VC prices -- Stop being a pussy.

Thing is I want more games to choose from which I know we will get and want new games. Nintendo should really take a cue from Xbox Live Arcade and bring in some cool flash based games that could work well witht he Wiimote.
 
[quote name='bingbangboom']Thing is I want more games to choose from which I know we will get and want new games. Nintendo should really take a cue from Xbox Live Arcade and bring in some cool flash based games that could work well witht he Wiimote.[/QUOTE]


there is a site that once Opera is up in running has flash games that you use your mouse to play the games and its being setup for Wii users

WiiCade.com allows users to submit their own Wii-friendly Flash creations. All of the games can be played with only a mouse/Wiimote. We played several of the games on offer and were pleasantly surprised by their quality. Tactical Assassin puts you in the role of a sniper tasked with taking out specific targets. Each mission takes place on a single, blacked-out screen, and you'll use the Wiimote to control your scope and locate your target. You'll be given hints as to which person is your target and how they should be taken down. The game has a slick, stick figure art style and is a blast to play. Oh yeah, and it's free.

Of course, any Flash game can be played on the Wii using the Opera browser. But games that require more than just mouse controls may cause problems. WiiCade collects only Wii-friendly games, divides them into genres, and ranks their popularity. All of the site's games are currently playable on your computer, and we can't wait to give them a try with the Wiimote. You can either pay $5-$10 for 20-year old games on the Virtual Console, or play new games for free on a site like WiiCade.

Nintendo had originally planned to have the Opera browser available at launch, but its availability has obviously been pushed back and the company isn't saying exactly when it will be available.
 
I just want *more* games to choose from. I don't know who the hell came up with the initial smattering but most of them are crap. Ice Hockey? Hell yes. F-Zero? Eh no.
 
Nintendo has always been pretty RAPE with their old games (see the GBA NES games). I'm only buying games I either don't own (TG16 games mostly) or games I play like a maniac and would appreciate tossing them up on the plasma without having to hook up the old Genesis or SNES to play. The N64games at $10 are decently priced considering that's how much PS1 games and the newer Live titles go for. I think that SNES games should have been closer to $5 and NES games closer to $2-3 though.

...and you did not just call F-Zero crappy.
 
"The N64games at $10 are decently priced considering that's how much PS1 games and the newer Live titles go for."

Correct me if Im wrong, but PSX games through Sonys download system are going for $5
 
I do feel they are overpriced, but there will be times where I might get a title of two on there for the hell of it. I've always wanted to try F-Zero, after all.
 
if they really want to rake in the dough, they should have occasional half price weekends or something. Then people will buy a bunch more than they would otherwise because they won't know when the price will go back down that low. Especially if they only do it once a year or something, with no specific announced date, so people don't just wait for that to happen again to buy everything.

Think about how many games you've bought because you saw it was dirt cheap on cag and figured it's your only shot at that price so may as well go for it now, yet you probably still haven't played the game.
 
I'm neutral on the VC pricing. Its certainly not a great deal but nor is it a ripoff. There are both advantages and disadvantages of it. I like the improved graphics, being able to play with out the original console hooked up, and the accessibility. On the down side you don't actually own any thing physical and there is a danger of losing it. I know Nintendo will repair the system right now so you can keep the downloads. But I hope in the future there is a way to transfer it to a different system if you need to buy a new one. The games are automatically registered to mynintendo so they should be able to set up a system where you can deauthorize one system and authorize another.

The VC as it stands now is a nice addition to the Wii. If they add some enhancements, make more games available faster, and give away free games or points it will be killer. Nintendo would be brain dead not to finally start a loyalty program in North America that revolved around the VC. Also if they give free points or games with the purchase of new Wii games, it may lead people to buy more new games instead of waiting for a used copy (which Nintendo makes nothing on). Imagine if they give away Super Mario All-Stars or Super Mario World with Mario Galaxy for a limited time, people would jump on it much quicker and guaranteed they would sell more copies. The cross promotion possibilities are endless.
 
