Kincect Success = The End of Harcore Gaming??

K

kingkiller33

CAGiversary!
I want Kinect to fail. Miserably. And yet it is alarming to see the $150 toy perched at the top of Amazon's bestseller list for Xbox 360.


As a hardcore gamer, Kinect poses several problems. First, it opens the door to kiddie family games on a platform that has been geared more towards mature audiences. If Kinect proves to be a big money maker, it doesn't take a rocket scientist to predict that the gaming shelves will be filled with WII like titles. Pro table tennis, kiddie cart races, and cutesy fun for the whole family.
And this means LESS games for hardcore audiences. How many hardcore games you see for the Wii? Exactly. Don't believe the MS hype and Major Nelson. MS is going to go in the direction where the money is. They have ZERO loyalty to hardcore gaming fans that made Xbox live such a success. It is all about making the money, hence the reason their hard drives and this POS device is priced so high.


Also, Kinect is a problem if it does integrate with hardcore games like Call of Duty. Players will be forced to either fork over the money for Kinect , or compete with Kinect players who might have an unfair advantage online.


Either way, the future don't look bright if Kinect is in the picture.
 
LOL... Kincect has potential, but two things will make it fail really quick... launch price @150 and lack of serious developer support.
 
They fill never force you to use motion controls with a COD game. Maybe have it as an option but never force you to fully use them.
 
[quote name='ITDEFX']LOL... Kincect has potential, but two things will make it fail really quick... launch price @150 and lack of serious developer support.[/QUOTE]


Apparently, the price point hasn't turned people off from making it a #1 bestseller on Amazon. (update now #2 after the new Xbox). People didn't have problems shelling out a lot of money for Rock Band either.
 
Its only so high up on amazon BECAUSE its a pre-order. I can pre-order 100 of them and it will shoot up the charts, doesn't cost a cent. A lot of people pre-ordered one in case it turns out to be like the wii so they can scalp them on ebay for the holiday season.
 
You should be more concerned with the failure of the industry as a whole, verses the end of "hard core" gaming. Hard core gaming is a joke. It's a minority of the population that play games (and tell everyone how hard core they are over the Internet for doing so). You're kidding yourself if you think people outside of a few video game forums really give two shits about the self proclaimed hard core gamer.
 
I doubt it will be that successful. It looks interesting and I can see why casual gamers find it appealing, but it doesn't have anything that will make it last. The people who are into that kind of thing already own Wiis. The games look pretty bad and will get boring after awhile. It will probably sell well at Christmas time, but casual gamers aren't the people buying several $60 titles a month. Sales will drastically drop after the holidays.
 
I don't get why people would WANT this to fail. I'm not enthralled by what I've seen so far and I don't plan on buying it at this point, but if this thing lives up to the potential it's good for the industry and nudges things forward a bit.

Topics like this make no sense. There's no reason to be insecure, it's not like they're going to cancel Super Duper-De-Dooper Street Fighter 5 or Gears of War: My Muscles & Cock Are Huge Edition if Natal takes off and sells a ton. The potential rise of "casual" gaming doesn't mean there would be a decrease in "hardcore" gaming on the 360. It just means your non-gaming girl cousin may want to get a 360 as well.

Shrug. Doesn't matter to me. I'd prefer it's a success, at least it means MS hasn't been wasting their fucking time for the last 2 years or however long they've been working on this.
 
No, it's going to tank hard if it really costs $150.

"Hardcore" gamers mostly aren't going to be interest in the Wii ports anyway, much less at that price. And at $150 for the gadget and $200+ for a 360 and $50-60 a game they're not going to get casuals/non-gamers to buy one instead of picking up a Wii (or sticking with their Wii if they already have one).
 
It'l sell millions, but you're crazy if you think it'll kill off hardcore gaming. Kinect cannot replicate the precision or just tactile/emotion connection of a physical controller. It's not going to happen.
 
[quote name='KaneRobot']The potential rise of "casual" gaming doesn't mean there would be a decrease in "hardcore" gaming on the 360. It just means your non-gaming girl cousin may want to get a 360 as well.
[/QUOTE]

I wouldn't be so sure. There have definitely been less "hardcore" games on the Wii than on previous Nintendo consoles.

