Obama Care Could Be Deadly

[quote name='Clak']Not really surprised by the golf placement. Then again, I watch and play golf myself.[/QUOTE]

Considering the other women's sports, I'm surprised by the LPGA placement.
 
detectiveconan16 said:
http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-june-5-2013/care-bearers?xrs=share_copy

Gotta love Tennesee's new innovative plan to save money on Medicaid that won't affect the state budget. It was a chance for poor and elderly residents to call a hotline like one does for tickets to a concert. And once you're one of the 25,000, you get to fill out a form and wait.
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The irony here is that there were the same people who back in '09 or so were screaming about how Obama wanted to ration out healthcare.

 
Well, this is a country that has people voting against their own best interests.  That new Purge movie is about killing off the poor and sick one day out of the year, and I think the reviewers said that it was the poor majority that voted for it or something.

 
detectiveconan16 said:
http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-june-5-2013/care-bearers?xrs=share_copy

Gotta love Tennesee's new innovative plan to save money on Medicaid that won't affect the state budget. It was a chance for poor and elderly residents to call a hotline like one does for tickets to a concert. And once you're one of the 25,000, you get to fill out a form and wait.
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This is a bit misleading. Doesn't the gov't contribution drop to 90% after the first year? And with the debt at record levels, this contribution will probably be cut more and more as the QE money dries up. So perhaps the states are looking to not increase their already strained budgets by agreeing to new, bloated gov't programs. I did like how the obese lady was complaining about her healthcare costs. I guess she was just unlucky that the diabetes fairy chose her....

 
 
egofed said:
detectiveconan16 said:
http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/wed-june-5-2013/care-bearers?xrs=share_copy

Gotta love Tennesee's new innovative plan to save money on Medicaid that won't affect the state budget. It was a chance for poor and elderly residents to call a hotline like one does for tickets to a concert. And once you're one of the 25,000, you get to fill out a form and wait.
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This is a bit misleading. Doesn't the gov't contribution drop to 90% after the first year? And with the debt at record levels, this contribution will probably be cut more and more as the QE money dries up. So perhaps the states are looking to not increase their already strained budgets by agreeing to new, bloated gov't programs. I did like how the obese lady was complaining about her healthcare costs. I guess she was just unlucky that the diabetes fairy chose her....
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Federal government contribution goes to 90% in 2020;

The final expansions of FMAPs are 100 percent for 2014–2016, 95 percent for 2017, 94 percent for 2018, 93 percent for 2019, and 90 percent for 2020 and thereafter.

 
hey my health insurance company is playing stupid or something 

so in  2014

are the only choices 

YOU GET IT FROM YOUR JOB 

OR YOU BUY IT FROM THE    government

or can you still buy your own plans  

 
http://www.nbcnews.com/health/employers-get-extra-year-provide-health-insurance-6C10520868

"Saying the goal is to implement reform in “a careful, thoughtful manner”, assistant Treasury secretary Mark Mazur said the administration would spend the extra year finding ways to simplify the process."

Maybe they shouldn't have forced this down our throats. Maybe having people who actually read and understood the whole Act before voting on it would have been a more "careful, thoughtful manner”....

 
egofed said:
http://www.nbcnews.com/health/employers-get-extra-year-provide-health-insurance-6C10520868

"Saying the goal is to implement reform in “a careful, thoughtful manner”, assistant Treasury secretary Mark Mazur said the administration would spend the extra year finding ways to simplify the process."

Maybe they shouldn't have forced this down our throats. Maybe having people who actually read and understood the whole Act before voting on it would have been a more "careful, thoughtful manner”....
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No dude. Trust Obama, he knows best when it comes to healthcare. I heard he went to Harvard.

 
Msut77 said:
forcing stuff down throats is code for "i dont like legislation i was told not to like".
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Nahhhh, its actually code for dislike of legislation that gives the gov't more power and control over personal freedom while being Constitutionally unsound, passed with the buying of votes for pork and exclusions on the law, is unpopular with a majority of Americans, is so complicated and misunderstood by even the Democrats that Pelosi said "We gotta pass it to see what's in it" (paraphrased), and last, but not least,.....legislation that Obama swore was not a tax on national TV, but was then argued as a tax by his legal team in order to be upheld by the Supreme Court.

 
I wish I could have seen you guys in 2001. Something tells me you are railing against Obamacare way more than Georgie's legendary assault on personal freedom.

I don't think Obamacare is a home run. I also don't have a debilitating preexisting condition.

 
willardhaven said:
I wish I could have seen you guys in 2001. Something tells me you are railing against Obamacare way more than Georgie's legendary assault on personal freedom.

I don't think Obamacare is a home run. I also don't have a debilitating preexisting condition.
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Willardhaven what you keep missing is that many of us dislike Bush just as much as we dislike Obama. Please do not put us in the same group as Neo-Cons who want to destroy personal freedoms and launch a bunch of nukes into middle east. We actually want peace and prosperity.

 
willardhaven said:
I wish I could have seen you guys in 2001. Something tells me you are railing against Obamacare way more than Georgie's legendary assault on personal freedom.

I don't think Obamacare is a home run. I also don't have a debilitating preexisting condition.
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Not to mention, a lot of folks here were probably a lot younger and totally unaware of what was going on at the time. That was 12 years ago. Also, mostly everyone was swept up in "AMERCUH, HELL YEAH" atmosphere...

