War on Christmas?

Quackzilla

Quackzilla

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Jerry Falwell has been making all this fuss about the phase "Happy Holidays".

He wants people to be REQUIRED to say "Merry Christmas".

I must say, this offended me when I was an atheist, and it offends me even more now that I am a member of a minority religion.

Why? Why does he want to crap on us all?
 
I'm not Christian and I don't care if people say Merry Christmas. I don't know why people are so hardheaded that they can't say it.
 
[quote name='Quackzilla']Jerry Falwell has been making all this fuss about the phase "Happy Holidays".

He wants people to be REQUIRED to say "Merry Christmas".[/quote]
And how will he go about doing that?
He can't. Plain and simple.

[quote name='Quackzilla']I must say, this offended me when I was an atheist, and it offends me even more now that I am a member of a minority religion. [/quote]What minority religion?
 
[quote name='Moxio']I'm not Christian and I don't care if people say Merry Christmas. I don't know why people are so hardheaded that they can't say it.[/quote]

Seconded.
 
[quote name='LiquidNight']And how will he go about doing that?
He can't. Plain and simple.

What minority religion?[/QUOTE]
He is getting his followers to hate people who don't say it, and boycott businesses who don't use it in advertising.

I am Shinto. And yes, I have been called a devil warshipper, a pagan, and some other things... I used to just tell people I'm Christian, but I got tired of that and stopped caring about the insults and patronizing sympathy and bullshit.

And it's not that big of a deal saying "Merry Christmas", but when people tell me I have to say it then it's a problem.
 
[quote name='rodeojones903']Minority religions are the new black I hear.[/QUOTE]
I'm not a Rasta! :lol:

Though that would be a great excuse to smoke weed!
 
as a non-christian, christmas time is a very obnoxious time. I deal with, but there is a constant bombardment of songs, ads, shows, and movies all dealing with christmas, and sometimes I feel enough is enough. There is no reason a non-christian should know christmas songs, but for some reason they are burned into my brain.
 
[quote name='Ikohn4ever']as a non-christian, christmas time is a very obnoxious time. I deal with, but there is a constant bombardment of songs, ads, shows, and movies all dealing with christmas, and sometimes I feel enough is enough. There is no reason a non-christian should know christmas songs, but for some reason they are burned into my brain.[/QUOTE]

Well that's where we stand at different points.

America was built on christianity in one form or the other, so there's no doubt that it will be a big part of what we see in any form: the media, the people we talk with, the president we elect to office, etc. Maybe it's just because I appreciate the diversity but I don't mind other religions telling their story (I mean I've watched Joel Osteen, who's evidently a great speach giver, talking about his Lord and I don't mind) and I think it's cool to learn about other religions.

I don't mind humming Christmas tunes.
 
im sick of fuckers getting offended by christmas greetings. i dont give 2 shits what religion you are, the words "merry christmas" or "happy hannukah" are words of good will, and if you're offended then you're a stupid fucking asshole.
 
I don't mind people practicing their own religion, but I think Jerry Falwell like an evil kami, trying to suppress all other religions.

I don't get offended by "Merry Christmas", but I do get offended when people act indignant upon hearing "Happy Holidays".
 
The war on Christmas and christianity is all one bullshit lie instigated by the O'Reilly's, Falwells, and especially the evangelical hard right wing neo-conservative/conservatives of the world (actually just America). I'm Jewish and am unashamed by it. I don't care what people say, though my friends will rag on me, but I understand it. This whole nonsense about people being allowed to say Merry Christmas versus Happy Holidays is all a bunch of bullshit cocked up to get people up in arms about something and push Fox News and other people's agenda. It's just like the other "social issues" that supposedly affect the country at the moment. Gays marrying, wow what a toughie, really what's the big deal. Who the hell cares whether they're married or not? In what way, shape, or form does it affect you as long as they are not trying to rub up against or hit on you? Who's right is it to decide for other people of mature and consenting age whether they can or should get married? If people actually did some work and were not fat ass lazies that sat and watch network/cable news all day and researched the matter, then they'd see that most Gays would rather just call it Civil Unions as long as they could do it and it is only the more radical of gays that continue to give it a bad name and keep pushing it as "marriage".

