Organic food is a scam

[quote name='HowStern']^There is no argument because you have no point.

I provided multiple informational links about how meat is the single most inefficient food to produce because you claim to be against decreasing food production yet you eat meat. You say "Well, don't use the internet if you're against polluting."
Like I said..Nothing to argue.. Show me that using the internet a couple hours a day is as wasteful as the pork industry. Then we'll talk.[/QUOTE]

Well, you at least came up with something to talk about after all. Now prove how me eating meat is any more representative of the pork industry than your using electricity and products made using fossil fuels is of pollution that came about producing those things. Or prove how, using your logic, why you should not kill yourself right now to reduce CO2 concentrations, or clear-cutting, or any number of things.
 
[quote name='elprincipe']Ah yes, the brilliant argument of "well, if you were really for increasing food production, you'd be a vegetarian!" Allow me to respond: if you really were for stopping pollution, you wouldn't be on the Internet.[/QUOTE]

*walks in mid-argument unaware, without having read half of the thread, seeing stupid as fuck statements in the parts he has read.*

I don't give a shit about food production, I don't give a rats ass about pollution, but I do give a flying fuck about what I eat, and I prefer consuming things that are less likely to have negative effects on my body, like say, things that don't have chemicals I can't fucking pronounce the names of in them, or the mystery meat served at many chain restaurants. (except Taco Bell, I think they mix cocaine with their mystery meat)

Oh, and I'm all for being put in charge of the "kill people to reduce various levels of things in the atmosphere" committee... even if it was at the expense of the internet losing a large chunk of people.
 
[quote name='elprincipe']Well, you at least came up with something to talk about after all. Now prove how me eating meat is any more representative of the pork industry than your using electricity and products made using fossil fuels is of pollution that came about producing those things. Or prove how, using your logic, why you should not kill yourself right now to reduce CO2 concentrations, or clear-cutting, or any number of things.[/QUOTE]


How is eating meat tied-in with the pork industry? Really?? Wow... By eating meat you are supporting the meat industry. Nothing else you have listed comes anywhere near as wasteful as the meat industry. Nothing.
The tiny ammount of C02 that comes from myself is nowhere near the amount that comes from the nations/worlds population of cows. Which if you read anything I posted you would have seen how much cows outweigh people population wise.


Again you fail to produce a valid argument. Only coming with analogies that are much like comparing a lit match to the sun.
 
[quote name='lilboo']This organic shit is annoying. I enjoy shopping at Whole Foods occasionally, as I find SOME of the natural versions of food much better. (example: Peanut Butter and bread). There's a difference with natural and organic. Organic is kind of stupid, IMO. But "natural" can be pretty good.

Overall, I am not too overly concerned about what's in the food I eat. I know shit like McDonalds isn't great for you, however, McDonald's isn't my main diet. Therefore, it's OK. Same goes for anything. The only thing I don't really trust is HFCS, but that's because I'm not really educated in that subject.. everyone seems to be afraid of it, so :shrug:[/QUOTE]

There's one big thing that you need to know as a difference between Organic and natural besides what has already been stated. MSG can sneak itself into anything that isn't USDA Organic. The thing is unless you have ALL components of MSG in a food product you don't have to list it. You see the components of MSG, like Glutamate, are hidden under all sorts of different names like natural flavors, spices, yeast extract, etc.
Oh and El did you even READ my comment about making Greenhouses out of Skyscrapers? I mean how many of those are probably empty across the nation for crying out loud?! Also to increase farmable land you could start creating Terrapretta, aka Bio Char en masse, that is if you got the world's wastewater systems to filter out Pharmaceutical drugs out of the water. I would also not get the Biochar from ANYONE who regularly takes drugs.
Still I reiterate the skyscraper idea. You could easily vertically grow all the Organic food you need. Heck about easily growing underground, using Geothermal to power the area. I mean you couple that with minimal power drains like LED and you're set. As for water aren't there devices to get water vapor out of the air? Couple things like that with rain water.
edit: How easily could Organic food feed the world if not for feeding cattle and other livestock? How many crops are WASTED feeding those animals?! I'll tell ya Soy Beans are wasted in that and would be great for people since they're a complete protein.
 
[quote name='HowStern']How is eating meat tied-in with the pork industry? Really?? Wow... By eating meat you are supporting the meat industry. Nothing else you have listed comes anywhere near as wasteful as the meat industry. Nothing.
The tiny ammount of C02 that comes from myself is nowhere near the amount that comes from the nations/worlds population of cows. Which if you read anything I posted you would have seen how much cows outweigh people population wise.


