Starcraft 2: Legacy of the Void

[quote name='The Crotch']My favourite game remains the 4v4 where Chicken - the one guy without a headset, and therefore the one guy who can't really communicate with us, especially when all four protoss are 2gating us - actually cannon rushed the enemy.

Just exiting "jesusfuckthisisalotofzealots" mode, hear "Your ally's base is under attack!" and... wait, that's on their side of the... Chicken, you magnificent bastard.

By the end of the game, I had taken their gold expansion and HotShot was in an abandoned enemy main (this on a shared base map). Don't suppose one of you guys saved a replay of that, did you?[/QUOTE]

I could hear you guys, I was just choosing not to talk back. Now that my Triton AX180 headset is broken, I no longer have the ability to chat. the Turtle beach X11 headset I bought to replace it has an absurd amount of hiss.. louder than I normally have my game volume, so I'm returning it. I want to find a Turtle beach X1, but they don't make them anymore.. so I'm headset-less.

I've got lots of headphones, but no active mic anymore.. so me not talking during games is the only way it can go right now.

But yeah.. nobody expects the cannon rush in a 4v4. It works really well a lot of the time.
 
[quote name='The Crotch']Nobody expects you to cannon rush when we're one or two zealots away from getting skullfucked by their rush.[/QUOTE]

Those cannons killed 12 zealots at least; and a bunch of stalker I didn't count.. I did my part!
 
I tried to sneak a pylon and cannons into a guy's base last time. He never saw the pylon or few cannons I got up, but I got rushed by a load of roaches before I got many built.
 
[quote name='The Crotch']By the end of the game, I had taken their gold expansion and HotShot was in an abandoned enemy main (this on a shared base map). Don't suppose one of you guys saved a replay of that, did you?[/QUOTE]

Seems I have all 4 of those games.
 
We should get some more games in under the HotShotX, Draekon, BattleChicken, and Balphon "You ain't gonna see this shit coming" train.

~HotShotX
 
[quote name='Clak']Anyway you could upload that to youtube or some place, Magus? I'd love to see it.[/QUOTE]

I don't have a good way to capture it. Though I can email it to you if you like, the thing is 75 kb.
 
Silly Crotch, when you msg'd me while I was in game I thought I must of somehow entered a UMS game because of a glitch or something. Then I asked my friends if they saw a message as well :lol:
 
[quote name='Magus8472']I don't have a good way to capture it. Though I can email it to you if you like, the thing is 75 kb.[/QUOTE]
Sure,i'll PM you my email.
 
Unsure how the protoss nerf will change things just yet. I mean, yes, so zealots come out slower to weaken zealot rushes. But you typically counter a zealot rush with other zealots, so... how do we come out ahead on this? And... what's this mean for getting rushed by the other races?

But I'm overall optimistic as to the changes. Tank change is cool; I miss being able to charge tank lines with swordsmen.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
The proposed changes in the 1.1 patch look good. Even the ultra 'nerf' strengthen zerg in just the ways they needed to be stronger without ruining non-zerg games.

The tank change is needed - the siege tank will now operate like the SC1 tank did. Locking down a zerg using 1-2 tanks with hellions and/or rines/viking is way too easy to do. Zerg are at an unfair advantage in terms of the number of tank shots needed to kill their units - one tank blast can outright kill 8-12 lings at once, and two shots can kill a hydra. A terran with 2 tanks with some halfway decent support can wipe out a much larger (and more expensive) army because of that inequity. The tank change means that lings and hydra get close enough to do some damage, as opposed to being literal cannon fodder.

I saw the math earlier and in an battle between tanks and a hydra, a hydra would get an extra 40 something DPS out of the encounter - this makes punching through what is currently a nigh impenetrable Terran ground D with zerg possible using ground units. Zerg are at a HUGE disadvantage there and this helps them a LOT. Tos, on the other hand, already has answers to mass tanks, and it makes zealots a more attractive mid/late game against terran because they now take 5 shots to kill with a sieged tank. Terran against terran is where I'm not sure yet.. marines can now toe-to-toe with tanks a lot easier now. I'm not sure if we'll see a spike in mass rines in TvT or not.. could be interesting.

The zealot build time is an answer to the early game rush ability of the tos.. I don't know if it's GOOD yet, but it's certainly not terrible. The 2 gate proxy zel rush is entirely too strong. even if you catch it early, unless the enemy makes mistakes, it is very hard to counter it unless you decided to go all in on T1 units also. THOSE changes were made from their observing how prevalent the 2gate proxy was in high diamond games. Factoring in chrono, the 'real' time increase is like 2.5 seconds and 3.something without. Not a huge nerf, but just enough of an edge off the early-game rush. I wonder how much more often tos will see 6 pools against zerg now though.

