2012 Election Thread

Biden looks ridiculous and unserious with all the laughing and pronounced sighs. Otherwise, he has been very strong and Ryan was tripped up when it came to explaining the workings of the Romney tax plan.
 
[quote name='dohdough']Sounds like R&R want to outlaw abortion.[/QUOTE]

Yup. And thats yet another mark against them in my opinion. It felt exceptionally weird tying it in with religious freedom. They want religious freedom, but not freedom of choice apparently...
 
I didnt watch. Did Ryan do that thing where he goes - first of all, I'm proud of my pro-life record. Something something the President sets the agenda and Romney has exemptions and so on and so forth.
 
[quote name='Dr Mario Kart']I didnt watch. Did Ryan do that thing where he goes - first of all, I'm proud of my pro-life record. Something something the President sets the agenda and Romney has exemptions and so on and so forth.[/QUOTE]

Sure did
 
Any anti abortion Supreme Court nominee would never even make it to a vote let alone get confirmed, that issue is nothing more than scaremongering.
 
[quote name='dafoomie']Any anti abortion Supreme Court nominee would never even make it to a vote let alone get confirmed, that issue is nothing more than scaremongering.[/QUOTE]

Does not change the fact that they want it.
 
A Romney victory assumes gains in both houses. In that situation, they would be much closer to confirmation.

They dont need to explicitly ban abortion either. Many states are working on effectively banning it by putting up ridiculous hurdles, which may or may not be decided Constitutional. Mississippi has exactly one clinic left in the entire state that is only still open by judicial order.

Overturning Roe wouldnt be a ban anyway. It would just return it to the states (i.e. banning it in the South).
 
[quote name='IRHari']They got Alito & Roberts and Dems couldn't get their shit together to filibuster either of those nominees. So no, dafoomie.[/QUOTE]
I must've forgotten those dark days of the vehemently pro life Bush administration where women had to get coat hanger abortions in back alleys. Oh wait, that didn't happen. The Democrats were even filibustering Bush's appeals court nominees in those days.

Roberts was confirmed with 78 votes, he was the compromise candidate. Pro lifers don't like Alito because of his track record of upholding Roe v Wade for a decade as an appellate judge. He's not an anti abortion crusader and thats why their hastily organized filibuster failed.
 
[quote name='dafoomie']This statistic that Biden keeps reciting, 98% of small businesses make less than $250k, is extremely misleading. You're including micro businesses in that number like the people who are now required to pay taxes on their ebay businesses and virtually all of them don't have any employees.[/QUOTE]


Fair enough, go ahead and define small business for the group... I'll be putting some popcorn in the nuker while I wait.
 
I'm pretty sure its not worth watching unless you really just have the free time or are deathly curious. Any good zingers or exchanges will bubble up in the news as they get around to analyzing and fact checking things.

I havent watched either debate, and I dont plan to watch any of the future ones. I'm not an undecided voter and I feel like I already know both sides' answers to a comfortable degree. There really shouldnt be a lot of mystery here.
 
[quote name='Dr Mario Kart']I'm pretty sure its not worth watching unless you really just have the free time or are deathly curious. Any good zingers or exchanges will bubble up in the news as they get around to analyzing and fact checking things.

I havent watched either debate, and I dont plan to watch any of the future ones. I'm not an undecided voter and I feel like I already know both sides' answers to a comfortable degree. There really shouldnt be a lot of mystery here.[/QUOTE]
I know what you mean...I enjoy it because I'm a huge political junkie. It's also like watching WWF.:lol:

Lots of coded language from Ryan though. You can kinda tell how he was toning down the language of his rhetoric to make it more palatable.
 
I tried to watch one of the primary debates, but I really couldnt deal with it for long. I dont expect the situation has changed. I consider myself to a be a political junkie, but I cant tolerate listening to Ryan or Romney for very long in one sitting. Hearing clips from the news is about as much as I can do.
 
[quote name='dohdough']I know what you mean...I enjoy it because I'm a huge political junkie. It's also like watching WWF.:lol:

Lots of coded language from Ryan though. You can kinda tell how he was toning down the language of his rhetoric to make it more palatable.[/QUOTE]
I love how this all comes down to a race to the middle, that's really what it is. Starting out, each candidate couldn't be more different, but by the time you get to this point it really comes down to just a few differences.
 
[quote name='Dr Mario Kart']I tried to watch one of the primary debates, but I really couldnt deal with it for long. I dont expect the situation has changed. I consider myself to a be a political junkie, but I cant tolerate listening to Ryan or Romney for very long in one sitting. Hearing clips from the news is about as much as I can do.[/QUOTE]
All they've done is lighten up the language and the messages are still the same. One thing I've noticed is that Democratic narrative and message control is A LOT tighter this particular cycle. 2 years ago, it was total shit.

