Lancey Howard
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GoDaddy Releases Position Backing SOPA
- Thread starter Lancey Howard
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Access_Denied
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Guess I'll never buy from GoDaddy again. :/
Soodmeg
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People want to bitch and complain about SOPA but they will never stop stealing things on the internet. It reminds me of PC gamers, they complain so much about how everyone ignores their platform and makes them jump through hoops to play. DRM, Ports not even releasing popular games etc etc.
But the very second someone does it gets pirated to no end.
You can have it both ways, I dont fully agree with SOPA either but what else do you want them to do? YOU STEAL EVERYTHING. You break into a place enough times and then get pissed when they put a fence up. They wouldnt have to be so extreme if everyone didnt think it was their right to steal everything.
Dont like SOPA? Try paying for some stuff. I also love how people always threaten to not buy things that wouldnt in the first place. The whole thing is based on the fact that so many things are stolen and reproduced on the internet so how does a threat of not buying things from them really work? Not enough people were in the first place.
But the very second someone does it gets pirated to no end.
You can have it both ways, I dont fully agree with SOPA either but what else do you want them to do? YOU STEAL EVERYTHING. You break into a place enough times and then get pissed when they put a fence up. They wouldnt have to be so extreme if everyone didnt think it was their right to steal everything.
Dont like SOPA? Try paying for some stuff. I also love how people always threaten to not buy things that wouldnt in the first place. The whole thing is based on the fact that so many things are stolen and reproduced on the internet so how does a threat of not buying things from them really work? Not enough people were in the first place.
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ShockandAww
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SOPA is vaguely worded which I think is the big issue with it. If you can stop piracy in a manner that won't possibly destroy the internet as we know it, cool. SOPA is not going to do that.
wikipedia.org and neogaf.com are hosted by GoDaddy. There's a big push at reddit to get wikipedia.org to switch registrars. I cant post at neogaf because I'm not cool enough but if there's someone that can could you point this out in the SOPA thread they have going on there? http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=455818
Maybe they can influence neogaf to change registrars as well.
wikipedia.org and neogaf.com are hosted by GoDaddy. There's a big push at reddit to get wikipedia.org to switch registrars. I cant post at neogaf because I'm not cool enough but if there's someone that can could you point this out in the SOPA thread they have going on there? http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=455818
Maybe they can influence neogaf to change registrars as well.
Soodmeg
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Yeah SOPA does seem like it would destroy the internet....but you are doing that already by stealing so many things. Again, its one or the other. Clearly the internet cant self police so what other option does a company have?
I am all for getting together and discussing what can be done but it doesnt seem like many internet users want to do that because the end result will make them face the fact that they do not have a "right" to steal whatever they want just because its digital.
The internet brought this upon themselves so you cant get mad now you should have saw this coming when you were downloading 30g of torrents a day.
I am all for getting together and discussing what can be done but it doesnt seem like many internet users want to do that because the end result will make them face the fact that they do not have a "right" to steal whatever they want just because its digital.
The internet brought this upon themselves so you cant get mad now you should have saw this coming when you were downloading 30g of torrents a day.
Trancendental
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[quote name='Soodmeg']People want to bitch and complain about SOPA but they will never stop stealing things on the internet. It reminds me of PC gamers, they complain so much about how everyone ignores their platform and makes them jump through hoops to play. DRM, Ports not even releasing popular games etc etc.
But the very second someone does it gets pirated to no end.
You can have it both ways, I dont fully agree with SOPA either but what else do you want them to do? YOU STEAL EVERYTHING. You break into a place enough times and then get pissed when they put a fence up. They wouldnt have to be so extreme if everyone didnt think it was their right to steal everything.
Dont like SOPA? Try paying for some stuff. I also love how people always threaten to not buy things that wouldnt in the first place. The whole thing is based on the fact that so many things are stolen and reproduced on the internet so how does a threat of not buying things from them really work? Not enough people were in the first place.[/QUOTE]
If we have to err between too much power to the citizens or too much power to the corporations I choose the former.
A bored teenager torrenting a few Nikki Minaj songs does not equate to the horrors that corporations will commit once they acquire unprecedented censorship powers.
But the very second someone does it gets pirated to no end.
You can have it both ways, I dont fully agree with SOPA either but what else do you want them to do? YOU STEAL EVERYTHING. You break into a place enough times and then get pissed when they put a fence up. They wouldnt have to be so extreme if everyone didnt think it was their right to steal everything.
Dont like SOPA? Try paying for some stuff. I also love how people always threaten to not buy things that wouldnt in the first place. The whole thing is based on the fact that so many things are stolen and reproduced on the internet so how does a threat of not buying things from them really work? Not enough people were in the first place.[/QUOTE]
If we have to err between too much power to the citizens or too much power to the corporations I choose the former.
A bored teenager torrenting a few Nikki Minaj songs does not equate to the horrors that corporations will commit once they acquire unprecedented censorship powers.
ShockandAww
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[quote name='camoor']If we have to err between too much power to the citizens or too much power to the corporations I choose the former.
A bored teenager torrenting a few Nikki Minaj songs does not equate to the horrors that corporations will commit once they acquire unprecedented censorship powers.[/QUOTE]
This.
And to me this isnt simply about whether piracy is right or wrong. Piracy for the sake of piracy is indeed wrong and rightfully illegal imo. However SOPA is even worse in the other direction. It is far too restrictive.
Here's a terrible analogy that I shouldn't post but will anyway: It's like someone getting bullied at school and then shooting up the school with the bully (and everyone else) in it to solve the problem. Sure they've solved their bully problem but did so by creating far worse problems for many many more.
Both are very clearly wrong.
Do I know a perfect solution to piracy? Hell no. But it's pretty clear that SOPA is not the proper response.
A bored teenager torrenting a few Nikki Minaj songs does not equate to the horrors that corporations will commit once they acquire unprecedented censorship powers.[/QUOTE]
This.
And to me this isnt simply about whether piracy is right or wrong. Piracy for the sake of piracy is indeed wrong and rightfully illegal imo. However SOPA is even worse in the other direction. It is far too restrictive.
Here's a terrible analogy that I shouldn't post but will anyway: It's like someone getting bullied at school and then shooting up the school with the bully (and everyone else) in it to solve the problem. Sure they've solved their bully problem but did so by creating far worse problems for many many more.
Both are very clearly wrong.
Do I know a perfect solution to piracy? Hell no. But it's pretty clear that SOPA is not the proper response.
Soodmeg
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[quote name='camoor']If we have to err between too much power to the citizens or too much power to the corporations I choose the former.
A bored teenager torrenting a few Nikki Minaj songs does not equate to the horrors that corporations will commit once they acquire unprecedented censorship powers.[/QUOTE]
This is wrong. Period. Its the crux of the their argument. It is so easy to say that its no big deal when you are the one doing the stealing and not the one getting stolen from. Trivializing what you are doing is the catalyst of their push to control everything.
Like most internet users you dont understand that the bored teenager torrenting a few Nikki Minaj songs represents a loss of 20 - 30 million dollars to a corporation. If someone was stealing 30% of your work wouldnt you fight to get it back? When I look at my bank account you dont think I wonder what it would be if 20-40% of my work wasnt stolen each month?
Unless you are an artist you have no way of understanding how it feels to have the world simply up and tell you that you shouldnt be paid for the hundreds of hours thousand of dollars you spent to do what you do.
Again, I am not really for SOPA because I think it does give them way to much power but internet users have FAR to much power right now. Ironically you are exactly what you think they will be. You are raping and pillaging everything around you with very little consequences yet you are scared that they will have too much power? You might as well be able to walk through walls like an X-Men because you found a way to seriously put your hand in the pocket of a major corp and take money out. The strange thing is how people still feel doing this to lets say a bank as illegal but its cool to do it to Sony. The bottom line is that hundreds of millions of dollars of other peoples money gets stolen every year (probably month) you couldnt possible think that they would be fine with that and wouldnt go to the ends of the earth to get it back. If someone stole 200 million from your personally account you would want to hire a hitman and kill them but as long as its a big corp than who cares right?
