Should I fight this eBay buyer? [UPDATED 1/24]

btw1217

CAGiversary!
Feedback
48 (100%)
Gonna keep this short. I sold a few XBOX Live codes on eBay to a few different people. Surprise, surprise, the buyer less than a month old says that one of them "was used".

He requested that I send him the code through eBay messages. I obliged. An hour later he sends me a screenshot of the Live website saying the code was already used, as in, he used the code twice, took a screenshot the second time, and is trying to play me for a fool. According to his feedback, I'm not the first person that he's received a "used" Xbox code from in his 4 transactions, what are the odds! Am I in the right to fight this? I'm 100% positive it's scam. I've already prepped the card to be mailed to him so that I can have a tracking number to give to eBay.

Here is the transcript thus far...

Him: Hello, I just bought, please send the code through eBay Message like you said you would on the selling page! Thank you! :)

Me: Thank you for your purchase! Here is your 3-month XBOX Live code: [Code Removed]

TO REDEEM GOLD MEMBERSHIP CODE:
1. Sign in to your Microsoft account.
2. Press the silver/green Xbox Guide button on the controller.
3. Navigate to Stores tab.
4. Select Redeem Code & enter code.
Codes can also be reddemed at live.xbox.com.

If you have any questions or concerns, please let me know. Thanks!

Him: I just tried to redeem the code, and it said it was used?

[Screenshot Link Removed Because It Contained Live Code]

Could you send me a working one please?

Me: The code was concealed until your purchase and only disclosed to you. I'm afraid I have no replacement code to offer.

Him: Iv'e showed you proof that the code had already been used. I either want a new code or a refund.

Me:I don't mean to discredit you, however that is not proof that the code was redeemed prior to it being issued to you. You could create that error message simply by trying to use the code twice. I'm afraid I don't have a replacement and can't offer a refund. You may have success raising the issue to Microsoft for a replacement code.

Him: Microsoft would just tell me to contact the seller and demand for a refund and or a working code, which is what I am trying to do. I am going to ask again, you need to give me a working code or a refund. If you must, I may accept an offer of something else, but that would be a worst case kind of deal.

UPDATE
He filed a PayPal dispute.

Him:
1/5/2013 16:43 CST - PayPal: Buyer escalated this dispute to a Claim.
1/5/2013 16:43 CST - Buyer: This user sent me an already used 3-Month Xbox Live Code via eBay Messages, which is against the eBay Policy as of 2008. I know PayPal and eBay are run by the same company, so I am disputing the payment here. Thank you.
1/5/2013 16:41 CST - Buyer: This user gave me a used 3-Month XBL code via eBay Message and Personal E-Mail.

Then:
Him:Ill give you one last chance. eBay knows when people like you are scam artists, and if you make it so they have to refund it I believe it makes a record on your account. I am just asking for you to give me a working code, or to refund me. It isn't that much to ask, please just comply with me. Thank you.

Me:I'm afraid I'm not the one who's the scammer, and I certainly won't glorify the term by calling it an art, but you've already filed a PayPal dispute, and it will be resolved there. I'm sure you'll receive a refund. I hope you enjoy the free 3 months of Live.

Him:
If I got 3 months, I would be happy. But if I do win the dispute, it will be simply getting my money back for something I did not receive. I have no negative feedback for a reason(He has 2 positives and is less than a month old. Here's my feedback.), I am the one who has been scammed before. All of you Xbox sellers think that you can use a code then just try and sell it and say it had never been used before, I hope eBay actually does something about this one, it's a real disgrace. Like I said, please give me a working code or a refund. Thank you.

