Xbox Live deals for retail employees only

CheapyD

CheapyD

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Microsoft has this promotion for retail employees only
ripped from www.fatwallet.com (thanks, JamManXC)

http://retail.microsoft.com/retail/xboxoffer/

Pick up the Starter Kit for only $29.99 (more than 50% off MSRP).
Starter Kit includes:
A 12-month subscription card
A Communicator headset
The full version of Crimson Skies®: High Road to Revenge™

Or

Get your hands on a 12-month subscription card for only $19.99 (more than 60% off MSRP).
 
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Because it is technically a valid deal, and CheapyD knows that. The way people are exploiting it is on it's face invalid, but that doesn't change the fact that the deal itself is valid.

The deal is not at fault.
Blaming the deal would be like blaming the gun when someone gets shot.
 
Don't people here jump on pricing errors at retailers? Is this really any different? Some people are getting something they shouldn't. If it works, then it works. If it doesn't then it doesn't.
 
"I wouldn't want to save just a few bucks just to go to prison or get prosecuted by M$ or the US Government for lying about something. Remeber, what goes around, comes around. "

LOL Nowhere on the entire site does it say it is limited to retail employees only.

It only asks for a "store" out of the blue. No context or explanation so I chose one.

And my order for 2 cards and a xbox live (crimson skies) package shipped out yesterday.
 
i ordered this...but i wanna know whether anyone knows if it comes with mech warrior or crimson skies considering the email i got has mech on it, but the site says crimson skies
 
Hmm you're right..

"Xbox Live kit w Mech 1 $29.99"

Either way I'll be happy, but I think its crimson.

Someone else emailed M$ and they said mech was the old deal and it needed to be corrected.
 
It comes with Crimson skies... you will get a receipt in a few days saying it shipped with Crimson skies.
 
[quote name='Indiana']It comes with Crimson skies... you will get a receipt in a few days saying it shipped with Crimson skies.[/quote]

my confirmation email also said mech on it, but since everyone is saying crimson skies, chances are thats what im getting
 
[quote name='cdancause']Don't people here jump on pricing errors at retailers? Is this really any different? Some people are getting something they shouldn't. If it works, then it works. If it doesn't then it doesn't.[/quote]

Nope. Competely different. There is no TOS or Rules of Use that dicate that people cannot order large numbers of copies of a game that has a mismarked price in a site's database. There is a clearly dicated Rules of Use to the Microsoft site. If you're a thief, so be it... a couple of words from me won't change that.... but don't go around making incorrect corrections and saying that this "deal" is legit.
 
[quote name='Valkryst']"I wouldn't want to save just a few bucks just to go to prison or get prosecuted by M$ or the US Government for lying about something. Remeber, what goes around, comes around. "

LOL Nowhere on the entire site does it say it is limited to retail employees only.

It only asks for a "store" out of the blue. No context or explanation so I chose one.

And my order for 2 cards and a xbox live (crimson skies) package shipped out yesterday.[/quote]

http://retail.microsoft.com/retail/training/terms.asp?termsofuse=on

MICROSOFT RETAIL TRAINING WEB SITE
TERMS OF USE
As of March 31, 2003
If this page appears when you try to access other pages on the site, then the Terms of Use have been changed since you logged on. By accessing and continuing to use this web site, you agree to these updated terms of use. Please read them carefully.

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You were saying?
Try reading the whole site before you go spouting your mouth off and making incorrect corrections.
 
I didn't take advantage of this deal, but I did look around to see what others were saying about: nothing says that you have to be a retail employee for this one. Its kind of odd that I can't find anything that says that you do. On the tests for free games/points it clearly says that you have to be a part of a retail store, which makes this deal really weird. It doesn't even ask to fill out the long form for joining the retail team. Weird, weird, weird. I also noticed that even if people are scamming, Microsoft is still getting a nice chunk of money and that's without dealing with retailers/shipping. Anyway, I say good luck to the guys taking chances, because I think nothing will happen (99% sure of that).

-Morpheus

Darn it for posting right after that huge post!!! =P Oh well. I still hardly doubt they will go after anybody since they are getting money. lol
 
I didn't take advantage of this deal, but I did look around to see what others were saying about: nothing says that you have to be a retail employee for this one.