And the other factor, for those like me who just fucking hate motion controls, is that even the "hardcore" games may end up using motion controls--as has been the case on the Wii--which ruins most of those games for us.

I play games to veg out and relax. Having to move around--which will be even more prevalent with Kinect than the Wii given it's body controlled--doesn't mesh with the way I enjoy games.

That said, I don't think Kinect will have any impact on traditional gaming on the 360. But I do worry if it (and the PS Move) catch on we'll see motion control be the dominant control scheme on all three consoles in the next generation.
 
It won't be long before you get a Kinect game that involves ripping off testicles, so you'll have your day. Don't you worry. However, if it has video chat, be sure to take off the tutu. Better safe then sorry!
 
[quote name='KaneRobot']I don't get why people would WANT this to fail. I'm not enthralled by what I've seen so far and I don't plan on buying it at this point, but if this thing lives up to the potential it's good for the industry and nudges things forward a bit.

Topics like this make no sense. There's no reason to be insecure, it's not like they're going to cancel Super Duper-De-Dooper Street Fighter 5 or Gears of War: My Muscles & Cock Are Huge Edition if Natal takes off and sells a ton. The potential rise of "casual" gaming doesn't mean there would be a decrease in "hardcore" gaming on the 360. It just means your non-gaming girl cousin may want to get a 360 as well.

Shrug. Doesn't matter to me. I'd prefer it's a success, at least it means MS hasn't been wasting their fucking time for the last 2 years or however long they've been working on this.[/QUOTE]


Lol, I could have said the same thing 15 years ago when FPS started becoming more popular. Who cares, they won't cancel my next TBS game or RTS.

Now I have seen my favorite genre reduced to a trickle of titles and watered down for the console world. TBS games practically don't exist anymore except for Civ series. Game developers are going to make games in the genre that is the MOST profitable. And if kiddie games brings in the most cash, kiddie games are what we will get from now on.

15 years ago, strategy games were tremendous popular. The same thing can happen to hardcore games.
 
I see no correlation between core 360 games and the success of Kinect.

Whether or not Kinect fails, or is a runaway success won't stop more games like Gears, Call of Duty, or any other game that appeals to more traditional gamers.

Microsoft wants a peice of that Wii money, and they have enough cash to make that bet.

I don't think developers are canning projects to move resources to motion controlled party games. Those types of games don't cost much to develop anyway, so it's not like Developers are going to go bankrupt if Kinect fails.

Ubisoft makes more casual shit games than anyone, and they still make Assasins Creed and other core games.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']

And the other factor, for those like me who just fucking hate motion controls, is that even the "hardcore" games may end up using motion controls--as has been the case on the Wii--which ruins most of those games for us.

[/QUOTE]

That's the case with the Wii because it had motion controls from the start...MS can't force any hardcore game to be Kinect only considering the majority of people will still be playing with a controller. Big difference
 
i dont know why everyone is whining about the $150 price tag. for one thats not even 100% confirmed yet. second, look at the competitions prices. if you want to buy 3 additional wiimotes, nunchuks, and wii motion plus to play 4 player on wii thats $225. a move starter pack and 3 additional move wands ro play 4 players? $250 not including the navigation controllers if required. with kinect, you can play 4 players right off the bat for that $150 if thats the price. looks a lot better than $200 plus with the others.
 
[quote name='bs000']http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGZbJlpsohc&feature=player_embedded[/QUOTE]


"Hi, I'm Kevin Butler and instead of being a badass like in the commercials I am going to suck a dick and tell you how awesome motion controls and 3D are! While I'm at it I'm going to shit on the competition that does us one better by not making you hold anything in your hands. Also, I wont tell you the competition lets you have 4 people playing at once for $150 and each person will cost $80 with us! I just lost all creditibility but the fanboys won't realize it because every time they see me they can't stop screaming how awesome I am long enough to hear what I'm saying!"
 
