Is it just me, or does the wii show alot of jaggies in 480p?

blackbird3216

blackbird3216

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I just got my new HDTV today(22inch, 720p,5ms, $340) and i have got so say, everything looks pretty slick, except Mario Galaxy. To me, mario galaxy looks really weak, compared to something like Sonic and the secret rings, and even madden 08. Those look really smooth with a component cable. Mario galaxy, especially the "lobby" has TONS of jaggies. Is this normal(for Mario galaxy to have more jaggies than madden?) Maybe someone can help me fix some settings? ;)

here's my set(I think it's worth the money. )
http://www.viewsonic.com/products/lcdtv/NX2232w/

Anyway, my computer has no sound until i get that cable from Monoprice... Well, at least my wii has 2.1 sound.

Edit, yes, it seems that textures look better, but jaggies are much more obvious.
 
If I'm not mistaken... that's not an actual TV, it's a PC monitor capable of progressive scan, meaning it can be labeled an HDTV technically.

If so, then yes, it'll look pretty crappy because you're basically stretching out a 840x480 (I think it's 840 horizontal lines though I'm not sure) picture to 1680x1050, the monitor's native resolution. In other words, the monitor is taking the Wii's native output and stretching 2x and then being displayed on your screen. So yeah, it's gonna look really bad.

But regardless of that... the Wii looks damn good on my 32" Aquos or my brother's Vizio. Mario Galaxy looks fucking amazing... as does Prime 3. Obviously it's not going to approach 360/PS3 graphics but we all know it's not supposed to. Before I got my Aquos, I used my Wii with a Samsung 215TW and it looked like ass.
 
Think it's just you :) I have a 46" 720p XBR and my Wii games (incl SMG) look good over the component cables. It's nothing like how crappy some PS2 games look on a large HDTV.
 
Depends on the game, but for the most part everything looks pretty damn good on my Samsung LCD. You'll notice jaggies more, but everything is really sharp and the colors are vibrant.
 
It doesn't look crappier, it looks more accurate. Blurry does not equal better, although personal opinion will vary on that subject.
 
I too just bought a new LCD TV, and I haven't experienced any jaggies in Galaxy.

[quote name='Vinny']
If so, then yes, it'll look pretty crappy because you're basically stretching out a 840x480 (I think it's 840 horizontal lines though I'm not sure) picture to 1680x1050, the monitor's native resolution. In other words, the monitor is taking the Wii's native output and stretching 2x and then being displayed on your screen. So yeah, it's gonna look really bad. [/quote]

This is the answer.
 
See, the thing with good looking Wii games is that they have great textures. but the models aren't made up of many polygons and thus it looks jagged on bigger TVs. Thats at least what I think after playing Zelda:TP on big TV screens.
 
come to think of it, everything seems to have better textures and color, but then again, there's tons of jaggies. I think it's a tradeoff here.

"It doesn't look crappier, it looks more accurate. Blurry does not equal better, although personal opinion will vary on that subject."

So in that case, with component cables, id see all the textures really smoothly, but for other things, i'd see jaggies because they make every detail more accurate, even then bad ones(especially on my screen).
 
[quote name='Mrcapcom']wow so its not really worth it to pick up the component cables?[/quote]

How did you get that out of this discussion? The component cables make a nice improvement over the standard ones. However it does depend on your TV if you will notice the difference.
 
[quote name='Mrcapcom']wow so its not really worth it to pick up the component cables?[/QUOTE]

If you're using a real HDTV, then it is it. Composite cables look like crap on a HDTV... I'm not sure what some people expect to see when they use component but I get a much sharper and more vibrant picture.

In the OP's case, he's confused a PC monitor with an HDTV.
 
[quote name='Vinny']If you're using a real HDTV, then it is it. Composite cables look like crap on a HDTV... I'm not sure what some people expect to see when they use component but I get a much sharper and more vibrant picture.

In the OP's case, he's confused a PC monitor with an HDTV.[/quote]
no. It's a HDTv I have it right now.
 
[quote name='blackbird3216']no. It's a HDTv I have it right now.[/QUOTE]

The link you provided clearly says it's a monitor/TV combo. So the output you're going to get from your Wii is being scaled to 1680x1050 (from the link you provided). Note: this is *not* 720p.

480p Wii output will be scaled by any true HDTV, and the results are going to depend on the quality of the scaler. How do DVDs and SDTV look?
 
