Darwin film 'too controversial for religious America'

[quote name='AdultLink']
Is a random diety so insulting to you? If it is, then again, please be a hermit, because you will meet lots of people in real life with crazy ass beliefs.[/QUOTE]

This is an unfortunate fact of life and I've decided to take it head-on because it's the only way I can makes sense of 60% of this country not "believing" in evolution.
 
[quote name='rabbitt']This is an unfortunate fact of life and I've decided to take it head-on because it's the only way I can makes sense of 60% of this country not "believing" in evolution.[/QUOTE]

Eh, if everyone believed in evolution we'd still find something we don't like and bingo! Another method for humanity to kill each other!
 
[quote name='Kirin Lemon']Damnit, this is what happens when kids gain access to the internet...[/QUOTE]

Seconded. Can't we get him banned from this part of the forum at least? I don't give a fuck if he trolls OTT threads....
 
[quote name='georox']Seconded. Can't we get him banned from this part of the forum at least? I don't give a fuck if he trolls OTT threads....[/QUOTE]

And I'm the child here? I'm sorry, but in real life, you can't get rid of people just because they disagree.

But please, keep crying about it. Maybe mommy and daddy will make it all better.
 
[quote name='AdultLink']And I'm the child here? I'm sorry, but in real life, you can't get rid of people just because they disagree.

But please, keep crying about it. Maybe mommy and daddy will make it all better.[/QUOTE]

If I wanted to get rid of you for disagreeing, maybe, but I want you gone because all you are doing is trolling on a GameFAQs level. You turn to childish insults the first chance you get, and use false-logic and bad interpretation (not interpretive dance :/ ) as an 'argument'

And now you resort to PMing me to further instigate this.
 
[quote name='georox']If I wanted to get rid of you for disagreeing, maybe, but I want you gone because all you are doing is trolling on a GameFAQs level. You turn to childish insults the first chance you get, and use false-logic and bad interpretation (not interpretive dance :/ ) as an 'argument'[/QUOTE]

First chance I get eh? Says the guy linking certain images about me.

I'm hotheaded yes, but I only resort to insults when hardheaded people like you annoy me enough.

And lets be honest here. You cannot talk. Your only comments toward me were about dicks and pictures accusing me of being dumb. You cannot talk about disagreements and trolling when you came trolling yourself.

False-logic? No matter what you may think, or not like about what I said, history shows the truth. History showed that these people did these things because of hatred and intolerance, not due to religion itself. Lots of good has actually come from religion, but at the same lots of bad. As I said before, religion is a vehicle, the choices come from within.

Simply put, you don't like what I'm saying. Your trolling reactions come because you don't like religion and you only came to bash it. History proves what I said.

Afterall, religious people are the biggest donators to programs helping children, elders, etc. Religious people like mother Teresa can be really good people.
 
[quote name='georox']I didn't bash religion in the thread. I said I would see the movie, and I said putting Jesus face on something sells it. That's bashing the consumerist society that prides itself on consumption that we all live in.

Religious people help children?

http://www.nowpublic.com/culture/ch...sed-dungeons-dragons-fans-gencon-indianapolis

Yea. Happy?[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I'm happy that you at least are proving that your trolling. Again, it's not about religion, it's about what kind of person you are. You realize the big gangsters who murder people in Italy go to church? Why not use that as an example of corruption?

You are finding any examples that agree with you, when the simple fact is, it's the person, not the inanimate object, not the religion, not the lifestyle. Your argument is about as worthwhile as anything Jack Thompson says.
 
[quote name='AdultLink'] Since you are all bashing others over things you can't prove, doesn't that make you the idiots here?
[/QUOTE]

1failurecomingup.jpg


What's that boy? You say he's copping out? We gotta let pop know to ignore him!
 
[quote name='Nohbdy']
1failurecomingup.jpg


What's that boy? You say he's copping out? We gotta let pop know to ignore him![/QUOTE]

[quote name='Kirin Lemon']Jesus fucking christ, STOP POSTING. YOU'RE NOT SMART ENOUGH.[/QUOTE]


Yes, you two are hilarious. My point on this entire thing apparantly went right over your heads. I even bashed some things in religion, I gave real reason to hate certain people, not hate of an entire group just because they are religious.

