Navy ad Bad.

[quote name='robot_jesus']Honestly, you should read the thread before making a comment, because that was useless. Podcasts are a completely different beast than TV programs.[/quote]

They both take time and money to produce, how are they that different?

[quote name='robot_jesus'] This thread is filled with users who are just mindlessly repeating Cheapy and Wombat's reasoning for the ads without even reading the OP's opinion.[/quote]

Nope, everyone has read and understands his opinion. How could we not when he keeps on and on about it like a raving lunatic. It seems you and he need to go back and read other people's responses. Which is, most people don't care about his point.

[quote name='robot_jesus'] If you were defending your opinions against all these internet tough guys you wouldn't want to sound like an idiot, would you?[/quote]

It's way too late for that. First, it's "it's not that the ads are Navy", then it's "I'd listen if wasn't Navy ads", now it's "Cheapy's reasoning for having ads", or "no one understands me"... blah, blah, blah.


Face it, he's complaining just to complain. It's that simple.
 
Well, the Navy's role in Iraq is pretty small. So whatever your feelings on that topic it really shouldn't be the issue.

That said, I think it's pretty lame we live in a country where the military has to advertise in the first place. I realize they do what they have to in order to hit their numbers but it's pretty ridiculous when you stop and think about it. I'd be all for mandatory service. We'd definitely have a much more responsible and politically aware population.

The major issue for me is that by running commercials for the Navy in the CAGcast, they're supporting a morally questionable ad campaign that as gamers we should be a little offended by. I am not a "military hater" or anything. My dad is a retired colonel. Several of my friends have served. I think it's a very admirable thing to do. But these ads are geared at deceiving kids into thinking it'll be just like Call of Duty. It's blatant. To the point where the military makes their own videogames and puts together tournaments which are basically recruiting sessions. Forget that yeah, you could die or come back wounded or disfigured. Instead it's, "Nice gamerscore. Military life is kickass fun too! So you want to be a badass for real? Sign here!" Pretty deceptive IMHO.

All in all, it's Cheapy's show. He's calling the shots. And hey, people gotta get paid. But I'd be lying if I said I didn't find the ads a little jarring. I just sit through them, shake my head, and enjoy the CAGcast for what it is. Free entertainment.
 
[quote name='robot_jesus']Honestly, you should read the thread before making a comment, because that was useless. Podcasts are a completely different beast than TV programs.

This thread is filled with users who are just mindlessly repeating Cheapy and Wombat's reasoning for the ads without even reading the OP's opinion. Any real argument or thought has been destroyed by Kosh, who has resorted to semantics.

It's really kind of disgusting to see somebody under constant attack because of their moral opinions. I'm sorry if you don't agree with him, but he has the right to share his views in an open forum.

It's not surprising his posts sound "high and mighty." If you were defending your opinions against all these internet tough guys you wouldn't want to sound like an idiot, would you?[/quote]

Thank you. Someone needed to step in and say that, 'cause no one was listening to me saying it, that's for sure.

You know, before this fiasco, I had high respect for the general CAG community. A group of gamers smart enough to realize that they don't have to pay full price for their games, and on top of that are collaborating and working together to achieve great means. How could they go wrong?

Now, it seems to me that a much greater percentage of them are just here for the freebies. Thorbahn3, a CAG with a respectable community standing, flamed me without even reading what I had to say. It seems that for the most part, the reaction is "ooh, an angry guy! Let's provoke him and see what he does!" Few people are taking this seriously (with the notable exception of Cheapy, ironic given my original approach), and many people are having trouble even seeing my point of view. I feel like every time I try to explain why two plus two is four, someone is asking where three comes into it. I've tried to be as understanding as I can, systematically reiterating that it is not five, six, or seven.

This place is almost as bad as the GameFAQs boards now. Heck, they've probably got more FAQs than we do deals.

[quote name='Kosh']They both take time and money to produce, how are they that different?[/quote]

Yeah! So do Florida Key limes, school buses, and cookies! Oh, wait, we're looking for differences?

Did you miss the part where the TV shows' alternative is being taken off the air, whereas the CAGcast's alternative is not sounding like yet another trashy advercast? For the record, there are billions of people who do not put up with overtly annoying ads. I know I don't, and so do most people I know. And television companies are wondering why their ratings are dropping? Try not broadcasting 40% ad time, maybe that's the problem... nahhh. Why do you think internet podcasting is so popular in the first place?

