40gb PS3 $399, no bc - 11/2, $499 80gb, limited bc, now. 56,877 new skus rumored

Well I do have a PS2 (working last I checked) and I'm pissed about the backwards compatibility. It doesn't matter if you have a PS2 or not, the point is that it is aging hardware and will break. I have 3 PS2 games I still want to play, Yakuza 2, Harvey Birdman and that Rule of Roses (forget if thats the correct title) game so it matters to me.

I was looking forward to a $399 PS3 this christmas with the bluray movie deal but they've lost my money over this unless the 60gb drops in price any time soon. I also have a 360 so I can get most of the multiplat releases I wanted. The PS3 barely has Heavenly Sword and Folklore and I'm not eager to buy any of those any time soon. The GT5 demo was the thing I was looking forward most to.

fuck you Sony, I Hope that $20 savings was worth it in costing you a sale.
 
[quote name='torifile']I just wonder why they took out BC versus the wifi. They're probably close in price and one was a system seller (when I bought a PS3 - now sold - I bought it because of the prospect of playing PS2 games now and PS3 games later) and the other just a convenience - and one that can be added externally later![/quote]

I could give two shits about BC...but wifi, that is a reason why I am hesitant to pick up a 360. I don't want to shell out extra cash just to get online.
 
I remember 18 or so months ago when Sony said that having more than one model of console would confuse people. How many does Sony have now? 7...8?

Stupid Sony, they are just asking for it.

And $500 is more than my rent.
 
[quote name='bigdaddy']I remember 18 or so months ago when Sony said that having more than one model of console would confuse people. How many does Sony have now? 7...8?

[/QUOTE]

I think the context of that (I'm purely speculating) was the HDD-less console v. the HDD-enabled one from Microsoft. But it's Sony, i'm simply giving them a benefit of the doubt... heh.

Sony's only really got an 80, 60, 20, and now a 40. I think the 60 and 20 are comparably close... and the 80 being almost the same, save the additional hardware emulation in the 60 and 20. To chrome or not to chrome ... almost like faceplates. :)

I think we're seeing that the HDD is becoming more mandatory on MS's side, and to the extent that games use it is becoming increasingly apparent. Trouble is, it's not a nice user-replaceable unit (that you can get from NewEgg, or somewhere), and you have to pay the "microsoft premium" to get it... But for those who know they need it, it's built into the costs of the Elite/Premiums.. *shrug*

Of course, as always, YMMV. :) Might cause explosive diarrhea...
 
I was thinking, tonight, of how in the hell Rock Band is going to work on the 360 and PS3. If you need 4 USB ports for all the peripherals, then if you own a 360 or 40GB PS3, you'll have to buy a port expansion. Not cool.
 
[quote name='orimental']According to the Wiki entry, the 360 bundle will include a USB hub in the package. No such luck for PS3 and PS2 owners, but they do come with wireless guitars.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_Band_(video_game)#Bundle_and_pricing[/QUOTE]

The guitar is wireless on PS3, but includes a "dongle," so something is still plugged into the USB port when using it. So, if you buy the 40GB PS3 and Rock Band, you'll need to provide your own USB hub.

This 40GB system is just looking like worse and worse an idea the more I think about it. People buy consoles in order to avoid the sort of "will this work on my system?" crap that PC gamers put up with. I hope it doesn't come to the states at all, unless it's changed so that the only difference from the 80GB is hard drive size.
 
well there is the possibility that rock band didn't announce a usb hub for the ps3 version as they didn't want to break an nda about the upcoming model. It is very possible to hear ea announce next week that a hub will come w/ the ps3 version as well.
 
[quote name='ryanbph']well there is the possibility that rock band didn't announce a usb hub for the ps3 version as they didn't want to break an nda about the upcoming model. It is very possible to hear ea announce next week that a hub will come w/ the ps3 version as well.[/QUOTE]

Yeah. I'm sure they didn't know about the new 40GB model until after they made the initial announcement about the different Rock Band packages.
 