It would be fun to let you interview some of my friends/co-workers from that time period. Considering I was one of the very few people I personally knew who was against the invasion of Afghanistan and was totally confused by the outrage at the Dixie Chicks.
 
mrsilkunderwear said:
Doctor dumps health insurance plans, charges patients less.
http://www.breitbart.com/system/wire/upiUPI-20130614-232724-6523

And people say they need the government to make it affordable. :D
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Not to put to fine a point on it, but at a salary of $200,000, this is clearly a doctor who actually got into the business for the sake of helping people.

The rest, I bet, are perfectly willing to go through paperwork to get more money.

I don't know if Obamacare will work, parts of it I read seem like they could inspire worse behavior on the parts of doctors/hospitals/employers, but at the same time, that doesn't mean I think the system up until now is so great either. I always remember the example of Glenn Beck: When he was suffering, "the system is terrible. I've been left waiting for xxx hours." When he was fine: "we have the best system in the world."

Since I doubt it will get repealed, I have to hope that Obamacare, whether it works or not, motivates the system as a whole to become more efficient down the line. This may involve turmoil, mistakes, and periods of suffering, but that's part and parcel of the learning process and I don't think that's avoidable when trying to change an institution.

Hopefully, it'll work out like the seatbelt (and not the airbag). At first, mandating it was expensive and people were offended.("You don't trust my driving?") But now, we're dying at the same rates as before, but driving 3-4x faster. This is an improvement in every way. We spend less time getting to places, and more time actually doing something productive. (I am aware of more pedestrian injuries. I have minimal sympathy for them. Ever watch the numbnuts cross the street as slowly as possible, checking their phones, not looking both ways, just assuming cars will stop? This is Darwin's Law in action. They grew up coddled by school-buses with built in stop signs. I say: 2-ton object moving at high speeds and a driver who may not be paying attention: learn to respect physics.)

 
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Well lets just say no one likes change and without change things don't get fixed.

Those not willing to change usually become non-existent. From business to politics we can't continue to run America like it s 1930,40,50 or 60.

Change happens every day from birth of a child, new job, loss of job, death and more. We adapt and move on. Things are obviously broken and what pisses me off more than anything our government parties spend so much time lobbying for political status for the next election.
 
I can't wait to go on Medi-Cal on Tuesday. This is going to rule. I'm going to go to the doctor like every week with my psychosomatic bullshit. 

 
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Spokker said:
I can't wait to go on Medi-Cal on Tuesday. This is going to rule. I'm going to go to the doctor like every week with my psychosomatic bullshit.
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how can you get on it tuesday. I thought none of the new plans take effect till Jan 1. yes you can sign up but you wont be covered until jan 1

 
willardhaven said:
https://www.healthcare.gov/what-if-i-need-coverage-that-starts-before-january-2014/

Short answer: he doesn't know anything beyond what he's heard in his echo chamber.
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Yes, my joke proves that I have no idea what's going on with Obamacare.

What I do know is going to happen, and is already happening, is that hours are being cut. Sure, we'll be able to go on Medi-Cal (or whatever your state equivalent is), but who knows how we are going to pay for everything else in life.

 
People are still using the part time jobs argument?

http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/3974/h9pf.jpg

Find March 2010 on this chart and try again to make that argument.

The vast majority of employers that will be required to provide insurance already do.  Of the remainder, the vast majority will.  Are there a few businesses owned by Romney fundraisers who will cut hours, absolutely.  But anyone looking beyond anecdotes to actual data has no leg to stand on.

 
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Loving the reasons why half of the states in this country refuse federal money in expanding their Medicaid under Obamacare, mostly out of spite. It's like getting health care was soooo much before Obamacare.

 
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Funny how some states refuse federal money for Obamacare, yet NOT ONE STATE refuse money from the federal gov't to turn their police force into military units

YAY!!!! for police state............

 
egofed said:
http://poorrichardsnews.com/post/63737924453/video-dave-ramsey-lays-out-the-facts-of-obamacare-for

Is he lying?
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He's not lying per se, but he's greatly simplifying a very complicated argument.

For starters, sick people without insurance don't just roll over and die in their homes. They run to the emergency room for care. Since they (probably) don't have the money to pay for the treatments, because hospitals are F***ing expensive, the hospital swallows the cost, which gets reimbursed by the government. Which gets its money from taxes. And because of no insurance, the hospital charges the FULL cost, instead of some negotiated lower cost between them and the insurance company.

So basically, we pay the cost for the uninsured sick people today through our taxes.

Where there is room for argument is that it is possible that while our insurance rates go UP, our taxes could possibly go DOWN by more, because the cost of the treatment is less.

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Another argument to consider is that if ONLY sick people without insurance now got insurance because of ACA, then yes, the insurance premiums should go up. HOWEVER, young healthy people who believe they are invincible are also forced to get insurance.

Thus, it is entirely possible that the addition of young healthy people paying premiums might offset the increase from the sick people.

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I don't know the actual numbers, so I don't know how they are actually expected to turn out. But it is at least more complicated than the guy says.

 
I'm not surprised to see premiums go up, but then when I look at my insurance (health, auto, home), over any time frame, they're always increasing. (And this is as someone in good health, no smoking, no drinking, no accidents, basically no claims at all)

Sometimes, I just think the insurance companies are using ACA as a scapegoat for what they were going to do anyway, only slower so you wouldn't notice. Like boiling a frog.

 
Hopefully we will get a truly all encompassing and factual picture of how rates are effected soon enough. I hope we didn't spend all this money and effort for minimal rate reductions while giving the gov't the power to mandate private purchases by its citizenry. How over budget is the ACA as projected by the CBO now? And surely no one here believes that any special exemptions or waivers should be given for any law, right? I mean, the law should apply to everyone equally, right?

 
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