Until internet users face the fact that they have basically been stealing 100 of millions of dollars from dozens of corporations for years now and decide to work with big corp of a common ground that is fair to both sides you will always be faced with a SOPA. And guess what? You will lose because they have far more lawyers and far more money than you.
I will say it again, dont like SOPA? Then convince your friends to stop downloading everything under the sun and use the thousands of legal apps that are floating around. You can get unlimited amount of virtually everything for under 20 bucks a month but even that is too much for MOST internet users to fork over. So even though I dont like it..prepare to get your ass raped in the exact same fashion you have been doing for years.
A bored teenager torrenting a few Nikki Minaj songs does not equate to the horrors that corporations will commit once they acquire unprecedented censorship powers.[/QUOTE]
This is wrong. Period. Its the crux of the their argument. It is so easy to say that its no big deal when you are the one doing the stealing and not the one getting stolen from. Trivializing what you are doing is the catalyst of their push to control everything.
Like most internet users you dont understand that the bored teenager torrenting a few Nikki Minaj songs represents a loss of 20 - 30 million dollars to a corporation. If someone was stealing 30% of your work wouldnt you fight to get it back? When I look at my bank account you dont think I wonder what it would be if 20-40% of my work wasnt stolen each month?
Unless you are an artist you have no way of understanding how it feels to have the world simply up and tell you that you shouldnt be paid for the hundreds of hours thousand of dollars you spent to do what you do.
Again, I am not really for SOPA because I think it does give them way to much power but internet users have FAR to much power right now. Ironically you are exactly what you think they will be. You are raping and pillaging everything around you with very little consequences yet you are scared that they will have too much power? You might as well be able to walk through walls like an X-Men because you found a way to seriously put your hand in the pocket of a major corp and take money out. The strange thing is how people still feel doing this to lets say a bank as illegal but its cool to do it to Sony. The bottom line is that hundreds of millions of dollars of other peoples money gets stolen every year (probably month) you couldnt possible think that they would be fine with that and wouldnt go to the ends of the earth to get it back. If someone stole 200 million from your personally account you would want to hire a hitman and kill them but as long as its a big corp than who cares right?
Until internet users face the fact that they have basically been stealing 100 of millions of dollars from dozens of corporations for years now and decide to work with big corp of a common ground that is fair to both sides you will always be faced with a SOPA. And guess what? You will lose because they have far more lawyers and far more money than you.
I will say it again, dont like SOPA? Then convince your friends to stop downloading everything under the sun and use the thousands of legal apps that are floating around. You can get unlimited amount of virtually everything for under 20 bucks a month but even that is too much for MOST internet users to fork over. So even though I dont like it..prepare to get your ass raped in the exact same fashion you have been doing for years.
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Trancendental
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[quote name='Soodmeg']This is wrong. Period. Its the crux of the their argument. It is so easy to say that its no big deal when you are the one doing the stealing and not the one getting stolen from. Trivializing what you are doing is the catalyst of their push to control everything.
Like most internet users you dont understand that the bored teenager torrenting a few Nikki Minaj songs represents a loss of 20 - 30 million dollars to a corporation. If someone was stealing 30% of your work wouldnt you fight to get it back? When I look at my bank account you dont think I wonder what it would be if 20-40% of my work wasnt stolen each month?
Unless you are an artist you have no way of understanding how it feels to have the world simply up and tell you that you shouldnt be paid for the hundreds of hours thousand of dollars you spent to do what you do.
Again, I am not really for SOPA because I think it does give them way to much power but internet users have FAR to much power right now. Ironically you are exactly what you think they will be. You are raping and pillaging everything around you with very little consequences yet you are scared that they will have too much power? You might as well be able to walk through walls like an X-Men because you found a way to seriously put your hand in the pocket of a major corp and take money out. The strange thing is how people still feel doing this to lets say a bank as illegal but its cool to do it to Sony. The bottom line is that hundreds of millions of dollars of other peoples money gets stolen every year (probably month) you couldnt possible think that they would be fine with that and wouldnt go to the ends of the earth to get it back. If someone stole 200 million from your personally account you would want to hire a hitman and kill them but as long as its a big corp than who cares right?
Until internet users face the fact that they have basically been stealing 100 of millions of dollars from dozens of corporations for years now and decide to work with big corp of a common ground that is fair to both sides you will always be faced with a SOPA. And guess what? You will lose because they have far more lawyers and far more money than you.
I will say it again, dont like SOPA? Then convince your friends to stop downloading everything under the sun and use the thousands of legal apps that are floating around. You can get unlimited amount of virtually everything for under 20 bucks a month but even that is too much for MOST internet users to fork over. So even though I dont like it..prepare to get your ass raped in the exact same fashion you have been doing for years.[/QUOTE]
OK - to be clear I'm not stealing anything. Netflix, Steam, plain old fashioned PS3 games, quality DLC, I'm a fan of all of them. Plus I already said how much I like Sony products in that other thread (even visited their store in NYC last week
)
I also agree that the corporations have all the lawyers and influence, and citizen's rights don't stand a chance. That's probably where the similarity in our opinions ends.
You make piracy in America sound like financial armegeddon - it's not. In terms of the GDP it's peanuts. SOPA is using nuclear weapons to swat flies - it's not going to end well and the citizens are going to pay the price.
But keep it up chuckles, and I'll make another donation to EFF in your name :lol:
Like most internet users you dont understand that the bored teenager torrenting a few Nikki Minaj songs represents a loss of 20 - 30 million dollars to a corporation. If someone was stealing 30% of your work wouldnt you fight to get it back? When I look at my bank account you dont think I wonder what it would be if 20-40% of my work wasnt stolen each month?
Unless you are an artist you have no way of understanding how it feels to have the world simply up and tell you that you shouldnt be paid for the hundreds of hours thousand of dollars you spent to do what you do.
Again, I am not really for SOPA because I think it does give them way to much power but internet users have FAR to much power right now. Ironically you are exactly what you think they will be. You are raping and pillaging everything around you with very little consequences yet you are scared that they will have too much power? You might as well be able to walk through walls like an X-Men because you found a way to seriously put your hand in the pocket of a major corp and take money out. The strange thing is how people still feel doing this to lets say a bank as illegal but its cool to do it to Sony. The bottom line is that hundreds of millions of dollars of other peoples money gets stolen every year (probably month) you couldnt possible think that they would be fine with that and wouldnt go to the ends of the earth to get it back. If someone stole 200 million from your personally account you would want to hire a hitman and kill them but as long as its a big corp than who cares right?
Until internet users face the fact that they have basically been stealing 100 of millions of dollars from dozens of corporations for years now and decide to work with big corp of a common ground that is fair to both sides you will always be faced with a SOPA. And guess what? You will lose because they have far more lawyers and far more money than you.
I will say it again, dont like SOPA? Then convince your friends to stop downloading everything under the sun and use the thousands of legal apps that are floating around. You can get unlimited amount of virtually everything for under 20 bucks a month but even that is too much for MOST internet users to fork over. So even though I dont like it..prepare to get your ass raped in the exact same fashion you have been doing for years.[/QUOTE]
OK - to be clear I'm not stealing anything. Netflix, Steam, plain old fashioned PS3 games, quality DLC, I'm a fan of all of them. Plus I already said how much I like Sony products in that other thread (even visited their store in NYC last week
)I also agree that the corporations have all the lawyers and influence, and citizen's rights don't stand a chance. That's probably where the similarity in our opinions ends.
You make piracy in America sound like financial armegeddon - it's not. In terms of the GDP it's peanuts. SOPA is using nuclear weapons to swat flies - it's not going to end well and the citizens are going to pay the price.
But keep it up chuckles, and I'll make another donation to EFF in your name :lol:
Looks like they learned their lesson. If you want to support something controversial do it silently and far away from the eyes of Reddit.
Politicians would love it if they could block access to websites at will with no oversight so SOPA will pass eventually. Fools like Soodmeg make it so easy for them.
Politicians would love it if they could block access to websites at will with no oversight so SOPA will pass eventually. Fools like Soodmeg make it so easy for them.
ShockandAww
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Ha. Was reading about why the hell GoDaddy supported SOPA to begin with. Turns out they helped create it and they're exempt from it. So if website A is hosted by Company X and has copyrighted content...TAKE IT DOWN. But website B has copyrighted material and is hosted by GoDaddy. Lucky them. It's ok to have pirated material because GoDaddy is your host! Sickening.
