BIOSHOCK - Gen. Discussion & Info

[quote name='magiic']fuck Im loving this game but holy crap the big daddy's are hard to kill. Is there any real strategy to them so I dont get ass raped everytime I face one[/QUOTE]


If it's early in the game, you're going to use up a lot of ammo, it's just how it is. Also, use tons of electric buck and anti-armor rounds. They can hardly move with the shock from the electric buck. And depending on what plasmids you can, it can be easier.

But they get a lot easier later on. I killed a Big Daddy literally within 3 seconds because of the traps I set. Pissed me off too, I went back to a section and he was all up on my ass for some reason, he probably walked into a mine or a trap bolt that I set and forgot about. I thought that was really cool though, the AI still goes on by itself despite you not even being in the same level.
 
anyone kno what a good weapon to upgrade 1st is?
im thinkin of raising machine gun dmg or something with shotgun

i just beat
peach wilkens
 
[quote name='magiic']fuck Im loving this game but holy crap the big daddy's are hard to kill. Is there any real strategy to them so I dont get ass raped everytime I face one[/QUOTE]

Electric gel from the chemical thrower can also work wonders once you have the research damage bonuses (and the consumption upgrade). Just keep inventing electric gel. Use a combination of that and electric buck, and the big daddies are just too easy.
 
When do you get an upgrade for more powers (I forget what they're called...the ones mapped to LT). I've only got two slots now for four powers and unless there are tons of gene banks in the second level, it's gonna be slightly annoying having to switch back adn forth at one.
 
[quote name='SteveMcQ']When do you get an upgrade for more powers (I forget what they're called...the ones mapped to LT). I've only got two slots now for four powers and unless there are tons of gene banks in the second level, it's gonna be slightly annoying having to switch back adn forth at one.[/QUOTE]
You're so early in the game do you really want to be told?

You have to spend your Adam to buy extra slots at a Gatherer's Garden.
 
[quote name='AshesofWake']hey anybody have this problem. I loaded my end game save right before the final hurrah. And then i went back to pick up missing diaries, weapon upgrades and such. But holy shit, the game keeps freexing randomly ever 10 seconds. It freezes, then it's okay, it freezes, then it's okay, it freezes, then it's okay. It's the most annoying shit ever and all im doing is walking around. I loaded a new game, and no problems there at all. It's only my end game save that is doing this. Anybody else have this problem? Im really starting to get pissed..... :bomb:[/quote]

Use the hard drive cache clearing trick mentioned somewhere in this thread. I did that and it fixed the problem for me.
 
[quote name='bortle']Use the hard drive cache clearing trick mentioned somewhere in this thread. I did that and it fixed the problem for me.[/QUOTE]


oh really? ok cool. ill try it out..now to find the method...lol
 
Just finished my first playthrough on medium or whatever it's called. Got 790 pts on one playthrough without really searching for everything. Going to start playing again tomorrow on Hard to get the last of the achievements.

Definitely the best game since like OOT. I gave it a 9.7, which places it only below OOT, LTTP, and Warcraft 2 in my book, and about equal with Starcraft.
 
Ah. Just beat the game. 810 points, not too shabby. After a lot of bickering back and forth, and even saying that this game doesn't deserve the tens well...it doesn't. But its very fucking close. I think you have to finish the whole game to fully see what the game has to offer. I watched the ending, and just thought to myself what an incredible experience that was. Seriously, I'll eat my words, one of the best games I've played.

I LOVED the ending
Watching the Little Sisters jump all Fontaine, oh man that was awesome. Hearing them yell "Kill him!" in their cute little voices, actually brought a smile to my face. Sick I know.

But..
Fontaine was fucking weak. I beat him in literally less than 60 seconds. With all that build-up and that was it. Lame. Still, amazing game.
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']
But..
Fontaine was fucking weak. I beat him in literally less than 60 seconds. With all that build-up and that was it. Lame. Still, amazing game.
[/QUOTE]

I agree. I was expecting a second fight after you sucked out all the adam (maybe there is one if you don't save the girls?)