The 360 has four USB ports, two in front, two in back.. not the most convenient, but you'd still be able to play without a hub. But not with a wireless adapter..

The problem is Sony is now removing things that cannot be upgraded to like the EE+GS. The memory card ports aren't such a big deal. Keeping Wi-Fi is a good idea, and the 360 should have had it. Although I'm told you can use any generic Wi-Fi bridge, not just the 360 specific one.
 
[quote name='jer7583']The 360 has four USB ports, two in front, two in back.. not the most convenient, but you'd still be able to play without a hub. But not with a wireless adapter.[/QUOTE]


Uhhh...360 has only three USB ports. Two in front, one in back. Hence the need for a hub for Rock Band.
 
[quote name='Nogib']Uhhh...360 has only three USB ports. Two in front, one in back. Hence the need for a hub for Rock Band.[/QUOTE]

If you have the Hd-dvd for the 360, then you have four, b/c the hd-dvd has two on the back.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']The guitar is wireless on PS3, but includes a "dongle," so something is still plugged into the USB port when using it. So, if you buy the 40GB PS3 and Rock Band, you'll need to provide your own USB hub.

This 40GB system is just looking like worse and worse an idea the more I think about it. People buy consoles in order to avoid the sort of "will this work on my system?" crap that PC gamers put up with. I hope it doesn't come to the states at all, unless it's changed so that the only difference from the 80GB is hard drive size.[/quote]

I don't get that though, why won't it work on the PS3?

I thought giving people choices was a good thing.
 
Not going to bother looking up old quotes but I'm sure Sony did something similar when rumble was pulled out. And now rumble is going to be offered. Stop taking everything literally with what these companies say.

They need to clear out old stock. Europe is phasing out on the 60GB right? NA has their own 60GB to clear out and some 80GB to sell. No one thought the 80GB was worth $100 more than the 60GB, how were you going to justify it if the 40GB had equal BC with the 80GB? Hardly no one would buy the 80GB. Stores are slowly getting rid of the 60GB now and that's with new stock being cut off.

If you don't see PS2 BC announced for the 40GB in the next year then you might have a reason to worry, but if it's not ready yet then it could be to their advantage to make the 60GB and 80GB versions look like a deal so they can get rid of old stock easier. If they announce it's coming some people will simply wait for a list to see how good it is, this way some people will jump the gun on the more expensive versions.

Edit: IMO the big flaw with this strategy (assuming this is what they're doing) is it might push someone to the 360 instead of the PS3 this Christmas so sony loses a customer. Otherwise this is actually a decent way to go about it. Rumble is supposedly delayed until next year (except Japan I think) so some people will wait anyway, this gives people an extra nudge to buy now since BC is at stake on the surface.

Announcing BC on the 40GB next year along with the release of Home and rumble with MGS4, GTA4, etc. being released will keep the PS3 looking good.
 
And did anyone stop to think what they'll do next year when rumble is released and you have 40GB versions collecting dust on the shelf that have non-rumble controllers packed in? How on earth are you going to sell those when rumble comes along? Same way with how you're going to sell 60GB and 80GB versions if 40GB had acceptable BC? Sony is getting their act together with making online and Home better, probably getting BC in order, getting rumble in the controllers, etc. You have to pump up the more expensive versions somehow to get rid of them. Retailers don't want to be stuck with old stock and sony wants them sold too.
 
I think you're over thinking Sony a bit here. This is a disastrous PR move simply to "clear out stock." Sony could simply slash the price of the 60/80GB models if that was their goal. No, this is a long term solution. Now, it doesn't mean that we won't ever see BC back, but look at MS, they're hardly trying hard to get those last few titles working.

I would wager they will soon stop work on the BC actually featured in software in the 80gb models. So, if you want it, pick up a 60gb version soon. Or else pick up a PS2 later.
 
