The NFL refs CHEAT?!

[quote name='Mex25']What are you talking about?! If it wasn't for those dumb mistakes, the fumbles, then the pats would have at least still been on the scoreboard. The only reason denver beat new england was because of the dumb mistake they made and some bullshit calls by the ref. Now I know you didn't watch the game.[/QUOTE]

did u even fuckin read my post? i said part of the reason Denver won is because they took advantage of Patriots fuck ups/mistakes. but ur using the mistakes and "bad calls" as an excuse. What, do you think they are just gonna give the ball back to the Patriots after the Patriots give it to them? The Broncos are better than the Patriots and they beat them when it counts. Enough said.
 
[quote name='WinnieThePujols']The speed of the game is so unbelievably fast that officials are bound to make mistakes every once in a while.

Did I agree with the Troy Polomalu call? No, I didn't. Did I agree with that pass interference call? No, I didn't. But bad calls happen. That's part of the game. They officials don't ultimately decide the game, though... the players do.

The average NFL game has what... 100? 120 plays? You think that a bad call in one or two of them is really going to make a difference? Yeah... it could. But ultimately, if a team plays well and, more importantly, better than they're opponent... they're more often than not going to win.

The NFL is not rigged. End of story.[/QUOTE]

I don't believe the NFL is rigged or anything but I do believe that most mistakes can and should be eliminated via instant replay. And I strongly believe that one bad call can sway a game - especially against two closely matched playoff teams. It's the same reasoning as to why a team who loses the turnover battle in the playoffs loses like 80% of the time - the teams are so equal that any advantage can affect the outcome of the game.

The Polomalu call was perhaps the worst call I've ever seen in any sport ever. By definition and league rules he made the catch - end of story. This isn't a "judgment call" or anything like that - he either caught the ball or didn't. We had several angles available and all of them showed him catching the ball by the textbook definition of a catch in the NFL. Nevermind the fact that the call on the field was an interception so you needed indisputable visual evidence to overturn it. It was an absolute joke of a call - how can the ref be the only person viewing the replays who not only thought it wasn't a catch but thought it was indisputable?

The pass interference was also a terrible call but at least it was within the rules of the game - the ref made a judgment and called it like he saw it. The rules state that this type of call is nonreviewable so I can live with it (even though it was a horrible horrible call).

While I'm at it - I hate when the refs blow a play dead. There were plenty of questionable fumbles that were nonreviewable because the ref blew the whistle. The NFL should mandate that every play be played out until it ends even if the refs are 99% sure the ground caused the fumble or whatever. They can huddle after the play and make that ruling but at least let the other team challenge the call.

Whew!
 
[quote name='javeryh']I don't believe the NFL is rigged or anything but I do believe that most mistakes can and should be eliminated via instant replay. And I strongly believe that one bad call can sway a game - especially against two closely matched playoff teams. It's the same reasoning as to why a team who loses the turnover battle in the playoffs loses like 80% of the time - the teams are so equal that any advantage can affect the outcome of the game.

[/QUOTE]

They already brought back instant replay because everyone threw a hissy fit a few years ago. But it still doesn't matter, look at the Polomalu play and the Bailey pylon play. The refs still made very questionable/wrong calls. The bottom line is, people make mistakes, so get over it. The NFL isn't rigging anything (cmon, you think Seattle would be a superbowl contender if they were). Nobody wants there to be infinite replays, or even say, 3 a quarter. It would slow the game down and actually be very annoying.
 
[quote name='iheartmetal']They already brought back instant replay because everyone threw a hissy fit a few years ago. But it still doesn't matter, look at the Polomalu play and the Bailey pylon play. The refs still made very questionable/wrong calls. The bottom line is, people make mistakes, so get over it. The NFL isn't rigging anything (cmon, you think Seattle would be a superbowl contender if they were). Nobody wants there to be infinite replays, or even say, 3 a quarter. It would slow the game down and actually be very annoying.[/QUOTE]

I said I didn't think the NFL was rigging anything but as a fan, I'd rather they spend an extra 15 minutes a game and get more calls right than be pissed about it forever. Of course nothing will be perfect but I think there is a way to improve drastically on the current system. Two major things they could do are (1) let every play go to the end (don't blow a play dead) and then make the call and (2) get a group of at least 3 refs (instead of the head guy) to look at the replays on a challenge.

