Should Hamm give back the Gold?

Javery

Javery

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I think so. I for one couldn't stare at the gold medal for the rest of my life knowing I only won because of a scoring error. A Silver medal at the Olympics is still an amazing accomplishment and nothing to be looked down upon...
 
That's really tough. It's not his fault they screwed that up, and it is against the rules to review tape after the event. Maybe they screwed up the judging somewhere else, and it's all somewhat subjective anyway.

That said, I think they ought to award an additional gold to the Korean gymnast - they are considering that. He definitely should get a gold, but I don't think they should take away Hamm's.
 
The real question is why aren't the rules changed so that if the judges cheat or mess up the medals can be properly distributed to their rightful owners.
 
I don't think so, all of the judging in that sport is bullshit anyways, if you went back over the tape of the event and actually judged it by the book you'd most likely have a completely different winner then Hamm or the Korean anyway.
 
yeah, it's a tough one but it comes down to a math error, not a subjective determination of how well something was done. Too hard to call - it stinks though because if he gives it back he won't have a gold medal but if he keeps it, no matter what, it will always feel a little tainted. Dumbass judges.
 
It was not a question of whether or not they judged his routine correclty, but it was that he won it because the judges goofed in rating the parallel bar routine of Yang, giving it a starting value of 9.9 instead of the 10 it should have had. The extra one-tenth of a point would have given Yang the gold.
 
its not his fault that they screwed up, people screw up all the time, shit happens, it sucks that the korean got silver, but his team didnt put the appeal in time. if anything they should just take this instince to make better preperation and caution for future olympic games.


this is something michael savage should decide
 
It seems that every Oplympics, something or some judge goes wrong and scores somebody wrong. Alsoo there always is some judge getting paid off. Ehh whatever. I haven't seen this yet so i'll have to see it on SportsCenter.
 
It was not a question of whether or not they judged his routine correclty, but it was that he won it because the judges goofed in rating the parallel bar routine of Yang, giving it a starting value of 9.9 instead of the 10 it should have had. The extra one-tenth of a point would have given Yang the gold.
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It's all guesswork, though. A columnist from Slate.com pointed out that in reviewing the Korean's tape, he did four hold moves instead of the maximum allowance of three. Do you know how much of a deduction that is? TWO tenths of a point. The judges also missed that entirely and it would have actually lowered his score.

The results should stand as is, no way in hell should he have to give it back.
 
[quote name='Backlash']That's really tough. It's not his fault they screwed that up, and it is against the rules to review tape after the event. Maybe they screwed up the judging somewhere else, and it's all somewhat subjective anyway.

That said, I think they ought to award an additional gold to the Korean gymnast - they are considering that. He definitely should get a gold, but I don't think they should take away Hamm's.[/quote]

Yeah I agree, they shouldn't take away a gold medal after its distributed.
 
[quote name='Scrubking']The real question is why aren't the rules changed so that if the judges cheat or mess up the medals can be properly distributed to their rightful owners.[/quote]

I agree with this also.
 
The review of the Korean's performance actually revealed two things. First the starting value should have been 10. Second the judges failed to deduct for one of his mistakes. It's a wash. If they re-evaluate the Korean's performance as a whole, he still loses. If the Korean wants his performance reviewed, he should request that his un-scored mistake also be counted.

The mistake occurred early in the event. Both competitor's knew the scores they would need in order to win from that point. Hamm did what he needed to do. The Korean blew a big lead. He has no one but himself to blame.
 
[quote name='secretvampire']
It was not a question of whether or not they judged his routine correclty, but it was that he won it because the judges goofed in rating the parallel bar routine of Yang, giving it a starting value of 9.9 instead of the 10 it should have had. The extra one-tenth of a point would have given Yang the gold.
Click to expand...

It's all guesswork, though. A columnist from Slate.com pointed out that in reviewing the Korean's tape, he did four hold moves instead of the maximum allowance of three. Do you know how much of a deduction that is? TWO tenths of a point. The judges also missed that entirely and it would have actually lowered his score.