It definitely looked better in 480p on my HDTV. Some games like Zelda it made the jaggies a bit more noticeable, but the improvement in colors, textures etc. more than offset that IMO. It's obviously nothing like the 360 or PS3, but it still looks much better than composite cables on an HDTV (or on my old SDTV I had the wii on previously). Much sharper and vibrant etc.
 
I got a 50" Sony HDTV and after playing Bioshock, Gears of War, Warhawk, Call of Duty 4, and Oblivion the Wii looks bad no matter what.
 
it looks ok on my 40 inch LCD. Its not 360 quality but it looks nice. Mind you I'm putting mine through my audio setup that upconverts video signals to 720p so its probably smoothing things out a little but even before I did that it looked fairly smooth especially metroid and mario galaxy. NMH is the only one that looks really jaggy but the games fun so *shrug*.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']It definitely looked better in 480p on my HDTV. Some games like Zelda it made the jaggies a bit more noticeable, but the improvement in colors, textures etc. more than offset that IMO. It's obviously nothing like the 360 or PS3, but it still looks much better than composite cables on an HDTV (or on my old SDTV I had the wii on previously). Much sharper and vibrant etc.[/quote]
that's what im seeing after the switch to 480p. A lot of jaggies, but nice textures/colors.
 
You may just be super sensitive to the Jaggies and/or your TV may make them worse than some.

They didn't bother me too much on most Wii games.
 
It's all personal opinion. I tried hooking up both ways to an LCD and I preferred some games via component and some composite. Ultimately, I prefer the composite look - I like the bright textures and only notice jaggies if I'm looking for them. I used Scarface Wii for a lot of comparisons because Tony's shirt is very textured and bright but his figure has a distinct outline.
 
Just for clarification, composite are the cables that come with the Wii right?

I know I have component and to be honest really didn't notice that much of a difference when I changed em out. Maybe little difference but not much at all IMO. I just figured it is stupid to pay for a 42" DLP Sammy HDTV and not spend another $30 on component cables.

Jaggies suck and become even clearer (even more HD jaggies!!! Yessss!) on compnent cables but after a while you don't notice them and they go away.
 
I'm SO happy there's a thread for this!!!!

I recently just got a new TV too (37" Olevia) and I immediatetly ordered component cables. Once they came, I hooked up my Wii.. changed my settings (set in Widescreen & 480p)...and turned on Mario Galaxy.

I was so confused.
It's because ALL I ever hear is "The games look AMAZING with the component cables" "OMG, ____ IS BEAUTIFUL!!!!" "____ Looks just awesome when I put in my component cables!"

I was like..WTF?
The problem I was having is that the backround, the actual area all look pretty good. Pretty good, not awesome. Not amazing. But pretty good and def better then when it was on my standard TV. However, when the game first starts (not the disc, but when you load up your game) you start off and you see Rosalina ahead of you. She looks like a bunch of blur?! When you get closer she looks better. Even Mario/Luigi has some white'ish outline glow to them. Luigi looks a little bit worse then Mario, IMO.

Even Pokemon Battle Revolution was kinda "SIGH" for me. The game itself looks good regardless of the TV..but now they look TOO sharp and thats why they seem jaggy.

Overall I find this really upsetting. I know I'll get flamed because "it's not about the graphics"..but whatever.

Also, these feelings are NOT because I own a 360 as well and comparing the two. I would never compare a 360 game with a Wii game because that would be silly.
 
The jaggie affliction also seems to vary based on the scaler in your TV. I don't notice the jaggies nearly as much on my Sceptre as I do on a friend's Samsung.
 
Damn, what did you people expect? :lol: I mean, yeah it's going to be jaggy on an HDTV... no matter what. You're stretching the image as the Wii can only output in 480p- it'll either be stretched to at least 720p in pro-scan (or 1050p in the OP's case). Either some of you don't understand the technology... or expected a miracle from some cables.:p

But I could definitely see how many were misled. I guess we should've said, it's beautiful if you know what to expect. Composite cables produce an image that's too flat, noisy and blurry. I'd rather put up with the jaggies myself.

The only way you won't see jaggies is if you have a EDTV (TV with a maximum resolution of 480p).
 
