Looking for advice from CAG on item I (sort of) recently sold

xbltheshadow

xbltheshadow

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First of all, here is a link to the auction of which I am inquiring about. Today, I recieve a message from the buyer stating...

"Your keyboard is cosmetically damaged and you did NOT disclose this in your auction. I feel cheated. Please refund my money." (Paraphrased, the actual message was much less detailed.)

So I'm thinking, okay, this could be true. Maybe I just missed whatever it is when I looked it over before putting it in the box. At the same time, I'm also thinking as to why they waited so long to contactme about this. The date of delivery on this item was July 7th. My return policy states that any buyer has 7 calendar days to contact me about a return, I've never had a problem with this policy until now. This buyer has waited 20 days since they recieved the item to pop up and say something! So in the back of my mind, I'm thinking this could be some kind of scam.

So my return reply was simple, it just stated that they were way past the date of return and I couldn't do much. They did purchase insurance on this package so I suggested that if they felt it was damaged during shipment to contact USPS about a claim.

It then got me thinking that if this person could actually show me the damage, then I really should either do a partial refund, or a full refund if they decided to send it back.

Since my last message, they told me exactly where they thought the problem was. "The damage is on the lower left side and it's about 5 inches long." So I think, okay, finally some detail. Let me see what I can see from my picture. Now, I know eBay has crappy quality on their pictures in auctions, but I originally took the picture in HQ, and saved it. I uploaded it to ImageShack and sent it to the buyer so they could also have a better look, this link can also be found embedded here.

So what I ask of you is, what should I do? I'm pretty sure that if they can show me the damage, I would have no problem giving a 20% refund. But what if they banter back and forth and show me nothing? I have a feeling they may file an "Item Significantly Not As Described" dispute with Paypal, and I'll be out of a good chunk of change.

Edit: They just sent a message stating that I have 15 minutes to issue a refund or else I recieve a negative. (Not really worried about it) I just find it odd that they come to threataning me for a simple thing like this.
 
I'd say ask for a picture showing the damage, and maybe tell them that if it looks like something that might have happened before you shipped, you'll issue a partial/full refund. If it's clearly shipping damage, then tell them they need to take it up with USPS, and that it's not your fault. Basically, don't let them push you around. Try and find out more information.
 
Yes, I did that. Upon asking for more information and a picture of the damage, all they did was say the bottom left side of the keyboard had no silver on it. So I again asked for a picture, then came the most recent threat of a negative. Which again, I'm really not worried about because I'm almost done with eBay.

I did also offer a partial refund, as stated in OP, but they want a full refund (including shipping) without sending the item back.
 
[quote name='xbltheshadow']Yes, I did that. Upon asking for more information and a picture of the damage, all they did was say the bottom left side of the keyboard had no silver on it. So I again asked for a picture, then came the most recent threat of a negative. Which again, I'm really not worried about because I'm almost done with eBay.

I did also offer a partial refund, as stated in OP, but they want a full refund (including shipping) without sending the item back.[/quote]
Yeah, sounds like they might just be trying to scam you. Granted, it could be a totally honest person acting like an ass, but I dunno. Maybe send another message stating that you'll gladly give them a refund but only once they return the faulty item. But if you're really almost done with eBay (which I can totally understand), then I'd say don't worry about it and let them give you a negative. The worst they can do is go to PayPal about it, and PayPal will just tell them to ship the keyboard back to you so that you'll issue a refund.
 
I absolutely would not issue a refund. The item was described as used, it stated clearly there was a 7 day refund policy. I see no issues in your picture. Sounds like the buyer is simply trying to get something for nothing. Not sure what you can do on your end to contact eBay and let them know the situation but I recommend doing some research and finding out what you can do because from my perspective it sounds like they're trying to screw you.
 
Seriously, do not budge an inch for these people. If you receive a negative, contact ebay and have it removed. If you stated a return policy clearly within your auction, and they are not following it - not to mention the shipping insurance - well then they are simple SOL. Don't let them push you around, not even for a partial refund.

Also, you may consider starting to put "Item as pictured" within your description somewhere, because then if it were in the picture, that's simply too bad. They should have noticed before.
 
"BEWARE: Seller claimed 'excellent' condition when in fact item in poor condition"

You give then a partial refund and let them keep the itemjerk still left you negative feedback.
 
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Well, it seems to be over. As Mugen posed above, they placed negative feedback while I slept. Kinda figured I would get a message saying "I'll remove the negative feedback if you give me a refund." I haven't recieved that yet, but I'm kinda expecting it, especially if they're trying to scam me.

As far as I know, the case is closed, I get a negative, but I get to keep all of the money. Not a perfect turn out, but since they were a total ass in every message I recieved, I'm satisfied.

