Building my first PC

[quote name='52club']

My questions are:

Is the power supply sufficient?

I'm planning on purchasing a systems builders OS, I searched google, but I'm really looking for a site that does the pros and cons of XP vs Vista 32bit vs Vista 64 bit other than just that Vista 64 accepts more than 3gigs of Ram.

Other than the fans that come with the case/parts should I add any other fans?

I'm trying to get a decent PC with parts that aren't top notch, but are a great value, please mention any better values that I might have missed.[/quote]

The big thing with PSUs is not to get caught up by the wattage moniker - b/c it doesn't tell you if they measure that at 25C's or 40C's and higher. But, the EarthWatt's a decent low-end PSU (though I'm not as much of a fan now after my experience with the Neo HE line). The only area you want to pay attention to is the 12V lines - looks like a combined 34A. Since you're only using a 4850 though, it's plenty. You will want to pay more attention if you upgrade to a GPU that demands dual 6pin connectors and the like.
 
[quote name='mav451']The big thing with PSUs is not to get caught up by the wattage moniker - b/c it doesn't tell you if they measure that at 25C's or 40C's and higher. But, the EarthWatt's a decent low-end PSU (though I'm not as much of a fan now after my experience with the Neo HE line). The only area you want to pay attention to is the 12V lines - looks like a combined 34A. Since you're only using a 4850 though, it's plenty. You will want to pay more attention if you upgrade to a GPU that demands dual 6pin connectors and the like.[/quote]
The 4870 uses 2 6-pin connectors, 4850 only uses 1 and it's quite efficient power wise with roughly a 210W peak power draw.
 
[quote name='jonac13']http://extreme.outervision.com/psucalculatorlite.jsp

According to that site, you'll only need 242 watts. It's not the perfect guide for power supplies, but it's a damn good indicator. Bookmark it if you plan on building more systems in the future.[/quote]
I came up to about 350W on that for my setup and i've always been told to add about 100W onto that score to be safe, so his 430W (and mine) should be plenty.
 
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Also, on the matter of the OS... at this point, Vista is all but mature in the things that would make XP the choice one or two years ago. Performance on Vista has definitely caught up to XP, and the problem with drivers is virtually non-existent, especially given that you're building a new PC (and not messing with old stuff).

As for 32 v 64, that's really a matter of performance. 64-bit will perform better in video processing applications, memory-intensive applications, and the like, but there is still not as much support for 64-bit systems for it to be viable for everyday computing. A lot of the normal programs you probably use might actually perform weaker than if you were running 32-bit. 64-bit is a good long term option, as many software developers are likely to start developing with more optimization for 64-bit systems, but for now, you might see better performance for daily operation on a 32-bit system. If you want more precise information, might want to check out this guide:

http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1697,2280808,00.asp

The following article from Microsoft is sorta muddled with marketing speak, but still may prove helpful:

http://windowshelp.microsoft.com/Windows/en-US/Help/41531554-d5ef-4f2c-8fb9-149bdc5c8a701033.mspx
 
Can anyone help me with the fans problem i posted above? Can my motherboard support/control 2 120mm fans (front and rear) as well as the HSF? If so, can i get 4-pin molex connectors to 3-pin mobo connector? I would like to be able to monitor temps via software and adjust the fans accordingly if possible.
 
[quote name='52club'] Intel Core 2 Duo E7200 Wolfdale 2.53GHz LGA 775 65W Dual-Core Processor Model BX80571E7200 - Retail
$130

G.SKILL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model F2-6400CL5D-2GBNQ - Retail
$45

ASUS P5Q LGA 775 Intel P45 ATX Intel Motherboard - Retail
$130

Antec earthwatts EA430 430W ATX12V v2.0 Power Supply - Retail
$60-$30 Rebate=$30

SAPPHIRE 100242L Radeon HD 4850 512MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFire Supported Video Card - Retail
$190-$30 Rebate=$160-$15 instant rebate=$145

HITACHI Deskstar P7K500 HDP725032GLA360 (0A35411) 320GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive -
$50

LG 20X DVD±R Super Multi DVD Burner Black ATAPI / E-IDE Model GSA-H55NK - OEM
$24

At about $630 before OS

I've got this case as mentioned before
http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/thermaltake_wing_rs_100_case/7.htm


My questions are:

Is the power supply sufficient?