Thank you for using this Microsoft Retail Training web site at retail.microsoft.com/retail/training ("Site"). This Site is provided by Microsoft Corporation ("Microsoft") and it is part of the microsoft.com family of web sites. Your activities at this Site are governed by the Terms of Use for the microsoft.com web site ("Master Site") and by this Site's Terms of Use, which by this reference; incorporate all of the Master Site Terms of Use. Please read the Master Site Terms of Use and this Site's Terms of Use; collectively they govern your use of this Site, including the training activities and sweepstakes available at this Site from time to time, and constitute your agreement with Microsoft as amended from time to time ("Agreement").

Purpose of this Site. This Site is only available to sales associates who are employees of a retailer authorized by Microsoft to offer Microsoft products and services in the United States ("Authorized Retailer"). If you have any questions about your eligibility to access and use this Site, please confirm that your employer is an Authorized Retailer in the drop down menu on the My Profile page in this Site. No other person is authorized to use this Site.

I swear, most of you just can't read that well can you? It explicitly states:
If you have any questions about your eligibility to access and use this Site, please confirm that your employer is an Authorized Retailer in the drop down menu on the My Profile page in this Site. No other person is authorized to use this Site

Just because some tool made a direct link to the deal doesn't mean that the Terms of Use doesn't apply.


Its kind of odd that I can't find anything that says that you do.
If you have any questions about your eligibility to access and use this Site, please confirm that your employer is an Authorized Retailer in the drop down menu on the My Profile page in this Site. No other person is authorized to use this Site

Funny, it says it right there.




On the tests for free games/points it clearly says that you have to be a part of a retail store, which makes this deal really weird. It doesn't even ask to fill out the long form for joining the retail team. Weird, weird, weird. I also noticed that even if people are scamming, Microsoft is still getting a nice chunk of money and that's without dealing with retailers/shipping. Anyway, I say good luck to the guys taking chances, because I think nothing will happen (99% sure of that).

Maybe it's because the tool who orginally posted this to fatwallet gave a direct link, and the people taking advantage of it realize what they are doing, or are just too dumb to seek out the terms of use for the site.
 
JSweeney, if you weren't so hot-tempered you would have noticed at the bottom of my post that I had edited it to add that I hadn't seen your reply because I was to busy posting. It doesn't say it like that but this gets the main jist across: "Darn it for posting right after that huge post!!! =P Oh well. I still hardly doubt they will go after anybody since they are getting money. lol". I don't know why it doesn't say that I edited it though. =( Bad timing for my original post though. :lol:

-Morpheus

BTW I don't know many people who actually read the terms of use before ordering something. I guess the majority of us are idiots.

After Edit: Plus, call me a double idiot because you really have to dig deep from that link posted by CheapyD to find those exact terms of use. Its like a freaking maze getting to them.
 
I just got the reply from Microsoft about my question to them. They said that you absolutely MUST work for a retailer that is on the drop down list, but you don't have to be part of the Retail Training Program. So I am set, when my cousin comes over I will order this.
 
I dont give a fuck. I dont work for any retail company, but im still cashing in on this deal, and whatever free products M$ wants to give me.

C'mon Xbox Live with a game for $30. HOW I CAN PASS THIS UP!?!?!
 
whoa...guess what I found on my doorstep today...the XBox Live kit after just about two days!!! I was not affiliated with any of the retail companies listed and thought it would take about 6 to 8 weeks. Damn I'm having the best luck lately. I just managed to get the XBox Halo bundle and Ninja Gaiden at Game Rush using Rogue Ops before the trade in price dropped and now I got XBox Live for 29.99. Thank you CAGs worldwide!!!
 
That's fine, but don't think that you aren't a damn thief. I can deal with things like that when people admit that it is theft, but when they try to justify it is when I get pissed off.

I've given up believing that most people here have any inate sense of honor, decency or fair play, and that more often than not you're dealing with the vile, disgusting dregs of society. That's the kind of behaviour you'd expect from them, and to expect any less would be naive.
 
I work at an EB. I told a friend about this site, and it worked for him. he tried signing up his g/f (who lived at the same address) and they got billed and got nothing in return.
 
JSweeney I was saying that there is no link to that page you posted from the page cheapy posted.

A legal page only applies to the products listed and visa versa.

Since that legal page isn't listed on the site I ordered my xbox starter kit from it doesn't apply. (my stepmom is a business lawyer and I just asked her)
 
If your step mother really is a lawyer, and she actually did tell you that, she isn't a very good lawyer, and if she ever told a client that she deserves to be sued for malpractice.