[quote name='Beer Monkey']Leaderboards are damned cool - it is loads of fun to compete with your friends via shared scoreboards. Jeebus, look at how many forums have threads where people are posting their high scores in Wii Sports? It's nonsense to have to do that in this day and age.[/quote]

yes, god forbid we even go on the internet to converse with others when our consoles could do it for us... >>
 
Personally I have no problems with the pricing of the VC games. I think the prices are fair (because face it if NES games were like 200 points would you have time to play all the NES games), and well I am just happy I could download them to my Wii. The only problem I have with the VC is the genesis games that are already avaiable on a collection for because I can go buy the collection for $20, but $8 for a game not on the collection is a good price in my opinion.
 
[quote name='cochesecochese']I just want *more* games to choose from. I don't know who the hell came up with the initial smattering but most of them are crap. Ice Hockey? Hell yes. F-Zero? Eh no.[/QUOTE]

Oh, man. F-Zero was one of the most amazing-looking games in its day. Still a blast to drift around those turns. I already downloaded it. No, the Wii doesn't perfectly emulate Mode7 graphics, but it looks way better than existing emulators. GBA hardware does a pretty good job, too.

And as a consumer, I'd like everyting to be cheaper, but look at the name of this website -- the fact that we Cheap Asses can even have this conversation means there's value there for the general public.
 
[quote name='hhhdx4']"The N64games at $10 are decently priced considering that's how much PS1 games and the newer Live titles go for."

Correct me if Im wrong, but PSX games through Sonys download system are going for $5[/QUOTE]


The price of PSone games on the PSP are 5 bucks in japan, in the states they are going to be from 5 to 10 bucks. Depending on the game. And I have a feeling FF7 isn't going to be 5 bucks.

I think the prices are too high. I have a feeling I will pick up some of the SNES games and N64 games down the line. Once the Shumps show up I'm going to get some of those for sure.

But I have a harder time with the NES games. Maybe SMB3, but I can play every NES game on my TV thanks to my dreamcast.

Oh and CAG keep your eyes open for discounts on those Wii points cards !!!
 
VC prices are overpriced compared to competitors.
Gametap is a similar service, with a wider selection of games (and easily superior right now), and only charges $10 a month for unlimited access to all. Now then, that's more expensive than buying just 1 VC game, but if you make any serious use of the VC at all (enough to make it worthwhile to have), I'm sure you can find $10 worth of games every month to play.

And Xbox Live is also releasing old games in addition to new simple ones. The thing is, their old games are actually updated. And I'm not just talking about the natural update Mario 64 got from going to a system with a higher native resolution and proper bilinear filtering, but rather new features like online play and such. Would have been nice if Nintendo released the best version of each game (say, Mario 64 with the DS levels and textures thrown in) and perhaps online play as well.

If I'm just looking for some quick jollies, I'm probably not going to pay on the VC to download some outdated NES game. And if it's a game I already like, I've probably already done my share of playing of it, and may even still own the actual game. I just read that the US Copyright Office just stated the emulation is legal for systems that are no longer produced, which means you can't really call roms illegal anymore (though since nintendo is rereleasing them for the VC, perhaps those games will be exempt).

Gametap is cheaper, and Xbox Live follows the value add model, Nintendo doesn't bring much to the table besides nostalgia. I was excited about the Virtual Console originally, but now looking at the game list, and the complete lack of any updates to any of the games, and I'm pretty sure that only new games will be touching my Wii. I don't have the free time anymore to spend $10 for the pleasure of playing something again that I've already spent countless hours on.
 
It's not that the games are overpriced compared to ROMs or even to the physical catridges. They are overpriced for their content compared to other games available now, both bargain games for last-gen systems and downloadable games for current-gen systems.

$8 for Altered Beast is a good example. Maybe it is a competitive price compared to getting the actual cartridge, but the game SUCKS! I know, I played it quite a bit when I first got my Genesis. Back then, we didn't have as many choices, and games in general weren't as advanced. Now it makes very little sense to play it all, much less pay that much for it. Even games like Sonic can be found on compilations or in portable versions for much less. It's too bad that this initial wave of games seems to be banking mostly on nostalgia and not on playability. There are lots of games that can still be enjoyed by people today and that might be worth the prices they are paying, but most of them haven't shown up yet. But yes, in general I think they are actually pricing themselves out of a lot of impulse purchases.

Edit: I guess what I'm saying is that the prices would be fair for some games, but for others they are ridiculous. The pricing shouldn't depend on the console, but rather on the game's quality/popularity.

