Madden 12 League-OFFICIAL CAG LEAGUE-Week 3 live. Deadline Monday night.

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[quote name='bvharris']84. Keep in mind these rosters are from the beginning of the NFL season, so that's why it's not lower.

He wasn't exactly at 100% health in College either.

Which is why he was still available at #33 overall
 
[quote name='bvharris']However, that's a lot different from the idea that I'm somehow gaming the system to get these players. That whole idea is just wildly insulting to the people I'm trading with, who people are basically implying are idiots who don't know what to do with their own rosters. One can't say "BV is raiding teams" without also saying "GB is allowing himself to be raided". Quite frankly, GB spent more time scouting this trade than the rest of you combined, and I think it says something that he's been right there with me in extolling its virtues. He didn't just put his head down and then suddenly look up and find himself with a pu pu platter where Roddy White used to be. He did his homework, identified the players he wanted, and made what he felt was the best deal for his team. If you guys think he is a rube for doing so, at least have the decency to say that to him directly rather than just hinting at it with the "BV pulls another fast one!" talk.[/QUOTE]

I don't think GB, or anybody else who trades for prospects is a rube. It's a valid strategy for a team needing to retool. But it takes time. Even constant comparisons to the Peterson deal aren't fair because not only was Peterson's progression known (as mentioned), but he had an extra off-season off progression to factor in. GB is playing "Beat the Clock" here. He won't see any improvement AT ALL from Dowling until two seasons of this league have been completed.

So, what, he's got two offseasons AT MOST (more likely one based on past history) to reach the potential that GB had envisioned when making the deal? It's that part of the deal that I think is you selling snake oil. He has to wait for his players to get better before the trade is worth it, and by that time, your players have regressed, everybody is "burnt out", and all of a sudden "see you next year everybody!"

The other issue you mention is being unfairly criticized for having deep pockets. The problem here is the way this league functions with the "same teams as last year" position. I get that it's fun, but you basically started with a stacked deck. Somebody had to get the Pats, sure, but they were just yours by default. It is AWFULLY hard for new players to come in and compete with that. I don't know, maybe you guys don't care about that because you've got your core group and everything, but it just seems like this league is very "set in its ways".

One last thing, as mentioned, even the Pats wouldn't be able to pull off these moves because of the salary cap. That's a fault of Madden for not having one, but you have to recognize that a real team would not be able to function the way you're running the Pats.
 
[quote name='n8rockerasu']The problem here is the way this league functions with the "same teams as last year" position. I get that it's fun, but you basically started with a stacked deck. Somebody had to get the Pats, sure, but they were just yours by default. It is AWFULLY hard for new players to come in and compete with that. I don't know, maybe you guys don't care about that because you've got your core group and everything, but it just seems like this league is very "set in its ways".
[/QUOTE]


DarthoftheDead had the patriots last year...
 
[quote name='n8rockerasu']
So, what, he's got two offseasons AT MOST (more likely one based on past history) to reach the potential that GB had envisioned when making the deal? It's that part of the deal that I think is you selling snake oil. He has to wait for his players to get better before the trade is worth it, and by that time, your players have regressed, everybody is "burnt out", and all of a sudden "see you next year everybody!"[/QUOTE]

Selling snake oil is an inaccurate metaphor, because GB wasn't in the dark at all about what he's getting here. He knows, it was his idea to get young. Again, selling snake oil implies that I'm taking advantage of him without his knowledge.

As commish, I hope this league goes as long as it possibly can. I actually hope we can sustain it through the Summer, which we didn't last year. My hope has always been for this league to run year round, and I hope that happens again. Can I guarantee that will happen? Definitely not. But that's my sincere hope. I miss the hell out of this league when we're not playing it.

(Edit: Apparently I hope it so much that I said the word "hope" 5 times!)

[quote name='n8rockerasu']The other issue you mention is being unfairly criticized for having deep pockets. The problem here is the way this league functions with the "same teams as last year" position. I get that it's fun, but you basically started with a stacked deck. Somebody had to get the Pats, sure, but they were just yours by default. It is AWFULLY hard for new players to come in and compete with that. I don't know, maybe you guys don't care about that because you've got your core group and everything, but it just seems like this league is very "set in its ways". [/QUOTE]

I didn't have the Pats last year, this is my first year with them. When I started two years ago I had the Titans. I was planning to stick with them last year but someone else really wanted them so I switched to the Chargers. Once Red Worm decided to leave the league, I saw the chance to take control of my favorite team and took it. So it's not like I automatically got the Pats, I waited two years to get them.

