Mods lock please or move to Vs board

The crosses? Big deal, the majority of the United States is some form of Christian. If that is going to be your barometer for people, you might have quite a problem in most of the Western World. Besides, I like the æsthetics of the cross only. I haven't been to church in years other than Christmas Eve. I mean, I'm Episcopalian for God's sake. We've got a woman running the church and gay bishops. We aren't exactly radical Christian extremists....

I thought if anything you'd take issue with the name (Stuka).
 
Let's see, to sum up this thread, jmcc was an asshole, bunch of nobodies were arguing, Natalie Portman is hotttttt, plus one for me, I have better chances than quite a few people, jmcc was an asshole, and Natalie Portman has more talent than 99% of the women in hollywood and the people I always hear as being hot, etc. Obviously people haven't seen her roles/enough of them. And yes she is in the upper echelon (my number 1 actually tied with Scarlett and teh Albas) with Hathaway (probably tied. Havoc sucked, but damn does she have some titties.) I think I summed it up. OH and jmcc was an asshole and I disagree greatly with his opinion of the conflict, but obviously like somebody else said, what are a bunch of gaming people gonna really do?
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']Let's see, to sum up this thread, jmcc was an asshole, bunch of nobodies were arguing, Natalie Portman is hotttttt, plus one for me, I have better chances than quite a few people, jmcc was an asshole, and Natalie Portman has more talent than 99% of the women in hollywood and the people I always hear as being hot, etc. Obviously people haven't seen her roles/enough of them. And yes she is in the upper echelon (my number 1 actually tied with Scarlett and teh Albas) with Hathaway (probably tied. Havoc sucked, but damn does she have some titties.) I think I summed it up. OH and jmcc was an asshole and I disagree greatly with his opinion of the conflict, but obviously like somebody else said, what are a bunch of gaming people gonna really do?[/QUOTE]Ah, the don't back-up anything you say and just call me an anti-semite for pointing out facts strategy. That seems very popular today.
 
sorry but jmcc was NOT an a-hole.

It was a friggin joke people. A bit off-color and insensitve but a joke none the less.
 
[quote name='jmcc'](I have no idea what she means by "I get more Jewish in Israel")[/QUOTE]

It's like saying "I get more Polish in Chicago," or "I get more Italian in Jersey." She's a ho, and very subtley likes to admit it publicly.

Godamnit people. DEMOGRAPHY!

Anyway, here's the deal:
9-1c.jpg

THAT is an anti-semite.

image.php

THAT is an asshole.

I dislike the Israeli state very greatly, and have no love for the Palestinians either (but a touch more sympathy for them), but if you dare call me an Anti-Semite, I'll punch you in the fucking circumcision.
 
[quote name='Stuka']The crosses? Big deal, the majority of the United States is some form of Christian. If that is going to be your barometer for people, you might have quite a problem in most of the Western World. Besides, I like the æsthetics of the cross only. I haven't been to church in years other than Christmas Eve. I mean, I'm Episcopalian for God's sake. We've got a woman running the church and gay bishops. We aren't exactly radical Christian extremists....

I thought if anything you'd take issue with the name (Stuka).[/quote]

Sweet, another Wiskey-palian.... =)
 
[quote name='jmcc']Ah, the don't back-up anything you say and just call me an anti-semite for pointing out facts strategy. That seems very popular today.[/quote]

First off, I don't argue on the internet. It's just for retards and I will call you that, but I never called you an anti-semite, though that is what you could be perceived as. And again, I will also call you an asshole. Thank you and good day sir.
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']First off, I don't argue on the internet. It's just for retards and I will call you that, but I never called you an anti-semite, though that is what you could be perceived as. And again, I will also call you an asshole. Thank you and good day sir.[/QUOTE]

Agreed with, he never called you an anti-semite, I read the whole thread. I also agree you are an asshole, and the mods should of shut this trash down 2 pages ago.
 
[quote name='CrimGhost']I've been snipped and stay Kosher, but im not Jewish...or am I? Anyway, Israel should not exist.[/QUOTE]

If you're seriously Jewish, then you're an embarrassment to our people. Regardless, saying the state of Israel shouldnt exist is the most retarded thing posted thus far. Shut up, and go back to your radical church, churchy.
 
