Limited Run Games Thread - Nothing is Limited, We Make Everything Now!

Squarehard

Squarehard

CAGiversary!
Feedback
182 (100%)
Please move all off-topic and non-game related discussion (such as reselling, or he who shall not be named) to the other thread below,

LRG Off-Topic Discussion Thread

---------------------------------------------------------

LRG is on Amazon now!

LRG Trading Thread - Miss a release? Trade with someone who might need a release you have.


Limited Run Games Store Fronthttps://limitedrungames.com/videogamedeals

Limited Run Games at Best Buyhttps://shop-links.co/chgcByJn9wg

Holiday 2022 LRG Releases at Best Buyhttps://cag.vg/lrg

Props to Cheapy for keeping the OP updated. :3
 
Last edited:
Upvote 3 Downvote
bradbo said:
I realize my preferences aren't everyone else's but can we not agree that demand for the releases seems to be waning?
Click to expand...
Honestly, I've seen no real difference actually. They have always had releases that sale out in minutes, and they've had some that last days(up to 4 close to 5 I believe).

Also, their runs have been larger than some of the earlier ones as well, so I would personally say nothing has changed. And if it has, I would say there is more interest, and not less. As the qty's are bigger, and you still have situations that mimic early releases, that had less qty.

 
I don't think LRG hype is dying down at all, heck they just doubled their price on a game (Darius) and sold out in minutes. However, LRG definitely has a successful business model and are making money, so other companies are jumping in and there's more competition. Now you have someone like PLAY ASIA offering a better dollar value (not talking about the game quality) but for 30 dollars you get the GAME, and a SOUNDTRACK, and a large attractive outer box. So to counter this competition, I would assume LRG course of action, and not cut into their profit margin, would be to leverage their bigger name (in admittedly a niche market) and go after larger games like Oddworld etc. As a consumer, I'm happy there is competition cause it befits us and I hope success for everyone involved in bringing digital games to physical release. The more exposure all these companies get, the better for everyone involved. 

 
Who cares how fast the games sell? The ONLY ones that should are LRG. Sometimes gamers need to be told to stop playing armchair quarterback. Common sense says certain titles will sell out faster then others.
 
bradbo said:
This is definitely how I feel. Instead it seems like printing 4000 copies of 30k games is the plan. I'd like to see less releases with more quality. I realize my preferences aren't everyone else's but can we not agree that demand for the releases seems to be waning?
Click to expand...
It's not, though, on a pure traffic basis we're getting more visitors than ever. It's weird that you simultaenously want us to print crazy amounts of stuff but then also feel like demand has waned if something doesn't sell out in five seconds. Those two things run counter to each other. Selling out in a day or a weekend does not signal waning interest, it means we might actually be hitting demand for some of these titles, which is a good thing.

For reference on DARIUSBURST, the publisher suggested 1,000 limited editions and 1,000 standard editions. I had to talk them into where we ended up. People seem to think we just arbitrarily decide these things. Our partners are the first people to set the run size, we provide feedback on what they choose but at the end of the day it is up to them. If the game could've truly sold 30K copies (it couldn't have without wider distribution and steep discounts) - the publisher would have suggested that based on whatever data they had - they suggested 2,000. We upped that by nearly 150%.
 
My perception seems to be off. I also did not ask for more prints... not sure how that got interpreted in that light. However, being a business that exists solely because there is a secondary market and "collectors", from what I'm reading in various forums and seeing on sites like eBay (a deluge of LRG titles going for retail) it seems that producing the right games is the healthy business decision.

As I've said it's just my opinion. Possibly wrong. But it's out there.
 
Doomstink said:
It's not, though, on a pure traffic basis we're getting more visitors than ever. It's weird that you simultaenously want us to print crazy amounts of stuff but then also feel like demand has waned if something doesn't sell out in five seconds. Those two things run counter to each other. Selling out in a day or a weekend does not signal waning interest, it means we might actually be hitting demand for some of these titles, which is a good thing.

For reference on DARIUSBURST, the publisher suggested 1,000 limited editions and 1,000 standard editions. I had to talk them into where we ended up. People seem to think we just arbitrarily decide these things. Our partners are the first people to set the run size, we provide feedback on what they choose but at the end of the day it is up to them. If the game could've truly sold 30K copies (it couldn't have without wider distribution and steep discounts) - the publisher would have suggested that based on whatever data they had - they suggested 2,000. We upped that by nearly 150%.
Click to expand...
Thanks for that cool bit of info. It's always interesting to see a bit behind the scenes and thank you for convincing them to increase the run size.