[quote name='elwood731']I think you're over thinking Sony a bit here. This is a disastrous PR move simply to "clear out stock." Sony could simply slash the price of the 60/80GB models if that was their goal. No, this is a long term solution. Now, it doesn't mean that we won't ever see BC back, but look at MS, they're hardly trying hard to get those last few titles working.

I would wager they will soon stop work on the BC actually featured in software in the 80gb models. So, if you want it, pick up a 60gb version soon. Or else pick up a PS2 later.[/quote]
I also agree that if you like the 40 gig PS3, that you are a terrorist -- that is a very good point!

:whistle2:\"
 
"According to The Hollywood Reporter, an "industry source" of theirs says the North American 40GB PS3 model will release on Nov. 2 at $399. Another source reveals Sony has been asking stores to try and clear out existing PS3 inventory by the November date. Just like the controversial European 40GB PS3 model, the North American model will also allegedly not be backwards compatible with the PS2."
Click to expand...

=(. I really don't want to buy a PS2 again. Why do I need to drag the sumbitch out every time I want to play an old game. I don't have to drag out an old P3 computer to play fucking Red alert 2 (I'm not sure about Vista in that regard, though). BC is important to me. The only reason I'm not really faulting MS is because I have all of 4 Xbox games. If Nintendo didn't release the Wii with BC for the Cube, I probably wouldn't have bought it outright.

Guess I need to start saving before the 60's are gone.
 
I believe I read somewhere that the French 40GB is getting one a' them popular soccer games (Project Evolution?) bundled with it. Here's to hoping the US gets something, be it a BR of Spiderman or one of the copies of Lair before it becomes "E.T. for a new century."
 
[quote name='elwood731']I think you're over thinking Sony a bit here. This is a disastrous PR move simply to "clear out stock." Sony could simply slash the price of the 60/80GB models if that was their goal. No, this is a long term solution. Now, it doesn't mean that we won't ever see BC back, but look at MS, they're hardly trying hard to get those last few titles working.

I would wager they will soon stop work on the BC actually featured in software in the 80gb models. So, if you want it, pick up a 60gb version soon. Or else pick up a PS2 later.[/QUOTE]

The 360 never launched with 100% BC. PS3 did.
PS3 now has 0% BC while Xbox 360 has around 65/70%, and most of the other games not BC yet are old sports games.
 
I'm glad I have a PS3, but I doubt they'll be a PS4 now. I really, really believe that.

Now this Sony exec is saying early adopters will feel cheated. That's quite the contrary in this situation. Early adopters feel overjoyed that they have the superior consoles.
 
[quote name='hufferstl']Imagine how confusing buying a used console is going to be in 5 years.[/QUOTE]


"I'd like a 43.6 gb PS3 slim with partial PS2 BC, 3 ethernet ports, the zip drive, a blu-ray drive that doesn't play DVDs, skim milk please, and hold the six axis controls."
 
Disastrous? Everything sony does is disastrous to the hardcore nerds on the internet. Wouldn't you consider 360 reliability "disastrous" too? I remember those same hardcore nerds tearing into the 360 because the hard drive wasn't standard. People got over it.

BC on the 360 and 80GB PS3, and everything in Europe has always been a game of russian roulette. Little Timmy on Christmas morning who had no clue what games can play would be rolling the dice with these machines on whether it'll even work or the performance was acceptable.

My main point is don't take what they say at face value. Rumble for some people was a deal breaker and only until a few weeks ago did sony finally confirm it was coming. Saying BC is coming on the 40GB, people might likely sit back and wait anyway for a list to see how good it is. What good is it to buy the 40GB when BC is important to you when you have no clue whatsoever what it will ultimately play? Withholding that info will help sell 60GB and 80GB consoles in NA and Europe and still give them value. A 40GB with BC on par with the 80GB (which is far from perfect) would kill any chances of selling them IMO.

Not saying it's going to happen, but give it a year and then come back and make the complaint. People paid more money for the Elite because it offered more value to them. If BC is important to the person, pay the extra money.
 