Actually, didn't christians generally support the recreation of Israel? I think they generally acknowledge its importance, especially in the Book of Revelation. After all, armagaeddon can't happen without it.
 
[quote name='jPoD']If you're seriously Jewish, then you're an embarrassment to our people. Regardless, saying the state of Israel shouldnt exist is the most retarded thing posted thus far. Shut up, and go back to your radical church, churchy.[/QUOTE]

Wow, it was a joke and im not a Jew. Get the sand out of your vagina, jPoD. And does anyone know the meaning of this?
IMG_0033New.jpg
 
[quote name='CrimGhost']Wow, it was a joke and im not a Jew. Get the sand out of your vagina, jPoD. And does anyone know the meaning of this?
IMG_0033New.jpg
[/QUOTE]


OMG LOLZ FunNaY! ....No. As for that? Radicals I guess? It doesnt say anything in the Torah about rejecting a jewish state.
 
[quote name='jPoD']Most of that is a load of crap. 99% of Jews dont believe in that trash.[/quote]

I doubt you speak for everyone as the pic & links prove otherwise. Fact of the matter is Israel isn't completely devoid of complicity of displacing hundreds (if not thousands) of Palestinians from their homes. Being jewish doesn't grant one complete immunity in global injustice. The Israel-Palestinian conflict has been around for a while and probably escalated since the establishment of the Jewish state in 1947. The establishment of Israel, in an attempt to provide a place for migrant Jews fleeing from the horrors of Nazi Germany, ended up causing just as much strife for the displaced Palestinians. Remember the old cliche, "The road to hell is paved with good intentions." That is certainly the case here. Yeah, jmcc's comment was quite distasteful. However, the fact of the matter is that Israel isn't the benign capital as perceived by most people in the Western Hemisphere.
 
[quote name='jaykrue']I doubt you speak for everyone as the pic & links prove otherwise. Fact of the matter is Israel isn't completely devoid of complicity of displacing hundreds (if not thousands) of Palestinians from their homes. Being jewish doesn't grant one complete immunity in global injustice. The Israel-Palestinian conflict has been around for a while and probably escalated since the establishment of the Jewish state in 1947. The establishment of Israel, in an attempt to provide a place for migrant Jews fleeing from the horrors of Nazi Germany, ended up causing just as much strife for the displaced Palestinians. Remember the old cliche, "The road to hell is paved with good intentions." That is certainly the case here. Yeah, jmcc's comment was quite distasteful. However, the fact of the matter is that Israel isn't the benign capital as perceived by most people in the Western Hemisphere.[/QUOTE]

That looks so googled :p

But obviously I dont speak for everyone, but coming from a pretty religious family, and going to a secular school from kindergarten through 7th grade, I know that not too many people feel the way those hasidics do.
 
[quote name='jPoD']That looks so googled :p

But obviously I dont speak for everyone, but coming from a pretty religious family, and going to a secular school from kindergarten through 7th grade, I know that not too many people feel the way those hasidics do.[/quote]

So what if it is googled? Does it negate the information given? Feeling a certain way doesn't negate facts. The fact of the matter is that stuff happened. Whether or not it makes you feel bad/better depends on your point of view. It's not a personal issue to me, being raised Catholic though I lean towards agnosticism/atheism, so I can see this issue w/o emotional bias. Did I get the facts wrong? If so, then please, enlighten me.
 
[quote name='jPoD']Most of that is a load of crap. 99% of Jews dont believe in that trash.[/quote]

Does that make it true? Having the majority opinion doesn't make you right, even if it is the majority opinion of a minority religion. The problem with Jews that 'don't believe that trash' is that you all think Israel is completely innocent in all of this. The land Israel sits on top of now is where Judaism was born, and so when Britian with the help of the United States handed that land over to the Zionist movement, it was all okay, even if means throwing Palestinians off the land and out of the houses they had owned for centuries, much like how the Nazis threw the Jews out of their homes and off their own land.

What do you think would be the reaction in the United States if the rest of the world decided to band together and told us to get the fuck out of America because they are going to give it back to the Native Americans and Mexico and the United States had no way to fight back? Something along the lines of guerilla war? Most likely. That's not to say the Palestinians' hands are free of blood either, but to just sum it up as "well, they attack Israel with suicide bombers so they are the bad guys" is just naive. To this day, Israel continues to increase their land in the West Bank by encouraging settlers to build further and further west and then build a new wall around it.
 
