McCain suspends campaign to "focus on economy" - delay debates

[quote name='depascal22']Any chance a 3rd party gets enough votes this time to get some real change going?[/QUOTE]

Every poll iv seen has shown no more then 3% for Nader and Babar the Elephant
 
[quote name='depascal22']Any chance a 3rd party gets enough votes this time to get some real change going?[/quote]

:lol:

In all honesty, a third party needs to attack city councils and weak congressional districts to become a real force.

Power flows from the people, not the government.
 
[quote name='depascal22']Any chance a 3rd party gets enough votes this time to get some real change going?[/quote]

Probably about the same chance as Palin has being attacked by witches..

(if you click the link you will see that there is no chance, since she has a +10 magic spell of protection on her)
 
[quote name='depascal22']Any chance a 3rd party gets enough votes this time to get some real change going?[/QUOTE]

About the same chance as Gears of War coming out on the PS3.
 
So apparently they had reached agreement until Mighty Mouse McCain swooped in to spring an entirely separate proposal by a small group of extreme right Republicans. Let's hear it for bipartisanship and compromise! SOOOO glad he showed up to help move things along.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']There's about it here:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/09/25/AR2008092500268.html?hpid=topnews

No details though.[/quote]

Rep. Shelby of Alabama seems to be one of the boneheads leading the charge to keep any deal from going through. I watched him on CNN earlier this evening and he was waving around a letter (the same letter he mentions in the above piece) "signed by 200 leading economists and thinkers" disparaging the Paulson plan (not the new plan they've been hammering out for two days -- the original plan floated by Paulson a week ago). Well NO SHIT. Pretty much everyone in the universe disparaged the Paulson plan. It was utter bullshit. That's why Democratic and Republican members of the Senate Banking Committee and the House Financial Services Committee have been locked in a room for the last two days trying to come up with a better plan. And by all accounts (including the involved Republicans), they had done that. But then McCain spends the afternoon riling up the House Republicans just in time to deep six the deal.

So with the scorched earth part of his plan successful, now I suppose McCain's plan is to try and shoehorn himself into any new negotiations (keeping in mind he has no involvement whatsoever with the Democratic and Republican members of the Senate Banking Committee and the House Financial Services Committee -- nor does Obama or Biden, for that matter).

There is only one word for this: GRANDSTANDING.
 
Curiously, has the Section 8 (I think that's the name of it) part of the bill been stripped? The one where Paulson gets to ride the LOLercoaster whenever he wants
 
Let me add this as well, because this is the only actual description I've read or heard of what actually went down in the meeting. It comes from an account given by Paul Begala on Larry King just now, who obviously is a biased source, but again, it's the ONLY account out there right now:

Meeting takes place in the cabinet room of the White House. All members of the Senate Banking Committee and the House Financial Services Committee are there, along with Paulson, Speaker Pelosi, Harry Reid, House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer, House Minority Leader John A. Boehner, the aforementioned Rep. Shelby, and of course McCain and Obama (at opposite ends of the table, natch).

Bush makes a statement opening the meeting, then the press is ushered out.

It is traditional for the Speaker of the House to speak first, since she is the highest ranking person in the room after the president. Pelosi cedes the floor to Obama, who is tapped to articulate the Democratic position on the bailout.

Obama lays out the requirements he has been talking about all week that have been, by all accounts, worked into the deal (oversight, cap on CEO salaries, guarantees on return of taxpayer investment). Incidentally, these are pretty much the same things McCain claimed he wanted.

It's now the Republicans turn to speak, so Obama throws it to McCain. McCain says "I believe in traditional rules of seniority, so I'm going to defer to Sen. Boehner." MCCAIN THEN DOES NOT SPEAK FOR THE NEXT 43 MINUTES.

Boehner floats a previously unheard of plan devised by House Republicans involving private mortgage insurance and a cut in the capital gains tax.

Obama asks Boehner (or anyone else) for more details on this plan. Boehner has none and concedes they haven't even put anything on paper.

Obama asks Paulson if this alternate plan, as roughly outlined, will work.

Paulson says no way.

During this time Shelby basically says "we ain't doin' this, no way, no how," waves his precious letter around, and throws the whole meeting into chaos before walking out in a huff.

Obama at one point interrupts and directly asks McCain for his opinion since he has said nothing the entire time (after ostensibly flying up here for the sole purpose of successfully shepherding a bailout plan through). McCain hems and haws for all of two minutes, saying he might support the House Republican plan but he doesn't really know.

Everyone walks out pissed.

Way to lead, Maverick!

EDIT: Augmented with some details from the Washington Post.
 
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Ok, so takin' bets here:

Is the debate gonna happen?
Is there going to be NO debate, and will we be forced to vote for a candidate based on their campaigning?

WOOOT.
 