To even get into the retail site, you must register, and submit a password to enter a secured area.
Doing that you must adhere to these rules:

MEMBER ACCOUNT, PASSWORD, AND SECURITY.
If any of the Services requires you to open an account, you must complete the registration process by providing us with current, complete and accurate information as prompted by the applicable registration form. You also will choose a password and a user name. You are entirely responsible for maintaining the confidentiality of your password and account. Furthermore, you are entirely responsible for any and all activities that occur under your account. You agree to notify Microsoft immediately of any unauthorized use of your account or any other breach of security. Microsoft will not be liable for any loss that you may incur as a result of someone else using your password or account, either with or without your knowledge. However, you could be held liable for losses incurred by Microsoft or another party due to someone else using your account or password. You may not use anyone else's account at any time, without the permission of the account holder.

Top of page
NO UNLAWFUL OR PROHIBITED USE.
As a condition of your use of the Services, you will not use the Services for any purpose that is unlawful or prohibited by these terms, conditions, and notices. You may not use the Services in any manner that could damage, disable, overburden, or impair any Microsoft server, or the network(s) connected to any Microsoft server, or interfere with any other party's use and enjoyment of any Services. You may not attempt to gain unauthorized access to any Services, other accounts, computer systems or networks connected to any Microsoft server or to any of the Services, through hacking, password mining or any other means. You may not obtain or attempt to obtain any materials or information through any means not intentionally made available through the Services.


That information right there is from the Legal link on that specific page.

Considering that the page is linked to by an outside user (thus deviating from the intented site flow and giving you access to an area you do not have the credentials to enter) makes any claim you make on it's face false because you are violating Microsoft.com's terms of use to gain access to that page.

Of course, you agree to any of the Terms of Use whenever you use the Microsoft site, and since http://retail.microsoft.com has a specific Terms of Use that dictates the use of the retail.microsoft.com site, you tacitly agree to adhere to said terms as a condition of your use of the site.
Microsoft cannot and would not be held accountable for you deviating from the expected flow of the site. Just as a matter of technological fact, you must go through http://retail.microsoft.com to reach http://retail.microsoft.com/retail/xboxoffer/.

You can't gain an illegal benefit because someone else violated the rules. That is entirely against the entire spirit of the law.

It's a moot point because I doubt Microsoft will go hunt down all these people, but the fact that a supposed proffession makes such comments worries me.



To state it in a very cliche way, "Ignorance of the law is no excuse".
 
I think it should be obvious to begin with that this site is intended for retailers only, and no amount of denial or self-justification will change that.

[quote name='Valkryst']A legal page only applies to the products listed and visa versa.

Since that legal page isn't listed on the site I ordered my xbox starter kit from it doesn't apply.[/quote]

Just because you say it doesn't make it so. Same goes for that supposed legal expert stepmother of yours. Do not pass GO, do not collect illegally-acquired merchandise. Go to jail, you joke of a thief.
 
LoL great replies.

If it the site ( http://retail.microsoft.com/retail/xboxoffer/ ) was built where you have to
pass the disclaimer stating the policy, then you'd be correct.

It doesn't.

A direct link will let you order a product for a given price.

That is a legally binding contract with no disclaimer therefore microsoft is required
by federal law to honor it.

I can scan the business law pages on contracts if you'd like, I still have the textbook from last qtr.

Edit:
If ms had displayed the disclaimer during the order I would have recognized it.

As of now, their policy has a flaw, which is why my order shipped out a couple days ago.

BTW that legal link is a link to microsoft's entire legal section, not the retail section.
Every policy listed under that link does NOT apply to the retail site.

A vendor must display any valid limitations or disclaimers before allowing the purchase of a limited product.

period.


***************************
The obvious fix would be to only allow registered & verified users to purchase the product.
Thus making a secure site where a direct link wouldn't function.

atm: ANYONE CAN ACCESS IT making the site PUBLIC.

Current Internet laws state if anyone can access a site, it is considered public.
***************************

So we have a public site offering a product with no disclaimer of limitations.

It is valid, it is legal, and microsoft will eventually fix it.
 
Oh yeah and here's another little except from their legal page:

PERSONAL AND NON-COMMERCIAL USE LIMITATION.
Unless otherwise specified, the Services are for your personal and non-commercial use. You may not modify, copy, distribute, transmit, display, perform, reproduce, publish, license, create derivative works from, transfer, or sell any information, software, products or services obtained from the Services.




Again, it was not "otherwise specified"
I.E. no disclaimer on the public http://retail.microsoft.com/retail/xboxoffer/ site.