 
Digital Devil said:
Thanks for that cool bit of info. It's always interesting to see a bit behind the scenes and thank you for convincing them to increase the run size.
Click to expand...
Since the start, some developers have wanted to many, while others don't want enough. The LRG guys seem to do the best in regards to the numbers overall. No one can get it perfect, but they do OK. They for sure more more about the market, than some of the game creators, and that's why it's a good relationship, as both sides can benefit when done properly.

 
Midori Monkey said:
Geez, I can't believe how off the publishers were with those Dariusburst numbers. 1000 SEs and 1000 LEs would have been insane.
Click to expand...
It would have been a bloodbath but I guess the digital version didn't sell too well.

New N Tasty of Vita was another case of severely underestimated demand. Oddworld Inhabitants insisted on a 2,500 copy run, which sold out pretty much instantly. I got them to boost the PS4 run size from 2,500 to 5,000, though.
 
Shmups is a genre I always want a physical of- mostly because they're usually quite replayable, lower print runs and often rare, but also because I can break them out 10 years later and they hold up well.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I also love shmups too. I thought Dariusburst would sellout fast but not under 2 minutes. I wonder why there isn't a lot of beat 'em ups in this gaming climate?

Final Fight, Streets of Rage, Double Dragon etc...
 
Looks like the people telling me I was wrong in predicting that Darius would sell out super fast were being overly optimistic. My internet crapped out on me temporarily right before I hit the button to finalize the sale of the LE, but I was fortunate enough to grab a regular copy a minute or so later when the internet came back. Been playing the imported copy I got from Play Asia and having a blast. I cannot wait to get the English version from LRG. It would be great if they could get some more shmups.

 
Madzane said:
Awesome. It's a shame Nintendo isn't more cooperative with 3DS publishing, I'd kill for a Steel Empire physical release.
Click to expand...
Ace Attorney 5 and 6 are my biggest physical wants for any games right now and it's a shame LRG or anyone else can't give them a physical run. It's crazy Capcom gives games like Ducktales and the Mega Man Legacy Collection physical runs but not Ace Attorney, they're just hurting the series popularity.

Same with Yakuza 5 but at least Sega is doing the series justice in the West now.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Doomstink said:
It would have been a bloodbath but I guess the digital version didn't sell too well.
Click to expand...
This is the perfect example of a developer not knowing their audience. When it comes to digital, no one is in a rush for Darius at full price, as they are going to wait for half off at least, as what's the rush? It's not going anywhere anytime soon, and no one is in a rush to buy, when a sale is going to happen more often than not. Just because a game sold poorly digitally, should really be of no surprise to anyone, especially when it comes to Sony, as they have killer sales all the time, on all types of games, across all of their platforms.

You would think someone would look at other shooters released by LRG, and see the potential and how fast they can go, but I honestly just don't think a lot of these places give much thought to these types of things.

 
bradbo said:
This is definitely how I feel. Instead it seems like printing 4000 copies of 30k games is the plan. I'd like to see less releases with more quality. I realize my preferences aren't everyone else's but can we not agree that demand for the releases seems to be waning?
Click to expand...
There's absolutely no indication of demand waning. They've had games linger a few days before, and had many sell out in minutes since then. Hell, the Darius CE lasted barely over 60 seconds just this past sale. You can say, "oh, well people have been waiting for that." What does that matter, at all? As if LRG won't end up printing more popular games?

Less popular, less highly reviewed games will just sell slower. I, personally, am happy that LRG prints every game they do. Even if I don't want it (which has never been the case, so far) the option to own a physical copy of any game is appreciated.

If you don't want a game, don't buy it. Just don't kick the whole "LRG is dying" horse kicked every time a game doesn't sell out in the blink of an eye.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
you know that they'll just come back saying "interest in LRG is dying! Look! The game didn't sell out in minutes! It took a weekend!" for the next release. And the next one....and then the next..

 
Doomstink said:
It would have been a bloodbath but I guess the digital version didn't sell too well.

New N Tasty of Vita was another case of severely underestimated demand. Oddworld Inhabitants insisted on a 2,500 copy run, which sold out pretty much instantly. I got them to boost the PS4 run size from 2,500 to 5,000, though.
Click to expand...
You've created a niche with these and you have a lot of people hooked with the notion of value, whether it's to collect or resell. Don't worry what anyone else says, other than aqua kitty everything else has been pretty smooth.

I passed on Darius Burst because it's overpriced imo, $40 would have been great. I know it's been talked about but if a Vita version does come out I'm totally getting that one, I just hope it's not $60.