[quote name='Kosh']Nope, everyone has read and understands his opinion. How could we not when he keeps on and on about it like a raving lunatic. It seems you and he need to go back and read other people's responses. Which is, most people don't care about his point.[/quote]

He needs to go read those responses to see that nobody cares? Near as I can tell, there are three sorts of responses here; Those who understand my point and agree with it, those who understand my point, but are loyal to the word of Cheapy with the kind of zeal usually reserved for crazy fanboys, and those who have discovered that I respond to trolls when they ridicule my cause. The first two are fine, and expected. The latter is just being annoying, though, and isn't really adding anything to the discussion.

[quote name='Kosh']It's way too late for that. First, it's "it's not that the ads are Navy", then it's "I'd listen if wasn't Navy ads", now it's "Cheapy's reasoning for having ads", or "no one understands me"... blah, blah, blah.[/quote]

What are you on about? You only just noticed that I actually have more than one complaint about this? I'm pretty sure I outlined everything from the beginning, there. As to why I keep on explaining, it's because people are in effect asking me to. "Why this?" "This is why." "Why this?" "Ok, I'll elaborate for you." "I don't agree with this point here." "Here's why I do." "You disagree with this other point." "And here's why."

Why shouldn't I explain why I say what I say?


[quote name='Kosh']Face it, he's complaining just to complain. It's that simple.[/quote]

Ok, that is really pissing me off. You think I have nothing better to do than bicker with flamers jeering at me for getting blown off "the man" like a flea? I do not enjoy this. I am putting this effort in because I do not want the CAGcast to deteriorate into an infested shell of its former self. Frankly I am shocked that so many CAGs are actively standing in my way, much less standing aside and rooting for me or, god forbid, joining me in my efforts to save the CAGcast from these shackles it seems to be so gleefully attaching itself to.

Kosh, I've tried to be adult about your trolling, but this is enough. If you have an argument against the CAGcast's integrity, lay it out and explain why you support it. If you have nothing but semantic complaints about how I write, please leave this thread and don't come back. You or I are not part of this discussion.
 
Have you been to cheapassgamer.com? Not the forums, but the front page of this website. If so, you realize that this is a business, that's right CAG including the CAGcast is a business ran by CheapyD. Take a look at that front page again, see the ads, not just the normal ads, but all the links to buying different games at different sites. Cheapy makes a small commission everytime someone clicks one of those links and buys a game. I'm sure it's not a lot, and I'm sure most of it goes back into the site, but I'm also sure he makes some kind of profit off of them.

I'd like to think he produces the CAGcast out of the bottom of his heart, and for the most part he probably does. However, the CAGcast is part of cheapassgamer.com, therefore a part of Cheapy's business. Is it too much to think that he might put some advertisements in the show. I understand he's giving the money from the ads to a charity, but hey, that's still a possible tax write off so he still could benefit from the ads.

So Cheapy puts time and money into making the CAGcast, now he and Wombat are getting something out of it. I say, good for them. Therefore, I find absolutely no problem with him putting ads into his show. No problem at all. That's my stance on this whole thing. Of course, nothing I've said hasn't been said before, so it's nothing new. You just have a problem listening.

As for why podcasting is so popular, I'm sure less advertising is one of the reasons why. Along with the fact that this particular podcast covers a topic that you can't find very often in other forms of media, ie. TV and Radio. There's also the fact that it's portable and the user can listen at his or her convenience. The last two are my reasons, I could care less about ads.

As far as your crusade against these ads and the supposed "deterioration" of the CAGcast, I have this to say. I think you are pretty naive to think that eventually advertisements wouldn't start coming to this relatively new form of media. Especially a podcast that is part of a business, like the CAGcast is as a part of the cheapassgamer.com business.

So, good luck with your crusade. Why stop at the CAGcast though. 1up has been putting ads in their podcasts as well. Outside of video game podcasts, Ricky Gervais has had ads in his podcasts since the beginning. In fact, when they first came out his podcasts were free, now you have to pay for them. Yes, pay for podcasts, heaven forbid anyone try to make a buck for taking the time and effort to produce entertainment for other people.
 