I will have fun using the [Service] for [my] personal and non-commercial use.
 
[quote name='"Valkryst"']Oh yeah and here's another little except from their legal page:

PERSONAL AND NON-COMMERCIAL USE LIMITATION.
Unless otherwise specified, the Services are for your personal and non-commercial use. You may not modify, copy, distribute, transmit, display, perform, reproduce, publish, license, create derivative works from, transfer, or sell any information, software, products or services obtained from the Services.
quote]

This is only detailing what it is to be used for, NOT THE MEANS OF WHICH IT IS OBTAINED. Stop trying to sound smart. You're failing terribly.
 
OK, I just went through the whole ordering process myself doing everything but placing the final order and didn't see anything that makes this deal seem like the criminal act some people are making it out to be.

As far as I can tell, it's just crappy site design on Microsofts part if they really did want to limit this to just retail employees. And I now believe more then ever that this is the exact same as taking advantage of pricing errors. When you do both of these things, everyone knows they are not supposed to be getting the deal they are trying for...but they try anyway!

And lets face it, this deal has been up for a while now. Thousands of people have taken advantage of it...probably thousands that don't work at retail stores. Do you idiots really think they are not aware of it? Have they taken it down or even changed it? NO.

So stop crying about it and let them handle it. Hell, every time you guys post another "Your a bad man"/"You have no morals" post, you're just bumping this bad boy back to the top of the pile for even more people to see it.
Feel free to reply to this though. My buddy is getting back from Europe today and if this is at the top then I'm sure he would love to take advantage of it!
 
[quote name='"Valkryst"']LoL great replies.

If it the site ( http://retail.microsoft.com/retail/xboxoffer/ ) was built where you have to
pass the disclaimer stating the policy, then you'd be correct.

It doesn't.

You were given a link by another that puts onto the public internet a link not meant for public consumption. You are not allowed to gain illicit benefit from misdeeds of others. There is a link to the Master terms of service there, and such cases are

A direct link will let you order a product for a given price.

Which you must fraudulently state a position at a retailer to get. Your legal footing is EXTREMELY TENOUS, as you must rely on at least one act of misrepresentation, and that is after having been given a link not intented for public consumption.

That is a legally binding contract with no disclaimer therefore microsoft is required
by federal law to honor it.

Microsoft has full latitude over everything on its site. You should read the disclaimers on thier site. Thanks to the wording, they have full latitude over just about everything they offer. By the way, a legal binding contract cannot be made if one of the parties is involved in fraud or misrepresentation to gain access to said contract. I'd love to see anyone argue that Microsoft must honor this when the person fraudulently states a connection to an authorized retailer to gain access to the order form.

I can scan the business law pages on contracts if you'd like, I still have the textbook from last qtr.

Try reading the rules and regs. on Microsofts page first. Your arguing a losing proposition.

Edit:
If ms had displayed the disclaimer during the order I would have recognized it.

To get to the order you must pass a dropdown asking for an affilated retailer. You commited an act of fraud to even get to the order form. Anything accessed after that put you on no better footing than if you were a hacker.

As of now, their policy has a flaw, which is why my order shipped out a couple days ago.

BTW that legal link is a link to microsoft's entire legal section, not the retail section.
Every policy listed under that link does NOT apply to the retail site.

That is the Master Terms of Service link. IT APPLIES TO EVERYTHING ON THE MICROSOFT.COM DOMAIN.


A vendor must display any valid limitations or disclaimers before allowing the purchase of a limited product.

They do. But you just used an unauthorized link to gain access and then use fraud to circumvent the system which is used to authenticate the people who are allowed to partake in said deal.

period.

Nope. I'd love to see you go argue that. It's in the normal site flow, and to gain access to the site in the intended manner you must LOG IN and pass throw the retail homepage to reach that site. Just because Microsoft has a hole in it's security doesn't give you the right to reap illlict gains from it.




***************************
The obvious fix would be to only allow registered & verified users to purchase the product.
Thus making a secure site where a direct link wouldn't function.

atm: ANYONE CAN ACCESS IT making the site PUBLIC.

Current Internet laws state if anyone can access a site, it is considered public.

You still must commit an act of fraud or misrepresentation to gain access to the order form.


***************************

So we have a public site offering a product with no disclaimer of limitations.

Your wrong. The rules set forth by the master terms of use and the retail site's terms of use sit apply. You agree to a defacto acceptance of these terms to even use thier site.

