Chrisitianity (or any religion really) is a order of bullshit and chips.

I was thinking of something the other day. If someone, somehow found actual proof for the existence of god it would basically destroy religious faith as we know it. Faith is only needed in the absence of proof, if actual proof for the existence of god existed, what place would faith have? Saying "I believe in god" would basically have no weight anymore.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']Who are you referring to? If me, like I said I don't bash religious folks. I have a different view, and I respect their right to have their own views.

As long as people aren't going around shoving their views down others throats, I couldn't give two shits less what anyone believes. At the end of the day, the only beliefs and opinions that matter are one's own.

In a general sense, of course, as one has to care what their boss, significant other etc. think. But on issues like faith and science? Opinions of others shouldn't have much bearing on your own. Independent though is a key requirement of being a worthwhile human being for both men of science and men of faith![/QUOTE]

I'm refering to this whole thread (not just you dude, relax :roll:). I agree with what you said, but at the same time there are a lot of angsty, arrgoant atheist, who hide behind their computer monitors and take potshots at people's faith and that I don't respect.

As a contemporary Christian , I've learn to respect other people's views...but how can I when I'm bombarded by militant suburban Atheist assholes. (Not indicated at anyone on this site.)
 
I don't see much militancy, unless you just mean our discussions. Either way, it isn't like their aren't plenty of militant Christians.
 
Agreed. Being pushy with views is hardly something unique to atheists.

In fact is much more common in religions since you have denominations like Mormons (to just pick one example without picking on them for any certain reason) that require followers to go on missions and try to convert people to their faith etc.

I don't like militant atheists either--I find them hypocritical personally. But most I know are like me and just simply don't discuss religion/faith with anyone as they believe as I do that religion/faith (or lack thereof) should be a deeply personal matter and not something people go around forcing on other's who have no interest in hearing what you have to say.
 
[quote name='Clak']I don't see much militancy, unless you just mean our discussions. Either way, it isn't like their aren't plenty of militant Christians.[/QUOTE]

I'm refering to where I live. Everyday on my way to work I have to past by a bunch of smug, doucebag, yuppie Atheists parroting what their college professors most likely told them, disrespecting what I believe. Then they get all pissy when someone shoves them and tells them to go fuck off.

These guys making fun of my faith and not getting checked is unfair and uncalled for. Garunteed if it where christians mocking Islam or Atheist, you'd never here the end of it.

But I also agree with you about militant christians...those fuckers are nutty as hell.
 
Yep, those atheists you deal with are douchebags and no different from the militant christians and other zealots who go around forcing their views on others and trying to win converts.
 
I getting really sick of you guys shoehorning faith into the telepathy convo. Faith is complete confidence in something supernatural.

As an example, if tomorrow it was proven that the grand majority of people who have supposedly experienced telepathic communication had suffered from some form of temporary schizophrenia then I'd be skeptical.

And Clak, I willingly concede that science has done a bang-up job of proving that average joes cannot use their minds to communicate printed symbols on paper cards into the minds of others, and as you so aptly point out pop culture entertainment has dutifully provided the punchline.

All this "men of science" and "men of faith" talk is pretty hokey. Science is just a way of using knowledge to predict outcomes. IMHO it's a mistake to believe you can understand everything by looking at the world through the window of contemporary science.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']I don't like militant atheists either--I find them hypocritical personally. But most I know are like me and just simply don't discuss religion/faith with anyone as they believe as I do that religion/faith (or lack thereof) should be a deeply personal matter and not something people go around forcing on other's who have no interest in hearing what you have to say.[/QUOTE]

I enjoy these convos until they get personal.
 
[quote name='camoor']I getting really sick of you guys shoehorning faith into the telepathy convo. Faith is complete confidence in something supernatural.

As an example, if tomorrow it was proven that the grand majority of people who have supposedly experienced telepathic communication had suffered from some form of temporary schizophrenia then I'd be skeptical.

