You can talk about LRG non gaming stuff here!

Regardless, I will defend trans rights and some of y'all need to crack a book or talk to someone IRL because the dog whistles are pretty deafening. Trans folks have exists as long as humans have, they're not sexual predators, they're not child groomers, and they're not "confused" nor is it a choice.
I'm not sure that I agree with everything that you stated, but I CAN agree with one thing: "I will defend trans rights". You see, as a right leaning person, I believe that I truly understand the "COEXIST" sticker that most liberals have on their car.

We need to learn to live with people of differing opinions. That's where LRG (not to mention other companies) went wrong.

Just because I don't agree with you, I firmly believe in your right to hold those beliefs and would proudly work beside you.

 
I'm not sure that I agree with everything that you stated, but I CAN agree with one thing: "I will defend trans rights". You see, as a right leaning person, I believe that I truly understand the "COEXIST" sticker that most liberals have on their car.

We need to learn to live with people of differing opinions. That's where LRG (not to mention other companies) went wrong.

Just because I don't agree with you, I firmly believe in your right to hold those beliefs and would proudly work beside you.
That's a bit of an iffy stance, if your coworker was openly racist would you respect their right to be racist and proudly work besides them?
 
That's a bit of an iffy stance, if your coworker was openly racist would you respect their right to be racist and proudly work besides them?
As long as the "racist" was respectful during working hours, I have no issues. This ALL changes, however, if those views are actively pushed within the workplace.

In our world, a Christian may have to work beside an atheist. A racist may have a black co-worker. I'm not saying that they have to be buddies and sing songs together, but yeah, you have to learn to deal with people that you may disagree with. In fact, we just might realize that the people that don't agree with us really are human beings ...

We need to stop dehumanizing people by labeling them as "transphobe" or "p3dos" when they have beliefs that don't completely align with ours. Both sides are just fueling hate at this point.

 
As long as the "racist" was respectful during working hours, I have no issues. This ALL changes, however, if those views are actively pushed within the workplace.

In our world, a Christian may have to work beside an atheist. A racist may have a black co-worker. I'm not saying that they have to be buddies and sing songs together, but yeah, you have to learn to deal with people that you may disagree with. In fact, we just might realize that the people that don't agree with us really are human beings ...

We need to stop dehumanizing people by labeling them as "transphobe" or "p3dos" when they have beliefs that don't completely align with ours. Both sides are just fueling hate at this point.
Yes, I too love when dangerous ideologies are just theoretical because I don't need to worry about them manifesting as legislation or violence against me simply for existing. XD

The notion that "labeling people as transphobes" is unfairly dehumanizing is beyond satire. Sure, they want to see us genocided, but we're being the bullies by calling them what they are.

 
Did anyone have "Ted Cruz tweets about LRG and Bronycon" on their 2023 Bingo cards?

https://twitter.com/tedcruz/status/1612498365731999746

 
Yes, I too love when dangerous ideologies are just theoretical because I don't need to worry about them manifesting as legislation or violence against me simply for existing. XD

The notion that "labeling people as transphobes" is unfairly dehumanizing is beyond satire. Sure, they want to see us genocided, but we're being the bullies by calling them what they are.
So when does disagreement become "transphobic"? If I say that a transwoman shouldn't compete against biological women in sports, am I a transphobe and get lumped in with those that are trying to "genocide" the community? The world is shades of gray, not just black and white.

In my opinion, labeling the argument above as "transphobic" would be just as bad as labeling someone defending the trans community as a "p3do". You're using the label to dehumanize the other side and mike drop ... end of discussion. Not good in a world where we need more discussion and less hatred.

 


If I say that a transwoman shouldn't compete against biological women in sports, am I a transphobe and get lumped in with those that are trying to "genocide" the community?
What a horrible strawman. If you see labeling every transgender as a pedophile or sexual predator the same as sports competitions, you're beyond lost. How about not going after every transgender while leaving all the guilty Catholic priests alone for decades?
 
So when does disagreement become "transphobic"? If I say that a transwoman shouldn't compete against biological women in sports, am I a transphobe and get lumped in with those that are trying to "genocide" the community? The world is shades of gray, not just black and white.

