Japan to ban "rape games"

WTF? Now where am I supposed to get my simulated rape products at?

The above was a joke lol.
Anyway I do find it to be freedom of speech, yet I do not know the laws in Japan. I didn't even know there were rape games available. Maybe I should buy one... Anyone know where these rape games can be purchased? Google checkout perhaps?

I view male rape to be a funny thing. If I were to be raped right now, I would probably laugh. I don't know why. I just would. I'm dead serious too haha. It's probably because I have aids. If it were a violent rape like they were to shove sharp objects up my doo doo hole, then no. Not cool. What kind of rape are we talking about here? Male v Male, Male v Female, Female v Male, or Female v Female? Violent (blood, sharp objects, killing) or non violent (just tied up etc.)
 
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"I may not agree with what you play, but I will defend to the death, your right to play it."

There is no justification for censorship, regardless of how distasteful the subject matter may be. Personally, to me it is on the same level as GTA or Manhunt. You're playing a sociopath. Not my cup of tea but, hey if there's a market for that sort of stuff, a company has the right to develop and sell those types of games. Likewise, stores have the right not to carry them, consumers have the right not to buy them and boycott stores that do sell them etc....
 
So. I can't use my freedom of speech to denounce them? I can't decide that a game that centers around rape isn't my cup of tea and sit here and say so? I can't decide that this type of game shouldn't be around for my daughter to find? The first amendment trumps my responsibilties as a parent? You guys seriously realize that you're arguing that rape play is protected by the Constitution, right?

Hova. You yourself said that you rape the girls the first time and then the girls are so broken that they just give it up every time after that. You also said that it was a creative gameplay mechanic. Why would I want to play a game like that? I have to play a game like that to decide I don't think it's right? Or should I not take your word for things?

Also, this isn't a free speech issue because, hello, this is in Japan..... Last time I checked the first amendment doesn't apply there but, hey, maybe you strict constitutionalists would like to invade them to give them that right.

And if it was a free speech issue, you guys surely know that the first amendment doesn't give anyone the right to say anything they want to. There are provisions for the general welfare and safety of the public that trump the first amendment. I think this might qualify. That being said, these games seem to still be legal since Hova went and played one. I'm not taking anyone's right to play the game away but don't think I won't call you a disgusting pervert for seeking out and playing it.

EDIT #1 -- dopa, Manhunt is completely different. You forget that he's being hunted down on TV for sport. The game speaks to the fact that will people will watch anything as long as it's violent. So there is some artistic merit. Please find me any sort of artistic merit for a rape game. Like I said, I don't think it does but I will listen to someone that says it has artistic merit instead of just saying it's protected by the Constitution and we shouldn't even be discussing banning it.
 
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I doubt the ban will stop anything, all the games will just move to being online downloads and the websites will be based in other countries. Even if the law somehow prevents Japanese companies from doing this companies elsewhere(china) will defiantly sell the games to the Japanese through the internet, it's too profitable not to.
 
Article 21 of the Japanese Constitution:

"Freedom of assembly and association as well as speech, press and all other forms of expression are guaranteed. 2) No censorship shall be maintained, nor shall the secrecy of any means of communication be violated."

I couldn't care less what Japan wants to do. If the government wants to violate their Constitution and its citizens let it slide, then it's no big deal from me. However, if you want to live in a truly free society, then government censorship is fundamentally wrong with no exceptions.
 
dopa, you have to look at the intent of free speech laws though. They're meant to allow people to say things about the government. They're meant to allow people to protest.

They do not allow people to say, "Fire!", "I'm going to kill you", "xxx is a proponent of rape and actively wishes every woman on this planet feel the liberation of a non-consensual sexual assault", or any other garbage like that. Not one of the sentences I just said are protected by our First Amendment or any other Constitution in the world.

So even with our Constitution, not ALL speech is guaranteed. Why? Because public safety trumps your rights to free speech.
 
depascal, in the case where the speech in question is intended to cause imminent danger to public or individual safety, like falsely yelling "fire" in a crowded theater, then I agree, it is not protected. However a rape game doesn't fall under that category. It's an admittedly offensive form of entertainment but it would not pose an imminent threat to public safety.
 