The results should stand as is, no way in hell should he have to give it back.[/quote]

ooohh I didn't know about that - he should definitely keep it then...
 
just give them both a gold, judges are losers, we shouldn't strip someone of a higher rank when,by rules he won it, but the korean shouldn't lose a gold when he obviously won it
 
ooohh I didn't know about that - he should definitely keep it then...
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But regardless, they shouldn't judge it based on a taped replay a day later. This is a horrible precedent to set for any sport. Just think what would happen if you could review any sporting event on tape the next day and try to correct the judges/referees mistakes! It would be absolute chaos.

just give them both a gold, judges are losers, we shouldn't strip someone of a higher rank when,by rules he won it, but the korean shouldn't lose a gold when he obviously won it
Click to expand...

Well, the problem is that he didn't obviously win, I've already pointed out a negative point against the Korean that was not caught. All that does is encourage every whiny brat who loses by a small margin to protest and try to pick apart his/her opponent's performance on the video tape. You pretty much just have to take measures to minimize any mistakes, but judges are human and mistakes will always occur.
 
If Hamm gives the medal to Yang, he would be the big hero of the games. I understand he's worked his entire life for the Olympics, but there is always going to be and asterisk beside his win now. Whether Yang won or not, Hamm could be the bigger man and give him the gold. The prestige he would get for that would be worth a thousand gold medals.
 
I think that is a non-issue compaired to the judges hating on the Russians.

After giving a Russian gymnist a VERY low score for a near perfect routine the crowd was yelling and it want on for about 10 minutes. The Canadian and Malaysian judges were forced to increase their scores.
 
Yeah, Nemov got screwed big time, he did 6 release skils, it was insane! And that sucked for Hamm too, cuz how are you supposed to concentrate after all that?
 
[quote name='Mr. Anderson']Uh....can somebody explain to me whats going on? I haven't watched much of the Olympics.[/quote]

One dude lost a tenth of a point b/c the judges made his start value 1/210 of a point too low. What people fail to realize is that he made an illegal move during his routine (4 hand somethings - i don't know the technical side of gymnastics) which would have cost him 2/10 of a point if the judges had seen it.

Short story: Hamm won fiar and sqare

You can read about what I just wrote @ cnnsi.com
 
No, he shouldn't give back his gold.
The protest was submitted after the awards ceremony, proper protocol was not followed.
Plus with all the developments about a deduction not being made on the illegal move in his routine I think they should just keep things the way they are.
 
In this case, there is an easy example of the athlete having been judged incorrecly in his favor and also against his favor. One is more subjective than the other, but as was said, the universe has not spun off its axis, and all is still right with the world.

More importantly though, there should be checks in place to ensure that any and all mistakes by the judges (which are objective) are caught immediately. I mean you have hundred of people making sure terrorists cannot enjoy the olympics, so you can spare a few people whose job it is to doublecheck everything so that the type of error where starting score is incorrect does not take hours later to come to light.

As for the medal, it should be donated to McDonalds, melted down into small pieces and awarded to random winners in the next Monopoly game.
 
The real problem here goes back to the Canadian pair skaters at the Winter Games. They, and the judging scandal, opened the door for every person who didn't win the gold to complain that the judging was unfair. The russians are complaining, Khorkina (Russian Female Gymnast) said that she knew in advance that the judges would give Carly Patterson the gold. There are procedures in place to comlain about the scoring IN THE MOMENT. You don't get a day to review and double check. You've got a coaching staff, one of those people should be watching the scoring like a hawk, doubel and triple checking the judges results. If you find an error, you complain THEN. Otherwise you open up all competitions for weeks of fine toothed combing over the routines.

Look at the NFL, they acknowledge, after the fact, ref errors that cost teams playoff games. But they do not overturn results. And an additional playoff game can mean hundreds of thousands of dollars in lost revenue for the team that got screwed.

The alternative, the olympics degenerate into battles over which country has the best lawyers.
 
