Beware of Paypal's buyer "protection" and eBay scammers

banpeikun

banpeikun

CAGiversary!
Feedback
65 (100%)
Here's a warning to my fellow CAGs. I bought something from a seller
called "tothemaxgames" on eBay with 2000+ feedback. Anyway, I didn't
arrive after a couple weeks, so I sent him an email. Then I looked at
his feedback again, and apparently lots of people had not gotten their
stuff, and he was no longer a registered user.

So I figure, no big deal, I missed a pretty decent deal, but I'll get
my money back because I'm covered under paypal buyer protection right?
So I apply at Paypal for a refund, then they wait for 10 days for the
seller to "respond." Anyways, finally at the end of the 10 days,
Paypal says okay, you were right, you didn't get your item, and you
should get your money back. But we can't give it to you. Here's the
exact email paypal sent me. So be careful of bidding on stuff that's
likely to be a scam. You are supposedly covered by Paypal's buyer
"protection" but if the scammer knows what he is doing and isn't
freakishly obvious on eBay like the italiancharm person, they don't
get caught until they've gotten the money out of their paypal account.
And then you don't get anything back. Paypal says, "sorry."

Email from Paypal below
--

Dear so and so,

After careful review, we have concluded our investigation of the Buyer
Complaint described below.

We have decided in your favor, however, we were unable to recover any
funds
from the seller's account. As stated in the PayPal User Agreement,
recovery
of funds associated with a Buyer Complaint cannot be guaranteed.

We will make our best effort to recover the funds in question if they
become available in the seller's account in the future. Please be
assured
that we will also take appropriate action against the seller's account,
which may include limitation of the seller's account privileges.
 
That's almost the exact same email I received four years ago! It's good to see that not much has changed at PayPal since eBay took over.
 
What was your source of funds? If you used a credit card dispute the charge. I had the same thing happen to me. Paypal couldn't get the funds, so I disputed it with my credit card company. They reversed the charge.
 
always try to make u rpurchase via a credit card if paying thru paypal. paypal can't get all ur money back if u have a dispute with an buyer/seller. CC companies have protection against disputes and give u credit back more likely than paypal
 
i had the same problem. the guy even switched his name on ebay and made antoehr paypal account. Paypal said they couldnt take it from the new account because that was not hte account associated with my transaction. Basically i was sol. Good thing AMEX is going to get my money back from paypal and paypal can go to hell!
 
[quote name='ImmortalfWd']What was your source of funds? If you used a credit card dispute the charge. I had the same thing happen to me. Paypal couldn't get the funds, so I disputed it with my credit card company. They reversed the charge.[/QUOTE]Hey that's a good idea. I paid for it with my discover card.

Actually, I've been on the other end of a reverse (just this week). On Aug 11, I sold a lot of MTGO cards (they're digital objects for an online game if you don't know). The buyer had 0 feedback, but he paid right away, so I was like, whew, it's not a deadbeat bidder. So I give him the cards since paid the money. End of story, right? No, a month later (this week), paypal takes $400 out of my account. I'm like wtf is this, and they said the paypal account holder said the funds were not authorized. Basically they claimed (probably truthfully) that their account was hacked (more likely they fell for one of those spoofed paypal emails). So I call Paypal and talk to them, and they say basically that I'm screwed.

I hate eBay and Paypal. They pretend to be so nice and guaranteed and secure, but actually they're anything but. I've been on eBay since 1997 and Paypal since 1999, but these are the first times I've run across bad transactions. When put to the test, eBay and Paypal fail miserably to do anything to fix the situation.
 
I'm sorry dude. I totally agree their "protection" is a joke.

I learned from experience to always fund with a credit card when using PayPal, despite all their "it's safe to use your bank account!" notices. Thing is, I was mildly stupid -- I bought a frequently-scammed item (limited edition Japanese GBA SP) at a pretty decent price and didn't notice the seller wasn't PayPal verified. When the item never arrived, I read up and learned the following things: 1) their protection guarantees ONLY that they'll try to track the person down for you and request a refund. (What scammer would roll over for that limp authority?), and 2) I didn't qualify for any assistance because the seller was unverified. After I got my credit card to refund me the money (easy as pie I might note), PayPal had the gall to send me a letter reminding me to use their services next time! Yeah right.

But, you bought from a 2000+ seller -- no one would expect them to suddenly go bad. Bad luck, that.
 
That's frustrating. Sorry to hear that happened.

A year or so ago my account mysteriously bought a $400 camera I'd never heard of or looked at. It took more than a month, but Paypal finally gave me my money back. Apparently I'd been hacked somehow.

-M
 
[quote name='Machikunas']That's frustrating. Sorry to hear that happened.

A year or so ago my account mysteriously bought a $400 camera I'd never heard of or looked at. It took more than a month, but Paypal finally gave me my money back. Apparently I'd been hacked somehow.

-M[/QUOTE]Yeah, suddenly, my credit card company is like a hero compared to those Paypal clowns.
 
Keep in mind some sellers will refuse any Credit card payments for that exact reason (reversales). I am very wary of selling anything over $100 and accepting paypal. Just ALWAYS use Delivery Confirmation, it MA help you out with Paypal.
 