Again you fail to produce a valid argument. Only coming with analogies that are much like comparing a lit match to the sun.[/QUOTE]

Once again you fail to reply to the question. I didn't argue eating meat supported the pork industry. You are arguing that your lifestyle, including the requirement of industrial society and the energy/resources that go into that society, does not result in pollution. It does, just like my eating meat results in animals being raised and killed. But to extrapolate that to a "if you're not with us, you're against us" mentality is idiotic, which is what you're doing.
 
[quote name='Sarang01']Oh and El did you even READ my comment about making Greenhouses out of Skyscrapers? I mean how many of those are probably empty across the nation for crying out loud?! Also to increase farmable land you could start creating Terrapretta, aka Bio Char en masse, that is if you got the world's wastewater systems to filter out Pharmaceutical drugs out of the water. I would also not get the Biochar from ANYONE who regularly takes drugs.
Still I reiterate the skyscraper idea. You could easily vertically grow all the Organic food you need. Heck about easily growing underground, using Geothermal to power the area. I mean you couple that with minimal power drains like LED and you're set. As for water aren't there devices to get water vapor out of the air? Couple things like that with rain water.
edit: How easily could Organic food feed the world if not for feeding cattle and other livestock? How many crops are WASTED feeding those animals?! I'll tell ya Soy Beans are wasted in that and would be great for people since they're a complete protein.[/QUOTE]

Big dreams are good, it's what has made America what it is today. Dream it and build it, buddy. I'll be very happy when you do, believe me. I argue in the present on this issue, but the future can be whatever we make of it, so long as we don't bring utter financial ruin to our country.
 
[quote name='elprincipe']Once again you fail to reply to the question. I didn't argue eating meat supported the pork industry. You are arguing that your lifestyle, including the requirement of industrial society and the energy/resources that go into that society, does not result in pollution. It does, just like my eating meat results in animals being raised and killed. But to extrapolate that to a "if you're not with us, you're against us" mentality is idiotic, which is what you're doing.[/QUOTE]

Quit trying to snake out of the argument.

You out and out said you were against decreasing food production. Railing against the organic food industry. I pointed out the hypocrisy of you eating meat, in turn supporting the most wasteful food production in the world. You then claimed I must be for pollution because I use the internet. Desperate much?
 
This is somewhat off base. As others have mentioned thats not the only reason for organic..

There are also what 3 types of organic? So if the cow as not shot with hormones, thats one level.. but what if his food was grown with pesticides? What if the product was treated with preservitives...
 
You know it's funny - when we see some bodybuilder shot up with steroids we recognize him as a freak of nature. Yet when they shoot up a cow with hormones, for most people it's no big deal! Some people even posit that the only stupidity is not shooting up the cow with hormones, they are the real crazies.
 
[quote name='elprincipe']Big dreams are good, it's what has made America what it is today. Dream it and build it, buddy. I'll be very happy when you do, believe me. I argue in the present on this issue, but the future can be whatever we make of it, so long as we don't bring utter financial ruin to our country.[/QUOTE]

The only thing right now is we need to see a water system created that could actually filter out drugs. To my knowledge none of them do. I'm talking commercial, home, etc. You see if I'm making Terrapretta I don't want to be getting trace amounts of drugs in the vegetables I'm growing somehow.
I really hate the fact that I probably have some cocktail of drugs in my system just because of how many around here are either dumped in the water around here, coming from the multitude of others who take them and then shit(a small amount of drugs don't go into your system and are evacuated) or both.
 
Green-washing is a scam, some of the organic pitches you've been hearing about included. But there is serious consequence to industrialized agriculture, they simply do not maintain the soil like they should. A lot of what organic farmers do is about maintaining the earth they use, rotating types of crops, not using chemical fertilizer that burns out the soil. All this adds up to produce that is just as good or better than industrial farms, but does not deplete the soil, create vast amounts of pollution, and overuses water as much.
cagus.smile.jpg
 
the reason there's no more nutritional value is the soil. The land used to contain about 54 minerals that we absorbed through the foods, but now it only contains 3. and these three are added by the farmers into the soil and are essential for the plant, not us. we practically get nothing from our food now. which is why vitamin, mineral, essential amino acids and omega-3 supplementation is important now.

