AMAZON/EBAY BUYERS BEWARE: PieceofMindMedia / NorAm selling YOUR used games as "NEW"

It seems like every time I randomly check NorAm's and PieceofmindMedia/Pieceofmindbooks Feedback they have more cases of resealing games. For today:


"I just received the "NEW" game from pieceofmindmedia and am SHOCKED to see it is a USED game covered in amateur shrinkwrap. There must be 2-3 different layers of shrinkwrap on this item but I can tell the games are used due to the open-side of the boxset having plasticwrap openings under the shrinkwrap. I am promptly returning this item to Amazon and will never use this seller again..."
1 out of 5
 
Thank God Noram finally ran out of "NEW" Endless Ocean for wii. I don't know if they actually ran out or are laying low or what, but prices are back to where they were before noram flooded ebay with their magically aquired "New" copies. It's about $55 again. I can finally sell mine for a good price. They offered alot in trade for endless oceans' trade of the day (probably received quite a few of them), freaked out and shot themselves in the foot by f-ing up the supply/demand curve . They were stupid to unload all their copies at once. - crooked and dumb.
 
Seems to me that buying much anything from Amazon sellers is risky. There is no outlet for them to post an actual item picture and most are only required to give a single sentence for a description. There's little accountability in this setup. You can always send an email asking the seller but many of them don't really care to properly answer.

Reminds me of the Retro Duo I ordered for $4 shipping. They sent the thing Media Mail. Now, video games are NOT covered by the USPS Media Mail rules to begin with. Loose instruction manuals are, but not games. I do not know why. A game system is definitely not covered. It was inspected(all Media Mail packages are subject to random inspection) and I had to pay $7 in postage fees to get the package from the post office.

Well... I hammered the seller. Mailed them direct photocopies of all relevant paperwork and made them refund my $7 for their screw-up.
 
^^ Video games are covered, at least if they are disc-based. Hell, NorAm/Amazon uses preprinted media mail labels for you to submit all trade-ins, and this goes for all systems from NES through PS3. They apparently just started taking accessories for trade. I'd be interested to see if they offer the USPS media mail option for those as they clearly aren't covered.

But as for the games, NorAm has gotten 100's if not 1000's of packages sent to them that way (via a postage due unit at their local PO) so I can't imagine that wasn't cleared beforehand.
 
Today I found this name as one of the visitors to my page:

NorAmGamer- joined 3/09, no posts (just lurking) maybe this is Michael
Anyone else who has posted here see this name on your visitors page?
 
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[quote name='Toss']Today I found this name as one of the visitors to my page:

NorAmGamer- joined 3/09, no posts (just lurking) maybe this is Michael
Anyone else who has posted here see this name on your visitors page?[/QUOTE]

No, he didn't visit me, but I was curious so I did look him up. http://www.cheapassgamer.com/forums/member.php?u=198475

Like you said he has no posts, but he is logging in. Maybe NorAm is hitting up the deals section for stock? LMAO.
 
[quote name='mguiddy']Oh dear god...
Look at the first two listings for Super Mario RPG.[/QUOTE]

If you are talking about the seller AOK games that has 2 copies listed as new that come cart only with price stickers attached, I just called Amazon about them

feel free to comment on their crappy company


AMAZON.COM Hours of Operation (PST): 24/7

1-800-201-7575 or 1-206-266-2992
 
[quote name='io']^^ Video games are covered, at least if they are disc-based. Hell, NorAm/Amazon uses preprinted media mail labels for you to submit all trade-ins, and this goes for all systems from NES through PS3. They apparently just started taking accessories for trade. I'd be interested to see if they offer the USPS media mail option for those as they clearly aren't covered.

But as for the games, NorAm has gotten 100's if not 1000's of packages sent to them that way (via a postage due unit at their local PO) so I can't imagine that wasn't cleared beforehand.[/QUOTE]

Video games are not covered by Medial Mail:

http://pe.usps.com/text/CSR/PS-334.htm

"In conclusion, video games, whether on CD-ROM, diskettes, or similar software, regardless of form, or playable systems including computers, do not meet the standards for Media Mail."
 
Yep. No video games. I just think it's so rare that they actually inspect these media mail packages that people assume that video games are covered. I'm guessing they are probably more inclined to inspect larger boxes that shipped via media, considering that is where the bigger savings are.
 
