Xbox360: Backwards Compatability? Are you psyched?

Javery

Javery

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Not announced yet?

I've been away for a few days and I missed the announcement and everything on MTV. What's the initial buzz on the console? I haven't seen anything that screams next-gen yet but I guess it's a bit early with e3 coming and everything. Is the general consensus that this is a must buy in the fall?
 
I have no evidence for this, because I lost the article and forgot where I got it from in the first place; but basically what it came down to, was that microsoft still have no idea whether the xbox 360 would have backwards capability.

To me, this says that you can kiss the possibility goodbye, unless it's aftermarket.
 
my father is a CFO of a newly formed hedgefund industry who through his partner has major sources with very important people in microsoft informed him that the 360 will NOT be backwards compatible. I asked him why the hell would he need to know that and i got some bullshit about how in order to co-operate with clients they need to give their whole shpeal. I sware im telling the truth the box will NOT be backward compatible
 
[quote name='sonderiaom']I have no evidence for this, because I lost the article and forgot where I got it from in the first place; but basically what it came down to, was that microsoft still have no idea whether the xbox 360 would have backwards capability.

To me, this says that you can kiss the possibility goodbye, unless it's aftermarket.[/QUOTE]


Was that article recent? I remember reading that months ago but haven't seen anything new since then.

I agree though- no news is bad news on this one, or else it would've been all over that MTV special. who knows, if we don't hear anything by the time E3 is over, it's a definite "no."
 
[quote name='sonderiaom']I have no evidence for this, because I lost the article and forgot where I got it from in the first place; but basically what it came down to, was that microsoft still have no idea whether the xbox 360 would have backwards capability.

To me, this says that you can kiss the possibility goodbye, unless it's aftermarket.[/QUOTE]


I don't know if this is the article:
http://www.hardgeus.com/index.php?ndailyupdateid=604

regardless if it is it, the article doesn't paint a pretty picture for the possibility of backwards compatibility.
 
[quote name='pubes']I don't know if this is the article:
http://www.hardgeus.com/index.php?ndailyupdateid=604

regardless if it is it, the article doesn't paint a pretty picture for the possibility of backwards compatibility.[/QUOTE]

He makes a few incorrect assumption that undermine his argument. It is a given that good emulation must cope with code that bypasses the API. Otherwise the task would be trivial. How does this guy suppose the numerous pure software emulators for earlier platforms manage to operate? Most of those are produced by guys working out of their homes for fun rather than well financed commercial efforts. The 'Black Box' approach to replicating a machines behavior by observation of correct behavior then running the same code on your emulator is a well established process, albeit time intensive.

I think it's funny that he just recently heard that the five year old PS2 has most of the PS1 within its I/O processor.

BTW: I think I still have a review copy of the guy's game Cylindrix in a box somewhere in my storage locker.
 
Borrowed from Ozzkev's post in the XB 360 forum:

[quote name='ozzkev']Fresh In From Gamespot
http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/0...ws_6124969.html

[quote name='Gamespot.com'] Graphics manufacturer Nvidia announced last week that it will stop chip shipments to Microsoft after August 1, according to a Financial Times report.

The statement indicates that Microsoft will very likely discontinue Xbox production in advance of the Xbox 360 launch planned for this holiday season since Nvidia chips are an essential component of the Microsoft Xbox game console.

The move is surprising because console manufacturers have traditionally continued older system production for several years after the launch of its successor. Sony's original PlayStation, for example, has had a decade-long lifecycle. Originally released in 1995, Sony continued selling the PlayStation as a value gaming system years after releasing its successor, the PlayStation 2. The continued sales helped maintain demand for an aging game library and also introduced the PlayStation brand to new users who could potentially upgrade to a newer system.

Microsoft has indicated in the past that the current Xbox system has been expensive to produce, partly due to the fact that it must purchase chips from Intel and Nvidia instead of manufacturing its own silicon. Sony was able to reduce console production costs by redesigning systems year after year, but that option isn't available to Microsoft with the Xbox. At the Consumer Electronics Show this year, Microsoft's Cameron Ferroni told us that the Xbox team had considered producing a cost-reduced design, but decided that the cost-benefit wasn't compelling enough.

