Israeli legislator complains “They are treating people here like Arabs”

alonzomourning23

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I have to disagree a bit. If arabs had been the ones throwing rocks and attacking soldiers I think they would have opened fire.

Amona, West Bank — Israeli forces completed the demoliton of a West Bank settlement outpost on Wednesday, ending a violent operation in which dozens of people were injured in clashes between police and Jewish settlers.
The army said all nine houses slated for demolition were reduced to rubble by late afternoon. Some forces remained in the area to prevent further unrest.

More than 160 people were wounded and dozens arrested in the confrontations at Amona, a hilltop enclave in the heart of the West Bank. The demolition of the nine houses was seen as a test for acting Prime Minister Ehud Olmert, who has said he would act with determination against settlers violating the law.

It was the first forced removal of Jewish settlers since last summer's pullout from the Gaza Strip and part of the West Bank, and was on par with the most violent scenes of the Gaza pullout. Both settlers and policeman were among the wounded, with police saying 31 of their officers had been hurt.

In all, about 5,000 demonstrators, including 1,800 right-wing extremists holed up in the nine homes, were being forcibly removed from the Amona outpost, and police said at least 40 people had been arrested.

The evacuation followed a Supreme Court order earlier in the day.

“This conflict has to end with one bottom line, that we enforce the law against the rioters,” Israeli Defence Minister Shaul Mofaz told Army Radio.

West Bank settler Uriel Shub, 18, said tensions during Wednesday's evacuation were “much worse” than last summer's Gaza pullout, but he said settlers have no choice but to take a tough stand. “If there is no resistance, the withdrawals will continue,” he said.

About an hour into the operation at Amona, troops reached the first home and began tearing down window shutters with crowbars. They dragged out protesters through the windows, as settlers dropped paint-filled balloons and stones on them from above.

Troops then climbed a ladder to reach rioters barricaded on a rooftop, with settlers pushing them back with sticks and hurling eggs and sand at them. Other troops rode the shovel of a bulldozer to the roof and began forcing settlers into the shovel to bring them down.

Across the outpost, settlers pelted troops with stones as soldiers tried to hold the crowds back with clubs and water cannons. Thick, black smoke from burning tires filled the air.

A field clinic was set up to treat the wounded, and people milled about with their heads wrapped in bandages and wearing T-shirts splattered with blood.

Two right-wing Jewish members of parliament were among those wounded in the clashes. Effie Eitam, a legislator from the National Union Party, stood among the protesters with blood streaming from his forehead.

“They are treating people here like Arabs,” said legislator Arieh Eldad in a telephone interview from the scene with Israel Radio. Mr. Eldad said he suffered a broken arm.

About 6,000 Israeli security forces moved into the outpost after Israel's Supreme Court cleared the last hurdle to the clearance on Wednesday morning. Under the court order, nine homes built illegally on private Palestinian land were to be demolished.

Earlier in the day, a Supreme Court judge had delayed the order to discuss the matter further after the settlers agreed to a compromise, but that was overruled by a larger panel on the court.

Since the mid-1990s, extremist Jewish settlers have established dozens of unauthorized outposts to prevent the transfer of disputed land to the Palestinians. The Palestinians hope to set up a state in areas Israel captured in 1967, which include the West Bank, Gaza Strip and east Jerusalem.

Under the internationally backed plan to end violence in the region, the so-called road map to peace, Israel has committed to dismantle about two dozen outposts but so far has taken little action. Amona is north of Jerusalem, near the Palestinian town of Ramallah.

The army had set up roadblocks Monday to prevent large-scale infiltrations into Amona. By Tuesday morning, however, hundreds of opponents of the evacuation – most of them teenagers – had slipped into the hilltop community and into Ofra.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20060201.wisra0201/BNStory/International/

Protestors also used children to attack police:

"Did you see what these children did? Before they were forcibly removed, they used a wooden log to try to force a police officer to fall from a ladder.".....

