Of HD-DVD/Blu-ray and Rat's Asses

BlueWingX

BlueWingX

CAGiversary!
Am I the only one that doesn't give a rat's ass about HD-DVD or Blu-ray? In fact, I'm kind of annoyed that they're putting so much effort into it right now.
It doesn't help that there are going to be 2 warring formats, but honestly, isn't the quality of most current DVD's good enough? Maybe it's just because I don't have a thousand plus dollar home entertainment system, but I think that the DVD's I get now look great. Why do we need to screw around with it and make a whole new format?

I'm honestly hoping that HD-DVD/Blu-Ray bombs. Unless they can pull off something really fantastic with this, I really don't care. The picture looks crisp enough and the sound is fine. Sigh...

I'm sorry, I guess there's just been a lot of news about this stuff lately, and it's been getting on my nerves. Thanks for letting me vent. Feel free to do your own venting, or just rip me a new one for not understanding the impending greatness of HD-DVD/Blu-ray.
 
Current DVDs do look great, but I am looking forward to the next generation as I have an HDTV. I haven't paid too much attention to the talk surrounding the two competing formats yet though. I just hope that it gets worked out before they hit the shelves. We don't need another VHS vs Beta.
 
On larger TV screens, the DVD format is showing its age. The difference between DVD video and the HD content that is available to me from digital cable is huge. I'm very excited to be able to watch my favorite movies in high definition - I just hope it's affordable!
 
Reason's to get excited and care about the two formats:

1) They will be used in the next gen systems, PS3 is going to support Blu-Ray, and Microsoft will most likely back HD-DVD
2) Both are working to be compatible with current DVD's, although I believe HD-DVD is compatible currently.
3) Whether it is important to you now, it will be if especially if you get an HD TV
4) It supports 1080i as apposed to 480p which is alot better picture
5) The larger format means better picture, sound, and extras

Reason not to get excited
1) Format wars!
 
Im excited about it, but I hate that there is 2 competitors. The movie industry is split on who they support. How will this work, you will need 2 players??? Sometimes competition sucks balls.
 
[quote name='tyecko']do you think a hd or blu ray player would also support dvd's? cuz then it sounds like a good deal to me.[/quote]

Yeah, they're both backward's compatible with DVD's.
 
Movie companies want both formats, one for North america and another for Asia to help destroy Hong Kong bootlegs. I just hope get the good end of the stick somehow.
 
whats really getting to me is with the two new formats I'm going to be pretty much forced into buying all my movies again because they will look crappy -_-x

I hate having a new format so soon.
But what I hate more is that the industry is devided on which format to use. Your going to have to have a Media player that not only plays your old DVDs but one that also plays HD-DVD and Blu-ray.

I do have a feeling that Blu-ray will be the one that bombs. I'm baseing it just on the fact that almost all of the formats Sony pushes seem to sell very badly and don't get suported at all. (Betamax, Mini-Disc, Memory Sticks)
 
That, and the greater storage capacity = fewer discs required for releases (specifically television releases) = less cost to produce = (hopefully) lower retail prices.
 
[quote name='guardian_owl']That, and the greater storage capacity = fewer discs required for releases (specifically television releases) = less cost to produce = (hopefully) lower retail prices.[/quote]

They'll probably end up charging us more because they suck like that. :roll:
 
[quote name='Moxio'][quote name='guardian_owl']That, and the greater storage capacity = fewer discs required for releases (specifically television releases) = less cost to produce = (hopefully) lower retail prices.[/quote]

They'll probably end up charging us more because they suck like that. :roll:[/quote]

yeah, it gonna be bad the 1st two years, then we may see relief. Maybe. I hope.
 
I'm all for new technology, but DVD was the first format I really managed to build a collection with. I'm not looking forward to doing it again, and neither is my bank account.
 
I think the current DVD format is okay, but I look forward to the new format(s) because then we will not only have true HD movies, but HD sound as well (DTS-HD). I can't wait for true 7 channel surround!
 
So how many people are exsited that in 2 years we'll be buying both StarWars Trilogy again in the extra special 4 disc collection with over 200 hours of bonus crap. With all new scenes and all 6 movies will be newly remastered.
 