So now they just BOOM have reversed and do not support SOPA that they are exempt from and helped create to begin with? Surrrre...
GoDaddy.
So now they just BOOM have reversed and do not support SOPA that they are exempt from and helped create to begin with? Surrrre...
GoDaddy.
Lancey Howard
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[quote name='Soodmeg']This is wrong. Period. Its the crux of the their argument. It is so easy to say that its no big deal when you are the one doing the stealing and not the one getting stolen from. Trivializing what you are doing is the catalyst of their push to control everything.
Like most internet users you dont understand that the bored teenager torrenting a few Nikki Minaj songs represents a loss of 20 - 30 million dollars to a corporation. If someone was stealing 30% of your work wouldnt you fight to get it back? When I look at my bank account you dont think I wonder what it would be if 20-40% of my work wasnt stolen each month?
Unless you are an artist you have no way of understanding how it feels to have the world simply up and tell you that you shouldnt be paid for the hundreds of hours thousand of dollars you spent to do what you do.
Again, I am not really for SOPA because I think it does give them way to much power but internet users have FAR to much power right now. Ironically you are exactly what you think they will be. You are raping and pillaging everything around you with very little consequences yet you are scared that they will have too much power? You might as well be able to walk through walls like an X-Men because you found a way to seriously put your hand in the pocket of a major corp and take money out. The strange thing is how people still feel doing this to lets say a bank as illegal but its cool to do it to Sony. The bottom line is that hundreds of millions of dollars of other peoples money gets stolen every year (probably month) you couldnt possible think that they would be fine with that and wouldnt go to the ends of the earth to get it back. If someone stole 200 million from your personally account you would want to hire a hitman and kill them but as long as its a big corp than who cares right?
Until internet users face the fact that they have basically been stealing 100 of millions of dollars from dozens of corporations for years now and decide to work with big corp of a common ground that is fair to both sides you will always be faced with a SOPA. And guess what? You will lose because they have far more lawyers and far more money than you.
I will say it again, dont like SOPA? Then convince your friends to stop downloading everything under the sun and use the thousands of legal apps that are floating around. You can get unlimited amount of virtually everything for under 20 bucks a month but even that is too much for MOST internet users to fork over. So even though I dont like it..prepare to get your ass raped in the exact same fashion you have been doing for years.[/QUOTE]
I think you make a sound argument; however, to give [the power that SOPA will] the power to censor is a major step in the wrong direction. I don't like the idea of anyone telling me that something on the internets is VERBOTEN because it sort-of kind-of approaches copyright infringement...with no checks and balances attached.
Sweeping edicts work rather poorly.
And I really do not think the backlash in public opinion towards the bill is fueled by pirates. Frankly, at least the people I talk to (which admittedly is very few, considering) are still scared to death to pirate anything because they think the RIAA is watching. Do I think copyright infringment is wrong? Yes. Do I think there should be a law in place that allows anyone to censor or block as THEY [government, copyright holders, Joe down the block] see fit to bitch about? No.
Like most internet users you dont understand that the bored teenager torrenting a few Nikki Minaj songs represents a loss of 20 - 30 million dollars to a corporation. If someone was stealing 30% of your work wouldnt you fight to get it back? When I look at my bank account you dont think I wonder what it would be if 20-40% of my work wasnt stolen each month?
Unless you are an artist you have no way of understanding how it feels to have the world simply up and tell you that you shouldnt be paid for the hundreds of hours thousand of dollars you spent to do what you do.
Again, I am not really for SOPA because I think it does give them way to much power but internet users have FAR to much power right now. Ironically you are exactly what you think they will be. You are raping and pillaging everything around you with very little consequences yet you are scared that they will have too much power? You might as well be able to walk through walls like an X-Men because you found a way to seriously put your hand in the pocket of a major corp and take money out. The strange thing is how people still feel doing this to lets say a bank as illegal but its cool to do it to Sony. The bottom line is that hundreds of millions of dollars of other peoples money gets stolen every year (probably month) you couldnt possible think that they would be fine with that and wouldnt go to the ends of the earth to get it back. If someone stole 200 million from your personally account you would want to hire a hitman and kill them but as long as its a big corp than who cares right?
Until internet users face the fact that they have basically been stealing 100 of millions of dollars from dozens of corporations for years now and decide to work with big corp of a common ground that is fair to both sides you will always be faced with a SOPA. And guess what? You will lose because they have far more lawyers and far more money than you.
I will say it again, dont like SOPA? Then convince your friends to stop downloading everything under the sun and use the thousands of legal apps that are floating around. You can get unlimited amount of virtually everything for under 20 bucks a month but even that is too much for MOST internet users to fork over. So even though I dont like it..prepare to get your ass raped in the exact same fashion you have been doing for years.[/QUOTE]
I think you make a sound argument; however, to give [the power that SOPA will] the power to censor is a major step in the wrong direction. I don't like the idea of anyone telling me that something on the internets is VERBOTEN because it sort-of kind-of approaches copyright infringement...with no checks and balances attached.
Sweeping edicts work rather poorly.
And I really do not think the backlash in public opinion towards the bill is fueled by pirates. Frankly, at least the people I talk to (which admittedly is very few, considering) are still scared to death to pirate anything because they think the RIAA is watching. Do I think copyright infringment is wrong? Yes. Do I think there should be a law in place that allows anyone to censor or block as THEY [government, copyright holders, Joe down the block] see fit to bitch about? No.
Soodmeg
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Camoor I didnt mean you, I just meant in general. Also remember that I AM NOT FOR SOPA...as I also think it gives them far to much power.
What I am saying is that you can not be outraged that your dog bit you after you spent 10 years beating it. It seems to me that a lot of people think that this is a big corp trying to bully the little guy when its just the opposite. The real problem is the generation of people who have grown to believe that they have a RIGHT to other peoples work as long as it on the internet. For their stand point what more can they do? They already have provided numerous avenues to purchase extremely cheap legal content and still people pirate the shit out of everything. So much so that many young people dont even understand the concept of ownership of digital things.
Also camoor, again, clearly you are not an artist. It is very easy to claim its just peanuts when ITS NOT COMING FROM YOUR BANK ACCOUNT. Basically what you are saying is.....as long as its an artist em but you would lose your shit if I walked into your bank and took 20% of your money. I am sure you know what I do for a living and my work gets stolen all the time, I am not super poor but I imagine if 30% of my work wasnt stolen each month I could maybe pay off all of my student loans and saving for a house or what not.
That is the crux of their push. Its the fact that people have grown to think they have a right to other peoples work and just because the format in digital. Until you convince people otherwise there will ALWAYS be a SOPA because a corp will never stand for letting million of dollars go for no reason.
What I am saying is that you can not be outraged that your dog bit you after you spent 10 years beating it. It seems to me that a lot of people think that this is a big corp trying to bully the little guy when its just the opposite. The real problem is the generation of people who have grown to believe that they have a RIGHT to other peoples work as long as it on the internet. For their stand point what more can they do? They already have provided numerous avenues to purchase extremely cheap legal content and still people pirate the shit out of everything. So much so that many young people dont even understand the concept of ownership of digital things.
Also camoor, again, clearly you are not an artist. It is very easy to claim its just peanuts when ITS NOT COMING FROM YOUR BANK ACCOUNT. Basically what you are saying is.....as long as its an artist
em but you would lose your shit if I walked into your bank and took 20% of your money. I am sure you know what I do for a living and my work gets stolen all the time, I am not super poor but I imagine if 30% of my work wasnt stolen each month I could maybe pay off all of my student loans and saving for a house or what not. That is the crux of their push. Its the fact that people have grown to think they have a right to other peoples work and just because the format in digital. Until you convince people otherwise there will ALWAYS be a SOPA because a corp will never stand for letting million of dollars go for no reason.
What about adapting with the times? So what if music becomes "free" - maybe that's the way it should be. Should Jay-Z and Lady Gaga really be among the highest paid people in the world? I don't begrudge them for it but would people really stop making music if all you could earn is $50,000 a year or something a normal person makes? Plus, there are plenty of other ways to make money as a band/entertainer. Same thing with movies - 3D may not be the ultimate answer to get people to go to the theater but at least it's something.