It's definitely true that league vets get first choice of teams, but I'm not sure there's a way to avoid that (short of starting from scratch every year). Last year in our secondary league which I ran we did a draft of teams where the weaker players got first pick, and I think people enjoyed that a lot (though truth be told, the good players ended up winning with the bad teams anyway).

[quote name='siradam134']DarthoftheDead had the patriots last year...[/QUOTE]

That was League 2. Red Worm had them in this league.
 
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[quote name='Tanabeo']Is this draft like the real thing were if you were 32nd pick you get 1st in the next one? Im setting up the draft order and just want to make sure.[/QUOTE]

Nope that's a snake draft. Since I have the 32nd pick in the 1st round, I'll also have that same slot for every round unless trades were made.
 
[quote name='Tanabeo']Is this draft like the real thing were if you were 32nd pick you get 1st in the next one? Im setting up the draft order and just want to make sure.

edit: nvm im dumb[/QUOTE]

You've just been playing too much fantasy football. ;)
 
Obviously the trade is not going through as constituted. Either it will be re-worked, or it will be dead.

In the meantime, we still have two other trades which need to be reviewed before tonight. I'd like some more opinions on both of those before they go through.
 
[quote name='siradam134']my bad bv. lol..i just knew it wasnt you.

speaking of the xfn cag site....is there some reason the "main page" doesn't display anything? it hasn't for a while...


http://xtreme-football.net/CAG[/QUOTE]

I believe it's because we're in the offseason. Once we advance past the draft, it should come back.
 
[quote name='bvharris']I believe it's because we're in the offseason. Once we advance past the draft, it should come back.[/QUOTE]

i dont remember .ever. seeing it this season yet;-/
 
I dont know if this has been said but everyone needs to make sure thier roster is down to 48 players or the draft might auto-drop someone you want to keep.
 
[quote name='siradam134']i dont remember .ever. seeing it this season yet;-/[/QUOTE]

It's definitely been working, I've been using it all year. I'm still able to access the admin functions, so I'm pretty confident it will be back after the draft.
 
[quote name='Tanabeo']I dont know if this has been said but everyone needs to make sure thier roster is down to 48 players or the draft might auto-drop someone you want to keep.[/QUOTE]

It has, but it's good to post a reminder. I made my drops last night.

Just make sure you write down who you dropped so you can add them after!
 
Setting aside the White deal, these are the three trades which need to be reviewed:

[quote name='Deuce20602']TRADE ALERT:

Steve Smith (the last original Panther) is being traded, along with the Panthers' 2nd round pick to the Minnesota Vikings for the 12th 14th pick in the upcoming NFL Draft
[/QUOTE]

[quote name='LVPatriots']
Seahawks give QB Tarvaris Jackson

To the Cardinals for a 4th round pick (10th in draft order)[/QUOTE]

[quote name='Deuce20602']
the Panthers have traded RB DeAngelo Williams and the 14th pick acquired from MIN to the Bengals for RB Cedric Benson and WR AJ Green. This concludes the Panthers trading for the year. Thank you and good night:D[/QUOTE]

We need an up or down on these TODAY since they involve draft picks. I am 100% fine with the first two. The third one I'm mostly fine with, though I'd like to hear more discussion on it.

EDIT: Also, note that in the first deal Deuce listed the pick coming from the Vikings as the 12th pick, and listed it in the Bengals deal as the 14th. It is the 14th.

This pick will have gone from the Bucs > Pats > Vikings > Panthers > Bengals now.

I'm having trouble getting on the EA site, could someone re-post the ages and ratings? :D
 
[quote name='Doomtime']So... to defuse the tension in here... what's everyone planning to pickup for Black Friday?[/QUOTE]

Tension? Compared to the AP and Samuel deals, this has been afternoon tea. :D

I'm probably going to break down and buy a 3DS, I really want that Zelda bundle. Other than that, I'll probably just grab some blu rays and then see if I can find a good deal on Arkham City.
 