[quote name='jPoD']If you're seriously Jewish, then you're an embarrassment to our people. Regardless, saying the state of Israel shouldnt exist is the most retarded thing posted thus far. Shut up, and go back to your radical church, churchy.[/QUOTE]

You are in serious need of some panooch.
 
I am going to say this: Israel continues to give up land to pacify them and has for years given them infrastructure, schools, etc. By giving up the land, Israel lost its ability to secore Israels citizens. How do they repay their generosity and their attempts to go down the peace path? Continued launching of rockets into Israel, murders and kidnappings. To hell with these people. They will always cry foul, cry to the UN but yet instigate these hostile acts. When their bridges and powerplants lie in ruines, they will accuse the Israelis of starting and doing everything. Israel has the right to protect itself. Nobody wants to be in the position that Israel is in. To be surrounded by enemies that went only death and destruction, to live in a constant state of fear that your child will die going to the grocery store for milk. These people do not want nor do they understand peace. Israel has been with peace with Egypt and Jordan for years. They may not see eye to eye on everything, but they have been capable of coming to terms with each other. Hamas and Hezbollah made the rules of the game with the ongoing rocket fire into Israel and the abduction of Israeli soldiers. Hamas will not even come to terms with the state of Israel and will not call off its intifidah and its wish for the death of every Jew not only in Israel, but in the world. America went out to Afghanistan to protect itself and Israel has every right to do so. Have both sides acted poorly? Yes, but none moreso than the Palestinians when their own government will not even come to the table for talks, etc.

jmcc probably agrees that what Osama bin Laden and Al Queda did on 9/11 was correct, because - quote as he put "the terrorists have lesser weapons and he probably doesn't agree with America's army's policies against Afghanistan". Give me break. They want to come here, flood our tunnels, destroy our subway system, have already destroyed to of our greatest buildings, cause mayhem destruction, what more is there? These aren't people you can negotiate with. As I said prior, Hamas and Hezbollah made the rules of the game with the ongoing rocket fire into Israel and the abduction of Israeli soldiers.

How do allow these states that sponsor terrorism without any sight of peace to go on?
 
[quote name='Fire']I am going to say this: Israel continues to give up land to pacify them and has for years given them infrastructure, schools, etc. By giving up the land, Israel lost its ability to secore Israels citizens. How do they repay their generosity and their attempts to go down the peace path? Continued launching of rockets into Israel, murders and kidnappings. To hell with these people. They will always cry foul, cry to the UN but yet instigate these hostile acts. When their bridges and powerplants lie in ruines, they will accuse the Israelis of starting and doing everything. Israel has the right to protect itself. Nobody wants to be in the position that Israel is in. To be surrounded by enemies that went only death and destruction, to live in a constant state of fear that your child will die going to the grocery store for milk. These people do not want nor do they understand peace. Israel has been with peace with Egypt and Jordan for years. They may not see eye to eye on everything, but they have been capable of coming to terms with each other. Hamas and Hezbollah made the rules of the game with the ongoing rocket fire into Israel and the abduction of Israeli soldiers. Hamas will not even come to terms with the state of Israel and will not call off its intifidah and its wish for the death of every Jew not only in Israel, but in the world. America went out to Afghanistan to protect itself and Israel has every right to do so. Have both sides acted poorly? Yes, but none moreso than the Palestinians when their own government will not even come to the table for talks, etc.

jmcc probably agrees that what Osama bin Laden and Al Queda did on 9/11 was correct, because - quote as he put "the terrorists have lesser weapons and he probably doesn't agree with America's army's policies against Afghanistan". Give me break. They want to come here, flood our tunnels, destroy our subway system, have already destroyed to of our greatest buildings, cause mayhem destruction, what more is there? These aren't people you can negotiate with. As I said prior, Hamas and Hezbollah made the rules of the game with the ongoing rocket fire into Israel and the abduction of Israeli soldiers.

How do allow these states that sponsor terrorism without any sight of peace to go on?[/QUOTE]Sure is a lot of "these people" in there.
 
[quote name='CocheseUGA']You are in serious need of some panooch.[/QUOTE]

I'm workin on that. Date's next week. Thanks for lookin out for me brah.
 