Before you insult people's intelligence, you might want to learn how to read english.

And btw, let's go into you conventional logic verus religious logic nonsense.

Before Albert Einstein's theory on physics came out, scientists didn't believe that atoms were real. Could they prove it then? Can they prove it now, yes, but it's obviously changed.

Even today, things like global warming are largely disputed, it's only a 'fact' because global warming has been agreed to by a consensus of scientists.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_scientists_opposing_global_warming_consensus

The point is that your argument on 'conventional logic' is very obtuse and ham-fisted. You are trying to say that conventional logic can simply prove things by showing it, but that hasn't always been the case.

The ONLY real point you two have out of both of your obtuse posts is the fact that religious people refuse to find proof, refuse to study reality while scientists study it. Yes, it's a valid point, but science is nowhere near as cut and dry as you try to make it out to be.

Now go ahead, insult me some more. That's the only thing you guys are apparantly capable of doing.
 
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[quote name='Nohbdy'](image)[/QUOTE]

I'm not interested in having a discussion on the actual topic this image is covering, but I will say that this attempt is hopelessly flawed. There's plenty of better metaphors to express the idea this one is attempting to, where the execution actually fits what would be considered scientific hypothesis versus a question of faith.
 
[quote name='Kirin Lemon']Jesus fucking christ, STOP POSTING. YOU'RE NOT SMART ENOUGH.[/QUOTE]

I'm going to give this quote full attention.

Let's go over the posting limits for intelligence. All forums have the limit being at 13 and above, and having the ability to post. Plus, this forum is meant for arguments.

All of this means that pretty much anyone can join this forum to post, including people from 4chan. Now people from 4chan would type worse and make less sense then me, so why are you saying that my intelligence is too low for the posting intelligence limit on this forum?

So why are you desperate to change the rules of the board to fit you? Are you saying that the moderators are stupid and didn't do a good enough job filtering people out? Because the mods and the site owner make the rules, so if anybody allowed somebody to come in who shouldn't, it would've been them.

Perhaps it might be because the people posting like idiots on 4chan would agree with your thoughts?

Perhaps its a emotional knee-jerk reaction to something you VERY MUCH hate?

Now then, please get right back to insulting me. You wouldn't want anything else to fill your head, like rational intelligent thought.........................
 
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[quote name='AdultLink']And lets be frank on a few things okay?

Science and technology is our new God, and yes, I did say that. Moving toward a technilogical singularity, any nuclear war would turn us back into cavemen.

It doesn't bother me that people belive in a god they don't see. If they are productive individuals why the fuck should it matter?

Is a random diety so insulting to you? If it is, then again, please be a hermit, because you will meet lots of people in real life with crazy ass beliefs.[/QUOTE]

Son, you gotta go back to arguin' school.
 
[quote name='AdultLink']It doesn't bother me that people belive in a god they don't see. If they are productive individuals why the fuck should it matter?[/QUOTE]

It doesn't matter if they keep it to themselves. Problem is they don't. Attempts to shove "intelligent design" BS down the throats of children in public schools is one example of this. All of the "morality" laws that attempt to control and restrict non-violent behavior of adults is another..

You wouldn't want anything else to fill your head, like rational intelligent thought.........................
Click to expand...
Religion and rationality don't mix bud.
 
What the hell?

So AdultLink, you're actually arguing that what someone personally believes doesn't affect others in a thread based on a movie about a scientific theory that people in America don't get to see because of the beliefs of others?

It was actually a perfect example of how people's beliefs affect others (and how capitalism can limit choice, but that's not particularly relevant here), and how the beliefs of some can actually limit the education of those who don't share those beliefs.

You try to treat science and religion as if they're equal with this not-very-well-thought-out argument about proof - that neither can "prove" anything. You're either intentionally being argumentative or you don't understand the disciplines you're talking about. Science doesn't have "proof" because it takes human error into consideration. It's not that much of science isn't as evident as the fact that throwing a brick through a window will break it (actually doing that systematically and recording the results would be science), it's that no one should be so sure about things because humans can make mistakes. Religion doesn't have "proof" because it's about things that have no empirical reality and intentionally cannot be studied or "proven."

