Illini Jeeper
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I didn't see anyone post on this, and seeing as how it's important to all of us in some way, shape, or form...
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Feds Take Over IndyMac (2nd Largest Bank Failure in US History)
- Thread starter Illini Jeeper
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[quote name='Moxio']I'm scared. 
[/quote]
I wouldn't be, the economy as a whole has been riding high on a bubble of false promises for years now. Now that the bubble has popped and everyone is falling flat on their ass, things will begin to level out and reset itself.
The same needs to happen to oil, and things will quiet down quite a bit.
~HotShotX
[/quote]I wouldn't be, the economy as a whole has been riding high on a bubble of false promises for years now. Now that the bubble has popped and everyone is falling flat on their ass, things will begin to level out and reset itself.
The same needs to happen to oil, and things will quiet down quite a bit.
~HotShotX
hiccupleftovers
CAGiversary!
[quote name='HotShotX']I wouldn't be, the economy as a whole has been riding high on a bubble of false promises for years now. Now that the bubble has popped and everyone is falling flat on their ass, things will begin to level out and reset itself.
The same needs to happen to oil, and things will quiet down quite a bit.
~HotShotX[/quote]
If only it were that simple. If Fannie and Freddy fall, then all hell will break loose. Let's not forget that the banks continue to throw write downs like they were nothing. Add to that the price of oil, which only dropped $10 so it could shoot back up, and you've got one fine mess of a storm. This isn't bubble, this is a perfect storm.
The same needs to happen to oil, and things will quiet down quite a bit.
~HotShotX[/quote]
If only it were that simple. If Fannie and Freddy fall, then all hell will break loose. Let's not forget that the banks continue to throw write downs like they were nothing. Add to that the price of oil, which only dropped $10 so it could shoot back up, and you've got one fine mess of a storm. This isn't bubble, this is a perfect storm.
Trancendental
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FISA just passed too.
Looks like it's finally time to stuff my money in a mattress, pack up a rifle, and head for the highest hill I can find.
Looks like it's finally time to stuff my money in a mattress, pack up a rifle, and head for the highest hill I can find.
Capitalizt
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Don't stuff your money under the mattress. Those paper dollars are rapidly declining in value as the fed runs the printing presses night and day..
Buy gold.
Buy silver.
Sleep tight.
Buy gold.
Buy silver.
Sleep tight.
Illini Jeeper
CAGiversary!
[quote name='mtxbass1']I honestly expect Freddie and Fannie to announce the same over this weekend.[/QUOTE]
Same here. What a mess. On the upside, I guess, young people (like myself) are having an easy time finding cheaper housing in some of these previously out-of-the-price-range places. But on the other hand, it'll be damn near impossible to get a loan for it.
Same here. What a mess. On the upside, I guess, young people (like myself) are having an easy time finding cheaper housing in some of these previously out-of-the-price-range places. But on the other hand, it'll be damn near impossible to get a loan for it.
fullmetalfan720
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Time to invest in the Euro.
[quote name='Liquid 2']Bernanke is wiping his ass with the dollar to "build consumer confidence."[/QUOTE]
He's not doing it to "build consumer confidence", he's doing it to keep the economy growing, albeit at an anemic rate. Besides, what would you do in his place? He's stuck between the proverbial rock and very hard place, but he's actually come up with some very creative solutions so far. AFAIC, let the banks/mortgage lenders that were idiots enough to make bad/high-risk loans go under. We need to get through this mess, and that's the only way we will.
He's not doing it to "build consumer confidence", he's doing it to keep the economy growing, albeit at an anemic rate. Besides, what would you do in his place? He's stuck between the proverbial rock and very hard place, but he's actually come up with some very creative solutions so far. AFAIC, let the banks/mortgage lenders that were idiots enough to make bad/high-risk loans go under. We need to get through this mess, and that's the only way we will.
