Copies of games (was: GBA ROMz)

elprincipe

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Just wanted to let the people know that were posting in there that making your own backup copies is expressly permitted by law, no matter what Nintendo or anyone else may say. It's selling or giving copies away that's illegal. I can make 100,000 copies of a game I have, but if I sell one to somebody and I'm not the copyright holder it's a crime.
 
Why do you even have to antagonize JSweeny. Seriously we're gonna have to listen to him go on about this like he did with the whole buy 2 get 1 at Blockbuster. We have already established that JSweeny is perfect and has done nothing wrong while the rest of us are the moral scum of the earth.
 
[quote name='RedvsBlue']Why do you even have to antagonize JSweeny. Seriously we're gonna have to listen to him go on about this like he did with the whole buy 2 get 1 at Blockbuster. We have already established that JSweeny is perfect and has done nothing wrong while the rest of us are the moral scum of the earth.[/quote]

I'm not trying to antagonize, just trying to make sure people don't get the wrong idea about their right to make backup copies of their legally-purchased property. :D I don't even have any ROMs on my computer and don't use them...
 
[quote name='RedvsBlue']Why do you even have to antagonize JSweeny. Seriously we're gonna have to listen to him go on about this like he did with the whole buy 2 get 1 at Blockbuster. We have already established that JSweeny is perfect and has done nothing wrong while the rest of us are the moral scum of the earth.[/quote]

dude, i dont even want to read his reply for this one... :shock:
 
[quote name='punqsux'][quote name='RedvsBlue']Why do you even have to antagonize JSweeny. Seriously we're gonna have to listen to him go on about this like he did with the whole buy 2 get 1 at Blockbuster. We have already established that JSweeny is perfect and has done nothing wrong while the rest of us are the moral scum of the earth.[/quote]

dude, i dont even want to read his reply for this one... :shock:[/quote]

Oh I can't wait :lol: , do you think I'll get the seperated out reply to each sentence like he does for everyone else?
 
[quote name='elprincipe']Just wanted to let the people know that were posting in there that making your own backup copies is expressly permitted by law, no matter what Nintendo or anyone else may say. It's selling or giving copies away that's illegal. I can make 100,000 copies of a game I have, but if I sell one to somebody and I'm not the copyright holder it's a crime.[/quote]

Actually so you know the United States of America law states that the owner can have one backup copy not 100,000.
 
The Law in the United States
Software is automatically protected by federal copyright law from the moment of its creation. The rights granted to the owner of a copyright are clearly stated in the Copyright Act, Title 17 of the US Code. The Act gives copyright owner "the exclusive rights" to "reproduce the copyrighted work" and "to distribute copies ... of the copyrighted work" (Section 106). It also states that "anyone who violates any of the exclusive rights of the copyright owner ... is an infringer of the copyright" (Section 501), and sets forth several penalties for such conduct.

Those who purchase a license for a copy of software do not have the right to make additional copies without the permission of the copyright owner, except when it is necessary to: (i) copy the software onto a single computer in order to use the software, and (ii) make a backup copy "for archival purposes only", which are specifically provided in the Copyright Act (Section 117).

A relatively new exception (Section 117) allows a user, or someone authorized by the user, to make a copy of the software during activation of the computer in order to repair the computer. The license accompanying the product may allow additional copies to be made -- be sure to review the license carefully.

The unauthorized duplication of software constitutes copyright infringement, regardless of whether it is done for sale, for free distribution, or for the copier's own use. Moreover, those who copy are liable for the resulting copyright infringement whether or not they knew their conduct violated federal law. Penalties include liability for damages suffered by the copyright owner plus any profits of the infringer that are attributable to the copying, or statutory damages of up to $150,000 for each work infringed.

The unauthorized duplication of software is also a Federal crime if done "willfully and for purposes of commercial advantage or private financial gain (Title 18 Section 2319(b))." Criminal penalties include fines of as much as $250,000 and jail terms of up to 5 years

http://www.siia.net/piracy/copyright/law.asp

Look at the bold section. This is what you purchase when you purchase a game. They give you a copy of the media along with the liscence you purchased, but you are purchasing the liscence first and foremost.

But what about the archival copy, you say?
Keeping an archival copy for backup purposes is just that.
It isn't a copy of a rom that you place on a computer to play with an emulator.. that violates both copyright law and your liscensing agreement.
An archival copy is expressly used to protect the purchaser of the software in the case that the original copy of the media becomes corrupted.