"You never say never, but it's a pretty major, massive engineering undertaking, and I'm not sure that the bang for the buck is necessarily there,” Ferroni said. “The reality is that no matter what we did to the Box, there's still a hard drive in there."

An imminent halt to Xbox production is the largest sign so far that the Xbox 360 will be backward compatible with legacy Xbox games. With the Xbox's large game library, Microsoft can't risk discontinuing the current Xbox console unless it plans to offer legacy support in a future system.[/quote][/quote]

Microsoft wouldn't stop making the Xbox if the 360 wasn't backwards compatible. They also wouldn't bring it out at a $600 price point if they were going to stop making regular Xbox units.
 
[quote name='shrike4242']Borrowed from Ozzkev's post in the XB 360 forum:



[/i]Microsoft wouldn't stop making the Xbox if the 360 wasn't backwards compatible. They also wouldn't bring it out at a $600 price point if they were going to stop making regular Xbox units.[/QUOTE]
You gotta return that post by noon on the 8th day ok...

Im psyched as hell
 
Yes, this was announced during the conference earlier. Complete BC, not just some games.. complete.

Along with a firm release date and price point, the other big question surrounding the 360 was backward compatibility with the library of games from the original Xbox. Robbie Bach, senior vice president and chief Xbox officer in the Home and Entertainment Division at Microsoft, made Xbox fans around the world happy when he announced that the 360 will indeed play Xbox games.
Click to expand...

It will be B/C with the more popular Xbox games.
Click to expand...

No. ALL. The Gamespot article originally said "some", and it's since been changed.
 
[quote name='Scorch']Yes, this was announced during the conference earlier. Complete BC, not just some games.. complete.

No. ALL. The Gamespot article originally said "some", and it's since been changed.[/QUOTE]

Now I just have to see if not having an HDTV is going to be an issue with the 360.
 
[quote name='Scorch']Yes, this was announced during the conference earlier. Complete BC, not just some games.. complete.





No. ALL. The Gamespot article originally said "some", and it's since been changed.[/QUOTE]


That is not what Peter Moore said. So yeah.
 
Xbox 360 officially will be backward compatible with the prior system's top-selling games, said Microsoft's Vice President Peter Moore. Microsoft will pick and choose only the most popular Xbox titles from its huge backlist of games and will most likely use emulator software for those limited titles.

There's an excerpt from the IGN article. SHIT!
 
Yeah I'm pretty pissed off man. I was hoping to just have my Xbox in storage and play all my XBL games on the 360, but those douchebags decided to be cute, so I suppose I can't store my Xbox. DAMN!
 
If it is indeed only "popular" games, MS just lost my sale. The wording still seems ambiguous and the sites seem to have different takes on it.
 
[quote name='XboxHardcore.com']So you are basing your purchase on BC..... how stupid.[/QUOTE]

Not at all. I have over 130 XBOX games I don't plan to give up, and I don't want a third gaming box in my living room. If XBOX360 is not BC with most titles, PS3 will be my first purchase for sure.
 
[quote name='Ruined']Not at all. I have over 130 XBOX games I don't plan to give up, and I don't want a third gaming box in my living room.[/QUOTE]

Is it that big of a hassle to have the XBOX out? Hell Ive got like 10 consoles in my entertainment center....
 
[quote name='XboxHardcore.com']Is it that big of a hassle to have the XBOX out? Hell Ive got like 10 consoles in my entertainment center....[/QUOTE]

Yes, I don't want my living room and home theater to be eclipsed by video game consoles and controllers. I was one of the staunchest proponents of XBOX1, got it on launch and loaded up on titles. MS really dropped the ball if they can't attain BC for most games (while Sony can in PS3). Massive mistake on their part IMO...
 