In my opinion, labeling the argument above as "transphobic" would be just as bad as labeling someone defending the trans community as a "p3do". You're using the label to dehumanize the other side and mike drop ... end of discussion. Not good in a world where we need more discussion and less hatred.
Do you acknowledge power dynamics? Is that something you can wrap your head around? Like, one the one hand, stochastic terrorists with platforms, either in media or politics, call trans people "p3dos," and we get murdered and have our rights stripped away. On the other hand, a woman was working in a public-facing position while following said transphobes, gets called a transphobe, and loses her job as a result.

You really see these as "just as bad?" C'mon, use that ability of yours to see the shades of gray here. She'll get another job and go on with her life. Meanwhile trans kids are denied care and commit suicide because they live in a world that ACTUALLY dehumanizes them.

 
What a horrible strawman. If you see labeling every transgender as a pedophile or sexual predator the same as sports competitions, you're beyond lost. How about not going after every transgender while leaving all the guilty Catholic priests alone for decades?
I try to point out that not everyone that agrees or disagrees an ideology are evil and you jump right to that I am "beyond lost" and then throw Catholic priests at me?

I'm not "going after every transgender" here ... I'm going after anyone that paints with a broad brush and instantly labels the other side as evil at the hint of disagreement, be they straight, gay, trans or non-binary. I don't discriminate.

(And of course the Catholic pedophile thing was horrible and evil but I fail to see how it belongs in this discussion.)

 


I'm not "going after every transgender" here ... I'm going after anyone that paints with a broad brush and instantly labels the other side as evil at the hint of disagreement, be they straight, gay, trans or non-binary. I don't discriminate.
You realize there's a group of very vocal people doing exactly what you say you're against, right? You knows that's why this situation blew up like it did, right?
 
Do you acknowledge power dynamics? Is that something you can wrap your head around? Like, one the one hand, stochastic terrorists with platforms, either in media or politics, call trans people "p3dos," and we get murdered and have our rights stripped away. On the other hand, a woman was working in a public-facing position while following said transphobes, gets called a transphobe, and loses her job as a result.

You really see these as "just as bad?" C'mon, use that ability of yours to see the shades of gray here. She'll get another job and go on with

her life. Meanwhile trans kids are denied care and commit suicide because they live in a world that ACTUALLY dehumanizes them.
Interesting that you downplay her situation. This is probably a very stressful moment of her life ... publicly being embarrassed by her company, the internet, you and others. Does she deserve it?

No, I don't see these as just as bad ... my point ... where is the line between disagreement and transphobia? I absolutely never condone violence against anyone, trans or otherwise, but if you're blaming the Libs of Tiktok for killing people, we can agree to disagree. You can call it stochastic terrorism, but to me, that's the same as saying violent video games lead people to commit massacres.

And I understand the power dynamics perfectly here as the media uses terms to end any discussion on matters. Words matter which is why abortion is "pro choice" and not "pro abortion".

Take this entire discussion for an example. I start out by saying everyone shouldn't label each other. But interestingly, that's not good enough ... many people aren't able to see that anything that they are saying or doing may be fanning the flames as well. We can all do better no matter what side you're on.

Unfortunately, it's getting to the point where any questioning of the "correct view" is seen as hatred and pounced on. If I say everyone (including myself AND you) can do better, why is that a bad thing?

 
No, I don't see these as just as bad ... my point ... where is the line between disagreement and transphobia? I absolutely never condone violence against anyone, trans or otherwise, but if you're blaming the Libs of Tiktok for killing people, we can agree to disagree. You can call it stochastic terrorism, but to me, that's the same as saying violent video games lead people to commit massacres.
Okay yeah, that's where I stop wasting my time lol.

Keep straddling that line between bigotry and acceptance and feeling like you're in a morally defensible position, I guess.

 
What a horrible strawman. If you see labeling every transgender as a pedophile or sexual predator the same as sports competitions, you're beyond lost. How about not going after every transgender while leaving all the guilty Catholic priests alone for decades?
Except that the person who attacked Kara Lynne and made her lose her job is in fact a p3d0. Those are the facts. The was no need to attack her. The single tweet she made took place 7 years ago, before she even started working at LRG.

Do you acknowledge power dynamics? Is that something you can wrap your head around? Like, one the one hand, stochastic terrorists with platforms, either in media or politics, call trans people "p3dos," and we get murdered and have our rights stripped away. On the other hand, a woman was working in a public-facing position while following said transphobes, gets called a transphobe, and loses her job as a result.