[quote name='bvharris']Tension? Compared to the AP and Samuel deals, this has been afternoon tea. :D

I'm probably going to break down and buy a 3DS, I really want that Zelda bundle. Other than that, I'll probably just grab some blu rays and then see if I can find a good deal on Arkham City.[/QUOTE]

Arkham city will be 30 at best buy im picking up these http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Klipsch+-+Icon+Dual+8%22+2-Way+Floor+Speaker+(Each)/2138273.p?id=1218310758886&skuId=2138273 they are going to be half off.

Also I think everyone should sign up for XFN becasue looking at the way they make the rookie draft on there its so easy you can trade your pick during your turn on the draft so you dont have to worry about doing it before the draft.
 
First and second trades are fine.

Is the pick involved in the third deal the pick he's getting from the Smith trade? Shouldn't it be 12th?

Deuce is just letting his longhorn colors bleed through in acquiring Benson. I think he's going to be a big step down compared to DeAngelo, but we'll see.

Let me look at AJ Green's stats
 
[quote name='Doomtime']
Is the pick involved in the third deal the pick he's getting from the Smith trade? Shouldn't it be 12th?
[/QUOTE]

See my edit. It's the 14th pick, which is the Bucs' selection, which has basically been the town bicycle of this draft.
 
If anyone has any issues with the draft picks I have listed as traded, speak now or forever hold your peace:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...BfOXJiQlVtMnc&authkey=CJWCoOQK&hl=en_US#gid=3

One outstanding issue is undetermined and conditional picks, which we haven't factored in yet. I know Cru has mentioned in the past that the Bengals should be sending a pick to the 49ers for Taylor Mays. If we are going to honor these, we need to decide which and how.
 
I wanna apologize to bv and gb if there was any hostility perceived coming from me... I'm very much against trading players in the high 90s and stacking teams because I like parody in the league and I would much rather play a "normal" team as opposed to a near pro bowl team. I'm a fierce competitor and I'm a spirited debater, so I know my intensity sometimes comes out a bit more aggressively than intended.
 
[quote name='Deuce20602']I wanna apologize to bv and gb if there was any hostility perceived coming from me... I'm very much against trading players in the high 90s and stacking teams because I like parody in the league and I would much rather play a "normal" team as opposed to a near pro bowl team. I'm a fierce competitor and I'm a spirited debater, so I know my intensity sometimes comes out a bit more aggressively than intended.[/QUOTE]

I know you mean "parity", but I do find the use of "parody" instead to be oddly fitting. ;)

I don't take it personally. It's a philosophical difference, I don't think everyone has to agree with my way of thinking on the subject, I respect everyone's right to have a different opinion.

All I ask is that we evaluate these things fairly in the context of league rules. Even if you're against high 90s guys moving, there's no rule against it at present, so we need to evaluate these things in the light of what the rules are not what we wish they were. If we want to have an "untradeables" list in future years (like an "undroppable" list in fantasy), I'm open to the idea. For the present, we need to work under the rules we have, even if we don't agree with all of them.
 
[quote name='Tanabeo']I can do this draft on the website right?[/QUOTE]

You can, but I'd really really recommend doing the draft itself on your 360 if you're able. I know people have had problems in the past drafting through the website. The interface is pretty bad.

What I do, and what most people do, is have both the website and the 360 on. Use the website for the chat function, and actually make your picks on the 360. I've found that to be very effective.
 
[quote name='Doomtime']We'll also have xbox live parties open for trade talks if anyone wants to join in.[/QUOTE]

Yes. Though I'm going to reiterate that any trade agreed to during the draft is still subject to review after it and can be overturned. So keep that in mind if you're trying to wheel and deal during the draft.
 
One outstanding issue is undetermined and conditional picks, which we haven't factored in yet. I know Cru has mentioned in the past that the Bengals should be sending a pick to the 49ers for Taylor Mays. If we are going to honor these, we need to decide which and how.[/QUOTE]


Ya I really wouldn't mind having my second rounder that the Cards traded with DRC for Kolb.

or are you talking about something completely different?
 
[quote name='bvharris']You can, but I'd really really recommend doing the draft itself on your 360 if you're able. I know people have had problems in the past drafting through the website. The interface is pretty bad.