I'm planning on purchasing a systems builders OS, I searched google, but I'm really looking for a site that does the pros and cons of XP vs Vista 32bit vs Vista 64 bit other than just that Vista 64 accepts more than 3gigs of Ram.

Other than the fans that come with the case/parts should I add any other fans?

I'm trying to get a decent PC with parts that aren't top notch, but are a great value, please mention any better values that I might have missed.[/quote]
you should be fine w/ that PSU as long as you dont OC.

If youre building using all those parts, there's a deal atm that would net you a slightly better mobo & the same vid card.

you can still use the Coupon VGA71115 for the vid card discount

http://promotions.newegg.com/asus/070308/index.html?cm_sp=Cat_Motherboards-_-ASUS070308

only you'd be using it on the ASUS instead.

Oh, and here's an article about XP & Vista you were asking about
http://www.techwarelabs.com/articles/editorials/XP-vs-Vista/index.shtml

the short answer is. 32 bit is more compatible with more legacy programs. If you arent going to be playing old games, vista 64 bit is your best bet. It will play 32 bit games as well, as long as they're vista compatible. you can check http://www.vistareadygames.com to get a general idea of it's support. not a complete list by far, but there are quite a few there. The only other issue w/ 64 bit vista is drivers, but all the hardware you list has 64 bit vista drivers so youre ok.

I would also recommend the Xigmatek HDT-S1283 HSF &
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835233003
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/cpu-cooler-charts,1967-12.html

Scythe S-FLEX™ SFF21E 120 x 25 mm Fan to use on it
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/2...m_Fan_w_S-FDB_Bearing.html?tl=g36c15s60#blank
http://www.silentpcreview.com/article695-page5.html#sflex

that will significantly cut down on your noise and keep your cpu running icy cold even under sustained load.
 
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[quote name='SynGamer']So...about those fan connectors...[/quote]
don't worry about it. unless you're going to OC. are you OCing? if not, even 1 (if you have a neat cable clamp / tied wrapped cable uncluttered air path) 120mm fan on low should keep it plenty cool.

the best way to reduce fan noise is to use a noise dampening gasket & grommets. they even have rubber push screws which help a little too. 90% of the noise is produced by vibration, not wind or the bearings.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16800999368
http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l3/g36/c111/s202/list/p1/Fans-Fan_Silencers-Rubber_Grommets-Page1.html
http://www.frozencpu.com/cat/l3/g36/c111/s484/list/p1/Fans-Fan_Silencers-Rubber_Screws-Page1.html

i beleive the mobo i listed uses 4 pin PWM, dont think it will throttle w/o it. not sure if it's just 1 or 2 though. you shouldnt need 2 imo. if it doesnt you can always get a silent fan like the Scythe S-FLEX. I would stick w/ using a direct connection or steady medium fan speed though, since PWM can actually increase noise in a lot of fans when throttling or varying speed.
 
I wanted to know how many slots my mobo has that supports regular fans (not HSF)...the goal is to hoot the front and rear fan to the mobo so that i can control their speeds via desktop.
 
i was talking about case fans. im 90% sure it just supports 1 case fan.
 
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[quote name='SynGamer']My thread...hence why i'm asking about MY motherboard.[/quote]
You already bought the motherboard? Because like i said, the deal i listed is the same mobo, just the Pro version. which is better. better version of same mobo (w/ crossfire) & $10 less to boot. but whatever. if you want to go w/ the standard model & pay more, go for it. they both have the same 2 case fan connectors if you look at the boards.
 
[quote name='TURBO']You already bought the motherboard? Because like i said, the deal i listed is the same mobo, just the Pro version. which is better. better version of same mobo (w/ crossfire) & $10 less to boot. but whatever. if you want to go w/ the standard model & pay more, go for it. they both have the same 2 case fan connectors if you look at the boards.[/quote]
Um, yeah...i bought the GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS3L motherboard about a week ago (first post). It cost me $78 brand new.
 
