OMG - My secretary is quitting today: Do I have to give her a HUG goodbye?

[quote name='ananag112']Why did she quit?[/QUOTE]

You stole my post.

If she was actually visibly crying when she was leaving she obviously had some attachment to the job.
 
She quit because the head of the office is a bully and a tyrant. She hated her job (as do most of us in the office). She was crying because she is going to miss me - we were buddies.
 
[quote name='javeryh']I actually don't mind the hug - it's the awkwardness leading up to the hug that bothers me. What if she leans in? What if we both move our heads to the same side? How long is the hug? Is there a squeeze involved? A pat on the back?[/QUOTE]

I understand this completely.
 
Awwwww... he is afraid of expressing his feelings and that he will have a meltdown and sob like a sissy. Awwwww... Now remember boys and girls, expressing your feelings is a good thing!
 
[quote name='javeryh']She quit because the head of the office is a bully and a tyrant. She hated her job (as do most of us in the office). She was crying because she is going to miss me - we were buddies.[/QUOTE]

then at the very least you should have told her " youre not just leaving here empty handed......youre leaving with a friend........and my heart".
 
[quote name='javeryh']She quit because the head of the office is a bully and a tyrant. She hated her job (as do most of us in the office). She was crying because she is going to miss me - we were buddies.[/QUOTE]

You were buddies and you didn't want to give her a hug? You thug.
 
[quote name='javeryh'] She was crying because she is going to miss me - we were buddies.[/QUOTE]

I think she was crying because she was dreading having to hug you, you emotionless wimp of a man..
 
I figure if you really want to not hug someone but not be a dick, then do the "double handshake" : The double handshake. This is when you "glove" or "sandwich" the other's hand with both of yours and indicates pride, warmth and sharing.

That way, you show them you care and you keep them at arm length so they can't go in for the hug.
 
[quote name='javeryh']She quit because the head of the office is a bully and a tyrant. She hated her job (as do most of us in the office). She was crying because she is going to miss me - we were buddies.[/QUOTE]

I thought you left your job in NYC proper for less pay to try to get away from this shit?
 
[quote name='Dead of Knight']I thought you left your job in NYC proper for less pay to try to get away from this shit?[/QUOTE]

I did. Apparently there's no escaping it as long as I'm at BigLaw. I'm hopefully going in-house soon. At least me commute is like 25 minutes instead of 90.
 
[quote name='javeryh']She's 46 years old with a 13 year old grand kid. Shenanigans were never on the table.[/QUOTE]

I'm surprised no one noticed this before. Are teen pregnancies an epidemic in that family?
 
[quote name='pitfallharry219']I'm surprised no one noticed this before. Are teen pregnancies an epidemic in that family?[/QUOTE]

I'm sure a lot noticed it and just didn't care. I know a bunch of people that had kids really young, it's not like it's some shocking new revelation and doesn't happen all the time.
 
[quote name='pitfallharry219']I'm surprised no one noticed this before. Are teen pregnancies an epidemic in that family?[/QUOTE]

Def. messed up... That's some crazy underage fucking going on.

That equates to them having a kid at 16 and 17.... wow....
 
[quote name='Steggy']Def. messed up... That's some crazy underage fucking going on.

That equates to them having a kid at 16 and 17.... wow....[/QUOTE]

How are you surprised by this? There's a tv show about this crap for fuck's sake. And it gets ratings, somehow.
 
I find the bro hug works best in these situations.

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1) Start with a hand shake.

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2) If it is a right handed shake, lean in and touch their right shoulder with your right shoulder. If it's left handed, use left shoulder. Be sure to maintain the all-important groin perimeter, as pictured above.

3) This is where I tend to disagree with the visual aid. With your non-shaking hand, give three distinct pats on the back. The reason it's three and not one, is that three is the minimum number required to signify to yourself and the rest of the world; "I'm. Not. Gay."
 
[quote name='javeryh']I did. Apparently there's no escaping it as long as I'm at BigLaw. I'm hopefully going in-house soon. At least me commute is like 25 minutes instead of 90.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I made a good decision leaving Big 4 (accounting). I'm still doing audit, which I like, but at a small, local firm that doesn't try to break you.
 
[quote name='Dead of Knight']Yeah, I made a good decision leaving Big 4 (accounting). I'm still doing audit, which I like, but at a small, local firm that doesn't try to break you.[/QUOTE]

How long did it take for you to realize they were trying to break you?
 
You should have done the fist pump

It's highly effective in situations that could be awkward. A fist pump is simple, yet effective.

EX:

Her: Well, this is it...
You: Hey, if you ever need me, just let me know
Her: Well, goodbye........
You: *Fist pump*

It stuns her enough to know that she has been set off


Of course this thread is now officially old...but next time, use the fist pump!
 
