hosed for a safe daycare.[/QUOTE]

We actually visited unannounced for that very reason. They had no idea that we were stopping by. The daily schedule distributes education and play in a reasonable manner. I would say it's approximately 60% play with 40% education that can be considered "play" (arts, crafts, and such).

We live in northwestern VA (not quite NOVA)... and the cost of daycare for most locations here hovers around $120-$150 per week. The other appealing aspect about this location (other than the academic accreditation and emphasis on learning through play) is class size. She will be one of only six kids in her class. With a high teacher to child ratio, she's guaranteed not to get lost in the shuffle.

Oh... and the other kids appear to be "clean." We visited a few locations where the kids just looked like they crawled out of the gutter. I understand that not all families have the necessary means to dress their children in upper tier attire, but you can at least make sure they're clean and relatively presentable.

This place also has an entrance system that requires anyone who chooses to enter the facility to use hand sanitizer before being allowed through the door. Not a big deal... but I though it was a nice touch. It's a very clean daycare. Cleaner than my own home.
 
Well that's good to hear then. Sounds like at the very least a decent place. My friend who just had a baby is staying home with the kid because it's fucking $250 a WEEK in Rhode Island. Just insane.
 
[quote name='metaphysicalstyles']We actually visited unannounced for that very reason. They had no idea that we were stopping by. The daily schedule distributes education and play in a reasonable manner. I would say it's approximately 60% play with 40% education that can be considered "play" (arts, crafts, and such).

We live in northwestern VA (not quite NOVA)... and the cost of daycare for most locations here hovers around $120-$150 per week. The other appealing aspect about this location (other than the academic accreditation and emphasis on learning through play) is class size. She will be one of only six kids in her class. With a high teacher to child ratio, she's guaranteed not to get lost in the shuffle.

Oh... and the other kids appear to be "clean." We visited a few locations where the kids just looked like they crawled out of the gutter. I understand that not all families have the necessary means to dress their children in upper tier attire, but you can at least make sure they're clean and relatively presentable.

This place also has an entrance system that requires anyone who chooses to enter the facility to use hand sanitizer before being allowed through the door. Not a big deal... but I though it was a nice touch. It's a very clean daycare. Cleaner than my own home.[/QUOTE]

If you can afford $480/ month for daycare, you can probably afford nice clothes for the kid.

My Dad volunteers at the church in rural MN and he said it's $220 /week. Crazy.
 
My other half gave up her career to raise our kids so we wouldn't have to do daycare. It could've been me, but I don't drive and cars are very necessary down here for things like doctor visits and Daisy Scouts. I would've done it in a heartbeat though. How on earth can other people care for your kids anywhere near as well as you? When you know that your time with them is so fleeting and you love them so damn much, how can you stand to put them somewhere you're not?

We get by on way less money and a way smaller house, and I doubt that I'll get to move back to the UK any time soon, but there's a lot of love here and I wouldn't trade it for anything. I wish we had made the decision not to put our first child in daycare, but certainly her sisters have reaped the rewards. We've never missed any of their milestones and have had the pleasure and privilege of watching them turn from tiny pink fleshy things into little people.

Talk of daycare being important for social development is a crock and an excuse to dissipate parental guilt, similar to the justification for letting babies "cry it out." Kids cry because they want their parents; you feel bad because parents are supposed to be with their kids. Simple as that. And as for socialization, my kids like other kids just fine and see them at other activities that *don't* last for hours and keep them away from a parent all day. Not being in daycare didn't hurt them a bit (if they grow up to be Ted Bundy-a-likes though, you can totally be the first to say "told you so.")

In case anyone out there thinks I'm getting all high and mighty about being a better parent than them, two things: 1) I suppose I am in a way, but don't think I don't appreciate good dads trying to do what's best for their kids - if only more dads were that involved and educated and 2) full disclosure: fiscally liberal socially conservative unschooler here so if you don't like my post, you can simply say "harrumph, one of those freaks," ignore it and carry on with your day raising your beautiful babies.
 