I couldn't imagine how annoyed I'd be if I were a Steelers fan and they ended up losing that game... oh wait, I can because the Giants got the no-call three years ago against the 49ers on the last play of the game and lost (the NFL even admitted it was a blown call). As a fan, you never forget crap like that.
 
the refs this past weekend sucked. But what are the other options. Fans of teams that got screwed over, will just have to deal with it.
 
[quote name='ryanbph']the refs this past weekend sucked. But what are the other options. Fans of teams that got screwed over, will just have to deal with it.[/QUOTE]


That's bullshit because it doesn't have to be that way. Things CAN be changed.
 
[quote name='javeryh']I don't believe the NFL is rigged or anything but I do believe that most mistakes can and should be eliminated via instant replay. And I strongly believe that one bad call can sway a game - especially against two closely matched playoff teams. It's the same reasoning as to why a team who loses the turnover battle in the playoffs loses like 80% of the time - the teams are so equal that any advantage can affect the outcome of the game.[/quote]

Here's the thing: I don't show sympathy for teams that get bad calls. That's part of the game. Ultimately, the biggest factor in the loss would've been the Bettis fumble. It doesn't matter what happened before that. Even if Polomalu did pick it off, then what? Would the Steelers have been in a better position to end the game? I'd say so. But regardless, that hardly cost them the game.

Remember a few years ago when the 49ers scored 25 unanswered points in the second half to beat the Giants? Score ended like 37-36, I think. On the last play of the game, there was blatant pass interference that wasn't called. Had it been called, the Giants were almost guaranteed to win.

Guess who didn't care? Me. Yes, I'm a 49ers fan. More importantly, though, the Giants sat on their asses and blew 25 points worth of a lead and let the game slip away. One play did not decide that game... en entire half of half-assing did.

Same applies for the Steelers. They were up how much, at one point? 18 points or so? Had they have lost, you would've heard Steelers fans saying the only reason they lost was because of the "incomplete" pass. No. They lost because they didn't play well with that lead. End of story. It's more than the interception. Was it a momentum swing? Yeah. It doesn't matter. Good teams can overcome that.


[quote name='javeryh']The Polomalu call was perhaps the worst call I've ever seen in any sport ever. By definition and league rules he made the catch - end of story. This isn't a "judgment call" or anything like that - he either caught the ball or didn't. We had several angles available and all of them showed him catching the ball by the textbook definition of a catch in the NFL. Nevermind the fact that the call on the field was an interception so you needed indisputable visual evidence to overturn it. It was an absolute joke of a call - how can the ref be the only person viewing the replays who not only thought it wasn't a catch but thought it was indisputable?[/quote]

Exactly. It was a horrible call. Without a shadow of a doubt in his mind, that was an interception?! Bad call? Yes. Conspiracy? God I hate some people.


[quote name='javeryh']The pass interference was also a terrible call but at least it was within the rules of the game - the ref made a judgment and called it like he saw it. The rules state that this type of call is nonreviewable so I can live with it (even though it was a horrible horrible call). [/quote]

Had to work, didn't see it.


[quote name='javeryh']While I'm at it - I hate when the refs blow a play dead. There were plenty of questionable fumbles that were nonreviewable because the ref blew the whistle. The NFL should mandate that every play be played out until it ends even if the refs are 99% sure the ground caused the fumble or whatever. They can huddle after the play and make that ruling but at least let the other team challenge the call.[/QUOTE]

Agreed.