Unless you make the copy yourself, you aren't allowed to have it. You didn't make the backup. If you have the hardware, and can dump a copy of a rom image to a piece of software you hold a liscense on, you can and do have the legal right to make the back up copy.

Yes, you are allowed to have an archival copy,
1. Provided that you make it yourself
2. That is used only for ARCHIVAL purposes.

This entire issue is not as simple as "I own the actual one so I can have a backup copy for it and do whatever I please with it".
That isn't what the laws and statues say on this issue, but because of the myths of popular opinion and misunderstanding of the finer points of the issue, that seems to be the defacto standard.

So, elprincipe, in a very tightly constrained situation, having a backup copy of a rom is legal. Of course, in the vast majority of the practical and actual uses these go through, they are not.

**Corrected a few glaring spelling errors.**
 
Perfect reply JS. Very few people have the means to make a back-up copy of any game. So very few people have legal back-ups.

DMCA
 
Someone needs to say it...

JSweeny PWNED elprincipe!

:D

Remember, kiddies...all roms are illegal unless you make them yourself and only use them as archives. Odds are you can still download and use roms without getting into legal trouble, but if you get caught, you ARE breaking the law. Be prepared to face the consequences...

Also...anyone who pirates roms for current systems (like the GBA) is pond scum that doesn't deserve the title of human. Still...you'll get yours in the end. Not buying games means no profit for publishers. No profit for publishers means fewer new games. Fewer new games means you'll meet a horde of angry gamers armed with baseball bats. That won't be pretty...
 
[quote name='JSweeney']The Law in the United States
Software is automatically protected by federal copyright law from the moment of its creation. The rights granted to the owner of a copyright are clearly stated in the Copyright Act, Title 17 of the US Code. The Act gives copyright owner "the exclusive rights" to "reproduce the copyrighted work" and "to distribute copies ... of the copyrighted work" (Section 106). It also states that "anyone who violates any of the exclusive rights of the copyright owner ... is an infringer of the copyright" (Section 501), and sets forth several penalties for such conduct.

Those who purchase a license for a copy of software do not have the right to make additional copies without the permission of the copyright owner, except when it is necessary to: (i) copy the software onto a single computer in order to use the software, and (ii) make a backup copy "for archival purposes only", which are specifically provided in the Copyright Act (Section 117).

A relatively new exception (Section 117) allows a user, or someone authorized by the user, to make a copy of the software during activation of the computer in order to repair the computer. The license accompanying the product may allow additional copies to be made -- be sure to review the license carefully.

The unauthorized duplication of software constitutes copyright infringement, regardless of whether it is done for sale, for free distribution, or for the copier's own use. Moreover, those who copy are liable for the resulting copyright infringement whether or not they knew their conduct violated federal law. Penalties include liability for damages suffered by the copyright owner plus any profits of the infringer that are attributable to the copying, or statutory damages of up to $150,000 for each work infringed.

The unauthorized duplication of software is also a Federal crime if done "willfully and for purposes of commercial advantage or private financial gain (Title 18 Section 2319(b))." Criminal penalties include fines of as much as $250,000 and jail terms of up to 5 years

http://www.siia.net/piracy/copyright/law.asp

Look at the bold section. This is what you purchase when you purchase a game. They give you a copy of the media along with the liscence you purchased, but you are purchasing the liscence first and foremost.

But what about the archival copy, you say?
Keeping an archival copy for backup purposes is just that.
It isn't a copy of a rom that you place on a computer to play with an emulator.. that violates both copyright law and your liscensing agreement.
An archival copy is expressly used to protect the purchaser of the software in the case that the original copy of the media becomes corrupted.

Unless you make the copy yourself, you aren't allowed to have it. You didn't make the backup. If you have the hardware, and can dump a copy of a rom image to a piece of software you hold a liscense on, you can and do have the legal right to make the back up copy.

Yes, you are allowed to have an archival copy,
1. Provided that you make it yourself
2. That is used only for ARCHIVAL purposes.

This entire issue is not as simple as "I own the actual one so I can have a backup copy for it and do whatever I please with it".
That isn't what the laws and statues say on this issue, but because of the myths of popular opinion and misunderstanding of the finer points of the issue, that seems to be the defacto standard.