What I do, and what most people do, is have both the website and the 360 on. Use the website for the chat function, and actually make your picks on the 360. I've found that to be very effective.[/QUOTE]

I will be at work I just want to make sure I grab a WR with my 2nd(if it doesnt get traded by draft time) and make sure I dont get a K or a P with my 3rd for the texans
 
[quote name='bvharris']It's definitely true that league vets get first choice of teams, but I'm not sure there's a way to avoid that (short of starting from scratch every year). Last year in our secondary league which I ran we did a draft of teams where the weaker players got first pick, and I think people enjoyed that a lot (though truth be told, the good players ended up winning with the bad teams anyway).[/QUOTE]

Well, I'd favor this approach (which is how we're doing it in the JV League). I can understand giving veteran players seniority, but at the same time, those are also the best players. Shouldn't these people be so into Madden that they could enjoy playing with different teams? There is a difference in good teams and bad teams. Admit it or not, it's there. I've been playing a lot of online ranked lately, and I can't do half the damage with the Titans that I can do with the Saints, Ravens, or even Falcons.

The difference makers are the things I can't control: the offensive line, DBs coverage, my QB's accuracy (I had a hilarious play with Jake Locker where I read the blitz perfectly, hot routed Cook Jr to a quick slant route across the middle, saw him all alone as I expected, and threw the ball to him quickly. The problem was Locker threw the ball about 7 yards behind Cook Jr directly at one of the DBs for an easy INT), etc. Having skill players does make a difference. Maybe certain people like Doom or Deuce are good enough to overcome having a bad team (and that speaks volumes for their skill), but I think you can attribute that more to them than to an "all teams are equal" mentality.

Ah well, it's really none of my business anymore anyway. Sorry for sidetracking the thread. Kinda just discussion for the sake of discussion. This league is very established and seems to have a very concrete way of doing things. It's definitely seemed to work for you guys though.
 
[quote name='n8rockerasu']Well, I'd favor this approach (which is how we're doing it in the JV League). I can understand giving veteran players seniority, but at the same time, those are also the best players. Shouldn't these people be so into Madden that they could enjoy playing with different teams? There is a difference in good teams and bad teams. Admit it or not, it's there. I've been playing a lot of online ranked lately, and I can't do half the damage with the Titans that I can do with the Saints, Ravens, or even Falcons.
[/QUOTE]

A lot of guys like to use their favorite teams, I think that's alright. Many of the vets have been established playing the teams they are fans of. Deuce actually switched from the Ravens to a lesser Panthers team because he's a fan, and then made the Super Bowl anyway. Part of the reason I switched to the Pats was because they're good, but 90% of it was because I'm a Pats fan.

Personally I've enjoyed the challenge of learning a new team every year. As good as the Pats are, it definitely took me some time before I got a hang of them. Offensively, I was much better as the Chargers. I might even let someone else have a crack at the Pats next year and move on to a different team.
 
[quote name='sprice8688']i wont lie i dont want duece to have aj green lol[/QUOTE]

Yeah, but the departure of Smith and Williams makes up for it. We'll see if the Carolina Cams can be led to the promiseland with their new pieces!
 
[quote name='Doomtime']Yeah, but the departure of Smith and Williams makes up for it. We'll see if the Carolina Cams can be led to the promiseland with their new pieces![/QUOTE]

I'm a bit surprised to see Deuce breaking up a Super Bowl team too, but I think the trades themselves are pretty fair. I looked at Green's ratings, and he isn't quite the beast yet in this game that he is in real life (though he's getting there).

In fact I wish I'd known he was on the block myself, since I would have made a play for him. :D Snooze you lose I guess.
 
[quote name='LVPatriots']One outstanding issue is undetermined and conditional picks, which we haven't factored in yet. I know Cru has mentioned in the past that the Bengals should be sending a pick to the 49ers for Taylor Mays. If we are going to honor these, we need to decide which and how.[/QUOTE]


Ya I really wouldn't mind having my second rounder that the Cards traded with DRC for Kolb.

or are you talking about something completely different?[/QUOTE]
 
[quote name='LVPatriots']Ya I really wouldn't mind having my second rounder that the Cards traded with DRC for Kolb.

or are you talking about something completely different?[/QUOTE]

Something different. That pick is gone. ;)

I'm talking about guys who were traded for picks in the real NFL, but what picks were involved haven't actually been disclosed.
 