VanillaGorilla
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Who cares, FDIC insured up to $100,000. Last time I checked, I had $120 in the bank.
darthbudge
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[quote name='VanillaGorilla']Who cares, FDIC insured up to $100,000. Last time I checked, I had $120 in the bank.[/quote]
:facepalm:
You are obviously missing the much higher economic problems that would happen when things like that happen. It isn't just about you losing the money in your bank or not.
:facepalm:
You are obviously missing the much higher economic problems that would happen when things like that happen. It isn't just about you losing the money in your bank or not.
GTzerO
Banned
[quote name='darthbudge']:facepalm:
You are obviously missing the much higher economic problems that would happen when things like that happen. It isn't just about you losing the money in your bank or not.[/quote]
He was making a joke.....
I'm going to be honest, I don't get most of what's going on, so I can only hope for the best.
You are obviously missing the much higher economic problems that would happen when things like that happen. It isn't just about you losing the money in your bank or not.[/quote]
He was making a joke.....
I'm going to be honest, I don't get most of what's going on, so I can only hope for the best.
[quote name='GTzerO']He was making a joke.....
I'm going to be honest, I don't get most of what's going on, so I can only hope for the best.[/QUOTE]
There is a lot of fear in the markets right now. It feels like the economy is on the edge of a cliff and one little push will cause everything to come crashing down. Consequently, any type of bad news will tend to get exaggerated, especially when related to financial companies. Using a example from Indymac, people know that the FDIC will insure up to $100,000 but that didn't prevent the panic last month when their customers withdrew about $100 milion dollars per day from their accounts.
The sad thing is this isn't even the biggest cause for concern right now. Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae are under a cloud of negative news and rumors. People are actually worried that GSEs like them will fail which could potentially bring down half of the mortgage market with them. IMHO the government will definitely step in to prop them up but this will cause a even bigger set of problems.
I'm going to be honest, I don't get most of what's going on, so I can only hope for the best.[/QUOTE]
There is a lot of fear in the markets right now. It feels like the economy is on the edge of a cliff and one little push will cause everything to come crashing down. Consequently, any type of bad news will tend to get exaggerated, especially when related to financial companies. Using a example from Indymac, people know that the FDIC will insure up to $100,000 but that didn't prevent the panic last month when their customers withdrew about $100 milion dollars per day from their accounts.
The sad thing is this isn't even the biggest cause for concern right now. Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae are under a cloud of negative news and rumors. People are actually worried that GSEs like them will fail which could potentially bring down half of the mortgage market with them. IMHO the government will definitely step in to prop them up but this will cause a even bigger set of problems.
cindersphere
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I don't know if this is wrong but I enjoys stories of the US economy failing. It brings a pic of a guy getting kicked in the nuts to my head. I kinda want to see how far this is gonna go.
[quote name='GTzerO']He was making a joke.....
I'm going to be honest, I don't get most of what's going on, so I can only hope for the best.[/quote]
No, VanillaGorilla is actually that stupid.
[quote name='Liquid 2']I wish the fed would stop bailing everyone out.
ing Ben Bernanke. 
|[/quote]
This. The mortgage companies and banks thated up get bailouts, but not all the people who got screwed.
I'm going to be honest, I don't get most of what's going on, so I can only hope for the best.[/quote]
No, VanillaGorilla is actually that stupid.
[quote name='Liquid 2']I wish the fed would stop bailing everyone out.
ing Ben Bernanke. |[/quote]This. The mortgage companies and banks that
ed up get bailouts, but not all the people who got screwed.
You have to look at the big picture. Yes, on the surface it seems unfair that the government would step in to bail out banks in danger of failure due to their own irresponsible business practices. However, a rash of banks going under would severely damage the economy as a whole leading to a complete collapse of the stock market which affects everyone.