[quote name='SMMM']Well, if anything, it'd certainly increase the value of the Wii system itself.[/QUOTE]

Aren't the games tied to your Nintendo account and/or credit card? I'm not sure that there is a way to sell the system with the games without giving the buyer control of your account as well.
 
[quote name='Fox5']VC prices are overpriced compared to competitors.
Gametap is a similar service, with a wider selection of games (and easily superior right now), and only charges $10 a month for unlimited access to all. Now then, that's more expensive than buying just 1 VC game, but if you make any serious use of the VC at all (enough to make it worthwhile to have), I'm sure you can find $10 worth of games every month to play.

And Xbox Live is also releasing old games in addition to new simple ones. The thing is, their old games are actually updated. And I'm not just talking about the natural update Mario 64 got from going to a system with a higher native resolution and proper bilinear filtering, but rather new features like online play and such. Would have been nice if Nintendo released the best version of each game (say, Mario 64 with the DS levels and textures thrown in) and perhaps online play as well.

If I'm just looking for some quick jollies, I'm probably not going to pay on the VC to download some outdated NES game. And if it's a game I already like, I've probably already done my share of playing of it, and may even still own the actual game. I just read that the US Copyright Office just stated the emulation is legal for systems that are no longer produced, which means you can't really call roms illegal anymore (though since nintendo is rereleasing them for the VC, perhaps those games will be exempt).

Gametap is cheaper, and Xbox Live follows the value add model, Nintendo doesn't bring much to the table besides nostalgia. I was excited about the Virtual Console originally, but now looking at the game list, and the complete lack of any updates to any of the games, and I'm pretty sure that only new games will be touching my Wii. I don't have the free time anymore to spend $10 for the pleasure of playing something again that I've already spent countless hours on.[/QUOTE]

The one thing you seem to be forgeting is the quality of the games offered through Live. Sure, Smash TV and Ultimate MK 3 are fun, but they're no where near the same level as something like Legend of Zelda or Sim City (the SNES version is still the best Sim City ever made). Sure, the Nintendo IPs are fueled by nostalgia so far, but there's a reason for that nostalgia. They're damn good games.

Take a long hard look at the arcade titles up on Live right now and think how many of them are worth the space on your hard drive let alone real points. Furthermore, these games that add content have had problems in the past. Frogger had absurd slow down as did Street Fighter 2. As for Gametap, it's a good service it's just got two things going against it. For one, playing a bunch of console games on a PC just doesn't measure up to hooking up a controller designed and laid out with that controller in mind. Second, the new Napster has and always will be beaten out by iTunes. Why is this? It's simple. People want to feel like they own their games (even if they're just "renting them according to US copyright laws"). Gametap doesn't offer that feeling.
 
There's one thing that makes the prices complete rip offs-

if we're not able to transfer VC games to a new Wii (aside from going through Nintendo's service). These games are a COMPLETE rip off if you can't deauthorize and authorize a new Wii.

If you can, the prices are fine. Sure, not all the games are worth the price, but that was true then, and it's true of current games. Just don't buy them.

I've got a question in to Nintendo's customer service about whether you can authorize different units. If you can, I'm buying a Wii and will get Toe Jam & Earl and Bonk's Adventure first. If not, I'm thinking of just forgetting about Wii. The VC is sort of what's pushing me to the tipping point of getting one.
 
[quote name='jollydwarf'] And, say, Chrono Trigger? Oy vey![/QUOTE]

You might still be able to find Chrono Trigger in Final Fantasy Chronicles. I bought that back in 2001 I think (it also includes Final Fantasy 5).

Chrono Trigger was absolutely amazing back in the day. So much so that I'm sure it still holds up well. It's as good as Final Fantasy 6.
 
Correct me if Im wrong, but PSX games through Sonys download system are going for $5

Not quite...I think. From what I recall reading, PS1 downloadable games are supposed to go for $5.99-$10.99. Or I could just be unintentionally furthering the Internet misinformation chain. If those numbers are right, the N64 games, i.e. the ones from the comparable generation of console, are still fairly priced. So MGS might be $10.99 and Ocarina of Time might be $10. Works for me. (Not that I need either of those games, but you get the idea.)
 