Either way, the ending cinematic was beautiful.
 
[quote name='lordwow']
I agree. I was expecting a second fight after you sucked out all the adam (maybe there is one if you don't save the girls?)

Either way, the ending cinematic was beautiful.
[/QUOTE]
Nope. Same crappy endboss fight. The ending was okay, but I wish it had cinematics (like the bad ending), instead of still pictures.
 
[quote name='lordwow']
I agree. I was expecting a second fight after you sucked out all the adam (maybe there is one if you don't save the girls?)

Either way, the ending cinematic was beautiful.
[/QUOTE]

Totally agree. It was a weird feeling.
I felt really good inside. IDK it's weird having such a sense of moral vindication from a videogame. I was genuinely happy to see the girls grow up and experience life, and it was very sweet for them to show up on your death bed.
 
All these damn spoiler tags are getting to me. I've barely scratched the surface of the game, but I don't have much time to play. Ugh. It's like holding a bat in a fine china shop. I wanna do it, but I know it's wrong.... Must find time to play through this game.
 
Well, my post-game conclusions. (These are OMEGA-CLASS SPOILERS)

The good ending was one of the most awesome good-guy moments in all of gaming. Watching the girls come to grab your hand as you lay in your death-bed was the most good guy awesomeness I've gotten in video games since saving Christmas in EBA.

Of course Fontaine was weak. System Shock 2's final bosses were equally unimpressive.

Really, when you get right down to it though... wasn't that the absolute most ridiculous, dumbest, most completely absurd plan known to mankind? I almost didn't believe the "Would you kindly" bit because it was so moronic. You want to kill Ryan, so the only way you can do it is to clone his child, accelerate his growth, send him BACK TO THE SURFACE, have him CRASH AN AIRPLANE AT PRECISELY THE RIGHT TIME (He'd be lucky to survive!), find his way through Rapture, marvel at the fake death of your fake family, and kill Ryan, even though you could have just said "Would you kindly kill Ryan?," even though RYAN WAS IN A fuckING UNDERSEA TIN CAN THAT COULD HAVE BEEN PENETRATED IN ANY THOUSAND LESS STUPID WAYS?!

In the end, a really, really stupid story told really, really well. A worthy sequel to Bioshock, but the less time spent actually thinking about the sequence of events in the plot vis-a-vis Fontaine and Ryan, the better. Which is probably why the endings were FMVs completely to that central struggle.
 
[quote name='RollingSkull']Well, my post-game conclusions. (These are OMEGA-CLASS SPOILERS)

The good ending was one of the most awesome good-guy moments in all of gaming. Watching the girls come to grab your hand as you lay in your death-bed was the most good guy awesomeness I've gotten in video games since saving Christmas in EBA.

Of course Fontaine was weak. System Shock 2's final bosses were equally unimpressive.

Really, when you get right down to it though... wasn't that the absolute most ridiculous, dumbest, most completely absurd plan known to mankind? I almost didn't believe the "Would you kindly" bit because it was so moronic. You want to kill Ryan, so the only way you can do it is to clone his child, accelerate his growth, send him BACK TO THE SURFACE, have him CRASH AN AIRPLANE AT PRECISELY THE RIGHT TIME (He'd be lucky to survive!), find his way through Rapture, marvel at the fake death of your fake family, and kill Ryan, even though you could have just said "Would you kindly kill Ryan?," even though RYAN WAS IN A fuckING UNDERSEA TIN CAN THAT COULD HAVE BEEN PENETRATED IN ANY THOUSAND LESS STUPID WAYS?!