[quote name='DQT']How long did it take for you to realize they were trying to break you?[/QUOTE]

I left after 3 months, so probably a bit before then. This new job requires 55 hours during busy season, but it is a maximum (not a minimum like the Big 4), and they were very upfront about it during the interview. And regular season is only 37.5 hours. The salary is also higher than the Big 4, which is pretty insulting.
 
[quote name='javeryh']She's 46 years old with a 13 year old grand kid. Shenanigans were never on the table.[/QUOTE]

Shame on you. Shenanigans are ALWAYS on the table!
 
[quote name='Oswald9599']You must be an introvert, right?

Whats wrong with hugs? People be trippin these days.[/QUOTE]

I'm not an introvert and I don't mind hugs - it's the 30 awkward seconds leading up to the hug that I can't stand. Also, I don't like anything that has to do with any part of the workplace.

[quote name='Dead of Knight']I left after 3 months, so probably a bit before then. This new job requires 55 hours during busy season, but it is a maximum (not a minimum like the Big 4), and they were very upfront about it during the interview. And regular season is only 37.5 hours. The salary is also higher than the Big 4, which is pretty insulting.[/QUOTE]

Sounds good. Do you have to bill your time? That's the worst part of my job. Our minimum is 2200 BILLABLE per year which is just insane and almost impossible to get to. 37.5 isn't easy and 55 is crazy if that is billable time.

Also, regarding the pay, I've been talking to headhunters who have told me that I'm SEVERELY underpaid - like they couldn't believe that I was making what I make. I think I'm looking at a 40%+ pay raise if I can find a new job. It's crazy - since there have been abut 200 people fired over the last year plus paycuts for everyone, they make you feel "lucky" just to be able to come to work every day and get shit on.
 
[quote name='Dead of Knight'] The salary is also higher than the Big 4, which is pretty insulting.[/QUOTE]

Not surprising actually. At least from my experiences so far.

[quote name='javeryh']
Sounds good. Do you have to bill your time? That's the worst part of my job. Our minimum is 2200 BILLABLE per year which is just insane and almost impossible to get to. 37.5 isn't easy and 55 is crazy if that is billable time.
[/QUOTE]

I know I do. I'm sure all accountants do.

Back to the topic. I can totally see where javeryh is coming from. Work is work. I think not wanting to hug someone there does not make a person anti-social.
 
But don't accountants get to actually bill the hours they work? I was under the impression that lawyers' billable hours tend to pale in comparison to the number of hours spent at work, though I'm just an undergrad so I don't actually know what the working conditions are like... i've heard people (in law) say they work around 3k hours a year to bill 2k hours. If that's the case, then billing 2200 would suck
 
[quote name='Koggit']But don't accountants get to actually bill the hours they work? I was under the impression that lawyers' billable hours tend to pale in comparison to the number of hours spent at work, though I'm just an undergrad so I don't actually know what the working conditions are like... i've heard people (in law) say they work around 3k hours a year to bill 2k hours. If that's the case, then billing 2200 would suck[/QUOTE]

This is accurate. I'm in the office 12 hours a day and I am LUCKY to bill 8 of those. Plus I'm always getting told to watch my billing and not spend too much time on stuff yet I need to get my hours up. This is also why I don't take any vacation ever (they don't give us vacation days, they say take as much as you want as long as you meet your billable hours requirement). It's just impossible.
 
We have billable hours and we're supposed to do as much of that as possible as client billable but it's hard and they seem to realize that. We mostly audit non-profits and small businesses that are billed a set amount that doesn't fluctuate based on hours billed. I think it's a lot easier for tax people to get the 55 during busy season, as they all seem so busy and have a ton of work to do; audit, not so much. Last week I was asking around the office for stuff to do and even my seniors were reading reference material to pass the time. I have less to do than most people right now, but I just started and I think they are still trying to get me to fit in and get me started on stuff. We get 3 weeks of vacation a year and it doesn't accrue so they pretty much make us take it. It just can't be in busy season, which is fair enough.

EDIT: So what do lawyers do when they aren't billing hours? Javery, you say you work 12 hours but only end up billing like 8 if you're lucky. What are you doing during that time?
 
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[quote name='Dead of Knight']We have billable hours and we're supposed to do as much of that as possible as client billable but it's hard and they seem to realize that. We mostly audit non-profits and small businesses that are billed a set amount that doesn't fluctuate based on hours billed. I think it's a lot easier for tax people to get the 55 during busy season, as they all seem so busy and have a ton of work to do; audit, not so much. Last week I was asking around the office for stuff to do and even my seniors were reading reference material to pass the time. I have less to do than most people right now, but I just started and I think they are still trying to get me to fit in and get me started on stuff. We get 3 weeks of vacation a year and it doesn't accrue so they pretty much make us take it. It just can't be in busy season, which is fair enough.