The best thing you can do is find POINT Cards at a Discount so the VC games will be cheaper (like the bestbuy GGC) $22.99 (ripoff) down to $17.99 (makes N64 games $9 each or wait for sales like CC had for $14.99
 
nice topic. i've altered my stance (from "expensive, but i'll buy some" to "not so expensive, and i'll still buy some") after reading the OP.
 
Well I'm still at the "expensive, but I'll buy some" stance... but this thread made me think about more games that I want lol.
 
I wholeheartedly agree with the OP's statement.

Many are comparing these overpriced games to roms and that's not fair. Besides, some roms are not perfect ports even on the best emulators.

I also think most VC games don't need online because they're fine the way they are. Exceptions may be those that are scoreboard potential like fighters and FPSs.

The games I'm most interest in buying, however, are multiplayer games. I have too much back catalog on my Cube.

BTW, Nintendo needs to improve their rewards system for Product Registration because I'm saddened to see how NCL and NOE gets all these LE goodies. Give us free Wii Points or something (besides wallpaper, character art, and buddy icons).
 
All I have to say to this is that I can get Small Arms for $10 on 360 and Sonic or Altered Beast for $8 on Wii. Kind of fucked up isn't it? :D

At least Wii games are priced just right. Most of them have a $49.99 pricetag compared to 360 and PS3 games $59.99. I guess its a matter of you win some, you lose some.
 
[quote name='Morpheus']All I have to say to this is that I can get Small Arms for $10 on 360 and Sonic or Altered Beast for $8 on Wii. Kind of fucked up isn't it? :D[/QUOTE]

I think you need to give Nintendo 1 year before you compare a game like that to the VC service as it exists today.

Personally, I think they're priced just fine. I've got quite a few points sitting in my account right now, thanks to the $15 - 2000 point cards at Circuit City and there are quite a few games coming out in the next 3 months that I know I'll be picking up.
 
[quote name='furyk']The one thing you seem to be forgeting is the quality of the games offered through Live. Sure, Smash TV and Ultimate MK 3 are fun, but they're no where near the same level as something like Legend of Zelda or Sim City (the SNES version is still the best Sim City ever made). Sure, the Nintendo IPs are fueled by nostalgia so far, but there's a reason for that nostalgia. They're damn good games.

Take a long hard look at the arcade titles up on Live right now and think how many of them are worth the space on your hard drive let alone real points. Furthermore, these games that add content have had problems in the past. Frogger had absurd slow down as did Street Fighter 2. As for Gametap, it's a good service it's just got two things going against it. For one, playing a bunch of console games on a PC just doesn't measure up to hooking up a controller designed and laid out with that controller in mind. Second, the new Napster has and always will be beaten out by iTunes. Why is this? It's simple. People want to feel like they own their games (even if they're just "renting them according to US copyright laws"). Gametap doesn't offer that feeling.[/QUOTE]

Xbox Live arcade also has doom. Ok, so that's a few major classic games, Smash TV, UMK3, SF2, and Doom, not to mention original games like Geometry Wars, a game that could never see the light of day on the Wii due to its "old games only" policy.

As far as gametap, well that seem to be doing decently well, they've just launched their own games label. And you can't say a pay per month service is doomed to failure in the face of ala cart, Xbox Live beat out Sony's online service and may even rival PC online gaming in popularity, and cable TV is definitely not ala cart, though it does have premium additional channels) I'd say these retro games are more like cable TV. With music, people know what music they want and they explicitly download it and they may not listen to that many songs, so $1 per song may make more sense than $10 per month. But these old games are banking purely on nostalgia, and I doubt very many people will play any through till the end. Given the choice, I think people would rather pay $10 a month and 'channel surf' then pay $5 for a game called "Pinball" on the chance that they might like it despite the ancient graphics.

Of course, that service won't be gametap because it's on the PC, whereas the VC coming with Wii gives it a much higher chance of succeeding. (gametap fully supports gamepads btw, it works quite well with hooking up an xbox 360 gamepad, which are usb)

Besides, some roms are not perfect ports even on the best emulators.

According to reviews, neither are the VC games. In fact, they're worse than PC emulators. At least when Microsoft nickels and dimes customers, they put SOME effort into it.

