2009-2010 NBA Thread

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[quote name='lordopus99']explain.[/QUOTE]

So, having another superstar in Antawn Jamison, a solid PG in Mo Williams and 2 pretty good big guys in Shaq and Illgauskas isn't enough for LBJ to win a title? He needs more superstars around him. What a joke. They get Antawn for free and add Shaq yet they still can't get to the finals. I love how every moron says "He needs a better supporting cast!". Didn't the Cavs finish with the best record in the NBA and the FAVORITE to win the title? How in the hell do you accomplish that with a lousy supporting cast? Now people want to say, "Well Kobe wouldn't have won shit without Shaq and Gasol!" Guess what? Neither Shaq or Gasol would have rings right now w/o Kobe. Shaq also needed Wade in Miami to win won. Why? Because it takes a team to win a title not an individual. The Cavs had the team to win it all they just didn't execute or step up their game like the good teams do this time of the year. But hey, let's give LBJ 3 or 4 more superstars so he can win a title because apparently that's what he needs.

Pau, Odom and Bynum are not all-stars. There is only one star on the Lakers and that's Kobe. Pau is overrated, imo. He's a ghost out there when it comes to playing defense....the opposing team can run lay-up drills all day on that guy. Odom? He's on one night, off the next two...the guy has no consistency. Bynum? He can't stay healthy long enough to prove what he can do. I'd much rather have Antawn Jamison and Mo Williams than Derek Fisher and Pau Gasol.
 
Yep, not many people realize that Kobe is scoring 30+ p/game in the play-offs with a broken finger on his shooting hand. LBJ would probably be out for the play-offs with that injury.
 
Agree with Setzer on all accounts, except some stuff about Pau, he can be good defensively. Other than that though as you were saying it seems every year the Cavs got someone new, had a great regular season and then somehow everyone says its always just LeBron showing up in the playoffs. I'm not going to say LeBron will never win a title because I'm sure he will eventually but there's something to be said when you add players like that and it doesn't really amount to anything past the conference semis.
 
Kobe's finger is still broken? I know its still taped, but I thought it had healed. Or did it need a cast and, since he's still playing, it hasn't gotten one yet?
 
[quote name='Setzer']So, having another superstar in Antawn Jamison, a solid PG in Mo Williams and 2 pretty good big guys in Shaq and Illgauskas isn't enough for LBJ to win a title? He needs more superstars around him. What a joke. They get Antawn for free and add Shaq yet they still can't get to the finals. I love how every moron says "He needs a better supporting cast!". Didn't the Cavs finish with the best record in the NBA and the FAVORITE to win the title? How in the hell do you accomplish that with a lousy supporting cast? Now people want to say, "Well Kobe wouldn't have won shit without Shaq and Gasol!" Guess what? Neither Shaq or Gasol would have rings right now w/o Kobe. Shaq also needed Wade in Miami to win won. Why? Because it takes a team to win a title not an individual. The Cavs had the team to win it all they just didn't execute or step up their game like the good teams do this time of the year. But hey, let's give LBJ 3 or 4 more superstars so he can win a title because apparently that's what he needs.

Pau, Odom and Bynum are not all-stars. There is only one star on the Lakers and that's Kobe. Pau is overrated, imo. He's a ghost out there when it comes to playing defense....the opposing team can run lay-up drills all day on that guy. Odom? He's on one night, off the next two...the guy has no consistency. Bynum? He can't stay healthy long enough to prove what he can do. I'd much rather have Antawn Jamison and Mo Williams than Derek Fisher and Pau Gasol.[/QUOTE]


You are joking right? Seriously, you must be joking? Jamison is a superstar now? Guy is a hasbeen who has never made it out of the second round. That is not a superstar. Jamison was the superstar on the 2009 Wizards that won 19 games? That's a real superstar. He has made the playoffs I believe 7 or 8 times in his career. 4-5 of those were first round losses and the other two/three were second round loses. Some Superstar! Guy is also going to be 35 next season. HASBEEN.