And Clak, I willingly concede that science has done a bang-up job of proving that average joes cannot use their minds to communicate printed symbols on paper cards into the minds of others, and as you so aptly point out pop culture entertainment has dutifully provided the punchline.

All this "men of science" and "men of faith" talk is pretty hokey. Science is just a way of using knowledge to predict outcomes. IMHO it's a mistake to believe you can understand everything by looking at the world through the window of contemporary science.[/QUOTE]

Yeah this guy gets it, I also agree with you when it comes to these disccusions as long as people don't act like jerkweeds.
 
[quote name='camoor']
All this "men of science" and "men of faith" talk is pretty hokey. Science is just a way of using knowledge to predict outcomes. IMHO it's a mistake to believe you can understand everything by looking at the world through the window of contemporary science.[/QUOTE]

I don't think contemporary science can explain everything by any stretch of the imagination.

I just accept that there are many things that are unexplainable and will be so for my lifetime. I don't feel a need to turn to faith to explain the unexplainable, so I don't buy religions, mystical explanations etc. etc. I just accept that human knowledge hasn't advanced at the level to explain and understand many things yet.

And yeah, all the telepathy etc. is another matter apart from faith. I just don't believe it as I've seen no evidence, had no personal encounters and I'm deeply skeptical person at heart and need hard evidence of first hand experience to believe anything.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']I don't think contemporary science can explain everything by any stretch of the imagination.

I just accept that there are many things that are unexplainable and will be so for my lifetime. I don't feel a need to turn to faith to explain the unexplainable, so I don't buy religions, mystical explanations etc. etc. I just accept that human knowledge hasn't advanced at the level to explain and understand many things yet.

And yeah, all the telepathy etc. is another matter apart from faith. I just don't believe it as I've seen no evidence, had no personal encounters and I'm deeply skeptical person at heart and need hard evidence of first hand experience to believe anything.[/QUOTE]

Thanks dmaul, even though we may disagree on the topic at hand, you understood exactly my point. Another thing I believe is that it's a good thing for a society to have a wide range of viewpoints. If there's one thing we're lacking it's probably reasonable skeptics such as yourself.
 
[quote name='camoor']Gee you haven't read the whole thread, have you.

Sarang was just saying he experienced it and I have a close friend who experienced it too. I have also read of anecdotal cases. Granted this is not irrefutable scientific method proof but that doesn't necessarily invalidate it. I will grant that it could turn out to be confabulation, but I lean towards the idea that there is something there.

BTW your responses are what I refer to as the religion of athiesm (as opposed to normal athiesm). The idea that you cannot have an opinion on anything until it has been proven via the scientific method.[/QUOTE]

Frankly the Atheists that piss me off are all about the Pharmaceutical love while completely dismissing the idea of Herbal cures. They also completely love the mainstream media. They don't carry enough cynicism for Pharma and others, the same sheeple that think they're so ahead of the curve and smart because they're Atheist.
But I suppose it makes sense. For these Atheists anything like a False Flag Operation, aside from shouting "We did it!" is not believed, regardless of the logical points you put out. Same with Big Pharma and other things. They apply the Scientific Method in situations that can never truly be proven given their area. This is much like believing the Free Market will sort out the winner, GMO and Non-GMO crops. You don't have any ground to fight from, no defined line. No Free Market fighting. The rules don't apply, just as in the former example cited.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']I don't feel a need to turn to faith to explain the unexplainable[/QUOTE]

This is my pet peeve..the idea that faith explains anything about anything. I don't think I'm being a jerk in pointing out that it doesn't. If it were a valid means of acquiring knowledge/explanations, there would be some sort of worldwide consensus developing around it..but we see quite the opposite. This isn't about bashing faith and worshiping science. It's about respecting the best proven method for arriving at TRUTH...and not respecting "methods" that have failed to do this. The problem is that faith is so entwined with some people's worldviews that the moment someone publicly dismisses it, people take it as a direct attack on their character. Christians today might LOL at Indians jumping around doing raindances or some primitive ritual designed to communicate with the gods..and those Indians would be highly offended by it. But it's not your fault they choose to believe crazy stuff in the absence of evidence is it? You aren't calling them pedophiles or scum.. You are simply dismissing a particular irrational belief they have. To be silent would be to perpetuate the behavior, whereas if you at least lodge an objection, maybe the younger crowd will shift their thinking a bit..and the silly ritual will die out in another generation.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']I don't feel a need to turn to faith to explain the unexplainable[/QUOTE]