It's kind of interesting to see Nintendo rerelease the same old games unchanged over and over, especially ones that have updated versions. Why release the original Legend of Zelda over and over, when there was an updated remake of it for the SNES in Japan? Why Mario 64 without the new levels and textures from Mario 64 DS?

So far, a large amount of the current VC games have been released...
On their original console.
As pack in titles in Animal Crossing or something else on the Cube.
As e-reader cards.
As GBA carts selling for full price.
And now as VC games. You know Nintendo, you don't have to go in chronological order of when the games were actually released. Nobody cares about NES games prior to Super Mario Bros, I certainly wasn't itching to play Urban Fighter.
 
[quote name='Fox5']...not to mention original games like Geometry Wars, a game that could never see the light of day on the Wii due to its "old games only" policy.[/quote]

What "old games only" policy? Nintendo's already said there's original content being developed for the VC.

Personally I find X-Box Live's stuff near useless. Most of the games aren't anything I'm interested in (old games, but not old GOOD games). And besides that, the 360 has an unusable d-pad, making the appeal of playing some of these games on it ziltch. The VC already has more games I'd consider buying than Live Arcade does. I'd never buy a Live Arcade game either just because of the way the DRM works-unfortunately it's looking like the same will be true of VC games.
 
[quote name='Fox5']
Why release the original Legend of Zelda over and over, when there was an updated remake of it for the SNES in Japan? Why Mario 64 without the new levels and textures from Mario 64 DS?
[/QUOTE]
The questions you pose here pretty much answer themselves. They're holding on to the SNES LoZ for the sake of having one more product to sell (assuming they're even interested in re-releasing the SNES version). Who will buy the NES LoZ if the SNES version from Japan is made available first? And as for not including the M64 stuff that was unique the DS, well, how can that be surprising? Why would they undercut a title for an existing platform?
[quote name='Fox5']
It's kind of interesting to see Nintendo rerelease the same old games unchanged over and over, especially ones that have updated versions. . .So far, a large amount of the current VC games have been released...
On their original console.
As pack in titles in Animal Crossing or something else on the Cube.
As e-reader cards.
As GBA carts selling for full price.
And now as VC games.[/QUOTE]
So long as there are sales to back up these decisions, Nintendo will continue to recycle old titles. It's easy money. Maybe consumers are making things a little TOO easy for Nintendo.

As for other points in this thread, the VC-to-ROM comparison is not a worthwhile argument. Neither is the VC-to-import-game-on-eBay comparison. Both are wrangling with an insignificant piece of a much bigger puzzle. The real question is will Wii owners make the impulse purchases that Nintendo wants at these prices? A related question is does Nintendo even care if a VC title doesn't sell? My guess is they don't care to the extent that they aren't going to pull low sale titles or lower prices anytime soon. I'm sure the cost to Nintendo for making titles available is ridiculously low, so there's no need to monkey with anything.

As far as additional content goes, the wishlist of a small selection of its customers (the 0.1% who are rabid gamer/CAG/fanboy types) isn't anywhere close to being Nintendo's concern. This gamer demographic consists of the same people who were bitching and moaning for HD/DVD/etc capabilities in the Wii, none of which Nintendo took seriously. Why would Nintendo put time and money into making substantial additions/improvements to old games when a large majority of their experience tells them that simply bringing old games to new media with very little adjustment/improvement is easy cash?

Any "upgrades" Nintendo makes to old titles will be in gussying up graphics or in allowing simple customization of in-game sprites. Nintendo's idea of "extras" is most likely allowing you to play SMB3 as Yoshi, not in upgrading Tecmo Bowl for online 4P. There's talk of additional levels for old titles, but I'd imagine that they are discarded levels from the game's development that have been cleaned up for sale via VC. Nintendo isn't going to overextend itself on the VC. They've got bigger fish to fry, and the VC just isn't going to be worth a big effort from them. That's why the VC prices will stay where they are for a while and we won't see much from the VC beyond a steady stream of mostly mundane game re-releases.
 
I agree with a lot of the sentiment here. I'm going to buy some VC games for a few reasons:

- No one here at CAG should be paying full price for anything: There are enough deals out there to get points cards. GGCs at Best Buy, the $20 off $50 at Buy.com (I got my points card for $13-something with that). So it's not AS big a deal.