It is valid, it is legal, and microsoft will eventually fix it.
Wrong. You still can't weasel around the act of misrepresentation and/or fraud.
 
OK, I just went through the whole ordering process myself doing everything but placing the final order and didn't see anything that makes this deal seem like the criminal act some people are making it out to be.
With the exception of the part where you must select an authorized retailer that you work for to gain access to the order form.

As far as I can tell, it's just crappy site design on Microsofts part if they really did want to limit this to just retail employees.

Yes, it is. They should have made it part of a secure area. That doesn't mean that people aren't misrepresenting themselves to gain the deal.


And I now believe more then ever that this is the exact same as taking advantage of pricing errors. When you do both of these things, everyone knows they are not supposed to be getting the deal they are trying for...but they try anyway!

Nope, because when you buy on pricing errors, you aren't misrepresenting themselves or commiting fraud.


And lets face it, this deal has been up for a while now. Thousands of people have taken advantage of it...probably thousands that don't work at retail stores. Do you idiots really think they are not aware of it? Have they taken it down or even changed it? NO.

Nope, but I have a feeling that the might be tightening down on sending out the product. If not, they're just going to let it all site in an effort to bolster the number of users of Xbox Live even further.


So stop crying about it and let them handle it. Hell, every time you guys post another "Your a bad man"/"You have no morals" post, you're just bumping this bad boy back to the top of the pile for even more people to see it.

I don't care if they take advantage of it. That's their perogative.
I just don't want them post on here that it is a correct, right, or 100% legal thing to do.


Feel free to reply to this though. My buddy is getting back from Europe today and if this is at the top then I'm sure he would love to take advantage of it!

Yep, just like I said before. This is getting Xbox Live just what it needs. A couple more assholes. It will be real fun when all these people get online and just start dropping out of games when they start losing.
 
Yep, just like I said before. This is getting Xbox Live just what it needs. A couple more assholes. It will be real fun when all these people get online and just start dropping out of games when they start losing.
Click to expand...

That's not very nice. :(

Just because some people love a bargain (and really, who doesn't) doesn't make them an asshole.

With the exception of the part where you must select an authorized retailer that you work for to gain access to the order form.
Click to expand...

All it really says is "Store". Not "You must work at one of these stores". Sure, almost all of us know what that means but are you really in so much denial that you can't see they left themselves open to some abuse here?
As for all the nice quotes you gave from the retail site...yep they are all on there for the training portion of the site, but NOT for this offer. Sooooo, what's your point again?
 
That's not very nice. :(

No it isn't. Unfortunately, it's likely to be true. Increasing the user base will always introduce more assholes to the environment, but using an exploit that requires misrepresentation to get a cheap price suggests a greater leaning towards the way of the asshole in those partaking in this deal.

Just because some people love a bargain (and really, who doesn't) doesn't make them an asshole.

This is not a bargain, however. You are exploiting a system, and since you tacitly agree to the terms of the site as a condition of using it, you are misrepresenting yourself and perhaps even comitting fraud.



All it really says is "Store". Not "You must work at one of these stores". Sure, almost all of us know what that means but are you really in so much denial that you can't see they left themselves open to some abuse here?

I know they left themselves open for expoit here. If people said they were just doing it because they were a cheap cared more about thier money that following rules, that is one thing.
I can't stand the fact that people are trying to justify thier theft because Microsoft left the site unsecured. That's like saying it's ok to go into a store and steal videogames because they are locked up in a case.


As for all the nice quotes you gave from the retail site...yep they are all on there for the training portion of the site, but NOT for this offer. Sooooo, what's your point again?

Most of the qoutes are from the master terms of use, which are located on every page.... even the page you first look at about this deal.
On top of it, the qoutes from the retail page are those that you tacitly agree to as a condition of your use of the retail.microsoft.com site... including the page that the deal was on. Just because it's not listed on that site doesn't mean that you don't agree to it when using that site.
 
Wow jsweeney...

If you expect to make a counterargument please, pay attention to the original point I make.

After that reply, I noticed that you fall into the logical fallacies of: either/or reasoning, ad hominem, ad populum, and the most obvious political trap a red herring.

I was hoping for an discussion with someone that would use logic above all else, instead you create irrational replies to my points.
When taken in context of my original statement, you're replies address very little and instead repeat what you've already said.

*clap*

this discussion will go nowhere if you don't do any more critial thinking and instead regurgitate what's already been said over 7 pages.