This was a good warm up for me to watch Stewart vs O'Reilly, which will probably be more exciting.
 
I dont know how pundits and media people can stomach sitting through one of these things in person or in close proximity. To sit there quietly and just get flagrantly lied to from beginning to end. It has to be insulting. How do you not go Joe You Lie apeshit before storming out?
 
[quote name='Clak']I love how this all comes down to a race to the middle, that's really what it is. Starting out, each candidate couldn't be more different, but by the time you get to this point it really comes down to just a few differences.[/QUOTE]
I thought they couldn't be more different tonight, but "the middle" is dumb and by that, I mean they're stupid morons.
 
And the interviews! Most of the media know that the Romney tax plan is mathematically impossible garbage. And yet they ask for specific exemptions. They shouldnt be asking that. They should be explaining to the candidates face and all who are watching that their plan is bullshit.
 
Because your average $32k nimrod can't figure out that their 6.5% effective tax rate at a 15% bracket is significantly less than a 12% effective rate at the Romey 20% rate reduction. They just hear "taxes go down" and then flip back over to the kardashibooboos or whatever it is these days.

If either Ryan or Romney would have the balls to step up and say "these are the deductions that we're targeting" then I wouldn't hammer this point. Instead, they leave it to conjecture and it isn't terribly difficult to assume that they'll squeeze any little guy deduction while keeping deductions in play for the 7 figure or more crowd.
 
Yeah....Joe Biden acts like he is insane, and Obama himself said that he is a one term deal if he can't fix the economy. And, well, every promise he made about the economy has fallen through. I mean when your deficit is WORSE than 8 years of BUSH in ONE TERM, because of methods promised to already take effect. It hits a point where the 50th "we need more time" just shows incompetence.

Romney...oh gosh man. Your record proves you are a smart businessman, but just please stop trying to act like a "normal guy". It's insulting.

And that concludes my yearly visit to the Political forum. Good Day, all. See you next year.
 
5scared6yr.gif
I hope she croaks soon...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2E87gciwebw
 
Googled "Study it out" colloquial and turned up instances of it being said by what appear to be Christian fundamentalists/evangelicals.

I thought it was just a regional thing (it still might be, it sounds strange to me) and wanted to know where it was from.
 
[quote name='6er']Yeah....Joe Biden acts like he is insane, and Obama himself said that he is a one term deal if he can't fix the economy. And, well, every promise he made about the economy has fallen through. I mean when your deficit is WORSE than 8 years of BUSH in ONE TERM, because of methods promised to already take effect. It hits a point where the 50th "we need more time" just shows incompetence.

Romney...oh gosh man. Your record proves you are a smart businessman, but just please stop trying to act like a "normal guy". It's insulting.

And that concludes my yearly visit to the Political forum. Good Day, all. See you next year.[/QUOTE]

Why are you so scared to discuss the issues?
 
[quote name='dohdough']I thought they couldn't be more different tonight, but "the middle" is dumb and by that, I mean they're stupid morons.[/QUOTE]
Eh, I'd say the VP candidates don't really even count, it isn't their platform the campaign is running on. Lately Romney himself has been inching towards the middle with some of his remarks.

Btw, what was it a few years ago that "some" people were saying about flip flopping? Can't remember what that was....
 
[quote name='VipFREAK']
5scared6yr.gif
I hope she croaks soon...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2E87gciwebw[/QUOTE]
That kind of thing kills me. She probably buys products made in China, which in turn is helping the Chinese economy. And since China is usually the typical example when one is discussing communism....

It's just ridiculous.
 
[quote name='dohdough']I thought they couldn't be more different tonight, but "the middle" is dumb and by that, I mean they're stupid morons.[/QUOTE]

I don't know about that. At least with the segment about Afghanistan, Ryan couldn't seem to distance himself enough without pulling himself back in.

"We agree with the incumbents' plan. We'll be out by the end of 2014! But we disagree, and we aren't going to say when we'll be out! But we'll be out by then. Geez, people, you're letting the terrorists know our secret date. Now they'll save up their attacks!" :roll:

I'm joking. The differences for the most part were stark.
 
[quote name='ID2006']I don't know about that. At least with the segment about Afghanistan, Ryan couldn't seem to distance himself enough without pulling himself back in.

"We agree with the incumbents' plan. We'll be out by the end of 2014! But we disagree, and we aren't going to say when we'll be out! But we'll be out by then. Geez, people, you're letting the terrorists know our secret date. Now they'll save up their attacks!" :roll:

I'm joking. The differences for the most part were stark.[/QUOTE]

He doesn't want them to know, because he would rather US troops die over there then the Afghanistan forces themselves.