[quote name='Rozz']Video games are not covered by Medial Mail:

http://pe.usps.com/text/CSR/PS-334.htm

"In conclusion, video games, whether on CD-ROM, diskettes, or similar software, regardless of form, or playable systems including computers, do not meet the standards for Media Mail."[/QUOTE]

Well then Gamestop is screwing the USPS since they've sent me my game orders through Media Mail in the past.
 
[quote name='Josef']Well then Gamestop is screwing the USPS since they've sent me my game orders through Media Mail in the past.[/QUOTE]

I've gotten plenty of games from Amazon via media mail too. And like I said before, NorAm/Amazon specifically uses media mail for their trade-in program. The link Rozz posted is pretty clear that it does not (at least now) qualify, but note that it was just put up in Sept. 2009 so maybe this is a new ruling or clarification. I was told specifically by my local PO that games were OK back in July/Aug. Still, though, the Amazon trade-in program continues to use media mail - I just sent some stuff in last week via that method.

It doesn't effect me too much either way as my only use of media mail recently has been the Amazon trade-in program and I don't pay for that anyway. When I ship my own stuff I always use first-class anyway because for a game or two it pretty much comes out to the same price.

I don't even fully understand the ruling because it says media mail was meant for "educational, cultural, scientific, and informational values" and that's why video games don't count. But there's no argument that DVD's and video tapes qualify, right? So you can send a Transformers DVD or some such nonsense like that and it qualifies? Wacko...

I know they are picky about periodicals (they can't have ads and such). I'm not sure where that leaves game guides, which I know many CAGs send via media mail.
 
[quote name='Josef']Well then Gamestop is screwing the USPS since they've sent me my game orders through Media Mail in the past.[/QUOTE]

I guess gamestop screws everyone..all my online orders from them recently have been shipped to me through USPS in presumably free 3 day UPS padded envelopes.
 
If you are sending a single game it is usually cheaper with first class. Now if you are sending in a lot media mail would be better
 
[quote name='mguiddy']Yeah, when I posted the AOK seller was the first two listings.[/QUOTE]
people generally catches on especially when it comes to this.

but why bother though cause people are not gonna wanna buy older gen cartridge based games on amazon. those cags that listed those are a bunch of idiots as well.. let them join the idiot only party :)
 
[quote name='Rozz']Video games are not covered by Medial Mail:

http://pe.usps.com/text/CSR/PS-334.htm

"In conclusion, video games, whether on CD-ROM, diskettes, or similar software, regardless of form, or playable systems including computers, do not meet the standards for Media Mail."[/QUOTE]Oh lovely. So much for that. I guess I'll have to start revising my packaging I use to protect items in shipment, since I often have the item weight above first class mailing weight. :whistle2:s Either that, or shift to priority mail when over 13 ounces.

[quote name='Josef']Well then Gamestop is screwing the USPS since they've sent me my game orders through Media Mail in the past.[/QUOTE]The last few shipments I've had from them have been UPS Ground, so I think they're making the shift to UPS Ground from Media Mail. I know that back in the past, yes, they did ship media mail for SAVER shipping.

[quote name='io']I've gotten plenty of games from Amazon via media mail too. And like I said before, NorAm/Amazon specifically uses media mail for their trade-in program. The link Rozz posted is pretty clear that it does not (at least now) qualify, but note that it was just put up in Sept. 2009 so maybe this is a new ruling or clarification. I was told specifically by my local PO that games were OK back in July/Aug. Still, though, the Amazon trade-in program continues to use media mail - I just sent some stuff in last week via that method.

It doesn't effect me too much either way as my only use of media mail recently has been the Amazon trade-in program and I don't pay for that anyway. When I ship my own stuff I always use first-class anyway because for a game or two it pretty much comes out to the same price.

I don't even fully understand the ruling because it says media mail was meant for "educational, cultural, scientific, and informational values" and that's why video games don't count. But there's no argument that DVD's and video tapes qualify, right? So you can send a Transformers DVD or some such nonsense like that and it qualifies? Wacko...