Shaq and Z Train are pretty good big men? Ummmmmmm WHAT? Shaq is a broken down freight train who can no longer go. Guy had to take almost half the season off just to make the playoffs and is 37 years old. All of his points were garbage points off of dunks. Z Train is another broken down Center who is going to be 35 this summer.


Mo Williams is a pretty good pg? Can you say overrated? His ast/to ratio is about 2 to 1. He makes wide open shots because of Lebron. Williams is feast or famine and has never stood up to be the clear #2 behind Lebron. A ton of guys in the league can shoot 40 percent plus behind the arc making wide open threes because of Lebron.

Cavs never had the team to win it all. It's Lebron with a bunch of jokes and ok role players.


Pau Gasol lead some pretty crappy teams in Memphis to the playoffs 3 years in a row. His #2 was either Mike Miller, Bobby Jackson or James Posey. Guy also averages 20 points, 11 rebounds a game and is 7 foot tall.

Odom isn't a superstar but he is 6'10 and puts up a double double every game points/rebounds and plays some defense.

Ron Artest is a crazy idiot but he can score when needed and plays great defense.

Bynum is a 22 year old center who is 7 foot tall and puts up 15 points 10 rebounds a game.


Kobe has young tall talent around him who are all under 30. Lebron has old dinosaurs around him. Huge difference.



Oooooo and there is a reason why the Cavs win 60 games a year or so. They have Lebron and a couple of other "ok" players for an 82 game season. During the season they get to play the Knicks, Clippers, Nets, T Wolves, Wizards, Pistons, Kings, Warriors and Pacers of the world. A team with a superstar an OK talent is going to win 55-60 games. Lakers only won 57 games this year to the Cavs 61. Why? Because the Lakers played in a conference that had eight 50 win teams. The Celtics would have been the #9 seed in the Western Conference.

Now put the Cavs with their crappy support system and even worse of a head coach in a playoff series with a competitive team. What is going to happen when the other teams coach gets to use strategy, coaching and is able to prepare his team for 4-7 games against the Cavs? Instead of facing them one game here and there during the regular season which includes teams having different schedules, rest, travel, etc. Well the thing that happened is what happened between the Celtics and Cavs. It's what Happened last year between the Cavs and Magic and the Spurs and Cavs in 2007.
 
[quote name='jlarlee']Not too mention Kobe playing with a rash of injuries and LBJ going to shit once he got one chink in his armor[/QUOTE]
The Cavs had no chance in that series because LeBron quit. His supporting cast never even came into play.
 
[quote name='dafoomie']The Cavs had no chance in that series because LeBron quit. His supporting cast never even came into play.[/QUOTE]


But Antawn who normally plays on 20 win teams is a Superstar and Shaq and Z Train are still good. And Mo Williams is a superstar in the making.
 
[quote name='advanced']Kobe's finger is still broken? I know its still taped, but I thought it had healed. Or did it need a cast and, since he's still playing, it hasn't gotten one yet?[/QUOTE]

If by "healed" you mean "became arthritic," then yes. He's actually compounded the injury by not having it fixed.
 
[quote name='wildcpac']
Oooooo and there is a reason why the Cavs win 60 games a year or so. They have Lebron and a couple of other "ok" players for an 82 game season.[/QUOTE]
You are joking right? Seriously, you must be joking?
 
[quote name='Setzer']You are joking right? Seriously, you must be joking?[/QUOTE]


Great retort. I guess I was expecting too much from someone who called Antawn a superstar and Shaq still good.
 
[quote name='wildcpac']Cavs never had the team to win it all. It's Lebron with a bunch of jokes and ok role players.[/QUOTE]

BS! You don't dominate the regular season with a crappy team. They were 23-7 vs. the WC to boot.

[quote name='wildcpac']Pau Gasol lead some pretty crappy teams in Memphis to the playoffs 3 years in a row. His #2 was either Mike Miller, Bobby Jackson or James Posey. Guy also averages 20 points, 11 rebounds a game and is 7 foot tall.[/QUOTE]
Ok, I guess you can say the same exact thing about Antawn Jamison. And at the end of the day I'll take Jamison over Gasol.