[quote name='hufferstl']Imagine how confusing buying a used console is going to be in 5 years.[/QUOTE]

Especially since people can just add their own in....How would you know if that 100GB PS3 is a '60GB' or a '40GB'? Is there any way to tell besides memorizing the colors of the logo or tray?

Holidays at stores will be fun:

"Hi, I'd like a PS3!'
'Sure. We have the 20GB, its $449. We have the 40GB for $399 with Spider-Man 3 Blu-ray inside but no BC. We have a 60GB PS3 for $499 with nothing but can play 100% of the PS2 and PS1 library, and the 80GB with Motorstorm that can play most of the PS2 games, but not as good as the 60GB".

"...HOLY....SHIT...."

Xbox is just as bad, but its only real difference will be if t comes with a hard drive and what size (since the core is rumored to be replaced with HDMI for the 'Arcade system'). Wii still sits at one SKU.....for now.
 
[quote name='GizmoGC']PS3 now has 0% BC while Xbox 360 has around 65/70%[/QUOTE]

:lol:

ONE model of the PS3 has 0% BC; the rest do have it.

And if you believe that the 360 has 70% BC, I'll bet you believe that HD DVD has 300% marketshare, too. :lol:

[quote name='GizmoGC']Holidays at stores will be fun:

"Hi, I'd like a PS3!'
'Sure. We have the 20GB, its $449. We have the 40GB for $399 with Spider-Man 3 Blu-ray inside but no BC. We have a 60GB PS3 for $499 with nothing but can play 100% of the PS2 and PS1 library, and the 80GB with Motorstorm that can play most of the PS2 games, but not as good as the 60GB".

"...HOLY....SHIT...."[/QUOTE]

Hmm. Unlikely. Here's how it will work in your average customer/employee interaction:

Customer: "PS3 DURRRRRRRRRR...." *spittle*
Employee: "PS3 EXPANSIVE DURRRRRRRRR..." *scans UPC*
Customer: "PS3 DURRRRRRRRRR...."

Don't believe me? Sit in one a' them rocking game chairs at BB for an hour and eavesdrop on shoppers and employees.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']:lol:
Hmm. Unlikely. Here's how it will work in your average customer/employee interaction:

Customer: "PS3 DURRRRRRRRRR...." *spittle*
Employee: "PS3 EXPANSIVE DURRRRRRRRR..." *scans UPC*
Customer: "PS3 DURRRRRRRRRR...."

Don't believe me? Sit in one a' them rocking game chairs at BB for an hour and eavesdrop on shoppers and employees.[/quote]

Maybe in ye old England, in the states people would just get confused and melt down... then shoot a hole through a ballot in anger.. or something...
 
[quote name='mykevermin']:lol:

ONE model of the PS3 has 0% BC; the rest do have it.

And if you believe that the 360 has 70% BC, I'll bet you believe that HD DVD has 300% marketshare, too. :lol:



Hmm. Unlikely. Here's how it will work in your average customer/employee interaction:

Customer: "PS3 DURRRRRRRRRR...." *spittle*
Employee: "PS3 EXPANSIVE DURRRRRRRRR..." *scans UPC*
Customer: "PS3 DURRRRRRRRRR...."

Don't believe me? Sit in one a' them rocking game chairs at BB for an hour and eavesdrop on shoppers and employees.[/QUOTE]

Anyone have any idea what the BC % is for the 360?

Yes, as of right now there is 1 PS3 with no BC. If you think this won't eventually carry into the 80GB line...you're nuts. 20GB is all but gone, 60GB is getting there...80GB is software emulation...and when the 100GB replaces that, I'm sure it will be 0% like the 40GB one.
 
[quote name='dallow']I thought it was at best 50% BC on 360 at last count or less.

Not 70% though![/quote]I'ts closer to 75%, sadly I own a gmae that is in the 25% :( (Capcom Collection).
 
[quote name='FxhoundADAM']I'ts closer to 75%, sadly I own a gmae that is in the 25% :( (Capcom Collection).[/QUOTE]

An official stats? I imagine 65/70% is about right, and Im sure 15% of the 'not BC' is sports crap anyway.
 