[quote name='jmcc']Sure is a lot of "these people" in there.[/QUOTE]

Did you read anymore past that? Hamas, Hizbollah, al Aqsa Marty's Brigade (interesting choice of name, no?) Syria, Iran, etc.

Terrorism is terrorism anyway you name it.
 
[quote name='Fire']Did you read anymore past that? Hamas, Hizbollah, al Aqsa Marty's Brigade (interesting choice of name, no?) Syria, Iran, etc.

Terrorism is terrorism anyway you name it.[/QUOTE]Like, say, cutting off power and water to millions of civilians, causing a humanitarian crisis? Would that be terrorism?
 
[quote name='jmcc']Like, say, cutting off power and water to millions of civilians, causing a humanitarian crisis? Would that be terrorism?[/quote]
Damn, mods must be slackin' off. This still hasn't been moved or locked yet.

Anyway, I'm with Fire and jPoD on this one. Israel has attempted to procure peace at least. They have given land, helped with humanitarian needs (do you really think that they have the money to build the infrastructure they need), Israel has provided power and water for years (up until recently). Israel has left posts, given back prisoners, etc.

And let's see, Hizbollah coming to the border staging war, killing and kidnappinng prisoners not terrorism? How about Hamas coming and killing two and abducting one? If memory serves me correct that how the violence and tension escalated this time around. Everytime there seems to be a little bit of quiet, Syria, Lebanon, Palestinians, someone has to rile something up. If Canada just up and started to bomb us from their border, would you just have America stand by and watch?

The UN Security Council has backed and passed plenty of resolutions calling for the disarmament and disbanding of these groups. The Lebonese Government and Palestinians need to take responsibility for the actions of groups within their borders. Hizbollah acts as a state within a state and doesn't even care what the Lebonese government says/sanctions/anything.

And on the matter of humanitarian crisis, what about the soldiers abducted? They have been claimed as Prisoners of War, yet Hamas will not let the Red Cross in to check on them?

And don't you find it interesting just at what time these soldiers were abducted? Right when Israel is in a transitionary time from Sharon to Olmert. This is clearly a test of Olmert's resolve.

Israel is dealing with an enemy who is unrelenting, who does not know what humility is. All they want is the destruction of the Jewish state and all Jews. That's what their religion and Allah supposedly want (not all, just these radicals and those that support them).

As has been said, Israel has the right to defend themselves.

You need to do just as you recommend to others, go read a book and study the matter and turn off CNN/Fox News and perhaps less of these internet discussions.
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']Damn, mods must be slackin' off. This still hasn't been moved or locked yet.

Anyway, I'm with Fire and jPoD on this one. Israel has attempted to procure peace at least. They have given land, helped with humanitarian needs (do you really think that they have the money to build the infrastructure they need), Israel has provided power and water for years (up until recently). Israel has left posts, given back prisoners, etc.

And let's see, Hizbollah coming to the border staging war, killing and kidnappinng prisoners not terrorism? How about Hamas coming and killing two and abducting one? If memory serves me correct that how the violence and tension escalated this time around. Everytime there seems to be a little bit of quiet, Syria, Lebanon, Palestinians, someone has to rile something up. If Canada just up and started to bomb us from their border, would you just have America stand by and watch?

The UN Security Council has backed and passed plenty of resolutions calling for the disarmament and disbanding of these groups. The Lebonese Government and Palestinians need to take responsibility for the actions of groups within their borders. Hizbollah acts as a state within a state and doesn't even care what the Lebonese government says/sanctions/anything.

And on the matter of humanitarian crisis, what about the soldiers abducted? They have been claimed as Prisoners of War, yet Hamas will not let the Red Cross in to check on them?

And don't you find it interesting just at what time these soldiers were abducted? Right when Israel is in a transitionary time from Sharon to Olmert. This is clearly a test of Olmert's resolve.

Israel is dealing with an enemy who is unrelenting, who does not know what humility is. All they want is the destruction of the Jewish state and all Jews. That's what their religion and Allah supposedly want (not all, just these radicals and those that support them).

As has been said, Israel has the right to defend themselves.

You need to do just as you recommend to others, go read a book and study the matter and turn off CNN/Fox News and perhaps less of these internet discussions.[/QUOTE]Simple question, then. Do you think any of Israel's current tactics move them closer to long-term peace?
 