Just a word of advice... stop selling to Vinny.... He needs to get a girlfriend and get laid. >_<

He needs to be like this guy.

tpac.gif


 
Rhythm Heaven Megamix 3DS would be great if Nintendo ever partnered with LRG. The EU region got a physical release while NA got digital only. I'd also love to own the complete Ace Attorney series on cartridge.

And Super Meat Boy PS VITA would be awesome. It'd be even more awesome with the original version's soundtrack. EU got a physical version for PS4.
 
Olengie said:
Dariusburst Vita will likely be $50
Click to expand...
Please don't compete with Import Price! I really hope Darius Burst is $39.99 + Shipping (the Price is Right for Vita version). Possible LE version for whoever missed PS4 LE Version. 5,000 Regular Copies for Vita is GOOD or Put up Pre-Order for 1 Week or 10 Days.

 
Olengie said:
Dariusburst Vita will likely be $50
Click to expand...
Masterkyo said:
Please don't compete with Import Price! I really hope Darius Burst is $39.99 + Shipping (the Price is Right for Vita version). Possible LE version for whoever missed PS4 LE Version. 5,000 Regular Copies for Vita is GOOD or Put up Pre-Order for 1 Week or 10 Days.
Click to expand...
I agree the price will probably be $50.

Their not competing with the import, but all pricing is based on the digital versions cost, so I believe the Vita digital game is full price, so the physical will be that at least, and most times more.

Backlog Hog said:
Rhythm Heaven Megamix 3DS would be great if Nintendo ever partnered with LRG. The EU region got a physical release while NA got digital only. I'd also love to own the complete Ace Attorney series on cartridge.
Click to expand...
Rhythm Heaven is a "N" published game, and no way we ever see LRG do one of those titles. We didn't get it here, as NoA is the fuck ing worst. I saw Chimpmeister lobbying for Nintendo to go out of business yesterday in another thread, and while I've felt his sentiments many times in recent years. I still enjoy some of their work, so I don't want to see them gone completely. But I would actually welcome that for NoA, as now that the NS is region free, they are a 100% useless entity in my opinion, and should close their doors. If you don't live in NY by the one store they have, your screwed for pretty much anything worth a damn released in the US.

Ace Attorney was another series LRG stated they wanted, but between "N", and Crapcom, that boat has sailed as well. They are working on NS related deals, but none have been 100% confirmed. They said summer would be the earliest something may happen.

 
Olengie said:
you know that they'll just come back saying "interest in LRG is dying! Look! The game didn't sell out in minutes! It took a weekend!" for the next release. And the next one....and then the next..
Click to expand...
Or something logical like "look at all the stagnant eBay prices."
 
Doomstink said:
It would have been a bloodbath but I guess the digital version didn't sell too well.

New N Tasty of Vita was another case of severely underestimated demand. Oddworld Inhabitants insisted on a 2,500 copy run, which sold out pretty much instantly. I got them to boost the PS4 run size from 2,500 to 5,000, though.
Click to expand...
60 dollars for a digital only game is a tough sell. It's even tougher for a shmup that has never even been that most popular in it's genre like Gradius or R-Type. I know you won't be able to comment on my post, but I think it proves the publisher is completely out of touch with the current market, and hopefully it doesn't kill the Darius franchise. It's long running, and has always been quality, but their business decisions has me worried for the franchise.

 
It might be a shocker, but as we've been telling people constantly over the last few weeks, resellers don't make up the majority of our audience. People like to point the finger at the scalper boogeyman when they miss out, but resellers are not our core market. Stagnant eBay prices just mean that we're hitting demand (or coming close to it).

 
Here's a recent update to Plague Road, and it's from a recent build of the Vita version running at 60fps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Osb-J44h1xQ

 
I don't care how fast games sell out.  I don't care if a bunch of extra units are made for a given run, or if the run remains small as per publisher requests.  I just want the bar to remain high for releasing quality games.  Dariusburst was a positive step in that direction.  Not a fan of the $5-10 Steam game releases; which become $1-5 during sales.  I would just buy them there for a fraction of the cost if I wanted those. 

Owning physical isn't anything special if the digital game has no value. 

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Doomstink said:
For reference on DARIUSBURST, the publisher suggested 1,000 limited editions and 1,000 standard editions. I had to talk them into where we ended up. People seem to think we just arbitrarily decide these things. Our partners are the first people to set the run size, we provide feedback on what they choose but at the end of the day it is up to them. If the game could've truly sold 30K copies (it couldn't have without wider distribution and steep discounts) - the publisher would have suggested that based on whatever data they had - they suggested 2,000. We upped that by nearly 150%.
Click to expand...
Did they ever consider that, maybe people don't wanna pay $60 for a niche, indie digital game?