This is my pet peeve..the idea that faith explains anything about anything. I don't think I'm being a jerk in pointing out that it doesn't. If it were a valid means of acquiring knowledge/explanations, there would be some sort of worldwide consensus developing around it..but we see quite the opposite. This isn't about bashing faith and worshiping science. It's about respecting the best proven method for arriving at TRUTH...and not respecting "methods" that have failed to do this. The problem is that faith is so entwined with some people's worldviews that the moment someone publicly dismisses it, people take it as a direct attack on their character. Christians today might LOL at Indians jumping around doing raindances or some primitive ritual designed to communicate with the gods..and those Indians would be highly offended by it. But it's not your fault they choose to believe crazy stuff in the absence of evidence is it? You aren't calling them pedophiles or scum.. You are simply dismissing a particular irrational belief they have. To be silent would be to perpetuate the behavior, whereas if you at least lodge an objection, maybe the younger crowd will shift their thinking a bit.
 
[quote name='Sarang01']Frankly the Atheists that piss me off are all about the Pharmaceutical love while completely dismissing the idea of Herbal cures. They also completely love the mainstream media. They don't carry enough cynicism for Pharma and others, the same sheeple that think they're so ahead of the curve and smart because they're Atheist.[/QUOTE]

There may be some people that dismiss herbal medicine outright, but there really isn't any difference between an "herbal" medicine and some synthesized chemical. The point is to test something and if it works you use it and if it doesn't then you don't. Morphine (and other opiates) comes from a plant and nobody cares. Marijuana is used medicinally and I can't think of anything more "herbal" than that. But if some herbal medicine is tested and doesn't work then it doesn't work (and then of course you have homeopathy that doesn't even make any sense and can't possibly work). Every medicinal herb doesn't necessarily work just by virtue of it being herbal does it?

The same pharmaceutical companies sell you herbal medicine that sell you non-herbal medicine. They don't care if it works or not. It isn't like herbal medicine is some super cheap alternative, it's a profitable and unregulated market. When you sell herbal medicine you get to bypass the FDA, clinical trials, hell, your medicine doesn't even have to contain anything in it and you can still sell it to people. Pharmaceutical companies don't pass up that opportunity.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']Agreed. Being pushy with views is hardly something unique to atheists.

In fact is much more common in religions since you have denominations like Mormons (to just pick one example without picking on them for any certain reason) that require followers to go on missions and try to convert people to their faith etc.[/QUOTE]

Just to be clear. One of , if not the largest tenenants of the mormon faith is free will. There is no "requirment" to serve a mission. Not serving a mission doesnt disqualify you for anything within the LDS church.
 
I hate to keep talking about Dawkins like i'm in love with the guy, but Bill O'Reilly once threw out the "science can't explain everything" comment and Dawkins simply replied "but we're working on it" Thats the difference between science and religion in a nutshell. Science is working to explain things, religions are not. What science can't explain today it may tomorrow, but I don't see any religion evolving (little joke there...) to really explain things.

I firmly believe that given an adequate amount of time to test and research, there's nothing the scientific process can't explain. That is things that aren't set up to be unexplainable.

But feeling a telepathic presence is no different than someone feeling they've spoken to god.
 
This is a good and necessary discussion. Religion does oppress society. Actively. Consider marriage. It is an institution that is religious in nature and our so called "separation of church and state" gov't institutes marriage. Other nations like Israel only allow religious organizations to confer marriage. The state takes no part in it. If you want to live with someone and a long term relationship, WHY do you need someone else, especially an authority, to validate it for the 2 of you. Or 3 or 4 if polygamy is more your flavor.