I know they are picky about periodicals (they can't have ads and such). I'm not sure where that leaves game guides, which I know many CAGs send via media mail.[/QUOTE]As soon as UPS was available as an option for trade-in items to NorAm, I started using it, so I wouldn't have to foot the bill for a DC # on the shipment. So, that's not an issue for me, and this ruling might be why they started using it themselves. Wouldn't surprise me if they changed to only doing UPS for the trade-in options, and requiring $10+ trade-ins, like they did initially for DVD trade-ins.

I don't agree with the ruling either, since it seems a bit arbitrary of a choice to specifically target video games but not single out movies and other DVD-type media. Seems very strange to me.

I'm assuming that she didn't mention game guides, so I'm still shipping them that way until told otherwise. :D

And if they're going to prevent video games to go media mail, I guess it's another reason to keep Amazon Prime for another year, so I won't have to run into issues with Amazon shipments going media mail and being subject to inspection.

[quote name='Toss']I guess gamestop screws everyone..all my online orders from them recently have been shipped to me through USPS in presumably free 3 day UPS padded envelopes.[/QUOTE]That's a big no-no, since those are only for UPS shipments, same thing for FedEx boxes and USPS Priority Mail boxes.
 
Yeah, I toyed with the UPS option at Amazon/Noram but it is so painfully slow that I went back to the media mail option - it is still there as recently as yesterday when I submitted a trade. I don't even bother with the DC # and when I send via media mail it has been taking just 5 or 6 days. With UPS it is a guaranteed 8+ for me (west coast). USPS at least tried to expedite while UPS will (it seems) intentionally hold something if, for some reason, they manage to get it there faster than anticipated. I guess UPS has the built-in insurance but that is generally not an issue anyway.
 
[quote name='mguiddy']In a similar vein, I've noticed a lot of sellers on amazon listing items as "New" when in the comments they say "Opened but never played" and the like.[/QUOTE]

Amazon's A-to-Z is very strict on garbage like this. If you order items that don't meet the guidelines (that isn't NEW, for example) the seller will be automatically deducted their funds and it will be given to the buyer.
 
[quote name='Niwen Starfire']Wow... I bought from them before. I might not have had I known about them resealing used games as new, even though both items I bought from them were correctly listed as used.

And I didn't know about Toolhaus, that will come in handy on future buys.[/QUOTE]


My recent orders were listed as Used-Like New and arrived in that condition.

To the Super Mario RPG people--- order then file an A-to-Z. That'll learn them.
 
[quote name='MrNEWZ']Amazon's A-to-Z is very strict on garbage like this. If you order items that don't meet the guidelines (that isn't NEW, for example) the seller will be automatically deducted their funds and it will be given to the buyer.[/QUOTE]

So is this like eBay where buyers can make false claims, get their money back, keep the item (well on eBay at least they have to return it), screw the seller's rep, and never face any consequences? Remind me never to sell on Amazon ;).
 
It's crap like that finally stopped me from really selling stuff online. I never had anything like that happen to me, but I heard enough stories and saw the potential for issues, so I just said, "Screw it."
 
I've ordered from Pieceofmind before, and have always gotten things in almost new condition (hd dvds & bluray sets) for ubercheap. I've never once had an issue with them and i've gotten like 6+ orders from them. We at HDD have never really had issues with them before.
 
BUYER BEWARE!!!

I bought a DVD that was supposed to be in Like New condition that was sold by pieceofmindmedia (Owned by NorAm International, LLC) and fulfilled by Amazon. When it arrived, it was not in Like New
condition so I attempted to contact them to see what could be done about it but they would not
respond to repeated attempts to contact them via Amazon and their website. Piece of mind indeed. Well here is a piece of my mind.

Normally, it would not have been a big deal but refusing to respond to customers is inexcusable so I
decided to do some research and discovered that many other people have had similar issues which
included selling resealed games and DVD's as new to fetch a higher price. It seems that people
started catching on to the reseals so "Like New" is the next best thing. Or is it?

Curiously, it seems that they have many aliases which only makes me wonder what the owners of NorAm International have to hide. Perhaps they are hiding their $1.6 million, 2,200-square-foot penthouse.

I would have posted several links with some interesting info about NorAm but CAG won't let me so this will have to do for now.
 