- I'm only buying "great" games that I missed (Mario RPG for example) and SUPERB games that I loved and can't play (ala, Ocarina of Time): The NES games, are pretty eh, the only ones I'd buy would be Zelda and Mario 3. I can't see paying 500 points even for the first super mario bros game. Maybe when they start bundling them or lowering costs or something.

- I am a proponent of the "all in one place" mentality. Anytime I don't have to switch my home entertainment system around to play an old game is a good day. It's almost worth the cost to avoid the aggrevation of setting up a console every time I want to play a different game, especially in an apartment like myself where space is at a premium.

- Online multiplayer needs to come: The #1, without a doubt, downfall of the VC is the lack of Online Multiplayer. I would pay $8 for many a mediocre SNES/N64 games just for this feature. Heck, I'd pay more to play games like Mario Kart 64 online than $10.
 
Guess im a pussy because i think they are overpriced. They charge $8 for Sonic when you can just get Sonic Mega Collection for like 2 bucks more and play that on the same console. The same can be said about alot of those games in one form or another.

The only difference is that now you get nothing physical out of this. The bigger problem however, is the lack of online multiplayer. Would i have bought UMK3 for $10? No. Its the online play that makes the game because it brings something NEW to a game thats like a decade old. Back then you either sucked or you didnt, because you played the same people over and over again, online changes all of that.

So add online play and i like the prices, otherwise i think its too much for the same exact thing that has been rehashed on compilations and handhelds.
 
I think everyone here needs to buy Bomberman 93. The game is a blast! 5 player multi-player is awesome and I think overall, depending on game to game, there will be games worth the purchase. Bomberman '93 especially convinced me of that.

Really, of all the games available on the VC, I think Bomberman '93 is pretty much the stand out title of the current Virtual Console line-up. It's the one VC game people at my house people keep going back to, even with Zelda, Wii Sports, and Rayman available to them. It was totally worth the 6$. I think we've gotten over 6 hours of playtime on it since we downloaded it yesterday.

Other than that, instead of just bitching, we should look to at least discuss what we're looking forward to. From the current list Nintendo has up, I'm looking forward to Gunstar Heroes and Toe Jam and Earl. Bonk looks interesting, but it's currently not worth a purchase from me at this point. Maybe later.

I mean, if you haven't played it before, it's still new to you, right?
 
Remember those NES games that were coming out for the GB Advance?

Now that was really overpriced. Glad they went down to clearance quickly.
 
Has nintendo flat out denied that Online Multiplayer will be possible with VC games? Maybe thats why we're not seeing some of the great multiplayer classics just yet, since the online multiplayer is still being worked out for Wii.

I'd love to play WaveRace, Mario Kart 64, Goldeneye, and many more multiplayer.

And I agree with the Bomberman Kudos. That is some fun stuff, and i really reccomend it. I've played a few hours of SimCity, and It's just as good as I remember. Trying to get a decent city without the money cheat that I used to use all the time as a kid, though.
 
[quote name='jollydwarf']But the thing is, with Xbox Live Arcade you are getting multiplayer, points/achievments, touched up graphics, and leaderboards.

And Xbox Live is also releasing old games in addition to new simple ones. The thing is, their old games are actually updated. And I'm not just talking about the natural update Mario 64 got from going to a system with a higher native resolution and proper bilinear filtering, but rather new features like online play and such. Would have been nice if Nintendo released the best version of each game (say, Mario 64 with the DS levels and textures thrown in) and perhaps online play as well.

[/QUOTE]


I see this as a negative not really a positive. The Live Arcade 'remakes'
aren't really well done versions, they come across as cheesy knockoffs
and the UI and sounds aren't exactly well done on a lot of them either.

I would much rather see the original games with modifications added
for online play etc grafted onto the original versions.

Frankly the Live Arcade games like Defender, Scramble etc are
the ones that come across as too expensive to me. There are
good ones though of course, especially original games like Geometry Wars.

My Wii hasn't arrived yet so I haven't tried VC games yet but if
they stick true to the original versions I will consider them more
valuable, thought I would still like to see the prices come down a bit.
 
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