UPDATE

I contacted the other sellers that this buyer has dealt with. I received one response so far. Here was there message. I don't think English is their first language, but their message is loud and clear:

PREVIOUS SELLER: Dear ticketusmaximus,

Hello! yes.after bought,He open claim "It was given to me via E-Mail, when it should have been delivered via my address. I checked the rules, and it even says that electronic goods cannot be sold on eBay" This was stupid reason.So I response "He asked "send by e-mail" (Sent Date: Dec-23-12 00:45:28 PST) Dear gaogaokytoh, "Hello! It being Christmas, I was wondering if there is anyway you can send me the codes via my E-Mail Address? I am going to be at my family members house, and am going to need it then and there. Thanks for a speedy reply! " - usmc_products So Why seller claim this??" and eBay has decided to refund the buyer.This is not fair also,However I didnot refund.So I "Report this buyer" as use Buyer protection.(you can find your feedback site,This is new option)You should be record also.If many same case happened, ebay can suspend him. and I met one more same kind buyer(more terriable,tricky)ID: genovese9797 I sold XBOX live 12 month Card,and sent code by e-mail.and He told "Used already" This was totally brand new.But ebay decided"Full refund" even I bought ebay store.and He left negative.I lost $49,and feedback.later I found out his trick.He bought another seller cheaper one same time.Depend on ebay resolution center.80% not fair for seller.So Please careful this buyer also.

- gaogaokytoh

PREVIOUS SELLER: Dear ticketusmaximus,

I had the exact same problem
He even sent me this http://gyazo.com/97c429a4e32e8175edf6653b1c8ba2ca
And than filed for a refund because it "Didnt work"

- carter56711

PREVIOUS SELLER: Dear ticketusmaximus,

Thank you for that information, the buyer actually just opened a case against me for a full refund of the item. I escalated the case with ebay, as well as call into customer service to include the information that you have relayed to me. I had a feeling when I sold the item to him because of the low feedback score and that he is a newbie to eBay that I am at jeopardy for such an occurance to take place. I wish you luck with your case, and I let eBay know that I am not the only one he has done this to. I hope by including your name into my eBay case it will help us both be absolved by this scammer.

Thanks again!

- kanellopoul


PREVIOUS SELLER: Dear ticketusmaximus,

Yes! I reported him to Ebay, but, of course, Ebay sided on his side. He is a scammer and a fraud. You most likely sent him a code and he said it didn't work. Tell him you called microsoft and they said it was redeemed shortly after you sent it to him. This seems to work for most scammers I have. Good luck with dealing with him.

- cart_can

PREVIOUS SELLER: Dear ticketusmaximus,

yes same situation, I knew he was lying but how do you prove it? You would think ebay would catch on.Also be careful because I don't think that is the only name he is doing it under

- pas7894

1/9

Status of the delivery confirmation shows "Delivered" hopefully throwing a monkey wrench in his scheme.

1/10

[quote name='PayPal']We are writing to let you know that we requested additional information from the buyer about this case.

We'll let you know if we require additional information from you.[/quote]

1/11

Case closed. I'm not exactly sure what happened, but I got by money back! There's no closure, but something inside me, maybe wishful thinking, says that he didn't get a refund, as the other seller's message mentioned both parties receiving money and mine did not. I simply got

[quote name='PayPal']

Hello ticketusmaximus,

We've closed the claim for this transaction. You don't need to do anything further at this time.

Thanks,

PayPal
[/quote]

I checked my account and the money was back. If he did lose, I expect to see a shiny, red negative on my feedback soon. I'm going to keep monitoring his account to warn new sellers and to see if it ever gets banned. Thanks again everyone for the support!

1/24

He was finally banned!
 
Last edited by a moderator:
At this point, it's a losing battle. Pointing out to ebay that he's done this before might have them look into his account, but you're probably going to lose the money from the sale.

Even if you mail it, he'll probably just open a dispute no matter what saying the card was used.

FYI, add his user name to the blocked bidder list in this forum.
 
You should definitely fight it. The chances of you winning are low but if you bring up his history, you might win.
 
Updated OP. He filed a PayPal dispute. I reported him to eBay and made PayPal statements that aren't showing up for some reason. Probably won't win, but I won't make it easy either.
 
[quote name='Vanacloud']This is why selling codes on ebay is a bad idea.[/QUOTE]

Yup. And the liar will be rewarded by eBay too. I say find out where he lives, visit him and smash his fingers with a hammer. Or just tell eBay that you are black and he is white and is being racist to you for it.
 
[quote name='georox']Tell him to suck the code out of your dick. #stayclassy[/QUOTE]

so awesome :lol:

I think you're screwed OP. Unfortunately, I don't think ebay approves of sending the codes by email/ebay messages. Anyone ever have problems shipping a code by mail and then have the buyer say the code was already redeemed?
 