[quote name='Vinny']Damn, what did you people expect? :lol: I mean, yeah it's going to be jaggy on an HDTV... no matter what. You're stretching the image as the Wii can only output in 480p- it'll either be stretched to at least 720p in pro-scan (or 1050p in the OP's case). Either some of you don't understand the technology... or expected a miracle from some cables.:p

But I could definitely see how many were misled. I guess we should've said, it's beautiful if you know what to expect. Composite cables produce an image that's too flat, noisy and blurry. I'd rather put up with the jaggies myself.

The only way you won't see jaggies is if you have a EDTV (TV with a maximum resolution of 480p).[/quote]
I think a lot of people who just upgraded to new TV's like liboo are the ones that are most disappointed because they've had to look at endless threads about cheap Wii component cables here on CAG with ongoing reassurances that the cables make the games look better. Which they do, just not so much better that you say "wow" or anything. It's little changes that make all the difference though. Like you, I'll endure easily ignored jaggies in exchange for the brightness the component cables provide.
 
In the Endless Ocean thread, I had brought this up and Mephitcal answered/responded to me. One of the suggestions was to play with the brightness/contrast, and I did. It looked better, so thank you BTW :)

But it's not really expecting a miracle, the fact is everytime I read about people getting component cables an saying things like OMG ITS AMAZING. I got mislead because people made it seem it like.. it was a billion times better looking with the cables and the truth is, it's not *THAT* much better. It IS better, but I don't think it's anything special.
 
[quote name='lilboo']In the Endless Ocean thread, I had brought this up and Mephitcal answered/responded to me. One of the suggestions was to play with the brightness/contrast, and I did. It looked better, so thank you BTW :)

But it's not really expecting a miracle, the fact is everytime I read about people getting component cables an saying things like OMG ITS AMAZING. I got mislead because people made it seem it like.. it was a billion times better looking with the cables and the truth is, it's not *THAT* much better. It IS better, but I don't think it's anything special.[/QUOTE]
i should play around with that too. What did you do? Did you lower/increase contrast and lower/increase brightness? The screen was pretty dark on the monitor side, so now i have it at 46contrast and 32 brightness, and it looks pretty nice... On the Component side, it's 50/50... I really need to fix that. (luckily the set has memory for every input)
 
[quote name='lilboo']In the Endless Ocean thread, I had brought this up and Mephitcal answered/responded to me. One of the suggestions was to play with the brightness/contrast, and I did. It looked better, so thank you BTW :)

But it's not really expecting a miracle, the fact is everytime I read about people getting component cables an saying things like OMG ITS AMAZING. I got mislead because people made it seem it like.. it was a billion times better looking with the cables and the truth is, it's not *THAT* much better. It IS better, but I don't think it's anything special.[/QUOTE]

Oh, so you do agree it looks better. Ok, that's what I was confused about... I just don't get when people say it doesn't look good period or looks worse than composite.

But that's what I've always meant... component is a billion times of an improvement over composite.:p
 
[quote name='blackbird3216']i should play around with that too. What did you do? Did you lower/increase contrast and lower/increase brightness? The screen was pretty dark on the monitor side, so now i have it at 46contrast and 32 brightness, and it looks pretty nice... On the Component side, it's 50/50... I really need to fix that. (luckily the set has memory for every input)[/QUOTE]

Honestly, I do not remember. I was playing with it A LOT.. :lol: So just keep tweaking everything.. and when things look too crazy just set it back to default and try again!

[quote name='Vinny']Oh, so you do agree it looks better. Ok, that's what I was confused about... I just don't get when people say it doesn't look good period or looks worse than composite.

But that's what I've always meant... component is a billion times of an improvement over composite.:p[/QUOTE]


Yes I DO agree that the component makes the Wii look better.. but how can you say it's a BILLLLION times better?! (Besides joking around with me :lol: ) Do you think it looks *that* much better?

Wait.
Did you have you Wii hooked up to your HDTV w/ composite before ..and that's been your only experience with composite/Wii ?

Because I had a Wii since launch, and it wasn't until last week that I got my TV & Wii component cables. I'm guessing the composite/standard combo was pretty good since everything fit accordingly, compared to the Wii on an HDTV.

Could this be the reason why I'm so mad at the Wii, these cables, and my TV? :lol:
 
[quote name='Vinny']
The only way you won't see jaggies is if you have a EDTV (TV with a maximum resolution of 480p).[/quote]

This is what I have going (no HDTV for me), and it looks great.
 