[quote name='Malik112099']"Hi, I'm Kevin Butler and instead of being a badass like in the commercials I am going to suck a dick and tell you how awesome motion controls and 3D are! While I'm at it I'm going to shit on the competition that does us one better by not making you hold anything in your hands. Also, I wont tell you the competition lets you have 4 people playing at once for $150 and each person will cost $80 with us! I just lost all creditibility but the fanboys won't realize it because every time they see me they can't stop screaming how awesome I am long enough to hear what I'm saying!"[/QUOTE]

As funny as that wasn't.. The majority of people actually found that to be pretty entertaining. Many media outlets considered it the best moment at E3 in fact, but I guess your sense of humor is well..biased. You act like that whole video was taking a shot at Kinect when he was doing a war cry for all gamers. Also if you don't see the humor in the Cirque du Solei jabs then I feel sorry for you.

Also I guess you may not have heard, Kinect doesn't support 4 people playing at once. And guess what? The Move controller is $50, you don't need the subcontroller.
 
[quote name='ssjmichael']That's the case with the Wii because it had motion controls from the start...MS can't force any hardcore game to be Kinect only considering the majority of people will still be playing with a controller. Big difference[/QUOTE]

And that's why I said I don't see it having any impact with the 360.

But worry that if it and PS Move do well all three consoles will have motion controls from the start next generation.
 
[quote name='kingkiller33']Lol, I could have said the same thing 15 years ago when FPS started becoming more popular. Who cares, they won't cancel my next TBS game or RTS. [/QUOTE]
Consoles do not equal PCs, especially in this day and age. Both are generally considered "hardcore" genres, so I'm not sure why you're comparing them for the point you're trying to prove. If Fuzzy Bear's Fun Family Picnic had burst on the scene and destroyed the Starcraft playerbase, that would be something worth mentioning.

15 years ago, strategy games were tremendous popular. The same thing can happen to hardcore games.
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Again, you're not even comparing the same thing. Strategy games are a genre. "Hardcore" games are a silly generalization made by people crying about how the sky is falling every time they see something their younger sibling may be into.

Microsoft is looking to get some of that Wii audience, not neglect what brought them to the dance. I don't get why people can't grasp that. Nothing is going to change for the forseeable future for all the exploding blood and guts / think about your next move for 20 minutes before making it / learn a 48-hit combo players whether Kinect succeeds or fails.
 
[quote name='ssjmichael']As funny as that wasn't.. The majority of people actually found that to be pretty entertaining. Many media outlets considered it the best moment at E3 in fact, but I guess your sense of humor is well..biased. You act like that whole video was taking a shot at Kinect when he was doing a war cry for all gamers. Also if you don't see the humor in the Cirque du Solei jabs then I feel sorry for you.

Also I guess you may not have heard, Kinect doesn't support 4 people playing at once. And guess what? The Move controller is $50, you don't need the subcontroller.[/QUOTE]


Kevin could have walked out and shit on the stage and eveyone would have thought it was the best moment at E3. I was watching that shit live and when he walked out I got excited until I realized he wasnt going to show off badass games but instead further push 3D and motion controls. He makes fun of the Kinect but Sony's big Move game is fucking Harry Kameotter which people seem to be excited about (I dont fucking know how). The thing that boggles my fucking mind is that it is a Wiimote for the PS3. A fuckING WIIMOTE FOR THE PS3! And then they try to shit on Microsoft for making the Kinect look like it would be fun for the whole family (the demographic they are aiming for).

Fine..$50 each = $200 and if the game still makes you use the DS3 for your other hand that is still $50 each. Please give me a link where MS states that the Kinect does not support 4 players.


A war cry for all gamers? Are you that stupid? He was doing a war cry for Sony because they think if Kevin can convert the hardcore then they make more money on this motion control venture.
 
[quote name='KaneRobot']C
You're not even comparing the same thing. Strategy games are a genre. "Hardcore" games are a silly generalization made by people crying about how the sky is falling every time they see something their younger sibling may be into.
[/quote]

It's kind of the same thing. Casual games are a genre. Casual games these days tend to be motion controlled.

The rise of casual games could result in some extreme scenario in a reduction of number of AAA games in other genres.

Just like the rise of FPS etc. has resulted in fewer strategy games, platformers etc.


Microsoft is looking to get some of that Wii audience, not neglect what brought them to the dance. I don't get why people can't grasp that. Nothing is going to change for the forseeable future for all the exploding blood and guts / think about your next move for 20 minutes before making it / learn a 48-hit combo players whether Kinect succeeds or fails.
Click to expand...