[quote name='metaphysicalstyles']She's a doc. Still not sure why she married me. As for her looks... yeah. I'll admit that I've approached her more than once (candidly) about starting a cam operation. Talk about doing something for the ol' masculinity thing
[/QUOTE]

The talk of having a hot doctor wife who could set up a cam site made me think of Zoidberg.

Well don't look into it, but I'm a respectful internal medicine doctor.

As for me, I design mansions, then live in them.
 
there are worse things than daycare....like having a jerk for a parent


meta- one thing I did was negotiate a 4 day work week with my employer when my daughter was born. Probably not realistic for everyone but it doesn't hurt to ask. My wife is a doctor as well and she also had a 4 day work week. So we only did daycare part time and each got to spend a day with the my daughter.
 
[quote name='usickenme']there are worse things than daycare....like having a jerk for a parent


meta- one thing I did was negotiate a 4 day work week with my employer when my daughter was born. Probably not realistic for everyone but it doesn't hurt to ask. My wife is a doctor as well and she also had a 4 day work week. So we only did daycare part time and each got to spend a day with the my daughter.[/QUOTE]

Where are all these people finding doctor wives and tell me where to find one.

Also, you have to have a doctor for a wife to afford a kid!
 
[quote name='usickenme']there are worse things than daycare....like having a jerk for a parent


meta- one thing I did was negotiate a 4 day work week with my employer when my daughter was born. Probably not realistic for everyone but it doesn't hurt to ask. My wife is a doctor as well and she also had a 4 day work week. So we only did daycare part time and each got to spend a day with the my daughter.[/QUOTE]

We must have parallel lives. :) My wife also only works four days a week. She has Wednesdays off... so the longest string of days that the baby will be at daycare is two. I unfortunately will be working a five weekday week. :cry:

Perhaps after logging some time at my new job, I'll consider looking into having a weekday off. Not sure if it will happen though... coordinating Distance Education for a University is generally a 9-5, M-F gig.
 
Just thought I'd share my experiences with you since I was in a similar situation and my 1y/o son started day care a month ago. It took him about two solid weeks to get adjusted to being left there, but the teachers were great and would get him to stop crying within seconds of him realizing I was going to leave him there. Now, he doesn't cry when I drop him off and just runs over to the toys to play with his "buddies." I do wish that they had some sort of webcam where I could see him playing throughout the day because I do find myself missing him quite often. One thing you will definitely need to do is arrange a backup sitter as she will be getting sick a LOT! Out of the month my son has been in day care, he has literally brought home a different illness each week, and since your new job is not likely to be very understanding about you having to take so much time off even though you just started, you'll need to arrange some sort of a backup plan. The benefits are that they can learn a lot from other children right now, and my son seems to be doing something different nearly every day now. I'm really impressed with his progress. I read something about taxes. My fiancee' and I file seperately on our taxes and when you do that only one of you can claim a child. As far as the law goes, it's the person who pays for more than 50% of the cost of taking care of the child is supposed to claim him. What we do, is use something like turbo tax and work up both of our returns and see who gets more money back for claiming him. Last year she got about $1000 more than I would have gotten back, plus she gets a break on tuition since she's in school part-time. Just my two cents.
 
[quote name='2DMention']
I have a cousin who's wife is an exec. at a bank, and she bankrolled him to start a beer brewery business. They go on vacations all the time to Germany. :drool:[/QUOTE]

That's just it though - he's running his own business now. Generally speaking, men who don't work don't respect themselves as much as men who do.
 
Thanks for the encouragement h0tr0d!

I feel like a should elaborate on our financial situation... I feel like I came off snob nob.

Yes... we have a rather nice combined income. She does the doc thing at a family practice, I push buttons at a University. When our paychecks are deposited, it looks really nice. HOWEVER, what I neglected to add is our combined debt (or her debt, I should say). At the moment, she still owes approximately $110k in med school bills. Add the $10k I owe for my student loans, various credit cards, her new car payment, house payment, daycare, other life expenses, and suddenly our monthly income is only a fraction of what was actually deposited.

Example... I've been dying to get a nice new couch. Unfortunately, unless I want to finance one (which I don't), it's kind of out of reach at the moment.