[quote name='Fire']Did you read anymore past that? Hamas, Hizbollah, al Aqsa Marty's Brigade (interesting choice of name, no?) Syria, Iran, etc.

Terrorism is terrorism anyway you name it.[/QUOTE]

Al Aqsa Marty's Brigade? that sounds like an a-capella group
 
It would be interesting to see how much land they(Israel) have "given back" as opposed to taken overall. Have they "given back" more then they continue to take? I wont even bring up all their failed assasination attempts that end up killing more civies: i.e bombing an ice cream truck. Oops, I just did ;P
Both sides are massively in the wrong imo.
 
Back on topic a bit... it would be nice if she had a rack. I think she's hot but sometimes i feel dirty looking at her because she has the body of a teenage boy

NataliePortman-CloserPromoAnother.jpg


NatalePortman-Closerpremiere04.jpg
 
[quote name='jmcc']Simple question, then. Do you think any of Israel's current tactics move them closer to long-term peace?[/QUOTE]
Thanks jmcc for having some common sense. As for all the Zionist brain washing... you guys should take it to the Vs. forum and jmcc and others can school you there.

On topic... yeah Natalie Portman isn't even that hot.
 
[quote name='jmcc']Simple question, then. Do you think any of Israel's current tactics move them closer to long-term peace?[/quote]

For the short term they must show a resilience and a resolve that they will not give in to terrorist threats, nor stand down to them. They must be able to protect their citizens. If no government wishes to meet them half way and procure peace talks, then they have all the right to do what they have to protect their citizens. Years ago, Barak at the Camp David talks gave Yasser Arafat the deal of a lifetime and he still denied it. Still, there must be plenty of thought as to how much of an offensive/defense Israel is to go and to make sure that much of it is not simply a knee jerk reaction.

The only way way to secure long-term peace is to do it diplomatically. It's simple as that. No ifs, ands, or buts. At the moment, I truly do not see how this can come about. There isn't a strong enough government (or almost one for that matter) to talk to with the Palestinians, nor one that seems willing to even talk. Terrorism continues to prevail and no government will take responsibility, nor attempt to stop the radicals that are within their borders. For the foreseeable (sp) future, the soldiers of the Israelies kidnapped must be returned with a subsequent ceasefire (or at least what can be called a ceasefire) taken place. And mediation must take place. Either the America must come in with stronger international diplomacy (like that will happen with Bush) and try to set things back on the path or at least for things to quiet down a bit. Perhaps Germany can step in like they did a few years ago with Lebanon and the exchange of soldiers.

Oh, one simple question to you....whereas Hamas, Hizbollah, etc. purposely go after civilians: men, women and children and go for places that will cause the most death and destruction (i.e. Bar Mitzvahs, Passover dinners, hotels, etc.) do you truly believe that Israel intentionally seeks out the destruction of children, etc.? I do not condone the death of children and women and civilian innocents, but in a war there are going to be casualties.
 
[quote name='Noodle Pirate!']It would be interesting to see how much land they(Israel) have "given back" as opposed to taken overall. Have they "given back" more then they continue to take? I wont even bring up all their failed assasination attempts that end up killing more civies: i.e bombing an ice cream truck. Oops, I just did ;P
Both sides are massively in the wrong imo.[/quote]

Let's not forget the land that the Egypt and Jordan took away from Israel and Palestine during the war of independence (oh i'm sure you know as it hasn't been left out of most history books here, the one that after Israel was made a state, Egypt, Syria, Iraq, etc. went on decided to attack Israel.)
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']For the short term they must show a resilience and a resolve that they will not give in to terrorist threats, nor stand down to them. They must be able to protect their citizens. If no government wishes to meet them half way and procure peace talks, then they have all the right to do what they have to protect their citizens. Years ago, Barak at the Camp David talks gave Yasser Arafat the deal of a lifetime and he still denied it. Still, there must be plenty of thought as to how much of an offensive/defense Israel is to go and to make sure that much of it is not simply a knee jerk reaction.