 
I have a hard time buying any full release digital on console- I think Overwatch is the only one I have because it was almost half price during a PSN sale. It would have to be an amazing title to ever consider dropping $60 on digital.
 
bojay1997 said:
Except thousands of people did. Why would LRG or a publisher care what people who aren't going to buy something think?
Click to expand...
I'm really responding to the publisher's desired run being so low, which as Doom said, is backed up by the publisher's data- had the game been priced lower, it likely would have sold better and we might have seen a larger LRG run.

I'm not saying the game isn't selling at $60, just saying sales would have been better if the pricing was more reasonable to other indie, digital releases.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
bojay1997 said:
Except thousands of people did. Why would LRG or a publisher care what people who aren't going to buy something think?
Click to expand...
Why would they not care? Lots of dollars are spent on market research trying to learn the whys and why nots of consumers. I agree with you that once they see they'll hit their targets it's a moot point- but if that information is available take it.
 
Vinny said:
I'm really responding to the publisher's desired run being so low, which as Doom said, is backed up by the publisher's data- had the game been priced lower, it likely would have sold better and we might have seen a larger LRG run.

I'm not saying the game isn't selling at $60, just saying sales would have been better if the pricing was more reasonable to other indie, digital releases.
Click to expand...
Yeah, in regards to their lower request, I agree 100% with your statement. I'm all for a publisher getting their just due for the work put in to a title, but I would NEVER buy a digital game at that price when a physical option is out there. I always planned to import Darius, but never got around to it, and then when I saw, LRG may have a shot, I just waited.

Publishers who have niche titles like this, really need to work with the consumer and offer greater discounts for games, so those who may not want to pay the high digital cost, or the import cost, can get in on their games. In a situation like this, most consumers past it by, as their request for 1000 shows what they thought of the sale potential.

With LRG, you now have a physical version that is limited, and if people are in to the title or not, it was going to sale well. But the fact that they couldn't see that, or even come to that conclusion on their own, shows how much work still needs to be done in regards to physical and digital releases on how they are priced, and how much is produced.

 
chris- this also explains why LRG took off as it did, with a group of gamers who had the insight of feedback from small groups like us they have data to give them confidence in their product and targets.
 
Vinny said:
I'm really responding to the publisher's desired run being so low, which as Doom said, is backed up by the publisher's data- had the game been priced lower, it likely would have sold better and we might have seen a larger LRG run.

I'm not saying the game isn't selling at $60, just saying sales would have been better if the pricing was more reasonable to other indie, digital releases.
Click to expand...
Except the publisher doesn't always just care about raw sales numbers. With SHMUPS in particular, the market is so niche that selling several thousand copies at $60 or $100 is a much more lucrative business model than trying to sell tens of thousands of copies at $20 like some publishers have tried previously. I think the only real variable here was the injection of the LRG audience into the mix which increased demand in ways that the publisher couldn't have reasonably forseen.

 
bradbo said:
Why would they not care? Lots of dollars are spent on market research trying to learn the whys and why nots of consumers. I agree with you that once they see they'll hit their targets it's a moot point- but if that information is available take it.
Click to expand...
I think you run a serious risk when you open up market research too broadly and listen to consumer feedback too closely. Being responsive and aware of your audience is important, but if LRG listened to all of the people that tried to play armchair CEO here and elsewhere, they would be out of business.

 
Let's be real. We're talking about what 5000?copies of a game with a recognizable name. If they sold through the previous releases with all the talk on boards for months this one was a no brainer. Even at $60.
 
They need to be more like Ed Boon is, on Twitter all the time and talking to fans all the time about what they want to see in games, how they want to play them, what characters to put in as DLC, etc. 

Mortal Kombat 9 and 10 were great games, but I'm convinced that at least a portion of that success was a result of Boon talking to people all the time and taking some of the fan suggestions into account. I think Josh is doing that here with us as well for LRG, but as for the developer of Dariusburst I have no idea. 

 
bojay1997 said:
Except the publisher doesn't always just care about raw sales numbers. With SHMUPS in particular, the market is so niche that selling several thousand copies at $60 or $100 is a much more lucrative business model than trying to sell tens of thousands of copies at $20 like some publishers have tried previously. I think the only real variable here was the injection of the LRG audience into the mix which increased demand in ways that the publisher couldn't have reasonably forseen.
Click to expand...
Good point, but now I'm curious b/c (and I might be wrong here) I thought the dev was paid a fixed fee up front by LRG in order for LRG to publish/sell the game? If that's the case, I would think the dev would be more willing for a higher print run since it's no risk to them in case there's overstock.

