Madden 12 League-OFFICIAL CAG LEAGUE-Week 3 live. Deadline Monday night.

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[quote name='bvharris']That was my take at well. Of course when I heard they extended him at first I laughed, but then I actually looked at the deal. They're only tied to him for the same two years they were anyways and they lowered his cap number. Not a bad deal, though I still don't think he's the answer long term at QB.[/QUOTE]

I don't think many people do at this point. The front office/coach won't admit that of course, but there's not much they can do for the next couple years anyways.

[quote name='BSETI50']the jets screwed up, they had a good thing goin with mangini. wins and losses may not have shown it, but he was bringin in good players until favre basically ruined it. i though kellen clemens had potential i really did. and even if he didnt they didnt give him a fair shot, they just handed everything to sanchez thats why he sucks cuz he never had to earn shit. the jets are going downhill, i just look at it as rex ryan brought mangini's team to the afc champiionship two years in a row now the teams turning into his team and they are kaka.[/QUOTE]

Comment of the year :applause: I can't believe you're saying Eric Mangini was the key to the Jets success after he left. Is this the Ewing theory on drugs? I will admit that the Jets under Mangini did great in the draft. But beyond that their signings and deals were below average at best (I loved the Jenkins signing, that may have been his best move off the top of my head, but he could never stay on the field). I don't think Rex Ryan would deal Vilma for nothing just because he wasn't a 3-4 LB. He would find a way to use him. A big key to those 2 playoff runs was Ryan's defensive schemes and the players he brought over from Baltimore.

Kellen Clemens? This must be some elite form of sarcasm. You don't think Clemens would have caught on somewhere by now if he was so good? He couldn't stick with the Redskins when John Beck was their starter. He was passed over for Jeff Garcia and T.J. Yates in Houston! He started the majority of the 4-12 season. Mangini's second year. If either of them were the answer then why did they show quite the opposite that year?
 
[quote name='ubernes']. A big key to those 2 playoff runs was Ryan's defensive schemes and the players he brought over from Baltimore.

this is why its awesome being a ravens fan... since 2000 so many defenders came and left but we still run shit on defense.... not to mention the ravens can actually beat the giants unlike the the 0 and 2 pats! :)
 
Vilma is not a 3-4 mlb, its not madden, if u can't do ur job ya gotta go. He sucked in mangini's defense therefore he had no value, and with david harris anothr mangini pick there was no room for a mlb who doesn't fit the scheme with a bad knee.
 
[quote name='BSETI50']Vilma is not a 3-4 mlb, its not madden, if u can't do ur job ya gotta go. He sucked in mangini's defense therefore he had no value, and with david harris anothr mangini pick there was no room for a mlb who doesn't fit the scheme with a bad knee.[/QUOTE]

damn son i was hoping to get a kick out of u wit my comment lol
 
[quote name='BSETI50'] i though kellen clemens had potential i really did. and even if he didnt they didnt give him a fair shot, they just handed everything to sanchez thats why he sucks cuz he never had to earn shit.[/QUOTE]

This is such a flawed claim. It doesn't matter how they "handed" everythIng to Sanchez. They believed he was an upgrade to Clemens. You act like he never got a chance, they started him for over half the season the year before Sanchez and decided he wasn't the future. As for Sanchez being handed everything, isn't that the case for all top 5 QBs? Peyton, Matt Ryan, Stafford, etc. all were handed the position without having to earn it first and are all at least moderately successful. And for me, I don't really like the Pats or the Jets. But at least I'll acknowledge that the deal gives them the best chance to determine the future of Sanchez.
 
trade alert
wr sidney rice 90 ovr a pot 27
cb alphonso smitg 78 b pot 28
3rd rouns pick
for giants
cb p amukamara a pot 25 93 ovr
wr mario manningham 29 82 ovr
 
Trade Alert

Lions send to Giants
WR Sydney Rice OVR 90 POT A AGE 27
CB Alphonso Smith OVR 78 POT B AGE 28
3rd round pick

Giants send to Lions
CB P. Amukamara OVR 93 POT A AGE 25
WR Mario Manningham OVR 82 POT B AGE 29
 
[quote name='sprice8688']trade alert
wr sidney rice 90 ovr a pot 27
cb alphonso smitg 78 b pot 28
3rd rouns pick
for giants
cb p amukamara a pot 25 93 ovr
wr mario manningham 29 82 ovr[/QUOTE]

Actually I just realized this will put me over the core player max, I messaged sprice8688 to see if we can come to a different agreement. Hopefully a revised trade coming soon.
 