I looked it up in my textbook, asked 3 lawyers (my stepmom, on of her friends and my college professor). All three were in agreement with me.

I have the expert witnesses, what do you have to bring to the table?

Oh and the hasty generalizations you make need to end here.

EX: "To get to the order you must pass a dropdown asking for an affilated retailer.."

There is no fruad there, it says
Store: [ ]

And It does not ask for "an affilated retailer."

EX2:"You still must commit an act of fraud or misrepresentation to gain access to the order form."

Ok lets examine your argument:

The whole context of it, thus far is based on the fact one is fraudulent by affiliating oneself with a company before the purchase of the product.

Now when signing up for the promotion the form promps you with a store selection, with no directions or options.

I attempted originally to submit the form without a store selected, because I didn't know what it meant.

Microsoft then sent me back to the form page stating in red letters
You must select a store. (again, nothing about affiliation)
So I picked my favorite store and went on to order the product.

Your argument is based on the prompt for a store affiliation, but in reality the prompt only asks for a store you may select at random.

(I am ignoring your counter on the public site, because a public domain is defined by a site that anyone can access.
& ATM anyone can access it)

On the public site:
There are no disclaimers prior to ordering.
There is not a section where you state store affiliation.
Anyone can order this product.

************************************

Small tangent:

Now I took a look at the retail signup where you register your microsoft passport account and it asks you for a store ID, management name, employee position, etc..

Now one has to wonder why microsoft wouldn't ask for those details if your passport account wasn't already activated under retail.

Its because they want more people on xbox live, like someone else mentioned earlier in this thread.

Its like Hershy's handing out breast feeding suppliment in third world contries, eventually the mothers stop producing their own and have to buy more.

Eventually the subscribers they get from this deal will have to come back and renew at full price.

Its a hook to gain subscribers.

That's why the security is minimal on an otherwise secure site.

And thats why they are not obvious when asking for a store.
 
I know they left themselves open for expoit here. If people said they were just doing it because they were a cheap cared more about thier money that following rules, that is one thing.
I can't stand the fact that people are trying to justify thier theft because Microsoft left the site unsecured. That's like saying it's ok to go into a store and steal videogames because they are locked up in a case.
Click to expand...

I think you are a little blinded by your temper. The majority of the people here know its stealing, but what they are justifying is a legal way out of this situation if Microsoft chooses to go after some these people. Which is what most of my posts are about. I'm just agreeing that there is nothing that definitely specifies this site is for retail only. Try clicking around from that link that CheapyD posted to find that disclaimer you posted. Have fun finding it without editing the address at the top.

As for signing up. It never says anything about signing up, because you don't need to sign up for the retail team to take advantage of this deal. All you need is Microsoft passport.

-Morpheus

BTW I don't claim to know if their way out is fail-safe, but it still is a way out.

After Edit: What is it with my timing?!!! I'm always posting after these big huge posts without seeing them first. DARN IT!!! :lol:
 
Wow jsweeney you're hopeless -_-

If you expect to make a counterargument please, pay attention to the original point I make.

After that reply, I noticed that you fall into the logical fallacies of: either/or reasoning, ad hominem, ad populum, and the most obvious political trap a red herring.

I was hoping for an discussion with someone that would use logic above all else, instead you create irrational replies to my points.

You keep throwing up straw men, so you're not exactly a person to be speaking about making completely rational statements.

You're falling into just as many logical fallacies as I am... but I'm actually qouting sources, which you have done very little to disprove. Not to mention that when you have qouted information from Microsoft's site you've done so in such a manner that is not consistant with the intent of Microsoft's wording.



When taken in context of my original statement, you're replies address very little and instead repeat what you've already said.

*clap*

this discussion will go nowhere if you don't do any more critial thinking and instead regurgitate what's already been said over 7 pages.

Well, considering that you haven't addressed my points in a satisfactory manner, it is a fair (and somewhat common) practice to revisit arguments already made.



I looked it up in my textbook, asked 3 lawyers (my stepmom, on of her friends and my college professor). All three were in agreement with me.

My guess is that you left them ill informed and your bais tainted what thier opinion would be. More likely that not, you stated your case to them and framed in the most favorable terms for them to reach the conclusion that you want them to. I'd be shocked if you actual showed them the site, the master terms of use for the microsoft domain, and the explicit statement of a terms of use in the same directory structure as the "deal" page was listed.
This link was not intented for public consumption, and the only way it became public was because someone leaked a site link that could be considered "sensitive" material by microsoft.