So, elprincipe, in a very tightly constrained situation, having a backup copy of a rom is legal. Of course, in the vast majority of the practical and actual uses these go through, they are not.

**Corrected a few glaring spelling errors.**[/quote]

Well said.. Roms ARE illegal. Simple as that.
 
[quote name='Gothic_Walrus']Someone needs to say it...

JSweeny PWNED elprincipe!

:D

[/quote]

Say what you wish, then look at what he actually posted:

(ii) make a backup copy "for archival purposes only", which are specifically provided in the Copyright Act (Section 117).

Therefore, what I said was correct. You can make copies for your own backup purposes, that's the law. I also don't see why ROMs would be any different than copying the CD, they can be a legal backup copy you have for software that you have purchased the license to use.
 
[quote name='elprincipe'][quote name='Gothic_Walrus']Someone needs to say it...

JSweeny PWNED elprincipe!

:D

[/quote]

Say what you wish, then look at what he actually posted:

(ii) make a backup copy "for archival purposes only", which are specifically provided in the Copyright Act (Section 117).

Therefore, what I said was correct. You can make copies for your own backup purposes, that's the law. I also don't see why ROMs would be any different than copying the CD, they can be a legal backup copy you have for software that you have purchased the license to use.[/quote]

Not that I care, but you obviously didnt read his whole post, which explains section 117. Not to mention the point that Archival purposes doesnt mean you can use them for whatever.
 
Im sorry I posted it...Didnt think I would get so much $hit for it...I just wanted it to test PSO Collection to see if I wanted to buy it...Didnt want to buy a 20$ game and have it suck...Being the CAG I am I wanted to test it first...SOOO SORRY! BLAME THE N00B! :oops:
 
[quote name='starman9000'][quote name='elprincipe'][quote name='Gothic_Walrus']Someone needs to say it...

JSweeny PWNED elprincipe!

:D

[/quote]

Say what you wish, then look at what he actually posted:

(ii) make a backup copy "for archival purposes only", which are specifically provided in the Copyright Act (Section 117).

Therefore, what I said was correct. You can make copies for your own backup purposes, that's the law. I also don't see why ROMs would be any different than copying the CD, they can be a legal backup copy you have for software that you have purchased the license to use.[/quote]

Not that I care, but you obviously didnt read his whole post, which explains section 117. Not to mention the point that Archival purposes doesnt mean you can use them for whatever.[/quote]

PWNED again, I see... :twisted:
 
[quote name='karmapolice620']Im sorry I posted it...Didnt think I would get so much $hit for it...I just wanted it to test PSO Collection to see if I wanted to buy it...Didnt want to buy a 20$ game and have it suck...Being the CAG I am I wanted to test it first...SOOO SORRY! BLAME THE N00B! :oops:[/quote]

I don't know about anyone else here, but I won't hold it against you. Everyone makes mistakes, and you're new here. :D

Remember...illegal activities don't go over very well with most CAGs.
 
I shy away from "illegal" activities as much as I can(except for the one alot of people do :wink:) I love this site and am happy I found it...Sorry to cause any trouble...I plan on staying here a while and will try not to f*(l< up agian :oops: lol
 
You know I just came to realise something if I want to know the facts on a "grey" subject then I am just going to post why I think its ok.

Then I will sit back and let everyone feed me the exact correct reasons as to why it is or isnt. Then I have my answer and I will be happy.

Great info JS.
 
I like how someone always assumes copies are legal so they can justify their illegal activities.

Simply put...its illegal now in all shapes and forms.

While about 5 years ago it was a grey area that the supreme court had not decided on...its now CLEAR AS BELL. You can't backup games.

Backups are stupid anyways. NES and Atari 2600 games still work...why would you need to backup a Gameboy game?
 
Backups do have their place.
I own several capcom system 2 boards, and unfortuately they only have a typical lifespan of 3-5 years after which the battery must be replaced. However if the board looses power then board is shot...so the only way to replace the battery is with the board on, or to send it back to capcom for a expensive fee :(. But as far as carts go, I have rarely seen any broken carts. I morally don't seen anything wrong with using nes roms if you own the carts...and wonder if the back up laws do offically apply to older games, or just to newer ones. (Grandfather clause). I see it the same putting your cd onto a mp3 player. But laws are laws, at least now Nintendo has shown that they actually will port the older games in some form or another.
 
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