[quote name='Hydro2Oxide']Wait wait wait, someone in the UK sits down, watches porn and determines whether or not it is rape? What are the qualifications?[/QUOTE]

I don't know but it would absolutely make my life to find out this duty was the Queen's.
 
[quote name='depascal22']
EDIT #1 -- dopa, Manhunt is completely different. You forget that he's being hunted down on TV for sport. The game speaks to the fact that will people will watch anything as long as it's violent. So there is some artistic merit. Please find me any sort of artistic merit for a rape game. Like I said, I don't think it does but I will listen to someone that says it has artistic merit instead of just saying it's protected by the Constitution and we shouldn't even be discussing banning it.[/QUOTE]

Same argument against you.

People will watch anything as long as it is sexual, and everything is sexual, everything is erotic. Let's imagine I made a game that you rape people, and record it on camera for a TV show that has millions of viewers. Yea. Same argument. Difference is, your uncomfortable with the idea of people being raped, yet violence no longer phases you. You have been conditioned to violence. :D

America: One of the most uptight nations.
 
Wow depascal, it's like you've taken every common misconception about free speech on the internet and packed them all into one post.

[quote name='depascal22']So. I can't use my freedom of speech to denounce them? I can't decide that a game that centers around rape isn't my cup of tea and sit here and say so? I can't decide that this type of game shouldn't be around for my daughter to find?[/quote] Of course you can. Just like I can point out that you're wrong.

Also, this isn't a free speech issue because, hello, this is in Japan..... Last time I checked the first amendment doesn't apply there but, hey, maybe you strict constitutionalists would like to invade them to give them that right.
Click to expand...

You haven't thought about this issue enough, because for some reason you've equated the first amendment with free speech. So no one outside the US can have free speech rights?
 
[quote name='depascal22']So even with our Constitution, not ALL speech is guaranteed. Why? Because public safety trumps your rights to free speech.[/QUOTE]
Video games are not a matter of public safety.
 
No need for a ban. in fact, I say the quality game companies need to add rape to their games, particularly GTA. If you can murder people you should be able to rape and molest them before/after you kill'em.
 
The whole point of free speech is that it should have no limit. This case reminds me of how a guy got arrested for possessing lolicon manga in the USA. The issue is not about whether I think lolicon manga or games like Rapelay make me feel, and on the manga issue, Neil Gaiman was saying that a believer of freedom of speech should be willing to defend even the ideas and concepts he does not agree with. Yeah, I can't believe how angry people got over Rapelay when rape in ALL hentai (anime, manga, games) isn't exactly taboo.
 
EDIT -- Please go about and play your rape games. I was an idiot for ever thinking that people would think that this was going too far or that we should try to protect our young girls from yet another negative stereotype. I will educate my daughter against them and call out anyone that chooses to play them for recreational "fun". I was silly for thinking that some CAGs would rather think about the children instead of wrapping themselves in the ideology that everything is art and nothing is bad. If I find out that any man in my family or man that marries into family is a fan of these games, I'll make sure everyone knows about it. This shit makes me sick and you should be too.

What's next? What if a game encourages you to go to playgrounds and entice young kids with different kind of candy? There will be a mini-game that determines whether the boy or girl was lured into your van and then there will be a short blurred out scene with the van rocking back and forth. Then, you can make a "moral" decision as to whether you let the child go or you slit their throat. A short driving section follows where you will see another short scene of a body dumping or a child getting thrown out of the door in the middle of nowhere. Another mini-game follows to make sure everyone around you believes your increasingly bizarre excuses for missing work/weddings/etc. What do you guys think about my new "game"? I'm giving a copy to every sex offender the minute he gets out of jail. It's my Constitutionally protected right isn't it?

rick -- I know that the First Amendment is really the freedom to assemble to protest a tyrannical gov't. If you read the first few posts in this thread, several people said that this was a free speech issue and that nothing should be banned or censored. It's been repeated several times. I countered with the fact that free speech isn't really free and gave several examples. You commented on one post instead of the entire body of work I contributed to this thread. We'll agree to disagree.
 