Look at gays in this country. Marriage is obviously a supposed moral/religious bastion with all these conservatives getting in a bunch. How about polygamy? Why can't consenting adults be committed to more than one other person? Religion oppresses. That is a fact. It would be fine if religion followers did not try to impose their beliefs on others. FAT CHANCE. Look at reality.

Check out this funny take on gay marriage from Aziz Ansari at 2:30 into it. Funny and oh so true. Enjoy!
http://fliiby.com/file/811357/lw73q57y9v.html
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']

In fact is much more common in religions since you have denominations like Mormons (to just pick one example without picking on them for any certain reason) that require followers to go on missions and try to convert people to their faith etc.

[/QUOTE]

fyi, mormons are not required in any way, shape or form to go on a mission. they are 100% voluntary.
 
Thanks for the clarification. Nearly everyone who's ever knocked on my door spouting religion had been mormon--along with the stories of BYU athletes who delay going pro to do a mission etc.--so I'd thought it was a mandatory part of the faith. Like eating kosher for Orthodox Jews etc.

So I stand corrected, and will now direct my disdain at the door knockers for being asshole zealots who feel the need to go around and shove their views on others without invitation rather than at the whole denomination! :D
 
[quote name='fatherofcaitlyn']I spoke with God once. I gave Him a call, but pushed 9 in the IVR. He started speaking in Spanish. I hung up, but forgot the number.[/QUOTE]
That wasn't god, that was a level 1 support guy named Jesus.
 
[quote name='joeboosauce']This is a good and necessary discussion. Religion does oppress society. Actively. Consider marriage. It is an institution that is religious in nature and our so called "separation of church and state" gov't institutes marriage. Other nations like Israel only allow religious organizations to confer marriage. The state takes no part in it. If you want to live with someone and a long term relationship, WHY do you need someone else, especially an authority, to validate it for the 2 of you. Or 3 or 4 if polygamy is more your flavor.

Look at gays in this country. Marriage is obviously a supposed moral/religious bastion with all these conservatives getting in a bunch. How about polygamy? Why can't consenting adults be committed to more than one other person? Religion oppresses. That is a fact. It would be fine if religion followers did not try to impose their beliefs on others. FAT CHANCE. Look at reality.

Check out this funny take on gay marriage from Aziz Ansari at 2:30 into it. Funny and oh so true. Enjoy!
http://fliiby.com/file/811357/lw73q57y9v.html[/QUOTE]
We've also made marriage a legal issue in the U.S.. Imagine trying to convince a health insurance company that your 5 wives and however many children should all be covered by your employer provided coverage.
 
stop quoting that guy, i was enjoying not having to read his posts.

edit:

I'm with dmaul, I hate door knockers. I don't come to your house wanting to talk to you about movies, games and anime, so leave me alone.
 
I know of feel sorry for witnesses around here, it's nearly 100F and they're out walking in dress clothes. That's suffering for your faith. :lol:
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']Thanks for the clarification. Nearly everyone who's ever knocked on my door spouting religion had been mormon--along with the stories of BYU athletes who delay going pro to do a mission etc.--so I'd thought it was a mandatory part of the faith. Like eating kosher for Orthodox Jews etc.

So I stand corrected, and will now direct my disdain at the door knockers for being asshole zealots who feel the need to go around and shove their views on others without invitation rather than at the whole denomination! :D[/QUOTE]

I'm with you on the asshole zealot part.
 
[quote name='Clak']I hate to keep talking about Dawkins like i'm in love with the guy, but Bill O'Reilly once threw out the "science can't explain everything" comment and Dawkins simply replied "but we're working on it" Thats the difference between science and religion in a nutshell. Science is working to explain things, religions are not. What science can't explain today it may tomorrow, but I don't see any religion evolving (little joke there...) to really explain things.

I firmly believe that given an adequate amount of time to test and research, there's nothing the scientific process can't explain. That is things that aren't set up to be unexplainable.