[quote name='SynGamer']Um, yeah...i bought the GIGABYTE GA-EP35-DS3L motherboard about a week ago (first post). It cost me $78 brand new.[/quote]
oh all right. didnt read the entire thread. I thought the system build on page 3 was what was being discussed.

for the Gigabyte, it looks like there are 2 case fan connectors. 1 between the northbridge & the audio out connectors & 1 along the the RAM slots lengthwise.

the heatsink's fan connector is likely the one nearest the CPU socket aligned w/ the ATX 12V connection. The one near where it says Saver & where a screw hole is is the PSU fan regulator connection i'm guessing.

If you already have the board, just look in your manual for goodness sake.
 
[quote name='TURBO']oh all right. didnt read the entire thread. I thought the system build on page 3 was what was being discussed.

for the Gigabyte, it looks like there are 2 case fan connectors. 1 between the northbridge & the audio out connectors & 1 along the the RAM slots lengthwise.

the heatsink's fan connector is likely the one nearest the CPU socket aligned w/ the ATX 12V connection. The one near where it says Saver & where a screw hole is is the PSU fan regulator connection i'm guessing.

If you already have the board, just look in your manual for goodness sake.[/quote]
Well, the whole point is that i don't know what each 'header' is as i outlined in one of my posts above. I think i'll just get a fan controller at some point.
 
[quote name='SynGamer']Well, the whole point is that i don't know what each 'header' is as i outlined in one of my posts above. I think i'll just get a fan controller at some point.[/quote]
it will only work one way. plug it in, if it doesn't spin, just turn it around.
 
OP, sorry for the confusion. I can break out into my own thread if you wish. I figure why not have one thread for building your own PC, but I could see how it would get confusing.
 
I don't know how useful or desired it would be, but I think it'd be cool to have a general PC building thread that might be able to get a sticky or something. God knows we have less popular topics already stickied. And that way, the same questions wouldn't be asked time and time again. (SLI v Single Card, 8800 GT v 4850, 'what mobo should i buy', etc.) What do you guys think?
 
[quote name='jonac13']I don't know how useful or desired it would be, but I think it'd be cool to have a general PC building thread that might be able to get a sticky or something. God knows we have less popular topics already stickied. And that way, the same questions wouldn't be asked time and time again. (SLI v Single Card, 8800 GT v 4850, 'what mobo should i buy', etc.) What do you guys think?[/quote]

I totally agree, some of the those with more knowledge could even show suggested builds for certain dollar figures, like $500, $700, and $1000.
 
I started the thread. Plan is to list all the most recent CPUs/Memory, etc. and then from there post average prices, reviews, and tips. The second post is going to be reserved for the reviews and actual builds.
 
[quote name='SynGamer']Well, the whole point is that i don't know what each 'header' is as i outlined in one of my posts above. I think i'll just get a fan controller at some point.[/quote]

This is usually in the mobo documentation. Though I have 0 experience with Gigabyte, so I have no idea if their manual's just a cheap throw-in or actually detailed.
 
If you don't mind, I'd like to take peripherals, like mice and keyboards. Since those are mostly about features, I'd like to just sorta layout the most popular, budget, and feature-laden products and sort of sort out which are best for each price range.
 
[quote name='jonac13']If you don't mind, I'd like to take peripherals, like mice and keyboards. Since those are mostly about features, I'd like to just sorta layout the most popular, budget, and feature-laden products and sort of sort out which are best for each price range.[/quote]
microsoft "natural" ergonomic keyboard
microsoft or logitech laser mouse. buy whatever's on sale.

that's it
 
Well, everything is up and running...my CPU is idling hot (49-51C) though my room temp is about 35-40C. I probably messed up the thermal paste/HSF installation so i'll redo that today.

:(
 
Eh, your ambients are a bit ridiculous haha. I think most of us are closer to 25-30C's, whereas you are at least 10C higher. E.g. 35-40C's, that's an average of 37.5C's (that's 100F folks). Thus, I think you could probably drop your idles about 6-7Cs...which would put you around 42C or so (which is normal). Hell, I'm putting around 44C's idle at ~ 77F ambient, but I'm at 4Ghz on my setup.

These days, unless you truly messed up, re-apps aren't gonna make that big of a difference. Did you do pea-sized or credit card method?
 