There's a great multi-vitamin/mineral/amino acid to take that you can get on Amazon called Ola Loa (LINK). Get the citrus flavor, tastes great. about $28 for a month's supply and it's individual powdered packets for on the go. Only vitamins in liquid and powder form are efficiently absorbed by the body. pills (One-A-Day, etc.) don't digest and are frequently found un-dissolved in cadavers and are full of toxins and less amounts of claimed vitamins. always take vitamins on a full stomach or the stomach can't extract nutrients and you'll piss them right out.

To complete the basic missed nutrients in the average diet, take Omega-3 fish oil. A good one I found at Whole Foods is Nordic Naturals (LINK) about $40 for a 3 month supply. Omega-3's are great for eliminating or reducing: high blood pressure, depression, bipolar disorder, post-partum depression, gout/arthritis, cholestorol, heart disease, diabetes, obesity, osteoperosis, ADD, acne, asthma, colon cancer, macular degeneration, breast cancer, etc. need i say more? we get enough omega-6 and 9 in our diet, it's hard to get enough omega-3 though.

Just some info i learned taking classes from my private nutritionist, learned so much about how bad we eat I lost my goal of 20 lbs. that took me 5 yrs. to put on in two months. Basically no more dairy, shellfish, pork, binge drinking, artificial sugars, white flour, and pasta. It's worth giving up all that to feel and look like i want. All those lead to so many of our preventable diseases plaguing us as a nation/world.
 
Von you do realize that Terrapretta probably has all those nutrients. It's also known as Biochar as well I've been told.
The enormous issue is the drugs in the water and so far no one knows of a system that can truly filter it out, not even the city sewage plants and so on. A system like that would very much be worth it to anyone.
 
[quote name='von551']Basically no more dairy, shellfish, pork, binge drinking, artificial sugars, white flour, and pasta.[/QUOTE]

I agree with you on dairy and artificial sugar. That stuff is disgusting.
 
[quote name='Sarang01']Von you do realize that Terrapretta probably has all those nutrients. It's also known as Biochar as well I've been told.
The enormous issue is the drugs in the water and so far no one knows of a system that can truly filter it out, not even the city sewage plants and so on. A system like that would very much be worth it to anyone.[/QUOTE]

never heard of the stuff, but i was getting at the land being stripped of nutrients from overuse by farmers. looks like this stuff is only in amazon, not the great plains of USA where most of our food is grown, unfortunately. what kind of drugs in the water? how do they get there? clean, pure water is essential, seems hydroponic is only way to go for that though...
 
Yeah, pasta should be fine as long as you're eating whole wheat pasta, not using a fatty sauce (i.e. alfredo) and not putting fatty meat or a ton of cheese on it. Same with bread, whole wheat bread is good for you. Key is to stick with complex carbs and avoid simple carbs.

Shellfish I suspect is probably just that it's usually served with a lot of butter etc. Plus the iodine and mercury issues I guess.
 
[quote name='thrustbucket']What's wrong with shellfish and pork? And why is pasta bad but not bread?[/QUOTE]

when i mentioned white flour, that included all things made with it, bread, tortillas, cereal, etc., although you can get whole wheat breads like Ezekiel. shellfish and pigs are bottom feeds and have a short, poor digestive tract. the excrete alot of the toxins/bacteria they ingest into their flesh. You know how some people are allergic to shellfish? Well, it's not the actual shellfish they're allergic to, but the pollutants in the meat of the shellfish. they absorb what they eat at the bottom of the ocean into their flesh. Another way to look at it is when scientists want to test the amount of pollutants in the water, they don't take samples of the water. They collect shellfish and sample their meat to see how full of toxins they are to get a more accurate reading on the water's health. Crazy, right? How about the lady that contracted a parasitic worm in her brain from eating pork? doctors though it was a turmor until they operated and discovered a parasite had died in her brain that she ingested from eating pork. Ironically, pork and shellfish are unclean animals in the Bible and advised against eating in Leviticus. Pretty much any bottom feeder (Talapia, flat fish, shellfish, pigs, reptiles, bats, fish without both scales and fins like eels, or catfish) are unclean and advised against eating. Cows, most birds, goats, lamb, most fish with both scales and fins, and deer are among some of the clean animals listed.
 
My sister-in-law is a dietitian at a major hospital. She convinced me to stop using white flour as often. Now I cut my breads and pizza crusts with 40-70% whole wheat flour. It just so happens that it's healthier, but it tastes a helluva lot better too.

I can't eat pesticide wax apples anymore. They all taste terrible now. Same with peanut butter that I didn't grind. Damn good tasting food. Feels communistic.
 
