The Last Remnant - Gen. Discussion & Info

AlexKidd

CAG Veteran
Been a long running fan of Square RPG's and am pretty anxious about The Last Remnant coming out on the 20th. The appearance (as always with Square) looks amazing and for being a turn based system the battles seem like they get pretty intense. Just curious if anyone else is excited or even interested in this one?
 
I thought this looked cool when the first screenshots were released, but the more that gets revealed about the game, the less attractive it looks. The graphics seem kind of plain and the only interesting thing about the character designs is how many of them seem blatantly lifted from other games (Basch from FF12, Frog from Chrono Trigger, etc.). And from what I've read of the battle system, it sounds like a hands-off mix of a traditional turn-based system with an RTS squad-based kind of thing. And then that whole thing about sending the mole guy out on missions to dig up treasure? I have the sense that the developers are trying to combine a lot of disparate ideas but I don't know how coherent the overall package is going to be.

My guess is that this game will turn out similar to Infinite Undiscovery-- fair to middling reviews, some fun to be had for dedicated genre fans, but not particularly outstanding or memorable.
 
I thought it looked good initially as well...but lately seeing some vids and reading about the characters/graphics, as well as the story, I won't be buying it for a very long time. I feel like I've played my share of RPGs lately, and this story seems like a combination of the two RPGs I've beaten most recently...
This is one game that even if it got 9's I wouldn't buy it for quite awhile...
 
I want to like this, mostly because I'm an old school Squaresoft sucker. But, something tells me I'm not going to like the battle system. I really truly am an old school JRPG guy. I don't need anything fancy when it comes to battle systems. The graphics look amazing. $40 at Amazon is tempting. But, I'll wait a while and see what kind of buzz this gets on CAG.
 
[quote name='Amelyssan']It's only a day or so early, but my local Wal-Mart is selling The Last Remnant. There was no little orange sticker with a "Do not sale before date" on the game and the clerk just rung it up.


The game is indeed two discs. If anyone else wants to try to grab a copy, it's the Wal-Mart in Oak Grove, KY. (The pre-order code is from GS.)

http://i38.tinypic.com/25rldf8.jpg

http://i38.tinypic.com/2qk7960.jpg

http://i34.tinypic.com/oohux.jpg

[/quote]

Thanks OP but I'll take my $40 Amazon copy over a $60 WM copy any day of the week. :)
 
[quote name='Amelyssan']It's only a day or so early, but my local Wal-Mart is selling The Last Remnant. There was no little orange sticker with a "Do not sale before date" on the game and the clerk just rung it up.


The game is indeed two discs. If anyone else wants to try to grab a copy, it's the Wal-Mart in Oak Grove, KY. (The pre-order code is from GS.)

http://i38.tinypic.com/25rldf8.jpg

http://i38.tinypic.com/2qk7960.jpg

http://i34.tinypic.com/oohux.jpg

[/quote]

Have you tried the game yet? What do you think?

I know I am very excited about picking it up tomorrow. :bouncy:
 
Previews

Square vets look west for their next big RPG.
By Jeremy Parish 11/17/2008

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I wasn't sure what to expect when Square Enix invited me and Game Developer magazine's Christian Nutt to have dinner with the creators of The Last Remnant. Mainly awkwardness, I suppose. It's difficult to have a casual, relaxed conversation with Japanese developers, which is more a matter of cultural barriers than language; Japanese devs tend to be guarded around the press, and Square Enix's creators doubly so. Much to my surprise, though, the men behind Remnant were open and relaxed. Surprisingly, they didn't come to hype their game but rather to engage in a frank, informal discussion about the differences in tastes between the American and Japanese markets. Ironically, though we barely talked about Remnant, by the end of the night I found myself more and more intrigued by -- and excited for -- Square's next major title. And make no mistake, this is a Square title. Even after the better part of a decade, Square Enix is very much two companies, and Remnant has all of the hallmarks of its Square half. It's internally developed, for one; while all Enix properties are created by outside collaborators like tri-Ace and Level 5, this is a strictly in-house project. In fact, at launch it will be Square Enix's first internally made title for the current console generation. It's also Square's first new in-house IP since 2001's The Bouncer. And it's the work of an impressive number of company veterans led by Hiroshi Takai, whose résumé includes a number of SaGa, Mana, and Final Fantasy titles stretching back to his work on Final Fantasy V's exceptional combat system.

SCREENS: Click the image above to check out all The Last Remnant screens.