[quote name='SynGamer']Well, everything is up and running...my CPU is idling hot (49-51C) though my room temp is about 35-40C. I probably messed up the thermal paste/HSF installation so i'll redo that today.

:([/QUOTE]
the thermal paste that comes stock is lackluster.

try cleaning it off w/ something like this
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835100010

use a lint free paper like you'd use to clean a camera lens.

then using AS5
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835100007
 
51 is a fine idle temp...

for a laptop.

Also, which CPU did you go with? My e8400 runs around 40 with the stock intel fan. Maybe those quads run hotter.


Searches say that your CPU temps should be around 40 idle and 55 fully loaded, with a max temp of 70 (assuming you have the q6600)
 
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[quote name='crystalklear64']51 is a fine idle temp...

for a laptop.

Also, which CPU did you go with? My e8400 runs around 40 with the stock intel fan. Maybe those quads run hotter.


Searches say that your CPU temps should be around 40 idle and 55 fully loaded, with a max temp of 70 (assuming you have the q6600)[/quote]
I have an E7200 Core 2 Duo @ 2.53 GHz...so i'll be taking everything apart and redoing the thermal.
 
Err, reapplying does nothing if your ambient is already 35-40C's. This is b/c a CPU will never be cooler than ambient. I.e. if your ambient is 40C's, I highly doubt your CPU would be at 40C then - it will likely be quite a bit higher than that. I'm hoping that you mistyped your temps, because that is one hot room.

I'm a little shocked that I am the only one that notices this.
 
[quote name='mav451']Err, reapplying does nothing if your ambient is already 35-40C's. This is b/c a CPU will never be cooler than ambient. I.e. if your ambient is 40C's, I highly doubt your CPU would be at 40C then - it will likely be quite a bit higher than that. I'm hoping that you mistyped your temps, because that is one hot room.

I'm a little shocked that I am the only one that notices this.[/quote]
It's a small apt. with 1 set of windows on the side of the building we live in. But yeah, room temp is down to about 27C with the A/C on. I'm going to reapply the HSF and use Arctic Silver 5 instead of the pre-applied stuff. That should get me a couple C's at least.
 
Well my comment is that people commenting on thermal performance (specifically those trying to help you) should have noted your high ambient temps the minute you mentioned it. Anyway, let's see what your temps are with the AC on, when 27C is your the ambient. I'd expect that a drop of 13C's should affect your idle temps considerably.
 
[quote name='mav451']Well my comment is that people commenting on thermal performance (specifically those trying to help you) should have noted your high ambient temps the minute you mentioned it. Anyway, let's see what your temps are with the AC on, when 27C is your the ambient. I'd expect that a drop of 13C's should affect your idle temps considerably.[/quote]
Still looking at 49C for idle (core).
 
Something's not quite right here - where did you get the "ambient" temps from? I'm a bit amazed that if your ambient was 35-40; dropped down to 27C's, and then you saw no benefit?

8 to 13C's...that's 14-24F. How's your case airflow? Those Newegg pics of the Tt case show 2 x 120mm's...which is plenty for a non-OCed, non-SLI system. There is one other possibility I could consider...which is the fact that many of the early e8400's had borked temperature sensors (e.g. it hits 52C's, and just stops). But we need to see graphs of how your CPU reacts to loads.

Anyway, I suppose a remounting wouldn't hurt.
 
[quote name='mav451']Something's not quite right here - where did you get the "ambient" temps from? I'm a bit amazed that if your ambient was 35-40; dropped down to 27C's, and then you saw no benefit?

8 to 13C's...that's 14-24F. How's your case airflow? Those Newegg pics of the Tt case show 2 x 120mm's...which is plenty for a non-OCed, non-SLI system. There is one other possibility I could consider...which is the fact that many of the early e8400's had borked temperature sensors (e.g. it hits 52C's, and just stops). But we need to see graphs of how your CPU reacts to loads.

Anyway, I suppose a remounting wouldn't hurt.[/quote]
I have a E7200. And the air flow is; 120mm fan intact up front/bottom, 120mm exhaust rear/middle. And then there's the heatsink fan which is attached to the heatsink, which is about 1 inch away from the rear 120mm fan...which is blowing air in through the heatsink and out to the rear fan. Could the HSF fan be the problem?
 
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