Next generation is the foreseeable future. If all three consoles next gen launch with motion controls included, then we'll see a bunch of casual games and also see traditional genres hampered (at least for those of us who hate them) by motion controls just like the Wii this generation.
 
*facepalm* Not even going to debate with you about the KB thing. You're entitled to your opinion.

Read this on the kinect's limitation: http://www.joystiq.com/2010/06/19/kinect-how-it-works-from-the-company-behind-the-tech

PrimeSense reps also told me that the camera can "see" any number of people on the screen -- you can fit as many people in that camera as possible, and the computer will see all of them and can even recognize them as human shapes. But it can only run calculations on two people at a time, just because the processing power required to track all of the body's locations and movements is so great.
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Also this may come as a surprise to you, but if there are more than two people playing on the PS3 already, or planning to, then they more than likely already own more than one DualShock 3 controller, or were planning to get one regardless of the PS Move. Another possible shocker. There are third party PS3 controllers avaiilable for cheaper, there will no doubt als be third party subscontrollers available for cheaper than Sony.
 
As long as game you like playing still sell and still make money somebody will make them.

If Kinect does well I imagine there will be less low budget "me too" 1st person shooters, but is that even a bad thing?
 
You can't 'end' something that doesn't technically exist. I've always hated this argument. Hardcore games are, like someone already said, things that people who have been gaming for years think are 'cool'. Weirdly, it's always stuff like Gears and CoD that come up, yet they sell huge numbers of copies, a ton of which are made up by what these people would call 'casual' gamers. Honestly, how many of you know someone who, literally, owns a 360 and just plays CoD and Madden? These distinctions are bizarre.

Now, motion controls are something that are here to stay, so deal with it. Talking about just the Wii, it's been a long time since a 'core' game has forced an obnoxious level of motion control. Twilight Princess is an example of such a game, but that was back when Nintendo seemed to tack it on everything. A game like Mario Galaxy has very subtle and acceptable motion controls, and if you're complaining about that... well, I can't help you.

The sky is not falling, motion controls aren't killing the industry, and it's absolutely bizarre to complain about such in a year that's seen Borderlands, Mass Effect 2, Batman Arkham Asylum, Dragon Age, Red Dead Redemption, Alan Wake, Mario Galaxy 2, Monster Hunter Tri, 3D Dot Game Heroes, Uncharted 2, and Demon's Souls. That's just scratching the surface.
 
[quote name='bs000'][youtube][/QUOTE]

That was pretty great actually. I hadn't seen that up til now. He almost, almost convinced me that a Wii w/balls controller wouldn't fail that bad on a non Wii system.
 
[quote name='007']You can't 'end' something that doesn't technically exist. I've always hated this argument. Hardcore games are, like someone already said, things that people who have been gaming for years think are 'cool'. Weirdly, it's always stuff like Gears and CoD that come up, yet they sell huge numbers of copies, a ton of which are made up by what these people would call 'casual' gamers. Honestly, how many of you know someone who, literally, owns a 360 and just plays CoD and Madden? These distinctions are bizarre.
[/quote]

Yeah, I've never liked the "hardcore" label I think just saying "traditional" games works better.

I want to keep playing FPS, WRPGs, action games like Assassin's Creed etc., lounging on the couch and pressing buttons and sticks on traditional controllers. I just can't stand Motion Controls.

Now, motion controls are something that are here to stay, so deal with it. Talking about just the Wii, it's been a long time since a 'core' game has forced an obnoxious level of motion control. Twilight Princess is an example of such a game, but that was back when Nintendo seemed to tack it on everything. A game like Mario Galaxy has very subtle and acceptable motion controls, and if you're complaining about that... well, I can't help you.
Click to expand...

I can't deal with it personally. If all three consoles next gen are motion controlled, I'll be done with gaming. I'm not in a rage over it, my interest has been waning anyway and it would just be more time for other hobbies etc.

But I do still enjoy gaming when I make time for it, and would like to have at least one console next gen that launches only with traditional controls.