[quote name='Justme8800'] Frankly I am shocked that so many CAGs are actively standing in my way, much less standing aside and rooting for me or, god forbid, joining me in my efforts to save the CAGcast from these shackles it seems to be so gleefully attaching itself to. [/quote]
I don't think CAGs are exactly "standing in your way", but instead are perhaps "standing up" for the decision to place short ads in the CAGCast.

Having revenue involved keeps CheapyD and Wombat hungry, and that keeps the podcasts coming, which in the end - is all I care about.

I don't know your age, but it just seems like you haven't fully grasped the concept of "Choose your battles wisely". Just my opinion...
 
Yvan eht nioj! :roll: This whole "crusade" absolute reeks of Cindy Sheehan.

I say Cheapy should run some birth control ads next and see how much more whining comes of it. Maybe he can get 2 complaints this time.
 
[quote name='Kosh']Have you been to cheapassgamer.com? Not the forums, but the front page of this website. If so, you realize that this is a business, that's right CAG including the CAGcast is a business ran by CheapyD. Take a look at that front page again, see the ads, not just the normal ads, but all the links to buying different games at different sites. Cheapy makes a small commission everytime someone clicks one of those links and buys a game. I'm sure it's not a lot, and I'm sure most of it goes back into the site, but I'm also sure he makes some kind of profit off of them.

I'd like to think he produces the CAGcast out of the bottom of his heart, and for the most part he probably does. However, the CAGcast is part of cheapassgamer.com, therefore a part of Cheapy's business. Is it too much to think that he might put some advertisements in the show. I understand he's giving the money from the ads to a charity, but hey, that's still a possible tax write off so he still could benefit from the ads.

So Cheapy puts time and money into making the CAGcast, now he and Wombat are getting something out of it. I say, good for them. Therefore, I find absolutely no problem with him putting ads into his show. No problem at all. That's my stance on this whole thing. Of course, nothing I've said hasn't been said before, so it's nothing new. You just have a problem listening.

As for why podcasting is so popular, I'm sure less advertising is one of the reasons why. Along with the fact that this particular podcast covers a topic that you can't find very often in other forms of media, ie. TV and Radio. There's also the fact that it's portable and the user can listen at his or her convenience. The last two are my reasons, I could care less about ads.

As far as your crusade against these ads and the supposed "deterioration" of the CAGcast, I have this to say. I think you are pretty naive to think that eventually advertisements wouldn't start coming to this relatively new form of media. Especially a podcast that is part of a business, like the CAGcast is as a part of the cheapassgamer.com business.

So, good luck with your crusade. Why stop at the CAGcast though. 1up has been putting ads in their podcasts as well. Outside of video game podcasts, Ricky Gervais has had ads in his podcasts since the beginning. In fact, when they first came out his podcasts were free, now you have to pay for them. Yes, pay for podcasts, heaven forbid anyone try to make a buck for taking the time and effort to produce entertainment for other people.[/quote]
That's a little more like it, thanks for laying down your position instead of just taking potshots at mine. Here's why I don't agree with you:

You say CheapAssGamer is primarily a business. I say CheapAssGamer is primarily a community, whose webmaster happens to make some money though affiliate links and banner ads. CAG would be nothing without the CAGs, so that begs the question; If CAG is a business, who does Cheapy consider to be his customers?

This is somewhat of a tangent, but lets find out the answer anyways. The CAGs? Not really, they're just here to support each other. Aside from occasional donations or whatnot, they are, as the site so boldy proclaims, cheap asses. So who else? Oh, right, the advertisers! They're the ones actually paying Cheapy for the CAG eyeballs/ears. That makes us CAGs, what, commodities? You don't find that mildly insulting?

Now, it's one thing for a website to mildly annoy its readers, it's understandably necessary to recoup bandwith and other costs. It's understandable for a TV or radio show to do that. It's quite another thing altogether to do it for its own sake, while blowing off the money saying you don't even need it. No one hears an ad and thinks "now they've got integrity," not even industry insiders. When I hear an ad, I hear the production saying "we are desperate enough to sully our creation with this obnoxious endorsement." What I hear Cheapy saying is more along the lines of "I don't need to do this or anything, I'm just going to rub these all over the shiny CAGcast 'cause I think it needs to look uglier." That is insulting enough to the listener to warrant boycott, and I can't believe I am the only one who feels that way.