[quote name='cindersphere']I don't know if this is wrong but I enjoys stories of the US economy failing. It brings a pic of a guy getting kicked in the nuts to my head. I kinda want to see how far this is gonna go.[/QUOTE]
I'm a bit curious too, although not for the lulz like you are. I never thought I would see a run on a bank in my lifetime and now I see two in one year (the equivalent for Bear Stearns and now Indymac) plus the one in England. I am curious how the govenment will react to this and what the long term consequences to the economy will be. My entire portfolio is down somewhat so this affects me on a personal level too. I'm not going to start panicking and convert everything to cash just because everyone else is going crazy though.
BTW everyone should read up on moral hazard. This is what people mean when they say the government is stuck between a rock and a hard place.
I'm a bit curious too, although not for the lulz like you are. I never thought I would see a run on a bank in my lifetime and now I see two in one year (the equivalent for Bear Stearns and now Indymac) plus the one in England. I am curious how the govenment will react to this and what the long term consequences to the economy will be. My entire portfolio is down somewhat so this affects me on a personal level too. I'm not going to start panicking and convert everything to cash just because everyone else is going crazy though.
BTW everyone should read up on moral hazard. This is what people mean when they say the government is stuck between a rock and a hard place.
[quote name='cletus'] My entire portfolio is down somewhat so this affects me on a personal level too. I'm not going to start panicking and convert everything to cash just because everyone else is going crazy though.[/QUOTE]
Good for you. But if you DO panic, you'll want to convert everything to Euros, or gold perhaps!
Good for you. But if you DO panic, you'll want to convert everything to Euros, or gold perhaps!
[quote name='mtxbass1']Um...I hope that's sarcasm. BoA has been rumored to be having lots of trouble as of late.[/QUOTE]
BOA is the largest bank in the country. They are going one of the banks that'll rise from the ashes relatively intact. Actually, they shrewdly took advantage of the market to acquire Countrywide which on the longterm will make them perfectly poised to dominate the mortgage market after the mess is over. I've been nibbling on BAC stock as a long-term buy.
BOA is the largest bank in the country. They are going one of the banks that'll rise from the ashes relatively intact. Actually, they shrewdly took advantage of the market to acquire Countrywide which on the longterm will make them perfectly poised to dominate the mortgage market after the mess is over. I've been nibbling on BAC stock as a long-term buy.
[quote name='dopa345']BOA is the largest bank in the country. They are going one of the banks that'll rise from the ashes relatively intact. Actually, they shrewdly took advantage of the market to acquire Countrywide which on the longterm will make them perfectly poised to dominate the mortgage market after the mess is over. I've been nibbling on BAC stock as a long-term buy.[/quote]
Citi is the largest bank in America by holdings. Bank of America is the largest commercial bank.
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0763206.html
You are crazy if you think either of those banks are immune to these problems just because they are so large.
How's that Pfizer stock treating you btw?
Citi is the largest bank in America by holdings. Bank of America is the largest commercial bank.
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0763206.html
You are crazy if you think either of those banks are immune to these problems just because they are so large.
How's that Pfizer stock treating you btw?
For those that care...
[quote name='Marketwatch']
WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) -- The implicit government guarantee of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac is now explicit.
In a dramatic statement released Sunday, the White House and Federal Reserve moved to give the mortgage giants the capital they need to survive the depression in the housing market and turmoil in financial markets that had left them dangling over a cliff.
Of most immediate importance, the Fed's board of governors voted to open up its emergency discount window to Fannie and Freddie.
In addition, Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson announced that he will seek Congressional authorization to by stock in the two companies and increase the government's credit line.
At the moment, each company may borrow only $2.25 billion.
[/quote]
http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/white-house-fed-step-rescue/story.aspx?guid={F942EDC2-E975-4F01-AF6F-F1D7591E4526}#
I love how Friday, everything was "fine". Now today it's not. It's another government bailout.
OH. And InBev just bought Anheuser Busch...
[quote name='Marketwatch']
WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) -- The implicit government guarantee of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac is now explicit.
In a dramatic statement released Sunday, the White House and Federal Reserve moved to give the mortgage giants the capital they need to survive the depression in the housing market and turmoil in financial markets that had left them dangling over a cliff.