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[quote name='Strell']There is a distinct lack of regrettable pictures here, depascal. I'll remember this.[/QUOTE]

Just wait until I develop Pedophila Trainer 101. Free demos for all sex offenders around the houses of CAGs that think this crap is art. I mean video games don't encourage people to do anything right so they shouldn't be pissed right?
 
[quote name='depascal22']EDIT -- Please go about and play your rape games. I was an idiot for ever thinking that people would think that this was going too far or that we should try to protect our young girls from yet another negative stereotype. I will educate my daughter against them and call out anyone that chooses to play them for recreational "fun". I was silly for thinking that some CAGs would rather think about the children instead of wrapping themselves in the ideology that everything is art and nothing is bad. If I find out that any man in my family or man that marries into family is a fan of these games, I'll make sure everyone knows about it. This shit makes me sick and you should be too.

What's next? What if a game encourages you to go to playgrounds and entice young kids with different kind of candy? There will be a mini-game that determines whether the boy or girl was lured into your van and then there will be a short blurred out scene with the van rocking back and forth. Then, you can make a "moral" decision as to whether you let the child go or you slit their throat. A short driving section follows where you will see another short scene of a body dumping or a child getting thrown out of the door in the middle of nowhere. Another mini-game follows to make sure everyone around you believes your increasingly bizarre excuses for missing work/weddings/etc. What do you guys think about my new "game"? I'm giving a copy to every sex offender the minute he gets out of jail. It's my Constitutionally protected right isn't it?

rick -- I know that the First Amendment is really the freedom to assemble to protest a tyrannical gov't. If you read the first few posts in this thread, several people said that this was a free speech issue and that nothing should be banned or censored. It's been repeated several times. I countered with the fact that free speech isn't really free and gave several examples. You commented on one post instead of the entire body of work I contributed to this thread. We'll agree to disagree.[/QUOTE]

With all due respect, I am not endorsing pornography of any kind, and I don't know if you would consider this related but hear me out.

You see, recently a man was arrested in the USA for possessing lolicon manga, or erotic drawings of underage girls, and maybe there were some drawings of child rape. This became a pretty big scandal among comic book fans, writer's etc. because they felt that a piece of fiction was not in any way hurting anybody in the real world (which I find similar to this case).

An English writer wrote an interesting piece about this, saying the following:

"If you accept -- and I do -- that freedom of speech is important, then you are going to have to defend the indefensible. That means you are going to be defending the right of people to read, or to write, or to say, what you don't say or like or want said.....Because if you don't stand up for the stuff you don't like, when they come for the stuff you do like, you've already lost."


http://journal.neilgaiman.com/2008/12/why-defend-freedom-of-icky-speech.html
 
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[quote name='depascal22']
What's next? What if a game encourages you to go to playgrounds and entice young kids with different kind of candy? There will be a mini-game that determines whether the boy or girl was lured into your van and then there will be a short blurred out scene with the van rocking back and forth. Then, you can make a "moral" decision as to whether you let the child go or you slit their throat. A short driving section follows where you will see another short scene of a body dumping or a child getting thrown out of the door in the middle of nowhere. Another mini-game follows to make sure everyone around you believes your increasingly bizarre excuses for missing work/weddings/etc. What do you guys think about my new "game"? I'm giving a copy to every sex offender the minute he gets out of jail. It's my Constitutionally protected right isn't it?
[/quote]

I think that would be disgusting and I wouldn't encourage anyone to play it.


rick -- I know that the First Amendment is really the freedom to assemble to protest a tyrannical gov't. If you read the first few posts in this thread, several people said that this was a free speech issue and that nothing should be banned or censored. It's been repeated several times. I countered with the fact that free speech isn't really free and gave several examples. You commented on one post instead of the entire body of work I contributed to this thread. We'll agree to disagree.
Click to expand...

No, you missed my point. You brought up the point that the first amendment does not apply in Japan.
Also, this isn't a free speech issue because, hello, this is in Japan..... Last time I checked the first amendment doesn't apply there
Click to expand...

What I'm trying to tell you is that this is about free speech, not the first amendment. They are not the same thing.
 
[quote name='rickonker']I think that would be disgusting and I wouldn't encourage anyone to play it.




No, you missed my point. You brought up the point that the first amendment does not apply in Japan.