This is a huge rant. Bad calls happen, though. That's sports. You live with it. I remember in the NLCS this year there were absolutely horrendous calls against the Cardinals. Did I complain about the umpires? Hell yeah! Was I irate? Of course! But did I claim that the league is rigged and suggest some conspiracy theory? No, I didn't, because that's asinine.
 
I'll always believe the NFL Rigs the games to keep them close and exciting, but i dont think fixing the ultimate outcome to either team is their true purpose.
 
[quote name='WinnieThePujols']Here's the thing: I don't show sympathy for teams that get bad calls. That's part of the game. Ultimately, the biggest factor in the loss would've been the Bettis fumble. It doesn't matter what happened before that. Even if Polomalu did pick it off, then what? Would the Steelers have been in a better position to end the game? I'd say so. But regardless, that hardly cost them the game.

Remember a few years ago when the 49ers scored 25 unanswered points in the second half to beat the Giants? Score ended like 37-36, I think. On the last play of the game, there was blatant pass interference that wasn't called. Had it been called, the Giants were almost guaranteed to win.

Guess who didn't care? Me. Yes, I'm a 49ers fan. More importantly, though, the Giants sat on their asses and blew 25 points worth of a lead and let the game slip away. One play did not decide that game... en entire half of half-assing did.

Same applies for the Steelers. They were up how much, at one point? 18 points or so? Had they have lost, you would've heard Steelers fans saying the only reason they lost was because of the "incomplete" pass. No. They lost because they didn't play well with that lead. End of story. It's more than the interception. Was it a momentum swing? Yeah. It doesn't matter. Good teams can overcome that.[/quote]

We are going to totally disagree on this one (and not just because I'm a Giants fan ;)). I'd agrue that yeah the awful second 1/2 by the Giants giving up 3 TDs and 3 2-point conversions obviously played a huge role in why they lost but what about the 49ers horrid first half? If they had fallen short, everyone would be saying it was a nice comeback but the poor play in the first half killed them. The whole game matters - every play - it's what ultimately leads to the outcome and final score.

That is a great example though - that bad call was on the last play of the game. It went against the Giants and they lost - the Giants had no chance to overcome it. Were the 49ers the better team? I don't know but they sure were luckier by getting that crucial game-deciding call to go their way. By your logic, every good team should win every game soundly so referee errors wouldn't really matter but that can't be true, can it? Aren't playoff games supposed to be close and evenly matched?

I do believe that had the Steelers lost it would have been a direct result of that play. Sure the Steelers proceeded to give up like 50 yards, a TD and the 2-point conversion in 30 seconds which wasn't the fault of the referees but it all flowed from that one call. There were 5 minutes left. The Colts were down 21-10. Assuming the Steelers did absolutely nothing on that drive (3 and out) they still could have taken the clock down to the 2 minute warning before punting and the Colts would have needed 2 scores to tie or win the game - in the final two minutes.

Also, I don't think you can compare the NFL to MLB. There is no instant replay in baseball. In football you have the opportunity to get every play right almost every time so they should be striving for that. In baseball a bad call is "part of the game" because nothing can be done about it - not so in football...
 
I doubt any official in the world wouldve flagged SanFran on that play......I mean it was a botched Field Goal and a busted play......even though he did interfere.
 
[quote name='javeryh']We are going to totally disagree on this one (and not just because I'm a Giants fan ;)). I'd agrue that yeah the awful second 1/2 by the Giants giving up 3 TDs and 3 2-point conversions obviously played a huge role in why they lost but what about the 49ers horrid first half? If they had fallen short, everyone would be saying it was a nice comeback but the poor play in the first half killed them. The whole game matters - every play - it's what ultimately leads to the outcome and final score. [/quote]

Really never considered that.

By the way, let's go back to that Giants game: why was there a questionable play at the end of the game, anyway? Because the Giants couldn't (this was evident earlier in the game too) exceute a basic snap, place and kick. Bad execution (especially of basic, fundamental aspects of the gap) never garners sympathy on my part.