Can I really get this removed? I looked over ebay's policy on removing feedback, and it looks like they only remove really bad feedback. I guess if I could, it wouldn't hurt. I'd probably win if ebay took a look at for more than a second.
 
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Contact ebay and dispute the negative. Provide them with all your documentation, the emails you received, and explain that the person did not contact you in the specified time frame and then tried to blackmail you with bad feedback. Ebay should back you on this and remove the neg.
 
[quote name='xbltheshadow']Well, it seems to be over. As Mugen posed above, they placed negative feedback while I slept. Kinda figured I would get a message saying "I'll remove the negative feedback if you give me a refund." I haven't recieved that yet, but I'm kinda expecting it, especially if they're trying to scam me.

As far as I know, the case is closed, I get a negative, but I get to keep all of the money. Not a perfect turn out, but since they were a total ass in every message I recieved, I'm satisfied.

Can I really get this removed? I looked over ebay's policy on removing feedback, and it looks like they only remove really bad feedback. I guess if I could, it wouldn't hurt. I'd probably win if ebay took a look at for more than a second.[/quote]

Make sure that you reply to the negative feedback (if you can still do that) and say that seller did not follow return policy could not prove damage.

This is the reason that I NEVER leave feedback for a buyer until I get the positive from them. Once you put that positive up there, you're screwed. He can (and did) apparently lie about the condition of the item and there is no retaliation for you.

The buyer will probably file a complaint with Paypal. Since Paypal are dicks, they will side with them and you will be out the money and the keyboard.

TBW
 
[quote name='TheBlueWizard']Make sure that you reply to the negative feedback (if you can still do that) and say that seller did not follow return policy could not prove damage.

This is the reason that I NEVER leave feedback for a buyer until I get the positive from them. Once you put that positive up there, you're screwed. He can (and did) apparently lie about the condition of the item and there is no retaliation for you.

The buyer will probably file a complaint with Paypal. Since Paypal are dicks, they will side with them and you will be out the money and the keyboard.

TBW[/quote]

Since sellers can no longer leave neutral or negative feedback, I've just been sending feedback right on payment. Even if I didn't this time, all I could do is a retalitory positive.

But yea, I fully expect him to screw me over through Paypal. I really don't know why he didn't go there right after leaving the feedback.

I'll go through ebay and see what they say about this. I'll post my update here once I recieve a respnse. I expect it to be automated.
 
[quote name='Dunvane']Seriously, do not budge an inch for these people. If you receive a negative, contact ebay and have it removed. If you stated a return policy clearly within your auction, and they are not following it - not to mention the shipping insurance - well then they are simple SOL. Don't let them push you around, not even for a partial refund.

Also, you may consider starting to put "Item as pictured" within your description somewhere, because then if it were in the picture, that's simply too bad. They should have noticed before.[/QUOTE]

As sick as it makes me feel to say this, for the most part, regardless of what "rules" you put in your ebay auctions, Pay Pal and eBay's rules trump yours everytime.
 
OH and to the OP..if youre really bored..go online and look for applications to shows like Judge Judy etc etc and try suing the buyer for damaging your reputation etc etc.

Sounds funny but its been done before and people have won from it.
 
[quote name='Will']OH and to the OP..if youre really bored..go online and look for applications to shows like Judge Judy etc etc and try suing the buyer for damaging your reputation etc etc.

Sounds funny but its been done before and people have won from it.[/quote]
Ha, that does sound funny, but I really don't want to go through the trouble for that. I've got my last item ending on Monday, so I'm not worried about it.
 
Ok, I have emailed eBay customer support about this. When filling out the form, I selected "Buyer only intended on leaving bad feedback." Below is my message to ebay.

[quote name='xbltheshadow']I recently sold item 150263755720. Yesterday, I was contacted by the buyer that they had some cosmetic damage on the keyboard that I did not list in the item and wanted a full refund.

My return policy states that any customer that has a problem with an item has 7 calendar days after reciept of delivery to contact me about a return. Their item was delivered on July 7th and I was first contacted on July 20th, 20 days after arrival. I notify them that I can't do a full refund because of the time lapse, but to possibly contact the USPS about getting a claim on their item, if they felt the damage was done during shipment, since insurance was purchased.

I was then accused of knowing of the damage before I shipped the item. Stated that the auction picture was purpously "shadowed" in the lower left corner so any potential buyer couldn't see the damage. I then take a look at my picture, seeing as I saved it to my computer before uploading it and it is much better quality. I couldn't find anything wrong in the area that was stated. I uploaded this to a free picture hosting site and sent it to the buyer to give them a better look that there is no damage.