What I'm trying to tell you is that this is about free speech, not the first amendment. They are not the same thing.[/QUOTE]

My bad. I made a small mistake and instead of my thinking about the merits of my whole argument. You guys decided to pick apart that one statement and then dismiss my opinion. I forgot I was discussing this with people that were absolutely perfect.

My statement still stands. Free speech does not trump public safety. These games are nasty and we shouldn't be surprised that Japan wants to ban them.

That being said, I can't argue with you people about this. You're dead set that everything is OK. It's OK to depict graphic rape of a 15 year old, her mother, and her younger sister. It's OK to distribute this as art.
 
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[quote name='depascal22']My bad. I made a small mistake and instead of my thinking about the merits of my whole argument. You guys decided to pick apart that one statement and then dismiss my opinion. I forgot I was discussing this with people that were absolutely perfect.

My statement still stands. Free speech does not trump public safety. These games are nasty and we shouldn't be surprised that Japan wants to ban them.

That being said, I can't argue with you people about this. You're dead set that everything is OK. It's OK to depict graphic rape of a 15 year old, her mother, and her younger sister. It's OK to distribute this as art.[/QUOTE]
Do you think everything that should be legal is OK? Because I don't.
 
I'm still not sure how you could categorically say that a rape game is a "public safety" issue. It's distasteful and morally degenerate material but it doesn't endanger public safety any more than a GTA game that promotes carjacking and assassination.

You could even make the argument that a rape game (or any other violent game) could theoretically help public safety in that it allows an outlet for someone with a propensity for violence towards women to express that urge in a way that wouldn't hurt anyone. That's just as valid an argument that a rape game is somehow a threat to public safety.

If there is no free speech, then the public is not safe.
 
[quote name='depascal22']Just wait until I develop Pedophila Trainer 101. Free demos for all sex offenders around the houses of CAGs that think this crap is art. I mean video games don't encourage people to do anything right so they shouldn't be pissed right?[/QUOTE]

Virtual children getting raped is no different than virtual women as far as I'm concerned. While we're at it let's add some necrophilia and cannibalism options into the game. gotta get rid of the body somehow, might as well eat it. Story mode should let you join the Illuminati and run a child prostitution ring for them.
 
[quote name='doodofdoods']rape and molest them before/after you kill'em.[/QUOTE]

Emphasis on that. :D

[quote name='doodofdoods']Virtual children getting raped is no different than virtual women as far as I'm concerned. While we're at it let's add some necrophilia and cannibalism options into the game. gotta get rid of the body somehow, might as well eat it. Story mode should let you join the Illuminati and run a child prostitution ring for them.[/QUOTE]

Only if we hire depascal to design it.

Seriously now, as I said before, it's just as bad as other things in games, thing is we aren't desensitized to sexuality, rape or otherwise. H-Games (Non-Rape) ones disturb people enough, add in rape and you've got an A-Bomb on your hands. If this game was about going around murdering people, nobody would give two fucks. People are desensitized. Stop thinking everything will hurt the fucking children, it's pure bullshit. Bad parents hurt children. If people want to protect kids, they should kill parents that do nothing for the kids. Games won't ruin our world, *we* will ruin our world.
 
What will really help the children is if we loosen all of these laws. Child pornography should be legal to view. Having sex with "minors"(12-17) should be legal as well, so long as the minor is consenting. Prostitution should be legal too. and once all those things are legal, watch all of the sexually-motivated violent crimes committed against women/children drop significantly. These things are more dangerous because they're kept from being regulated.

People want sex and drugs, just because their desires offend you doesn't give you the right to restrict their freedoms. And it's not like it even works. If there's a big enough market for something, legal or illegal, people are going to find a way to get what they want. Groups are going to start offering their services to these persecuted consumers. And they're probably the worst groups we'd want running this stuff, yet we're giving these groups a monopoly by making these things illegal. Doesn't sound like it's been thought out too well by these people who talk about safety being the reason for banning certain recreational activities.
 