It's not so bad that I have to whore myself out to big women... but it's not so cushy that I can just go out and buy a couch. I believe we figured that we will be clear of our debt in approximately 7 years. That's considering that we continue to pay a bit more than the minimum monthly payments every month.

In the meantime, I will continue dreaming of having a nice new couch.
 
Not the mention that Family Docs are the worst paid in the business..it a decent gig but not like the old days

if you want that couch- get your wife to do some "expert witness" work. Ka-Ching!
 
[quote name='usickenme']Not the mention that Family Docs are the worst paid in the business..it a decent gig but not like the old days

if you want that couch- get your wife to do some "expert witness" work. Ka-Ching![/QUOTE]

This is true. However, as a "business partner" at the family practice, she makes a bit more than the other doc who isn't in the fold.

But yes... she could make more in an ER even.
 
[quote name='Thekrakrabbit']You rich jerk, vacationing and putting your kid in prep-school daycare. :rofl:[/QUOTE]
Yup, sounds nice tip for sure.
 
[quote name='olde_english']How on earth can other people care for your kids anywhere near as well as you?[/QUOTE]

I don't know what kind of daycare you put your first into, but ours has trained professionals that teach new vocabulary, activities, and songs every day, have an amazing play yard beyond anything we have at home, and most importantly friends his age he can interact with. He met a "best friend" there that he pals around with.

That's not to say they care for our son "better" than us. This isn't a competition. They provide supplementary experiences and activities beyond our own.

When you know that your time with them is so fleeting and you love them so damn much, how can you stand to put them somewhere you're not?
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You said you go to work, right? Same reason as you. Because you believe the sacrifice you make will ultimately provide a better life for your child. The trick is finding proper balance.

Talk of daycare being important for social development is a crock and an excuse to dissipate parental guilt, similar to the justification for letting babies "cry it out."
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Frankly, it seems like YOU are the one trying to dissipate parental guilt.

Nobody is saying you *have* to go to daycare for proper social development. Daycare provides a convenient conduit for socialization - but you can get that through other channels such as family gatherings, going to parks where there are other kids, friends, etc. Daycare is particularly nice because it is a controlled, reliable environment, but again, doesn't have to be through daycare.

Kids cry because they want their parents; you feel bad because parents are supposed to be with their kids.
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Babies cry because that is how they tell you they want something. If your baby cries because s/he wants candy, do you just give him/her candy? No, because you need to keep a semblance of discipline so that crying doesn't become nothing more than a manipulation tool and so that your child doesn't become a spoiled brat. My son cries every now and then when he is dropped off and it's heartbreaking. But then he sees a friend or some food or a toy he likes and the waterworks stop right away.

As far as daycare acclimation, this varies from child to child - some may have separation anxiety beyond the norm. It's your job as a parent to determine where to draw the line.
 
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[quote name='Eltis']
Babies cry because that is how they tell you they want something. If your baby cries because s/he wants candy, do you just give him/her candy? No, because you need to keep a semblance of discipline so that crying doesn't become nothing more than a manipulation tool and so that your child doesn't become a spoiled brat. My son cries every now and then when he is dropped off and it's heartbreaking. But then he sees a friend or some food or a toy he likes and the waterworks stop right away.[/QUOTE]

There is a bit of confusion here. I don't consider a "baby" one who would eat candy. In my mind, and I think many others who write about/debate this issue, a baby is generally from birth to around one year or less. At this age I believe they are unable to "manipulate." I think this is where the cry-it-out folks think those opposed to it are trying to say never let your child cry - even if they are 16 and want a new car! It's not like that. Those opposed to cry-it-out are opposed to anyone who says you should let your BABY cry instead of comforting/providing for them.

Being a new parent (and a soon-to-be stay at home dad) me and my wife have delved pretty deep into a variety of parenting theory books. We've come out on the side of *gasp* attachment parenting. It is the style that fits US. I don't think we could do the detached, cry-it-out, rigid scheduling thing even if we wanted to. From what all I've read/seen/heard there seems to be two pretty distinct camps. We read Baby Wise but tossed it aside for Dr. Sears.
 