Of most immediate importance, the Fed's board of governors voted to open up its emergency discount window to Fannie and Freddie.
In addition, Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson announced that he will seek Congressional authorization to by stock in the two companies and increase the government's credit line.
At the moment, each company may borrow only $2.25 billion.
[/quote]
http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/white-house-fed-step-rescue/story.aspx?guid={F942EDC2-E975-4F01-AF6F-F1D7591E4526}#
I love how Friday, everything was "fine". Now today it's not. It's another government bailout.
OH. And InBev just bought Anheuser Busch...
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Bank of America? Screw them when I had them as my primary banking needs, I got a few overdraft fees, so I went negative $100 or so, just because I don't have the funds do not mean I cant spend it, I told them muther ers I will hit them up next week with the loot......They dident listen....closed my account
ers I will hit them up next week with the loot......They dident listen....closed my account
VanillaGorilla
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Oh boy, the old "Everyone should care because this affects everyone in some way!" Well, what the do you want me to do about it? I don't worry about things I have no control over. Sure, I can take what little money I have out of the bank and buy commodities, but aside from that, what else? Sell all my belongings, buy gold, and live my life like a ing hermit?
do you want me to do about it? I don't worry about things I have no control over. Sure, I can take what little money I have out of the bank and buy commodities, but aside from that, what else? Sell all my belongings, buy gold, and live my life like a ing hermit?
[quote name='Poor2More']Bank of America? Screw them when I had them as my primary banking needs, I got a few overdraft fees, so I went negative $100 or so, just because I don't have the funds do not mean I cant spend it, I told them muther ers I will hit them up next week with the loot......They dident listen....closed my account[/QUOTE]
How do you function?
Our human scientists could learn a lot from you.
ers I will hit them up next week with the loot......They dident listen....closed my account[/QUOTE]How do you function?
Our human scientists could learn a lot from you.
[quote name='mtxbass1']Citi is the largest bank in America by holdings. Bank of America is the largest commercial bank.
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0763206.html
You are crazy if you think either of those banks are immune to these problems just because they are so large.
How's that Pfizer stock treating you btw?[/QUOTE]
I didn't say they weren't immune, I just think someone has to come up on top so why not the bank in the with the largest amount of deposits who also has positioned itself to be the leading residential mortgage banker in the country.
However, I'll fully admit I could be completely off the mark so wait 3 years or so and we'll see.
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0763206.html
You are crazy if you think either of those banks are immune to these problems just because they are so large.
How's that Pfizer stock treating you btw?[/QUOTE]
I didn't say they weren't immune, I just think someone has to come up on top so why not the bank in the with the largest amount of deposits who also has positioned itself to be the leading residential mortgage banker in the country.
However, I'll fully admit I could be completely off the mark so wait 3 years or so and we'll see.
[quote name='dopa345']I didn't say they weren't immune, I just think someone has to come up on top so why not the bank in the with the largest amount of deposits who also has positioned itself to be the leading residential mortgage banker in the country.
However, I'll fully admit I could be completely off the mark so wait 3 years or so and we'll see.[/quote]
Dopa, here's some info for you.
http://bankimplode.com/blog/2008/07/08/bank-of-america/
also
http://bankimplode.com/blog/2008/06/21/wells-fargo-14b/
I'd be wary of financials that you think are a "good deal" right now.
However, I'll fully admit I could be completely off the mark so wait 3 years or so and we'll see.[/quote]
Dopa, here's some info for you.
http://bankimplode.com/blog/2008/07/08/bank-of-america/
also
http://bankimplode.com/blog/2008/06/21/wells-fargo-14b/
I'd be wary of financials that you think are a "good deal" right now.