[quote name='von551']when i mentioned white flour, that included all things made with it, bread, tortillas, cereal, etc., although you can get whole wheat breads like Ezekiel. shellfish and pigs are bottom feeds and have a short, poor digestive tract. the excrete alot of the toxins/bacteria they ingest into their flesh. You know how some people are allergic to shellfish? Well, it's not the actual shellfish they're allergic to, but the pollutants in the meat of the shellfish. they absorb what they eat at the bottom of the ocean into their flesh. Another way to look at it is when scientists want to test the amount of pollutants in the water, they don't take samples of the water. They collect shellfish and sample their meat to see how full of toxins they are to get a more accurate reading on the water's health. Crazy, right? How about the lady that contracted a parasitic worm in her brain from eating pork? doctors though it was a turmor until they operated and discovered a parasite had died in her brain that she ingested from eating pork. Ironically, pork and shellfish are unclean animals in the Bible and advised against eating in Leviticus. Pretty much any bottom feeder (Talapia, flat fish, shellfish, pigs, reptiles, bats, fish without both scales and fins like eels, or catfish) are unclean and advised against eating. Cows, most birds, goats, lamb, most fish with both scales and fins, and deer are among some of the clean animals listed.[/QUOTE]

it's too easy to blanket statement that all bottom feeders, and all pigs are unhealthy to eat.

there's plenty of well raised pigs, and clean shellfish (tho sadly less and less) that are perfectly fine to eat - besides, unless you're wolfing down oysters every single day, those trace amounts aren't gonna kill you.

at least not anymore than the treated water in american cities (flouride etc.), and all other processed foods.
 
[quote name='von551']never heard of the stuff, but i was getting at the land being stripped of nutrients from overuse by farmers. looks like this stuff is only in amazon, not the great plains of USA where most of our food is grown, unfortunately. what kind of drugs in the water? how do they get there? clean, pure water is essential, seems hydroponic is only way to go for that though...[/QUOTE]

there are very very very few places where completely distilled water exists in the wild.

water with minerals is good for you depending on what they are.
 
[quote name='speedracer']My sister-in-law is a dietitian at a major hospital. She convinced me to stop using white flour as often. Now I cut my breads and pizza crusts with 40-70% whole wheat flour. It just so happens that it's healthier, but it tastes a helluva lot better too.

I can't eat pesticide wax apples anymore. They all taste terrible now. Same with peanut butter that I didn't grind. Damn good tasting food. Feels communistic.[/QUOTE]

have you ever tried veggiewash? supposed to work well, just never bothered, usually get fruits and veggies from farmer's market.
 
[quote name='von551'] Ironically, pork and shellfish are unclean animals in the Bible and advised against eating in Leviticus. Pretty much any bottom feeder (Talapia, flat fish, shellfish, pigs, reptiles, bats, fish without both scales and fins like eels, or catfish) are unclean and advised against eating. Cows, most birds, goats, lamb, most fish with both scales and fins, and deer are among some of the clean animals listed.[/QUOTE]

Yes, that is ironic. Trichinosis from undercooked pork is indeed a health risk.
Good thing the bible also warned us about the risk of e.coli from undercooked beef and the shadow of mad cow disease... oh wait.

A book that proposes some interesting, practical socio-economic reasons for sacred and profane designations of animals throughout the world is Cows, Pigs, Wars and Witches by Marvin Harris. LINK
 
Last edited by a moderator:
[quote name='looploop']Yes, that is ironic. Trichinosis from undercooked pork is indeed a health risk.
Good thing the bible also warned us about the risk of e.coli from undercooked beef and the shadow of mad cow disease... oh wait.

A book that proposes some interesting, practical socio-economic reasons for sacred and profane designations of animals throughout the world is Cows, Pigs, Wars and Witches by Marvin Harris. LINK[/QUOTE]

hey buddy, don't quote the Bible unless you know it. all throughout Leviticus the Bible commands Israelites to not eat raw meat. "And wherever you live, you must not eat the blood of any bird or animal." Leviticus 7:26. Isn't that how you get E.Coli? I thought so, looks like that's covered in the Bible too, ironic? What else? Oh, mad cow? ha, well that's man's doing there. Farmers feeding cows ground up dead cows, which were created by God as herbivores. That can't be good, right? The product called MBM is now banned to feed to cows, but you know what is still allowed to be fed this? Pigs, just one more reason to not touch pork. So you want the Bible to tell you about every disease in the future man causes? Gimme a break. anything else?
 