In the end, a really, really stupid story told really, really well. A worthy sequel to Bioshock, but the less time spent actually thinking about the sequence of events in the plot vis-a-vis Fontaine and Ryan, the better. Which is probably why the endings were FMVs completely to that central struggle.
[/QUOTE]

I was actually going to post a question to try and clear up the story for me. I personally didn't like the diary story-telling system. A lot of the time I'd start playing one, then completely stop paying attention, or if Atlas or whoever said something to me over the radio, again, sometimes I would stop listening since you CAN just keep playing. But, with the diaries, I would usually find a corner and start playing one.

But the radio messages are scripted for certain points in the game, and at times, you're fighting, just finished a fight, or are about to get into a fight, thus not allowing yourself to give full attention to the person talking to you.

If Bioshock 2 comes along, I'd love to see a mix of cutscenes AND diaries. I thought the cutscene where you first get a plasmid was great. It was very well done, and hardly took you out of the gameworld, which I think is a BS excuse BTW. But anyways, I wasn't able to think too much about the story after I beat it since I had to run over to my friend's house immediately after.

Thanks for clearing it up for me. That's actually what I thought the story was, but I was like, no, it can't be that stupid. This game is too smart for that. I guess not. I was more confused than anything when they showed that short sequence of the player as a baby...I actually thought the story wasn't told all that great, again, mainly because of the radio messages and diaries. But the story itself is fine, though still retarded.

And I totally agree about the "would you kindly" shit. I actually went "pfft" and snickered when I heard it explained. But after that, I actually felt bad about killing Ryan...especially with a golf club, Jeez. He was a very gray character where I wasn't even sure why he should die or why he should live. Good stuff there.

And yes, if you read my post. The good guy ending is AMAZING.

And also actually
I watched the "evil" ending on youtube. Jeez. I'm pretty sure if I got that ending, I'd be calling this game the most overrated piece of trash to grace gaming. Because if you couple that bullshit ending with the pretty retarded story (that still works)...you got bad news

And to SteveMcQ - I know how you feel. I haven't been able to play videogames just about all summer because of work and other stuff. But since my internship ended last Thursday, it's been Bioshock constantly. I played the games throughout 4 days total. The first day I played about 4 hours, and didn't get back to it until a week later when work ended for me. Then it was 2 days straight, 4 1/2 hour and 6 hour sessions, then Labor Day, whereI wasn't quite sure how long I played, but I think in the 4-5 hour range.
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']I was actually going to post a question to try and clear up the story for me. I personally didn't like the diary story-telling system. A lot of the time I'd start playing one, then completely stop paying attention, or if Atlas or whoever said something to me over the radio, again, sometimes I would stop listening since you CAN just keep playing. But, with the diaries, I would usually find a corner and start playing one.

But the radio messages are scripted for certain points in the game, and at times, you're fighting, just finished a fight, or are about to get into a fight, thus not allowing yourself to give full attention to the person talking to you. [/quote]
The radio messages are archived in the Back menu.

The diary story-telling was a LOT better fleshed out in System Shock 2. There was lots more in the way of actual story-telling. Would the two lovers make it out safely? What is up with the weaselly Korenchkin and the gruff, glory-hound Diego? Exactly how apeshit is security chief Bronson going? Will you finally meet Delacroix? Is she a pawn of the villain?


Thanks for clearing it up for me. That's actually what I thought the story was, but I was like, no, it can't be that stupid. This game is too smart for that. I guess not. I was more confused than anything when they showed that short sequence of the player as a baby...I actually thought the story wasn't told all that great, again, mainly because of the radio messages and diaries.

And I totally agree about the "would you kindly" shit. I actually went "pfft" and snickered when I heard it explained. But after that, I actually felt bad about killing Ryan...especially with a golf club, Jeez. He was a very gray character where I wasn't even sure why he should die or why he should live. Good stuff there.

And yes, if you read my post. The good guy ending is AMAZING.
Click to expand...
Ryan had to die. He whacked the only likeable, self-aware member of the cast: Crazy plant lady. Not to mention the folks he butchered in his war with Fontaine.