Much of Remnant's staff previously worked on Romancing SaGa and Final Fantasy XII, and it shows through in their work. "We've avoided comparisons to SaGa and FFXII, because this is something completely different," Takai demurs. "We'd like to avoid preconceptions." Later, however, he did admit that he feels Remnant brings together the best aspects of SaGa and FFXII while adding new concepts and refinements. A paternity test would definitely prove the game's Final Fantasy heritage: Remnant's large-scale battle system runs on what art director Yusuke Naora calls "Gambit 1.5," an evolution of FFXII's Gambit system, which allowed for intelligent, automated A.I. control of nonplayer party members. "Players can't actually edit their party A.I.," says Naora, "but during the development process, the team worked with Gambits" -- the tool to define the rules by which the player's party would behave in the finished game.
While many RPG fans may initially find the lack of direct control over their party off-putting, the transparency of Remnant's use of Gambits makes sense. In FFXII, the player controlled a party of three characters drawn from a pool of six; here, the active "party" consists of as many as five Unions, which are groups of five warriors working in unison. Battles can involve as many as 50 combatants. Rather than force players to issue commands at the individual level and transform the game into a toilsome exercise in tactical micromanagement, Remnant zooms back from the macro view and becomes more about overall battlefield dynamics. Each Union's treated as a character might be in another RPG, with individual units within each Union acting according to their predetermined Gambits.
In practice, combat isn't so cut-and-dried as that, though. A character's action in any given round will depend on their skill level, learned abilities, the status of their comrades, the positioning of the character's Union relative to enemy Unions, and the team's overall morale in the current battle. In other words, A.I.-determined actions are highly context-driven. A character with wounded allies is likely to use healing skills -- unless, perhaps, his Union has the drop on an enemy formation and can safely finish off their opponents in that round. In that case, they might go all-out to mop up the rabble instead. Victory in combat seems to be less about the specifics (which are handled intelligently by preset Gambits) and more about general combat strategies, understanding the capabilities of each Union, positioning your team advantageously against the enemy, and knowing your foes' potential abilities. Because the combat system is entirely turn-based and features an extremely detailed interface, players can cycle through possible tactics to choose the most advantageous set of commands available to their Unions; they'll never be forced to guess what their party will do.

SCREENS: Click the image above to check out all The Last Remnant screens.

This is where the SaGa connection comes into play, although abstractly; it's a link that's difficult to express or define in concrete terms. Still, something about Remnant is powerfully reminiscent of the SaGa games, even though the game mechanics are radically different. The character-building system is a part of that. As in the SaGa titles (and Final Fantasy II before them), character stats improve according to skill use, so that characters whose Unions act defensively will be rewarded with added endurance while characters whose Unions focus on special attacks will become more adept with the corresponding abilities. But there's a more nebulous connection as well in the general feel of the game. Early reviews from Japan paint a picture of an RPG with a heavy emphasis on combat, and by all appearances Remnant's battle mechanics are unique and idiosyncratic -- unapologetically so. Maybe that's the SaGa spirit bleeding through: both feature large, seemingly chaotic battles where your characters initially seem to behave with their own minds until, suddenly, everything clicks for you and falls into place.



Still, it's clear that Takai and his team have worked to make Remnant much less of a niche-oriented RPG than the SaGa games. "The problem with SaGa is that it has very passionate fans, but it can't break out beyond them," he laments. "If people see the SaGa connection as a good thing, that's great, but we want to make it clear that this game is much more refined and accessible."
Accessibility seems to be much on the team's mind; most of our conversation over dinner centered on the subject -- and more specifically, how to make a game like Remnant accessible and appealing to Americans. Japanese developers are mindful of the fact that their side of the industry has "lost its edge," to put it in the terms that Square Enix president Yoichi Wada himself used recently, and Remnant has been designed from the ground up as an RPG targeted just as much toward Western gamers as our Japanese peers. "We did a lot of research into Western tastes, things that Americans want from their games," Naora says. Our meeting was ultimately another step in that process, a chance for the team to field more input about what works here and what doesn't.

SCREENS: Click the image above to check out all The Last Remnant screens.

The tremendous success of Fallout 3 seems to have made a particularly profound impact on Naora. "When we make a game that sells two million copies, that's always seemed like a tremendous success for us," he says. "But now we hear about Fallout 3 selling four million in just a few weeks, and it really surprises us. This is a game that doesn't even look like what we in Japan consider an 'RPG,' yet it's incredibly popular."
"Until about a year ago, we'd never even heard the term 'J-RPG' to distinguish our RPGs from Western games," he admits. Now he seems determined to sort out the defining differences between the two schools of RPG design. Does it mean stronger female characters? A first-person perspective? More realism?
And that's why Remnant is so intriguing. It's one thing for Japanese developers to pay lip service to appealing to Western audiences, but it's something else entirely to make a sincere effort. Naora and Takai appear genuinely interested in pushing their games beyond the limitations of language and culture, and their team is largely comprised of veterans from some of Square's most unconventional and Western-oriented titles. The SaGa titles have always hewed more closely to the structure of 8-bit PC RPGs than any other Japanese franchise; the much-reviled Unlimited Saga attempted to delve even further into the genre's roots by adopting the style and conventions of a pen-and-paper RPG. Meanwhile, FFXII boldly combined the narrative and character conventions of its series with the trappings and openness of Western MMOs. Hopefully, Remnant's creators will continue to explore the works of developers like BioWare and Bethesda to discover what makes those games tick and incorporate their findings into their own projects -- ideally without compromising the fundamental flavor that their Japanese perspective provides.
Balancing the need to appeal to both American and Japanese audiences is a demanding, difficult task that eludes most developers. Fortunately, Remnant seems like a vital step in the right direction.
 
