Slowdown in VC game sales

Cheapy mentioned that there's been a decline in VC sales on the Wii recently. One reason posited was one of wombat's criticisms - they're too expensive. I can think of a few other reasons:

1) People aren't playing their Wiis as much. If Wiis don't get turned on, people aren't even going to *see* the new VC offerings.
2) People have given up on shopping for Wii stuff since it's so often out of stock and the games out there aren't that great. If you don't shop the Wii section of the store, you won't pick up a Wii points card.
3) People *don't like points*. I have no idea how XBLA is doing but I've heard criticism about the marketplace's points system. I prefer to use real money to purchase things.
4) VC games have onerous DRM. I know that I'm not going to buy another VC game until I can back it up. I wonder if others are holding off for the same reason.

Am I missing any?

All good reasons, but some people like points better, such as getting them free when you purchase something and people don't like giving credit card info over the internet. I think the main reason (besides that they are a rip-off) is that most of the people buying Wii's now aren't the ones interested in old games and that all the people that wanted old games, already bought them.

That, and there haven't been any OMG MUST HAVE~! games lately.

One point you missed

There are more and more actual Wii games coming out, so people might be spending their money on those instead (Super Paper Mario, Godfather, Spider-Man 3 today, etc..)

Not saying it is right but it is a possibility.

My understanding of it is, the more Wii games you have saved onto your console, everytime you want to go back to your main Wii menu it takes a very long time to load, just because of the extra space from those games, I could understand that if its a process when you first turn on your system, but to have a blackout time to turn on your console, do something short like the everybody votes channel then go back to the main menu and have that "blackout" is very annoying.

Honestly, my two biggest reasons for not buying more VC games are the overly-restrictive DRM, which you mentioned and the fact that the Wii doesn't really offer any easy or intuitive way to manage the VC games accumulating on our systems. Not only is the free space getting quickly smaller and smaller, but it's simply annoying to have to manage all the icons on the menu.

I'm sure all the Nintendo fans are going to tell me that it's not that difficult if you just do X and Y and Z, but as somebody who is obsessive about organization, I wish Nintendo would have allowed us to organize the games a bit better. Even a simple Wii Channel containing all the purchased VC games would be OK for now.

Now that I think about it, the games are a buck or two overpriced too... but that would be less an issue for me if I knew the downloads were linked to me and not my specific Wii system.

Maybe because most of the games being put on the VC are terrible beat em ups or crappy sports games? I'm pretty sure XBLA game sales took a dip when the only things being released were crappy puzzle games.

Geez... the overpriced argument again.

The most expensive VC game, of which there are barely any (N64 games) are $10 a piece. Most XBLA games are released at $10 a piece, and that's not even as expensive as they can get (a few top out at $15).

Yea, most XBLA games offer online play, but in my experience NOBODY plays these games online after a week or two of their release unless it is something insanely popular. I remember going on Cloning Clyde and no one was playing... not a single soul. I have to imagine games like Small Arms are equally dead, and a ton of other XBLA games I tried were also dead, like Gauntlet, Smash TV, and some others. So yea, the online part is a non factor in over half the games.

For me, when I had a 360, the replayability of many of the games was shit too. From what I can tell, it's turning around with better games, finally.

I'd gladly take a $5 Super Mario Bros or Punch Out over a $5 Gauntlet nobody plays online, or a $5 Robotron. Hell, I'd take Punch Out over the Millipede / Centipede combo too.

I'd also gladly take an $8 Link to the Past over a $10 Cloning Clyde or Boom Boom Rocket.

If anything, XBLA is vastly overpriced on 90% of its content, but 360 fans eat that shit up like crazy, and it gets a pass because it's "original" (the most popular things are the ports) and "online" (when the online community abandons it weeks after release). At least with the VC games I own, they are classics I can replay over and over again. I sure as hell never touched Cloning Clyde again when I was done with it though, and I wonder how many CAG's really kept going back to Alien Hominid once they finished it? I sure don't see it show up in many Gamertag sig's these days.

