The 'Jimmy King' Wrestling Thread
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strongpimphand
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I don't want Danielson to win....but it would make sense in a sense.
He has a title. So for him to lose KOTR wouldn't really make...sense.
And it's not like it's the cruiserweight title neither.
He has a title. So for him to lose KOTR wouldn't really make...sense.
And it's not like it's the cruiserweight title neither.
007
CAGiversary!
If I were booking KotR this year, it'd go to either Del Rio or Sheamus.
My issue is that, frankly, KotR means absolutely nothing. This isn't winning the Royal Rumble, or headlining WrestleMania, or, hell, it isn't winning MitB. It's nothing. KotR means as much as Survivor Series does, which means you need someone who can elevate the title.
It used to be that it was a title that was meant to elevate the person it was given to, which was hit or miss (Mabel, Billy Gunn) at best. Now, with how much it's been neutered and, frankly, forgotten, you need a wrestler who *makes* it mean something. Del Rio and Sheamus are the only two that fit that bill. Truthfully, I'd hand it to Del Rio, who would get the title over more than the WWE has in a decade. It needs a smarmy heel persona to make it a 'thing' again, and Del Rio is that guy. Sheamus would be a fine substitute, but they have to write him a little better... it also runs under the assumption that it would lead into the HHH return feud.
Morrison is a terrible choice. I'll assert it... Morrison is the Billy Gunn of this tournament. He's a man with middling fan support, no true charater, and yet is being pushed hard right now. To think that KotR is going to change any of his faults, especially with what it means now, is ludicrous. What changes if he wins? Nothing, except now he gets introduced as 'King' Morrison. He isn't getting himself over, and he won't be able to get KotR over. Like I said, Billy Gunn. Just because he won King of the Ring doesn't change the fact that he's still BILLY GUNN. Fact.
So, no Morrison, Danielson, Jackson, or (holy shit no) McIntyre. Del Rio is the best choice, Sheamus is #2 if they want to build the HHH feud, and I think Rhodes would be a great #3. Just my opinion.
Oh, and the sheer fact that I typed that and totally forgot Kingston was in the tournament? That about covers him, yeah.
My issue is that, frankly, KotR means absolutely nothing. This isn't winning the Royal Rumble, or headlining WrestleMania, or, hell, it isn't winning MitB. It's nothing. KotR means as much as Survivor Series does, which means you need someone who can elevate the title.
It used to be that it was a title that was meant to elevate the person it was given to, which was hit or miss (Mabel, Billy Gunn) at best. Now, with how much it's been neutered and, frankly, forgotten, you need a wrestler who *makes* it mean something. Del Rio and Sheamus are the only two that fit that bill. Truthfully, I'd hand it to Del Rio, who would get the title over more than the WWE has in a decade. It needs a smarmy heel persona to make it a 'thing' again, and Del Rio is that guy. Sheamus would be a fine substitute, but they have to write him a little better... it also runs under the assumption that it would lead into the HHH return feud.
Morrison is a terrible choice. I'll assert it... Morrison is the Billy Gunn of this tournament. He's a man with middling fan support, no true charater, and yet is being pushed hard right now. To think that KotR is going to change any of his faults, especially with what it means now, is ludicrous. What changes if he wins? Nothing, except now he gets introduced as 'King' Morrison. He isn't getting himself over, and he won't be able to get KotR over. Like I said, Billy Gunn. Just because he won King of the Ring doesn't change the fact that he's still BILLY GUNN. Fact.
So, no Morrison, Danielson, Jackson, or (holy shit no) McIntyre. Del Rio is the best choice, Sheamus is #2 if they want to build the HHH feud, and I think Rhodes would be a great #3. Just my opinion.
Oh, and the sheer fact that I typed that and totally forgot Kingston was in the tournament? That about covers him, yeah.
Ansé Solis
Banned
Great post! I think Rhodes should get it.
mykevermin
CAGiversary!
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I don't know that it 'means nothing.' It was always used previously as a way to catapult someone to the upper card - but 15 years ago, there were few formal avenues to do that other than KOTR or the IC title. Today there's a bajillion ways to get there, which makes KOTR seem less important, or perhaps even unncessary.
Looking at the lineup, you have a number of guys who need that extra bit of proof to show they can be in the upper card (and let's be honest, the WWE upper card is waning both in the number of dudes there as well as who still remains - Edge? Kane? Zoinks!). KOTR is one way of establishing someone as a main eventer, unless the winner ends up "Billy Gunning" the whole ordeal (still one of my favorite verbs used in pro wrestling ever).