There is nothing wrong with saying Happy Holidays. There is no big deal about it. Why not be all inclusive to the other races/groups/religions?

Still I don't mind having the wealth of knowledge of 90% of the christmas tunes out there and to be able to sing/recite/humm along to them. They're just songs and I actually like some of them. Jingle Bells is always fun and doesn't speak about Christmas in any way, though it repeatedly gets associated and tacked onto the Christmas holiday because that is what it reminds people of.
 
[quote name='Moxio']Well that's where we stand at different points.

America was built on christianity in one form or the other, so there's no doubt that it will be a big part of what we see in any form: the media, the people we talk with, the president we elect to office, etc. Maybe it's just because I appreciate the diversity but I don't mind other religions telling their story (I mean I've watched Joel Osteen, who's evidently a great speach giver, talking about his Lord and I don't mind) and I think it's cool to learn about other religions.

I don't mind humming Christmas tunes.[/quote]
America was not built on any religion. Period. That's part of the reason why our forefathers escaped England. Our country may be built on moral values that are apart of various religions, but we are not, nor ever were a Christian state/country. That's why there is that clause of separation of church and state so that not one religion may impose its will on others.
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']America was not built on any religion. Period. That's part of the reason why our forefathers escaped England.[/quote]

lol, silly anglos
 
[quote name='Cormier6083']Happy Chrismakwanzramahaunkahidays to you![/quote]
I prefer Merry Chanukkahdonzika. I think that's how I used to spell it.
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']I prefer Merry Chanukkahdonzika. I think that's how I used to spell it.[/quote]

Mais, it's your life.
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']America was not built on any religion. Period. That's part of the reason why our forefathers escaped England. Our country may be built on moral values that are apart of various religions, but we are not, nor ever were a Christian state/country. That's why there is that clause of separation of church and state so that not one religion may impose its will on others.[/QUOTE]

Damn, I always thought the US of A was mainly populated by Christians who have their own public TV channel and many shows on other TV's and their own dozens of special movies with Santa and their own holiday TV specials and their own preachers with 50,000 people audiences and their own president who talks about his man the Lord and their own thousands of churches across the country.

What was I thinking?
 
I don't give a shit if something offends you. People get offended over everything.


Now with that said, I think you/we/I should try our best to respect all people as best as you can. Saying Happy Holidays is the best way to do that. Not everyone celebrates xmas. Most people/religions have year end celebrations. Saying Merry Christmas just alienates everyone else. That doesn't believe in xmas/Christianity in these must be PC days. But at the same time its not like people wear what religion they are on a patch. Or say what they are after there name; "Hi, my name is David, Catholic."

I find that most people don't care if you say Merry Christmas, even if they are another religion. Hell some people would get mad if you asked what religion they are, then say the proper phrase. This is what I mean by my first sentence, so I just say have a Happy Holidays. You have Thanksgiving, Christmas, Kwanzaa, Hanukkah and New Years all in a little over a month. You could even argue that Holidays doesn't mean what it used to, but I digress.

Where I live the two big year end celebrations are Christmas (the biggest by far), and Kwanzaa. We have other religions but I'm in the mid-west, Christians are by far the biggest group of people around. So I can get away with saying Merry Christmas to everyone. Unless I see a star of David around there neck, then I know what to say.

I was trying to find that clip of south park where they're putting on a play. Mr. Garrison gets mad cause everyone is offend by one of the decorations. It even went so far as to someone being offended by garland, or popcorn on string. I hope someone knows what I'm talking about and can post it.
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']What's Mais? But yaeh I was just saying.[/quote]


Mais is Meh but Meh is the english intranets spelling of Mais which means "of" or "meh" ;)
 
[quote name='Moxio']Damn, I always thought the US of A was mainly populated by Christians who have their own public TV channel and many shows on other TV's and their own dozens of special movies with Santa and their own holiday TV specials and their own preachers with 50,000 people audiences and their own president who talks about his man the Lord and their own thousands of churches across the country.