I also don't know any XBLA game that can come close to comparing to the length of many of the VC games, like Ocarina of Time, Super Mario 64, hell, even Link to the Past. SOTN is close, though. VC is awesome for those of us that don't want to bother with old systems and old games. I like being able to just turn on my Wii and start playing Punch Out, rather than deal with the hassle of the NES, I can't even get comfortable because of the wired controller (everything else I own is wireless, so my gaming set up is set up so I can sit back away from my television).

[quote name='Roufuss']Geez... the overpriced argument again.

The most expensive VC game, of which there are barely any (N64 games) are $10 a piece. Most XBLA games are released at $10 a piece, and that's not even as expensive as they can get (a few top out at $15).

Yea, most XBLA games offer online play, but in my experience NOBODY plays these games online after a week or two of their release unless it is something insanely popular. I remember going on Cloning Clyde and no one was playing... not a single soul. I have to imagine games like Small Arms are equally dead, and a ton of other XBLA games I tried were also dead, like Gauntlet, Smash TV, and some others. So yea, the online part is a non factor in over half the games.

For me, when I had a 360, the replayability of many of the games was shit too. From what I can tell, it's turning around with better games, finally.

I'd gladly take a $5 Super Mario Bros or Punch Out over a $5 Gauntlet nobody plays online, or a $5 Robotron. Hell, I'd take Punch Out over the Millipede / Centipede combo too.

I'd also gladly take an $8 Link to the Past over a $10 Cloning Clyde or Boom Boom Rocket.

If anything, XBLA is vastly overpriced on 90% of its content, but 360 fans eat that shit up like crazy, and it gets a pass because it's "original" (the most popular things are the ports) and "online" (when the online community abandons it weeks after release). At least with the VC games I own, they are classics I can replay over and over again. I sure as hell never touched Cloning Clyde again when I was done with it though, and I wonder how many CAG's really kept going back to Alien Hominid once they finished it? I sure don't see it show up in many Gamertag sig's these days.

I also don't know any XBLA game that can come close to comparing to the length of many of the VC games, like Ocarina of Time, Super Mario 64, hell, even Link to the Past. SOTN is close, though. VC is awesome for those of us that don't want to bother with old systems and old games. I like being able to just turn on my Wii and start playing Punch Out, rather than deal with the hassle of the NES, I can't even get comfortable because of the wired controller (everything else I own is wireless, so my gaming set up is set up so I can sit back away from my television).[/quote] I'm taking for granted that Cheapy's info was correct (he didn't cite a source on the CAGcast) and given that, what reason would you give for the slow down in the VC sales?

I don't think it's just about price, and I've delineated several other possibilities in my OP. In absolute terms we're talking about VC games being overpriced by a buck or two and that's not really enough to deter that many people. However, there must be some real reasons for the slowdown. Put aside for the moment the argument against why XBLA sucks (that's not really the point of this thread) and name some reasons you think a slowdown is occurring.

How about VC sales have slown down for the same reason that game sales have slown down since launch? Most people bought a game or two games at launch or close to it, and maybe have only bought the same amount since then. Same with VC games. People probably bought 2000 points close to launch and spent them within the first couple of weeks of owning their system, but without a compelling reason to buy more, they just haven't.


Also, how is there not a good way to backup your games? The DRM excuse doesn't hold any water. If something happens to your VC game you can just redownload the title for free.

What numbers are we actually talking about here? I know they've sold 3.3 million (total?) as of their investor meeting, but I'm not sure what or when the first numbers to compare these totals were.

Hmm, Punch-Out for $5?
Or Tekken 2 for $6 that I can play on my PS3 and PSP using the same game save?

[quote name='dallow']Hmm, Punch-Out for $5?
Or Tekken 2 for $6 that I can play on my PS3 and PSP using the same game save?[/quote]Punch-Out. (there's no saving in Punch-Out )

[quote name='botticus']Punch-Out. (there's no saving in Punch-Out )[/quote]

Haha, yeah yeah Botticus.
I know I'm not "supposed" to compare those prices.

I think another reason to factor in is the backlog.

I've purchased 7 or 8 VC games and I'm yet to finish any of them. There are still a few more I want to get (Mystical Ninja, Starfox, MK64, Kirby - to name the first four to pop into my head) but when I'm yet to touch LttP I just don't see the need to download these new games. Especially when I know that they'll always be available and that the prices won't be changing.