How am I naive to feel that sort of insult is unnecessary?

As for 1up or any of those other crapcasts, I'm generally of the opinion that they're not worth listening to even despite the ads. The CAGcast is something good enough that it doesn't need to go that route, and I believe it is worth the effort it's taking to save. Cheapy should be offended that you don't.


[quote name='Mookyjooky']I just dont understand how having ads in your cast makes you lack "Class"

Insulting stuff you didnt even have to pay for is retarded.[/quote]
Insulting one's listeners is retarded.

The "class" thing was wrapped up the instant Cheapy replied to this thread. It had nothing to do with the ads in the first place.


[quote name='SirMikael']I don't think CAGs are exactly "standing in your way", but instead are perhaps "standing up" for the decision to place short ads in the CAGCast.[/quote]
Other than semantics, what's the difference there? They are hands still feeding the dog that bit them. They are actively siding with an obligation they feel towards defending the word of Cheapy, no matter what the words say. They are putting up with tripe that does not need putting up with.

There are many ways to analogically describe what they are doing. That's all beside the point that they are doing it.

[quote name='SirMikael']Having revenue involved keeps CheapyD and Wombat hungry, and that keeps the podcasts coming, which in the end - is all I care about.[/quote]
If only Cheapy agreed with that. 'Cause, you know, he did say something about "not even needing the money...." This is kind of the issue here.

[quote name='SirMikael']I don't know your age, but it just seems like you haven't fully grasped the concept of "Choose your battles wisely". Just my opinion...[/quote]
You mean, only play games you'll win? Maybe one day you'll grasp the concept of a conscience. Cheapy may bring the CAGcast down into whatever ad infested hellhole he likes, but at least I'll be able to sleep soundly knowing that I did everything in my ability to save him.


[quote name='sp00ge']Yvan eht nioj! :roll: This whole "crusade" absolute reeks of Cindy Sheehan.

I say Cheapy should run some birth control ads next and see how much more whining comes of it. Maybe he can get 2 complaints this time.[/quote]

Yeah, and most of these replies reek of redneck hillbillies with sawed-off shotguns, saying "we don't like yer kind in these parts."

Now, see how ridiculous that was? Making comparisons to rival Godwin is not helping. I am trying to help Cheapy and the CAGcast, not impeach him.

As for birth control ads, I would be surprised if he could pull that off given the audience represented in this thread, and the unlikelyhood that a significant amount of them are in any danger of procreating. Then again, maybe it would be a good idea to run them just to make sure.
 
[quote name='Justme8800']You say CheapAssGamer is primarily a business. I say CheapAssGamer is primarily a community, whose webmaster happens to make some money though affiliate links and banner ads. CAG would be nothing without the CAGs, so that begs the question; If CAG is a business, who does Cheapy consider to be his customers? [/quote]
Yes, the CAGs are his customers. If you've ever clicked on one of the links on the front page and bought something, you are one of his customers. Cheapy was the middleman and he recieved a commission off your purchase. Pretty similar to a salesman really.

[quote name='Justme8800'] This is somewhat of a tangent, but lets find out the answer anyways. The CAGs? Not really, they're just here to support each other. Aside from occasional donations or whatnot, they are, as the site so boldy proclaims, cheap asses. So who else? Oh, right, the advertisers! They're the ones actually paying Cheapy for the CAG eyeballs/ears. That makes us CAGs, what, commodities? You don't find that mildly insulting? [/quote]
No, I don't. I completely understand my role here. If you find it insulting then you probably shouldn't be at this website, because that's they way it is, it's a fact. I'm not saying that's the number one reason the site was created and I'm not even saying it's the number one reason the site still exists, however it's still a fact that Cheapy makes money off of this website and CAGs.