You really see these as "just as bad?" C'mon, use that ability of yours to see the shades of gray here. She'll get another job and go on with her life. Meanwhile trans kids are denied care and commit suicide because they live in a world that ACTUALLY dehumanizes them.
How old are you? 16-17 years old? I believe that 99% of people have no problem with trans. Who you sleep with or what you do to your body as an adult is your business and should stay that way. The problem is that you're not trying to defend trans rights, what you're advocating for is trying to normalize the mutilation of children. If you think that parents are just going to stand back and let you mutilate their kids then think again. Messing with kids is the one line you don't want to cross. Even in prison amongst the hardened criminals and murderers, messing with underage kids is the one crime you don't want to go to prison for. I promise you.

There were no trans kids when I was growing up. Where do they even get that idea from? By watching TIkTok and from schools? This is why you hate Libs of Tiktok because she reposts everything that you don't want your parents to find out. We had to wait until we were 18 before we could get our first car, get a tattoo, vote, or go to a bar. You can wait until you're 18 just like the rest of us before you start doing irreversible damage to your body. Also it goes without saying, if you take away people's ability to reproduce, the human species would literally cease to exist.

 
Except that the person who attacked Kara Lynne and made her lose her job is in fact a p3d0. Those are the facts. The was no need to attack her. The single tweet she made took place 7 years ago, before she even started working at LRG.

How old are you? 16-17 years old? I believe that 99% of people have no problem with trans. Who you sleep with or what you do to your body as an adult is your business and should stay that way. The problem is that you're not trying to defend trans rights, what you're advocating for is trying to normalize the mutilation of children. If you think that parents are just going to stand back and let you mutilate their kids then think again. Messing with kids is the one line you don't want to cross. Even in prison amongst the hardened criminals and murderers, messing with underage kids is the one crime you don't want to go to prison for. I promise you.

There were no trans kids when I was growing up. Where do they even get that idea from? By watching TIkTok and from schools? This is why you hate Libs of Tiktok because she reposts everything that you don't want your parents to find out. We had to wait until we were 18 before we could get our first car, get a tattoo, vote, or go to a bar. You can wait until you're 18 just like the rest of us before you start doing irreversible damage to your body. Also it goes without saying, if you take away people's ability to reproduce, the human species would literally cease to exist.
The condescension is cute, but I'm 35. Already done a fair bit of "irreversible damage" to my body, and I guarantee I'm hotter than any girl you'll ever be with. XD

 
The condescension is cute, but I'm 35. Already done a fair bit of "irreversible damage" to my body, and I guarantee I'm hotter than any girl you'll ever be with. XD
No condescension intended. You brought up genocide. I have no other idea why you would feel like someone would want to genocide you.. As I said, if the intention is to go after kids, there will be push back from parents. Even animals will fight to the death to defend their young. That is inherent to all species.

I've evolved beyond chasing after hot girls. It's like a drug, you'll never be satisfied as there will always be someone hotter. I prefer a nice loyal woman that I can settle down and form a connection with. I'm glad that you're hot though. If that's what makes you happy, end of the day that's all that matters! XD

 
Okay yeah, that's where I stop wasting my time lol.

Keep straddling that line between bigotry and acceptance and feeling like you're in a morally defensible position, I guess.
Sorry that I can't give 100% approval, I still have issues with many different facets of the ideology. To Bryson's point, I also have issues with the "trans kids" thing, parent approval, hormone blockers, etc. Bill Maher recently had a monologue on the subject (Along for the Pride, look it up on YouTube) which pretty much sums up my stance. As an adult, you're free to make your own decisions, but kids aren't mature enough to make many of these life altering changes that are often glorified and celebrated on social media.

And I'm straddling just fine, thank you. Trying to accept but I have real concerns about the ideology. Call me (and others) bigot or transphobe if it makes you feel better but it's not a winning strategy for the movement.

 
Sorry that I can't give 100% approval, I still have issues with many different facets of the ideology. To Bryson's point, I also have issues with the "trans kids" thing, parent approval, hormone blockers, etc. Bill Maher recently had a monologue on the subject (Along for the Pride, look it up on YouTube) which pretty much sums up my stance. As an adult, you're free to make your own decisions, but kids aren't mature enough to make many of these life altering changes that are often glorified and celebrated on social media.