Never send your codes through email. Always mail your item.

eBay is a shithole of scamming and they do nothing to stop it. In fact, I think they actively encourage it. Why can't sellers leave negatives? That's fucking retarded.

Regardless, protect yourself when you sell on eBay. You know what kinda filth roam that site...

I had two people in the same month claim that I sold them broken consoles, and they wanted refunds after like 2 weeks. I told them that was fine and I would refund them as soon as I verified the serial numbers on the consoles and I never heard back from them. BOTH of them were scammers, both in the same month. Luckily I protected myself against that shit.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Unfortunately your going to lose for the simple fact your no longer allowed to sell this type of digital content on Ebay anymore. And this is precisely the reason why it was disallowed. I imagine it's too time consuming for Ebay and near impossible to verify who is telling the truth when a dispute occurs over a digital code.
 
[quote name='AugustAPC']Never send your codes through email. Always mail your item.
[/QUOTE]

All they have to do is claim the code doesn't work, which the buyer did. This fact, plus his/her history described by OP says that this buyer is an experienced scammer.

[quote name='twiceborn']Unfortunately your going to lose for the simple fact your no longer allowed to sell this type of digital content on Ebay anymore. And this is precisely the reason why it was disallowed. I imagine it's too time consuming for Ebay and near impossible to verify who is telling the truth when a dispute occurs over a digital code.[/QUOTE]

I think that rule is for DLC content only, which by fineprint, is for the recipient. Retail codes of virtual money (Wii Points, Live points) and subscription is still allowed (PSN+ and XBL Gold) are ok.
 
[quote name='AugustAPC']Never send your codes through email. Always mail your item.

eBay is a shithole of scamming and they do nothing to stop it. In fact, I think they actively encourage it. Why can't sellers leave negatives? That's fucking retarded.

Regardless, protect yourself when you sell on eBay. You know what kinda filth roam that site...

I had two people in the same month claim that I sold them broken consoles, and they wanted refunds after like 2 weeks. I told them that was fine and I would refund them as soon as I verified the serial numbers on the consoles and I never heard back from them. BOTH of them were scammers, both in the same month. Luckily I protected myself against that shit.[/QUOTE]

Glad I read this. I've sold consoles on eBay before with no problem. But the leading bidder has a 0. I'm always wary of 0s
 
I'm planning on mailing the card first thing Monday. Luckily I printed a shipping label prior to the dispute being filed, so maybe PayPal is waiting to see if I physically deliver the item. Hoping for the best.
 
[quote name='poopants']I would also like to know the ebay user name so I can add to my blocked bidders list[/QUOTE]

His username is usmc_products

My favorite part is where he kindly asked me to send him the code through eBay messages, and then once the PayPal claim was filed, told PayPal that it was against eBay ToS since 2008 to send codes through messages.
 
[quote name='Vinny']All they have to do is claim the code doesn't work, which the buyer did. This fact, plus his/her history described by OP says that this buyer is an experienced scammer. [/QUOTE]

Yes, but you have absolutely no chance of winning any case if you don't mail your item. If you send a code by eMail, you've digitally fucked yourself. At least when you mail your item, you can get passed step 1, which is proving you actually delivered your item.

[quote name='NonShalant']Glad I read this. I've sold consoles on eBay before with no problem. But the leading bidder has a 0. I'm always wary of 0s[/QUOTE]

Yea, man. Always take down serial numbers for consoles. I was so blown away that out of 4 consoles I was selling in a month, two of them were being returned to me being claimed they were broken. It was a 360 and a Dreamcast... around $150 that I would have had to refund. Not a peep out of them when I told them that I would be verifying the serial numbers. I'm sure they intended to send me back their broken consoles and keep my working ones.
 
did the OP actually call up Microsoft to verify the code was used?

can't believe the buyer said that Microsoft would likely tell him to get the seller to refund or send a new code. fuck this guy.

OP should contact the other sellers and inquire. Google the buyer's zip code and local police and call them saying this person is a scammer.
 
Calling MS should yield the date and time (and maybe even location) of the code redemption. At least it has in the past. That could help you prove that he redeemed it.
 