EDIT: So what do lawyers do when they aren't billing hours? Javery, you say you work 12 hours but only end up billing like 8 if you're lucky. What are you doing during that time?[/QUOTE]

Your firm sounds like mine. We have a set budget for each of our engagements. Juggling/managing my hours can sometimes be more involving than the actual work.
 
[quote name='Dead of Knight']EDIT: So what do lawyers do when they aren't billing hours? Javery, you say you work 12 hours but only end up billing like 8 if you're lucky. What are you doing during that time?[/QUOTE]

I'm still working, I'm just not allowed to bill the time (or there is pressure not to at least). Some of it is secretarial work of the kind that would take longer to explain so I do it myself and some of it is research or routine things like audit response letters. Partners wish I wouldn't even bill for the legitimate stuff I do.

The problem is that the partner will promise a client that something will cost $20,000 when in reality it is a $40,000 job so if I bill the time they have to write it off to get the bill down (makes them look bad) so they'd rather I just not bill it (makes me look bad). It is horrible.
 
[quote name='javeryh']I'm still working, I'm just not allowed to bill the time (or there is pressure not to at least). Some of it is secretarial work of the kind that would take longer to explain so I do it myself and some of it is research or routine things like audit response letters. Partners wish I wouldn't even bill for the legitimate stuff I do.

The problem is that the partner will promise a client that something will cost $20,000 when in reality it is a $40,000 job so if I bill the time they have to write it off to get the bill down (makes them look bad) so they'd rather I just not bill it (makes me look bad). It is horrible.[/QUOTE]

Ah, so YOU'RE the poor bastard who responds to our legal letters. ;)

I spoke to a senior the other day, telling her about my concerns about downtime. She said the partners don't really give a shit as long as you're doing the best you can and get your work done, unlike with the Big 4, where if your utilization % is down, they get on your ass and may use it an as excuse to fire you due to no fault of your own. But then, they bitch about how projects are constantly overbudget because they want you to work 12 hour days. :lol: So glad I'm out of that shithole. Even only working there about 6 months shady shit went down. A senior manager (one step below partner) told me to charge my work as an intern to administrative even if I was doing work for the client, because he had concerns about going overbudget. Meanwhile, in training videos, they tell you not to do that because it's unethical. :lol:
 
[quote name='Dead of Knight']Ah, so YOU'RE the poor bastard who responds to our legal letters. ;)

I spoke to a senior the other day, telling her about my concerns about downtime. She said the partners don't really give a shit as long as you're doing the best you can and get your work done, unlike with the Big 4, where if your utilization % is down, they get on your ass and may use it an as excuse to fire you due to no fault of your own. But then, they bitch about how projects are constantly overbudget because they want you to work 12 hour days. :lol: So glad I'm out of that shithole. Even only working there about 6 months shady shit went down. A senior manager (one step below partner) told me to charge my work as an intern to administrative even if I was doing work for the client, because he had concerns about going overbudget. Meanwhile, in training videos, they tell you not to do that because it's unethical. :lol:[/QUOTE]

I keep saying I want to write a book about all of my experiences at BigLaw - I swear I have at least 50 really good stories that I'm sure I could weave into something interesting (but maybe only to other professionals). I've been emailing myself little blurbs when something goes down so I don't forget.

Tell everyone that you know that:

1. Audit letters can't be provided in a day (except for maybe really really small clients). Here's why:

2. We have to solicit every attorney and paralegal in the entire firm who has ever billed time to the client and receive a response back saying they either have nothing to report or that they have something and here are the details - this could range from 15-20 people which is typical or for larger clients over 100. Most people are lazy and have to be harassed 2 or 3 times to provide the response. After I get 100% of the responses back I have to draft the letter and then submit it for review which takes the reviewing attorney time. Once it comes back approved I have to find a partner to sign the damn thing and only then can I send it off to the accountants.

3. If you are doing the audit on 3/31 and need our response within the 5 days prior, don't ask for an effective date on 3/20 and then just think a phone call on 3/31 will get you the bring-down in 30 seconds. I have to repeat the entire process again to get that bring down. What a pain!

I don't think it is anyone's fault - I just think that the accountants aren't fully aware of the process so I try to explain it to everyone I can. I also think that the entire process is too long for no good reason other than to cover our asses (which is what drives everything we do - try reading a legal opinion once in a while - we barely opine to anything and we disclaim everything!).

I'm on the firm's audit committee and I hate it (but it looks good on a resume) - I'm really bitter right now because every February and March I'm literally doing 100s of these things and my phone is ringing constantly with people looking for the letter.
 
Sounds like social anxiety issues to me. You tell yourself that everything will be awkward, and then you make it so.

Someone's gonna post a picture of Picard.
 
[quote name='javeryh'] we barely opine to anything and we disclaim everything!. [/QUOTE]

Sounds awfully familiar.;) Especially the CYA part. Thanks for all those nuggets of information though. Never really knew what it was like on the other side of the phone when I was nagging you guys.
 
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