We all hate each other

davo1224

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I pretty much already know that this topic is going to spawn a lot of ignorant discussion but hopefully I can gain some insight as well.

It's been brought up before but generally hispanic and black culture tends to side with more conservative ideals. This thought might not ever cross the mind of some because you'd figure they'd be on the more liberal end of things in terms of wanting civil rights, equality, etc. However, religion has a huge foundation in both.

Across the spectrum of conservatism (if even), you have the stereotype of the Christian or Catholic, straight, white, rich family. According to the stereotype, these people do not like anyone who is not them basically. Sadly, the stereotype isn't too far in some cases (as seen a lot recently) but it's too broad of a generalization.

This would of course put conservatives against each other. Where is the common ground usually? Gays.

This amuses me greatly especially in the black and latino communities. Between rappers who will denounce the police as racists then go on to call their detractors gay as an insult, shows/movies which attempt to instill pride and show perspective on black culture all while making gays the comedy characters, and the fact that the phrase "on the down low" even exists, there's plenty of instances of foolishness. You'd think that after all the mess we've seen happen AFTER slavery since the 1860's in Afro-American culture and the ongoing illegalphobia in Hispanic culture, they wouldn't join their oppressers in marginalizing another group in the same boat. Or are gays really in the same boat?

It's a lot easier to tell if someone is black/hispanic than it is gay. As is common in every day life and more readily seen in the news, there's always new instances of people "coming out" with some even having been harsh critics in the past. You can easily portray the caricature of the Christian white man who hates all gays, blacks, latinos, etc. all the while cheating on your wife at a bathhouse every weekend.

This doesn't even scratch the surface or even touch on Asians or other cultures, but anybody get why there's so much hate to spread around when it seems like there's obviously enough common ground to connect us all?
 
[quote name='davo1224']
It's a lot easier to tell if someone is black/hispanic than it is gay. [/QUOTE]

Yes, it is. That's probably why people make fun of them because they are different from the majority and because being gay is more of a choice (debatable) unlike being hispanic which is something that you can not change.

There are enough factors that can make us more unified but there are even more differences that do the opposite. And you know what? I think people like that even if they don't admit to it. People are assholes and assholes need to vent. So yes, haters gonna hate...

When I first started to read the OP, I was thinking, "man, another guy writing about blacks, whites, and hispanics and casually omitting asians like everyone else". But even if it was just for a brief moment, you came through in the end. :applause:
 
Already I feel that my forms of hate have not been addressed and thus have been marginalized by the introduction. :lol:
 
Here are a few thoughts that address some of your points:

-Being a member oppressed group does NOT mean that you will have empathy for others that are being oppressd.

-Oppressed groups do marginalize each other.

-In order to understand black homophobia, you need to understand why black men in particular are socialized to be hyper masculine. *hint*It was because black people were considered inferior to whites and had little brain capacity.

-Yes. Religion has a lot to do with similarities between people of color and whites, but it ends there. Also, religion was used in order to control slaves/indigenous peoples, which is an often overlooked point.

You hit on a lot of valid points and fortunately, there are answers to your questions, but there's A LOT to learn. Here are 2 sources for a very quick crash course into racism and classism. I separated them here, but in reality, they're quite intertwined in here. Read A People's History of the United States by Howard Zinn, which can be found for free and legal on the interwebz, and kill a couple hours watching a couple talks by Tim Wise on youtube. The Q and A's can be especially good. If you want to learn more, take an intro to sociology 101 course, this will provide better framework for reconciling the different social phenomenon you're observing.
 
[quote name='dohdough']
-In order to understand black homophobia, you need to understand why black men in particular are socialized to be hyper masculine. *hint*It was because black people were considered inferior to whites and had little brain capacity.

[/QUOTE]

Wow, this says it all about this guy right here. Is there any bigotry that isn't the white man's fault? Someone should take care of those troublemakers. :roll:
 
[quote name='Knoell']Wow, this says it all about this guy right here. Is there any bigotry that isn't the white man's fault? Someone should take care of those troublemakers. :roll:[/QUOTE]
I guess all the black people that where in political offices upto 1964 decided to have themselves count as 3/5ths a person, enacted Jim Crow, denied any kind of enfranchisement, allowed lynching, promoted rape, kept black people illiterate, and a whole host of things that I shouldn't really need to rehash.

I GUESS THAT MEANS HISTORY IS RACIST AGAINST WHITES!!!!! :hot:
 
[quote name='dohdough']I guess all the black people that where in political offices upto 1964 decided to have themselves count as 3/5ths a person, enacted Jim Crow, denied any kind of enfranchisement, allowed lynching, promoted rape, kept black people illiterate, and a whole host of things that I shouldn't really need to rehash.

I GUESS THAT MEANS HISTORY IS RACIST AGAINST WHITES!!!!! :hot:[/QUOTE]

So let's clear it up, are you saying white people oppressed black people, or are you saying that white people are the reason black people oppress gays?
 