And I'm straddling just fine, thank you. Trying to accept but I have real concerns about the ideology. Call me (and others) bigot or transphobe if it makes you feel better but it's not a winning strategy for the movement.
https://www.vice.com/en/article/epnzjk/no-one-had-a-problem-with-puberty-blockers-when-only-cis-kids-took-them

Again, suicide is high within the trans community because we're demonized and denied life-affirming care. If you actually care about these kids, there's really only one side of the issue to take.

Ultimately I have little expectation of actually changing individual's minds. Everyone's in their little media echo chamber these days (myself included) that reinforces what they already believe. I think eventually, barring some sort of actual right-wing extremist uprising, conservatives will be dragged kicking and screaming into modernity just like they had to be with interracial marriage, same-sex marriage, etc. And then given enough time they'll look back with zero self-reflection as they deny rights to the next minority group they're told to demonize.

 
Everyone who disagrees is not conservative. Why does this black-or-white thinking always come up? I'm very liberal, and I don't agree with the trans movement either. And it's in fact BECAUSE I'm socially liberal.

See, long ago, society invented this thing called "gender roles". Men should do this, and women should do that. And there are myriad reasons why they were started. At best, it was disciplined rules to help primitive people survive when nature was still extremely harsh and fatal. And at worst, it was used as a way for those in power to keep others from taking their power.  But regardless of origins, it was a thing that got passed down into the present day, where there is absolutely no reason for it in modern society. These gender stereotypes still exist only because people saw previous people doing it, so they feel that it's "right".

And then a few decade ago, there was something called a "feminist movement". These are people who felt like these gender roles were causing harm to women. So they advocated to abolish these rules. Women should be free to do anything they want to do, and act however they want to. And society should not call somebody a failure of a woman (or failure of a man) because they do not adhere to these stereotypes. Which sounds fantastic to me. Men and women are free to do whatever they want to, with no barriers in their way.

But now, comes along the trans movement. And suddenly, not only are gender stereotypes important again, but they are somehow THE most important thing in determining if you're truly a woman or a man. Teaching people that if you're a woman but you behave "manly", then, well, you're probably a man. You should just become a man. It's not right to have you acting like this while still being a woman. And I heavily disagree with this logic. I think sex is the only thing that exists, and gender is completely fake.

And yet, like many other people, I don't care if a person is trans. There is no secret desire to "genocide" anyone. Wear what you want, date who you want, act how you want. It's your life. Have fun. I just disagree that the pro-gender ideology is correct and that everybody else must be forced to believe the same.

Like others have just said, there should never be any excuse to cause harm upon those you disagree with. I also don't agree with religious logic, or pro-corporation logic, or people who wear socks with sandals. But at the end of the day, these same folks are also nice people and I can get along with them all just fine without having to try to ruin their lives or make up pejorative labels to stick on them. Thinking that you are "right" is NEVER a justification to attack others.

 
I understand exactly what he's saying. Society has in recent years tried to eliminate gender stereotypes such as: girls like dolls, boys like trucks. This was considered progressive saying that a girl can like masculine things and that a boy can like feminine things.

In some circles now, this has morphed into: "Billy plays with dolls? Maybe Billy is a girl." Many see this as going backwards by reinforcing old gender norms.

 
Yeah, if there was one complaint I had about modern queer culture, it's that we've completely erased the femboy.

It gets so exhausting even trying to figure out how to respond to these kind of claims after a while, lol.  I'm sorry that the community that I'm a member of and active in is apparently pushing these ideologies that you made up entirely in your own head?  I know far more trans gender abolitionists than cis ones, but yeah, we're totally the ones pushing for gender stereotypes I guess.

It's like when Matt Walsh tweeted the other day about how you never see trans girls dating other trans girls.  After a while you just have to laugh to keep from going insane.

 
"Queer" and "trans" are not the same thing. Though a person could be both at once. For example, femboys are not trans. By definition, they are boys who act feminine. They can also be gay or straight, so sexuality is not a defining characteristic either. So at the end, if you remove the belief of "fem" gender stereotypes, then all you're left with is... a boy. Who in theory would be free to do whatever he wants without being judged or labelled for it.

As for the contradiction between people who say they are against gender norms and yet reinforce them blatantly, I have no good answer. My best guess is that they do not fully understand what they're talking about. Perhaps merely following what other people have told them that they need to say. But either way, that is something that they can figure out for themselves. Just because I don't understand someone's beliefs doesn't mean I need to violently force mine onto them.