The KOTR is full of guys who have seen stutter-start non-main event pushes in the past 12-24 months. Sheamus is feuding with the George The Animal Steele/Eugene/Evad Sullivan retard character on Raw right now - and on the losing end; Kofi Kingston took it to Randy Orton just over a year ago, showing an aggressive side of him that, IMO, really latched onto the crowd. Morrisson is on his way to the main event, but hasn't done much of anything in 2010 to get in a position to be a serious PPV main eventer. Other competitors (Daniel Bryan, Del Rio, Zeke) are on their way, but it's waaaaay too early for them, and others (Cody Rhodes, Drew McIntyre) just are nowhere near ready for a KOTR win and subsequent push, but they neatly fill out the 8 with 'name' talent. Maybe one of them can get to the finals and look good in the process, and KOTR can be used to get two dudes over.
I think it's more important than you, 007, but I'm still not going to the show tonight.
Looking at the lineup, you have a number of guys who need that extra bit of proof to show they can be in the upper card (and let's be honest, the WWE upper card is waning both in the number of dudes there as well as who still remains - Edge? Kane? Zoinks!). KOTR is one way of establishing someone as a main eventer, unless the winner ends up "Billy Gunning" the whole ordeal (still one of my favorite verbs used in pro wrestling ever).
The KOTR is full of guys who have seen stutter-start non-main event pushes in the past 12-24 months. Sheamus is feuding with the George The Animal Steele/Eugene/Evad Sullivan retard character on Raw right now - and on the losing end; Kofi Kingston took it to Randy Orton just over a year ago, showing an aggressive side of him that, IMO, really latched onto the crowd. Morrisson is on his way to the main event, but hasn't done much of anything in 2010 to get in a position to be a serious PPV main eventer. Other competitors (Daniel Bryan, Del Rio, Zeke) are on their way, but it's waaaaay too early for them, and others (Cody Rhodes, Drew McIntyre) just are nowhere near ready for a KOTR win and subsequent push, but they neatly fill out the 8 with 'name' talent. Maybe one of them can get to the finals and look good in the process, and KOTR can be used to get two dudes over.
I think it's more important than you, 007, but I'm still not going to the show tonight.
masked lemon
CAGiversary!
Del Rio is the obvious choice.
007
CAGiversary!
[quote name='mykevermin']I don't know that it 'means nothing.' It was always used previously as a way to catapult someone to the upper card - but 15 years ago, there were few formal avenues to do that other than KOTR or the IC title. Today there's a bajillion ways to get there, which makes KOTR seem less important, or perhaps even unncessary.
Looking at the lineup, you have a number of guys who need that extra bit of proof to show they can be in the upper card (and let's be honest, the WWE upper card is waning both in the number of dudes there as well as who still remains - Edge? Kane? Zoinks!). KOTR is one way of establishing someone as a main eventer, unless the winner ends up "Billy Gunning" the whole ordeal (still one of my favorite verbs used in pro wrestling ever).
The KOTR is full of guys who have seen stutter-start non-main event pushes in the past 12-24 months. Sheamus is feuding with the George The Animal Steele/Eugene/Evad Sullivan retard character on Raw right now - and on the losing end; Kofi Kingston took it to Randy Orton just over a year ago, showing an aggressive side of him that, IMO, really latched onto the crowd. Morrisson is on his way to the main event, but hasn't done much of anything in 2010 to get in a position to be a serious PPV main eventer. Other competitors (Daniel Bryan, Del Rio, Zeke) are on their way, but it's waaaaay too early for them, and others (Cody Rhodes, Drew McIntyre) just are nowhere near ready for a KOTR win and subsequent push, but they neatly fill out the 8 with 'name' talent. Maybe one of them can get to the finals and look good in the process, and KOTR can be used to get two dudes over.
I think it's more important than you, 007, but I'm still not going to the show tonight.[/QUOTE]
I guess I have trouble not looking at it from the 'what have you done for me lately?' perspective. To people like you and I, KotR means something, or at least used to. We know the history of it, we see why it was important, and we see what it did for certain wrestlers.