BC doesn't really matter to me. It would matter to me if I didn't have an xbox. Do you guys really play your old systems enough to have them out all the time? I'm about to bust out my N64 for which I havent played in years, but that has been stored away.
 
I'd never sell my Halo Xbox anyways, so BC is pretty inconsequential to me. Though it would be nice to not have to have both systems sitting out.
 
Limited? What the fuck....I hope the Xbox games I have are comptible or I don't what I'm going to do. Sell my Xbox or keep it for the handful of games that aren't compatible.... :( I don't know.
 
[quote name='zewone']Limited? What the fuck....I hope the Xbox games I have are comptible or I don't what I'm going to do. Sell my Xbox or keep it for the handful of games that aren't compatible.... :( I don't know.[/QUOTE]

From the IGN article it sounds like it will be the handful of games that ARE compatible. Gamespot seems more optimistic. Either way, it sucks, we will have to wait and see. Maybe those who take the XBOX360 plunge at launch can make a list of the games that do and don't work for those of us who find BC a very important feature.
 
As I explained previously, the method of emulation may include files that are generated in advance to provide much of the code in already translated form. This means each game required a lot of playtesting to generate the data and assure the emulation is working correctly throughout.

Due to this it could take a very long time to cover every item in the Xbox library. So the natural thing to do is play favorites. Halo 2 is going to get the treatment long before turkeys like Stake or Kabuki Warriors. As more titles are processed the files can be downloaded from XBL Silver.

Out of the 600 or so Xbox titles (many are offered only in Europe or Japan) only a hundred or so are critical to keeping migrating Xbox owners happy and hold the promise of selling many more copies to 360 owners who never owned its predecessor. Thems the breaks. Many titles just aren't worth the effort. If Madden 2005 runs, how many will notice that Madden 2004 doesn't? That progression in sports titles covers a lot of ground right there.

As the process goes on the emulation software should imporve to the point that the time it take to proess a game will get shorter but for now nobody in their right mind will shed a tear if Aquaman is left behind.
 
Sigh.

So basically by telling us something, they've told us next to nothing and now even more questions are raised. Before we just wanted to know if it would be backwards compatible...now we get to play the "with ALL titles or with SOME titles" game.

While I'm sure stuff like Halo 2 and PGR 2 and other big name stuff will work ok, I'm just as concerned about the rest of my library as the "important" stuff.

I do want to throw my support behind this system based on what I've seen so far, but there are still too many questions and still a lot of stuff to come from competitors that could change my mind. Oh well.
 
w00t!

some clarification:

http://news.com.com/A+gaggle+of+new+games+for+Xbox+360/2100-1043_3-5709353.html?tag=st_lh

"At Monday's event, Microsoft also announced plans to make all games from its previous console compatible with the upcoming Xbox 360. However, few details were given regarding how, or when, updated support for Xbox titles would be achieved. Microsoft representatives did say they would start with more popular titles such as "Halo," then move down the line."

Now thats what I like to hear! I bet you money each game will likely need a "profile" of sorts to be stored on the hard drive in order to work right, and users will be able to download more profiles as time goes on over XBOX Live. As long as MS plans to keep up work to make most games BC eventually through Live updates, I'll buy the console.
 
this is soooo weak... i was actually thinking of purchasing one at launch, but no longer. i think ill go for a used xbox after the next price drop. what would possess microsoft to do this when the ps3 can play ps2 and ps1 games and the revolution will be able to play gamecube games. i mean it makes little sense, i know there are more than a few of my kind (ie people with no xbox that thought they could get away with buying a 360) who will be irked by this
 
[quote name='iheartmetal']this is soooo weak... i was actually thinking of purchasing one at launch, but no longer. i think ill go for a used xbox after the next price drop. what would possess microsoft to do this when the ps3 can play ps2 and ps1 games and the revolution will be able to play gamecube games. i mean it makes little sense, i know there are more than a few of my kind (ie people with no xbox that thought they could get away with buying a 360) who will be irked by this[/QUOTE]

read my above post things look more positive now.
 