Hamm should keep it and all the judges should be shot. I mean come on, wrong point value, too many grab holds, allowing video replay, and who knows what else. Horrible.
 
[quote name='abrannan']The real problem here goes back to the Canadian pair skaters at the Winter Games. They, and the judging scandal, opened the door for every person who didn't win the gold to complain that the judging was unfair. The russians are complaining, Khorkina (Russian Female Gymnast) said that she knew in advance that the judges would give Carly Patterson the gold. There are procedures in place to comlain about the scoring IN THE MOMENT. You don't get a day to review and double check. You've got a coaching staff, one of those people should be watching the scoring like a hawk, doubel and triple checking the judges results. If you find an error, you complain THEN. Otherwise you open up all competitions for weeks of fine toothed combing over the routines.

Look at the NFL, they acknowledge, after the fact, ref errors that cost teams playoff games. But they do not overturn results. And an additional playoff game can mean hundreds of thousands of dollars in lost revenue for the team that got screwed.

The alternative, the olympics degenerate into battles over which country has the best lawyers.[/quote]

I really felt that Khorkina should have taken the gold. Pure personal preference for me. For or some odd reason, I've become a big fan of Khorkina and gymnatics in general after just watching her for the first time at this year's Olympics. I agree with your points, though.

Its odd how people are capitalizing on the scoring mistake and how Hamm should share or doesn't deserve the gold medal, but never mention that the Korean did the 4 holds instead of 3. I've never even heard about it before reading this thread.
 
I don't think Hamm should give the medal back. He won it according to the rules and they did not challenge the score right away when they were supposed to.

I do want to say that the part about the judges missing one deduction is irrelevent. I really don't think they should use that as an excuse for Hamm not giving the medal back. I am sure they would also find something they missed in Hamm's performance if they went back and reviewed tape of him also. All they need to say is that he won by the rules and leave it at that.

Both sides just need to let it go and quit making excuses about who should have the medal.
 
Judges are human, and make mistakes like everyone else. That comes with any sport. I agree with whoever said it before, but that sets a dangerous precedent for the Olympics if he is forced to turn over the gold. The judges awarded him the gold, so the ruling should stand.

That being said, Hamm should give the medal back on his own, who knows what doors that perceived selfless act will open up for him.
 
[quote name='MrBadExample']If Hamm gives the medal to Yang, he would be the big hero of the games. I understand he's worked his entire life for the Olympics, but there is always going to be and asterisk beside his win now. Whether Yang won or not, Hamm could be the bigger man and give him the gold. The prestige he would get for that would be worth a thousand gold medals.[/quote]

the only part is that hamm's coaches would never allow him to give the medal back even if he wanted to. the usa olympic team gets more endorsements if they have more golds. there is always a running medal coount, and there is big nationalist pride in saying "our country won the most golds"
 
He should keep the medal. Whatever is done with the medal should be the Olympics' business, not his, because he had nothing to do with the error that got him the medal.. it was totally on the judges. If you wanted to be nitpicky you could say there's lots of times where judges went too high/too low, but thats why there's no video review. Because the arguements would never end.

If the olympics said give it up, fine, but if they didn't rule anything, he should keep it.
 
[quote name='dracula'][quote name='MrBadExample']If Hamm gives the medal to Yang, he would be the big hero of the games. I understand he's worked his entire life for the Olympics, but there is always going to be and asterisk beside his win now. Whether Yang won or not, Hamm could be the bigger man and give him the gold. The prestige he would get for that would be worth a thousand gold medals.[/quote]

the only part is that hamm's coaches would never allow him to give the medal back even if he wanted to. the usa olympic team gets more endorsements if they have more golds. there is always a running medal coount, and there is big nationalist pride in saying "our country won the most golds"[/quote]

I'd be surprised if Hamm gets any endorsements after this scandal. He stood to make more money if he gave it back when the point discrepancy was first discovered.
 
After learning more about the Hamm incident, I believe he should keep it. Oh and Alexei Nemov had an awesome performance that he should have won the gold by.
 
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