On top of that I'm still playing Paper Mario and I'm only about 90% through Zelda. Then there's the backlog of ps2 and DS games I have.

I think the biggest reason, at least for the majority of Wii owners ie. casual fans.

Is they bought a couple VC games at first to just try it, for the novelty of it.
The novelty is now gone.

[quote name='drfunk85']How about VC sales have slown down for the same reason that game sales have slown down since launch? Most people bought a game or two games at launch or close to it, and maybe have only bought the same amount since then. Same with VC games. People probably bought 2000 points close to launch and spent them within the first couple of weeks of owning their system, but without a compelling reason to buy more, they just haven't.


Also, how is there not a good way to backup your games? The DRM excuse doesn't hold any water. If something happens to your VC game you can just redownload the title for free.[/QUOTE]
Huh? You can't put it on a card and save it like you can with other media. I've learned, after years of experience, that you can't trust someone else to do your backups for you. Archiving your stuff is essential. What if my Wii breaks? Can't redownload it. (See the thread I linked for this discussion.)

So, you're saying that there are no good VC games to buy? But millions of Wiis have been sold recently. Surely not everyone's bought everything they wanted.

[quote name='torifile']Huh? You can't put it on a card and save it like you can with other media. I've learned, after years of experience, that you can't trust someone else to do your backups for you. Archiving your stuff is essential. What if my Wii breaks? Can't redownload it. (See the thread I linked for this discussion.)

So, you're saying that there are no good VC games to buy? But millions of Wiis have been sold recently. Surely not everyone's bought everything they wanted.[/QUOTE]

You can put them onto a card but you can't play them from the card. Hope that makes sense.

[quote name='natureboy46']You can put them onto a card but you can't play them from the card. Hope that makes sense.[/quote]
It makes sense, and then it doesn't make sense (for a different reason). It's so dumb.

[quote name='dallow']It makes sense, and then it doesn't make sense (for a different reason). It's so dumb.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, I agree. Hopefully that's something they can fix with an update. It seems like a no-brainer.

[quote name='natureboy46']You can put them onto a card but you can't play them from the card. Hope that makes sense.[/QUOTE]
You can neither play them from the card NOR can you transfer them to your Wii from the card. Essentially, they're just taking up space because they're COMPLETELY USELESS.

The whole story about the VC sales declining is just negative spin. If you compare the XBLA download numbers for the 360 over the same timeframe, the VC downloads blow them out of the water.

The fact is, even if the numbers have been dropping lately, the VC is still killing the competition by a landslide.

A lot of people, like my brother who bought the wii never really play it. There are still better games on ps2 and the ds right now. Lots of people still arent even online yet. The 3 people who I know that have Wiis aren't! I bought the genesis collection for 11 bucks on ps2. The wii channels are of extremely poor quality at the moment. Why does there photo channel have to be so crippled.
I am not going to buy a wii until they fix at least a few of there major flaws.
Mii characters are about the worst thing I could think of. I don't want to play baseball with pez holders.

If it is failing it's probably due to the ridiculous prices and the craptacular lineup.

Super Mario Bros for the NES is not worth a ing $5. Nintendo's pricing is insane (no other description for it). And if you are one of those non-cheap asses who loves to pay out the ass for games then keep that shit to yourself and find another board because you are delusional if you think that DRM ridden, not true to the original VC games are reasonably priced.

[quote name='Scrubking']
Super Mario Bros for the NES is not worth a ing $5. [/quote]

It is to me. I have a 360 and a Wii. That is it. If I wanted to play SMB, I would have to go buy a nintendo and SMB. That involves going through the hassle of finding one that works, finding the game, hooking up a new system, etc..

Cutting out that nonsense is WELL worth $5 to me.

Can someone come up with an idea to allow the download of VC games that doesn't restrict them as tightly as Nintendo does but does restrict users from downloading them from the Internet for free to play on their Wii?

[quote name='torifile']You can neither play them from the card NOR can you transfer them to your Wii from the card. Essentially, they're just taking up space because they're COMPLETELY USELESS.[/quote]

You can transfer them to your Wii if you're the one who d/led them. You just can't hand games off that you've d/ed to anyone else's Wii.