With that false equivalency out of the way (I know myke didn't feel like explaining it), we can move on to how people's beliefs can affect others (one example being the OP), and how religion is more than simply a tool used by intolerant individuals, but can actually lead to further intolerance. I'll type that up later, I have to get to work.
 
[quote name='SpazX']What the hell?

So AdultLink, you're actually arguing that what someone personally believes doesn't affect others in a thread based on a movie about a scientific theory that people in America don't get to see because of the beliefs of others?

It was actually a perfect example of how people's beliefs affect others (and how capitalism can limit choice, but that's not particularly relevant here), and how the beliefs of some can actually limit the education of those who don't share those beliefs.

You try to treat science and religion as if they're equal with this not-very-well-thought-out argument about proof - that neither can "prove" anything. You're either intentionally being argumentative or you don't understand the disciplines you're talking about. Science doesn't have "proof" because it takes human error into consideration. It's not that much of science isn't as evident as the fact that throwing a brick through a window will break it (actually doing that systematically and recording the results would be science), it's that no one should be so sure about things because humans can make mistakes. Religion doesn't have "proof" because it's about things that have no empirical reality and intentionally cannot be studied or "proven."

With that false equivalency out of the way (I know myke didn't feel like explaining it), we can move on to how people's beliefs can affect others (one example being the OP), and how religion is more than simply a tool used by intolerant individuals, but can actually lead to further intolerance. I'll type that up later, I have to get to work.[/QUOTE]

I wasn't arguing that science is equal to religion,my argument was drawing small parrellels with science and religion. My argument about believe and proof is that sometimes, that's all it is today, esp. when we don't know the answers yet still.

Even science itself can be a belief at times. My point in all of this was to give valid reasons why a person would still have faith.
 
And lets be honest, this topic was quickly becoming a bash on America and religion itself, which is why I defended religion.

There are still valid reasons why a person could be a rational human and come home and believe in religion.

And again, why should it matter? If I knew a guy from the church of scientology, why the fuck should I care?

I'm not arguing that religious people think as rational as science, or any of the other crap you guys seem to think, I'm just giving a few reasons why belief can be valid still.

Even if i8t wasn't valid, religion is based around core beliefs, religion ha nothing to do with the persons intelligence. Just like how being democrat or republican has nothing to do with it. That is the point as well, alot of people can believe in wierd shit.

The simple fact is, you cannot draw a corelation with relligion and intelligence. People can believe in anything they want, although their intelligence and personality will decide how crazy they are for it.
 
The institutional form of religious belief has led not to encouraging debate based on empirical reality, but a collective shutting of our eyes from it. Your "belief," and the fear followers have of that belief being negated by science, has led to willful ignorance not at an individual level, but at an institutional level. At a national level. I can't find a place to watch this film in this country because people don't want this movie to be seen.

The uniform characteristic of those who oppose evolution and empiricism is this "belief." It is not the belief itself that needs to be destroyed - you act like it is the target of scientific discovery, rather than collateral damage (when mythology is replaced with empirical forms of epistemology). The lack of knowledge is what needs to be destroyed, and a lack of knowledge is what science seeks to fill - a lack of knowledge that is bolstered by people who refuse to let science come in and help reduce the gap between mankind and understanding.
 
[quote name='perdition(troy']it. will. not. make. money.[/QUOTE]

Let's go to the next step. Why wouldn't a film about Darwin not make money in the US?
 
So let me see if I have this straight:

A producer makes a movie and shops it around to Hollywood studios.
He fails to get it picked up.
For all we know the movie is boring as shit.
The sore-ass producer is now publicilly whining his belief that it's because America is too anti-evolution.

Is that it?

Remember, Bill Mahr's Religioulous got distribution, and that movie was an outright attack on religion, where as this one is not. So something is rotten in this story.