[quote name='Eltis']
Frankly, it seems like YOU are the one trying to dissipate parental guilt.

Nobody is saying you *have* to go to daycare for proper social development. Daycare provides a convenient conduit for socialization - but you can get that through other channels such as family gatherings, going to parks where there are other kids, friends, etc. Daycare is particularly nice because it is a controlled, reliable environment, but again, doesn't have to be through daycare.[/QUOTE]

Dude, I don't have *any* parental guilt because either myself or my wife are always with my children. Like bordjon, we're really into attachment parenting and it's worked out awesomely for us.

You said in your previous post that daycare was essential for social development and honestly that was the little item that caused me to post - had you originally posted the above para, I probably would've kept on browsing.

Most of the "teachers" at daycare couldn't give a flying fuck about your kids. Certainly the State Of Texas' requirements for professional childcarers are quite dismal. Development and stimulation is usually the last thing on both the carers' and the parents' minds; they want your money or to start evangelizing (if they're church-affiliated), and you need somewhere to drop off your kids because you don't have family that will watch them and your career is really important to you.

Sweeping generalisation? Probably not, might not apply to you but applies to most. I used to work for a company that vetted daycares for corporate relocation firms, so I know a little about this - I've seen plenty of sick kids dropped off for "development" because Mommy and Daddy both couldn't miss their respective meetings.

No-one ever read a forum post that made them completely change their mind on a topic, but let me say this:
Styles, your little poppet will likely be off to school in a couple of years. Your new couch can wait, and the loans aren't going anywhere. You'll never get back that time without her though.
Eltis, I'm glad you want to do right by your family, I just think unless poverty is compels you (and I've been there), a family is better served by having a good parent like you around more, especially in the early years.
 
Nothing good ever comes from others telling others what's the best way to parent.

Kids who are raised by a full time parent turn out fine. And some don't. Kids who are in day care from 6 months on turn out fine, and some don't. There's no one perfect way to parent.

If I ever have kids--doubt I will as I turn 32 tomorrow and still have zero interest in them--mine would be in day care most likely. At least if with my current long-term girlfriend as we're both career focused people who love our jobs and there's no way either of us would quit or take a few years off etc.
 
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The armchair psychologists in this thread are making my head spin.

Your child will most likely develop fine if he or she is staying at home or in a daycare. It wont have an effect on attachment. Trust me.
 
Styles, your little poppet will likely be off to school in a couple of years. Your new couch can wait, and the loans aren't going anywhere. You'll never get back that time without her though.
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Well... this was a bit of a surprise.

First of all, I'm not sending my child to daycare so I can get a couch. I'm sending my child to daycare because I feel that it is time. She is more than ready to start interacting with other children... and she's also more than eager to learn. I'll admit... we obviously taught her most of everything she knows. However, I have not been able to teach her many social skills. Or, to be more specific, how to interact with other children. I would hate to send her to kindergarten one day with ZERO interpersonal skills. Not only would she have detachment issues from only being around her parents, she would have no clue how to interact with the other children.

I've had more time than most with my child. She is ready for things that I can't provide... additional interaction with humans that are her age.

Sounds more like you are padding your own sense of self. There's attachment parenting, and then there's the inability to put down the leash.
 
[quote name='seanr1221']The armchair psychologists in this thread are making my head spin.

Your child will most likely develop fine if he or she is staying at home or in a daycare. It wont have an effect on attachment. Trust me.[/QUOTE]

That's all probably true and I'm definitely not a trained psychologist. But my niece is. She has a phd in developmental psychology from Georgetown and focused her studies on children in the criminal justice system. She is director of Kids Count - a national data collection program on child well being. She is someone I have talked with a good bit regarding all this stuff. Styles, she actually works and lives in Richmond for Voices for Virginia's Children.

http://www.vakids.org/
 
[quote name='olde_english']a family is better served by having a good parent like you around more, especially in the early years.[/QUOTE]

he was around the first 16 months. That is a key development time.

and attachment parenting creates kids that waste 20 minutes of my kids class time crying for their parents at the beginning of every school day.
 