Yeah buddy, shit sucks. You're probably screwed.

I just sold a code to someone with low feedback when I specified in my listing that I didnt want anyone with low feedback buying from me because of shit like this. Of course he completely ignored it and there's nothing I can do about it. No messages or anything from him. I almost just want to relist it and tell the guy to fuck off..
 
OP,

What type of PP dispute did he open (SNAD or INR)?

It is against eBay's and PayPal's Terms of Service (TOS) to sell anything that is not tangible or delivered electronically. That's not to say you can't do it (although your listings may get flagged) it just means you will lose your seller protection.

If you do decide to continue to sell electronic items figure out what your loss threshold is. Is it a $10 item? $20? $50?

Figure out what the number is and physically ship any item that crosses that threshold.

You can still send the codes through e-mail but ALWAYS print a shipping label first that way they'll look stupid if they file INR but you have a Delivery Confirmation/tracking number.

It doesn't mean they can't later upgrade the case to a SNAD but at least you have that first line of defense.

If the buyer files a SNAD case you're up shit creek regardless of what you're selling as the majority are almost always found in the buyer's favor and your only and best option as a seller is to select "Return for Refund" which leaves you empty handed in a case like this.

I have outsmarted scammers in situations like this by responding to the effect of:

"Dear buyer, I'm very sorry you are having a problem with the code/DLC. I will contact Microsoft/Steam/EA/Origin and give them the information to see if and when it was redeemed or why it is invalid"

Typically I would get a response a few minutes later saying that they must of incorrectly entered the code because now it's working

but there are always going to be those idiots that are willing to risk getting permabanned from eBay because they can't help themselves over $5/$10 worth of DLC and continue to open cases.

This is below me but others have said that to get even they sign the buyer up for all kinds of junk mail and subscriptions because you have their mailing address.

Anyways Good luck with your dispute
 
The buyer opened a "Not As Described" dispute claiming that the code was already used. I'm waiting with Microsoft right now to see if they can tell me when the code was actually redeemed. I'll feel like an asshole if they say sometime other than yesterday afternoon, but somehow I doubt they will. Even if they confirm my suspicions, I don't think PayPal will take that information into consideration, as it doesn't prove that I didn't redeem it prior to sending it. Unfortunately it's just my word against his, and I don't think PayPal cares.
 
It is very unlikely that you will win this case being that he opened it as a SNAD.

However here a couple of things you could try.

First did you send the code through eBay messages? If so you might have a more difficult time pulling this off (eBay and PayPal communicate) however you could go to the case in PayPal and enter an update to the effect of "Item was mailed on [Enter Date]; here is the tracking information. I'm not sure how the buyer could possibly have a problem with the item at this time as it hasn't been delivered yet".

PayPal and eBay almost never take any communication outside of eBay into account as it can't be considered credible (anyone can doctor an e-mail).

Also just to make things more difficult for the buyer you could request that they return the voucher/dlc code for a refund as that is your only option.

That typically will delay a refund of your funds from PayPal to the buyer until he can prove to PayPal that he returned something (they will check Delivery Confirmation/tracking). At least this way he has to take the time to mail something back to you and you'd be surprised at how lazy scammers can be.

If he just refuses the item or marks it "return to sender" he can't really claim a SNAD as he never had possession of it.

But again you'd still only have an outside shot because as soon as PayPal realizes this was a digital code that you sent through eBay messages they will most likely rule in the buyer's favor.
 
I did send it through eBay messages, as I naively assumed that would offer me extra protection. If given the option I may do the "Return for refund". Still waiting with Microsoft. If they can actually tell me when and WHERE it was used, maybe that would mean something.
 
Microsoft will tell you when the code was redeemed for sure. However, I don't believe they will release who redeemed it or their location. I just have a feeling ebay won't care. Good luck.
 
Microsoft told me that the code was used yesterday, but couldn't give me a time or location. That confirms my suspicions, but doesn't provide me any real ammunition for this dispute.
 
[quote name='btw1217']I did send it through eBay messages, as I naively assumed that would offer me extra protection. If given the option I may do the "Return for refund". Still waiting with Microsoft. If they can actually tell me when and WHERE it was used, maybe that would mean something.[/QUOTE]

Keep us updated! I really do hope you win this case.
 