I'm not saying pirating is right/moral/OK but of course the ones making millions and millions year after year who, by the way, also happen to have a MAJOR influence over politics and lawmakers, are going to throw a fit. SOPA is not the answer - I'm doubtful that there even is an answer other than to adapt. The cat is out of the bag.
I'm not saying pirating is right/moral/OK but of course the ones making millions and millions year after year who, by the way, also happen to have a MAJOR influence over politics and lawmakers, are going to throw a fit. SOPA is not the answer - I'm doubtful that there even is an answer other than to adapt. The cat is out of the bag.
packerfan10
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This is classic New World Order. Problem, Reaction, and Solution. The government creates an artificial problem, we had the reaction stage where we get enough people to go on one side, last the solution stage where government "fixes" the problem and becomes the hero.
Trancendental
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[quote name='Soodmeg']Camoor I didnt mean you, I just meant in general. Also remember that I AM NOT FOR SOPA...as I also think it gives them far to much power.
What I am saying is that you can not be outraged that your dog bit you after you spent 10 years beating it. It seems to me that a lot of people think that this is a big corp trying to bully the little guy when its just the opposite. The real problem is the generation of people who have grown to believe that they have a RIGHT to other peoples work as long as it on the internet. For their stand point what more can they do? They already have provided numerous avenues to purchase extremely cheap legal content and still people pirate the shit out of everything. So much so that many young people dont even understand the concept of ownership of digital things.
Also camoor, again, clearly you are not an artist. It is very easy to claim its just peanuts when ITS NOT COMING FROM YOUR BANK ACCOUNT. Basically what you are saying is.....as long as its an artist em but you would lose your shit if I walked into your bank and took 20% of your money. I am sure you know what I do for a living and my work gets stolen all the time, I am not super poor but I imagine if 30% of my work wasnt stolen each month I could maybe pay off all of my student loans and saving for a house or what not.
That is the crux of their push. Its the fact that people have grown to think they have a right to other peoples work and just because the format in digital. Until you convince people otherwise there will ALWAYS be a SOPA because a corp will never stand for letting million of dollars go for no reason.[/QUOTE]
Eh - I'm more sympathetic to your viewpoint then you probably think and it seems we agree to a certain extent about SOPA.
I think the 'IP should be free' mentality is common among youth because that's a very natural, rebellious, youthful attitude to have. Kids always have and will always going to have those attitudes (ever hear of bootleg tapes back in the dark ages). Draconian laws won't change it either.
From what I've seen with artists, writers, etc - they get screwed more by entertainment companies then the fans.
I think the entertainment services coming out are moving things in the right direction (Amazon cloud sounds cool). And it's because American businesses can afford to hire the most cunning, ruthless, and clever businesspeople - hell they can sell you bottled water when we all know you can get it free from the tap, and they're starting to suceed in offering a superior pipeline of entertainment to the choppy low-quality, virus-ridden torrents. Anyone in the vs forum will tell you that I'm not opposed to sensible regulation, but this is one where even I say let the markets figure it out (and reform the DMCA - the fines areing ridiculous!!!)
What I am saying is that you can not be outraged that your dog bit you after you spent 10 years beating it. It seems to me that a lot of people think that this is a big corp trying to bully the little guy when its just the opposite. The real problem is the generation of people who have grown to believe that they have a RIGHT to other peoples work as long as it on the internet. For their stand point what more can they do? They already have provided numerous avenues to purchase extremely cheap legal content and still people pirate the shit out of everything. So much so that many young people dont even understand the concept of ownership of digital things.
Also camoor, again, clearly you are not an artist. It is very easy to claim its just peanuts when ITS NOT COMING FROM YOUR BANK ACCOUNT. Basically what you are saying is.....as long as its an artist
em but you would lose your shit if I walked into your bank and took 20% of your money. I am sure you know what I do for a living and my work gets stolen all the time, I am not super poor but I imagine if 30% of my work wasnt stolen each month I could maybe pay off all of my student loans and saving for a house or what not. That is the crux of their push. Its the fact that people have grown to think they have a right to other peoples work and just because the format in digital. Until you convince people otherwise there will ALWAYS be a SOPA because a corp will never stand for letting million of dollars go for no reason.[/QUOTE]
Eh - I'm more sympathetic to your viewpoint then you probably think and it seems we agree to a certain extent about SOPA.
I think the 'IP should be free' mentality is common among youth because that's a very natural, rebellious, youthful attitude to have. Kids always have and will always going to have those attitudes (ever hear of bootleg tapes back in the dark ages). Draconian laws won't change it either.
From what I've seen with artists, writers, etc - they get screwed more by entertainment companies then the fans.
I think the entertainment services coming out are moving things in the right direction (Amazon cloud sounds cool). And it's because American businesses can afford to hire the most cunning, ruthless, and clever businesspeople - hell they can sell you bottled water when we all know you can get it free from the tap, and they're starting to suceed in offering a superior pipeline of entertainment to the choppy low-quality, virus-ridden torrents. Anyone in the vs forum will tell you that I'm not opposed to sensible regulation, but this is one where even I say let the markets figure it out (and reform the DMCA - the fines are
ing ridiculous!!!)
Trancendental
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Also, for the lulz:
http://gizmodo.com/5869321/dear-recording-industry-pay-9-million-for-pirating-tv-shows-or-shut-up
These are the people you want to trust? :lol:
http://gizmodo.com/5869321/dear-recording-industry-pay-9-million-for-pirating-tv-shows-or-shut-up
These are the people you want to trust? :lol:
Soodmeg
CAGiversary!
[quote name='Javery']What about adapting with the times? So what if music becomes "free" - maybe that's the way it should be. Should Jay-Z and Lady Gaga really be among the highest paid people in the world? I don't begrudge them for it but would people really stop making music if all you could earn is $50,000 a year or something a normal person makes? Plus, there are plenty of other ways to make money as a band/entertainer. Same thing with movies - 3D may not be the ultimate answer to get people to go to the theater but at least it's something.
I'm not saying pirating is right/moral/OK but of course the ones making millions and millions year after year who, by the way, also happen to have a MAJOR influence over politics and lawmakers, are going to throw a fit. SOPA is not the answer - I'm doubtful that there even is an answer other than to adapt. The cat is out of the bag.[/QUOTE]
Are you seriously with this? Alright Javery, I am going to say something that you wont like and this post will be full of irate jabs at you but know that I actually really like ya and think you are crazy smart.
Jay-z is more important to the world than you ever could be.
Lets go through this shall we. Note that these are gross under estimates.
Jay-Z
Manger
Producers, Directors
10 Audio Engineers, 10 Sound Techs, 10 Sound designers,
Drummers, Pianist, Guitarist, Singers, Dancers, Keyboards,
Live Lighting Engineers, Live Sound Engineers, Set Designers, Stage Designers, Stage Hands, Stage Mangers, Roadies, Cable Wranglers
Camera Ops, Projectionist, Laser Techs, FX, Graphic Designers, Web Designers, Web IT, PR Specialist, Writers, Lawyers, Accountants, Drivers, promoters, Event Planners, Party Companies, Clean up, the person who owns the venue, security, ticket takers, The people who work at your local energy company who provides electricity to run 400 thousand amps of gear, their techs, their customer service, the company that actually design and press the physically cd, etc etc etc.
And that not even including the thousand of people who build the gear that gets used....there is no reason to research and design microphones, cables, stages, lights etc etc if no one can buy them.
So tell me J? How many people do you employ around the world?
Yay...thought so. Yah, I love being told that my career isnt vital enough to the planet from 1 of 5 millioning lawyers walking around. I also love how you are not saying that people should stop making music you are just saying that people should stop being paid for it. If Jayz doesnt make money he then cant pay the thousands of people in over 40 professions.
How many days of the year do you work for free there J? How much do you make a year?
I'm not saying pirating is right/moral/OK but of course the ones making millions and millions year after year who, by the way, also happen to have a MAJOR influence over politics and lawmakers, are going to throw a fit. SOPA is not the answer - I'm doubtful that there even is an answer other than to adapt. The cat is out of the bag.[/QUOTE]
Are you seriously with this? Alright Javery, I am going to say something that you wont like and this post will be full of irate jabs at you but know that I actually really like ya and think you are crazy smart.