[quote name='Sleepkyng']it's too easy to blanket statement that all bottom feeders, and all pigs are unhealthy to eat.

there's plenty of well raised pigs, and clean shellfish (tho sadly less and less) that are perfectly fine to eat - besides, unless you're wolfing down oysters every single day, those trace amounts aren't gonna kill you.

at least not anymore than the treated water in american cities (flouride etc.), and all other processed foods.[/QUOTE]

why take the risk? our planet's becoming more and more polluted, you think it's ok to eat the garbage eaters of the earth? have you EVER seen ANY pork product claiming organic grain-fed pig? I haven't. It's an oxymoron. Pork is popular now because we have refrigeration and before then it would spoil in a day so nobody bothered with it. and also it's popular because it's cheap, the great depression made pork more popular because of how cheap it was compared to beef. i'd just rather not eat an animal that spends it's whole life eating other animal's crap or dead animals. take tilapia for instance, they just bring them into fish farm tanks after the farmed fish are taken out to eat all the fish crap in the tanks. that's not common knowledge to most people. only eat wild-caught fish and grain-fed non-hormone beef, goat, lamb, and chicken and you'll be alright.
 
[quote name='von551']hey buddy, don't quote the Bible unless you know it. all throughout Leviticus the Bible commands Israelites to not eat raw meat. "And wherever you live, you must not eat the blood of any bird or animal." Leviticus 7:26. Isn't that how you get E.Coli? I thought so, looks like that's covered in the Bible too, ironic? What else? Oh, mad cow? ha, well that's man's doing there. Farmers feeding cows ground up dead cows, which were created by God as herbivores. That can't be good, right? The product called MBM is now banned to feed to cows, but you know what is still allowed to be fed this? Pigs, just one more reason to not touch pork. So you want the Bible to tell you about every disease in the future man causes? Gimme a break. anything else?[/QUOTE]

Well technically feeding cows dead cows didn't create mad cow, it simply spread it when it normally would not have.

Though I'm sure there's something in Leviticus about not eating the retarded cows.

And of course there's nothing wrong with eating whatever animal (if you eat animals) whether deemed "unclean" or not, but there are more risks with eating some than others, which by the time of Leviticus the writers had learned from trial and error. Obviously all animals can carry disease and there is a certain amount of risk in eating them because of that (besides the risk of something like consuming too much saturated fat).
 
[quote name='von551']hey buddy, don't quote the Bible unless you know it. all throughout Leviticus the Bible commands Israelites to not eat raw meat. "And wherever you live, you must not eat the blood of any bird or animal." Leviticus 7:26. Isn't that how you get E.Coli? I thought so, looks like that's covered in the Bible too, ironic? What else? Oh, mad cow? ha, well that's man's doing there. Farmers feeding cows ground up dead cows, which were created by God as herbivores. That can't be good, right? The product called MBM is now banned to feed to cows, but you know what is still allowed to be fed this? Pigs, just one more reason to not touch pork. So you want the Bible to tell you about every disease in the future man causes? Gimme a break. anything else?[/QUOTE]

A great job missing the point, Von. When both a "clean" animal and an "unclean" animal can be made safe to eat(though to the detriment of one's soul), it's clear that these categories are, outside of a religious context, unreliable and inapplicable today.
If you want to argue against the safety of eating swine and shellfish then simply talk about that.
 
[quote name='rabbitt']I see von is spreading the poison of religion all over CAG. I've never blocked anyone, but I'm getting goddamn close.[/QUOTE]
Poison, huh? You're real tolerant.
 
HOW in the hell does a discussion about ORGANIC FOOD include crap from the Bible?! Oh, God!!!

Shut UP, Christians!
 
[quote name='fullmetalfan720']Poison, huh? You're real tolerant.[/QUOTE]

Tolerance goes to the extent they don't push shit on people as fact and truth. Once you overstep the boundary, it becomes mind-numbing poison.

I'm tolerant of beliefs, I'm not tolerant in extremists.
 
food science is an inexact science. I am honestly unsure what to think. First they say eggs are good, then they are bad, and now they are good again. They created margarine to be a healthier butter substitute, but it turned out margarine was much worse. Even if organic food is = to regular food, it has more positive side effects. I like my cows hormone free, it can create genetic diversity by having different types of the same crop grown in different areas, it support smaller farms, less chemicals used which equals less runoff into our drinking water. I am willing to pay more those things, have if they are better for you, so be it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
bread's done
Back
Top