[quote name='btw1217']Microsoft told me that the code was used yesterday, but couldn't give me a time or location. That confirms my suspicions, but doesn't provide me any real ammunition for this dispute.[/QUOTE]

If you don't mind answering what was the XBL code for? 1 month? 3 months? A year?

I'm just trying to gauge how involved I'd get if I was you.

You could also look at their feedback to see what other transactions they've been involved in and contact those sellers.

You could then use the information they give you to help support your case by either telling the buyer you've contacted other sellers and know he is full of shit or contact PayPal and tell them he has a history of this type of behavior.

You can also report the buyer for abusing eBay/PayPal's buyer protection. The easiest way to do this is directly through eBay's website.
 
[quote name='GBAstar']If you don't mind answering what was the XBL code for? 1 month? 3 months? A year?

I'm just trying to gauge how involved I'd get if I was you.

You could also look at their feedback to see what other transactions they've been involved in and contact those sellers.

You could then use the information they give you to help support your case by either telling the buyer you've contacted other sellers and know he is full of shit or contact PayPal and tell them he has a history of this type of behavior.

You can also report the buyer for abusing eBay/PayPal's buyer protection. The easiest way to do this is directly through eBay's website.[/QUOTE]

It was for a 3 month code and is really of no substantial loss for me. I have issues with injustice though and would rather waste my entire weekend fighting this than to let him get away with another scam and move on to the next. It's not about my money at this point, simply hoping that he'll get what he deserves.

I filed a report for buyer abusing buyer protection on eBay yesterday. Maybe they'll actually look into it. I may contact the other sellers to see if they had issues. I know one did.
 
[quote name='GBAstar'] I have outsmarted scammers in situations like this by responding to the effect of:

"Dear buyer, I'm very sorry you are having a problem with the code/DLC. I will contact Microsoft/Steam/EA/Origin and give them the information to see if and when it was redeemed or why it is invalid"

Typically I would get a response a few minutes later saying that they must of incorrectly entered the code because now it's working [/QUOTE]


I like this idea. Maybe you should try tricking the scammer by saying you are on the phone with Microsoft and that they are looking to see what day/time it was redeemed. It might scare him off.
 
I looked up his feedback profile. More importantly his feedback left for others. He's only left feedback for 2 items which were both MSP/XBL codes. He left feedback for the 1600 MSP saying "First code didn't work, so he gave me another, no questions asked! Good seller!" Too much of a coincidence really.
 
[quote name='btw1217']It was for a 3 month code and is really of no substantial loss for me. I have an issues with injustice though and would rather waste my entire weekend fighting this that to let him get away with another scam and move on to the next. It's not about my money at this point, simply hoping that he'll get what he deserves.

I filed a report for buyer abusing buyer protection on eBay yesterday. Maybe they'll actually look into it. I may contact the other sellers to see if they had issues. I know one did.[/QUOTE]

I 100% agree with you--Don't give in! But don't stress either. If it is any consolation if you do lose the case hopefully he will either get booted from eBay, lose his ability to file claims with PayPal or both.

I'll give eBay a little bit of credit because a few months ago they really did start cracking down on bad buyer behavior. They even went as far as to paying someone to make an algorithm that they can use to track habitual offenders (although no one knows what it is and it only took them 14 years to do it).

Also I have heard of buyers being notified by both PayPal and eBay that they can continue to use their services but that they will no longer have any buyer protection... I suppose that is similar to Best Buy notifying you that you can still purchase items at their store but that you will no longer have the ability to return items due to past behavior.
 
[quote name='GBAstar']I 100% agree with you--Don't give in! But don't stress either. If it is any consolation if you do lose the case hopefully he will either get booted from eBay, lose his ability to file claims with PayPal or both.

I'll give eBay a little bit of credit because a few months ago they really did start cracking down on bad buyer behavior. They even went as far as to paying someone to make an algorithm that they can use to track habitual offenders (although no one knows what it is and it only took them 14 years to do it).