What was I thinking?[/quote]
Doesn't matter. That doesn't make it a Christian state. All it means is that christianity is the majority religion in this country otherwise they could force me to start eating pig and praying to whatever deity/g-d they told me to. And I hate to tell ya buddy, but you just proved my point that this country was built on freedom of religion. They can have their channels and movies and what not, but it doesn't mean I have to go watch them, and even if I do watch something like the Peanuts Christmas Special, that's doesn't just turn me into a Christian.
 
[quote name='Lobsterjohnson']Bill O'Reilly was all about this last year as well. Gotta find something to complain about I suppose.[/quote]
I remember how he did the whole talk show circuit himself and got "owned", as internet speak would have it, by David Letterman and wiped all over the place by John Stewart. there's probably videos of it on Youtube.
 
[quote name='Cormier6083']Mais is Meh but Meh is the english intranets spelling of Mais which means "of" or "meh" ;)[/quote]

Well o.k. then I guess. Didn't know there were so many alternate spellings of meh.
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']Well o.k. then I guess. Didn't know there were so many alternate spellings of meh.[/quote]

Yes. It's even more confusing if you know French :)
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']America was not built on any religion. Period. That's part of the reason why our forefathers escaped England. Our country may be built on moral values that are apart of various religions, but we are not, nor ever were a Christian state/country. That's why there is that clause of separation of church and state so that not one religion may impose its will on others.[/QUOTE]
Our founding fathers thought religious zealotry, especially within Christianity, was dangerous... They were mostly deists or protestants that were fairly secular.

There is a reason why there is no mention of "God" or "Jesus" in the constitution. Unlike other governments, the power of the government is not a power granted by god, its a power granted by the mutual consent of the people. It is an extremely important distinction.
 
[quote name='Moxio']America was built on christianity in one form or the other.[/QUOTE]

No, it wasn't. You're wrong. Whoever told you that was wrong or lied.

I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, by the Roman church, by the Greek church, by the Turkish church, by the Protestant church, nor by any church that I know of...Each of those churches accuse the other of unbelief; and for my own part, I disbelieve them all."
Click to expand...

This would be the best of all possible worlds, if there were no religion in it!
Click to expand...

"Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise."
"During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What have been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the Clergy, ignorance and servility in the laity, in both, superstition, bigotry and persecution."
Click to expand...

I have examined all the known superstitions of the word, and I do not find in our particular superstition of Christianity one redeeming feature. They are all alike founded on fables and mythology. Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned. What has been the effect of this coercion? To make one half the world fools and the other half hypocrites; to support roguery and error all over the earth.
Click to expand...

More: http://skeptically.org/thinkersonreligion/id9.html
http://www.positiveatheism.org/writ/founding.htm
 
[quote name='dafoomie']Our founding fathers thought religious zealotry, especially within Christianity, was dangerous... They were mostly deists or protestants that were fairly secular.

There is a reason why there is no mention of "God" or "Jesus" in the constitution. Unlike other governments, the power of the government is not a power granted by god, its a power granted by the mutual consent of the people. It is an extremely important distinction.[/quote]
Yaeh I know. You basically said what I said, except far better than I did as it's 12:00 here and I should be doing work and getting to bed for the big day tomorrow/today.

Essentially our constitution, if I am not mistaken, took away what every state had come to rely on to stay in power - their own form of the "Mandate of Heaven".
 
And here I was, thinking that christians should be thrilled to see that capitalist commercial America wants to separate itself from the religious tradition.

"You got Santa Claus in my Jesus!"

"You got Jesus in my Santa Claus!"

:shock:
 
[quote name='mykevermin']And here I was, thinking that christians should be thrilled to see that capitalist commercial America wants to separate itself from the religious tradition.

"You got Santa Claus in my Jesus!"

"You got Jesus in my Santa Claus!"

:shock:[/quote]

How could you think of something like that :shock: Capitalist Commercial America as you put it would never want to separate itself from this religious tradition as it gives them one of their most economically viable quarters of the year and more incentive to make people go out and buy!!buy!!buy!!buy!!
 
[quote name='Cormier6083']Christmas should be called "Marketing Day" instead of Christmas...[/quote]

Marketing day would be to set up the advertising for the holiday season. And on Christmas, for some reason every thing needs to be closed to torture us. At least Veg is nice as some places here are open.
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']Marketing day would be to set up the advertising for the holiday season. And on Christmas, for some reason every thing needs to be closed to torture us. At least Veg is nice as some places here are open.[/quote]

Yeah thats true... Marketing Month? No.