Jay-z is more important to the world than you ever could be.
Lets go through this shall we. Note that these are gross under estimates.
Jay-Z
Manger
Producers, Directors
10 Audio Engineers, 10 Sound Techs, 10 Sound designers,
Drummers, Pianist, Guitarist, Singers, Dancers, Keyboards,
Live Lighting Engineers, Live Sound Engineers, Set Designers, Stage Designers, Stage Hands, Stage Mangers, Roadies, Cable Wranglers
Camera Ops, Projectionist, Laser Techs, FX, Graphic Designers, Web Designers, Web IT, PR Specialist, Writers, Lawyers, Accountants, Drivers, promoters, Event Planners, Party Companies, Clean up, the person who owns the venue, security, ticket takers, The people who work at your local energy company who provides electricity to run 400 thousand amps of gear, their techs, their customer service, the company that actually design and press the physically cd, etc etc etc.
And that not even including the thousand of people who build the gear that gets used....there is no reason to research and design microphones, cables, stages, lights etc etc if no one can buy them.
So tell me J? How many people do you employ around the world?
Yay...thought so. Yah, I love being told that my career isnt vital enough to the planet from 1 of 5 million
ing lawyers walking around. I also love how you are not saying that people should stop making music you are just saying that people should stop being paid for it. If Jayz doesnt make money he then cant pay the thousands of people in over 40 professions. How many days of the year do you work for free there J? How much do you make a year?
Last edited by a moderator:
Friend of Sonic
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Whoever posted that Youtube video, that's some serious trippy shit.
ShockandAww
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And wikipedia is leaving GoDaddy. Donated $10 to wikimedia for doing the right thing.
Feeding the Abscess
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Copying isn't theft.
Nobody has a right to make money on their ideas, goods, or services.
Nobody owns an idea.
Nobody has a right to make money on their ideas, goods, or services.
Nobody owns an idea.
bigpimpin24
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[quote name='camoor']
From what I've seen with artists, writers, etc - they get screwed more by entertainment companies then the fans.[/QUOTE]
This.
From what I've seen with artists, writers, etc - they get screwed more by entertainment companies then the fans.[/QUOTE]
This.
Trancendental
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[quote name='Soodmeg']From what I seen with the common man they get screwed more by banks than congress. Its ok to walk in and take money out of the vault.
You see how that doesnt work in any other field.[/QUOTE]
It's convenient that congress enacts legislation against the big bad scary media pirate, but they almost never go after the exploitative entertainment companies. That's all.
Media pirates have no great moral standing, but they are hardly worse then music execs. It's hard to feel sorry for your "victim" when this same victim owns most of congress and exploits people like you every day.
There are no winners here, but it's hardly a "what did you expect?" situation. I expected media companies to overreach, but I also expected congress to stand up for the people, for citizen rights, over undue powers of censorship. I'm sure there's a bill out there that gives a few more powers to media companies to track down pirates without resulting to SOPA's way-too-broad censorship powers and draconian punishments.
You see how that doesnt work in any other field.[/QUOTE]
It's convenient that congress enacts legislation against the big bad scary media pirate, but they almost never go after the exploitative entertainment companies. That's all.
Media pirates have no great moral standing, but they are hardly worse then music execs. It's hard to feel sorry for your "victim" when this same victim owns most of congress and exploits people like you every day.
There are no winners here, but it's hardly a "what did you expect?" situation. I expected media companies to overreach, but I also expected congress to stand up for the people, for citizen rights, over undue powers of censorship. I'm sure there's a bill out there that gives a few more powers to media companies to track down pirates without resulting to SOPA's way-too-broad censorship powers and draconian punishments.
usickenme
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[quote name='Soodmeg']
Jay-Z
Manger
Producers, Directors
10 Audio Engineers, 10 Sound Techs, 10 Sound designers,
Drummers, Pianist, Guitarist, Singers, Dancers, Keyboards,
Live Lighting Engineers, Live Sound Engineers, Set Designers, Stage Designers, Stage Hands, Stage Mangers, Roadies, Cable Wranglers
Camera Ops, Projectionist, Laser Techs, FX, Graphic Designers, Web Designers, Web IT, PR Specialist, Writers, Lawyers, Accountants, Drivers, promoters, Event Planners, Party Companies, Clean up, the person who owns the venue, security, ticket takers, The people who work at your local energy company who provides electricity to run 400 thousand amps of gear, their techs, their customer service, the company that actually design and press the physically cd, etc etc etc.
?[/QUOTE]
no offense but asinine. Jay-z isn't single handily responsible for any of that save a few PAs.
lol "Thank God for Jay-z. He is keeping the power company going, Never mind the millions of other customers". Get real
while we are at it. We might as well have a curfew 8pm every night because some people get up to no good.
Jay-Z
Manger
Producers, Directors
10 Audio Engineers, 10 Sound Techs, 10 Sound designers,
Drummers, Pianist, Guitarist, Singers, Dancers, Keyboards,
Live Lighting Engineers, Live Sound Engineers, Set Designers, Stage Designers, Stage Hands, Stage Mangers, Roadies, Cable Wranglers
Camera Ops, Projectionist, Laser Techs, FX, Graphic Designers, Web Designers, Web IT, PR Specialist, Writers, Lawyers, Accountants, Drivers, promoters, Event Planners, Party Companies, Clean up, the person who owns the venue, security, ticket takers, The people who work at your local energy company who provides electricity to run 400 thousand amps of gear, their techs, their customer service, the company that actually design and press the physically cd, etc etc etc.
?[/QUOTE]
no offense but asinine. Jay-z isn't single handily responsible for any of that save a few PAs.
lol "Thank God for Jay-z. He is keeping the power company going, Never mind the millions of other customers". Get real
while we are at it. We might as well have a curfew 8pm every night because some people get up to no good.
[quote name='Soodmeg']Yeah SOPA does seem like it would destroy the internet....but you are doing that already by stealing so many things. Again, its one or the other. Clearly the internet cant self police so what other option does a company have?
I am all for getting together and discussing what can be done but it doesnt seem like many internet users want to do that because the end result will make them face the fact that they do not have a "right" to steal whatever they want just because its digital.
The internet brought this upon themselves so you cant get mad now you should have saw this coming when you were downloading 30g of torrents a day.[/QUOTE]
I know you've already expressed your opinion in subsequent posts, but I just wanted to point out that saying "but you are doing that already by stealing so many things." is ridiuclous when you consider that piracy has been around since before the public even had access to the internet. You're saying that something which has been around since the beginning, is going to kill the thing?No, the truth is that, like many other things, it was going on long before any of us knew, ti's just that now it's big enough that organizations like the RIAA and MPAA are making a stink about it. Frankly, if they really wanted to stop internet piracy they should have started a long, long time ago.
I am all for getting together and discussing what can be done but it doesnt seem like many internet users want to do that because the end result will make them face the fact that they do not have a "right" to steal whatever they want just because its digital.
The internet brought this upon themselves so you cant get mad now you should have saw this coming when you were downloading 30g of torrents a day.[/QUOTE]
I know you've already expressed your opinion in subsequent posts, but I just wanted to point out that saying "but you are doing that already by stealing so many things." is ridiuclous when you consider that piracy has been around since before the public even had access to the internet. You're saying that something which has been around since the beginning, is going to kill the thing?No, the truth is that, like many other things, it was going on long before any of us knew, ti's just that now it's big enough that organizations like the RIAA and MPAA are making a stink about it. Frankly, if they really wanted to stop internet piracy they should have started a long, long time ago.
Trancendental
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Most downloaded movies and how much was lost to it.
Its stuff like source code. Great movie, deserved to get that money. If it had half of that, it would of been looked at as more of a success. Duncan Jones is proving to be a great upcoming director story wise, just not box office wise. Kind of a shame.
Its stuff like source code. Great movie, deserved to get that money. If it had half of that, it would of been looked at as more of a success. Duncan Jones is proving to be a great upcoming director story wise, just not box office wise. Kind of a shame.