[quote name='javeryh']That is a great example though - that bad call was on the last play of the game. It went against the Giants and they lost - the Giants had no chance to overcome it. Were the 49ers the better team? I don't know but they sure were luckier by getting that crucial game-deciding call to go their way. By your logic, every good team should win every game soundly so referee errors wouldn't really matter but that can't be true, can it? Aren't playoff games supposed to be close and evenly matched? [/quote]

No, I'm saying that given the situation -- up 11 points with "not much" time to go -- a team can't place all the blame on one single play (hypothetically assuming they had lost). They did a handful of things wrong/poorly after the interception, and there's no excuse for that. As a result, I show no sympathy.

[quote name='javeryh']I do believe that had the Steelers lost it would have been a direct result of that play. Sure the Steelers proceeded to give up like 50 yards, a TD and the 2-point conversion in 30 seconds which wasn't the fault of the referees but it all flowed from that one call. There were 5 minutes left. The Colts were down 21-10. Assuming the Steelers did absolutely nothing on that drive (3 and out) they still could have taken the clock down to the 2 minute warning before punting and the Colts would have needed 2 scores to tie or win the game - in the final two minutes. [/quote]

So had the Steelers lost... what did Jerome Bettis's fumble have to do with the would-be interception? Nothing. Absolutely nothing. It doesn't matter if the interception stood or not... at the time of that play, the Steelers still had an 11 point lead (I believe)! If Jerome Bettis didn't fumble that ball, this wouldn't be a discussion. Period.

And back to that fumble again... who would have predicted he would've fumbled that? No one. So how can you be so sure that the Steelers were even assured a 3-and-out?

[quote name='javeryh']Also, I don't think you can compare the NFL to MLB. There is no instant replay in baseball. In football you have the opportunity to get every play right almost every time so they should be striving for that. In baseball a bad call is "part of the game" because nothing can be done about it - not so in football...[/QUOTE]

They're more comparable than you think. While you can't go to instant replay in baseball, there is ocassionally a meeting in which the umpires will gather on the field and say what they saw. This, although not often, does lead to calls being overturned... While it's obviously not instant replay, it still has the same concept behind it...
 
[quote name='WinnieThePujols']Really never considered that.

So had the Steelers lost... what did Jerome Bettis's fumble have to do with the would-be interception? Nothing. Absolutely nothing. It doesn't matter if the interception stood or not... at the time of that play, the Steelers still had an 11 point lead (I believe)! If Jerome Bettis didn't fumble that ball, this wouldn't be a discussion. Period.

And back to that fumble again... who would have predicted he would've fumbled that? No one. So how can you be so sure that the Steelers were even assured a 3-and-out?


[/QUOTE]

Maybe you missed the part that Bettis wouldn't have been in that position had the interception been called right. Yes Bettis fucked up, but it was the refs that put him in that position, so to say it wasn't a factor is ignorant.

And it seems that that is the only call people are harping on. there were AT LEAST 3 other HORRIBLE calls/no calls during the game too.
 
[quote name='Deadpool']Maybe you missed the part that Bettis wouldn't have been in that position had the interception been called right. Yes Bettis fucked up, but it was the refs that put him in that position, so to say it wasn't a factor is ignorant.

And it seems that that is the only call people are harping on. there were AT LEAST 3 other HORRIBLE calls/no calls during the game too.[/QUOTE]

First of al, it's not ignorance.

Second of all, it's just as silly to say that an overturned interception directly lead to the erasing of an 11-point lead.
 
[quote name='WinnieThePujols']First of al, it's not ignorance.

Second of all, it's just as silly to say that an overturned interception directly lead to the erasing of an 11-point lead.[/QUOTE]
in football, play is directly correlated to momentum. If the interception was called correctly, that would have deflated the colts, and potentially allowed for pitts to take off a decent amount of time by marching it slowly down field. Even if they didn't get a first down, 3 minutes of clock could have been eaten, and they would have punted, putting the colts in horrible field position.