 
Maybe you should reexamine your need to control women, I think it might be holding you back emotionally if you're having trouble coping in the real world
I grew up with younger sisters you f#cking weirdo. It's probably why I feel the need to protect women from perverts like you. Meanwhile the recent mass shooting of innocent children in Nashville was committed by a trans activist. I implore anyone with children to keep them far far away from these mentally deranged psychopaths.

https://twitter.com/MaximeBernier/status/1640741055556382723?s=20

 
Is this in response to the “I’ll pay any legal fees if you were fired for a tweet?” Musk posted over the weekend?

If so, L.O.L. if she thinks a) she has a case and b) Musk will actually pay for anything, at all.
 
Is this in response to the “I’ll pay any legal fees if you were fired for a tweet?” Musk posted over the weekend?
If so, L.O.L. if she thinks a) she has a case and b) Musk will actually pay for anything, at all.
Sure seems to be, which is absolutely laughable. NC is an at-will state that can fire for any reason whatsoever, and me thinks being the COMMUNITY MANAGER for a company that sells a wide variety of games from different cultures and backgrounds, and being transphobic like she was is absolutely understandable terms for termination: hell, even if you were on the “wow did they really kneejerk that fast over an old follow?” Train, all that should have flown out the window the minute she began publicly associating with anti trans activists and known bigots after the firing, and going on a silly “pity me” tour.

Especially since you know, embracer were the ones making the call for LRG to fire her as swiftly as they did, the idea of kara and musk teaming up to sue a company of *that* size for that reason? Yeah no, she has zero case and musk will turn on her the minute it’s most convenient for him. Maybe she shouldn’t have associated with known members of hate groups during the period of time when states were trying to force heinous anti LGBT bills on everyone, after being a CM publishing games like Ikenfell, Celeste and NITW.
 
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I must have missed this. Who did she associate with?
hours after being fired, her husband tweeted at TheQuartering and Tim Pool, two of the biggest outrage bigots on YT and complained about the company being "woke" when firing her, then weeks later Kara appeared on Tucker Carlson, which... Yeah, explains itself. She even got backing from libs of tiktok, who pretty much is the absolute worst of toxicity in the anti-trans space as of now, and months later she quote retweeted Gays Against Groomers backing their dumb crusade against trans people. Not to mention the many interviews she went on from all sorts of far right grifters like Quartering in the months and weeks since before ending up at her new job. As a looooong time game reviewer who've met hundreds of devs and pubs from all over the world, those sorts of associations are a great way to get blacklisted or at least get a lot of indies to not want to work with you, especially when a bunch of LGBT folk are making games while also having to fight for their human rights in recent years and hardly anyone is tolerant of that bigotry these days anyhow.

It isn't like she just quietly followed random people from a political party that people didn't like (if she followed random congressmen, i dont think people would bat an eye): she openly followed anti-LGBT activists and figures who openly trash LGBT and minorities very frequently, have pushed to get LGBT rights weakened in several states over the past year, and after her firing has gotten even more comfortable with talking to them publicly since her new employer doesn't care about that and she's pretty much able to go mask off to the new audience she built off of the whole incident.

The bigger question in my head is why LRG didn't vet that stuff to begin with or at least give her a different position than CM if they knew: my guess is based on how sloppy CS/PR was in the weeks after the firing, they literally had nobody else to prepare for the position and the firing was also unprepared due to not even being done by them to begin with, and they assumed since she didn't blurt that stuff out publicly, it would be OK. Well, joke's on them.

 
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Sure seems to be, which is absolutely laughable. NC is an at-will state that can fire for any reason whatsoever, and me thinks being the COMMUNITY MANAGER for a company that sells a wide variety of games from different cultures and backgrounds, and being transphobic like she was is absolutely understandable terms for termination: hell, even if you were on the “wow did they really kneejerk that fast over an old follow?” Train, all that should have flown out the window the minute she began publicly associating with anti trans activists and known bigots after the firing, and going on a silly “pity me” tour.
For the at will employment piece, she even acknowledged this herself in her first post after getting fired. That post alone would likely undercut a lot of her ability to bring any type of legal theory she could come up with for her “wrongful” termination. (Those quotes doing a lot of heavy lifting obviously)

The tone on that initial statement is wildly different than her position and attitude since.
 
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