I don't agree with the ultra damage reduction.. it was a very odd move for an already underused unit. removing the building attack, though is absolutely a buff. In theory, if the ultralisk's pathing works right, it should be trying to punch through the enemy's wall. Using the siege attack, it hits one building and thats it. Using its normal attack, it now deals spash damage to all the buildings AND units around it -- so, rather than just hitting that terran bunker, you hit the barracks and marines standing near the bunker too. In theory, you punch a hole faster.

The reaper change is good, for similar reasons as the zealot ones. most answers for zerg/terran to early reaper are light, so the extra build time gives a few more units to fight back with. Tos should still just make a couple stalker.. mind you.

The final change to Battlecruisers.. that is the only one I don't get. BCs are already scrap against pretty much any other air-based AA unit.. so making them even weaker against all ground based AA makes them less useful. I can't see why anyone would choose to make BCs over a combination of viking and banshee as it is.. this just seals that for me.
 
[quote name='BattleChicken']
The zealot build time is an answer to the early game rush ability of the tos.. I don't know if it's GOOD yet, but it's certainly not terrible. The 2 gate proxy zel rush is entirely too strong. even if you catch it early, unless the enemy makes mistakes, it is very hard to counter it unless you decided to go all in on T1 units also. THOSE changes were made from their observing how prevalent the 2gate proxy was in high diamond games. Factoring in chrono, the 'real' time increase is like 2.5 seconds and 3.something without. Not a huge nerf, but just enough of an edge off the early-game rush. I wonder how much more often tos will see 6 pools against zerg now though.
[/QUOTE]
I'm a good deal more worried about anything involving our old friends the marauder than I am about 6pools.
 
[quote name='Strell']It's not gonna happen tonight. Tomorrow is a long day for me I'm afraid.

But it'll happen soon enough.[/QUOTE]

:whistle2:(
 
[quote name='Strell']It's not gonna happen tonight. Tomorrow is a long day for me I'm afraid.

But it'll happen soon enough.[/QUOTE]

Should sell tickets.
 
[quote name='Magus8472']Should sell tickets.[/QUOTE]

I'd watch a Strell vs. Crotch matchup.

But only so I can make snappy comments.

~HotShotX
 
[quote name='yukine']Why even still have reapers in the game? They are only really useful for early game harass and now it takes even longer to get them out.

The BC nerfing is baffling, I agree with the tank nerfs, but I feel that void rays should have gotten nerfed a little as well.[/QUOTE]

They make your enemies do stupid things. OHSHIT HE KILLED A DRONE MAKE 5 SPINE CRAWLERS AND TECH TO ROACHES! NEVER EXPAND!!!!

As for BC's, yeah I don't really get that too much either. Perhaps they destroyed static objects too quickly.
 
[quote name='iKilledChewbacca']is strell good at this game or something ?[/QUOTE]
Balls if I know.

But as to the reaper nerf: Morrow beat IdrA at IEM using pretty much nothing but mass reapers and marauders. Morrow later claimed that he had fuck all experience actually using reapers (he said that he had practiced them for a couple of hours previously to get his micro to an un-horrible level), and that mass-reaper openings were simply too powerful against zerg. The IEM finals led to a huge wave of ZOMG NERF REAPERS from a lot of places.

Dunno how much that factored in to Blizzard's decision making, though.
 
:rofl: That replay was great guys, were you planning to cannon rush, chicken? Or was it just a spur of the moment thing? I can't believe they all up and quit like that, they still had a chance.
 
When does the game bump you up a division? I'm in the top 10 right now in mine with like 5 win streak so I'd assume it'd bump me up eventually?
 
Why are the roaches so impossible to beat as the Protoss early in the game?
Every AI match I've played as the Protoss I lose to the roaches while still building up resources to work up to the more powerful Protoss units. I've slaughter the AI with both Zerg and Terran but not with the Protoss. Any tips to beat the Zerg or the Terran after they get the Battle Cruiser.
 
Well, first of all, don't let them get damn cattlebruisers!

As for roaches? They'll kite your zealots pretty effortlessly on creep. I'm assuming you're having trouble rushing zerg who get roaches to counter your rush, yes? As far as I'm concerned, once the roaches pop, the rush is over. A 2gate rush isn't that mineral-intensive, so you should have a forge with cannons or some stalkers waiting for you back home, and depending on the map, a nice little wall at your natural. Stalkers hold up rather well against roaches, having both a speed and range advantage, and cannons outrange them, so if you put them one back from your wall (assuming you're playing somewhere like lost temple or blistering sands, where a wall outside your natural is viable), they won't even be able to touch 'em.

If you're losing to a roach rush... well, I flat-out have not had that happen to me. The zerg I play view roaches as an irritating necessity that they create to counter my early aggression. Roaches are durable, but they do little damage and have crap for range. Zealots to shield against the lings and stalkers to do the damage to the roaches. As soon as you get a void, immortal, or even a good pile of chargelots, there's not a whole helluva lot those things can do to you.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
[quote name='The Crotch']Well, first of all, don't let them get damn cattlebruisers!