The debate will happen. Count on it. Despite the posturing, McCain simply cannot allow Obama a 90-minute open floor with a national audience. He would also end up looking like a coward or a fool. It would be a disaster for his campaign.
 
[quote name='Tybee']The debate will happen. Count on it. Despite the posturing, McCain simply cannot allow Obama a 90-minute open floor with a national audience. He would also end up looking like a coward or a fool. It would be a disaster for his campaign.[/QUOTE]

Actually, it's illegal for them to allow him an open-floor. It's considered offering support to one specific campagin by the government.

What McCain can't afford is, like you said, to look like he's too afraid to debate, or that he's "just too busy".
 
Called it.

Watching CNN. He just officially announced he'll show up. He's headed to the airport to fly down now.

Anyway you look at it, this stunt blew up in his face. He got nothing he wanted, he had either zero impact or completely derailed the bailout negotiations depending on who you listen to, and Obama called his bluff and now he has to show at a debate he has not prepared for. On top of everything, he looks irrational, petty, and ineffective. WHOOPS.
 
[quote name='Tybee']Called it.

Watching CNN. He just officially announced he'll show up. He's headed to the airport to fly down now.[/quote]

Hahaha! :lol:
 
Reality's Fringe;4903841]Actually said:
Not true. Once one candidate welshes on the agreed upon terms of the debate, all bets are off. The terms were set. Obama adhered. McCain tried to force the commission and Obama to do what HE wanted. They would not. Therefore, the commission was free to do whatever it wanted, which looked like it would have been a town hall of some sort.
Click to expand...
 
Good point from The National Review:

A Hostile Audience [Rich Lowry]

One side effect of McCain's debate gambit is, I'm told, that everyone at Ole Miss now hates him. It will make for a very hostile audience tonight among those students and faculty attending. He might have to apologize for creating the uncertainty or make some explanation up front, which is never ideal.
Click to expand...
This fits with what I've been seeing on CNN. I've seen a lot of interviews with many Ole Miss officials, Mississippi politicians (including the governor, who is a McCain supporter), students, and locals, who identify themselves as McCain supporters. They all said something along the lines of "I actually support McCain's campaign, but what he has done to us is wrong. How dare he?"

He's gonna have a hard road to hoe tonight.
 
[quote name='cochesecochese']He could always pull an Oprah and give out a free Wii and a salon day to everyone in the audience.[/quote]


haha.. just picturing it.. Mccain saying "before we begin... can everyone look under your seats..I've left a surprise to make up for me being a asshat"
 
[FONT=verdana, arial, helvetica]McCain continues to look like a moron. How can people vote for this duttering old fool?

According to reports from people in the meeting yesterday, all McCain did was sit there and spoke for maybe a minute or two. WOW WASHINGTON SURE FELT YOUR PRESENCE MCCAIN! What decade is this dolt from?[/FONT]
 
[quote name='fatherofcaitlyn']According to Rush, Obama screwed the deal.

Hmm.

I wonder how Rush saw that closed door meeting.[/quote]

All the drugs he did made him clairvoyant.

The McCain camp line is that Obama caused everything to go south because he had the audacity to speak and ask questions in the meeting, whereas McCain was "presidential" and "bipartisan" because he listened to everyone without being rude and injecting his own ideas.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

Obama wasn't the one running hither and thither yesterday afternoon, whipping up House Republicans and encouraging them to dream up this psychotic deal of theirs and then spring it in this meeting.

And wasn't it McCain who called for Obama to show up in the first place, when Obama was content to leave things to the parties that had already achieved a deal?
 
Actually, he said he made a call to people. And that Obama became the de facto Democratic party leader for the discussions.

This morning I heard there was a shouting match at that discussion.
 
[quote name='fatherofcaitlyn']According to Rush, Obama screwed the deal.

Hmm.

I wonder how Rush saw that closed door meeting.[/QUOTE]


of course he did.
 
[quote name='Tybee']All the drugs he did made him clairvoyant.

The McCain camp line is that Obama caused everything to go south because he had the audacity to speak and ask questions in the meeting, whereas McCain was "presidential" and "bipartisan" because he listened to everyone without being rude and injecting his own ideas.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

Obama wasn't the one running hither and thither yesterday afternoon, whipping up House Republicans and encouraging them to dream up this psychotic deal of theirs and then spring it in this meeting.

And wasn't it McCain who called for Obama to show up in the first place, when Obama was content to leave things to the parties that had already achieved a deal?[/QUOTE]

What McCain "had" from House Republicans was a letter to Santa asking for more tax cuts and even more deregulation.

It was supposedly pretty disgusting.
 
If I didn't listen to Rush, none of you would. Of course, I was playing Flatout 2 at the time. The people in the cars I was ramming were in less pain than me.
 