So I'm playing on a 19.5" that I have to run the standard cables through the vcr and then into the tv (as the tv has no outlets). I'm interested in upgrading a little bit. I wouldn't mind something around 30" standard def or "EDTV" (first time I ever heard about it was 10 seconds when I read some of your posts). How much money would that set me back? (estimates are fine, if you want to post a link I appreciate it but it's not necessary)
 
[quote name='cheapwiigamer']So I'm playing on a 19.5" that I have to run the standard cables through the vcr and then into the tv (as the tv has no outlets). I'm interested in upgrading a little bit. I wouldn't mind something around 30" standard def or "EDTV" (first time I ever heard about it was 10 seconds when I read some of your posts). How much money would that set me back? (estimates are fine, if you want to post a link I appreciate it but it's not necessary)[/quote]
You are probably better off going HD, if nothing else because of the impending signal conversion requirement. A decent SD/ED TV around 27"-32" is going to cost you about $300 and be immediately obsolete, wheras you can get a really decent 32" LCD Sceptre or Olevia from Costco for $400-$500 with tons of connections for future consoles and components you might get.
 
[quote name='cheapwiigamer']So I'm playing on a 19.5" that I have to run the standard cables through the vcr and then into the tv (as the tv has no outlets). I'm interested in upgrading a little bit. I wouldn't mind something around 30" standard def or "EDTV" (first time I ever heard about it was 10 seconds when I read some of your posts). How much money would that set me back? (estimates are fine, if you want to post a link I appreciate it but it's not necessary)[/quote]

Wow. Cheap Wii Gamer is right.
 
[quote name='lilboo']
Yes I DO agree that the component makes the Wii look better.. but how can you say it's a BILLLLION times better?! (Besides joking around with me :lol: ) Do you think it looks *that* much better?

Wait.
Did you have you Wii hooked up to your HDTV w/ composite before ..and that's been your only experience with composite/Wii ?

Because I had a Wii since launch, and it wasn't until last week that I got my TV & Wii component cables. I'm guessing the composite/standard combo was pretty good since everything fit accordingly, compared to the Wii on an HDTV.

Could this be the reason why I'm so mad at the Wii, these cables, and my TV? :lol:[/QUOTE]

Well, it's only been about a year since I've had my HDTV. For a couple of months, I used it with my PC monitor/HDTV (like the OP's). I actually used composite though as component looked like ass on due to the huge different in resolutions.

When I got my HDTV, I just compared composite and component. I'd say component is a significant improvement... well worth recommending a friend to use component over composite. Obviously, not a billion times better... because that would mean it looks a million times better than PS3/360.

You just have decide what's for you: better colors, better contrast, no noise, smoother image and 60fps (when supported) or not seeing jaggies?
 
[quote name='Vinny']Well, it's only been about a year since I've had my HDTV. For a couple of months, I used it with my PC monitor/HDTV (like the OP's). I actually used composite though as component looked like ass on due to the huge different in resolutions.

When I got my HDTV, I just compared composite and component. I'd say component is a significant improvement... well worth recommending a friend to use component over composite. Obviously, not a billion times better... because that would mean it looks a million times better than PS3/360.

You just have decide what's for you: better colors, better contrast, no noise, smoother image and 60fps (when supported) or not seeing jaggies?[/QUOTE]
just came back playing MP3, and it looks AMAZING over component. Just sit a little farther away and the jaggies don't even become noticeable anymore. Maybe i was just sitting a little too close...

Wait, Vinny, does that mean you own a HDTV/LCD and a Regular HDTV?
 
[quote name='blackbird3216']

Wait, Vinny, does that mean you own a HDTV/LCD and a Regular HDTV?[/QUOTE]

You're mixing up terms there buddy.:lol:

LCD (and plasma, CRT, rear projection, projector) is just a type of display. Any display capable of showing at least 1080i can be called a HDTV.

I have an HDTV (a 32" Sharp Aquos LCD HDTV) and a PC monitor capable of HD (a 21" Samsung LCD HD monitor). My PC monitor is just like your's... same resolution and almost identical specs, does the same HD resolutions too.

That display you have is really a PC monitor with HD capabilities. It's just marketing PC monitor makers are using as they can get more sale that way.