I don't see any specifics in that article about what makes this JRPG more "Western-influenced" or "Western-focused" than any other JRPG. Does anyone know?
 
[quote name='Ryuukishi']I don't see any specifics in that article about what makes this JRPG more "Western-influenced" or "Western-focused" than any other JRPG. Does anyone know?[/QUOTE]

I get what you're saying. Last Remnant definitely doesn't look anymore western influenced than the average JRPG, at least from the previews I have seen. though it looks to have an interesting Battle system.
 
WHAT THE HELL?

AMAZON NOW SHIPPING 25st!?!?!?!?!

Screw you amazon. Seriously.

Im tempted to sell my pre order of the 39.96 and just pick up a copy at best buy tomorrow.. @_@
 
[quote name='Ice2Dragon']WHAT THE HELL?

AMAZON NOW SHIPPING 25st!?!?!?!?!

Screw you amazon. Seriously.

Im tempted to sell my pre order of the 39.96 and just pick up a copy at best buy tomorrow.. @_@[/quote]


Amazon says: Shipping: Usually ships within 3 - 5 weeks.

Also, changing shipping changes your place in the shipping order, which is initially based off when you order. So you essentially screwwed yourself a bit there. It's stupid I know, but they don't seem intent on changing it.
 
[quote name='Ice2Dragon']has anyone's order shipped? I changed one day shipping and it still says "expected day 25th to be delivered"...[/quote]

Same here, I have the free 2-Day shipping and it says "November 25th."
 
[quote name='Draekon']Amazon says: Shipping: Usually ships within 3 - 5 weeks.

Also, changing shipping changes your place in the shipping order, which is initially based off when you order. So you essentially screwwed yourself a bit there. It's stupid I know, but they don't seem intent on changing it.[/quote]

I didnt save it, i just tried it to see estimation and it was still the same.

Whats with this "3 to 5" weeks crap? Its been in stores since monday lol :(
 
[quote name='Ice2Dragon']Whats with this "3 to 5" weeks crap? Its been in stores since monday lol :([/quote]

Yeah, Amazons game section pretty much sucks on shipping. Oh well, I'll take $20 off and a week late than none at all or waiting two months after the game releases to reach that price or possibly lower.
 
[quote name='Draekon']Yeah, Amazons game section pretty much sucks on shipping. Oh well, I'll take $20 off and a week late than none at all or waiting two months after the game releases to reach that price or possibly lower.[/quote]

Yeah I agree, but I really want to play this.. im bored with left 4 dead (36/50 ach's already...)and have nothing else to really play @_@
 
[quote name='Draekon']Yeah, Amazons game section pretty much sucks on shipping. Oh well, I'll take $20 off and a week late than none at all or waiting two months after the game releases to reach that price or possibly lower.[/quote]

I got Left 4 Dead the day it came out.. with 2 Day Free Shipping.. so up until now I never had a problem with it.
 
Every time I've preordered a video game on Amazon with Super Saver shipping, it's taken about a week from the release date to actually ship out. For the price though, I'm not complaining.

It does seem to be unique to video games though. I preorder a lot of CDs too, and those generally ship out a few days before the release date, even with Super Saver.
 
Anyone remember what the pre order bonus was with amazon? I wanna say some in game items and a poster possibly? I dont see any info on the site and I forget now.
 
[quote name='GeorgeCostanza']Anyone remember what the pre order bonus was with amazon? I wanna say some in game items and a poster possibly? I dont see any info on the site and I forget now.[/quote]

three codes for "winning formations"

free poster is at gamestop and target I think.
 
Reviews are starting to trickle in on Metacritic. Looks like Famitsu is the only outfit that has really liked the game so far.
 
[quote name='Ryuukishi']Reviews are starting to trickle in on Metacritic. Looks like Famitsu is the only outfit that has really liked the game so far.[/quote]

Only 3 reviews I see up are from XBox Mag, Game Informer, and Game Pro... and they're all bad... I never use any of those three for reviews regardless.
 
[quote name='cmart05']Only 3 reviews I see up are from XBox Mag, Game Informer, and Game Pro... and they're all bad... I never use any of those three for reviews regardless.[/QUOTE]

But its generally because they give bad games good reviews, not the other way around. I have this coming from amazon, but I'm starting to get worried.
 