[quote name='BlueWingX']In fact, I'm kind of annoyed that they're putting so much effort into it right now.[/quote]
The reason that they're putting so much effort into it is because its going to be years before they get all the loose ends tied up, and more years before the technology needed to make the systems and discs cheap enough to be feasable exists. There'll be a couple of sporadic releases for both formats in the next couple of years, but it'll be 2010 (or later) before things are settled enough for the 'real' release. DVD took that long to go from a committee plan to an actual product you could buy at Walmart: DVD 2 will take just as long.
 
where you also mad when tvs got color, it just advancemnent in technology
Click to expand...

Thats totally different. DVD's have only been mainstream for like 4 years and we are already being persuaded to be buying a new format. A majority of America doesn't own an HD TV let nor a TV big enough to "show a DVD's age". It's ridiculous if we start using formats that will only work on 1 TV in a household. Most HD TV users should have thought about how useful HD will actually be, now they are trying to make everyone else buy expensive technology because they don't want to feel like they wasted a few grand.
 
[quote name='bignick']Im excited about it, but I hate that there is 2 competitors. The movie industry is split on who they support. How will this work, you will need 2 players??? Sometimes competition sucks balls.[/quote]
Don't worry, it'll work itself out. Sony is just playing their usual 'we're big and can fuck you all over' card. They really have no intention of making BluRay a 'real' product, but they know they're big enough to hold everything up pretty much indefinitely. The HD-DVD committee will eventually cave in and throw Sony a bone in the form of 'upgrading' their standard, in the form of a useless feature that uses some randomly chosen process that Sony holds a patent on. Once Sony gets a cut of every single HD-DVD drive and disc sold, they'll step out of the way. The did the exact same thing with DVDs.

The only other meaningful backer of the BluRay standard is Disney, who just wants to hold up the next generation product as long as possible so they can sell 49 more 'super-duper triple platinum re-re-re-re-re-mastered' versions of Snow White. They know they have a huge fanbase of Mouse worshipers who buys every single overpriced DVD set that Disney releases, so the more time they have to sell deliberately-obsolete editions before the next media format, the better.
 
[quote name='Drocket'][quote name='bignick']Im excited about it, but I hate that there is 2 competitors. The movie industry is split on who they support. How will this work, you will need 2 players??? Sometimes competition sucks balls.[/quote]
Don't worry, it'll work itself out. Sony is just playing their usual 'we're big and can shaq-fu you all over' card. They really have no intention of making BluRay a 'real' product, but they know they're big enough to hold everything up pretty much indefinitely. The HD-DVD committee will eventually cave in and throw Sony a bone in the form of 'upgrading' their standard, in the form of a useless feature that uses some randomly chosen process that Sony holds a patent on. Once Sony gets a cut of every single HD-DVD drive and disc sold, they'll step out of the way. The did the exact same thing with DVDs.

The only other meaningful backer of the BluRay standard is Disney, who just wants to hold up the next generation product as long as possible so they can sell 49 more 'super-duper triple platinum re-re-re-re-re-mastered' versions of Snow White. They know they have a huge fanbase of Mouse worshipers who buys every single overpriced DVD set that Disney releases, so the more time they have to sell deliberately-obsolete editions before the next media format, the better.[/quote]

Dell Inc.
Hewlett Packard Company
Hitachi, Ltd.
LG Electronics Inc.
Mitsubishi Electric Corporation
Panasonic (Matsushita Electric)
Pioneer Corporation
Royal Philips Electronics
Samsung Electronics Co., Ltd.
Sharp Corporation
Sony Corporation
TDK Corporation
Thomson
Twentieth Century Fox
Walt Disney Pictures and Television

So, 20th Century Fox doesn't matter or Dell and HP, which would most likely start installing players when they're cheaper. Sony's own library of movies is pretty big as well. They've got some good companies behind them that will certainly help them in the future.
 
There are a number of companies who have given some half-hearted support to the bluray standard (hedging their bets, just in case by some miracle it actually does manage to become the standard), but its very shakey support. Most of those companies (again, with the exception of Sony and Disney) are promising as much, if not (far) more support for HD-DVD as for BluRay, and several of them have come straight out and said they prefer HD-DVD (especially because several of them are on the HD-DVD committee in charge of creating the standard, and will therefore get large profits if it becomes the one true standard.)
 
There have been many good points made here, though as crazytalkx said, I don't have an HDTV so why should I care? Sure, I'm all for putting more content on fewer discs. That's an idea I can support. But I don't need the upgraded visuals and stuff.