Problem is, this isn't our wrestling anymore. For the legions of, forgive the generalization, 'Cena fan' fans, KotR isn't really something that is relevant. Let's be fair here... the last 'real' KotR was Brock Lesnar in 2002. That was EIGHT years ago, which is two lifetimes in wrestling. Think about what the WWE has become since then, and it's tough not to see that the people they're selling the product to now have no frame of reference for KotR. Sure, there were half-baked re-launches in 2006 and 2008, but it just wasn't the same. Personally, the legacy of KotR ended in 2002, but that's only my opinion.
It's also a bit antiquated now because of something that's evolved over the past few years, and that's the idea that winning in of itself doesn't mean anything. Now, with the Rumble, MitB, Elimination Chamber, etc... it's all about *what* you get for winning, not the bragging rights (ugh, sorry) of simply coming out on top. It's why, I think, Survivor Series and KotR have fallen by the wayside... there's no true 'benefit' to winning. With the death of kayfabe and how unimportant wins and losses are, they've become completely unexciting to the average fan. Great, he's a King. So what? Unless they can cash the crown in for a title shot, I don't think people are all that excited.
I want to be wrong. I'd *love* to be wrong. I hope this turns into a great springboard for a younger talent. I just don't have a ton of faith in WWE to make it happen the right way.
Boy, I might as well just save that last part, because that's useful for almost any discussion in this thread. Ha.
Looking at the lineup, you have a number of guys who need that extra bit of proof to show they can be in the upper card (and let's be honest, the WWE upper card is waning both in the number of dudes there as well as who still remains - Edge? Kane? Zoinks!). KOTR is one way of establishing someone as a main eventer, unless the winner ends up "Billy Gunning" the whole ordeal (still one of my favorite verbs used in pro wrestling ever).
The KOTR is full of guys who have seen stutter-start non-main event pushes in the past 12-24 months. Sheamus is feuding with the George The Animal Steele/Eugene/Evad Sullivan retard character on Raw right now - and on the losing end; Kofi Kingston took it to Randy Orton just over a year ago, showing an aggressive side of him that, IMO, really latched onto the crowd. Morrisson is on his way to the main event, but hasn't done much of anything in 2010 to get in a position to be a serious PPV main eventer. Other competitors (Daniel Bryan, Del Rio, Zeke) are on their way, but it's waaaaay too early for them, and others (Cody Rhodes, Drew McIntyre) just are nowhere near ready for a KOTR win and subsequent push, but they neatly fill out the 8 with 'name' talent. Maybe one of them can get to the finals and look good in the process, and KOTR can be used to get two dudes over.
I think it's more important than you, 007, but I'm still not going to the show tonight.[/QUOTE]
I guess I have trouble not looking at it from the 'what have you done for me lately?' perspective. To people like you and I, KotR means something, or at least used to. We know the history of it, we see why it was important, and we see what it did for certain wrestlers.
Problem is, this isn't our wrestling anymore. For the legions of, forgive the generalization, 'Cena fan' fans, KotR isn't really something that is relevant. Let's be fair here... the last 'real' KotR was Brock Lesnar in 2002. That was EIGHT years ago, which is two lifetimes in wrestling. Think about what the WWE has become since then, and it's tough not to see that the people they're selling the product to now have no frame of reference for KotR. Sure, there were half-baked re-launches in 2006 and 2008, but it just wasn't the same. Personally, the legacy of KotR ended in 2002, but that's only my opinion.
It's also a bit antiquated now because of something that's evolved over the past few years, and that's the idea that winning in of itself doesn't mean anything. Now, with the Rumble, MitB, Elimination Chamber, etc... it's all about *what* you get for winning, not the bragging rights (ugh, sorry) of simply coming out on top. It's why, I think, Survivor Series and KotR have fallen by the wayside... there's no true 'benefit' to winning. With the death of kayfabe and how unimportant wins and losses are, they've become completely unexciting to the average fan. Great, he's a King. So what? Unless they can cash the crown in for a title shot, I don't think people are all that excited.
I want to be wrong. I'd *love* to be wrong. I hope this turns into a great springboard for a younger talent. I just don't have a ton of faith in WWE to make it happen the right way.
Boy, I might as well just save that last part, because that's useful for almost any discussion in this thread. Ha.
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strongpimphand
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Scared to make one since on account of the dibs called frequently and the secret dibs and the expected dibs....
Obviously though, whomever makes it NEEDS to just make it centered around either Juan Cena or the disturbed girl.
Obviously though, whomever makes it NEEDS to just make it centered around either Juan Cena or the disturbed girl.
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