And trust me when I say that PC monitors DO NOT scale well... so anything not in the native resolution (1680x1050 for you) will look bad. Believe me, I used my Wii with my PC monitor for a few months before I got my HDTV.
 
[quote name='blackbird3216'] Maybe i was just sitting a little too close... [/quote]
It's funny, I think this is actually the cause of a lot of videophiles' complaints. I remember back when I was choosing an HD set all the threads on AVS complaining about various problems displaying SD, none of which I experienced once we got the new set. Our couch is about 9 feet back from the TV. I went back and asked some questions and reread threads and it turns out a lot of them were sticking their faces right on the screen to look for imperfections. Even my PS2 games look fine with a wireless controller and me slouching way back on the couch.
 
[quote name='Vegan']Wow. Cheap Wii Gamer is right.[/quote]

Darn right. College kids gotta save as much as possible. Besides the Wii is the first system I've owned since SNES.
 
[quote name='blackbird3216']in that case, your saying i should return the TV? just got it yesterday, and im liking it. Everyone seems to have a very good review of it, and that it scales really well... Im not sure..

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produ...tedRating=5&PurchaseMark=&VideoOnlyMark=False[/QUOTE]

If you like it... what else matters?:)

I'm just trying to explain to you why Wii games look as bad as they do. I'm not saying it's bad display... my brother had a Viewsonic just like that one except it only had DVI and VGA, I think it was a VX2235wm. He saw how good the 360 looked on my monitor so he got that. Here are some pics of it that he took from when he sold it. (He decided to get a HDTV... after he saw mine.:roll: ).
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a187/fyreboltx/v1.jpg
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a187/fyreboltx/v4.jpg

Trust me, for the year or so I used my PC monitor, it was great. Sure Wii games looked bad but thats why you just go back to composite. The 360 and PS3 both have support of computer monitors I believe so you won't face any of those issues with those systems. Plus, it was nice having one display rather than two- saves space.
 
I've had my Wii hooked up on two TV's -- initially on my girlfriends 32" widescreen LCD HDTV, with the composite cable, then on my basement hometheater TV, a 56" widescreen CRT RPTV HDTV monitor (i.e. no internal ATSC tuner).

The Wii looked very good on the 32" LCD with the "in the box" composite video hook up. It looked miserable on my 56" TV. Switching to a component cable improved the picture a great deal, but the video quality is still quite low -- there are often "squiggles" in the video in the background. I'm not sure how to decsribe the squiggles -- almost like there is video information missing and jagged holes in the video. I think this is a case of taking a low resolution image and magnifying it too much.

Does anyone know what the video format for the Wii _really_ is? Is it like DVD where video is 4:3 480i, and is scaled to 16:9 and deinterlaced to 480p? Or is the video true 480p and/or true 16:9?

At least on my set, DVD video is much better than the game video on the Wii.


Joe
 
Man i just hooke dmy wii up to my 42 sony and omg I see what you guys are talking about I put mines in widescreen and altho it looks great you can see that it kinda looks like a N4 game playing Mario Galaxy but hey even tho the gfx didnt look as sweet as my 360 (no comparison just saying) I did notice I had a smile on my face the whole time I was playing Mario Galaxy and I guess thats why I got the wii so im good
 
[quote name='DrJoe']
Does anyone know what the video format for the Wii _really_ is? Is it like DVD where video is 4:3 480i, and is scaled to 16:9 and deinterlaced to 480p? Or is the video true 480p and/or true 16:9?

At least on my set, DVD video is much better than the game video on the Wii.
[/quote]
The "video format" that I think you are referring to is coded in the games, not the Wii. Many of the games are true 480p and 16:9 (that was a major selling point of RE4 for me). If you have a widescreen TV, you should set your Wii to widescreen, but the actual display ratio for a game is determined by the game itself.

For the curious, check out this site - it's fairly comprehensive:

http://hdgames.net/

You can select the Wii radio button and Submit Query and get a list of specs for all the current games.
 
I think alot of it depends on the TV you are using as well. You would think a smaller TV would hide the jaggies better.

i had a 32" Westinghouse at first and running the Wii in 480p on that TV made everything look horrible. Zelda and Resident Evil were nearly unplayable.

I now have a 46" Aquos D64 unit and when running the Wii in 480p on that TV things look far far better. SMG is very smooth and clear on that set. It just seems that some sets handle low resolutions better than others.
 
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