[quote name='bvharris']I'm a bit surprised to see Deuce breaking up a Super Bowl team too, but I think the trades themselves are pretty fair. I looked at Green's ratings, and he isn't quite the beast yet in this game that he is in real life (though he's getting there).

In fact I wish I'd known he was on the block myself, since I would have made a play for him. :D Snooze you lose I guess.[/QUOTE]

Me too, though I know Deuce is still looking for that shutdown corner. Had there been one on Bowe, the game would have gone differently.
 
I think trade 3 is acceptable. After evaluating the draft class, it will produce a WR equal or better and Cedric just did not produce as I wanted him to. DWilliams and the 12th and 14th DP should be able to produce something much greater if not equal to what was lost.

P.S. - I vote to void the undetermined and conditional picks option
 
[quote name='Doomtime']Me too, though I know Deuce is still looking for that shutdown corner. Had there been one on Bowe, the game would have gone differently.[/QUOTE]

I wonder if I could have swayed him on the Roddy deal by dangling McCourty. :D

Not that I'd ever do that. McCourty is the one player on my team I consider to be 100% untouchable in any trade.
 
i wasnt planning on it at first but after really sitting back and looking at the team, i want a corner to overtake, or at least compliment Chris Gamble... i wasnt gonna get that with the #31 pick. I decided that moving Smitty was probably my best option. When nobody was biting on that, i remembered that DeAngelo was hurt for most of the regular season but up until he got hurt, he had amassed 1300+ yards but for all the yards he got, he only had maybe 3 runs over 25 yards. I made it to the SB without him and when he made his long-awaited return, he fizzled. So that told me the Cam Newton was the driving force in my offense... him and Greg Olsen (Ballhawk and Cru can attest to that:D). With Newton at the helm, it doesnt matter too much who my receivers are as long as they catch the ball. Superstar PM'd me about Smitty, and his 14th pick was high enough for me to get a CB that i had my eye on... until i checked his potential. After seeing that, i lost some interest in having that high of a pick for a corner that wouldn't be what i expected him to be. So i sifted thru the rosters after the deal with the Cards broke down (DeAngelo was almost shipped to ARI for Beanie Wells, and Tracy Porter), i saw three teams that could upgrade at RB and still give me something to work with in return... Buffalo, Indy, and the Bengals. I PMd the Bills about CJ Spiller and a WR named Easly... then the Zero about Addai and Garcon... the Bengals were last cuz i figured he wasnt trading Green but he responded first and actually came across as enthused about DWill... and Green would be better than any WR OR CB that i got with that 14th pick so it made sense. I ran with Benson last year and i'm comfortable enough with Mike Goodson as my speed back that DeAngelo was expendable so it was welcome to Carolina AJ Green... gives Cam 4 BIG pass catchers (Gettis is 6'3, Green is 6'4, Naanee is 6'2, and Olsen is 6'5).... good luck to the opposing secondaries I face in the upcoming season

Sidenote... Smitty barely eclipsed 1000 yards receiving with Greg Olsen stealing looks from Newton as the season progressed. I recognized that i'm at my best moving the ball when i'm not taking shots deep down the field and with Steve Smith on the outside, it's toooooooo tempting to look out there every other pass play. I'm sure i'll still get opportunities to go deep but it wont be as often, meaning Cam wont throw 21 INTs this year :D
 
[quote name='ballhawk20']I really interested in a mid to early 1st rd pick so everyone in tht range look at my saints n offer me something asap!![/QUOTE]

It's not mid to early, but since the White deal is in limbo, your pick is back on the table if you're still interested.
 
Also, I'm back now and trying to respond to PMs. I'm working on possible deals for McCoy, but haven't heard anything about Hillis. I'm looking for LBs and picks, but really I have needs everywhere.
 
After all the talk, it will be amusing if the Patriots do absolutely nothing before the draft. I'm still fielding offers on Green-Ellis if anyone is interested. I'm also not totally opposed to moving Aaron Hernandez, though it would take a lot.
 
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