My thoughts: Yes, Microsoft was stupid doing no hard drive/yes hard drive. They SHOULD had made on console (the Pro) and then added Elite later. And their reliability is disastrous (My 360 just got sent in the week after Halo 3 came out) But Sony is even MORE confusing. MS does a good job of differentiating between the SKUs. One is barebones; one has more accessories; one has the same as before but a larger hard drive. It is simple, they advertise each seperately, etc. They have made the difference known. For Sony, though... Wow. 4 Sku's in less than 1 year is impressive, and VERY confusing to the customer. They aren't different enough, either. I think people will just get confused. Then they backtrack on BC, keep it a litte and take it away, no rumble, but wait, we have rumble, just much later, etc. Craziness. It will definitely drive people to the 360, I think.
 
I don't think so regis.
The sales person can just read the box to them, or they can read it themselves. and they can just buy it.
Like any other product.

Consoles are still much less confusing than computer configurations, or even TV types to the average person.
 
[quote name='dallow']I don't think so regis.
The sales person can just read the box to them, or they can read it themselves. and they can just buy it.
Like any other product.

Consoles are still much less confusing than computer configurations, or even TV types to the average person.[/QUOTE]
I don't think he's wrong at all. Sony have made buying a console more confusing than it has ever been before. Granted, consoles are more complex than ever before, but still, this is getting ridiculous. It isn't that there's 4 different PS3s with different hard drives or games packed in, but different levels of BC, different hardware features (WiFi, MC reader, etc.) and likely soon (well, spring) there will be some with rumble controllers. This is a bigger mess than any console has seen before with the exception of the 3DO with the different manufacturers it had.

And no, I am not a Sony hater. I just hate this mess, and don't worry, I'm none too happy with MS either. They're just slightly lesser an evil when it comes to this than Sony. The PS3 is starting to look more and more like a computer setup with differing systems and incompatibilities. And isn't this why most people are console gamers, to avoid the hassles of PC gaming? Who would have thought it would be Sony and not MS to bring it home.
 
I think the backward compatibility is not the best thing on the world ... So I think PS3 , didn`t lost anything ... Everyone who loves their PS2 games can keep their PS2 and play games on it ...
I think 40GB PS3 is only good thing for Sony. But I was shocked by the decision to say `bye-bye` to the 60GB version of the PS3 which is not the best decision they could make. I have 60 GB version and what is going to happen now with my warranty ????
I am sorry if there are any mistakes , I am Slovenian. Slovenia is near Italy in Europe , so ...
Regards to all CAGCast forum ...
 
[quote name='GizmoGC']An official stats? I imagine 65/70% is about right, and Im sure 15% of the 'not BC' is sports crap anyway.[/QUOTE]

42% (394 titles out of roughly 938 Xbox releases) work, with varying degrees of success, on the Xbox 360. Going by your "65/70%" rate, you overestimated the BC rate by a considerable margin (148% over at the minimum).
 
[quote name='mykevermin']Going by your "65/70%" rate, you overestimated the BC rate by a considerable margin (148% over at the minimum).[/QUOTE]

:lol: And he faults Sony for inflating numbers.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']42% (394 titles out of roughly 938 Xbox releases) work, with varying degrees of success, on the Xbox 360. Going by your "65/70%" rate, you overestimated the BC rate by a considerable margin (148% over at the minimum).[/QUOTE]

But how many of those titles were sports / demo titles, and ergo, completely dismiss-able? ;)
 
[quote name='regisphilbi0']My thoughts: Yes, Microsoft was stupid doing no hard drive/yes hard drive. They SHOULD had made on console (the Pro) and then added Elite later. And their reliability is disastrous (My 360 just got sent in the week after Halo 3 came out) But Sony is even MORE confusing. MS does a good job of differentiating between the SKUs. One is barebones; one has more accessories; one has the same as before but a larger hard drive. It is simple, they advertise each seperately, etc. They have made the difference known. For Sony, though... Wow. 4 Sku's in less than 1 year is impressive, and VERY confusing to the customer. They aren't different enough, either. I think people will just get confused. Then they backtrack on BC, keep it a litte and take it away, no rumble, but wait, we have rumble, just much later, etc. Craziness. It will definitely drive people to the 360, I think.[/QUOTE]