[quote name='Capitalizt'][FONT=verdana, arial, helvetica]McCain continues to look like a moron. How can people vote for this duttering old fool?
[/QUOTE]

I know about a dozen people that plan to vote for McCain. Not one of them likes him, nor would they disagree with your keen assessment of him.
 
[quote name='FloodsAreUponUS']America is Racist.

That is the secret reason McCain is going to win.[/QUOTE]

Probaly but I have hope. I live in Ohio in a small rural town where you would think racism would run rampant. Iv seen like 4 Obama/Biden signs and not a single McCain one yet. Iv also heard a number of people saying positive things about Obama while out and about or linking McCain to Bush. Small stuff but it gives me hope.
 
I fully expect Obama to win this election. I'd bet on it if I had money.

But that said, if he loses, cries of Racism and/or election stealing will be heard from here until Romney's presidency in 2012.
 
[quote name='MSI Magus']Probaly but I have hope. I live in Ohio in a small rural town where you would think racism would run rampant. Iv seen like 4 Obama/Biden signs and not a single McCain one yet. Iv also heard a number of people saying positive things about Obama while out and about or linking McCain to Bush. Small stuff but it gives me hope.[/quote]

I live in a small VA town, and I see about 5 McCain signs for every 1 Obama Sign. It worries me. I should take a picture of the gun store that is littered with McCain signs. This is also a town where we had a KKK rally about 5 years ago.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']I fully expect Obama to win this election. I'd bet on it if I had money.

But that said, if he loses, cries of Racism and/or election stealing will be heard from here until Romney's presidency in 2012.[/quote]

Isn't that statement by itself racist? :lol:

Obama just can't be too aggressive nor too passive. If he is too aggressive they will just spin it into another "Obama is an angry, disrespectful uppity $$$$er" ad campaign. Although they will probably do that anyway.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']I fully expect Obama to win this election. I'd bet on it if I had money.

But that said, if he loses, cries of Racism and/or election stealing will be heard from here until Romney's presidency in 2012.[/quote]

If you're feeling so confident, you could always do a ban bet.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']I fully expect Obama to win this election. I'd bet on it if I had money.

But that said, if he loses, cries of Racism and/or election stealing will be heard from here until Romney's presidency in 2012.[/QUOTE]

Whenever a president thats really unpopular has historically lost, the economy is in the tank and people in general feel we need change. How the fuck could you not think race played a large roll in it? Iv freaking heard people, including in my own family say they wont vote for him because he is black.

Thrust I know your head is up your ass on alot of issues like this one but come on seriously? If Obama was white he would be an instant win and you either fucking know it or your in denial.
 
If my head is up my ass sometimes, it's in order to try and understand what you're saying a lot of the time.

I never said racism doesn't exist. I never said people weren't going to vote for Obama for racist reasons. Did I? You're putting so many words in my mouth, as usual, I am having trouble figuring out what those words are trying to say....

I simply stated that if Obama loses, people will cry racism eternal. Trying to decipher your post, I guess you agree. So? Why the attack?
 
MSI's onto something.

There's something to be said about race relations in the US currently when you have someone the caliber of Obama and the caliber of McCain, the cultural/economic issues we're dealing with, and that the race was/is close.

I do think it's a very age-graded difference, though. Older folks are more likely to not vote based on race and also more willing to bring it up as an issue. I wouldn't suggest younger folks are "less racist," but that some of the cultural environment they've grown up in has less institutional racism involved in it now. Remember: if you're 44 or older, you grew up when Jim Crow laws were in effect. Wasn't all that long ago.

I think there's also a confluence of the "he's a secret muslim" banter that's covert racism in action. Like you can find patterned discrimination in job applications that favor a guy names "John" over a guy names "Jamal." It's racism, but pinpointing the discriminatory act as obvious or intended is next to impossible.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']If my head is up my ass sometimes, it's in order to try and understand what you're saying a lot of the time.

I never said racism doesn't exist. I never said people weren't going to vote for Obama for racist reasons. Did I? You're putting so many words in my mouth, as usual, I am having trouble figuring out what those words are trying to say....

I simply stated that if Obama loses, people will cry racism eternal. Trying to decipher your post, I guess you agree. So? Why the attack?[/QUOTE]

When you sit and say shit like if he doesnt win people are going to cry racism till 2012(when you say Romney a man who you have to have your head somewhere unpleasenet to support)then you freaking imply that Racism wont be the biggest reason he lost. Again thats just freaking stupid.
 
So...how many 1 liners and zingers are Obama and McCain expected to have tonight? Supposedly they're going to spend a few minutes first on the economy.
 
[quote name='freakyzeeky']LOL, supposedly his campaign says he's already won tonight's debate. :lol:

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/thefix/2008/09/mccain_wins_debate.html[/QUOTE]

deweyobama.jpg
 
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