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Styles, your little poppet will likely be off to school in a couple of years. Your new couch can wait, and the loans aren't going anywhere. You'll never get back that time without her though.
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I also didn't want to remain unemployed for more than 18 months. When you work in a technology based field, time away can make your resume obsolete. My education and experience is concentrated on technology (old, new, and future). If I was to remain unemployed for more than a year, I would be losing tons of experience relating to new technology standards and practices. Telling your future supervisor that you've been keeping up with new technology via the internet just isn't going to cut it.
 
Don't feel a need to defend yourself. There's nothing wrong with wanting a career and putting your kid(s) in day care. As long as you're putting in the parent time in evenings and weekends, the kid will turn out fine (or if not it's not due to poor parenting!).

Some people are fine with their only purpose in life being raising their kids. Others just want that to be part of their life and want a career along with it. Others are like me and don't really want kids and want to focus on career and themselves etc.

Different strokes for different folks. There's not wrong answer besides neglecting kids--but having a career does not mean neglecting one's kids as they'll be in school M-F from age 5 on anyway.
 
[quote name='metaphysicalstyles']After living life as a stay-at-home dad for the past 16 months.....
It's a flat $170 per week......

.......
Does anyone have any experience in similar situations? Any advice?

Thanks![/QUOTE]
I'm not a parent but I know enough. As I've seen some other people have answered already, it is good for the kids to get into social environments where they can learn to socialize with other children and not just learn from daddy. It's very important for your kid to learn essential things of life and out meeting with other children.

You may even want to consider another daycare. 5 to 1 seems like way too personal for me. They won't meet a lot of children and really get the chance to socialize with that type of ratio. It's good to have them in daycare too for reasons that they'll learn the alphabet there and lots of other learning to be done.

You could watch the movie Parenthood. It's really great and shows different ways that people mess up parenting. In one case the father is abusive, another case the parent (Rick Moranis) is forcing all this knowledge to his daughter but she never has a chance to socialize and meet other children.

Most often it's better to have them in daycare then to be at home.

Source: College courses in Psychology, Sociology, and life experience.
 
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[quote name='metaphysicalstyles']Well... this was a bit of a surprise.

First of all, I'm not sending my child to daycare so I can get a couch. I'm sending my child to daycare because I feel that it is time. She is more than ready to start interacting with other children... and she's also more than eager to learn. I'll admit... we obviously taught her most of everything she knows. However, I have not been able to teach her many social skills. Or, to be more specific, how to interact with other children. I would hate to send her to kindergarten one day with ZERO interpersonal skills. Not only would she have detachment issues from only being around her parents, she would have no clue how to interact with the other children.

I've had more time than most with my child. She is ready for things that I can't provide... additional interaction with humans that are her age.

Sounds more like you are padding your own sense of self. There's attachment parenting, and then there's the inability to put down the leash.[/QUOTE]

Sense of self? Inability to put down the leash? Come the fuck on sunshine, I just recognise that my kids' development is more important to me than to some daycare director/pretend teacher and being no less qualified and way more personally invested, I should probably take care of it myself.

My issue was with the other chap saying daycare was essential before he flip-flopped. I don't seriously think you're selling your kid out for a couch - I do think you are shortchanging yourself and that little cutie though.
 
I still don't see how I am "shortchanging" myself. I've spent the last 16 months with her... 10-12 hours a day, just my daughter and I. I've been able to see all of her milestones. First solid poo, laugh, word, steps, fragmented sentence... everything. She speaks, walks, jumps, plays, slides, swings, climbs, colors, pretends, hides, smiles, laughs... she does it all. The only thing that I will be missing out on is the refinement of these abilities.

It's going to be a little while before she has any other epic milestones.

Oh... and the "daycare" she'll be attending isn't stocked full of "pretend teachers." They are actual kindergarten/pre-K teachers with degrees. The school is the only "daycare" in the area that is SACS accredited. This is by no means your typical baby jail.
 