The only way way to secure long-term peace is to do it diplomatically. It's simple as that. No ifs, ands, or buts. At the moment, I truly do not see how this can come about. There isn't a strong enough government (or almost one for that matter) to talk to with the Palestinians, nor one that seems willing to even talk. Terrorism continues to prevail and no government will take responsibility, nor attempt to stop the radicals that are within their borders. For the foreseeable (sp) future, the soldiers of the Israelies kidnapped must be returned with a subsequent ceasefire (or at least what can be called a ceasefire) taken place. And mediation must take place. Either the America must come in with stronger international diplomacy (like that will happen with Bush) and try to set things back on the path or at least for things to quiet down a bit. Perhaps Germany can step in like they did a few years ago with Lebanon and the exchange of soldiers.

Oh, one simple question to you....whereas Hamas, Hizbollah, etc. purposely go after civilians: men, women and children and go for places that will cause the most death and destruction (i.e. Bar Mitzvahs, Passover dinners, hotels, etc.) do you truly believe that Israel intentionally seeks out the destruction of children, etc.? I do not condone the death of children and women and civilian innocents, but in a war there are going to be casualties.[/QUOTE]It was a yes or no question that you didn't answer yes or no.

edit: but to answer your question, yes, I certainly do believe Israel targets civilians, directly and indirectly.
 
[quote name='MadChedar0']Thanks jmcc for having some common sense. As for all the Zionist brain washing... you guys should take it to the Vs. forum and jmcc and others can school you there.

On topic... yeah Natalie Portman isn't even that hot.[/quote]

Zionist brain washing???? fuck you!:D I won't even thiink about where that one will lead me. I've seen your rants in the VS forum and it is nearly as bad as some that post there like pittsburghafterdark (haven't seen him in awhile, then again I couldn't take any of his bullshit anymore and ignored him). And common sense? Yaeh I won't even try to get into that one. No offense jmcc, but I think only in the last page or so of your posts has this thread cooled down a bit and turn into an actual discussion/debate.

And yaeh, I'm still quite astonished this hasn't gone to the VS yet.
 
[quote name='jmcc']It was a yes or no question that you didn't answer yes or no.

edit: but to answer your question, yes, I certainly do believe Israel targets civilians, directly and indirectly.[/quote]

Interesting....I've seen this tactic taken before time and time again on Fox News. Good job in trying to simplify an issue that has been going on for years and years. I attempted to answer the question wholeheartedly and you manage to write off all that I said.

Indirectly, I am willing to concede to that, but directly...no definitely not. Directly would mean that they purposely go around simply dropping bombs where every they want to try and kill civilians, etc. No that is definitely not how they work. If you want to say it that way, then you have to concede the same thing of our government in Iraq and Afghanistan, and while they may have raped, etc., I do not believe that they go into terminator mode to take out civilians like that.
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']Interesting....I've seen this tactic taken before time and time again on Fox News. Good job in trying to simplify an issue that has been going on for years and years. I attempted to answer the question wholeheartedly and you manage to write off all that I said.

Indirectly, I am willing to concede to that, but directly...no definitely not. Directly would mean that they purposely go around simply dropping bombs where every they want to try and kill civilians, etc. No that is definitely not how they work. If you want to say it that way, then you have to concede the same thing of our government in Iraq and Afghanistan, and while they may have raped, etc., I do not believe that they go into terminator mode to take out civilians like that.[/QUOTE]Ok, then do you also concede they have the resources and know-how to fight a much "quieter" war with Palestine?

edit: I don't care if they want to beat down Palestine in order to be recognised as a state. I do care that they have the option of behaving in a much more clandestine manner than they do, but they choose to instead attack massively and in the open. That tactic does not work against any terrorist forces. It's been proven since forever that it only makes the situation worse by driving moderates over to the fanatic's side.
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']Zionist brain washing???? fuck you!:D I won't even thiink about where that one will lead me. I've seen your rants in the VS forum and it is nearly as bad as some that post there like pittsburghafterdark (haven't seen him in awhile, then again I couldn't take any of his bullshit anymore and ignored him). And common sense? Yaeh I won't even try to get into that one. [/QUOTE]
I don't think my 1 and 2 liners count as rants, but everyone is entitled to his opinion.

I'm not trying to belittle you or anyone else on this subject, but one must form an opinion on this matter by reading books and multiple news sources. I'm just presuming, but I think you & many people (both sides) make the mistake of forming an opinion from one source.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
bread's done
Back
Top