[quote name='wildcpac']Odom isn't a superstar but he is 6'10 and puts up a double double every game points/rebounds and plays some defense.[/QUOTE]
Are you fucking crazy or just delusional? Do you watch Lakers games? LO does NOT put up a double double EVERY game. The guy shows up one night and then disappears the next, sometimes the next 2 or 3.

[quote name='wildcpac']Ron Artest is a crazy idiot but he can score when needed and plays great defense.[/QUOTE]
Plays good defense and that's about it.

[quote name='wildcpac']Bynum is a 22 year old center who is 7 foot tall and puts up 15 points 10 rebounds a game.[/QUOTE]
Nope. He's almost as bad as LO, you don't know what you're going to get from him game to game. Plus, he can't even stay healthy. Shaq at 38 is probably more reliable than Bynum is. Hell, even Illgauskas is.


[quote name='wildcpac']Kobe has young tall talent around him who are all under 30. Lebron has old dinosaurs around him. Huge difference.[/QUOTE]
Couldn't be any further from the truth. Not a huge difference. I would say Kobe's supporting cast compared to Lebron is just about equal. It's just Kobe is the better player.
 
[quote name='wildcpac']Great retort. I guess I was expecting too much from someone who called Antawn a superstar and Shaq still good.[/QUOTE]
You just rambled on with BS. How do I reply to that? :lol:
 
The biggest problem I see is Lebron's supporting cast just isn't well put together. Shaq was little help as he's old and should have retired years ago. Jameson just doesn't fit what they need as he didn't mesh well in an offense with James.

The Cavs have a solid team around James for sure--as the regular season record shows. But when it boils down to it, that supporting cast isn't going to beat the Celtics, Magic or Lakers unless James goes crazy all series as those three teams have better supporting casts around Pierce, Howard and Kobe respectively.

The Cavs supporting cast isn't going to outplay (Allen, Garnett, Rondo, Perkins, Davis, Wallace) or (Nelson, Carter, Lewis, Pietrus, Reddick, Gortat) or (Gasol, Odom, Fisher, Bynum, Brown, etc.) often enough to win a seven game series.
 
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wildcpac hits it right on the noggin.

[quote name='setzer']Pau, Odom and Bynum are not all-stars[/QUOTE]
Please do some research. Pau has been an All-Star for the past two seasons. In addition to 2006.

[quote name='setzer']Odom? He's on one night, off the next two...[/QUOTE]
How about your boy Mo Williams... He is streakier than Odom. He is easily the number 2-3 in Cleveland and he doesn't out perform Odom who is 4-5 choice in LA (behind Kobe, Pau, Bynum). Remember he comes off the bench as well.

Fun Fact:
Odom (during Suns series) - Average 48% shooting, almost 10 boards a game (not including his 19 boards performance)
Williams (during Celtics series) - Average 40.9% shooting
:roll:

This doesn't include the fact that it is hard for most people to guard Lamar Odom. He is a 6'10 mismatch for most players. You put a SF on him and he can easily shoot over you. You put a PF on him and he will easily drive on you since he is quicker. Mo Williams can't do that hence why Rondo owned him the whole series.

[quote name='setzer']Bynum? He can't stay healthy long enough to prove what he can do. [/QUOTE]
Just like Shaq. huh?
Bynum averages 15 pts, 8.3 rebounds when healthy. (65 games this year)
Shaq averages 12 pts, 6.7 rebounds when healthy. (53 games this year)
Again, you rather have Shaq... :roll:

Now onto Antawn Jamison...
I grew up watching him at UNC and thought he was good. That was back in the 90s... he is now 34 and each year his production has regressed i.e. he is getting old and not playing at the same level. Guess you haven't seen at all this season :applause:

08-09 Wiz - 22.2 pts, 8.9 boards
Cleveland - 15.8 pts, 7.7 boards

Pau Gasol averages 18.3 pts, 11.3 boards
Again, you rather have Jamison over Gasol :roll:

[quote name='setzer']Didn't the Cavs finish with the best record in the NBA and the FAVORITE to win the title? [/QUOTE]
Analyst also didn't think the Celtics had enough muster to get through both the Cavs as well as the Magic (no analyst picked them in either win). Favorites mean nothing... ask the BCS.