If the movie is really as good as he was saying, it would have gotten picked up. If, after it gets wide releases elsewhere, is really that well received, it WILL get picked up.

Now what is more plausible is that they wanted too much money for the movie or demanded that it get a certain level of distribution that no studio in the US wanted to give it. It sounds like an art house film, and art films get small distros.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']A producer makes a movie and shops it around to Hollywood studios.
He fails to get it picked up.
For all we know the movie is boring as shit.
The sore-ass producer is now publicilly whining his belief that it's because America is too anti-evolution.

Is that it?[/QUOTE]

There you go.
 
AdultLink has said this topic is full of hate, he has yet to provide an example. You can't say it's full of hate and not provide a SINGLE EXAMPLE.
 
[quote name='IRHari']AdultLink has said this topic is full of hate, he has yet to provide an example. You can't say it's full of hate and not provide a SINGLE EXAMPLE.[/QUOTE]

He has proved we all hate him.
 
True. He should change his name to 'ToonLink' or 'YoungLink' as it's more indicative of his rationality or lack thereof.
 
If Darwin was a gun toting ex-marine hell bent on revenge, this movie would not only be released here but would make millions.

The whole topic makes me glad i picked richard dawkins to write a paper on.
 
[quote name='JolietJake']The whole topic makes me glad i picked richard dawkins to write a paper on.[/QUOTE]

That guy from Family Feud was pretty cool. :lol:
 
Yes, when you can't win an argument, resort to personal insults.

Here you go children, examples of your hate:

[quote name='IRHari']Wow, so someone thinks people will watch a show about a bisexual making people compete for her 'love' by doing stupid shit, but they won't distribute a movie about Darwin because of the controversy?

To quote Bill Maher, "I would never put anything past this stupid country."[/QUOTE]

[quote name='rabbitt']And the world gets another laugh.

We must seem cute to the outside world.[/QUOTE]

[quote name='IRHari']That's pretty upsetting, this movie sounds like it'll be really good and Paul Bettany is a really good actor.

US distributors really don't think much of people in this country right? Ah well, considering how much money Transformers 2 made, they're absolutely right.[/QUOTE]

[quote name='homeland']A snuff film like passion of the christ, people blow a load for.. A film depicting the story of one of the most influental people in western civilization. Oh my god no!![/QUOTE]

I suppose that all of this American bashing is nothing of much concern, or isn't hateful? I mean, your just making assumptions of a large group of people, nothing serious eh?

And all over a blurb of someone elses comments too. Someone says this and people go on a rant. If I am so dumb, why can't any of you think for yourselves? One person tells you something and you go on a rant like this?

Has it even been proved that Darwins film would sell bad? Has it even COME OUT? So you guys hear somebody say something and automatically assume it's true, and you want to act like I'm the dumb one here?

Tell me what people would say if you were making assumptions on a race, like blacks?
 
[quote name='georox']He has proved we all hate him.[/QUOTE]

You should stop and notice that only the same 4 or 5 people are insulting me, before you start getting delusional about everyone hating me.
 
Tell you what guys, before insulting someone, make sure you can think for yourselves. Just because someone says something won't sell doesn't mean it will. Afterall, you seem like the same group of idiots who would believe it if the democrats told you that the ceos are a bunch of idiots (Which they are, but that is besides the point), and companies are mismanaged, yet you believe what any clown tells you....
 
You can't assume that just because I think someone isn't smart, it means I hate them. Indeed, I pity them. It's unfortunate that they're so badly misinformed, or they're presented a one sided take on the issue. We're not assuming, we're citing what the Gallup poll tells us about the American public.
 
[quote name='AdultLink']You should stop and notice that only the same 4 or 5 people are insulting me, before you start getting delusional about everyone hating me.[/QUOTE]

Technically, 4 or 5 people disliking you in the Vs. forum is a majority of the users here.
 
[quote name='fatherofcaitlyn']Technically, 4 or 5 people disliking you in the Vs. forum is a majority of the users here.[/QUOTE]

Well whatever. 4 or 5 people who can't think for themselves don't bother me very much. Anything sells here, all the people who think this couldn't sell ask yourselves why adult film is one the top sellers every time?