Thought of this thread today when I received a re-sealed game from Gohastings.com. It was an obvious reseal job as it was a 360 game in heat-shrink with no tamper proof seal. Called them up and they promised to send a return prepaid mailing label because "the package did not live up to my standards of what I would consider new." This wording intrigued me as it seems very scripted (indicating they'd been called on this practice before), for one, and because it is now (in my experience) the 3rd retailer in addition to NorAm and Gamestop with their gutted copies to sell opened merchandise as new. I paid a premium for the product I received today ($30 new as opposed to $10 used) and feel at least a little inconvenienced by this. Just wanted to give a heads up to the people that read this thread in case it was not known that Hastings may be up to the same thing as Noram.

PS I'm not ruling out the possibility that this may have been a pulling mistake. I've got a few more games on order from them. Will report back here when received.
 
Note that not every game has the folded plastic wrap and security seals. Some games, even for the 360 (though much more commonly for the DS and Wii) come from the factory with the melted shrink wrap. And in some cases you can get both types a the same time (I remember this being an issue with Castlevania Dawn of Sorrow when it was a "rare", highly sought after game).

Though it is true that even shrink-wrapped 360 games do usually also have the security seal at least (Blue Dragon, I think, was like this).
 
Hey io (or anybody).. can the post office make you open up the package you're sending out with a pre-paid media mail label? It's happened to me once when I sent out an Amazon trade in and I had to get into an argument with them to accept my package as it was the recipient's problem and not mine. Just wondering because it seemed kind of shady on the post office's part because the shipping label was cut horizontally when they opened it up (luckily the bar code was still in tact).
 
[quote name='io']Note that not every game has the folded plastic wrap and security seals. Some games, even for the 360 (though much more commonly for the DS and Wii) come from the factory with the melted shrink wrap. And in some cases you can get both types a the same time (I remember this being an issue with Castlevania Dawn of Sorrow when it was a "rare", highly sought after game).

Though it is true that even shrink-wrapped 360 games do usually also have the security seal at least (Blue Dragon, I think, was like this).[/QUOTE]

I made this very point about the DS games earlier in the thread. Didn't realize this was an issue with 360 games. Anyway, I should have identified the game I was talking about. Star Trek Legacy. Anyone know if it's one of the known games to come from the factory without a microsoft seal in heatshrink?
 
[quote name='darkslime']The post office has the legal right to open any media mail package for inspection[/QUOTE]

Happens quite often during the holidays too. I remember I had 3 packages from last xmas that were slashed then resealed with USPS tape and then there was a note inside that they inspected it. It didn't really tell me what the reason was or what they even found, but they did leave me a note at least...
 
[quote name='Squarehard']Happens quite often during the holidays too. I remember I had 3 packages from last xmas that were slashed then resealed with USPS tape and then there was a note inside that they inspected it. It didn't really tell me what the reason was or what they even found, but they did leave me a note at least...[/QUOTE]
this is why there was alot of packages stolen last year. mainly alot of Wii systems coming from amazon. they see that amazon logo on the side, they know its either electronics or games or something.
 
NORAM SUCKS! I hate those fu***rs! I really need to stop using that Amazon service. It is being run by crooks. They are an ugly cancer in a otherwise great operation - amazon.com
 
I just got a couple of DVDs from Amazon via "PieceofMindMedia" that were advertised as new, but obviously not. The cases were teh really cheap kind you get at places like the 99 cent store, the disks were badly scratched and the shrink wrap looked fake. I see their name pop up a lot due to the low prices and FSSS eligibility but given the crap I received from them, its not worth it.
 
[quote name='dchrisd']I just got a couple of DVDs from Amazon via "PieceofMindMedia" that were advertised as new, but obviously not. The cases were teh really cheap kind you get at places like the 99 cent store, the disks were badly scratched and the shrink wrap looked fake. I see their name pop up a lot due to the low prices and FSSS eligibility but given the crap I received from them, its not worth it.[/QUOTE]
leave them a negative feedback
 
[quote name='phear3d']leave them a negative feedback[/QUOTE]

I've seen some of their negative feedback crossed out by Amazon and not counting towards their average. No wonder why they have such a high rating. :roll:
 
Dang right I'm leaving negative feedback, even if it does get deleted. Whether the feedback is deleted or not, I've already complained about the product and got and RMA.
 