I have the expert witnesses, what do you have to bring to the table?

A firm doubt of the qualifications of your "expert witnesses".
For all we know, you could be making up your "stepmother the lawyer"

Oh and the hasty generalizations you make need to end here.
EX: "To get to the order you must pass a dropdown asking for an affilated retailer.."

There is no fruad there, it says
Store: [ ]

And It does not ask for "an affilated retailer."

Again, you ignore the fact that this is a part of the site that is not intended for public consumption, and to enter this part of the site you are expected to sign up and agree to the terms stated on the homepage of the Microsoft retail page. If Microsoft sent the intial email with the link to this directly to you, it would be an entirely different situation.


EX2:"You still must commit an act of fraud or misrepresentation to gain access to the order form."

Ok lets examine your argument:

The whole context of it, thus far is based on the fact one is fraudulent by affiliating oneself with a company before the purchase of the product.
Which you have done little to dispute or disprove.

Now when signing up for the promotion the form promps you with a store selection, with no directions or options.

Only if you gain access through a link provided to you by an outside source, which is a breach of the terms of use for Microsoft's webpage.

I attempted originally to submit the form without a store selected, because I didn't know what it meant.

Ignorance of the law is no excuse for the commision of a crime. The fact that you are so lax in reading the terms associated with the deal you what you are agreeing to does not mean that your transaction was legal or correct.

Microsoft then sent me back to the form page stating in red letters
You must select a store. (again, nothing about affiliation)
So I picked my favorite store and went on to order the product.

Ignorance of the law is no excuse for the commision of a crime. The fact that you are so lax in reading the terms associated with the deal you what you are agreeing to does not mean that your transaction was legal or correct.

Your argument is based on the prompt for a store affiliation, but in reality the prompt only asks for a store you may select at random.

Ignorance of the law is no excuse for the commision of a crime. The fact that you are so lax in reading the terms associated with the deal you what you are agreeing to does not mean that your transaction was legal or correct.

Just because you didn't read the terms to which you agree when you use the retail.microsoft.com site does not mean that they are not applied to you.

(I am ignoring your counter on the public site, because a public domain is defined by a site that anyone can access.
& ATM anyone can access it)

Where did you gain this information, then?
Here? That information was given by another person, one that did not have authority to give others information pretaining to the access of Microsoft's site.

On the public site:
There are no disclaimers prior to ordering.
There is not a section where you state store affiliation.
Anyone can order this product.

The public site mentions the master terms of use, which mentions that Microsoft can amend the rules dictating the use of any part of thier site.
The do so on the retail.microsoft.com site. Just because you didn't read it doesn't prevent it's application on you.

************************************

Small tangent:

Now I took a look at the retail signup where you register your microsoft passport account and it asks you for a store ID, management name, employee position, etc..

Now one has to wonder why microsoft wouldn't ask for those details if your passport account wasn't already activated under retail.

Because this deal was not meant to become public. It was sent out to registered members of the retail site, and someone made this link public when they did not have the authority to do so.

Its because they want more people on xbox live, like someone else mentioned earlier in this thread.

Its like Hershy's handing out breast feeding suppliment in third world contries, eventually the mothers stop producing their own and have to buy more.

Eventually the subscribers they get from this deal will have to come back and renew at full price.

Its a hook to gain subscribers.

That's why the security is minimal on an otherwise secure site.

And thats why they are not obvious when asking for a store.

Your accusing me of faulty logic and then you post this?
 
You know what, if all of you that ordered this are so certain of the legality the manner you attained it, go to the Contact page for the site, ask them about this promo, tell them about the order you placed, and be sure to put in your full contact information.

Since you have so many "experts" agreeing with you Valkryst, why don't you do it first.

Since most of you are already dead-set in the opinion that this is legal, and since this has already been up on here and fat wallet for nearing a week, arguing it any further is rather a pointless endeavor... anyone who would order this probably already has, and anyone who hasn't probably won't.

All of you can continue posting on this as much as you want, and you can say all the horrible things about me you want in this thread.
I'm done with it. Ciao.

See you all on the boards :)
 
/shrug

lol :?
lets agree to disagree then.

Its obvious that each of us believes we are in the right and this will only go on for pages more.

In tying up lose ends;
With the lawyers... I showed my stepmom and my professor the site (my stepmom's friend I talked to on the phone, thus could've been biased).

It was fun and I do believe nothing will come of this if one is to order it, but only time will tell.