[quote name='setzer']Neither Shaq or Gasol would have rings right now w/o Kobe. Shaq also needed Wade in Miami to win won[/QUOTE]
Actually yes. Shaq won one in Miami and he almost won a couple in Orlando. Remember he was still in his prime in those days. No one could guard him one on one. Now since he has his lingering toe injury he has been done for years. He should have retired when he left Miami. I hope you wouldn't think Penny Hardaway is a Kobe/Wade talent.

On your second comment, what has Wade done now that Shaq is gone. Went from Eastern Conference Finals competitors to barely making playoffs.

[quote name='setzer']Yep, not many people realize that Kobe is scoring 30+ p/game in the play-offs with a broken finger on his shooting hand. LBJ would probably be out for the play-offs with that injury. [/QUOTE]
Lebron played with a strained elbow on his shooting hand. He still played all his games during the playoffs with it (not out). He averaged 29 pts this playoffs. Kobe averaged the same amount of points 29 during the playoffs. Fun Fact: Lebron had two triple doubles this playoffs and almost had a third.

Kobe on the season - 27 pts, 5.4 boards, 5.0 assists
Lebron on the season - 29.7 pts, 7.3 boards, 8.6 assists

And he did it will overrated players (Williams and West) and hasbeens (Jamison and Shaq). I hope he leaves so you can see how devestated the Cavs organization really will be. To go from #1 in Eastern Conference to looking on the outside of the playoffs from losing one player... it would be a sight to be seen.

[quote name='setzer']Are you ing crazy or just delusional? Do you watch Lakers games? LO does NOT put up a double double EVERY game. The guy shows up one night and then disappears the next, sometimes the next 2 or 3.
[/QUOTE]
No do you watch Lakers game... Lamar Odom on the season averages 10.8 pts, 9.8 rebounds... that is pretty much a double double every game.
 
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[quote name='Setzer']BS! You don't dominate the regular season with a crappy team. They were 23-7 vs. the WC to boot.


Ok, I guess you can say the same exact thing about Antawn Jamison. And at the end of the day I'll take Jamison over Gasol.


Are you fucking crazy or just delusional? Do you watch Lakers games? LO does NOT put up a double double EVERY game. The guy shows up one night and then disappears the next, sometimes the next 2 or 3.


Plays good defense and that's about it.


Nope. He's almost as bad as LO, you don't know what you're going to get from him game to game. Plus, he can't even stay healthy. Shaq at 38 is probably more reliable than Bynum is. Hell, even Illgauskas is.



Couldn't be any further from the truth. Not a huge difference. I would say Kobe's supporting cast compared to Lebron is just about equal. It's just Kobe is the better player.[/QUOTE]


1. I said Lebron had some has beens and a couple of "ok players" on the team. Lebron is a top 5 player in the league. Wade, Lebron and Kobe are so far ahead of everybody else. It's easy for a team with a top tier player to dominate in the regular season. Even against a western team. You have teams playing the first night or the second night of a back to back. You have teams playings in 4 different cities in 1 weeks time. Opposing head coaches cant implement game plans game to game against certain teams because they only face them a couple of times per year. The regular season and playoffs are two different animals. Playoffs have two teams, with the same exact schedule, same rest time, same travel, etc etc etc and the opposing coach can make alterations after a game that can play a huge impact on the next game.


Jamison did jack shit in his 5 years in Golden State. Jamison lost in the first round with the Mavs in 04 on a team that had Dirk, Howard, Finley and Nash. Jamison goes to Washington and loses in the first round every year on a team that had Gilbert Arenas averaging almost 30 points a game and Caron Butler or Larry Hughes putting up 20 a game. Jamison is nowhere close to being a "superstar".

Pau Gasol took crappy Memphis teams that were coached great by Hubie Brown and then Fratello to the playoffs several years in a row in a tough as nails Western Conference. Gasol had the Bobby Jacksons, Posey and Mike Miller's of the world as his teammates.