[quote name='KasterDB']This is such a flawed claim. It doesn't matter how they "handed" everythIng to Sanchez. They believed he was an upgrade to Clemens. You act like he never got a chance, they started him for over half the season the year before Sanchez and decided he wasn't the future. As for Sanchez being handed everything, isn't that the case for all top 5 QBs? Peyton, Matt Ryan, Stafford, etc. all were handed the position without having to earn it first and are all at least moderately successful. And for me, I don't really like the Pats or the Jets. But at least I'll acknowledge that the deal gives them the best chance to determine the future of Sanchez.[/QUOTE]


The year before sanchez was favre wasn't it?? I just think clemons got shfted in ny, first favre shafted him then sanchez. Yea he probbaly would have sucked too but ya can't be much worse, nor more of a douch than marky sanchez. If I was a jet fan id be most bummed bout penningtons career. He was nice.
 
[quote name='sprice8688']trade alert
wr sidney rice 90 ovr a pot 27
cb alphonso smitg 78 b pot 28
3rd rouns pick
for giants
cb p amukamara a pot 25 93 ovr
wr mario manningham 29 82 ovr[/QUOTE]
changed to just rice for amukamara
 
[quote name='BSETI50']The year before sanchez was favre wasn't it?? I just think clemons got shfted in ny, first favre shafted him then sanchez. Yea he probbaly would have sucked too but ya can't be much worse, nor more of a douch than marky sanchez. If I was a jet fan id be most bummed bout penningtons career. He was nice.[/QUOTE]

I forgot about Favre, I try to make that a habit ;)
 
[quote name='BSETI50']The year before sanchez was favre wasn't it?? I just think clemons got shfted in ny, first favre shafted him then sanchez. Yea he probbaly would have sucked too but ya can't be much worse, nor more of a douch than marky sanchez. If I was a jet fan id be most bummed bout penningtons career. He was nice.[/QUOTE]

I don't understand how a guy is given the keys to the team, goes 4-12 and then loses his job and he gets "shafted." It's not like he never was given a chance, he was given an entire season. And won 3 games (the 1st game was won before Pennington got hurt, if I'm not mistaken).

Clearly you're biased here, which is fine. But most of us here are able to shelf our own biases when having these types of conversations. Nothing you've said so far makes sense, or gives any credit to the claim that Clemens is a good QB, got shafted or that Eric Mangini was even an above average coach.

For the record, I liked what Mangini was doing while he was here but it was time for him to leave when he did. I almost feel bad his last season was the Favre experiment gone wrong, but it's not like he helped his case the season prior. If he didn't go 4-12 and Clemens showed something, I really doubt Favre would have ever been signed to the Jets in the first place.
 
[quote name='Blade3D']Trade Alert

Lions send to the Giants

WR Sydney Rice OVR 90 POT A AGE 27

Giants send to the Lions

CB P. Amukamara OVR 93 POT A AGE 25[/QUOTE]

looks good to me...
 
[quote name='Blade3D']Trade Alert

Lions send to the Giants

WR Sydney Rice OVR 90 POT A AGE 27

Giants send to the Lions

CB P. Amukamara OVR 93 POT A AGE 25[/QUOTE]

This is close enough for me. BV can weigh in as well, of course. 2 years and 3 points isn't a huge deal and CBs aren't as valuable as they were in Madden 11.
 
If anyone is interested in getting rid of a 2nd round pick, take a look at my roster and hit me up.

I am at the core limit (pending Rice trade) so no one over 79 is available.
 
[quote name='Blade3D']Trade Alert

Lions send to the Giants

WR Sydney Rice OVR 90 POT A AGE 27

Giants send to the Lions

CB P. Amukamara OVR 93 POT A AGE 25[/QUOTE]

[quote name='ubernes']This is close enough for me. BV can weigh in as well, of course. 2 years and 3 points isn't a huge deal and CBs aren't as valuable as they were in Madden 11.[/QUOTE]

Not yet there for me. Amukamara is a much more valuable player than Rice, a good deal more so than the 3 point difference would indicate. 93 Speed, 99 man, 96 zone, 88 press - he's an elite corner at this point.

Rice is certainly a very nice receiver, but what really kills his value for me is his 65 injury rating. As the owner of several players with ratings that low, I can tell you that Rice is going to have a very difficult time staying on the field. His low carry rating is not inspiring of confidence either, but it's not completely horrendous for a WR.