As for forced motion controls, the new Zelda certainly goes that way. Metroid Prime 3 was another that I'd have enjoyed much more with dual analog control personally. Mario Galaxy was fine motion wise--but would have been more comfortable with a normal controller as the nunchuck+wii-mote combo is a bit awkward to me vs. say the 360 controller for games that aren't making much use of the motion controls.

The sky is not falling, motion controls aren't killing the industry, and it's absolutely bizarre to complain about such in a year that's seen Borderlands, Mass Effect 2, Batman Arkham Asylum, Dragon Age, Red Dead Redemption, Alan Wake, Mario Galaxy 2, Monster Hunter Tri, 3D Dot Game Heroes, Uncharted 2, and Demon's Souls. That's just scratching the surface.
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But that's in a generation with 2 consoles that are focused on traditional controls. Will we get the same level of kick ass, traditionally controlled games next generation if all three consoles launch with motion control included?

That's the key question/concern for me.
 
I still think it will " NOT " launch at $150 it is just a disguise so people think it is so cheap when they change the price to $80-$100

Just my thoughts :D
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']



But that's in a generation with 2 consoles that are focused on traditional controls. Will we get the same level of kick ass, traditionally controlled games next generation if all three consoles launch with motion control included?

That's the key question/concern for me.[/QUOTE]

I admit, I bought TP for GC simply because I wanted regular controls. I just think the TP motion was poorly implemented. I disagree with you on Metroid, though, as I enjoyed the Wii re-release more than the traditional controlled ones. For me, they enhanced the game.

As far as next generation, I don't think we'll see much, if any, slow-down in 'traditional games' with regular controls. A lot, of course, will depend on this winter. Regardless, looking at the top sellers of this gen, the vast majority of the games are either traditional games, or Nintendo non-shovelware stuff (WiiPlay excluded, of course). You look at the numbers for things like CoD, and you wonder why anyone would mess with that formula. Even a game like Red Dead seems to be selling reasonably well. My hope is that we would get the OPTION of controls, like RE5 Gold, RE4 Wii, and the new Socom. For me, that's the perfect future. A bit pricey with the different controllers, mind you, but it's the best compromise I think you'll get.

Bottom line is, though, when the inevitably CoD, Mass Effect, Dragon Age, what have it sequels come out, I'd be shocked to see mandatory motion controls.
 
I honestly could see a situation where it's $150 if you don't have one, but bundled with every Arcade at $199. Microsoft is pretty crazy right now, and they want to take down the Wii and are almost at a point where they'll do anything to do it, even if it means losing a lot of money on the thing.
 
[quote name='007']I disagree with you on Metroid, though, as I enjoyed the Wii re-release more than the traditional controlled ones. For me, they enhanced the game.
[/quote]

Yeah, but to be fair the GC Metroid Prime games weren't great control wise to begin with since the GC didn't really have a dual analog controller as the right stick was small and awkward to use. So they didn't really play like FPS games to begin with. I still prefered those to MP3's pointer control, but both paled compared to dual analog FPS games IMO.

As far as next generation, I don't think we'll see much, if any, slow-down in 'traditional games' with regular controls. A lot, of course, will depend on this winter. Regardless, looking at the top sellers of this gen, the vast majority of the games are either traditional games, or Nintendo non-shovelware stuff (WiiPlay excluded, of course). You look at the numbers for things like CoD, and you wonder why anyone would mess with that formula. Even a game like Red Dead seems to be selling reasonably well. My hope is that we would get the OPTION of controls, like RE5 Gold, RE4 Wii, and the new Socom. For me, that's the perfect future. A bit pricey with the different controllers, mind you, but it's the best compromise I think you'll get.

Bottom line is, though, when the inevitably CoD, Mass Effect, Dragon Age, what have it sequels come out, I'd be shocked to see mandatory motion controls.
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I hope you're right. My ideal--if Kinnect succeeds--would be for MS to launch "Family Bundle" and a normal bundle console next gen--Kind of like Arcade vs. Pro/Elite this gen.

Family comes with the motion control stuff, the other just comes with traditional controls.

If they launch with every bundle having motion controls I think we'll see motion controls tacked on to most games as we've seen on the Wii. If everyone has it, developers will feel a need to make use of it.
 