Lamar Odom averaged 10.8 ppg and 9.8 rpg for the regular season. His career average is 14.6 ppg and 8.9 rpg. His rpg has gone up almost 3 compared to when he first played with the Clippers. He is averaging 10.5 ppg and 9.5 rpg for this year playoffs.

I said Artest scores when needed and plays great defense. Artest shoots .35 behind the arc for his career and 42 fg. Artest from 2003-2009 averaged over 17 ppg in his career for each season. Guy can score when needed.

Is Andrew Bynum Mr Glass? Maybe but he is still one of the top 2 young centers in the game. Lopez of the Nets is the other and Bynum is only 22 years old. I hate to break it to you, but Shaq for his career missed a ton of games. Shaq missed 30 games as a 23 year old and as a 24 year old. Shaq missed 20 games as a 25 year old. So from the ages of 23-25, Shaq missed a full season worth of games. In the last 9 seasons, Shaq has only played more than 70 games 2 different seasons.

Z Train? He missed 45 games in 1999 as a 23 year old. Which was almost the whole season (50 games). He missed the whole 99-2000 season as a 24 year old. He missed 60 games in 2000-2001 and 20 games in 2001-2002 by the time he was 26. Why did he miss so many games? Injuries.


Kobe and Lebron have equal talent? What GM's in the league do you think would trade Bynum, Artest, Odom, Gasol for Shaq, Z Train, Mo Williams and Antawn straight up? I can only thing of one gm who would do it. His name is Danny Ferry.
 
Andrew Bynum is overrated. He is SOFT. He will always be SOFT. His enthusiasm for the game reminds me of Kwame Brown (although he is a hell of a lot more talented than that waste of a first pick). I'm sorry Andrew Bynum is not one of the top young centers in the game. Horford, Lopez brothers, Perkins, even Noah is better. He is one of the tallest young centers in the league, I'll give you that.
 
[quote name='lordopus99']Actually yes. Shaq won one in Miami and he almost won a couple in Orlando. [/QUOTE]

Almost won a couple? How does him getting to the Finals once and promptly getting swept translate into him "almost winning a couple"?

Are Karl Malone and John Stockton's two "almost" rings each worth more than Shaq's couple?
 
Hey LordOpus, Jamison's stats were 18.7 PPG and 8.4 RPG. He is also only 33. Of course his production is going to drop when moving to a new system (one that fit his game that well in the first place). Lebron can't get it done in crunch time and Kobe is the better player. The goal is to win rings right, not just win MVPs? Lebron has no rings and hasn't even been close.
 
Well the Magic in 1995 almost won game 1 of the Finals before Nick Anderson decided to miss some free throws. Could have been a whole different series. Cant really Blame Shaq for losing to a better Hakeem and Drexler was possessed to get that title in 1995.

1996 Magic won 60 games and lost to one of the best teams of all time in the 1996 Bulls in the Eastern Conference Finals. 96 Bulls went 72-10 in the regular season.

To say Shaq couldn't get it done without Lebron or Wade is kind of Silly. Guy lost to one of the top 5 centers in his prime while Shaq was still a baby and lost to one of the greatest teams of all time.
 
[quote name='FrankySox'] Lebron can't get it done in crunch time and Kobe is the better player. The goal is to win rings right, not just win MVPs? Lebron has no rings and hasn't even been close.[/QUOTE]

Lebron, in the right system, will get a ring.

As for crunch time...
Exhibit A:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3fD1MNjkPFs
Some more for you.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_L9RwQ1jiU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NohZ...=5723849E93396838&playnext_from=PL&playnext=2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0C52RQ4z-so&feature=related

I could on if you want me to :lol:
Are you sure you don't want to retract your statement that he can't get it done in crunch time??

[quote name='antlp89']I'm sorry Andrew Bynum is not one of the top young centers in the game. Horford, Lopez brothers, Perkins, even Noah is better.[/QUOTE]
I'll give you Brook Lopez. But the rest... :roll:
Horford - great offensively but undersized (see Magic sweep)
Robin Lopez - alright; maybe better if he moved teams
Noah - great defender; thats it
Perkins - big and takes up space; offensively limited to dunks

Bynum, on the other hand for being so injury prone, has a good offensive game and defensive game.