[quote name='Justme8800'] Now, it's one thing for a website to mildly annoy its readers, it's understandably necessary to recoup bandwith and other costs. It's understandable for a TV or radio show to do that. It's quite another thing altogether to do it for its own sake, while blowing off the money saying you don't even need it.[/quote]
I know Cheapy said he doesn't need the money. What about Wombat? He's said he'd definitely take the money and I'm sure he does. I'm not sure about Wombat's business relationship as far as cheapassgamer.com goes and making money off the commissions, but he is a part of the CAGcast. Being part of the CAGcast should allow him some sort of compensation and the ads do that.

[quote name='Justme8800']No one hears an ad and thinks "now they've got integrity," not even industry insiders. [/quote]
Prove it. Are you an industry insider?

[quote name='Justme8800']That is insulting enough to the listener to warrant boycott, and I can't believe I am the only one who feels that way.[/quote]
You're not the only one probably. However, I think you are in the minority and I think that minority is very small.


[quote name='Justme8800']Cheapy may bring the CAGcast down into whatever ad infested hellhole he likes, but at least I'll be able to sleep soundly knowing that I did everything in my ability to save him. [/quote]
I think this is where you are running into problems. You've asked in other posts why people have a problem with you and not your message, this is it. You think you're the single handed saviour of the CAGcast. Just like big government, I don't need you to save me from myself and I'm pretty sure Cheapy doesn't need you to save him from his business decisions. If you've seen this site, I think you'd have to agree he makes some pretty good business decisions on his own. If people don't like the ads they will stop listening on their own, they don't need you to save them from the dirty, dirty capitalists.
 
[quote name='Justme8800']
Yeah, and most of these replies reek of redneck hillbillies with sawed-off shotguns, saying "we don't like yer kind in these parts."

Now, see how ridiculous that was? Making comparisons to rival Godwin is not helping. I am trying to help Cheapy and the CAGcast, not impeach him.

As for birth control ads, I would be surprised if he could pull that off given the audience represented in this thread, and the unlikelyhood that a significant amount of them are in any danger of procreating. Then again, maybe it would be a good idea to run them just to make sure.[/quote]

How are you trying to help him when you are the only one that has an apparent problem with what he's doing? Sure, other people have said they really don't care for it, but as said, they just ignore it.

Why not give up your crusade and save your energy and efforts for something that really makes a difference, like helping starving families? You sure seem to be putting an awful lot of time into this and for what? Why not actually try to make a difference where it counts?

As far as I'm concerned, you're just a rabble-rouser looking to get a rise out of people. The majority of spoken on the issue and don't agree with you. The same rights that allow you to whine about something frivelous also gives the rest of us the right to disagree and speak our minds.
 
also, a general FYI for the person who mentioned something about enhanced podcasts ... they also work in Windows Media Player, as at one time Major Nelson was doing them.

I for one don't mind the Navy ads at all, a lot of the podcasts I listen to (TWIT leading the list) has a single commercial before the show.
 
[quote name='Kosh']I think this is where you are running into problems. You've asked in other posts why people have a problem with you and not your message, this is it. You think you're the single handed saviour of the CAGcast. Just like big government, I don't need you to save me from myself and I'm pretty sure Cheapy doesn't need you to save him from his business decisions. If you've seen this site, I think you'd have to agree he makes some pretty good business decisions on his own. If people don't like the ads they will stop listening on their own, they don't need you to save them from the dirty, dirty capitalists.[/quote]
*Sigh* I know perfectly well what problems people have with me, that's been fairly well established. What I'm asking is for people to stop focusing on me, and instead on the issue at hand.

I do not think of myself as any kind of savior. Though I'm being made out as some kind of martyr, I don't agree with that either. I'm simply expressing why I am distraught with something that I am reasonably unhappy with. I am not some Jesus-like "savior" telling you what to think, I am telling you what I think.

True, I do harbor the small hope that Cheapy might see these problems with his show, and fix them. I'm not holding my breath, though.

[quote name='sp00ge']How are you trying to help him when you are the only one that has an apparent problem with what he's doing? Sure, other people have said they really don't care for it, but as said, they just ignore it. [/quote]
In five years, when CAG is some giant media conglomerate feeding greedily on ad deals, and Wombat gets fired for some less-than-positive opinion on an advertiser's product, I just want you all to know that I ****ing called it.