All well. Christmas isn't Christmas. This world is falling apart and it burns with the flame of a thousand suns in my heart :cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry:
 
[quote name='Cormier6083']Yeah thats true... Marketing Month? No.


All well. Christmas isn't Christmas. This world is falling apart and it burns with the flame of a thousand suns in my heart :cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry::cry:[/quote]

What a very emo observation of you. Thank you for sharing that detail with us.
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']I've read both of those sites before and while the quotes that they have are true (did my own research in college), Moxio could have called you out on the fact that your sources come from atheist websites and therefore by extension tend to favor the atheists' perspective. Woo for debate![/QUOTE]

Debate? Too much work. :lol:

Should we move this to that one Politics or Vs board or whatever?
 
[quote name='Moxio']Debate? Too much work. :lol:

Should we move this to that one Politics or Vs board or whatever?[/quote]

Then I won't see it as I don't really care to even tread in that forum. Too much work.
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']Then I won't see it as I don't really care to even tread in that forum. Too much work.[/QUOTE]

:lol:
 
[quote name='hiccupleftovers']I've read both of those sites before and while the quotes that they have are true (did my own research in college), Moxio could have called you out on the fact that your sources come from atheist websites and therefore by extension tend to favor the atheists' perspective. Woo for debate![/QUOTE]

This is a logical fallacy known as Ad hominem circumstantial.

Unless of course you'd be questioning whether the quotes themselves are true.
 
..... shouldn't this topic be over in the political and controversey area by now?

I will say that I do find people who are offended by "Merry Christmas" are... shall I put it.... people who need to quit being a hard ass. Yeesh.
 
The silly thing is the Christians that get offended when you say "Happy Holidays" to them instead of "Merry Christmas". Happy Holidays is just the more general, all-encompassing phrase that more intelligent people say to people they don't know. The whole thing just seems like a whiny cry for attention, and I really can't believe that grown adults would act in such a chilidish mannor.

Next time a store employee says "Merry Christmas" to you, just reply with "Happy Hannukah". They'll probably look confused, but in reality you're doing the same thing as them. You're using a greeting meant for a specific audience, and you can't/shouldn't assume that they are all of that religion. Major stores should use the more general "Happy Holidays" greeting, not because it's "right", not because it's "politically correct", but simply because it's a more intelligent thing to say in that situation. If you're talking to a friend who you know is Christian, feel free to say "Merry Christmas" to your heart's content.
 
[quote name='evilmax17']The silly thing is the Christians that get offended when you say "Happy Holidays" to them instead of "Merry Christmas". Happy Holidays is just the more general, all-encompassing phrase that more intelligent people say to people they don't know. The whole thing just seems like a whiny cry for attention, and I really can't believe that grown adults would act in such a chilidish mannor.

Next time a store employee says "Merry Christmas" to you, just reply with "Happy Hannukah". They'll probably look confused, but in reality you're doing the same thing as them. You're using a greeting meant for a specific audience, and you can't/shouldn't assume that they are all of that religion. Major stores should use the more general "Happy Holidays" greeting, not because it's "right", not because it's "politically correct", but simply because it's a more intelligent thing to say in that situation. If you're talking to a friend who you know is Christian, feel free to say "Merry Christmas" to your heart's content.[/QUOTE]

A store can try to be as PC as it wants to be. A person should be able to say what they please, PC and feelings be damned. The greeter knows what religion/belief you are as much as you do they.
 
[quote name='thagoat']im sick of fuckers getting offended by christmas greetings. i dont give 2 shits what religion you are, the words "merry christmas" or "happy hannukah" are words of good will, and if you're offended then you're a stupid fucking asshole.[/QUOTE]

Listen to this man, he is correct.

If you're offended by Merry Christmas, you're the one with the problem. If you "don't believe in Christmas" or whatever, just smile and nod and GET OVER IT. Don't you have better things to worry about? I'm not going to crap my pants if I'm in Dearborn (look it up) and someone gives me good wishes on a non-Christian holiday.
 
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