[quote name='Ruined']read my above post things look more positive now.[/QUOTE]

that doesnt sound promising, i mean popular titles doesnt mean squat to me, and like someone pointed out it could take a long time to emulate each individual game. so what if i can play halo 2 out of the box (i know a lot of people will want to) but i want to play panzar dragoon, shenmue, ninja gaiden and the likes and i dont want to have to wait several months, or longer to do so
 
[quote name='iheartmetal']that doesnt sound promising, i mean popular titles doesnt mean squat to me, and like someone pointed out it could take a long time to emulate each individual game. so what if i can play halo 2 out of the box (i know a lot of people will want to) but i want to play panzar dragoon, shenmue, ninja gaiden and the likes and i dont want to have to wait several months, or longer to do so[/QUOTE]


Don't forget mediocre sellers that were great/unique games like Steel Battalion, Super Monkey Ball Deluxe, Pure Pinball, Oddworld: Stranger's Wrath, Beyond Good and Evil, Jet Set Radio Future, Psychonauts, and Guilty Gear X2 #Reload :)

It does suck that it won't work right away, but if they get them to work eventually, that's good enough for me. Getting a solid base emulation engine down is the toughest part, though it appears MS has already done this. The next part is not as hard, but time consuming, and involves playtesting games to see if any tweaks must be made to avoid glitches in the emulation on a per-game basis. This can be done with game profiles in XBOX Live downloads.

Let's face it, Halo 2 pushed the limits of the XBOX console to the extreme. If they can emulate that (and it will likely be the first title they are working on), they can emulate anything given the commitment.
 
BC is extremely important to me because I never owned an xbox this generation. In fact, I've only played one for about 10 minutes at a friend's house so I know I'm missing out on some great games. BC would have sold me on the 360. Oh well. I'm still thinking about getting it but it's no longer a slam dunk for me...
 
I know this has been said by everyone already, but I would never buy a system at launch if it wasn't BC. I can't see myself buying a $300 or more system that only can play a few (probably) subpar launch games. If I have to stare at my XBOX360 for a long time with no games to play I would feel pretty shitty about my purchase.
 
I'm not a collector so i want bc that way i can sell my Xbox to help finance the 360. If it's not bc that's not a deal breaker by any means.
 
I'm one of the people who don't have an xbox and was considering buying a 360 if it was going to be backwards compatable. Upon hearing the news I'm sure Halo 1 and 2 will be covered, but I'm personally interested in Sega's Xbox games like Panzer Dragoon and Toe Jam and Earl. Also Tecmo's games. I guess I'll wait till next year and have a wait and see attitude. I'm pretty much sold on PS3 and 90% sold on Revolution (though it should sell for about $150 at launch since it will be the weakest of the systems).
 
[quote name='Ozzkev55']Huh...What?[/QUOTE]

Only B/C with certain titles. Microsoft should look at the success of PS2 B/C, and now Nintendo is doing it to. Bad mistake.
 
[quote name='Mr. Anderson']Only B/C with certain titles. Microsoft should look at the success of PS2 B/C, and now Nintendo is doing it to. Bad mistake.[/QUOTE]
Oh damn, only certain titles, well that is a bad move after all.
 
[quote name='bil4l']Yeah I'm pretty pissed off man. I was hoping to just have my Xbox in storage and play all my XBL games on the 360, but those douchebags decided to be cute, so I suppose I can't store my Xbox. DAMN![/QUOTE]
no, but you can stack thanks to the wonderful design dimensions.
 
My concern, I have a fairly large Xbox game collection. I need to keep it.

Xboxs die. We hear about it all the time. First the DRE's hit, then it takes 2 minutes to load a level. I had a Thompson drive crap out in me in less than a year. And I take excellent care of my stuff.

Now, Microsoft is not getting anymore shipments of the Xbox video card. What does that mean. Come Nov. - Dec. of next year, if your Xbox takes a dump on you, so could your collection.

Think Microsoft is sitting on a wherehouse of Xboxs? Could be, but remember where all the old PS2's went, when the new model came....
 
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