My g/f's dad has an HD TV, and I hate it. It only looks good if you look at it from the right angle, otherwise it looks all f'd up. I have no interest in ever owning an HD tv, which is why I also don't care for the long rumored manditory HD tv switchover.

I guess what really set me off was the article here... http://www.thedigitalbits.com/#mytwocents
and the comments such as "At the HD-DVD presentation at CES today, Toshiba, NEC and Sanyo Electric all said that HD-DVD players will be available to consumers in the U.S. starting as early as September." and "FYI, it's now looking as if Blu-ray Disc titles and hardware will launch here in the U.S. in early 2006. Looks like only a miracle is going to stop this format war now."

I know there will be no requirement for anyone to upgrade right away, but eventually there will be, and anyone who doesn't upgrade will be left behind, like those last few stubborn VHS tape buyers. I worry that there will be that one company that will decide "Well, this movie is really popular, so if we make it only availible in the new format, people will have to upgrade...". I know, I know, it's the nature of things to evolve, and it should all be for the better, but something about this doesn't feel right.

Oh well, I'm sure the day will come when I'll own whichever player wins the war, and I'll forget all about my dislike of the whole affair. I still can't help but hope that these new formats become the LD's of this generation...
 
BlueWingX the inital price on these new HD-DVD players are going to be in the $1,000's not mainstream at all. In will mainly appeal to the home theather people who have to have the absoulte best. DVD will be around for a long time, so no need to worry, plus with DVD being compatiable w/ HD-DVD and Blue-Ray your existing collection is not just going to be thrown out. DVD is a cash cow for the movie industry right now and they will milk it for all it's worth, but they also have to look to the future market and that market is HD.

Also just read on gamespot that EA and Vivindi Universal Games are throwing their support behind Blue-Ray, probably because the PS3 will likely use that format.
 
[quote name='whiteboy']
where you also mad when tvs got color, it just advancemnent in technology
Click to expand...

Thats totally different. DVD's have only been mainstream for like 4 years and we are already being persuaded to be buying a new format. A majority of America doesn't own an HD TV let nor a TV big enough to "show a DVD's age". It's ridiculous if we start using formats that will only work on 1 TV in a household. Most HD TV users should have thought about how useful HD will actually be, now they are trying to make everyone else buy expensive technology because they don't want to feel like they wasted a few grand.[/quote]

Got news for you, TV wasn't all that mainstream when the first color units hit the market. TV had been around in various forms for decades before it really began to hit big. (Adolf Hitler had a few live broadcasts of his speeches.) Serious commercial broadcasting started in the US in 1949. The color NTSC spec already existed but with the exception of a few experimental and promtional broadcasts, TV production and broadcasting didn't switch over broadly to color until over a decade after color sets became widely available. Notably, those color set began to dominate sales only after there was a constant flow of color broadcasting to view on those sets.

DVD had the fastest acceptance speed of any new product introduction in consumer electronics history. The essential required equipment, a color TV, already had a effectively universal installed base, so there were no great hurdles. Thanks to the nature of digital electronics the price came down to be all-inclusive very quickly. In the wake of the VCR DVD had it easy.

HDTV is in the same position as early color TVs. They're expensive and don't seem to deliver until fairly recently when most cable and satellite systems began offering a good selection of HD channels. Still, the big missing factor for modern consumers is easy availability of pre-recorded HD material. HDTV screen prices are poised to drop like a rock if the market demand increases in response to an HD playback disc format. There are billions of dollars in sales riding on this so getting the details right is very important. (The strong HD support expected in the next generation of consoles should also help.) Both camps have strong arguments for their approaches. I've favored HD-DVD for several reason but as more time passes it almost comes down to a coin flip if the companies involved can't reach a single stand before the products enter mainstream pricing.

Low-end HDTVs are already well under $1000. This is considerably better than color TV pricing when they starting gaining momentum. The time is really ripe for HD screens to go mainstream once the other pieces of the puzzle are filled in.
 
[quote name='BlueWingX']There have been many good points made here, though as crazytalkx said, I don't have an HDTV so why should I care? Sure, I'm all for putting more content on fewer discs. That's an idea I can support. But I don't need the upgraded visuals and stuff.

My g/f's dad has an HD TV, and I hate it. It only looks good if you look at it from the right angle, otherwise it looks all f'd up. I have no interest in ever owning an HD tv, which is why I also don't care for the long rumored manditory HD tv switchover.