 
If they'd seen the previous releases in which two titles were released (often unknown or more niche) and sold through, then they should have expected success. I wonder how many people bought at least two titles previously- that's enough market research to say that releasing a widely known IP at twice the price would sell. Selling another title on Darius day worked out, but certainly guaranteed that I'd not buy both.
 
It's not that people WANT to pay $60 for a digital indy game... its more that LRG threw a massive wrench into the lives of anyone going for 100% complete North America PS4 library from day one before anyone could predict LRG being born...  North America releases are the most popular among collectors.

And while they don't have a ESRB log, they originate in the US by a US company and they don't have a PEGI or ASIA logo so that makes them officially US/NA releases.

A lot of people committed to complete PS4 library before LRG came along and it's kinda stirred things up.

Likewise a lot of Vita collectors almost had closure on that system so they can divert funds to new systems, but so much for that now lol.  Going to be buying Vita releases and PS9 releases at the same time at this rate.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
chrislaustin said:
Ace Attorney was another series LRG stated they wanted, but between "N", and Crapcom, that boat has sailed as well. They are working on NS related deals, but none have been 100% confirmed. They said summer would be the earliest something may happen.
Click to expand...
Fast RMX and Blaster Master Zero for NS would be sweet.
 
I'd agree that throwing Darius out there months ago and establishing a fan base was a clever move. It may have been that way for various reasons I don't understand but the timing was right.
 
I never understood why the Dariusburst developers insisted on charging so much for the game, and I'm a huge shmup fan who owns many of them on multiple platforms. Releasing the game digitally for $60 (PS4) and $50 (Vita) is really out of line, and has certainly negatively impacted sales of the game. Also not releasing the game physically in North America, after the stupidly high digital prices, really left a bad taste in my mouth. It seemed (and still seems) insulting to North American gamers/collectors.

I watched many Youtube videos of the game, and it never really seemed like a great shmup. Backgrounds are bland, aspect ratio is bizarre, and it just doesn't compare well to other shooters like Soldner X2, Caladrius Blaze, Raiden Fighters, Raiden 4, etc.

I understand that they priced it high because they believed that the market for the game would be much smaller than for other genres, but in the end those high prices have certainly hurt the overall sales of the game. In my opinion they should have priced the digital versions at $40, and physical versions at a max of $50. I ended up just passing on the game (both digitally and physically) for PS4, and haven't decided yet on the Vita version.

Surely with more reasonable prices, the developer could have sold many, many more copies of the game. But in the end, it's their decision and they have to live with the results. I bet with lower prices they could easily have sold 5000+ copies for each platform physically.
 
JoshTX said:
They need to be more like Ed Boon is, on Twitter all the time and talking to fans all the time about what they want to see in games, how they want to play them, what characters to put in as DLC, etc.

Mortal Kombat 9 and 10 were great games, but I'm convinced that at least a portion of that success was a result of Boon talking to people all the time and taking some of the fan suggestions into account. I think Josh is doing that here with us as well for LRG, but as for the developer of Dariusburst I have no idea.
Click to expand...
This just some down to good business. I personally don't use social media, as I'm as anti social as one could get. LOL But from a business perspective, it seems a must. Now, it's so easy to take polls, to inquire about features, or to say what is being planned, and fans feel included, and it helps to make for a better game and business. As you can talk directly to your user base, and get feedback to improve.

A lot of Japanese businesses are very old school(place stick in the mud Japanese company here: X ), and when it comes to fan input or business decisions in general, they don't believe the public or fans know anything, and you get completely "blind" shit being done on the regular, that a trip to facebook/twitter could have easily prevented, or corrected.

We live in a golden age of information, and the ones who do best, are those that use it to the full extent possible. The ones that don't, ride the tide of ignorance with the "we didn't know", or "please understand" excuses. If you can't take time to avail yourselves of the tools that can grow, or help your business, you shouldn't be in the game to begin with.

 
But they sold 4800 copies at $60+? Why would they drop the price by $20 to sell 5000?

It's the same reasoning as anime. Selling 7,000 copies at 6k yen is considered successful. Lowering it to 2k doesn't mean they'll sell 21k copies.

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
bread's done
Back
Top