[quote name='sp00ge']Why not give up your crusade and save your energy and efforts for something that really makes a difference, like helping starving families? You sure seem to be putting an awful lot of time into this and for what? Why not actually try to make a difference where it counts?[/quote]
Who instilled this "crusade" idea into your head? I'm putting far more time into this than I ever intended, simply because it's something that needs time put into it. Few others seem to want to go against the will of the conformist masses, and I'm not about to let this scandal fly by uncontested. It needs to be said, and you sure as heck aren't about to say it, are you? Oh wait, you're too busy helping starving families.

[quote name='sp00ge']As far as I'm concerned, you're just a rabble-rouser looking to get a rise out of people. The majority of spoken on the issue and don't agree with you. The same rights that allow you to whine about something frivelous also gives the rest of us the right to disagree and speak our minds.[/quote]
If that's really what you think, you don't have to exercise your "right" to take part in this. I shouldn't have to point out that the "majority" is not always correct, especially when it comes to opinion. Are you saying minorities should remain silent because they aren't the majority?

[quote name='Chicken008']Well, I live in Canada, so I don't get ads on my CAGcast. :D[/quote]

Really? Sweet, you wouldn't mind sharing that magical XML feed with the rest of us, would you?

~Justme8800
 
[quote name='Justme8800']
In five years, when CAG is some giant media conglomerate feeding greedily on ad deals, and Wombat gets fired for some less-than-positive opinion on an advertiser's product, I just want you all to know that I ****ing called it.
[/quote]


LOL, that's funny stuff. :applause:
 
All this is about less than 2 minutes of ads?

I have gone through this thread, and I still don't quite understand what JustMe's problem is. Do you flip out when you see a billboard as you drive down the street, too?

Besides, Cheapy had a point: the Navy is a prime advertiser. (Oh no! I'm a parrot! Squawk-squawk!) He is trying to build the show, and bring in revenue. It is a good thing you weren't alive during WW2 when there was a Draft and military posters were everywhere. (Hell, even Batman and Superman were used to sell war bonds.) Obviously, I'm not comparing the current clusterfuck to WW2, but the point is the same - it is just an ad, you can ignore it.

Cheapy and Wombat have been doing this, what, 95 episodes with no ads. Add in the preparation time and post-production, and that is a lot of time invested that they have been giving away. (Time is money, afterall.) I, for one, all for seeing Cheapy and (especially) Wombat make some cash for all their efforts. Hell, I could even handle a couple more ads, if they were put into stopsets, ala a radio hour.

And let's look at the CAGcast history: there have been numerous off-color comments and drug references made, but that was all okay? Was it because it was "cool" because it was unsponsered? So, the Navy wants to buy time on the show, let them! I take this as a good thing: the CAGcast has "made it" and advertisers see this as a way to reach people.

There are a lot of problems in this world that could certainly use your attention, rather than focusing on ads, and what they are, played on a podcast.
 
[quote name='Justme8800']In five years, when CAG is some giant media conglomerate feeding greedily on ad deals, and Wombat gets fired for some less-than-positive opinion on an advertiser's product, I just want you all to know that I ****ing called it. [/quote]I pray you are correct. :pray: Especially the part where I fire Wombat. Can we make it 1 year instead of 5? I really don't want to wait that long for the ad deals or the firing.
 
Haven't read the whole thread, but as long as Cheapy introduces the Arbiter before it plays, I don't really mind. It makes me giggle in my mind.
 
[quote name='moojuice']Haven't read the whole thread, but as long as Cheapy introduces the Arbiter before it plays, I don't really mind. It makes me giggle in my mind.[/QUOTE]

i cant stand that shit and how crappy it sounds when right in the middle of something i hear, "ok wombat, lets take a quick break....." shittily cut into the middle of our once great cast.
 
I am completely fine with the ads in the CAGcast. For a show which is between 1-2 hours having a minute and a half of ads is not going to kill anybody. If anybody hates them then that would be the time to go take a leak or get something to eat.

I agree with the reasons CheapyD said that he considered when taking on the advertiser.
 
Hey Keith David is cool..... I've met him in person on a couple of occasions. Guy is a real stand up just nice guy. I will support anything he's involved with.
 
Please CheapyD don't fire Wombat! You two play off of each other like a well oiled comedy machine. Speaking of which, does Wombat have his internet access yet?
 
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