Anyway, I'd need more to be coming from the Lions before I could sign off on this deal. I don't really understand the reason Blade would do this deal anyway. I mean, it's your team man but you already have a decent receiving corps and now AP, why would you trade away by far your best CB - a position you're not very deep at to begin with?
 
[quote name='GpNinja']Just a friendly reminder hope everybody took in the time change in affect for tonights draft.:bouncy:[/QUOTE]

Don't remind me. I have to go hop on a bike and ride to 3 hours of basketball games in a minute. Not sure I'm going to even make it out of the house. :drool:
 
Btw I just started a new job so my hours of availability will be much different from now on. No more weekdays off really. Up till now I could basically play whenever since days I did work I was home by noon. Now I'm basically on a 9-5 schedule so nights will most likely be gametime for me. Plus I won't be able to access the thread while at work so don't expect immediate responses from me during the day when trying to setup games.j
 
[quote name='bvharris']Not yet there for me. Amukamara is a much more valuable player than Rice, a good deal more so than the 3 point difference would indicate. 93 Speed, 99 man, 96 zone, 88 press - he's an elite corner at this point.

Rice is certainly a very nice receiver, but what really kills his value for me is his 65 injury rating. As the owner of several players with ratings that low, I can tell you that Rice is going to have a very difficult time staying on the field. His low carry rating is not inspiring of confidence either, but it's not completely horrendous for a WR.

Anyway, I'd need more to be coming from the Lions before I could sign off on this deal. I don't really understand the reason Blade would do this deal anyway. I mean, it's your team man but you already have a decent receiving corps and now AP, why would you trade away by far your best CB - a position you're not very deep at to begin with?[/QUOTE]
rice played every game for me last yr and put up great numbers and i think 17 tds..... stafford also has a low injury rating and has not missed 1 game since weve been playing thats an lame excuse to block my trade
 
[quote name='sprice8688']rice played every game for me last yr and put up great numbers and i think 17 tds..... stafford also has a low injury rating and has not missed 1 game since weve been playing thats an lame excuse to block my trade[/QUOTE]

The numbers he put up for you don't affect his value to the Giants. Just because he wasn't injured for you doesn't change what his injury rating is, nor does Stafford's injury rating enter into it.

Whether you think it's lame or not, I don't approve the current iteration of the trade. You can either re-work it or not, up to you.
 
sometimes ur a power hungry dick being commisioner... i thought it was about the majoritys vote.. this right here is y everyone hates on ur trades... u always think ur trades are reasonable but feel everyone elses need work
 
[quote name='sprice8688']i thought it was about the majoritys vote..[/QUOTE]

You thought wrong. Uber and I need to sign off on all trades, that's been true of every trade ever put through in the franchise. Of the ten or so trades in this offseason, I've raised objections with exactly two of them - this one and the Jets-Bucs deal, which they re-worked.

Your trade isn't fair. You think I'm wrong? Offer Sydney Rice straight up for every other elite CB (which Amukamara is) in the league and see how many people take you up on it.

You can resort to name calling all you want, you can not imagine how little your insults bother me.

Throw a pity party for yourself if you want, or re-work the trade, that's your call.
 
[quote name='bvharris'][quote name='sprice8688']i thought it was about the majoritys vote../QUOTE]

You thought wrong.

Your trade isn't fair. You think I'm wrong? Offer Sydney Rice straight up for every other elite CB (which Amukamara is) in the league and see how many people take you up on it.

You can resort to name calling all you want, you can not imagine how little your insults bother me.

Throw a pity party for yourself if you want, or re-work the trade, that's your call.[/QUOTE]

lol watever man...out of all people duece would of bashed it if it was that unfair..... y does every other trade get wieghed in upon everybody then if ur then only one who matters? ill talk to blade either way if i added a 3 rd pick does that help ur majesty?
 