[quote name='bordjon']That's all probably true and I'm definitely not a trained psychologist. But my niece is. She has a phd in developmental psychology from Georgetown and focused her studies on children in the criminal justice system. She is director of Kids Count - a national data collection program on child well being. She is someone I have talked with a good bit regarding all this stuff. Styles, she actually works and lives in Richmond for Voices for Virginia's Children.

http://www.vakids.org/[/QUOTE]

You don't have to throw all of your niece's credentials at me. I'm just saying, a child can easily have a secure attachment to a parent if they are in a daycare. Just look up the Strange Situation task.

As for letting them "cry it out" I don't agree with that either. However, a child CAN manipulate a parent with crying. Don't think of it in a sense that the baby thinks, "Oh man, I have to wake mom up cause it's 3am." It's more like, "I got this for crying before, if I cry again, I will get it again."
 
[quote name='seanr1221']You don't have to throw all of your niece's credentials at me.[/QUOTE]

Just trying to give a little credence and validate my armchair psychology.

Not to worry - I didn't throw them ALL at you ;) (but here are a few more for you! her mom, my sis, has masters degrees in early childhood and psychometry!) I mentioned my niece also because she is in VA and that's where the OP lives - thought he might be interested in/familiar with her organization.

I'll let you get back to your armchair psychology now...
 
[quote name='Dead of Knight']First solid poo is considered a milestone? :lol:[/QUOTE]

First solid poo is definitely a milestone!! I was so excited, I took several photos and recorded video of it. :D
 
Shoot - right now we get excited every time our daughter poops! She's breastfed and only poops like once a week now - freaks me out!
 
[quote name='bordjon']Just trying to give a little credence and validate my armchair psychology.

Not to worry - I didn't throw them ALL at you ;) (but here are a few more for you! her mom, my sis, has masters degrees in early childhood and psychometry!) I mentioned my niece also because she is in VA and that's where the OP lives - thought he might be interested in/familiar with her organization.

I'll let you get back to your armchair psychology now...[/QUOTE]

Oh ho ho, time to drop some knowledge on you, then.

https://openaccess.leidenuniv.nl/retrieve/2104/168_094.pdf

Looks like infants who were securely attached spent more hours per week in day care. You don't have to be all over your baby to have them develop a secure attachment. You DO realize (or maybe it didn't mention it in your books) that the Strange Situation task can be used across almost all cultures, and you'll see the same signs of attachment. So the parent who puts their baby to work in a third world country, can still have the same exact attachment you will have in America.

Secure attachment is important, I don't want you to think crying it out is a good thing, because it's not. But you can be an "attached parent" and have your child in daycare most of the day. You also ignored my point about babies being able to manipulate behavior through crying. Since you feel that my operant definition of reinforcement theory is my own version of armchair psychology, I'd love to see you refute it.
 
[quote name='seanr1221']Oh ho ho, time to drop some knowledge on you, then.

https://openaccess.leidenuniv.nl/retrieve/2104/168_094.pdf

Looks like infants who were securely attached spent more hours per week in day care. You don't have to be all over your baby to have them develop a secure attachment. You DO realize (or maybe it didn't mention it in your books) that the Strange Situation task can be used across almost all cultures, and you'll see the same signs of attachment. So the parent who puts their baby to work in a third world country, can still have the same exact attachment you will have in America.

Secure attachment is important, I don't want you to think crying it out is a good thing, because it's not. But you can be an "attached parent" and have your child in daycare most of the day. You also ignored my point about babies being able to manipulate behavior through crying. Since you feel that my operant definition of reinforcement theory is my own version of armchair psychology, I'd love to see you refute it.[/QUOTE]

I'm not sure if you are arguing with yourself or another poster here or what. I haven't said anything at all regarding day care - I have no problems with the op or anyone, myself included, using day care. I mentioned that me and my wife have chosen the "attachment parenting" style and that it seems to work for US. It's a rather broad spectrum of approach really. I'm not sure if you are jumping down my throat because of that or what. I did talk about CIO specifically as it relates to a baby (0-12m). I disagree with your point about "babies" (0-12m) being able to manipulate. I think they cry for more instinctual reasons - I'm hungry, I'm in pain (gas, too hot/cold, etc.), I'm scared. I fully believe as they grow older than one year they can and do learn about manipulation and pushing boundaries.
 