In the pats game, that pass interference call, gave them a TD. And the champ baily pick, that when he got tagged, he threw into the endzone, gave them another 7 points. 14 points due to bad calls on the field is tough to make up. It forces a team to go for the big play. Would the pats have won, dunno, but it would have been a much better game in the closing minutes if they refs didn't fuck up.
 
[quote name='ryanbph']in football, play is directly correlated to momentum. If the interception was called correctly, that would have deflated the colts, and potentially allowed for pitts to take off a decent amount of time by marching it slowly down field. Even if they didn't get a first down, 3 minutes of clock could have been eaten, and they would have punted, putting the colts in horrible field position.[/quote]

Again, that's all hypothetical. On first down after sacking Peyton Manning with roughly 45 seconds to go, Jerome Bettis coughed up a fumble and put the Colts right back in the game. Who would have expected him to fumble? No one. How can you be so sure they wouldn't been able to go 3-and-out? You can't. It's all hypothetical.

Yes, you're right. I know momentum plays a big role in any sport. Regardless, if you lose after having an 11 point lead with less than five minutes to go and are going to say that momentum was entirely to blame, then you're a jackass; momentum is something, but not everything.


[quote name='ryanbph']In the pats game, that pass interference call, gave them a TD. And the champ baily pick, that when he got tagged, he threw into the endzone, gave them another 7 points. 14 points due to bad calls on the field is tough to make up. It forces a team to go for the big play. Would the pats have won, dunno, but it would have been a much better game in the closing minutes if they refs didn't fuck up.[/QUOTE]

How about this: if Tom Brady throws a better pass, we aren't having this discussion. They reviewed the play and it wasn't conclusive. Personally, I don't think he fumbled through the end zone... looked to me like he fumbled out of bounds; and honeslty, I would have preferred it had been a touchback, since Baily tried to show boat and cock off on his way in.
 
And let me add this:

If the Colts managed to receive such an immense boost of momentum from the would-be interception, how did the Steelers manage to sack Peyton Manning on 4th down, on the play prior to the Bettis fumble?


The interception may have made things harder for the Steelers, but the biggest play in the game was the Jerome Bettis fumble... plain and simple.
 
[quote name='WinnieThePujols']And let me add this:

If the Colts managed to receive such an immense boost of momentum from the would-be interception, how did the Steelers manage to sack Peyton Manning on 4th down, on the play prior to the Bettis fumble?


The interception may have made things harder for the Steelers, but the biggest play in the game was the Jerome Bettis fumble... plain and simple.[/QUOTE]

Actually the subequent tackle by Big Ben was the biggest play. If he doesn't make that tackle the Steelers lose.
 
[quote name='Deadpool']Actually the subequent tackle by Big Ben was the biggest play. If he doesn't make that tackle the Steelers lose.[/QUOTE]

How is a Big Ben tackle a bigger play than a missed game-tying field goal? There's no guarantee Harper was in, even if Big Ben missed the tackle.
 
[quote name='WinnieThePujols']How is a Big Ben tackle a bigger play than a missed game-tying field goal? There's no guarantee Harper was in, even if Big Ben missed the tackle.[/QUOTE]
Considering that Ben was the last obstacle for Harper to get much farther down the field, it's a much bigger play than the missed field goal. Ben doesn't make the tackle = Indy has more time, less field in front of them, and a better chance for the TD.
 
[quote name='Deadpool']hehe. the refs strike again.[/QUOTE]

No shit. I was talking to the mailman and he had this conspiracy theory that those refs were paid off. I don't know if I would go that far but it was certainly one of the worst Superbowls ever.

Superbowl XL - XL stands for extra lousy
 
All sports in the United States are controlled by politics and money.

Any professional game in America has already become a coordinated play instead of what it should be.
 
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