EDIT:
I wrote this before reading that jsweeney...
While that would be entertaining and a little dumb to do, it would be a waste of time & money.

I guess if discussing legalities with a company with a near-infinate supply of money sounds fun to you, go for it.

But its a big no-no in law.

DOUBLE EDIT:
Aww jweeney, editing your post to say goodbye after you read my post calling it quits?

I wanted a reply or at least a nod of good faith.

Too bad. :roll:
 
You mean like this? :)

Since I was just editing my last post, I'll answer the last post you'll probably make in this thread too..


lol :?
lets agree to disagree then.

That's a great idea. I was ready to drop the topic anyway, but this makes it all the better.

Its obvious that each of us believes we are in the right and this will only go on for pages more.

Well, not really, but you even mentioned that at the edit at the end of this post :)

In tying up lose ends;
With the lawyers... I showed my stepmom and my professor the site (my stepmom's friend I talked to on the phone, thus could've been biased).

You know, it's actually possible we are both right... Internet law is shifting very quickly and a very dynamic medium right now. A lot of times it just the law as dicated by the victor... and since MS has the most money, more often than not they are the victor.

Yeah you're right about the straw man, I edited my post too late.
:lol:
It was fun and I do believe nothing will come of this if one is to order it, but only time will tell.

I sincerely do doubt anything will come of this.
It's the idea of impropriety and the inclusion of these boards in it that I didn't care for. Everyone who ordered it probably will get it.


EDIT:
I wrote this before reading that jsweeney...
While that would be entertaining and a little dumb to do, it would be a waste of time & money.

I know, dramatic overstatements and foolish challanges like that make for good reading though :)

I guess if discussing legalities with a company with a near-infinate supply of money sounds fun to you, go for it.

Nope, since like I said above, a great deal of the law in the area is dictated by the victors in the court cases... and usually that's the guy with the most money.


But its a big no-no in law.

Exactly.

Good to see we could end this on good terms.

Edit: come on, read this one. I really want this to end well.
 
Well, now that the acidic nature of this thread has finally lost momentum, let's change the subject to something more light-hearted.

Who likes pancakes? I myself prefer buttermilk.
 
Well, now that the acidic nature of this thread has finally lost momentum, let's change the subject to something more light-hearted.

Who likes pancakes? I myself prefer buttermilk.

Who are you kidding everybody knows blueberry are the best. :D
 
[quote name='ajh2298']
Who are you kidding everybody knows blueberry are the best. :D[/quote]

Dude, you are gonna turn this into another flame war. And get that damn fruit off my shortstack. Buttermilk + Maple Syrup = Edible Jesus
 
It was fun JSweeney :)

And props to your moral compass for saying no.

Being the poor college student I am, and w/o xbox live...
I decided to go for it.

And when I finally land a job after my graduate studies, I'll compensate by giving to charity in the future :p
 
I too would like to apologize to you Valkryst for taking cheap shots at you and your Stepmother, who I'm going to go ahead and assume exists. Lemme know when and if you get your Live account running and we can play something maybe. I'll have mine running at the beginning of June. You too, JSweeney. I got SC:pT, and I can't wait to start playing it. And I promise I'm not the type of guy to drop a match when he's losing. I know just how frustrating that can be.
 
Thanks led, no hard feelings.

& I like this community feeling I'm getting here.

Can't hold grudges when we are all looking for a good deal ^^

Anyway atm my xbox is in the microsoft shop getting a samsung drive,
but as soon as they send it back and I get SP:pT set up we can own it up.
 
Right on. We'll find JSweeney, team up against him, cry like little girls as he slaughters us, and quit right at the end of the match. :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

Just kidding, JSweeney. Much love, see you online.

These are far and away the best emoticons ---> :robot: :fridge:

No contest.
 
JSweeney, looks like you are wrong. My friend received this email straight from the cats mouth:

If the site allowed you to place the order, then you may keep the order. Thank you

If we may be of further assistance to you, please let us know. Have a great day!
Click to expand...

Its now a legit deal straight from Microsoft. I'm gonna get me some of this. 8)

-Morpheus
 
[quote name='xspeedracerx']Some one should get one for me. I'll pay $40 shipped for one. PM me if you interested.[/quote]They cost $40 shipped after tax and shipping. Not many people will do that for you.
 
[quote name='xspeedracerx']Some one should get one for me. I'll pay $40 shipped for one. PM me if you interested.[/quote]

Dude just order your own.
 
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