Really, I think the diaries succeeded in places. The story of Ryan's mistress was told nicely, even if it lacked an ending. Only slight problem is precisely how much time had passed between your getting here and the events on the diaries. How many of these folks actually coexisted with the monsters you end up fighting?

Additional observations:

I'm glad the Randianism wasn't preachy, but Ryan's death was stupid as hell as well, even independent of the plot twist.

Also, seriously, where did Fontaine get all the adam he stuck himself with for the boss battle? That part was stupid as well
 
[quote name='mr ryles']hopefully I will beat this game today, can finely read whats behind all these spoiler tags.[/quote]
Really, if you've gotten to Andrew Ryan, you've seen everything in the spoiler tags except the bits about the ending.

Also, yes, Happy Panda, I agree with you completely about the evil ending. Hell, I'll say it outside of spoiler tags. Everyone playing should shoot for the good ending.
 
[quote name='RollingSkull']Really, if you've gotten to Andrew Ryan, you've seen everything in the spoiler tags except the bits about the ending.

Also, yes, Happy Panda, I agree with you completely about the evil ending. Hell, I'll say it outside of spoiler tags. Everyone playing should shoot for the good ending.[/QUOTE]

Yes agreed. Get the good ending. Start over if you have to (not really...well maybe)
Just watching the evil ending on youtube made me go WTF, can't imagine how I would've reacted if I actually spent 20 hours to get that garbage.

Also
I felt bad for Ryan mainly because he was your typical character who wanted to do good and change the world, but of course loses their way along the way.

Yeah I know the messages are achived. But IDK, I don't feel I should have to put effort into re-reading the story, but I probably will.
 
I am still playing through this....I think I am getting near the end. Had a few late nights with my rental copy. Overall, pretty fun game...I want to keep seeing "What is next", although, it was a bit repetitive.

I just became a BIG DADDY, so not sure how much more I have to go
 
[quote name='doubledown']
I just became a BIG DADDY, so not sure how much more I have to go
[/QUOTE]
One more level and the endboss. It was about thirty minutes from there, for me.

[quote name='RollingSkull']Also, yes, Happy Panda, I agree with you completely about the evil ending. Hell, I'll say it outside of spoiler tags. Everyone playing should shoot for the good ending.[/QUOTE]
If you would actually even consider harvesting a little sister, then you fucking deserve the crappy ending you sack of shit.
 
[quote name='PyroGamer']If you would actually even consider harvesting a little sister, then you fucking deserve the crappy ending you sack of shit.[/QUOTE]

I've been harvesting those whores with no remorse.
28.gif
 
I don't know, reading a bunch of today's posts I'm beginning to wonder about the 9.7ish score I gave it. The game is amazing, and clearly in 9.0+ territory, but a lot of people pointed out some pretty big flaws.

A few end thoughts:
I thought the "would you kindly" thing was pretty clever. I noticed him saying it, but didn't think of that.

I feel like an idiot for not realizing Atlas = Fontaine until the twist. I knew something was up when the tape right before you meet Ryan, Atlas doesn't have his accent, and instead has his Fontaine voice. But from the earlier audio clips I thought Ryan had killed him.

Also, I don't know how you can become a Big Daddy and not have the sweet claw or rail gun thing.

Loved the period music in the game, too bad it's not on the actual soundtrack.

And I think Ryan was a far better villain than Fontaine. The whole story built up to the confrontation with Ryan, and ultimately he should be the main villain of the game. He's a tragic character, he attempted to make this utopian society but ended up being basically a dictator. I find Ryan to be a well-developed and thought out character, and comparatively, Fontaine was pretty stupid.

That's all I can think of at the moment
 
[quote name='buttasuperb']I've been harvesting those whores with no remorse.
28.gif
[/QUOTE]

Ditto on my first time through. If they would have fleshed out the evil ending a bit more, I could see it being as awesome.
 
[quote name='lordwow']
I thought the "would you kindly" thing was pretty clever. I noticed him saying it, but didn't think of that.