Also I have heard of buyers being notified by both PayPal and eBay that they can continue to use their services but that they will no longer have any buyer protection... I suppose that is similar to Best Buy notifying you that you can still purchase items at their store but that you will no longer have the ability to return items due to past behavior.[/QUOTE]

Thanks! I'm being optimistic. I submitted a PDF of the shipping label to PayPal yesterday and noticed that the date on the dispute got pushed back. Perhaps it was a coincidence, but maybe they're waiting to see if there's a physical delivery.

Also, I've contacted the other two sellers that I can see that he's dealt with. Now I'm waiting/hoping to hear back from them. We shall see.
 
Hope you win but I doubt it. I lost a case for Halo 3 a year or so ago. Sold it to some guy in CA with delivery confirmation and signature. It showed it as delivered. Turns out the guy bought it from Canada, but he had me send it to his "house" in CA claiming he moved their a few weeks ago. Guy had over 500+ positive review, and I confirmed the new address so I went with it. He claimed he never got it. I refered paypal to the confirmation number ect ect. No go he still won. This battle went on for days, me even talking to ebay and paypal.

Evidently if you buy a product from Address A, then email the seller and ask for it to be sent to Address B, and the seller sends it to Address B, delivery confirmation/signature means nothing. You will auto lose. Dont know if it fixed it.

Also, the guy had his gamertag in his ebay profile. I even looked online and he was playing it since the day he received it. I sent all of that to paypal as well, and still nothing.

Although I did get him in trouble through Microsoft who banned his account (I befriended him on xbox live without him knowing who I actually was.) At least I got some sort of justice.

Good luck.
 
Nice...

I just recently had a buyer try to open an item not as described case on a no refund item. I sent him a gameboy with sound issues clearly described in the description. That was the ONLY issue. When he received it he opens a case and says that one of the buttons dont work...which is BS because I tested it with a game (twice) and it worked flawlessly (except for the sound which I noted). I think it was that he did not fully read the description and did not know about the sound issue before getting the gameboy...which was his fault for not reading the full description that I took my precious time to write out.

So anyway, he opens a case and I get a message saying the A button does not work unless you are mashing it, which I KNOW is BS. I tell him to mail it back to me and as soon as I receive the gameboy in the mail and (a) verify it is the same Gameboy, and (b) verify the issue, I will give him a full refund. He messages me back saying that basically Im a piece of shit for not just refunding him and letting him keep the item, then tells me he took it apart and fixed it himself (which requires special tools to do)...

At this point I know its a scam so I tell him to either ship it back to me or to go fuck yourself. Next thing I know the case is dropped and I get a neutral feedback from him saying that I sent him an item not as described and he had to fix it. I repair other tyes of consoles and I dont even have the special screwdriver necessary to open a gameboy because gameboys rarely ever fuck up, and if they do its usually the sound or the screen.

Aynway, that is my latest story. Feels like a partial victory 'cuz I didnt have to refund that prick, didnt have to deal with a case, but instead got a worthless neutral feedback (which I reported the buyer to eBay for leaving me).

I can usually avoid scammers by not selling 1-time-use items, and by taking LOTS of pictures of my items and fully describing them. The fact that I had close-ups of the serial number on the back and all the identifying marks on the Gameboy may have saved my ass this time. Screw you eBay piss-ant scammers.
 
[quote name='Kevbo887']Hope you win but I doubt it. I lost a case for Halo 3 a year or so ago. Sold it to some guy in CA with delivery confirmation and signature. It showed it as delivered. Turns out the guy bought it from Canada, but he had me send it to his "house" in CA claiming he moved their a few weeks ago. Guy had over 500+ positive review, and I confirmed the new address so I went with it. He claimed he never got it. I refered paypal to the confirmation number ect ect. No go he still won. This battle went on for days, me even talking to ebay and paypal.

Evidently if you buy a product from Address A, then email the seller and ask for it to be sent to Address B, and the seller sends it to Address B, delivery confirmation/signature means nothing. You will auto lose. Dont know if it fixed it.

Also, the guy had his gamertag in his ebay profile. I even looked online and he was playing it since the day he received it. I sent all of that to paypal as well, and still nothing.

Although I did get him in trouble through Microsoft who banned his account (I befriended him on xbox live without him knowing who I actually was.) At least I got some sort of justice.