Turning to settlement leaders, Bar-On described their actions as "a form of cowardice or hypocrisy, first of all hiding behind children, inciting children to climb onto the rooftops and to attack security forces, afterward hiding behind young girls."

"These same young girls hurl stones, endanger lives, wound people.
And I see [National Union MK] Uri Ariel, supposedly a law-maker, standing there and interfering with the evacuation."

http://www.haaretzdaily.com/hasen/spages/677565.html
 
This is one case where I think the israeli settlers should have used the democratic technique of surrendering to fight for another day. You aren't going to win with rocks and cooking oil against the israeli army. Hell, the arabs didn't even stand a chance and they had bigger weapons and more people.
 
[quote name='Three Dollar Hooker']Oh great, let me guess, another Jew hater.

The Palestinians are oppressed and the Jews deserve to be thrown in the sea right?[/QUOTE]

So let me guess, you think it is a legitmate complain to treat a jewish person like an arab (or vice versa)?
 
I recognize anti-Semitism by your tone and disapproving stance.

Hey, I have an idea! Why don't you ask Jews to put serial number mark on their arms? Maybe they should all be forced to wear Stars of David? Perhaps the world should be asked to stop doing business with companies with Jewish directors or maybe Jewish sounding names?

Don't answer a statement questioning with your anti-Semitism with a rhetorical question. What are you? Stupid? What does my opinion or thoughts have to do with anything?

You're anti-Israel stance is pure unadulterated racism and a glowing testament to your religous intolerence. Maybe you'd have a bit more perspective if you never got to meet 4 grandparents, 2 uncles and an aunt because someone just like you thought it was a better idea that they be rounded up, put in ghettoes and shipped off to be made into ash.

Instead you wish to wrap up your caring "I wish to see both sides..." attitude in feelgoodism that one side, the Jews, are bad and the other side did nothing wrong until these dirty Jews from Europe showed up and oppressed the whole lot of them.

Why not answer the question I posed; do the Jews deserve to be thrown into the sea or does the State of Israel deserve to exist as it was given to us in the Torah?
 
You accuse me of racism while apparently seeming to agree that jews should not be treated like arabs.

Looking at your rant you did nothing to explain why I am anti-semitic. What about my statements are anti-semitic? Why don't we get that out of the way first.

edit: I seem to have touched a nerve by looking at your avatar.
 
Tell you what, when you can come to me and know what it's like to receive phone calls from relatives shortly after you see a bus, marketplace or hotel blown up on CNN let me know. Until then you have no idea what families go through wondering if its their cousins, aunts or uncles were blown up by these "sympathetic" Arabs. How would you treat people that killed your countrymen? Invite them over for tea? Perhaps bring them to a roundtable discussion.

Jews shouldn't be throwing Jews out of their homes and bulldozing them to the ground.
 
Actually if you read the quote itself it comes from someone involved in the removal, obviously he is going to be pissed. You didnt really mention that in your attention grabbing header. You cant make it like the whole Israeling government feels that way. Get off your high horse and realize there will always be factions that think like idiots. Ohh and its Israeli not Isreali, it detracts from the little to no argument you made.
 
Jews shouldn't be treated by enemies of the state by their own government.

Last I checked you'd be hard pressed to find stories about Jewish youth going through Gaza and West Bank checkpoints on their way to blowing themselves up in Ramallah or East Jerusalem. So you tell me, who should hold the moral high ground with the Israeli government?

When one side offers half their country in exchange for peace and the offer is spit on and met with the unleashing of Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade bombers in your cities you tell me who deserves to be treated with respect and who deserves to be treated like the enemy.
 
[quote name='Ikohn4ever']Actually if you read the quote itself it comes from someone involved in the removal, obviously he is going to be pissed. You didnt really mention that in your attention grabbing header. You cant make it like the whole Israeling government feels that way. Get off your high horse and realize there will always be factions that think like idiots. Ohh and its Israeli not Isreali, it detracts from the little to no argument you made.[/QUOTE]

I did read the quote. It's characteristic of the die hard settlers and many of the supporters. I did no such thing as to suggest that the whole government feels that way, and posted a quote by from a government official attacking those involved. Though the spelling was just a typo.