I feel like an idiot for not realizing Atlas = Fontaine until the twist. I knew something was up when the tape right before you meet Ryan, Atlas doesn't have his accent, and instead has his Fontaine voice. But from the earlier audio clips I thought Ryan had killed him.

Also, I don't know how you can become a Big Daddy and not have the sweet claw or rail gun thing.

Loved the period music in the game, too bad it's not on the actual soundtrack.

And I think Ryan was a far better villain than Fontaine. The whole story built up to the confrontation with Ryan, and ultimately he should be the main villain of the game. He's a tragic character, he attempted to make this utopian society but ended up being basically a dictator. I find Ryan to be a well-developed and thought out character, and comparatively, Fontaine was pretty stupid.

That's all I can think of at the moment[/QUOTE]

That's the irony! For all of his intelligence and lofty ideas, Ryan was destroyed by a con man and thug. Speaking of "irony", that's one of the best achievements in any game.
 
[quote name='Darkside Hazuki']
That's the irony! For all of his intelligence and lofty ideas, Ryan was destroyed by a con man and thug. Speaking of "irony", that's one of the best achievements in any game.
[/QUOTE]
Not to mention the irony of Fontaine staying more true to Ryan's ideals than Ryan himself.
 
[quote name='Rei no Otaku']
Not to mention the irony of Fontaine staying more true to Ryan's ideals than Ryan himself.
[/QUOTE]

Ya, that's a good point. I think I need to let this game digest a bit more
 
I just thought of something....why would a city have vending machines for ammo? Maybe I missed a diary about this?

Also regarding the story
Like some of you said, I would agree Ryan was a more fleshed out character. Again, the scene were you kill him, I was both shocked and thinking how gray the whole situation was. After Atlas revealed himself as Fontaine, and hearing his radio messages, it was pretty clear to me that he had to die. Still, the overall story is pretty....uh, ridiculous.

Still one of the best games I've played in a long time, but yeah, I'm re-thinking the statement about it being damn close to a 10. A 9 is a more suitable score for me now that I've finished the game and had time to think about it.
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']I just thought of something....why would a city have vending machines for ammo? Maybe I missed a diary about this?

Also regarding the story
Like some of you said, I would agree Ryan was a more fleshed out character. Again, the scene were you kill him, I was both shocked and thinking how gray the whole situation was. After Atlas revealed himself as Fontaine, and hearing his radio messages, it was pretty clear to me that he had to die. Still, the overall story is pretty....uh, ridiculous.

Still one of the best games I've played in a long time, but yeah, I'm re-thinking the statement about it being damn close to a 10. A 9 is a more suitable score for me now that I've finished the game and had time to think about it.[/QUOTE]
Agreed; there are people in this thread who say it's one of the best stories they've ever experienced, I'd love to know what about it makes it so great.
 
Without spoilers, can anyone tell me what the point of no return is? Basically, I'd like to know precisely when to save my game where I can still go back and look for missed diaries and research and such.

Thanks!
 
[quote name='Mojimbo']Without spoilers, can anyone tell me what the point of no return is? Basically, I'd like to know precisely when to save my game where I can still go back and look for missed diaries and research and such.

Thanks![/QUOTE]
Right before going up the elevator in Proving Grounds.
 
[quote name='Mojimbo']Without spoilers, can anyone tell me what the point of no return is? Basically, I'd like to know precisely when to save my game where I can still go back and look for missed diaries and research and such.

Thanks![/quote]
Don't worry right at the end you'll have a autosave and then you'll go just a bit farther and before the final fight it'll say no more saves from here on out blah blah blah and then you go do your thing. You can always just go back and do what you need from that last autosave point.

Edit: Was there an autosave or did I just save right before going up the elevator? I forget now..... lol save often!
 