[quote name='Knoell']So let's clear it up, are you saying white people oppress(edit: fixed to present tense) black people, or are you saying that white people are the reason black people oppress gays?[/QUOTE]
Both.
 
[quote name='dohdough']
Both.
[/QUOTE]

In that case:

[quote name='Knoell']Wow, this says it all about this guy right here. Is there any bigotry that isn't the white man's fault? Someone should take care of those troublemakers. :roll:[/QUOTE]


If the reason some black people are homophobic is because white people make them feel inferior, then why do some white people hate gay people?
 
[quote name='Knoell']In that case:[/quote]
So what's your point.

If the reason some black people are homophobic is because white people make them feel inferior, then why do some white people hate gay people?
It's more complicated than black people being homophobes because white people have been oppressors since before the inception of this country, it's about perpetuating bigotry that only serves to maintain power for the power elite. Religious indoctrination plays a big part in this and ultimately, who does this conflict really serve.
 
[quote name='dohdough']So what's your point.


It's more complicated than black people being homophobes because white people have been oppressors since before the inception of this country, it's about perpetuating bigotry that only serves to maintain power for the power elite. Religious indoctrination plays a big part in this and ultimately, who does this conflict really serve.[/QUOTE]

So black homophobes are promoted/encouraged/placed for and by whites to divide and conquer minorities?

I'm still interested in the reason there are white homophobes. I guess noone tormented white people ever :roll:, so they only have to blame their individual selves for being intolerant.
 
[quote name='Knoell']So black homophobes are promoted/encouraged/placed for and by whites to divide and conquer minorities?[/quote]
You're separating class and race when you shouldn't be.

I'm still interested in the reason there are white homophobes. I guess noone tormented white people ever :roll:, so they only have to blame their individual selves for being intolerant.
Religion that's reinforced by the power elites. And yes, divide and conquer is how the power elite as a class, it reinforces their ability to maintain power over other groups by proxy of race and class.

When it comes to white people, ummm...actually no. Unless you're talking about white people oppressing other white people.
 
[quote name='Knoell']So black homophobes are promoted/encouraged/placed for and by whites to divide and conquer minorities?

I'm still interested in the reason there are white homophobes. I guess noone tormented white people ever :roll:, so they only have to blame their individual selves for being intolerant.[/QUOTE]
Why do you care?

Sure, it's silly to tie Black Homophobia to oppression. It's a silly excuse.

But intolerance is intolerance and it isn't excusable. Regardless of origin.
 
Knoell has the unique ability to make a complete and utter ass of himself on an almost daily basis.
 
I think it's indirectly from white oppression. The common stereotype since even before then is that the black man makes up in strength/power what he lacks in knowledge. After slavery ended, the negative ideals sorta stayed in play and continued to develop across the generations. The black man has to be especially uber-masculine because of how long he was made to be a subordinate.

Then you just have the common gender identity BS in play which affects all races. No man wants to feel threatened by someone of his own gender. Female homophobes are also bogged down by their culture of subordination too. I mean, what else is there to live for if a man can get married or have kids without a woman? (Unfortunately, FAR too many woman think this way be it liberal or conservative).
 
[quote name='Clak'] Knoell has the unique ability to make a complete and utter ass of himself on an almost daily basis.[/QUOTE]

I hope we don't end up debating whether white christian males are an oppressed minority in the age of Obummer. We will reemember in november throw out the socialist marxists.
 
All the world's problems stem not from our differences in religion, gender, race, or sexual orientation, but from the inferiority complexes of those who cannot accept any differences beyond their own.

~HotShotX
 
[quote name='Quillion']Why do you care?

Sure, it's silly to tie Black Homophobia to oppression. It's a silly excuse.

But intolerance is intolerance and it isn't excusable. Regardless of origin.[/QUOTE]

I don't care, and I agree it is a silly excuse. Dohdough was throwing around the excuse for intolerance, I wasn't. To him every mistake a minority makes can be traced back to how the white man treated him. I simply wanted to point that out.

If that makes me an "ass" then so be it.
 
knoellass.jpg


;)
 
[quote name='davo1224']I'm enjoying the demonstration of what I'm speaking of in this very thread[/QUOTE]

Care to explain? Am I being hateful in pointing that out?
 
[quote name='davo1224']I'm enjoying the demonstration of what I'm speaking of in this very thread[/QUOTE]

I'm curious why you initially point out conservatives most of all. There's a lot of infighting amongst my liberal pals as well. I guess that's just what happens when you divide by two, there aren't enough options to get everyone's ideas out there without ruffling feathers. Then again, if there were 8 political parties people would get confused and the "big tent" philosophy would go to hell in a handbasket.
 
[quote name='nasum']I'm curious why you initially point out conservatives most of all.[/quote]

Because there really isn't a distinction to be made between extremist conservatives and mainstream.
 
[quote name='Knoell']Care to explain? Am I being hateful in pointing that out?[/QUOTE]

Wasn't even talking about you. You were questioning a point in this thread which is good for discussion.
 
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