Where's the explanation of "Early adopters were the type of people who wanted the Wii half for the VC anyway, and now we're seeing the side effects of Trendy Motherer getting his or her suburbanite hands on it"?

EDIT: And for the record, I think the VC prices are totally fair. Not a 'deal', not a 'rip-off', but FAIR. All the arguments and points I'd bring up have been said already.

[quote name='Purple Flames']You can transfer them to your Wii if you're the one who d/led them. You just can't hand games off that you've d/ed to anyone else's Wii.[/quote] Umm. NO YOU CAN'T. I've tried. I had a Wii that I gave away to a family member. I had purchased LoZ:OoT and saved it on my SD card. Couldn't transfer it. I bought Donkey Kong, backed it up. Same deal.

Are you talking from experience or out your ass?

[quote name='UncleBob']Can someone come up with an idea to allow the download of VC games that doesn't restrict them as tightly as Nintendo does but does restrict users from downloading them from the Internet for free to play on their Wii?[/QUOTE]
That's such a simple problem, I don't know why it's even a question. We've got "mynintendo" accounts. We've got unique IDs in our Wiis. Match them up and only allow one Wii at a time to be authorized.

Just like we can only have one Wii linked to a "mynintendo" account. It's not rocket science.

[quote name='schuerm26']It is to me. I have a 360 and a Wii. That is it. If I wanted to play SMB, I would have to go buy a nintendo and SMB. That involves going through the hassle of finding one that works, finding the game, hooking up a new system, etc..

Cutting out that nonsense is WELL worth $5 to me.[/quote]

I'd much rather donate $2.00 to my favorite charity, google the game, and presto, play it on my PSP/Computer/PS3Linux/modXBOX.

I'd buy it for $2.00. Until then, charities get my money.

[quote name='torifile']Umm. NO YOU CAN'T. I've tried. I had a Wii that I gave away to a family member. I had purchased LoZ:OoT and saved it on my SD card. Couldn't transfer it. I bought Donkey Kong, backed it up. Same deal.

Are you talking from experience or out your ass?[/quote]

I just copied Bomberman '93 to my SD Card, deleted the game from my Wii, copied it back onto my Wii from the SD Card, and it worked just fine.

I still had my saved data and everything.

[quote name='Purple Flames']I just copied Bomberman '93 to my SD Card, deleted the game from my Wii, copied it back onto my Wii from the SD Card, and it worked just fine.

I still had my saved data and everything.[/quote] So, yes, you were talking out your ass.

You describe a different scenario. Copying them to a new Wii will yield the error "this game has cannot be copied because it has not been played on this Wii before" or something like that. I can check the exact wording later. Bear in mind that mynintendo account downloaded the VC game and it was linked to my new Wii.

[quote name='torifile']So, yes, you were talking out your ass.

You describe a different scenario. Copying them to a new Wii will yield the error "this game has cannot be copied because it has not been played on this Wii before" or something like that.[/quote]

Well yeah, because it's been stated plenty of times before that you can't do that because you can only play games on the Wii that you downloaded it from originally unless you contact Nintendo and let them know about the situation, and they can transfer your account to your new Wii.

You never mentioned beforehand that you had a new Wii.

[quote name='dallow']I'd much rather donate $2.00 to my favorite charity, google the game, and presto, play it on my PSP/Computer/PS3Linux/modXBOX.

I'd buy it for $2.00. Until then, charities get my money.[/QUOTE]

So why not just pirate all your games then?

I mean really, if it's ok to grab some old games for free that aren't yours to begin with, go ahead and just grab some PS2 and Xbox iso's and fire those up too, and donate that money to charity.

I'd really like to hear the justification for this one, especially since you threw in the charity bit (like you *really* donate to a charity, and that this somehow makes stealing ok?).

I tell you what, instead of spending money on new PS2 games, I'll just download the iso's for Odin Sphere and Persona 3 and donate that money to charity instead, because apparently that makes it ok. I mean, hell, if VC games are too expensive, those $40 PS2 games must be killer!

I mean, yea, we've all played rom's before, but trying to justify it by pretending to donate the money to charity like it somehow makes your actions ok, well, that's kind of ed up.

Sometimes I wonder why you still have a Wii since all your posts just shit all over it.