[quote name='mtxbass1']Dopa, here's some info for you.
http://bankimplode.com/blog/2008/07/08/bank-of-america/
also
http://bankimplode.com/blog/2008/06/21/wells-fargo-14b/
I'd be wary of financials that you think are a "good deal" right now.[/QUOTE]
The fact remains that both banks are still turning a profit and will survive. There is virtually zero chance of them going under and the rash of bank failures picking off smaller banks will only increase their market share when the dust settles. Is it going to be painful for the short-term? Absolutely but I'm willing to ride it out. If I'm wrong, well at least I don't invest anymore than I can afford to lose. Also I have a couple home runs (SPG and OMPI) to make up for it.
http://bankimplode.com/blog/2008/07/08/bank-of-america/
also
http://bankimplode.com/blog/2008/06/21/wells-fargo-14b/
I'd be wary of financials that you think are a "good deal" right now.[/QUOTE]
The fact remains that both banks are still turning a profit and will survive. There is virtually zero chance of them going under and the rash of bank failures picking off smaller banks will only increase their market share when the dust settles. Is it going to be painful for the short-term? Absolutely but I'm willing to ride it out. If I'm wrong, well at least I don't invest anymore than I can afford to lose. Also I have a couple home runs (SPG and OMPI) to make up for it.
Citi and BoA have many other assests then Morgages... and that's where they will be able to pull ahead. Just because they will get hit in the nuts, doesn't mean that the rest of the body will go under.
I find it interesting, but besides all that's happening, our economy is still growing.
USA is robust and showing that we have oil and house morgages slamming us, we're still going...
I am siding with the theory of "waiting till this pass, we'll eventually reset". We'll be a stronger country afterwards.
I find it interesting, but besides all that's happening, our economy is still growing.
USA is robust and showing that we have oil and house morgages slamming us, we're still going...
I am siding with the theory of "waiting till this pass, we'll eventually reset". We'll be a stronger country afterwards.
[quote name='dopa345']The fact remains that both banks are still turning a profit and will survive. There is virtually zero chance of them going under and the rash of bank failures picking off smaller banks will only increase their market share when the dust settles. Is it going to be painful for the short-term? Absolutely but I'm willing to ride it out. If I'm wrong, well at least I don't invest anymore than I can afford to lose. Also I have a couple home runs (SPG and OMPI) to make up for it.[/quote]
All I'm saying is that you run very high risk right now with very little reward. This problem isn't going away any time soon. Even if they "recovered" in a few years, you could have put your money elsewhere to make a much better return.
If you don't mind, how do you consider SPG and OMPI "homeruns"?
Even if you played both of those at their absolute lows for this year, and sold them at the absolute highs, that still isn't a homerun IMO. OMPI especially with it trading at a low of $6.81 and a high of $9.75 this year. No one is able to perfectly determine the absolute low for something, nor the absolute high.
Go look at SKF (which I bought at 108 in March) and look at what it's at today (192.01). That's a homerun. A near $88 per share gain in less than 5 months? Sign me up.
See BHI, CEDC as well for more examples of short term homeruns.
As far as BAC and WFC turning a "profit". Let's see how much of a profit they turn when they report Friday. My bet is that it will be well below last quarter, if not a loss entirely.
All I'm saying is that you run very high risk right now with very little reward. This problem isn't going away any time soon. Even if they "recovered" in a few years, you could have put your money elsewhere to make a much better return.
If you don't mind, how do you consider SPG and OMPI "homeruns"?
Even if you played both of those at their absolute lows for this year, and sold them at the absolute highs, that still isn't a homerun IMO. OMPI especially with it trading at a low of $6.81 and a high of $9.75 this year. No one is able to perfectly determine the absolute low for something, nor the absolute high.
Go look at SKF (which I bought at 108 in March) and look at what it's at today (192.01). That's a homerun. A near $88 per share gain in less than 5 months? Sign me up.
See BHI, CEDC as well for more examples of short term homeruns.
As far as BAC and WFC turning a "profit". Let's see how much of a profit they turn when they report Friday. My bet is that it will be well below last quarter, if not a loss entirely.
bread's done