I think Sony really fucked up BC. I couldn't really care less what the % is, but just keep it constant. At this rate, it looks like all future PS3s will have 0% BC (They should all still be able to play PS1 games though right?). This is what is most confusing about their multiple SKUs. It doesn't affect me at all, since I have the near perfect BC model and I still have my PS2 hooked up, so I'm okay with it, but taking it out completely was a mistake, in my opinion. Thing is, more people care about price than they do BC, which is why we are seeing this. The sales gained from this drop in price will be much more than the sales lost due to the removal of BC.

The pack-ins and different sized HDDs don't really bother me too much, as they essentially don't really affect the core gaming/movie playing portion of the PS3. Aside from the BC variations, I don't think the multiple SKUs are all that bad. Given the rate at which HDDs drop in price, this may occur almost every year too. I believe their reasoning for using 80GB instead of 60GBs is that the 60GB are becoming more uncommon, and are about the same price as 80GBs to produce. I'm guessing the same is true regarding the 40GB and 20GB.
 
Here's the thing, though: I don't like the variation in system capability any more than many of you...but a few pages back, you'll see that only 37% of would-be PS3 owners are even aware of BC, so to act like this is catastrophic is overkill. A few more than 1 in 3 owners know about it at all, and that's not even getting into what portion of that 37% care about BC...some do, and some don't, as evidenced by this thread.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']Here's the thing, though: I don't like the variation in system capability any more than many of you...but a few pages back, you'll see that only 37% of would-be PS3 owners are even aware of BC, so to act like this is catastrophic is overkill. A few more than 1 in 3 owners know about it at all, and that's not even getting into what portion of that 37% care about BC...some do, and some don't, as evidenced by this thread.[/QUOTE]

I agree that the majority of gamers are not going to care. People on gaming message boards represent such a small portion of the entire gaming population. The majority of the population is represented by the casuals who probably could not care less about BC and would prefer cheaper models (as evidenced by the uproar regarding MSs shoddy BC when the competition, at the time, was offering perfect or near perfect. While it was an unpopular move at the time, it does not seem to have hindered them too much). I am part of the minority that is against the removal of BC, but, from a business standpoint, and can totally see why they did do this and why it will help them more than hurt them.
 
I am just glad I got my 2 60 GB PS3. They seem to be the only one that will have all the features - Emotion Engine, Wi-Fi, card reader and mid range hard drive size. Throw in the 5 free movies and you get a dcent deal. If you want to get a PS3 grab a 60 GB while you can. Still seems to be the best deal.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']42% (394 titles out of roughly 938 Xbox releases) work, with varying degrees of success, on the Xbox 360. Going by your "65/70%" rate, you overestimated the BC rate by a considerable margin (148% over at the minimum).[/QUOTE]

Like I said, I had no idea but thought it was 65/70%. Its not like MS promised 100% BC at launch (well, they did for Halo and Halo 2). Sony, on the other hand, did. MS never stripped away the ability for new systems to have BC. You either bought the core with no BC in the box, or the Premium with BC. Now, you have 4 different PS3's all with different options and abilities. Can't wait to see how an average Target salesperson handles these questions when I send my girlfriend to ask. :lol:
 
Reality's Fringe;3437806]"According to The Hollywood Reporter said:
Guess I need to start saving before the 60's are gone.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I've decided that the 60GB is the only one I'm interested in if I'm going to get one. The thing is, I still can't justify paying $500 for the console. I guess I have to either blow my GameRush credit to get one (I was planning to use it for an Elite 360 when the bundles come out later this month) or hope that I can find a used 60GB PS3 for a decent price later. Bah.
 
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