Good luck.[/QUOTE]

Haha that's pretty awesome xD Nice job.
 
[quote name='Kevbo887']Hope you win but I doubt it. I lost a case for Halo 3 a year or so ago. Sold it to some guy in CA with delivery confirmation and signature. It showed it as delivered. Turns out the guy bought it from Canada, but he had me send it to his "house" in CA claiming he moved their a few weeks ago. Guy had over 500+ positive review, and I confirmed the new address so I went with it. He claimed he never got it. I refered paypal to the confirmation number ect ect. No go he still won. This battle went on for days, me even talking to ebay and paypal.

Evidently if you buy a product from Address A, then email the seller and ask for it to be sent to Address B, and the seller sends it to Address B, delivery confirmation/signature means nothing. You will auto lose. Dont know if it fixed it.

Also, the guy had his gamertag in his ebay profile. I even looked online and he was playing it since the day he received it. I sent all of that to paypal as well, and still nothing.

Although I did get him in trouble through Microsoft who banned his account (I befriended him on xbox live without him knowing who I actually was.) At least I got some sort of justice.

Good luck.[/QUOTE]


Yeah hopefully that's a lesson learned. 100% of the time you will lose a INR (Item Not Received) or an unauthorized use chargeback if you mail the item to ANY address OTHER then what is on the PayPal invoice.

To have seller protection against a INR case you must be able to show delivery (by means of DC if the item is $249.99 or less or Signature Confirmation if it is $250 or more [including shipping]) to the address / zip code on the PayPal invoice.

For an unauthorized use chargeback you just need to show proof of shipment (proof of delivery is nice but not needed) and it has to be to the address on the invoice as well.
 
[quote name='RedRingOfDeath']
I can usually avoid scammers by not selling 1-time-use items, and by taking LOTS of pictures of my items and fully describing them. The fact that I had close-ups of the serial number on the back and all the identifying marks on the Gameboy may have saved my ass this time. Screw you eBay piss-ant scammers.[/QUOTE]

If an item has a Serial Number I always make note of that on the PP invoice I keep for my records (I also staple the shipping label receipt to that invoice as well---they can come in handy for disputes).

That way if a buyer has a problem with an item and I'm forced to accept a return I can always inform the buyer I'll issue a refund as long as I receive the same item and according to my records it is the PS3/PSP/Xbox 360 etc. with serial number xxxxxxxxxxxxx.

That will stop most common scammers unless they are good enough to swap out the guts. If they continue to return something with a different serial number then you can open a police report and report the buyer for mail fraud. Once you receive a case number from either report you can upload that into the eBay or PayPal dispute and you should receive a refund---even if it is from PayPal/eBay instead of the buyer.

Fortunately I have never been in that position but that is pretty much standard procedure if you want to get your money back.
 
Another good way to defeat scammers, at least on stuff you can open prior to shipping like used items, or computer stuff like motherboards and whatnot...is you can use a small brush and a little paint and with the tip of the brush put a random splotch of paint on the item in a discreet area that either does not matter if it has paint on it, or that the buyer will never see. Then take a super zoomed in, close up shot of it to capture the "unique-ness" (as well as a panned out shot to show the exact location of the mark). That way if they pull shit you have picture of the unique marking you placed on the item. If the item you get back either does not have the unique marking, has the marking in the wrong spot, or the marking is in the right spot but it is not the same mark (it is a forgery to commit return fraud), you know they are full of shit and you have proof that they in-fact swapped parts or items on you.

Usually just advising the buyer that you have done this and the item will be checked to ensure that it is the same item that was shipped out will be enough to stop most scammers. I do this in addition to taking pics of all the serial numbers whenever I can. It has saved my ass a couple times.

If it does not scare the buyer from proceeding with an illegitimate case, it will ensure that they are not committing return fraud.
 
[quote name='DerekVinyard']I looked up his feedback profile. More importantly his feedback left for others. He's only left feedback for 2 items which were both MSP/XBL codes. He left feedback for the 1600 MSP saying "First code didn't work, so he gave me another, no questions asked! Good seller!" Too much of a coincidence really.[/QUOTE]
He got a taste and now he just can't stop.