I'm looking forward to 1UP's review, they seem to know what's up when it comes to JRPGs usually. Lately I feel like their reviews are getting shorter though, more quick overview than detailed criticism.
 
[quote name='Ryuukishi']I'm looking forward to 1UP's review, they seem to know what's up when it comes to JRPGs usually. Lately I feel like their reviews are getting shorter though, more quick overview than detailed criticism.[/quote]

That's because the internet community as a whole has ADD really bad. Alot of reader email to all websites states that articles are too long. That's why 1Up has almost entirely gone to crappy top ten lists and super short reviews. Chris Fowler on ESPN said as much on his weekly college football article.
 
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I saw the poster yesterday at GameStop. It's pretty ugly.

Has no one picked it up? Most reviews I've found so far have been average.
 
[quote name='cmart05']I cancelled my order from Amazon... not worth the wait apparently.[/quote]

After all that, you cancelled your pre-order....
 
But you were the one hyping this game up like it was the Second Coming. You couldn't stop going on about Famitsu and all that. Does that review mean nothing now?
 
[quote name='depascal22']But you were the one hyping this game up like it was the Second Coming. You couldn't stop going on about Famitsu and all that. Does that review mean nothing now?[/quote]

You've obviously got the wrong person...

I posted a 1UP Article, that is all.
 
[quote name='depascal22']You didn't say that you'll settle for mediocrity? Or you didn't say that at $20 off this is a must-buy?[/quote]

Don't feed them depascal.

troll.jpg
 
Went and bought it at Best Buy. Shiny case + Free poster is a no win over some crap ass downloadable codes.

Installing to the HDD, ill post some impressions later.
 
Alright, after about 4 hours of playing.

the game has a very steep learning curve.. once you learn it you're golden. it takes a bit getting used to of doing the customization of items and battle techniques as well as forming different parties.

Story is good, graphics are good, load times are NIL when you do the hard drive save... its roughly 7gb.
 
Crap I forgot to cancel my Amazon order! At least it's only $40. But then, Lost Odyssey's like ~20 and I've not got around to picking that up yet.
 
More impressions, please!

Even though I have no idea when I'd be able to get to this one. I still have Gears 2 and Fallout 3 waiting for me.
 
So ive played for about 15 hours.

Theres no actual "level" for characters.. its just a battle rank.. everytime it increases by winning battles/encountering enemies you get HP + or strength +.. you get new abilities by using combat arts/mystic/healing.

The game has a HUGE difficulty leap.. the first few bosses are hella easy and can be beaten in no more than 2 rounds, but theres one against a titan where you fight him along with two birds that can cast curse.

Doesnt sound bad, but its the stupidest boss ever. Curse can instantly kill you, if it doesnt, it stops you completely from attacking. Its all about luck.

THe game also limits how many leaders you can use, and since you have at least 7 at the start, you can also use four including Rush. Kinda dumb.

It also forces you to use 3 unions for the boss fights, since otherwise you get flanked repeatedly and your morale drops to zero.

Morale is a great idea, but it blows. Even with full morale the enemy still dodged a decent portion of attacks or got criticals against me.

Bosses also cant be flanked, instead they get "multi deadlocked".

Which is complete bullsheot.

Everytime you attack with a union, it means the boss ALSO GETS AN ATTACK. The bosses have INSANE ATTACKS, most have one that hits the entire party at once. It makes you wonder why thats fair, since some bosses get an additional attack on top of that one they got versus your union.

It takes getting used too.. im roughly 15 hours into it and level 30 or so battle rank.

Its fun, but this game takes A LOT of getting used too..
 
[quote name='Ice2Dragon']So ive played for about 15 hours.

Theres no actual "level" for characters.. its just a battle rank.. everytime it increases by winning battles/encountering enemies you get HP + or strength +.. you get new abilities by using combat arts/mystic/healing.

The game has a HUGE difficulty leap.. the first few bosses are hella easy and can be beaten in no more than 2 rounds, but theres one against a titan where you fight him along with two birds that can cast curse.

Doesnt sound bad, but its the stupidest boss ever. Curse can instantly kill you, if it doesnt, it stops you completely from attacking. Its all about luck.

THe game also limits how many leaders you can use, and since you have at least 7 at the start, you can also use four including Rush. Kinda dumb.

It also forces you to use 3 unions for the boss fights, since otherwise you get flanked repeatedly and your morale drops to zero.[/quote]


Ah you are talking about the optional sidequest for the female general, I forgot her name, yeah that quest is Very tough, Im currently leveling for it as we speak, and while on the subject of hard battles you Really want to avoid regular mobs called Imp's, they look like werewolves, but I probably dont have to tell you that.:applause:
 
I haven't really been paying any attention to this game. what's the whole gameplay system like, and what is the story about?
 
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