I guess what really set me off was the article here... http://www.thedigitalbits.com/#mytwocents
and the comments such as "At the HD-DVD presentation at CES today, Toshiba, NEC and Sanyo Electric all said that HD-DVD players will be available to consumers in the U.S. starting as early as September." and "FYI, it's now looking as if Blu-ray Disc titles and hardware will launch here in the U.S. in early 2006. Looks like only a miracle is going to stop this format war now."

I know there will be no requirement for anyone to upgrade right away, but eventually there will be, and anyone who doesn't upgrade will be left behind, like those last few stubborn VHS tape buyers. I worry that there will be that one company that will decide "Well, this movie is really popular, so if we make it only availible in the new format, people will have to upgrade...". I know, I know, it's the nature of things to evolve, and it should all be for the better, but something about this doesn't feel right.

Oh well, I'm sure the day will come when I'll own whichever player wins the war, and I'll forget all about my dislike of the whole affair. I still can't help but hope that these new formats become the LD's of this generation...[/quote]

You're being a bit silly here. The problem you mention can be seen in plenty of projection TVs that handle only plain old NTSC as well. You're going to judge all of HDTV by a single unit? Would you write off all of video games because your first experience was with a bad game? There are several competing technologies in the HDTV field. Field of view is one of areas on which they compete.

You say you have no interest in ever owning an HD set but you're lying to yourself. You may not realize it yet but you are. The day will come when you see a spectacular demonstration of 1080i material on a screen within your price and then you'll know you have no choice but to have this or forever feel left behind.

Right now, sales of EDTV screens is booming because they display DVDs at their best at a lower cost than an HD screen. This will become a non-issue when HD screens are demonstrated with genuine HD material at mainstream pricing. The difference is dramatic to say the least. Much greater than the difference between DVD and VHS.
 
[quote name='Raider']

Also just read on gamespot that EA and Vivindi Universal Games are throwing their support behind Blue-Ray, probably because the PS3 will likely use that format.[/quote]

That is incorrect. They haven't thrown their support behind anything. What they done is purchase memberships in the group that manages the Blu-Ray specification. I can guarantee they've done the same with the HD-DVD Forum. What this does is give their developers access to the proprietary documentation so that they can perform detailed evaluations. For companies of this size it is a small investment for keeping abreast of developments. When DVD was getting started the cost for that membership was $5,000. Either of the HD playback contenders is charging much more.
 
[quote name='epobirs']You're being a bit silly here. The problem you mention can be seen in plenty of projection TVs that handle only plain old NTSC as well. You're going to judge all of HDTV by a single unit? Would you write off all of video games because your first experience was with a bad game? There are several competing technologies in the HDTV field. Field of view is one of areas on which they compete. [/quote]

Ok, I'll admit that I am the victim of a kneejerk reaction on that one, but until HDTVs fall into the $200-300 range, I'm really not going to have any interest in investing in one.

You say you have no interest in ever owning an HD set but you're lying to yourself. You may not realize it yet but you are. The day will come when you see a spectacular demonstration of 1080i material on a screen within your price and then you'll know you have no choice but to have this or forever feel left behind.
Click to expand...

That's quite an assumption on your part, if I may say so. Not everyone cares how crisp their picture is, or if they do care, it's not always that big a deal. I'm sure I'll end up getting an HDTV one day, but it's most likely not going to be for several years.

Right now, sales of EDTV screens is booming because they display DVDs at their best at a lower cost than an HD screen. This will become a non-issue when HD screens are demonstrated with genuine HD material at mainstream pricing. The difference is dramatic to say the least. Much greater than the difference between DVD and VHS.
Click to expand...

Well, I suppose it would have to be a dramatic difference, since I never really noticed the difference between DVD and VHS video quality, unless you compare it to an old semi-deteriorated VHS tape... That's just my opinion, though...
 
[quote name='BlueWingX']Well, I suppose it would have to be a dramatic difference, since I never really noticed the difference between DVD and VHS video quality[/quote]
Ok, blind. Gotcha.
 
[quote name='Drocket'][quote name='BlueWingX']Well, I suppose it would have to be a dramatic difference, since I never really noticed the difference between DVD and VHS video quality[/quote]
Ok, blind. Gotcha.[/quote]
When you go from VHS -> DVD for the first time you don't really notice too much of a difference, then go back to watching VHS and are jolted by the lower quality.
 
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