[quote name='Lice']Most downloaded movies and how much was lost to it.
Its stuff like source code. Great movie, deserved to get that money. If it had half of that, it would of been looked at as more of a success. Duncan Jones is proving to be a great upcoming director story wise, just not box office wise. Kind of a shame.[/QUOTE]
Be careful when attempting to estimate how much money is lost to piracy. The GAO succinctly addresses some of the problems in doing so in this report: http://www.gao.gov/products/GAO-10-423
It's still an objectively bad thing, just not as bad as certain groups would have you believe.
Its stuff like source code. Great movie, deserved to get that money. If it had half of that, it would of been looked at as more of a success. Duncan Jones is proving to be a great upcoming director story wise, just not box office wise. Kind of a shame.[/QUOTE]
Be careful when attempting to estimate how much money is lost to piracy. The GAO succinctly addresses some of the problems in doing so in this report: http://www.gao.gov/products/GAO-10-423
There are also positive benefits that are overlooked. They may not outweigh the negative effects overall, but I think the losses to piracy are vastly overstated.
It's still an objectively bad thing, just not as bad as certain groups would have you believe.
Trancendental
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[quote name='Lice']Most downloaded movies and how much was lost to it.
Its stuff like source code. Great movie, deserved to get that money. If it had half of that, it would of been looked at as more of a success. Duncan Jones is proving to be a great upcoming director story wise, just not box office wise. Kind of a shame.[/QUOTE]
Even in a world without piracy, I doubt if he would have made half of that.
First of all, you have to consider how studios make money. If someone torrented it then they didn't care enough to see it in the theater or buy a professional DVD. For example I watched Source Code on netflix. Yeah the studio probably made a little coin on that but it's a far cry from box office or dvd sales money.
Secondly, how many of the downloaders actually paid to see the movie in the end? How many would have bought it if they couldn't torrent it? Would they even be able to get half of those downloaders to acquire it legallly as you opine (doubtful)
It's a big impressive number but it's fairly illusory.
Its stuff like source code. Great movie, deserved to get that money. If it had half of that, it would of been looked at as more of a success. Duncan Jones is proving to be a great upcoming director story wise, just not box office wise. Kind of a shame.[/QUOTE]
Even in a world without piracy, I doubt if he would have made half of that.
First of all, you have to consider how studios make money. If someone torrented it then they didn't care enough to see it in the theater or buy a professional DVD. For example I watched Source Code on netflix. Yeah the studio probably made a little coin on that but it's a far cry from box office or dvd sales money.
Secondly, how many of the downloaders actually paid to see the movie in the end? How many would have bought it if they couldn't torrent it? Would they even be able to get half of those downloaders to acquire it legallly as you opine (doubtful)
It's a big impressive number but it's fairly illusory.
[quote name='camoor']very interesting
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2470...l_reddit_users_target_republican_senator.html[/quote]
HA HA Operation CORK SCREW
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2470...l_reddit_users_target_republican_senator.html[/quote]
HA HA Operation CORK SCREW
Salamando3000
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[quote name='Lice']Most downloaded movies and how much was lost to it.
Its stuff like source code. Great movie, deserved to get that money. If it had half of that, it would of been looked at as more of a success. Duncan Jones is proving to be a great upcoming director story wise, just not box office wise. Kind of a shame.[/QUOTE]
Actually, that's not a chart of downloads and how much was lost...but a chart of downloads and how much the movie grossed wordwide. Source Code didn't lose 123 million from pirates, it made 123 million total Link.
Its stuff like source code. Great movie, deserved to get that money. If it had half of that, it would of been looked at as more of a success. Duncan Jones is proving to be a great upcoming director story wise, just not box office wise. Kind of a shame.[/QUOTE]
Actually, that's not a chart of downloads and how much was lost...but a chart of downloads and how much the movie grossed wordwide. Source Code didn't lose 123 million from pirates, it made 123 million total Link.
Soodmeg
CAGiversary!
I didnt know we had so many movie/tv/film experts on CAG. I never noticed any of you in my 10 years of working in the field. So how many station/networks/movies you work on there Camoor? Me? I have credits/non credit supporters in probably over 30 station and networks over 40 national tv show, 10 big budget feature length films (I hate working in film) 12 indie movies with national releases, 6 or so shorts and I have produced concert events for people like Jay-Z, REO Speedwagon, Kid Rock, Mario etc. Then there my day job which probably adds about 200 or so live,taped,CCTV events for various billion dollar corporations like Ford, GM, Jaguar, Honda.
I have no beef with any of you, in fact I like most of you a lot but.....your justing stupid. This entire thread is full of people who wouldnt even be able to sniff a real set in a million years but you all somehow know all the ends and outs of the business. From what I can gather half of you should be on staff at News Corp (2nd Largest media conglomerates) or Viacom (4th but I am sure you guys knew that) in the budgetary marketing department.
It would be like if I log onto a medical forum with all my information coming from ER and House episodes.
Although I love debating new ideas (specifically this because its my career) this is more like expecting Aaron Rodgers to actually listen to some armchair QB about what plays the Packers should be running.
So, good talk guys, I will bid ado as I have to get back to actually working in film/tv/broadcasting...but I will pass along your wisdom to the higher ups at Discovery channel when I work for them next week, I am not sure why they didnt get your ideas already because it seems like you guys know so many people working in the industry.
By the way, for the last time, I actually disagree heavily with SOPA, its just that most "internet wise men" are so misguided that I always have to jump on that side to even it out.
I have no beef with any of you, in fact I like most of you a lot but.....your just
ing stupid. This entire thread is full of people who wouldnt even be able to sniff a real set in a million years but you all somehow know all the ends and outs of the business. From what I can gather half of you should be on staff at News Corp (2nd Largest media conglomerates) or Viacom (4th but I am sure you guys knew that) in the budgetary marketing department. It would be like if I log onto a medical forum with all my information coming from ER and House episodes.
Although I love debating new ideas (specifically this because its my career) this is more like expecting Aaron Rodgers to actually listen to some armchair QB about what plays the Packers should be running.
So, good talk guys, I will bid ado as I have to get back to actually working in film/tv/broadcasting...but I will pass along your wisdom to the higher ups at Discovery channel when I work for them next week, I am not sure why they didnt get your ideas already because it seems like you guys know so many people working in the industry.
By the way, for the last time, I actually disagree heavily with SOPA, its just that most "internet wise men" are so misguided that I always have to jump on that side to even it out.
[quote name='camoor']Even in a world without piracy, I doubt if he would have made half of that.
First of all, you have to consider how studios make money. If someone torrented it then they didn't care enough to see it in the theater or buy a professional DVD. For example I watched Source Code on netflix. Yeah the studio probably made a little coin on that but it's a far cry from box office or dvd sales money.
Secondly, how many of the downloaders actually paid to see the movie in the end? How many would have bought it if they couldn't torrent it? Would they even be able to get half of those downloaders to acquire it legallly as you opine (doubtful)
It's a big impressive number but it's fairly illusory.[/QUOTE]
I agree with the fact that these estimated losses are most likely overinflated. There's no way of knowing how many of these people who downloaded said movie, song, game, etc actually had money or any intention to buy said item in the first place. Also, there's no way of knowing who went on to buy said product because of their initial impression of it.
I've heard this same argument on animenewsnetwork pertaining to downloaded anime or streaming manga.
First of all, you have to consider how studios make money. If someone torrented it then they didn't care enough to see it in the theater or buy a professional DVD. For example I watched Source Code on netflix. Yeah the studio probably made a little coin on that but it's a far cry from box office or dvd sales money.
Secondly, how many of the downloaders actually paid to see the movie in the end? How many would have bought it if they couldn't torrent it? Would they even be able to get half of those downloaders to acquire it legallly as you opine (doubtful)
It's a big impressive number but it's fairly illusory.[/QUOTE]
I agree with the fact that these estimated losses are most likely overinflated. There's no way of knowing how many of these people who downloaded said movie, song, game, etc actually had money or any intention to buy said item in the first place. Also, there's no way of knowing who went on to buy said product because of their initial impression of it.
I've heard this same argument on animenewsnetwork pertaining to downloaded anime or streaming manga.