Or something to that affect at the end of the segment. I was laughing too hard to hear everything he was trying to say.
 
[quote name='Clak']That kind of thing kills me. She probably buys products made in China, which in turn is helping the Chinese economy. And since China is usually the typical example when one is discussing communism....

It's just ridiculous.[/QUOTE]

See what kills me is this is an aspect of the whole "low information voter" thing that's made up media bullshit. Dont get me wrong , she's clearly a low information holder but,shes not a passive entity. Shes right there at the debates. She's an active participant.
 
[quote name='EdRyder']See what kills me is this is an aspect of the whole "low information voter" thing that's made up media bullshit. Dont get me wrong , she's clearly a low information holder but,shes not a passive entity. Shes right there at the debates. She's an active participant.[/QUOTE]
She can't be a low-info voter when she said she "studied it out.":lol:

But holy fuck, would it have killed her to give 1 or 2 details about why she thinks he a fucking commie?
 
[quote name='Clak']That kind of thing kills me. She probably buys products made in China, which in turn is helping the Chinese economy. And since China is usually the typical example when one is discussing communism....

It's just ridiculous.[/QUOTE]

Just like all the folks rallying against big business buy iPhones and gasoline, eh?
 
I Just cant understand the desire to paint it like these people are at home watching Thursday night football instead of the debates.

No , these are the people that had their egg scrambled
 
[quote name='EdRyder']See what kills me is this is an aspect of the whole "low information voter" thing that's made up media bullshit. Dont get me wrong , she's clearly a low information holder but,shes not a passive entity. Shes right there at the debates. She's an active participant.[/QUOTE]
A lack of accurate information never stopped anyone from speaking their mind, unfortunately.
 
[quote name='UncleBob']Just like all the folks rallying against big business buy iPhones and gasoline, eh?[/QUOTE]
You rally against government and yet still use government provided services. I know I know, not the same, right? Now explain why...yeah that's it...now we say you're full of shit as usual...ok we're done.
 
[quote name='Clak']You rally against government and yet still use government provided services. I know I know, not the same, right? Now explain why...yeah that's it...now we say you're full of shit as usual...ok we're done.[/QUOTE]
:rofl:
 
[quote name='Clak']You rally against government and yet still use government provided services.[/QUOTE]

Services I'm forced to pay for?

Does Apple or BP threaten to come into you home and detain you if you don't give them money?
 
[quote name='nasum']Fair enough, go ahead and define small business for the group... I'll be putting some popcorn in the nuker while I wait.[/QUOTE]

Listen dafoomie, there is a finite amount of corn in this world to be popped and only so much room in my belly...
 
[quote name='4thHorseman']Got a giggle out of this, thought I would post it here as well about last night's debate:
[/QUOTE]

I was actually thinking of that partway through the debate.
 
[quote name='ID2006']I was actually thinking of that partway through the debate.[/QUOTE]
When it comes to actual content, Biden wins hands down, but as for the theatricality of the event, he loses. He doesn't come off like a smug douche like Ryan, but the interruptions and laughing doesn't really endear him to "undecideds" and low-info's regardless of the accuracy or veracity of his arguments. Instead, they see it as a "tone" problem like the one Stewart describes on his Crossfire appearance, but if his debate with O'Reilly is any indication of his leanings, I think he's changed his tune a bit. Unfortunately, most people don't really understand politics, so we're left with "tone."
 
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Haven't watched it yet (DVR'd) it, but have been reading about the tone etc.

I think that's fine. VP debates have little impact on the election, so Biden's performance may have been good for firing up the base again who were very unhappy with Obama's performance in the first debate.

It's Obama's job in the last two debates to win over undecided independents.
 
[quote name='dohdough']When it comes to actual content, Biden wins hands down, but as for the theatricality of the event, he loses. He doesn't come off like a smug douche like Ryan, but the interruptions and laughing doesn't really endear him to "undecideds" and low-info's regardless of the accuracy or veracity of his arguments. Instead, they see it as a "tone" problem like the one Stewart describes on his Crossfire appearance, but if his debate with O'Reilly is any indication of his leanings, I think he's changed his tune a bit. Unfortunately, most people don't really understand politics, so we're left with "tone."[/QUOTE]

I agree. Nearly every time he smiled or interrupted, I was thinking about how people would perceive that. Reminded me of Bruce Banner losing a bit of control, but inevitably laying out some disorderly smackdown.
 
Why do people even comment on the debates when all that is ever said is:

Democrats: "my guy won, the other guy is a douche".

Republicans: "my guy won, the other guy is an idiot and a douche".
 
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