Also included in that message, I decided to do away with my own 7 day return policy. I offered to do a partial refund if they could send me a picture showing the damage, or I could give them an address to send it back for a full refund. Buyer then insisted that I give him a full refund without sending the item back and threatened me with a negative if I did not do so. Also gave an unrealistic 15 minute time window in which I had to do this.

I personally feel that during all of this, the buyer had every intention of trying to rip off an honest seller. I attempted to easily resolve this by simply asking for evidence of my mistake, but was denied. If needed, all messages between us are still in my Inbox/Outbox.

Thank you for your time.[/quote]
 
Sounds good man, good luck with that asshole. This is why I hate ebay, yet I still sell on it because other than here and CAG, I'm at a loss. @_@
 
Just going to post a final update as to what ebay has said over this entire debacle. I won't post their messages here simply because they are so massive. I recieved a total of 2 official messages regarding this situation.

So in summary, ebay is not going to remove the feedback basically because there is no court order asking for its removal. They say this is the only way feedback can be removed. Can't say I'm suprised about this ruling, but I did find the content of these messages interesting.

They pretty much sided with me. Stating that the buyer had no right to request a full refund without returning the item. I also did the right thing by offering a partial refund upon proof of the damage stated. They also looked at the pictures from the auction and including the one that I sent the buyer and could also find no faults on my product in the area which the buyer stated.

Despite all of this, as I said before, they could not remove the feedback simply because there was no court order. While I think it is wrong that the buyer had to threaten me with a negative just to get what he want, that did not seem to be a factor in their decision, although they did address it as well.

In the end, I am stuck with the negative feedback, but will keep all of the money. Ebay assured me that because of my complaint, if he filed a dispute with Paypal over the condition, he would have to submit a picture as well to be granted his request. If he wouldn't give that to me when I asked for it, I doubt he will give it to Paypal. And considering that I just sold my last item yesterday that already had bids on it before this, I am satisfied by this outcome. I probably won't sell on ebay anymore, but will still buy things from time to time if the price is right.

Hopefully my experience will be informative to you and to any others that come across this situation. Get a court order if you really want the feedback removed. Which, IMO, is not worth it in almost any situation.
 
I don't think you should give them any sort of refund. You should file a claim against THEM since they have no proof that it was damaged and they are lying about it! The keyboard looks fine in the picture you have up, so unless they can provide a picture with the damage, they really don't have a case. And since they can't even show you a picture of the damage, then it's pretty obvious they're making it up. This is just plain stupid of them to do this to you!

[quote name='xbltheshadow']I did also offer a partial refund, as stated in OP, but they want a full refund (including shipping) without sending the item back.[/quote]

btw - do they have any negatives? If so, then they're a scammer. Sounds like it is based on the fact that they're asking for a full refund without sending the item back. Try sending copies of their demands along with your case to eBay and/or Paypal, or perhaps you can file for mail fraud (not sure if it would apply, but I think it should work)
 
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[quote name='SuperhumanChichi']btw - do they have any negatives? If so, then they're a scammer. Sounds like it is based on the fact that they're asking for a full refund without sending the item back. Try sending copies of their demands along with your case to eBay and/or Paypal, or perhaps you can file for mail fraud (not sure if it would apply, but I think it should work)[/quote]

Ebay does not allow sellers to give buyers neutral or negative feedback anymore. But you can still complain in the positive feedback. I don't see any that fit my previous statement, but I send my feedback right after I receive payment. I think this may be part of the reason he came after me, I had no retaliatory method. His record showed that he was always the first to leave feedback, which is totally opposite what I did. So because of this, I will no longer be leaving people feedback first (on eBay, on here people are MUCH more trustworthy :D).

And as stated in the previous page, I did contact ebay about this and he now has a small note in his file saying that he may be trying to scam future sellers and if he ever does it again, he could face disciplinary action. And mail fraud is not an option since he did not send the item back and I can't prove (because of no pic) that any damage was done during shipment.
 
they missed the 7 day return policy. the problem is no longer yours. it could be damaged from transit, who knows. maybe they had sex on top of it and broke it with their asses, still not your problem. be prepared though, they might leave you a negative. but at this point, i dont think there isnt anything else you could do.
 
[quote name='xbltheshadow']And as stated in the previous page, I did contact ebay about this and he now has a small note in his file saying that he may be trying to scam future sellers and if he ever does it again, he could face disciplinary action. And mail fraud is not an option since he did not send the item back and I can't prove (because of no pic) that any damage was done during shipment.[/quote]

Oh ok, sorry >.< Glad to hear that eBay did something though

[quote name='phear3d'] maybe they had sex on top of it and broke it with their asses, still not your problem.[/quote]

^ LMAO XD
 
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