Trancendental
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[quote name='Soodmeg']I didnt know we had so many movie/tv/film experts on CAG. I never noticed any of you in my 10 years of working in the field. So how many station/networks/movies you work on there Camoor? Me? I have credits/non credit supporters in probably over 30 station and networks over 40 national tv show, 10 big budget feature length films (I hate working in film) 12 indie movies with national releases, 6 or so shorts and I have produced concert events for people like Jay-Z, REO Speedwagon, Kid Rock, Mario etc. Then there my day job which probably adds about 200 or so live,taped,CCTV events for various billion dollar corporations like Ford, GM, Jaguar, Honda.
I have no beef with any of you, in fact I like most of you a lot but.....your justing stupid. This entire thread is full of people who wouldnt even be able to sniff a real set in a million years but you all somehow know all the ends and outs of the business. From what I can gather half of you should be on staff at News Corp (2nd Largest media conglomerates) or Viacom (4th but I am sure you guys knew that) in the budgetary marketing department.
It would be like if I log onto a medical forum with all my information coming from ER and House episodes.
Although I love debating new ideas (specifically this because its my career) this is more like expecting Aaron Rodgers to actually listen to some armchair QB about what plays the Packers should be running.
So, good talk guys, I will bid ado as I have to get back to actually working in film/tv/broadcasting...but I will pass along your wisdom to the higher ups at Discovery channel when I work for them next week, I am not sure why they didnt get your ideas already because it seems like you guys know so many people working in the industry.
By the way, for the last time, I actually disagree heavily with SOPA, its just that most "internet wise men" are so misguided that I always have to jump on that side to even it out.[/QUOTE]
Ah I see. We're not industry bigwigs so we're not allowed to have an opinion.
I have no beef with any of you, in fact I like most of you a lot but.....your just
ing stupid. This entire thread is full of people who wouldnt even be able to sniff a real set in a million years but you all somehow know all the ends and outs of the business. From what I can gather half of you should be on staff at News Corp (2nd Largest media conglomerates) or Viacom (4th but I am sure you guys knew that) in the budgetary marketing department. It would be like if I log onto a medical forum with all my information coming from ER and House episodes.
Although I love debating new ideas (specifically this because its my career) this is more like expecting Aaron Rodgers to actually listen to some armchair QB about what plays the Packers should be running.
So, good talk guys, I will bid ado as I have to get back to actually working in film/tv/broadcasting...but I will pass along your wisdom to the higher ups at Discovery channel when I work for them next week, I am not sure why they didnt get your ideas already because it seems like you guys know so many people working in the industry.
By the way, for the last time, I actually disagree heavily with SOPA, its just that most "internet wise men" are so misguided that I always have to jump on that side to even it out.[/QUOTE]
Ah I see. We're not industry bigwigs so we're not allowed to have an opinion.
[quote name='Soodmeg']I didnt know we had so many movie/tv/film experts on CAG. I never noticed any of you in my 10 years of working in the field. So how many station/networks/movies you work on there Camoor? Me? I have credits/non credit supporters in probably over 30 station and networks over 40 national tv show, 10 big budget feature length films (I hate working in film) 12 indie movies with national releases, 6 or so shorts and I have produced concert events for people like Jay-Z, REO Speedwagon, Kid Rock, Mario etc. Then there my day job which probably adds about 200 or so live,taped,CCTV events for various billion dollar corporations like Ford, GM, Jaguar, Honda.
I have no beef with any of you, in fact I like most of you a lot but.....your justing stupid. This entire thread is full of people who wouldnt even be able to sniff a real set in a million years but you all somehow know all the ends and outs of the business. From what I can gather half of you should be on staff at News Corp (2nd Largest media conglomerates) or Viacom (4th but I am sure you guys knew that) in the budgetary marketing department.
It would be like if I log onto a medical forum with all my information coming from ER and House episodes.
Although I love debating new ideas (specifically this because its my career) this is more like expecting Aaron Rodgers to actually listen to some armchair QB about what plays the Packers should be running.
So, good talk guys, I will bid ado as I have to get back to actually working in film/tv/broadcasting...but I will pass along your wisdom to the higher ups at Discovery channel when I work for them next week, I am not sure why they didnt get your ideas already because it seems like you guys know so many people working in the industry.
By the way, for the last time, I actually disagree heavily with SOPA, its just that most "internet wise men" are so misguided that I always have to jump on that side to even it out.[/QUOTE]
You certainly are one smug individual. I'll let you get back to holding a camera.
I have no beef with any of you, in fact I like most of you a lot but.....your just
ing stupid. This entire thread is full of people who wouldnt even be able to sniff a real set in a million years but you all somehow know all the ends and outs of the business. From what I can gather half of you should be on staff at News Corp (2nd Largest media conglomerates) or Viacom (4th but I am sure you guys knew that) in the budgetary marketing department. It would be like if I log onto a medical forum with all my information coming from ER and House episodes.
Although I love debating new ideas (specifically this because its my career) this is more like expecting Aaron Rodgers to actually listen to some armchair QB about what plays the Packers should be running.
So, good talk guys, I will bid ado as I have to get back to actually working in film/tv/broadcasting...but I will pass along your wisdom to the higher ups at Discovery channel when I work for them next week, I am not sure why they didnt get your ideas already because it seems like you guys know so many people working in the industry.
By the way, for the last time, I actually disagree heavily with SOPA, its just that most "internet wise men" are so misguided that I always have to jump on that side to even it out.[/QUOTE]
You certainly are one smug individual. I'll let you get back to holding a camera.
Soodmeg
CAGiversary!
No, I am not a big wig, I am a random guy with a set of skills. I am not smug I barely know anything. The problem is that you guys are not saying opinions you are pretending to speak in factually debate while having no context what so ever.
Even worse is most of you refuse to accept any evidence to the contrary of your own opinion that isnt based on anything. Sure you will readily devoure any report that says piracy doesnt hurt that much but will promptly ignore anyone that says it does. You cant have a debate like that.
You guys are throwing away every statement by anyone who has more insight than you and choosing to only believe what you want. Not counting me I am just a random guy who knows more than you because I happen to work in this field. If we were talking about anything else I would be as lost as you guys are now. They release numbers that say they have x amount of dollars stolen from piracy your instant reaction is to say they are lying and that it cant be that much. Then you shift blame to studios or execs or the boogie man without providing any substance as to how that can be possible. Do you even know what studios actually do in regards to funding and budgets?
I mean seriously guys honestly answer this question. Is there anything that they can release that you would actually believe? At this point most of you are so far biased to one side its pointless to even talk about.
Hell even that chart that was just posted that tracked downloads vs gross income proves without a shadow of a doubt that if a movie was pirated 9 million times but still made 10 million dollars then it should have made 30 million (guessing to make this point) or simply more money than it grossed.
This whole topic is based on one half simply refusing you believe a very FACTUAL statement that pirating is indeed taking away income from any form of media. Your answer to that is many forms of "its not that big of a deal and of course this strange adapt or die statement. How about you suggest some ways to for them to adapt indeed of stating a stawman? Its not even a real opinion its just a way to sidestep the actually topic. It reminds of pro life rally when you ask them if you are against abortion than what should be do with all the unwanted welfare babies?
Again, I love all of you but this is arm chair qbing at its best, a bunch of guys who self admittedly have not worked in, read about, made, budgeted shot, recorded,edited any thing but are going to debate the inner workings of media and who also will refuse any information from a source that does indeed work in the field that you are debating. (Not me, I am referring to the millions of data that networks and studio release each year that most of you so promptly discredit)
So again, sorry, I have no beef with anyone, I still greatly enjoy camoor and claks topics outside of this one. Especially camoor who has been here as long as I have, he is a long time cool CAG its just this one topic I fully disagree to the point of murder on mostly because its directly effects my real life. So debate to your hearts content everyone I will not derail this thread and you can have at it.
Even worse is most of you refuse to accept any evidence to the contrary of your own opinion that isnt based on anything. Sure you will readily devoure any report that says piracy doesnt hurt that much but will promptly ignore anyone that says it does. You cant have a debate like that.