As a general rule:
Paypal has NO protection for sellers who are the victims of fraudulent CC chargebacks.
Paypal has NO protection for buyers who are the victims of sellers 'disappearing' (if they pay with something without fraud protection like a bank account)

Of course if you don't accept Paypal you lose like half your prospective bidders so Ebay owns us basically.

I agree with the DC suggestion. I always add free DC and insurance to big ticket items to deter scammers. Never been ripped off as a seller but as a buyer...man people salivate over people like me who pay through a bank account. I should really switch over soon.
 
i got fucked a few months ago also. paypal said oh you were right......and we recovered 0.00 back. We will get you back the rest when the funds become available.

What those asshats do know is that we were ripped off but they dont understand that the people who ripped us off, are not going to put the money back in their account. They got paid and then Paypal let them take all the money out so later after the complaint, there would be nothing for Paypal to take. Its really not Paypals problem. They dont care that you got ripped off. As long as they never get ripped off.
 
I was just wondering. If a buyer was trying to do a charge back, but the seller didn't have any money in their account, is their any way Paypal could get still get the money from the seller? Say, from their bank account or something?
 
[quote name='darkcrawlspace']I was just wondering. If a buyer was trying to do a charge back, but the seller didn't have any money in their account, is their any way Paypal could get still get the money from the seller? Say, from their bank account or something?[/QUOTE]No, I asked my friend at Paypal that same question (because when I got hit by the $400 chargeback, it left me at -$100). Anyways, it's illegal for Paypal to just draw the money out of your accounts. They send it to their collections people who hound you like a credit card company would.

If you don't pay up you're basically screwed since you can't sign up for another Paypal account with any of the same ccs, bank accounts, email addresses, or home addresses. If you can avoid using any of the same information and avoid getting caught by your name or IP or anything, the only drawback is you live like a kind of online fugitive as well as taking a hit to your credit.
 
[quote name='banpeikun'] the only drawback is you live like a kind of online fugitive as well as taking a hit to your credit.[/QUOTE]

So a PayPal account in default with an outstanding balance IS reported to credit agencies?
 
Yeah. We all know ebay and paypal sucks when it comes to user protection. They're both great services, but they're "USE AT YOUR OWN RISK" services, which is quite sad.
 
[quote name='banpeikun']No, I asked my friend at Paypal that same question (because when I got hit by the $400 chargeback, it left me at -$100). Anyways, it's illegal for Paypal to just draw the money out of your accounts. They send it to their collections people who hound you like a credit card company would.

If you don't pay up you're basically screwed since you can't sign up for another Paypal account with any of the same ccs, bank accounts, email addresses, or home addresses. If you can avoid using any of the same information and avoid getting caught by your name or IP or anything, the only drawback is you live like a kind of online fugitive as well as taking a hit to your credit.[/QUOTE]

Sorry to hear about the chargeback you got screwed on, but thanks for the info. I'm currently involved in an ebay transaction with an absolutely idiot. I put an auction up that clearly stated that I only ship within the United States. The guy wins the auction, and I find out he's located in Thailand. So he emails me and tells me that he wants me to ship the item to his friend in America, since he won the auction, and I won't ship out side of the U.S. So I have absolutely no clue what to do, because he already sent the payment. But I know he might be scamming me. So either I risk it and keep the money. Or end the transaction now just to be safe. Which would you recommend? And is their an option on ebay where you can set up your auctions to prevent unwanted bids from members who arent within your shipping radius?
 
I looked this this seller's feedback on ebay. Even though he has 2000+ feedback, he has way too many negative feedback to be a trustworthy seller. His positive feedback is less than 95%. And in the most recent month, he has 161 positive, 40 neutral, and 99 negative. That's only around 50% positive.
 
So why doesnt paypal just use that scammers credit card, charge them for the amount they owe you. When they dispute it say "you signed the agreement".
 
[quote name='mookiemeister']I looked this this seller's feedback on ebay. Even though he has 2000+ feedback, he has way too many negative feedback to be a trustworthy seller. His positive feedback is less than 95%. And in the most recent month, he has 161 positive, 40 neutral, and 99 negative. That's only around 50% positive.[/QUOTE]That's because he ripped a ton of people off at once. Rewind to August 2 when I won his auction. He had 99+% positive feedback. There's a window of like two weeks where he can list auctions and get paid and no one realizes he's not shipping out stuff anymore until it's too late. Obviously no one bought stuff from him when his last 100 feedback are all negative.
 
It goes both ways. I sold a card for 173.00 shipped to someone in france. I sent registered and all that good stuff. My mistake was that Pay Pal doesnt protecet sellers that send something to anywhere other than Canada, UK, and USA. If the buyer says they didnt get it, your acct gets locked up hella quick. I bluffed the buyer. They said they paid for all kinds of fee's and im trying to screw them. So i told them my post office sent an international inquiry about the package and that it was delivered so i could prove they lied. The paperwork was on its way and to expect fraud charges to be filed. Next day the dispute was dropped cause the buyer said it was settle "amicably"
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
bread's done
Back
Top