But feeling a telepathic presence is no different than someone feeling they've spoken to god.[/QUOTE]

Religions come in all flavors, from conservative to progressive. Perhaps fundamentalists are completely resistent to change, and perhaps religion in the US is overrepresented by conservatives, but for any other type of practitioner you will find shades of grey.

Unless you have proof that eventually humanity will be able to predict everything in the universe, your belief that science can explain everything is simply that, a belief. You are a self-professed member of the Church of Science.

There's a subtle difference between my limited belief in telepathy and someone thinking they speak to god. My belief in telepathy is not absolute by any stretch, it is leaving the door open to the possiblity that telepathy can occur in very specific situations, and it takes into account that this is based on my layman analysis of anecdotal evidence. Typically when Americans speak of talking to God they are speaking of Christians, and Christians have faith (IE 100% confidence) that they are communicating with a supernatural entity. It seemed to me to be a loaded sentence, so I felt the need to clarify.
 
[quote name='camoor']
Unless you have proof that eventually humanity will be able to predict everything in the universe, your belief that science can explain everything is simply that, a belief. You are a self-professed member of the Church of Science.
[/QUOTE]


The fact of the matter is that there are certain things that will never be explained. Ever. By religion or science.

If the Big Bang created the universe, what hell created the objects, gasses etc. that caused the Big Bang?

If god created the universe, who the hell created god?

There are some things that are just unexplainable. To me the difference between a man of science and a man of faith is that the former just accepts that somethings can't be understood while trying to find evidence to explain as much as possible. While the latter has faith and can except mystical explanations for things beyond comprehension.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']
If the Big Bang created the universe, what hell created the objects, gasses etc. that caused the Big Bang?

If god created the universe, who the hell created god?

[/QUOTE]

the answer to both is obvious. but ill only tell you for $49.95.
 
[quote name='camoor']Religions come in all flavors, from conservative to progressive. Perhaps fundamentalists are completely resistent to change, and perhaps religion in the US is overrepresented by conservatives, but for any other type of practitioner you will find shades of grey.

Unless you have proof that eventually humanity will be able to predict everything in the universe, your belief that science can explain everything is simply that, a belief. You are a self-professed member of the Church of Science.

There's a subtle difference between my limited belief in telepathy and someone thinking they speak to god. My belief in telepathy is not absolute by any stretch, it is leaving the door open to the possiblity that telepathy can occur in very specific situations, and it takes into account that this is based on my layman analysis of anecdotal evidence. Typically when Americans speak of talking to God they are speaking of Christians, and Christians have faith (IE 100% confidence) that they are communicating with a supernatural entity. It seemed to me to be a loaded sentence, so I felt the need to clarify.[/QUOTE]
Ah but you see, my confidence is not based on faith, but rather the fact that science continues to make progress in many areas. That continued progress is what leads me to believe that given enough time (and money I suppose) that science can explain the explainable. Science will never prove nor disprove the existence of god because it's an idea that cannot be proven or disproved.

When I say that telepathy and talking to god are the same things, I mean physically. If they were possible, there would be little difference. People seriously believe they have heard god speak to them, if you really, honestly believe you've felt some sort of telepathic link to someone, how is that any different? Both are about as probable, only the subjects spoken to are different.

There have been times I've thought I heard voices, but I also know the human mind can play tricks on us. Seeing things we want to see, hearing things we want to hear.
 
i have a story. when i was younger i smoked pot, quite often. one time hanging out with friends we were discussing the morality of our recreational activities. i simply said that if god didnt want me to smoke pot hed give me a sign. the same day on my way to purchase some marijuana i got a flat tire, my spare was flat so i had to call a tow truck. the cost was $50, the exact amount of the 1/8th i was on the way to buy. spooky eh? i dont smoke pot anymore (though not because of that incident, i actually paid for the tow and bought the pot anyway).
 