I don't like to pirate new material, anything over 10 years I can deal with and justify to myself.

I download music, but I always buy the CD.
I've downloaded some roms, yes, but never disc images or things like that.
(well, except for unreleased beta games, etc)


Sorry I'm not a monster.

I donate a lot of my money to charity, I don't actually go and say, hmm, screw the VC, I'm going to get this ROM, and donate 2 bucks instead.
I donate 10% of my income every month, regularly.

I actually don't need to download the SMB rom, I did that 8 or so years ago.


EDIT:
I should add that it is kinda nice to download from the VC channel. I have for N64 games.
So I do want to support it.

Why do I have a Wii? For Nintendo games. It also allowed me to store away my GC.

[quote name='dallow']dI don't like to pirate new material, anything over 10 years I can deal with and justify to myself.


[/QUOTE]


Sorry, I just don't get this.

[quote name='SMMM']Sorry, I just don't get this.[/quote]
I don't feel bad about downloaded roms of ancient cart systems.
I had my fun with them as a kid. I don't want to take them out of storage.

My friend sent me a couple of burned DVDs full of PSP images. Almost every PSP game to date.
Now my PSP is capable of playing them, but I threw the discs away.
I still look for deals here on CAG to get the ones I want on clearance.
All you have is my word though.

I only buy deep or multiplayer VC games. There have been no good, deep games or multiplayer games released recently. I hope others have discretion when buying games as well, or else everyone is going to end up with the attitudes listed in the OP.

They are not all equal to one another, so why are VC sales even measured like this? If they release Shockman one day and Mario Kart 64 another, those sales ratios are going to be drastically different. It is stupid to look at a decline in VC sales as a result of some larger problem like a dislike for points, how the 'novelty' of owning a game has worn off (what the does that even mean?), or that they are suddenly too expensive. Old games are still good and are still worth $10 and under, the only thing that is slowing sales is the sporatic release of games that warrant a purchase.

Even though some of the older games are still fun, Xbox360 has spoiled me. I mean as LAME as Frogger is, achievements really do (for me) make old games just a bit better and gives more incentive on playing.

Think of some of these old games. I don't care to play through OoT again. However, if Nintendo had some sort of achievement system, I would most likely do so. Star Fox 64 with achievements? Awesome! A lot of these games would just be cooler and would be worth it, IMO

Also, the fact that they take some old arcade games, revamp them up and add some sort of multiplayer online just makes it worth it!

But that's just my 2 cents.

I really don't care about the achievements on Live, or the upcoming Trophies/Milestones on PS3.

But getting something for beating these VC games actually would be really nice, and special.
Something a ROM wouldn't give me the satisfaction of.

[quote name='dallow']I really don't care about the achievements on Live, or the upcoming Trophies/Milestones on PS3.

But getting something for beating these VC games actually would be really nice, and special.
Something a ROM wouldn't give me the satisfaction of.[/QUOTE]


That's what I mean! Having SOME sort of incentive would be nice. Of course some of these games are great as they are..but to me, I need a little bit more reasoning to actually play through the entire game again.

Even if they did a Trophy thing like PS3 is doing! It doesn't even have to be something everyone can access! I would think it was pretty cool to have a trophy room on the Wii and show all your accomplishments and what not. But whatever =(

[quote name='Purple Flames']Well yeah, because it's been stated plenty of times before that you can't do that because you can only play games on the Wii that you downloaded it from originally
[/quote]
Really? Where is that? Not on Nintendo's site, that's for sure.

unless you contact Nintendo and let them know about the situation, and they can transfer your account to your new Wii.

Click to expand...

Wrong wrong wrong. I've contacted Nintendo about it and they say it's NOT POSSIBLE. Are you just making stuff up as you go along? The point is I want to be able to play my games on whatever machine I own. I'm not asking a whole lot. Apple's got it right with their system. I'm not even asking that much; just one machine of my choosing.

How about this for N's response to my query:
[quote name='Nintendo rep']

Normally, our website is equipped to address many of the issues our fans might encounter with our products. However, in this case it would be more effective to speak with you directly. At your earliest convenience, please contact Nintendo's Consumer Service Department by calling 1-800-255-3700. Representatives are available to speak to you between 6:00 a.m. and 7:00 p.m. Pacific Time, seven days a week.