[quote name='metaphysicalstyles']First solid poo is definitely a milestone!! I was so excited, I took several photos and recorded video of it. :D[/QUOTE]

Sure, I was excited when my kittens finally got their bowels sorted out and stopped making liquid diarrhea, but I did not take any evidence of it. :lol:

[quote name='bordjon']Shoot - right now we get excited every time our daughter poops! She's breastfed and only poops like once a week now - freaks me out![/QUOTE]

That sounds odd, but I bet it's different for every baby and probably normal if the doctor is ok with it. My friends got a daughter who is a month and a half old and is a breast-feeding and pooping machine.
 
[quote name='Dead of Knight']That sounds odd, but I bet it's different for every baby and probably normal if the doctor is ok with it. My friends got a daughter who is a month and a half old and is a breast-feeding and pooping machine.[/QUOTE]

Yeah it's odd but apparently very normal. Doc says babies process breast milk very efficiently. Doc and a couple of lactation consultants as well as several friends have all said no worries. She is 7 weeks and the slowdown started about 2 or so weeks ago. When it comes though man look out - it's a lot!
 
[quote name='bordjon']I'm not sure if you are arguing with yourself or another poster here or what. I haven't said anything at all regarding day care - I have no problems with the op or anyone, myself included, using day care. I mentioned that me and my wife have chosen the "attachment parenting" style and that it seems to work for US. It's a rather broad spectrum of approach really. I'm not sure if you are jumping down my throat because of that or what. I did talk about CIO specifically as it relates to a baby (0-12m). I disagree with your point about "babies" (0-12m) being able to manipulate. I think they cry for more instinctual reasons - I'm hungry, I'm in pain (gas, too hot/cold, etc.), I'm scared. I fully believe as they grow older than one year they can and do learn about manipulation and pushing boundaries.[/QUOTE]

You're missing the point. You can 'choose' attachment parenting while sending the child to daycare. It's pretty much exactly what I said in my first post, which you quoted and then talked about your niece.

As for it working, I encourage you to try the strange situation task yourself, and see if your baby has a secure attachment.

And yes, a baby can manipulate you through crying. Once again, don't look at it as in the baby thinks, "Oh boy, I'm gonna piss off mom and dad and scream!" Behavior manipulation isn't always like that.

http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthom...he Role of Pitch and Duration in Adults' .pdf
 
So I'm taking her tomorrow for a half-day. Tuesday will be her first full day... but I thought a half-day would be good to get her feet wet.

She's been really sweet lately... actually running around the house saying "skooow."

Hopefully she'll adapt quickly.
 
Metaphysics - Congrats - Hope all goes well. Be strong.

To everyone posting in the topic, clearly there are strongly opinioned people on both sides. It's funny, the only other time I've seen such heated debate on the internet was on a forum talking about vaccinnations and kids. It's great that people feel very strongly about their own side on these arguments, since it isn't SONY/MS/Nintendo fanboyism, but about your kids. It's like an adult-oriented loud argument.
 
I wish I had the money to send my nearly three year old. Thankfully she's not as 'odd' as her mildly-autstic brother. But she could definately benefit from more of a social and structured enviornment. There's only so much Dora can teach her.
 
[quote name='Frankski']

To everyone posting in the topic, clearly there are strongly opinioned people on both sides. [/QUOTE]


Nah it's pretty much one douche telling us we are all selfish pricks for sending out kids to daycare.
 
Well... Zoe (my daughter) had a really BAD first day at daycare. As I mentioned, we only sent her for a half-day. Unfortunately, in the 4 hours that she was in attendance, she cried several times, didn't want to be part of the group, and fell on her face while playing outside. So I go to pick her up, and there she sits with a goose egg on her forehead, the tip of her nose skinned, a scratch on her cheek, and a busted pinky knuckle.