The only reason I could think of that they didn't bring it here is perhaps, the movie sucked? Or maybe that's reaching too far, when you could just bash America?
 
[quote name='IRHari']You can't assume that just because I think someone isn't smart, it means I hate them. Indeed, I pity them. It's unfortunate that they're so badly misinformed, or they're presented a one sided take on the issue. We're not assuming, we're citing what the Gallup poll tells us about the American public.[/QUOTE]

Again, you may want to actually have a mind of your own first. If this was such a christian nation you wouldn't have porn as number 1 sellers, shows like Sex and the city, the sopranos, advocating sex, drugs, murder, as number 1 hits.

All that had to happen for you to come up with your assumptions was a web link. I guess you ignored everything else that sells excellently eh?
 
[quote name='AdultLink']

Has it even been proved that Darwins film would sell bad? Has it even COME OUT? So you guys hear somebody say something and automatically assume it's true, and you want to act like I'm the dumb one here?

[/QUOTE]

You can never "prove" anything that has not happened. Personally, I can't see into the future. But one thing you can do is look at the evidence.

America, when compared to other developed countries, is much more religious. You can then take a guess that the majority of those who are affiliated with a religion do not believe fully in the "Theory of Evolution". Therefore, there is probably not much interest in a film like this. This is probably the atheist version of "The Passion".

We merely have an issue at hand, and a probable cause.

Could we be wrong? Absolutely. Unlike religion, if solid evidence is submitted, any decent logic based person will change his mind. He's not "dumb", he's merely basing his knowledge on current evidence.

Also, I wouldn't consider all of these comment "hateful". They are merely criticizing where criticism is necessary. America has flaws. You cannot fix them unless you have the people to point them out. And I'm sorry, but I cannot think of a better place to criticize the US than on it's scientific ignorance.

Sure, I'm generalizing, but sometimes it is necessary to get things done. Do you think everybody in the south was for slavery? Probably not. Did the south deserve the criticism it recieved? Absolutely.

P.S. Richard Dawkins is the bomb. ( I don't feel like looking for the person who said that they were doing a report on him. Sorry :D )
 
And btw, since I'm so dumb, I wouldn't know this part that I'm about to tell you:

A little known fact about America: We were not a christian nation in the method the christians say we were. Up until the early 1900's we allowed prostitution while europe had it banned! Alot of christian women during the early 1900's baneded together and eventually banned prostitution.

Look it up yourself. Or don't since I'm stupid, I must be making shit up, instead of being someone who studies history, unlike yourselves...
 
[quote name='DrMunkee']You can never "prove" anything that has not happened. Personally, I can't see into the future. But one thing you can do is look at the evidence.

America, when compared to other developed countries, is much more religious. You can then take a guess that the majority of those who are affiliated with a religion do not believe fully in the "Theory of Evolution". Therefore, there is probably not much interest in a film like this. This is probably the atheist version of "The Passion".

We merely have an issue at hand, and a probable cause.

Could we be wrong? Absolutely. Unlike religion, if solid evidence is submitted, any decent logic based person will change his mind. He's not "dumb", he's merely basing his knowledge on current evidence.

P.S. Richard Dawkins is the bomb. ( I don't feel like looking for the person who said that they were doing a report on him. Sorry :D )[/QUOTE]

But isn't this the same retarded argument people were giving me for this entire coversation? Sicne I was defending something that cannot be proved (God), I am an idiot? Yet the people who came to post in this topic, acting like they were using logic, and cannot prove that a Darwin film would or would not sell, were telling me I was the idiot here?

Interesting...
 
Anyone else who wishes to comment and/or call me idiot, please remember that when you try to act like you are using scientific knowledge to call me an idiot of defense for something that cannot be proven, you are by doing so NOT using scientific knowledge by making assumptions about a Darwin film that could or could not sell.

I'm an idiot remember? I could never make a metaphor of a topic...
 
[quote name='Msut77']Link is even sillier and whackier than I thought.[/QUOTE]

You care to prove anything here or just run your mouth?
 
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