[quote name='iKilledChewbacca']I still think it will " NOT " launch at $150 it is just a disguise so people think it is so cheap when they change the price to $80-$100

Just my thoughts :D[/QUOTE]

I agree. If the price was indeed $150 then why didn't MS just announce it at E3? I mean, GS and Amazon clearly think that's the price for some reason so what would be the reason MS would hold back on that? The main reason I can think of is that they're planning to drop it to $99.99. If they do announce it for $150 in a few months then it'll be sort of anti-climactic
 
[quote name='007']You can't 'end' something that doesn't technically exist. I've always hated this argument. Hardcore games are, like someone already said, things that people who have been gaming for years think are 'cool'. Weirdly, it's always stuff like Gears and CoD that come up, yet they sell huge numbers of copies, a ton of which are made up by what these people would call 'casual' gamers. Honestly, how many of you know someone who, literally, owns a 360 and just plays CoD and Madden? These distinctions are bizarre.

Now, motion controls are something that are here to stay, so deal with it. Talking about just the Wii, it's been a long time since a 'core' game has forced an obnoxious level of motion control. Twilight Princess is an example of such a game, but that was back when Nintendo seemed to tack it on everything. A game like Mario Galaxy has very subtle and acceptable motion controls, and if you're complaining about that... well, I can't help you.

The sky is not falling, motion controls aren't killing the industry, and it's absolutely bizarre to complain about such in a year that's seen Borderlands, Mass Effect 2, Batman Arkham Asylum, Dragon Age, Red Dead Redemption, Alan Wake, Mario Galaxy 2, Monster Hunter Tri, 3D Dot Game Heroes, Uncharted 2, and Demon's Souls. That's just scratching the surface.[/QUOTE]


Hardcore is just a label. To me, it means a game geared towards a mature audience. You want more specific, ok M rated games vs E rated kiddie games. If Kinect is a huge money maker, I could see Xbox game library becoming 90% E rated games and 10% or less M rated games.

It won't happen overnight, or even in the next year or so. These companies are gonna design games that make the most sense financially. Why is that so hard to understand? Why spend years developing a complex Mass Effect game when you can develop Wii sports in 6 months and sell just as many?
 
[quote name='kingkiller33']
It won't happen overnight, or even in the next year or so. These companies are gonna design games that make the most sense financially. Why is that so hard to understand? Why spend years developing a complex Mass Effect game when you can develop Wii sports in 6 months and sell just as many?[/QUOTE]

That's exactly the worry. If all consoles go motion controls and go hard after the casual market, we could see many fewer games in traditional genres.

It costs a shit ton more money to develop a Mass Effect or Gears of War than some simople casual game as you note. If they can sell the same or more copies at the same price of the much cheaper to make casual game, we'll definitely see more focus on those than on traditional games.

Again, it's no worry this generation as the vast majority of 360 owners won't have Kinnect. But if all consoles launch with motion controls next gen, it could be a different story.

Then every console could be like the Wii were the majority of game releases are motion controlled casual games, and traditional games are limited to a few times a year where the first party developers throw "hardcore" gamers a bone--and even those bones have motion controls tacked on.
 
[quote name='frankcastle']i dont know why everyone is whining about the $150 price tag. for one thats not even 100% confirmed yet. second, look at the competitions prices. if you want to buy 3 additional wiimotes, nunchuks, and wii motion plus to play 4 player on wii thats $225. a move starter pack and 3 additional move wands ro play 4 players? $250 not including the navigation controllers if required. with kinect, you can play 4 players right off the bat for that $150 if thats the price. looks a lot better than $200 plus with the others.[/QUOTE]
You make a very valid point. $150 isn't a bad price and the tech that has went into Kinect is pretty amazing, it's hard to deny that. I personally am not ready to drop $150 on this when I know I'd probably only use it to navigate menus on the dashboard.

I also don't think this will kill hardcore gaming or even come close. The thought is actually pretty ridiculous, Microsoft has made a name for themselves in video games with the Xbox being the system that caters towards hardcore gamers and a more mature audience in general. It's obvious they still have a slew of "hardcore" gamers titles releasing this year with games like Reach, Crackdown 2, Fable 3, and Castlevania on the arcade.