You forgot Dwight Howard and Al Jefferson who are both better than all you listed.
 
I will say Gasol is better than anybody LBJ has but their supporting casts are not wildly different in talent. I don't care what the stats say LBJ was not right in the series against the celtics. Whether it was his elbow or his mom skanking it up with face herpes Delonte West I dunno, but he didn't strike the fear into me as a C's fan that he did in 2008
 
[quote name='wildcpac']But Antawn who normally plays on 20 win teams is a Superstar and Shaq and Z Train are still good. And Mo Williams is a superstar in the making.[/QUOTE]
Wouldn't have mattered if he had Kobe's supporting cast or D-Wade's supporting cast. LeBron quit, he packed it in. Delonte West fucked his mother and he wanted no part of the Cavs after that. He will never resign with Cleveland now.

I'll say this about Kobe, if a teammate fucked his mother, he'd probably go rape their sister and drop 50 points the next game.
 
[quote name='dafoomie']
I'll say this about Kobe, if a teammate fucked his mother, he'd probably go rape their sister and drop 50 points the next game.[/QUOTE]

:lol:
 
[quote name='dafoomie']Wouldn't have mattered if he had Kobe's supporting cast or D-Wade's supporting cast. LeBron quit, he packed it in. Delonte West fucked his mother and he wanted no part of the Cavs after that. He will never resign with Cleveland now.

I'll say this about Kobe, if a teammate fucked his mother, he'd Give their sister The Trinity and drop 50 points the next game.[/QUOTE] Fixed :lol:
 
[quote name='dafoomie']
I'll say this about Kobe, if a teammate fucked his mother, he'd probably go rape their sister and drop 50 points the next game.[/QUOTE]

This is the single best sentence in this entire thread. I don't know how we go on after that :lol:
 
[quote name='wildcpac']Well the Magic in 1995 almost won game 1 of the Finals before Nick Anderson decided to miss some free throws. Could have been a whole different series. Cant really Blame Shaq for losing to a better Hakeem and Drexler was possessed to get that title in 1995.

1996 Magic won 60 games and lost to one of the best teams of all time in the 1996 Bulls in the Eastern Conference Finals. 96 Bulls went 72-10 in the regular season.

To say Shaq couldn't get it done without Lebron or Wade is kind of Silly. Guy lost to one of the top 5 centers in his prime while Shaq was still a baby and lost to one of the greatest teams of all time.[/QUOTE]

How quickly people forget how good Penny was before the leg injury. Shaq has always had a great sidekick to get him his.
 
[quote name='dafoomie']Wouldn't have mattered if he had Kobe's supporting cast or D-Wade's supporting cast. LeBron quit, he packed it in. Delonte West fucked his mother and he wanted no part of the Cavs after that. He will never resign with Cleveland now.

I'll say this about Kobe, if a teammate fucked his mother, he'd probably go rape their sister and drop 50 points the next game.[/QUOTE]
Whoa whoa whoa. Where have I been? Is this true??
 
[quote name='CaseyRyback']How quickly people forget how good Penny was before the leg injury. Shaq has always had a great sidekick to get him his.[/QUOTE]

Penny was 22/23 years old in 1995/1996. I wasn't discrediting either one of them. Penny was one of the better pg's in the league. Only thing though is when has two great young players combined to win a championship before of the age of 25? It really has never happened. Magic lost to two HOF's in their end of their Prime but still Prime in the NBA Finals (Hakeem and Clyde). Magic the next year lost to the best single season team of all time in the 1996 Bulls.
 
[quote name='wildcpac']Well the Magic in 1995 almost won game 1 of the Finals before Nick Anderson decided to miss some free throws. Could have been a whole different series. Cant really Blame Shaq for losing to a better Hakeem and Drexler was possessed to get that title in 1995.[/QUOTE]Game 1 of the finals in 1995 - Magic were up on the Rockets by 20 for most of the night. Rockets had to battle back . . . Kenny Smith hit seven 3 pointers (NBA Finals record setting) to get them a chance to win, aided by Nick (the Brick) Anderson missing 4 consecutive free throws at the end of regulation.