When calling, you may bypass the recorded information by pressing "0" on your touch-tone phone. This will connect you to the next available representative.
[/quote]
During this call, they told me it's just not possible.

Getting back to the point of this thread - it's the primary reason I haven't bought VC games since the beginning (LoZ:OoT excepting because I was given some Wii points).

[quote name='torifile']That's such a simple problem, I don't know why it's even a question. We've got "mynintendo" accounts. We've got unique IDs in our Wiis. Match them up and only allow one Wii at a time to be authorized.

Just like we can only have one Wii linked to a "mynintendo" account. It's not rocket science.[/QUOTE]

So... Let's see. From this, I could download games to my Wii that would be linked to my MyNintendo account. Then, unlink my Wii from my MyNintendo account and link my friend's Wii to my MyNintendo account. Then, once the games are loaded onto his system (either by re-downloading them or copying them on an SD card), re-link my Wii to my MyNintendo.

Now, if you mean only having one Wii "authorized" to run the games at a time, how do you suggest that Nintendo keep track of that (without causing crazy headaches for those who aren't as savy as some of us are).

Let's say I'm visiting your house that's two hours away. Now, I don't have DSL at my home, so my Wii isn't always connected and I can't download games at home. But while I'm at your house, I download some games. Then, we go to another friend's house and while we're there, we link my MyNintendo to your Wii (that we bought with us) so we can play my downloaded games. Then, for whatever reason, we forget to relink my MyNintendo to my Wii and I get home with it. Now, I can't relink my Wii (because it's not connected) and I can't play my games.

Additionally, how hard would it be to use your PC to trick the Wii into connecting to what it thinks is "Nintendo's servers" and getting the "okay" to play games from your friend's Wii? I mean, that's pretty similar to the workaround that people used to browse the web on Wii before. Seems like it'd be pretty easy to monitor the data that your internet connection sends to the Wii, see what address it connects to and what data it sends to the Wii and then tell your computer that if the MAC address of your Wii ever tries to connect to the DNS address of Nintendo's Servers, then connect it to this other DNS that sends it fake info.

Also, not every Wii user has a MyNintendo account. I assume with your method, every user would be required to give their personal info to Nintendo (over the internet) in order download Wii games, right?

[quote name='UncleBob']So... Let's see. From this, I could download games to my Wii that would be linked to my MyNintendo account. Then, unlink my Wii from my MyNintendo account and link my friend's Wii to my MyNintendo account. Then, once the games are loaded onto his system (either by re-downloading them or copying them on an SD card), re-link my Wii to my MyNintendo.
[/quote] Nope. You can't relink your Wii to your account while another is linked.

Now, if you mean only having one Wii "authorized" to run the games at a time, how do you suggest that Nintendo keep track of that (without causing crazy headaches for those who aren't as savy as some of us are).

Click to expand...

Really simple. They just keep track of whether a Wii is linked or not. It's not that hard.

Let's say I'm visiting your house that's two hours away. Now, I don't have DSL at my home, so my Wii isn't always connected and I can't download games at home. But while I'm at your house, I download some games. Then, we go to another friend's house and while we're there, we link my MyNintendo to your Wii (that we bought with us) so we can play my downloaded games. Then, for whatever reason, we forget to relink my MyNintendo to my Wii and I get home with it. Now, I can't relink my Wii (because it's not connected) and I can't play my games.

Click to expand...

You lost me. You unlinked your Wii so you could play on my Wii? If you can't connect to link, you're out of luck. It sucks but not being able to connect for long enough to make a quick transaction like that is much less likely a scenario than what we're faced with now. Further, the failing in my suggested scenario is on the user's end and not on Nintendo's. If it's your own "fault" that you can't play, then it's your fault. As it is now, you've got no control over your purchases.

Additionally, how hard would it be to use your PC to trick the Wii into connecting to what it thinks is "Nintendo's servers" and getting the "okay" to play games from your friend's Wii? I mean, that's pretty similar to the workaround that people used to browse the web on Wii before. Seems like it'd be pretty easy to monitor the data that your internet connection sends to the Wii, see what address it connects to and what data it sends to the Wii and then tell your computer that if the MAC address of your Wii ever tries to connect to the DNS address of Nintendo's Servers, then connect it to this other DNS that sends it fake info.