At $150 like it or not, Kinect will sell like crazy and likely be the biggest wish-list item for Christmas this year. Not saying the move will fail, because it looks pretty damn cool. The Move just looks a lot more "Wii-Too" than the Kinect, which is something a bit different with the no controller approach.
 
Microsoft and other developers aren't going to sacrifice their hardcore audience for their casual. This move is simply branching out into casuals, rest assured we won't be abandoned and hardcore gaming won't be ruined.
 
[quote name='seanr1221']You're not much better as a MS fanboy.[/QUOTE]


Im not an MS fanboy. I do use my Xbox for gaming more than my PS3 but all in all my PS3 gets used more. It is my media center. Pointing out fanboyism for one system does not automatically make me a fanboy for the other. You saying it does just further proves that you are one.
 
[quote name='Sigma']
I also don't think this will kill hardcore gaming or even come close. The thought is actually pretty ridiculous, Microsoft has made a name for themselves in video games with the Xbox being the system that caters towards hardcore gamers and a more mature audience in general. It's obvious they still have a slew of "hardcore" gamers titles releasing this year with games like Reach, Crackdown 2, Fable 3, and Castlevania on the arcade.
[/QUOTE]

[quote name='PhantomBlob']Microsoft and other developers aren't going to sacrifice their hardcore audience for their casual. This move is simply branching out into casuals, rest assured we won't be abandoned and hardcore gaming won't be ruined.[/QUOTE]


But will that be true next gen if the consoles all launch with motion controls?

Will we still get the awesome amount of AAA traditionally controlled games that we've gotten on the 360 and PS3 this generation?

Or will we get fewer traditional games and have most have some level of motion control tacked on like we've seen on the Wii?

This gen I"m not worried at all. The 360 and PS3 will continue to get a big amount of kick ass traditional games. And it looks like this gen will keep on running for a while. If they're just now launching these peripherals, the next gen consoles are probably 2-3 years away at a minimum.

So we're fine for now. But if Kinnect and Move sell like hotcakes, I worry that when the next gen finally arrives we'll be left with a market place full of casual games and motion controlled traditional games.

Time will tell of course, and I certainly hope I'm wrong.
 
Kinect is just a way for Microsoft to appeal to the casuals and make their shareholders happy. They won't take a loss on it because their shareholders are already pissed about bleeding profits (though the 360 has profited quite well the last two years) and even have asked MS to pull the plug on their console adventures (google it, its true) so I still see it staying at $150 unless pre-orders start to really slow. Some people just have way too much money on their hands (look at all the people who bought those Rockbands - very good example) and then you have the crazy parents who will spend any amount on stupid stuff (Tickle me elmo anyone?) so it will do decently thru the holidays. Then when sales slow down in spring of next year MS can drop it to $100 and can probably still profit because production costs will drop even further.

Oh, and of course Hardcore games will always exist. MS is appealing to all audiences and would not drop It's 30+ million fanbase that bought nothing but the Halos Gears and CODS.
 
I really don't get this "hardcore" thing.. so long as compelling, fun content gets made for the device, who cares if it's a commercial success or not?

The only difference between a hardcore gamer and a regular one is how how much they complain about the hobby.
 
[quote name='BattleChicken']I really don't get this "hardcore" thing.. so long as compelling, fun content gets made for the device, who cares if it's a commercial success or not?

The only difference between a hardcore gamer and a regular one is how how much they complain about the hobby.[/QUOTE]

Agree, like I said earlier, the "hardcore" label is pretty silly. I'm not a hardcore gamer. I'm a casual gamer who likes traditional, mainstream AAA games in popular genres, and don't care for motion control or party games like Wii Sports.

I just want to be able to play games like CoD, Gears of War, Mass Effect, Fallout 3, Oblivion, Halo etc. etc. etc. next gen.

Meaning I want just as many (if not more) AAA games like those coming out and I want them to have traditional controls, no motion or waggle tacked on.

And I worry slightly that if Kinnect and Move sell really well all consoles next gen will be like the Wii with fewer traditional games, and having the traditional genre games have tacked on motion control/waggle.
 
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