[quote name='zewone']Right before going up the elevator in Proving Grounds.[/QUOTE]

It's pretty fun to
go back as a Big Daddy The splicers leave you alone, making the search for diaries and power to the people stations much easier. I'm not sure if the cameras detect your not.

However, be aware that there are at least 2 diaries that if you miss, you cannot go back to get them. At least 2 I know of, there may be more, check a FAQ. If you missed them originally, you have to restart the game.

Are you sure Shady? I'm pretty sure it auto-saves in
the elevator right before Fontaine
. I always had 2 saves, one auto, and one I did myself whenever I felt like it. I don't think I ever loaded my game from an auto-save.
 
[quote name='A Happy Panda']It's pretty fun to go back as...[/QUOTE]
Whoa, that needs a spoiler tag. (Un)fortunately I already knew about it but it's not supposed to be common knowledge.
 
about the It's pretty fun spoiler above ^
Yea cameras don't detect you when you are a big daddy. That sucked for me BECAUSE I have EVERYTHING researched fully besides cameras and I was going back through the game looking for the ones I didnt destroy.... Pain in my ass!
 
[quote name='$hady']about the It's pretty fun spoiler above ^
Yea cameras don't detect you when you are a big daddy. That sucked for me BECAUSE I have EVERYTHING researched fully besides cameras and I was going back through the game looking for the ones I didnt destroy.... Pain in my ass!
[/QUOTE]

Eh, sucks even more for me.
I hacked or destroyed just about every piece of security related hardware.
No research achievement for me. Oh well.
 
Bioshock is a very up front game; It WILL TELL YOU STRAIGHT UP what the point of no return is before you hit it.

And, I kinda disagree with you, Rei, vis-a-vis Ryan and Fontaine.
I don't like arguing this on Bioshock's terms, because it is obvious the story was contrived, but Fontaine bested Ryan by providing a more effective brutal exploitation of capitalism than Ryan, and, as Atlas, a more effective populist/socialist appeal than Ryan. Granted, then he bested Ryan with a stupid plot device: you. Still, it is hard to look at Fontaine as a petty thug and con artist. That's just what the game presented him as, but he was a petty thug and con artist who crafted ADAM through his own capital and managed to run a good deal of the underworld in Rapture... supposedly. Even though he is supposed to be thuggish compared to Ryan's eloquence and almost ridiculous flair for the dramatic, it is hard to take that as believable.

Also, Ryan actually murdered a GREAT many more people than Fontaine. He deserved the golf club for the murder of crazy flower lady alone.
 
[quote name='zewone']Agreed; there are people in this thread who say it's one of the best stories they've ever experienced, I'd love to know what about it makes it so great.[/QUOTE]


Rapture.
 
So, I've been playing this very casually, and am just curious how far along I am.

I saved just after Ryan killed the scientist who was going to raise trees back from the dead and now I have to make the Lazarus somethingorother.
 
[quote name='daroga']So, I've been playing this very casually, and am just curious how far along I am.

I saved just after Ryan killed the scientist who was going to raise trees back from the dead and now I have to make the Lazarus somethingorother.
[/QUOTE]
About the halfway point.
 
damn, after beating the game all the way I missed one weapons upgrade station and am missing like 8 audio diaries. I explored every part of them map corner to corner, so I'm surprised I missed so much. I can't get the historian achievement since apparently one of the ones I missed I can no longer get, but I'll go back later and try to find the last weapon upgrade station.
 
[quote name='slickkill77']http://my.opera.com/noisewar/blog/2007/09/01/bioshock-explained

read[/QUOTE]

the ending he described would have been so bad ass.


As Atlas lies defeated before Jack, you are given a minute to choose to kill him or save him while he utters the last words "Would you kindly save me?" Failing to choose and he dies. Choosing to let him to die carries out revenge fantasies for "the good guys." Choosing to save him means doing his bidding. Which choice you consider to be truly free will always be subjective. Here, I would turn off the game, and start playing this wonderful tale all over again.


 
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