That Rockets team was the first 6th seed to win a championship, the first championship team that defeated four 50+ win teams to earn the title (three of them were 60+ win teams), and won a record 9 road games in the playoffs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKir54uGiWA

Sorry, I'm a Rockets fan, felt like reliving some past glory. ;)
 
Nothing, nobody outside of LA and Boston cares about Lakers/Celtics Part 100000000. All I care about is the season ending so Lebron can join the Knicks. Lakers/Celtics 1000000000 is going to be as watchable and desirable as Rocky 5 and Superman 4.
 
This thread should be dead until the free agency market starts going.

I mean... really... does anyone actually care about watching the Celtics/Lakers... not me.
 
:rofl:



The Free Agents Secret Society is the only thing to talk about now. I heard that Amare now wants a piece of the action.

I do find it strange that Joe Johnson is part of this team. He hasnt been a superstar for years...he barely even hits the star level most nights. He is the Aquaman of this team.
 
I dunno what you guys are talking about, the Lakers/Celtics game is going to be epic to watch. Y'ALL just jealous, WHATEVA WHATEVA.
 
[quote name='mis0']I dunno what you guys are talking about, the Lakers/Celtics game is going to be epic to watch. Y'ALL just jealous, WHATEVA WHATEVA.[/QUOTE]


yea maybe if your a lakers or celtics fans. but the rest of us are tired of this same recycled BS espically since both these teams have been gifted all their major pieces. (gasol, KG, allen)
 
I honestly don't care about either. I pretty much don't watch sports unless my team is in it. Too much to do, too little time to watch sports I don't have a rooting interest in.

Free agency I don't care that much either. The Magic are pretty much stuck with their roster and aren't a player for any big free agents, so all I care about there is seeing where the big guys land when all is said and done, and how that affects the Magic's path to the championship.

Could make it tougher if a couple of them end up together on a contender. Could make it easier if they land in separate places on teams a few years away from contending--i.e. if Lebron goes to the Nets, Wade stays with the Heat and Bosh ends up wherever etc.
 
The Magic. What can they do?

Nelson doesnt seem like he can carry a team. Vince actually looked decent most nights but he is old as hell. Lewis is the biggest black hole. He has the false potential because he preforms well in tight situations but not nearly consistent enough. They have nothing at the PF spot and of course you got D.Howard who is who he is.

The biggest problem with Howard is people want him to be something he is not. He wont ever be a offensive guru. He is the best at rebounding, Blocking, garbage points which is a good thing. Dont discount what he does well because you want him to be something else.

Honestly like you said you are kind of stuck. You cant get rid of Lewis or Vince, you could trade Nelson but then you would just have to replace him and you still need a solid PF that you are willing to actually play (what happen to Bass?)

Sorry Dmual...your team is stuck.
 
Yeah, it's just a matter of making tweaks like I said earlier in the thread.

Start Bass or Anderson at PF--which ever plays better in terms of banging in side and hitting short jumpers. Providng some offense at the 4 to take some pressure of Howard who will never be an offensive star as you note. That's much more valuable than starting Barnes for defensive reasons IMO.

And tweak the offense. Get away from tossing it in to Howard with his limited offense and hoping for dunks or kick outs to threes. And the pick and roll with Howard. Fine to use those, but they shouldn't be 90%+ of the offensive sets!

Magic were at their best when Nelson and Carter where attacking the rim, when they were setting screens to get shooters and slashers open etc. So the offense needs a big tweak to focus more on those things, and less on tossing it to Howard every other possession and hoping he magically turns into Patrick Ewing.
 
Since you are a magic fan, what is your view of Matt Barnes? I didnt watch enough Magic games to really notice this guy.

What kind of player is he? Defense, Offense, play maker? Also, do you think SVG will be back next year?