[quote name='dchrisd']Dang right I'm leaving negative feedback, even if it does get deleted. Whether the feedback is deleted or not, I've already complained about the product and got and RMA.[/QUOTE]
awesome. make sure to be honest with your feedback.
 
I bought an HD-DVD/DVD combo movie from pieceofmindmedia and complained to Amazon when it was HD-DVD only. Instead of getting an exchange like I asked for, Amazon just refunded me the cost and let me keep it. I felt bad about it... but then I didn't because I found out what pieceofmindmedia is all about.

But it was fulfilled through Amazon, so are they the ones losing out?
 
[quote name='Indiana Jones']I bought an HD-DVD/DVD combo movie from pieceofmindmedia and complained to Amazon when it was HD-DVD only. Instead of getting an exchange like I asked for, Amazon just refunded me the cost and let me keep it. I felt bad about it... but then I didn't because I found out what pieceofmindmedia is all about.

But it was fulfilled through Amazon, so are they the ones losing out?[/QUOTE]

no it would still be noram losing out
 
Indeed. They have things worked out. And I'm sure if Amazon continues to get complaints about their nonsense ways, they won't be working with NorAm much longer, so they will pay even further.
 
they are losing out on this. but i cant believe though that amazon wont even check the integrity of the product they were willing to ship. its one way to be deceitful, but another to pretend not to care (amazon). at the end, greed wins and youre stuck with something you dont want.
 
It's kinda pathetic and I didn't know it was possible to sink lower than Gamestop when it comes to resealing games but these guys have accomplished it.
 
This is a totally noob question: what exactly does a y-seal look like?

I have a couple of sealed games I bought from ebay and I'm afraid one or two of them might be reseals. :???:
 
Ah crap on a stick! I just recently bought Lips NOHs for my friend from this seller, and since I ran into this I decided to open the box and I notice that the box is really beat up, could have been the shipping I dunno, so I open it up and the first thing I notice(again I am not sure)is that the game itself isn't wrapped in any shrinkwrap, I am not sure if Lips does the shrinkwrap but I know Guitar Hero and Rock Band does, so I will just guess that this should be shrinked.

Man, well the disk is in perfect shape and it came with the 5 free songs code unexposed so I guess, but thanks for this warning, they are off my list.
 
[quote name='glemtvapen']This is a totally noob question: what exactly does a y-seal look like?

I have a couple of sealed games I bought from ebay and I'm afraid one or two of them might be reseals. :???:[/QUOTE]
if you buy new, factory sealed games the seal is usually a "Y" fold seal. at the top where the 2 meet it forms a "Y" at both ends thus people calling it the yfold seal. these are tougher to fake compared to seam sealed games.

but noram have a professional/official looking sealer compared to factory sealers. but the bigger they are, the dumber they get. leaving obvious evidence that indeed they are resealed.

from now on, anyone posting anything they received from noram please post pictures. they'll continue to do what they're doing because obviously, amazon is behind their backs. $$$$ money changes everything :applause:
 
[quote name='phear3d']if you buy new, factory sealed games the seal is usually a "Y" fold seal. at the top where the 2 meet it forms a "Y" at both ends thus people calling it the yfold seal. these are tougher to fake compared to seam sealed games.

but noram have a professional/official looking sealer compared to factory sealers. but the bigger they are, the dumber they get. leaving obvious evidence that indeed they are resealed.

from now on, anyone posting anything they received from noram please post pictures. they'll continue to do what they're doing because obviously, amazon is behind their backs. $$$$ money changes everything :applause:[/QUOTE]

The key word is "usually." There are some games that don't use the Y-fold sealing (many of them DS games in fact) so I don't want people to think that every video game release uses Y-fold sealing :) I think people have been starting to get that mindset in certain cases. A good example being Castlevania: Order of Ecclesia. As far as I know, this never had the Y-fold sealing and now that it's getting harder to find people are thinking they are getting resealed copies of it from places when in fact they are getting the original factory seal.
 
All authentic DS games work fine on DSi systems, so I am rather disheartened to see the huge amount of DS game listings on Amazon that say things such as "For Nintendo DS and DS Lite consoles. Not for DSi systems." This obviously means that they are bootlegs, though I'm not sure if anything can be really done about it.

However, none of Amazon's certified sellers pull this garbage, so be very careful with third-party sellers.
 
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