Frankly with all you people bitching about the rape games, haven't you heard of "Rape Tapes"? Those sell and you don't hear anything about banning them. Frankly I'm not surprised there are Rape games in Japanese PC given how huge Hentai is on the PC scene over there. I'd even go so far as to argue when I was in Japan at this one store in the PC section that's pretty much ALL I saw. Yeah it's like 90-95% of Japanese PC games sadly, with the other 5% being Nihon Falcom product, Sega and Koei as well as some Doujin shmup's.
Furthermore I would defend NAMBLA's view and I fucking despise them. You see I believe in the adage "I don't agree with your beliefs but I will defend to the death your right to say it.". So while I agree with NONE of NAMBLA's views I have no problem with them expousing it vocally. As soon as they act on it though I say throw their asses in prison immediately.
 
Frankly with all you people bitching about the rape games, haven't you heard of "Rape Tapes"? Those sell and you don't hear anything about banning them. Frankly I'm not surprised there are Rape games in Japanese PC given how huge Hentai is on the PC scene over there. I'd even go so far as to argue when I was in Japan at this one store in the PC section that's pretty much ALL I saw. Yeah it's like 90-95% of Japanese PC games sadly, with the other 5% being Nihon Falcom product, Sega and Koei as well as some Doujin shmup's.
Furthermore I would defend NAMBLA's view and I fucking despise them. You see I believe in the adage "I don't agree with your beliefs but I will defend to the death your right to say it.". So while I agree with NONE of NAMBLA's views I have no problem with them expousing it vocally. As soon as they act on it though I say throw their asses in prison immediately.
I can't say I'm surprised you wouldn't mind living in a world like "1984" koggit. You're a wimp Neo-Liberal, the kind anyone needs to prove wrong as much as possible. Old Liberals don't share your stupidity.
 
[quote name='depascal22']My statement still stands. Free speech does not trump public safety. These games are nasty and we shouldn't be surprised that Japan wants to ban them.[/QUOTE]

Then why not ban smoking (I know it's not speech but bare with me) It's self destructive and second hand smoke can be harmful. That's against public safety. That's even me agreeing with this being against public safety which it's not, it's a video game.

And you seem to have the idea we want to play these rape games. No, no I don't. It sounds really creepy and disgusting but as many have said here, if at any point you start knocking on one thing that's a freedom, you have no right to defend anything else because you are a hypocrite.
 
[quote name='depascal22']
That being said, I can't argue with you people about this. You're dead set that everything is OK. It's OK to depict fictional graphic rape of a 15 year old, her mother, and her younger sister. It's OK to distribute this as art.[/QUOTE]

Fixed.
 
[quote name='Hydro2Oxide']Then why not ban smoking (I know it's not speech but bare with me) It's self destructive and second hand smoke can be harmful. That's against public safety.[/QUOTE]
i'm pretty sure most/all areas did ban smoking in areas where others have to be nearby (here in seattle it's inside any commercial establishment, public building, or 25 feet of a door of such a building)... and i bet tobacco would be illegal if they didn't have such a powerful lobby.

[quote name='Hydro2Oxide']That's even me agreeing with this being against public safety which it's not, it's a video game.[/QUOTE]
like any social science it's probably bullshit, but there have been a lot of surprising studies showing very strong correlation between vulgar media and sexual assault. like, that specific link, it's sort of crazy stuff. people who hear fuck on tv are more likely to rape a chick. that's the whole idea behind FCC censorship and local porn regulations. a game about raping goes a little far for me.



and re: all the free speech arguments, obscene speech isn't fully protected http://viciousmomma.blogspot.com/2006/04/protected-vs-unprotected-speech.html -- if you sell your 'rape tapes', sarang, in a conservative southern community, you most certainly could go to jail. in fact there were some very interesting cases around the dawn of teh interwebz with porn sites being held to local standards -- a couple in california who ran an amateur porn site went to jail after being prosecuted by a tennessee DA, despite the fact that their california community agreed their material did not shock the conscious, tennessee decided it goes against their standards and they went to jail for it. that case is a little ridiculous because of teh interwebz aspect, but if it were magazines or something it'd be way more clearcut. fact is this type of stuff is regulated, and if japan decides something went to too far, it's 100% their prerogative to ban it. japan's pretty tiny, not much different than california saying "this is okay, this isn't" re: porn.
 
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