As for roaches? They'll kite your zealots pretty effortlessly on creep. I'm assuming you're having trouble rushing zerg who get roaches to counter your rush, yes? As far as I'm concerned, once the roaches pop, the rush is over. A 2gate rush isn't that mineral-intensive, so you should have a forge with cannons or some stalkers waiting for you back home, and depending on the map, a nice little wall at your natural. Stalkers hold up rather well against roaches, having both a speed and range advantage, and cannons outrange them, so if you put them one back from your wall (assuming you're playing somewhere like lost temple or blistering sands, where a wall outside your natural is viable), they won't even be able to touch 'em.

If you're losing to a roach rush... well, I flat-out have not had that happen to me. The zerg I play view roaches as an irritating necessity that they create to counter my early aggression. Roaches are durable, but they do little damage and have crap for range. Zealots to shield against the lings and stalkers to do the damage to the roaches. As soon as you get a void, immortal, or even a good pile of chargelots, there's not a whole helluva lot those things can do to you.[/QUOTE]

The computer's been building it within the first few minutes of the game so I'm guessing roach rushing is a built in tactic. I've better luck with the other races so far. Zerg I've had no problems playing and wiped out my opponents so far and Terran I've had the same luck building up and knocking out the enemy. I'll do this strategy and build up faster to knock out the Zerg. I see that Zergling rush is still a viable strategy atleast against the computer.
Right now I'm working on completing the storyline and some minor AI matches for quick gameplay.
Thanks for the reply.
 
What difficulty are you playing on? If it's insanity, then I understand, 'cause they cheat like motherfuckers.

But otherwise... roaches are the exact same tech as stalkers and sentries. Exact same. Build times might be a bit different, but I don't think there's really any reason for roaches to be at your door if you've only got zealots. And if you don't only have zealots, there's no real reason you should lose to such a one-dimensional unit. Roaches take hits. That's about all they do. Split them on the ramp with a forcefield and take on half the army at a time. Wall outside your expansion on LT or Blistering Sands and use the superior range of cannons or stalkers.

If you wanna give me a replay of one of your games, that'd help considerably.

EDIT: This the build you're fighting?
 
I have been playing 3v3 Zerg a lot lately climbing up in ranks in Silver. Yesterday I decided to switch it up and start playing Protoss and I have done very well. Played one particular match where 1 on my allys dropped in the first 30 secs, then we proceeded to kick the crap out of the other team, and actually had one of the people whining about how badly we beat them.

I've been going strong economy and zealot, stalker, sentry mix and then adjusting the mix and upgrades based on the enemies forces. If we have air control then I divert stalker $$$ to immortals and collossi. I love immortals, it's so nice having anti mech unit. I think all the void ray protoss are making the other team think I'm going to go straight VRs, when I actually go straight ground. I also think I am benefitting from the underuse of immortals, people seem content with pumping out armored ground units no matter how many immortals I have mixed in.
 
oof.. having problem w/ VR rushes on team games. i can handle them fine on 1v1 but when they team up and get 4 VRs early against one of us.. sigh.

anyone in a diamond league here?
 
[quote name='jarvis307']oof.. having problem w/ VR rushes on team games. i can handle them fine on 1v1 but when they team up and get 4 VRs early against one of us.. sigh.

anyone in a diamond league here?[/QUOTE]

Anything above 2v2 is a joke tbh, it's not meant to be perfectly balanced.
 
[quote name='The Crotch']What difficulty are you playing on? If it's insanity, then I understand, 'cause they cheat like motherfuckers.

But otherwise... roaches are the exact same tech as stalkers and sentries. Exact same. Build times might be a bit different, but I don't think there's really any reason for roaches to be at your door if you've only got zealots. And if you don't only have zealots, there's no real reason you should lose to such a one-dimensional unit. Roaches take hits. That's about all they do. Split them on the ramp with a forcefield and take on half the army at a time. Wall outside your expansion on LT or Blistering Sands and use the superior range of cannons or stalkers.

If you wanna give me a replay of one of your games, that'd help considerably.

EDIT: This the build you're fighting?[/QUOTE]
Basically. I'm only playing the AI on medium and on the map where there is only one way into the enemy base as well as your own. They sent a few other units on the wave as well as the roaches. I'm going to replay it today and use that strategy to beat them.
 
[quote name='The Crotch']Like I said, a replay would help me help you best.[/QUOTE]
Nevermind that strategy worked quite well against the computer. I overlooked it in the previous game. Thanks for the advice on how to beat the roaches when competing against the zerg.
 
My games were a mixed bag last night. The matcher clearly thinks I need a 50% win rate. In my 2v2s, I think I'm still 60% or 70%.

After reading the link posted earlier about how the matcher works on teamliquid, what I observed earlier in the thread (way too many matches where the opponents are favored) makes perfect sense!

The matcher *IS* out to get me, I'm not paranoid at all.
 
I'm not feeling all that great today, so I stayed home from work. If anyone wants to play some SC2, I'm-a playing. My ID/number are in post#1 of this thread.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
bread's done
Back
Top