Though by attacking my point you are really getting at the reason why I posted it. I'm not holding up these people as unique, but as examples of what can happen when people feel threatened and/or powerless.
 
[quote name='alonzomourning23']Though by attacking my point you are really getting at the reason why I posted it. I'm not holding up these people as unique, but as examples of what can happen when people feel threatened and/or powerless.[/QUOTE]

Really? I thought it was because you wanted to make Israelis look like terrorists and Palestinians to be sympathetic people placed under the yolk of racism.

Glad you cleared this up that this was nothing more than an illustration of human behavior.
 
Jews shouldn't be treated by enemies of the state by their own government.

So arabs who live in Israel should be treated differently? Again, you're doing more to show your own prejudices than mine.

Last I checked you'd be hard pressed to find stories about Jewish youth going through Gaza and West Bank checkpoints on their way to blowing themselves up in Ramallah or East Jerusalem. So you tell me, who should hold the moral high ground with the Israeli government? [/quote]


If you switched the situation around you'd get a significant increase in jewish extremists who engage in terrorist tactics. It's not unheard of now, and there is no military need for it with the Israeli military being what it is.


When one side offers half their country in exchange for peace and the offer is spit on and met with the unleashing of Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade bombers in your cities you tell me who deserves to be treated with respect and who deserves to be treated like the enemy.


Well, there are jewish scholars who believe that the concept of a "jewish state" is forbidden by god at this point in time. That was the dominant view among many rabbi's before the holocaust, when zionism was largely a view held by secular jews. There is a significant difference between having a state of multiple peoples than a state that holds one single people as being most important. But religious doctrine means nothing to the people who do not believe it. One group claiming god gave them a large area of land should mean nothing when it involves taking land from others. There is really nothing suggesting that the occupied territories are part of Israel if you look at the demographics of those areas. Though, quite honestly, I would support full incorporation of the occupied territories into Israel, with full civil and political rights. The end result of that would eventually be one state, neither jewish nor palestinian. If you want all that land you have 3 choices, kill or forcibly move the people there, create a true apartheid system so they cannot exercise democratic powers, or be resigned to Israel as a jewish state becoming nothing but a memory sooner or later.
 
I see by your own signature that you have a history of being mentally ill.

I'll let it go that you think you know what you're talking about but really don't.

Arabs living in Israel have all the rights of Jewish citizens. There is no apartheid within Israeli borders.

"All that land"? Israel is the size of New Jersey. I didn't realize that qualified as a lot of land.
 
[quote name='Three Dollar Hooker']
I'll let it go that you think you know what you're talking about but really don't.[/quote]

I'm not the one ranting about bloodthristy neighbors, or calling anyone who doesn't agree with a certain political view racist.

Arabs living in Israel have all the rights of Jewish citizens. There is no apartheid within Israeli borders.

I didn't say there was, I said that is one way to incorporate all of that territory without losing Israel as a jewish state. Though there are some distinctions that would be considered racist if similar policies were in place in the u.s., I never said it was apartheid.

"All that land"? Israel is the size of New Jersey. I didn't realize that qualified as a lot of land.

This is a pointless comment, since it's of significant importance to both sides.
 
Hey alanzo, I realize you're not used to being called a know nothing Jew hating anti-semite with no grasp of the facts which you try to argue.

I'll let you continue to tell us all about how your thread, designed to make Israelis out to be evil racist people applying double standards to people that kill and murder them going about their daily lives, is really an illustration about how threatened people tend to react. I've found the best thing to do with people that insist on looking like idiots is to let them continue to look like idiots.

So continue, I know you need to get the last word in so you win. I'm done arguing with your half brained reasoning that has ranged from; I'm not really an anti-semite, to some Jewish scholars say your country shouldn't exist to accusing me of being prejudiced against people that would kill my friends and family. As if that isn't a pretty damn fucking good reason to be prejudiced.