[quote name='sprice8688']lol watever man...out of all people duece would of bashed it if it was that unfair..... y does every other trade get wieghed in upon everybody then if ur then only one who matters? ill talk to blade either way if i added a 3 rd pick does that help ur majesty?[/QUOTE]

Man, people get so worked up over this crap. Try to have some class, Mr. Super Bowl champ. Winning doesn't mean you can shit all over the people who run the league. For the record, I think the trade is a little imbalanced. Blade isn't getting a good enough return for one of the best cornerbacks in the league.
 
it has nothing to do witg the super bowl... 2 people said ok and bv denied.. everyone should be able to give there opinion before it gets turned down.... people get worked up because so many people get bogus trades that go thru.. our origional tradr didnt work out cause of his cap limit... i dont really see y ur judging me cause i won the superbowl and im not shitting on anyone i would like to have my trade looked over by everyone and then have the results not have 2 okays and a deny because hes co commish... i want ma and doom and most of the other regulars say wat they think is that wrong?
 
id be fine with it if detroit threw in a 3rd rounder as long as blade is ok with it. we all may not agree with blade, but as long as the trade is fair and both parties agree it should be fine right?
 
[quote name='BSETI50']id be fine with it if detroit threw in a 3rd rounder as long as blade is ok with it. we all may not agree with blade, but as long as the trade is fair and both parties agree it should be fine right?[/QUOTE]

thank you
 
[quote name='sprice8688']it has nothing to do witg the super bowl... 2 people said ok and bv denied.. everyone should be able to give there opinion before it gets turned down.... people get worked up because so many people get bogus trades that go thru.. our origional tradr didnt work out cause of his cap limit... i dont really see y ur judging me cause i won the superbowl and im not shitting on anyone i would like to have my trade looked over by everyone and then have the results not have 2 okays and a deny because hes co commish... i want ma and doom and most of the other regulars say wat they think is that wrong?[/QUOTE]

If you would calm down and actually read my posts on it you'd see that I haven't killed the trade, just asked you to re-work it. Nowhere will you find "there's no way I will allow you to trade Rice for Prince", just that I think the current trade is imbalanced and needs work.

You're welcome to make your argument for why you think the trade is fair, after all that's something I myself do - quite vigorously - every time I make a trade. I'm not inflexible - if you can convince me it's a fair deal using rational arguments and not name calling than that's fine.

What's not acceptable is the personal attacks. I can't and won't censor what you say in the thread - but I assure you it reflects poorly on you, not on me.
 
personally i think we should have a trade committee. not that bv or uber are always wrong or anything, but its kind of a conflict of interest. bv u may not try to, but u do come off as a power hungry dick sometimes. i think if say we put MA and someone else in charge of all trades it would relieve tension and a lot of hostility towards the commishs. people would stop complaining about ur trades bv (including me) because its completely out of ur control whether it gets approved. just a thought not trying to start any shit here
 
[quote name='BSETI50']personally i think we should have a trade committee. not that bv or uber are always wrong or anything, but its kind of a conflict of interest. bv u may not try to, but u do come off as a power hungry dick sometimes. i think if say we put MA and someone else in charge of all trades it would relieve tension and a lot of hostility towards the commishs. people would stop complaining about ur trades bv (including me) because its completely out of ur control whether it gets approved. just a thought not trying to start any shit here[/QUOTE]

this isnt the first time this idea has been put out there and just like last time, i agree with the idea of a 3 or 5 person panel
 
i mean i know u dont try to come off as a dick i just think its natural for a commish. look at goodell he comes off as the biggest asshole in the world, im sure hes a nice guy tho
 
[quote name='sprice8688']bv does a 3rd make it better. [/QUOTE]

Better, but still not enough in my opinion, I think Blade needs to be getting another player back, not just a draft pick (as we've discussed a bunch, this is a pretty shallow draft). If Smith was still in the deal I'd probably look more kindly on it.

I think all league vets (including you) would agree that if #1 CBs aren't the most valuable resource in this league, they're pretty close to the top of the list. So when a CB as talented as Amukamura in in a deal, it deserves both additional scrutiny and a damned good return on the value.

I'd also like to hear Blade's thoughts/rationale on the deal - especially since he's a new player in the league. Having him making the case for the deal along with you would go a long way.
 
[quote name='BSETI50']people would stop complaining about ur trades bv (including me) because its completely out of ur control whether it gets approved. just a thought not trying to start any shit here[/QUOTE]

It's already completely out of my control whether my deals get approved. Always has been. Same for uber and his deals.

As for a trade committee, we basically already have one in a de facto sense - I've never straight-out vetoed a trade, and there are plenty of times I've objected to one but let it through anyway because uber or the consensus likes it. The current system leads to plenty of hand-wringing and arguing, but what doesn't in this league? If we had an official committee, people would still argue.. That's just what we do. We're not going to implement any wide-sweeping changes this late in the league, if it ain't broke don't fix it.
 