It's one thing to rip off a faceless corporation (part of a larger point -> )... but to rip off individual users on eBay..? Disgusting.
 
UPDATE! I received a response from one of the other sellers he has dealt with. I have saved the full eBay message as a PDF and added it to the PayPal dispute.

Here was the response:

Dear ticketusmaximus,

Hello! yes.after bought,He open claim "It was given to me via E-Mail, when it should have been delivered via my address. I checked the rules, and it even says that electronic goods cannot be sold on eBay" This was stupid reason.So I response "He asked "send by e-mail" (Sent Date: Dec-23-12 00:45:28 PST) Dear gaogaokytoh, "Hello! It being Christmas, I was wondering if there is anyway you can send me the codes via my E-Mail Address? I am going to be at my family members house, and am going to need it then and there. Thanks for a speedy reply! " - usmc_products So Why seller claim this??" and eBay has decided to refund the buyer.This is not fair also,However I didnot refund.So I "Report this buyer" as use Buyer protection.(you can find your feedback site,This is new option)You should be record also.If many same case happened, ebay can suspend him. and I met one more same kind buyer(more terriable,tricky)ID: genovese9797 I sold XBOX live 12 month Card,and sent code by e-mail.and He told "Used already" This was totally brand new.But ebay decided"Full refund" even I bought ebay store.and He left negative.I lost $49,and feedback.later I found out his trick.He bought another seller cheaper one same time.Depend on ebay resolution center.80% not fair for seller.So Please careful this buyer also.

- gaogaokytoh
 
Last edited by a moderator:
[quote name='btw1217']His username is usmc_products

My favorite part is where he kindly asked me to send him the code through eBay messages, and then once the PayPal claim was filed, told PayPal that it was against eBay ToS since 2008 to send codes through messages.[/QUOTE]

I added him to my block list. I like selling DLC over eBay, and I would prefer to avoid your situation.
I wonder if there's a public 'blocked buyers list' out there...
 
[quote name='GBAstar']Yeah hopefully that's a lesson learned. 100% of the time you will lose a INR (Item Not Received) or an unauthorized use chargeback if you mail the item to ANY address OTHER then what is on the PayPal invoice.

To have seller protection against a INR case you must be able to show delivery (by means of DC if the item is $249.99 or less or Signature Confirmation if it is $250 or more [including shipping]) to the address / zip code on the PayPal invoice.

For an unauthorized use chargeback you just need to show proof of shipment (proof of delivery is nice but not needed) and it has to be to the address on the invoice as well.[/QUOTE]


Yup. Sure was. Im not sure if I explained myself clearly enough or not (was half asleep) The guy changed his paypal address after he paid, and before I shipped. Then emailed me. After I had shipped, he changed his address back. Sorry for the confusion.

Either way, he lost more getting banned on xbox than he spent on halo 3, but still aggravating none the less. I refuse to do auctions on ebay now. Buy it now only with immediate payment. Biggest reason I stopped auctions was because of people not paying. People can bid on 10 of the same items, all ending near each other, and choose which one they get lowest. Nothing us as a buyer can do incept for send a second chance offer (which rarely works because usually 24 hrs goes by.) Ive had this happen to me my last 20 auctions. All of them I had to relist 2-3 times. All buyers were 50+ in positive reviews. Disgusting what Ebay has turned into.
 
I wish you luck with your case. I did however, lose one case, but I'm glad we have a great forums such as CAG, which made my life so much easier than to deal with eBay.
 
I have had problems with buying cards from Target.com , where the card simply was never activated to begin with. If you let those cards sit forever, and never verify that they are actively working, you probably are at fault for it. It's sad but true, I had to wait a few days for target.com to get my card to work which was a year card, but in the end glad it was resolved.

Typically you can type the code into Xbox Live before you sell a card, take a screenshot (with a capture device, or a camera, or a phone) and maybe even while taking the picture put the card in view with the code on the card to show as proof when you email the code, so no one can scam you out of money. But do verify your codes before you sell them to someone, because assuming is not the right thing to do. He very well may be scamming people but do as I suggested and scammers shouldn't use you as a target anymore.
 
bread's done
Back
Top