Do go on though, continue arguing with yourself and drag your reasoning around the four corners of the compass as you already have.

Heng dikh oyf a tsikershtrikl vestu hobn a zisn toyt.

Shalom.
 
Three Dollar Hooker, you really do a great job of making yourself out to be a Jingoist bigot. Even the most fervent Hillel (and illinipac) kids at my school didn't act nearly as fanatical as you do.
 
[quote name='Three Dollar Hooker']Hey alanzo, I realize you're not used to being called a know nothing Jew hating anti-semite with no grasp of the facts which you try to argue.

I'll let you continue to tell us all about how your thread, designed to make Israelis out to be evil racist people applying double standards to people that kill and murder them going about their daily lives, is really an illustration about how threatened people tend to react. I've found the best thing to do with people that insist on looking like idiots is to let them continue to look like idiots.

So continue, I know you need to get the last word in so you win. I'm done arguing with your half brained reasoning that has ranged from; I'm not really an anti-semite, to some Jewish scholars say your country shouldn't exist to accusing me of being prejudiced against people that would kill my friends and family. As if that isn't a pretty damn fucking good reason to be prejudiced.

Do go on though, continue arguing with yourself and drag your reasoning around the four corners of the compass as you already have.

Heng dikh oyf a tsikershtrikl vestu hobn a zisn toyt.

Shalom.[/QUOTE]


You're wrong, the problem is I am used to being called an anti-semite, as a result it no longer bothers me. The term anti-semite has become so devalued that it is often nothing more than a childish insult. When a term that is supposed to mean animosity towards a particular people comes to also mean any disagreement with a political philosophy and the politics of a nation then it has lost all meaning. It's a word that sadly has become a weapon used against political opponents, and now gives legitimacy to those who really deserve the title. The one thing you have in common with everyone else who has accused me of anti-semitism is you can never pinpoint why I am anti-semitic. The most anyone ever comes up with is comments I made about the nation of Israel, never has anyone mentioned a comment I made about jews. I swear at least half the american population equates anti-semitism as anything even remotely negative of the state of israel.

Though I am glad to hear you finally admit to your prejudice. It kind of hurts your argument since you are accusing me of being prejudice, but nonetheless you're being honest.

And because I just can't resist:

antizionjews0ke.jpg


Uh oh, they better watch out, there's arabs all around!
 
[quote name='Three Dollar Hooker']Jews shouldn't be treated by enemies of the state by their own government.[/quote]

Sorry, you don't get a pass for being jewish when you are breaking the law and the army orders you to leave. You get to be forcibly removed. Now please let's not get into the differences between 'god's law and 'man's law argument. We leave that to the fanatical christians on this board.

When one side offers half their country in exchange for peace and the offer is spit on and met with the unleashing of Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade bombers in your cities you tell me who deserves to be treated with respect and who deserves to be treated like the enemy.


I totally agree with you. When the arabs took up arms and were defeated by Israel, the land they took in the wars rightfully belongs to Israel. Not even mentioning the land promised to them by god to begin with, Isreal could have been the size of Egypt and Syria but they graciously chose to let the arabs live and keep their own countries while keeping a tiny parcel of land to secure their borders. It's really a shame no other arab country would take any of the palestinians as refugees. those poor people are detested by their surrounding arabs brothers more than by the Israelis. If anything, Isreal has done more for them than their own kind has ever offered to do.

You have to take Alonzo with a grain of salt. He's been conditioned to believe the Palestinians are freedom fighters and are entitled to the land they've been squatting on for a measly hundred or so years and forgets about the historical premise that it was jewish land in the begining, now, and will be in the end.

But that doesn't mean jews get a free pass to settle in illegal areas. You have to follow man's law. Without it, there is only chaos. Just look at the palestinians - they don't believe in the rule of law either and look how well that's turning out.
 
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