You guys are throwing away every statement by anyone who has more insight than you and choosing to only believe what you want. Not counting me I am just a random guy who knows more than you because I happen to work in this field. If we were talking about anything else I would be as lost as you guys are now. They release numbers that say they have x amount of dollars stolen from piracy your instant reaction is to say they are lying and that it cant be that much. Then you shift blame to studios or execs or the boogie man without providing any substance as to how that can be possible. Do you even know what studios actually do in regards to funding and budgets?
I mean seriously guys honestly answer this question. Is there anything that they can release that you would actually believe? At this point most of you are so far biased to one side its pointless to even talk about.
Hell even that chart that was just posted that tracked downloads vs gross income proves without a shadow of a doubt that if a movie was pirated 9 million times but still made 10 million dollars then it should have made 30 million (guessing to make this point) or simply more money than it grossed.
This whole topic is based on one half simply refusing you believe a very FACTUAL statement that pirating is indeed taking away income from any form of media. Your answer to that is many forms of "its not that big of a deal and of course this strange adapt or die statement. How about you suggest some ways to for them to adapt indeed of stating a stawman? Its not even a real opinion its just a way to sidestep the actually topic. It reminds of pro life rally when you ask them if you are against abortion than what should be do with all the unwanted welfare babies?
Again, I love all of you but this is arm chair qbing at its best, a bunch of guys who self admittedly have not worked in, read about, made, budgeted shot, recorded,edited any thing but are going to debate the inner workings of media and who also will refuse any information from a source that does indeed work in the field that you are debating. (Not me, I am referring to the millions of data that networks and studio release each year that most of you so promptly discredit)
So again, sorry, I have no beef with anyone, I still greatly enjoy camoor and claks topics outside of this one. Especially camoor who has been here as long as I have, he is a long time cool CAG its just this one topic I fully disagree to the point of murder on mostly because its directly effects my real life. So debate to your hearts content everyone I will not derail this thread and you can have at it.
Soodmeg
CAGiversary!
Again, for the record. I am actually on the side of stopping SOPA. I actually do believe that the industry will need to even further adapt to this new age, I just know that if I walked into a best buy and tried to walk out with a tv none here would be running to my defense claiming that best buy should have to adapt with the times and that tvs should just be free to all who wants them.
My last question would be the same as my very first. Why is it ok to do this to digital media but not ok to do this with physical media. You wont go take a playstation off a shelf but you will download to your hearts content. I just dont get it.
The other big problem which probably got lost in the shuffle is the fact that you still WANT the media. If you were claiming that there should be less rappers in general that is one thing...but you are not...you still want just as many techo, pop, house, underground as ever you just dont want them to profit from their creations. I just dont understand that logic...as much as you guess dont understand the industry! HIOW!!! I kid I kid!
My last question would be the same as my very first. Why is it ok to do this to digital media but not ok to do this with physical media. You wont go take a playstation off a shelf but you will download to your hearts content. I just dont get it.
The other big problem which probably got lost in the shuffle is the fact that you still WANT the media. If you were claiming that there should be less rappers in general that is one thing...but you are not...you still want just as many techo, pop, house, underground as ever you just dont want them to profit from their creations. I just dont understand that logic...as much as you guess dont understand the industry! HIOW!!! I kid I kid!
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pippin
CAGiversary!
[quote name='Soodmeg']Again, for the record. I am actually on the side of stopping SOPA. I actually do believe that the industry will need to even further adapt to this new age, I just know that if I walked into a best buy and tried to walk out with a tv none here would be running to my defense claiming that best buy should have to adapt with the times and that tvs should just be free to all who wants them.
My last question would be the same as my very first. Why is it ok to do this to digital media but not ok to do this with physical media. You wont go take a playstation off a shelf but you will download to your hearts content. I just dont get it.[/QUOTE]
Well for starters, digital media can be replicated quickly and easily with no degradation of quality. It's not the same as stealing a physical product. It's more like if you could walk up to a playstation on a shelf and save an exact duplicate of it onto a flash drive.
These "artists" need to understand that if lots of people are pirating your work and not many people are paying for it, then the general consensus must be that your work isn't worth the money. People will buy movies they love, people will pay for music they love, and people will download stuff that they don't feel is worth their hard earned money. Maybe it would help if there was more focus on rewarding paid downloaders instead of crying about piracy.
My last question would be the same as my very first. Why is it ok to do this to digital media but not ok to do this with physical media. You wont go take a playstation off a shelf but you will download to your hearts content. I just dont get it.[/QUOTE]
Well for starters, digital media can be replicated quickly and easily with no degradation of quality. It's not the same as stealing a physical product. It's more like if you could walk up to a playstation on a shelf and save an exact duplicate of it onto a flash drive.
These "artists" need to understand that if lots of people are pirating your work and not many people are paying for it, then the general consensus must be that your work isn't worth the money. People will buy movies they love, people will pay for music they love, and people will download stuff that they don't feel is worth their hard earned money. Maybe it would help if there was more focus on rewarding paid downloaders instead of crying about piracy.
[quote name='Salamando3000']Actually, that's not a chart of downloads and how much was lost...but a chart of downloads and how much the movie grossed wordwide. Source Code didn't lose 123 million from pirates, it made 123 million total Link.[/QUOTE]
Agreed, I don't think Lice read the chart correctly.
[quote name='Soodmeg']You can have it both ways, I dont fully agree with SOPA either but what else do you want them to do? YOU STEAL EVERYTHING. You break into a place enough times and then get pissed when they put a fence up. They wouldnt have to be so extreme if everyone didnt think it was their right to steal everything.
Dont like SOPA? Try paying for some stuff. I also love how people always threaten to not buy things that wouldnt in the first place. The whole thing is based on the fact that so many things are stolen and reproduced on the internet so how does a threat of not buying things from them really work? Not enough people were in the first place.[/QUOTE]
For being against SOPA, you sure seem to sympathize with this extreme over-reaching bill, eh? Why do you think our only choices are SOPA or the status quo?
[quote name='Soodmeg']No, I am not a big wig, I am a random guy with a set of skills. I am not smug I barely know anything. The problem is that you guys are not saying opinions you are pretending to speak in factually debate while having no context what so ever.
Even worse is most of you refuse to accept any evidence to the contrary of your own opinion that isnt based on anything. Sure you will readily devoure any report that says piracy doesnt hurt that much but will promptly ignore anyone that says it does. You cant have a debate like that.[/QUOTE]
But what evidence have you provided? What report have you provided links to? You're just saying things without any evidence either other then 'this many people work for jay-z and he's more important than you' than saying you've got 'experience' and implying your opinion holds more weight than others.
EDIT: Awww, I saw one of the tags on this thread was 'ball-licking idiots'...was that you Soodmeg? cute...
Agreed, I don't think Lice read the chart correctly.
[quote name='Soodmeg']You can have it both ways, I dont fully agree with SOPA either but what else do you want them to do? YOU STEAL EVERYTHING. You break into a place enough times and then get pissed when they put a fence up. They wouldnt have to be so extreme if everyone didnt think it was their right to steal everything.
Dont like SOPA? Try paying for some stuff. I also love how people always threaten to not buy things that wouldnt in the first place. The whole thing is based on the fact that so many things are stolen and reproduced on the internet so how does a threat of not buying things from them really work? Not enough people were in the first place.[/QUOTE]
For being against SOPA, you sure seem to sympathize with this extreme over-reaching bill, eh? Why do you think our only choices are SOPA or the status quo?
[quote name='Soodmeg']No, I am not a big wig, I am a random guy with a set of skills. I am not smug I barely know anything. The problem is that you guys are not saying opinions you are pretending to speak in factually debate while having no context what so ever.
Even worse is most of you refuse to accept any evidence to the contrary of your own opinion that isnt based on anything. Sure you will readily devoure any report that says piracy doesnt hurt that much but will promptly ignore anyone that says it does. You cant have a debate like that.[/QUOTE]
But what evidence have you provided? What report have you provided links to? You're just saying things without any evidence either other then 'this many people work for jay-z and he's more important than you' than saying you've got 'experience' and implying your opinion holds more weight than others.
EDIT: Awww, I saw one of the tags on this thread was 'ball-licking idiots'...was that you Soodmeg?
cute...
bread's done