[quote name='BSETI50']i mean i know u dont try to come off as a dick i just think its natural for a commish. look at goodell he comes off as the biggest asshole in the world, im sure hes a nice guy tho[/QUOTE]

the standard for a dickish commisioner is David Stern...
 
[quote name='Deuce20602']the standard for a dickish commisioner is David Stern...[/QUOTE]

Hang on, Gary Bettman can't get a free pass here :D

I'm fine with the Prince/Rice trade if a third rounder is added.
 
[quote name='bvharris']It's already completely out of control whether my deals get approved. Always has been. Same for uber and his deals.[/QUOTE]

no it isnt tho because when u have a trade up in the air, all other trades seem to go thru twice as quick and easy. but when u dont it seems u pick at every trade. i know ur response to this will be "come up with evidence" but i dont have the energy or time to search the thread on my phone so i will just rely on people agreeing with me....im completely in favor of a committee. im also in favor of a salary cap in next years madden, which will elimanate all the bullshit trades
 
I'm going to be out of touch all afternoon, I'm running a softball practice. I'll be back in plenty of time to deal with any league business before the draft.

For the Rice/Prince deal, the most important thing for me at this point is to hear from Blade, specifically his rationale on the deal. I know in other cases where I thought one side was getting the clear advantage, it's helped a lot to hear the other side's defense of the deal.
 
[quote name='bvharris']If you would calm down and actually read my posts on it you'd see that I haven't killed the trade, just asked you to re-work it. Nowhere will you find "there's no way I will allow you to trade Rice for Prince", just that I think the current trade is imbalanced and needs work.

You're welcome to make your argument for why you think the trade is fair, after all that's something I myself do - quite vigorously - every time I make a trade. I'm not inflexible - if you can convince me it's a fair deal using rational arguments and not name calling than that's fine.

What's not acceptable is the personal attacks. I can't and won't censor what you say in the thread - but I assure you it reflects poorly on you, not on me.[/QUOTE]

i aint attacking u i just want a fair vote. sidny rice is an awesome wr.. u said i cant weigh it on wat he accomplished for me so how can i argue his talent besides wat he did for me... i look at it like this with him dallas strong stoped getting as many passes and my defense was high in passong yards i think 24th last yr.... if u wanna do statistics amakamura really hasnt dont much over the past 3 seasons but his stats are awesome.. i could.use a good cb as anyone could... but for me sidny rice was a beast and helped get me to the superbowl had a big game in the superbowl and played everygame all yr long....
 
[quote name='BSETI50']no it isnt tho because when u have a trade up in the air, all other trades seem to go thru twice as quick and easy. but when u dont it seems u pick at every trade.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, it's just not true. I'm not going to waste my time arguing with you.

BSETI, I'll lay it out like this: I don't really care whether you approve of my performance as commissioner or not. I pour too much time and energy into this league to allow myself to get rattled by people who only seem to want to be negative. I work for this league for hundreds of hours a year for precious little thanks, and while I certainly don't need your congratulations, at the very least I'd appreciate if you'd not devote your entire existence in the league to trying to undermine half the things I do. That's your call though, you're free to say whatever you want.

If you really hate my performance so much, nobody is stopping you from making your own league where you can run things the way you think they should be run instead.
 
[quote name='sprice8688']i aint attacking u i just want a fair vote. sidny rice is an awesome wr.. u said i cant weigh it on wat he accomplished for me so how can i argue his talent besides wat he did for me... i look at it like this with him dallas strong stoped getting as many passes and my defense was high in passong yards i think 24th last yr.... if u wanna do statistics amakamura really hasnt dont much over the past 3 seasons but his stats are awesome.. i could.use a good cb as anyone could... but for me sidny rice was a beast and helped get me to the superbowl had a big game in the superbowl and played everygame all yr long....[/QUOTE]

You did attack me. It's right there in print. Like I said though, I don't care what negative things you have to say about me, it's a free country.

Setting that aside, I never told you that you can't use his ratings and stats to argue - just that it doesn't affect what his value to the Giants would be. You run the best passing offense in the league by a wide margin, I fully believe you could put up big passing numbers with any old scrub.

As for his injury rating, my point was that just saying "he wasn't injured for me" doesn't change what his injury rating is. It's a static value, and it's part of the package he brings to the table. So considering his injury rating as part of the deal is just as fair as considering any other stat, no?
 
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