You know what I think will help? Getting a solid PF that can create offense on his own. That way your draw all the attention away from Howard while the PF is scoring, if he misses Howard can do what he does best and get rebounds and dunks.

Travis Outlaw is a free agent and is solid offensively. Udonus (sp) Haslem is solid..not great but can knock down jumpers and can move on the block.
 
Heh, some of you are acting as if you were old as fuck and have seen every Lakers - Celtics finals matchup. It would make sense if you were tired of them back in the 60's but this is only the second matchup since 1987. But I can honestly say if I wasn't a fan of the Lakers I wouldn't give a fuck about the finals either.
 
[quote name='Soodmeg']Since you are a magic fan, what is your view of Matt Barnes? I didnt watch enough Magic games to really notice this guy.

What kind of player is he? Defense, Offense, play maker? Also, do you think SVG will be back next year?

You know what I think will help? Getting a solid PF that can create offense on his own. That way your draw all the attention away from Howard while the PF is scoring, if he misses Howard can do what he does best and get rebounds and dunks.

Travis Outlaw is a free agent and is solid offensively. Udonus (sp) Haslem is solid..not great but can knock down jumpers and can move on the block.[/QUOTE]



Barnes is a great defender, no doubt. He can guard the other teams best player (as long as that's not a big man of course as he's not a 4 or 5). Offense he's mostly a three point shooter, though he can drive some.

He definitely should be playing--but you can't play him and Lewis at the same time IMO, as they're both 3-point threats at the SF position. One of them needs to come off the bench and let Bass or Anderson play the PF.

I lean toward Bass as when he got minutes this year he was crashing the boards, banging inside and knocking down short jumpers, while Anderson was just another player on the roster who mainly camped the 3 point line. I'd liken him to Haslem in his offensive game, he just needs minutes. Van Gundy just played Barnes too much as Van Gundy is all about defense, and there's no question that Barnes is the best defender on the roster.

And yes I think Van Gundy will be back. I have some qualms with him, but you can't ax a coach who is winning close to 60 games a year and getting to NBA finals and conference finals. He needs to win a title, but with that record you give him a few more years to keep trying barring a big set back, or losing the locker room etc.


So I'd just make the offensive tweaks I noted in my above post and go with a rotation like this.

PG--Nelson (Williams or new backup)
SG-Carter (Reddick, Pietrus)
SF-Lewis (Barnes, Anderson)
PF-Bass (Anderson, Gortat)
C- Howard (Gortat)

Start Lewis, but give Barnes decent minutes, especially if Lewis is struggling. Do a lot of offense/defense substitutions with the two late in games etc. I'd also give Reddick more minutes. He played very well this year, and it's good to keep Carter's minutes down some so he's fresher late in games.
 
[quote name='DT778']Heh, some of you are acting as if you were old as fuck and have seen every Lakers - Celtics finals matchup. It would make sense if you were tired of them back in the 60's but this is only the second matchup since 1987. But I can honestly say if I wasn't a fan of the Lakers I wouldn't give a fuck about the finals either.[/QUOTE]

I'm not that sick of the match up. I'm more sick of the Lakers as they've been in the finals a ton over the past decade. I am old enough to remember some of the Lakers-Celtics match up in the mid 80s though. I was born in '78 so I was young, but my Dad liked watching Larry Bird play so I do remember watching some of the finals matchups with the Lakers.

But in general, as I said, I just have largely given up watching sporting events my team isn't in. Other than one offs like the super bowl or other sports with one game championships like college football etc. Those I may go to a party and watch, but I wont' watch much (if any) of a seven game series if my team isn't in it.
 
Sheesh, you guys must hate basketball. I'm looking foward to the finals, see if the Celts can bring it again against the Lakers, see if Artest can get into Garnett's head, and I never get tired of see Ray Allen's beautiful shot.:)
 
I'm looking forward to this series more than any other NBA series, NFL playoff game, MLB, etc EVER! This is going to be so awesome!!! People who think this is bad for the NBA are just upset they didn't make it to the finals. I cannot wait for tipoff of game 1! I'm going crazy waiting.
 
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