The daycare seemed to handle the accident quite professionally. They treated her with ice and cleaned the wounds, as was listed on the incident report which I had to sign. However, before signing, I had them list all injuries other than the knot on her head.

Tomorrow is my first day back to work. So not only do I have the stress of starting a new job, but I also have to worry about my daughter getting killed at daycare.

I understand that today's incident was a mere accident, but I can't help wanting to kill. This sucks.
 
[quote name='seanr1221']You're missing the point. You can 'choose' attachment parenting while sending the child to daycare. It's pretty much exactly what I said in my first post, which you quoted and then talked about your niece.

As for it working, I encourage you to try the strange situation task yourself, and see if your baby has a secure attachment.

And yes, a baby can manipulate you through crying. Once again, don't look at it as in the baby thinks, "Oh boy, I'm gonna piss off mom and dad and scream!" Behavior manipulation isn't always like that.

http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthom...he Role of Pitch and Duration in Adults' .pdf[/QUOTE]

I never said attachment parenting and daycare were mutually exclusive. I even said I had no problem with myself using daycare AND that we chose the attachment parenting style. I was just trying to determine what ruffled your feathers. I see it is the CIO/manipulation thing now.

The article you link is is neat and all and even has the word manipulation used several times. All I see though is they manipulate the pitch and duration of a cry with a computer to find that higher pitch longer cries get quicker and more attention. They found that also with babies who are having what would be considered more pain would elicit the higher pitch longer duration cry. It never says anything about a child learning to manipulate their own cry to receive a quicker or more serious response.

I still believe a baby/infant cries for more instinctual reasons. That's a baby/infant - not a toddler or a tween or an adult ;)

Styles, that does suck but it sounds like the day care did a good job of handling it. It sounds like you are very conscientious and found a good day care. Give it a little time and I bet she'll settle in nicely.
 
[quote name='olde_english']
You said in your previous post that daycare was essential for social development and honestly that was the little item that caused me to post - had you originally posted the above para, I probably would've kept on browsing.
[/QUOTE]
I was like "What? I never said that" and I looked back and my post and sure enough, I did. Poor choice of words on my part. Second post clears it up, but I do need to call myself out on the original goof.

Most of the "teachers" at daycare couldn't give a flying fuck about your kids. Certainly the State Of Texas' requirements for professional childcarers are quite dismal. Development and stimulation is usually the last thing on both the carers' and the parents' minds; they want your money or to start evangelizing (if they're church-affiliated), and you need somewhere to drop off your kids because you don't have family that will watch them and your career is really important to you.
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I feel bad that this is what was available to you. That's why I spent a good paragraph talking about spending time determining what kind of care your child is getting. Of course, some won't have that option, and that needs to factor into the decision as well. I guess we got lucky with ours because my wife works at a hospital and the daycare there is partially subsidized. Also, we are in CA so the laws are stricter with adult/child ratios and so forth.

Eltis, I'm glad you want to do right by your family, I just think unless poverty is compels you (and I've been there), a family is better served by having a good parent like you around more, especially in the early years.
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We'll agree to disagree. We didn't put our child into daycare until after 1. And even then, only when we found the right fit for him. So in some sense, we may be on the same page on some issues even if we fundamentally disagree.
 
I guess we got lucky with ours because my wife works at a hospital and the daycare there is partially subsidized. Also, we are in CA so the laws are stricter with adult/child ratios and so forth.
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The university I work for has a daycare program as well... but the last time I was there on a work related task, I witnessed something horrifying. Three kids were seated at a table smearing glue all over it, and then licking their hands. Best of all, at the same table sat TWO daycare workers complaining about their sex lives.

Oh... in case I didn't mention before, I'm going back to work at the same place I worked before. Different job, different department, much different pay (in a good way).

Zoe has recovered from her traumatic first day of daycare. Nothing a nap, some Neosporin, and extra kisses can't cure. She does look a bit like a prize fighter on the losing end though.
 
This has been a great read, my wife and I are expecting our first in March. As it stands right now, I'm going back to finish my degree and luckily my sister is moving from Florida to live with us and do her grad work, so we should be covered for a while.
 
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