Click to expand...

That's why they'd use encrypted keys. Your Wii would get a key that's unique so it couldn't be faked. You were talking about "crazy headaches for those who aren't as savy (sic) as some of us are", right? Someone who could execute the workaround you're referring to is unsavvy.

Also, not every Wii user has a MyNintendo account. I assume with your method, every user would be required to give their personal info to Nintendo (over the internet) in order download Wii games, right?

Click to expand...

Not necessarily. Using Apple's model, all you'd need is an email address. You don't have to give any personal info if you don't want to.

[quote name='torifile']Nope. You can't relink your Wii to your account while another is linked.[/QUOTE]
I meant to imply that you were unlinking the second Wii before re-linking the first.

[quote name='torifile']If you can't connect to link, you're out of luck. If it's your own "fault" that you can't play, then it's your fault.[/QUOTE]
With the current system, it's no one's "fault", that's just how the rules of the game are. You download a game on one Wii and it is tied to that Wii. With your system, it leaves room for error and blame and, quite frankly, is a Nintendo rep supposed to tell a customer "Well, it's you're fault you've screwed up. Sorry."

[quote name='torifile']That's why they'd use encrypted keys.[/QUOTE]
Because, you know, no one ever breaks encryption. Ever.

[quote name='torifile']You were talking about "crazy headaches for those who aren't as savy (sic) as some of us are", right? Someone who could execute the workaround you're referring to is unsavvy.[/QUOTE]
See, here's the thing though... The system has to be made simple enough so that the unsavvy folk don't get confused or have a hard time with it while the savvy folks can't easily work around it. My theoretical work-around to your theoretical idea is a pretty easy one to individuals with slightly above average computer skills (once any encryption is broken). In fact, once the encryption is broken, someone with enough skills could easily make a PC program that just requires a download of the program and the "ROM" and a few clicks.

And that's why DRM is dumb. It's a burden on someone, somewhere. You prefer games tied to the Wii, I prefer them tied to an account. It's 6 of one, half dozen of the other, really. I consider my account to be more "me" than the console, but that's because I move through my gadgets quickly. Others may not care as much.

[quote name='torifile']And that's why DRM is dumb. It's a burden on someone, somewhere. You prefer games tied to the Wii, I prefer them tied to an account. It's 6 of one, half dozen of the other, really. I consider my account to be more "me" than the console, but that's because I move through my gadgets quickly. Others may not care as much.[/QUOTE]

I wouldn't say that I "prefer" my games tied to anything. In fact, I'd perfer my games not tied to anything at all (which is why I still have my NES/SNES/N64 hooked up).

But, the fact is, there's not really much of a way that Nintendo can make a system that's easy to use for the large majority of the users while at the same time hard to use in ways that do harm to Nintendo. Hell, even with the system now in place, I bet you'll see a way to download and play illegal copies of VC Games before the Wii's End of Life. It'll be hard to do, but it'll be figured out.

Just keep this in mind. When someone talks about illegally downloading copyrighted materials and they're all "Oh, it doesn't hurt anyone." and "They've got lots of money anyway." - they're talking out their ass. Illegal downloading causes companies to come up with crazy and elaborate methods so that they can try to protect their rights as long as possible. If people wouldn't violate the rights of others for their own greed, then perhaps all this crazy DRM stuff that gets in the way of the legally operating individuals wouldn't have to be around.

Those who purchase/download legally get screwed. The owners of the material get screwed. The only ones who come out ahead are those who break the law and steal from others. Wow. That's fair.

I just skimmed the thread, but thought I read something to the effect of if your Wii breaks you're SOL on your VC games. I can assure you that's not true. You have to send it in to Nintendo and they reauthorize your replacemnt system to redownload the titles that you had previously purchased (and get any remainder points onto that system).

It would be nice to have an account-tied method, but sadly that's not the case. The 360 has a weird inbetween method where it's kinda tied to both. If you have to get a new harddrive for the 360, you have to be connected to the internet to play the full versions of your arcade games.