[quote name='SpazX']There may be some people that dismiss herbal medicine outright, but there really isn't any difference between an "herbal" medicine and some synthesized chemical. The point is to test something and if it works you use it and if it doesn't then you don't. Morphine (and other opiates) comes from a plant and nobody cares. Marijuana is used medicinally and I can't think of anything more "herbal" than that. But if some herbal medicine is tested and doesn't work then it doesn't work (and then of course you have homeopathy that doesn't even make any sense and can't possibly work). Every medicinal herb doesn't necessarily work just by virtue of it being herbal does it?

The same pharmaceutical companies sell you herbal medicine that sell you non-herbal medicine. They don't care if it works or not. It isn't like herbal medicine is some super cheap alternative, it's a profitable and unregulated market. When you sell herbal medicine you get to bypass the FDA, clinical trials, hell, your medicine doesn't even have to contain anything in it and you can still sell it to people. Pharmaceutical companies don't pass up that opportunity.[/QUOTE]

I would be skeptical on a synthesized chemical and an herbal medicine really not having any difference. Also I'm sure some companies do testing but I frankly don't WANT herbal meds. to get testing under the FDA because they'll all end up getting defacto banned in the process, what with the fact they're in bed with Big Pharma. Herbal cures, REAL one's, are too much of a threat, are too cheap, unless they require a certain process or mixture you can patent to them, COUGHBayerAspirinCOUGH. So basically Big Pharma would use the FDA to sabotage all the studies, all the while making them look legitimate.
Look at all these Pharmaceutical drugs we see people getting sick from nowadays. You couldn't PAY me to take that crap. I'll grant you all those side effects have to be listed from the study if even ONE person has them. I'm extremely skeptical of Pharmaceutical and trust them as far as I can throw them. It's not the underlings but the CEO's as such.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']Ever figure out what sign god was giving you by removing the shift key from every keyboard you use to post on forums?[/QUOTE]

you must have missed my question mark, dollar sign and parentheses.

jackass.
 
[quote name='RAMSTORIA']you must have missed my question mark, dollar sign and parentheses.

jackass.[/QUOTE]

Touche. So what did you do for god to smite your ability to use proper capitalization? :D

I'm no grammar nazi, and make plenty of typos myself, but have to admit I often skip reading your posts as lack of capitalization is an eyesore.
 
[quote name='dmaul1114']Touche. So what did you do for god to smite your ability to use proper capitalization? :D

I'm no grammar nazi, and make plenty of typos myself, but have to admit I often skip reading your posts as lack of capitalization is an eyesore.[/QUOTE]

just a grammar hitler youth.

its a forum, i just dont bother. if i write an email to someone, ill take the time to make it proper, but this is just CAG (you like that), so whatever.
 
Why do Atheist care so much in something they don't believe? If you deny the fact any gods or goddess exist, then what's big deal?
 
[quote name='LuKazKane']Why do Atheist care so much in something they don't believe? If you deny the fact any gods or goddess exist, then what's big deal?[/QUOTE]

Most of us don't care.

The only time I think about god, religion etc. is when in a discussion like this on a forum or with friends. Or when some religious person is forcing their views on me etc.

Otherwise, it never crosses my mind.
 
[quote name='Clak']Ah but you see, my confidence is not based on faith, but rather the fact that science continues to make progress in many areas. That continued progress is what leads me to believe that given enough time (and money I suppose) that science can explain the explainable. Science will never prove nor disprove the existence of god because it's an idea that cannot be proven or disproved.[/QUOTE]

Sounds like you'd be a big fan of Hegel and Kant.

Just because we know more then we did yesterday doesn't mean that eventually we'll know everything. Today there are problems with trying to make sense of everything, even moreso only using one methodology. To a scientist such as yourself, I could point to Schrödinger's cat. To believe that we will not only solve these contraditions but that we will know everything, using science, with 100% confidence, well that's nothing more then an article of faith.

[quote name='RAMSTORIA']i have a story. when i was younger i smoked pot, quite often. one time hanging out with friends we were discussing the morality of our recreational activities. i simply said that if god didnt want me to smoke pot hed give me a sign. the same day on my way to purchase some marijuana i got a flat tire, my spare was flat so i had to call a tow truck. the cost was $50, the exact amount of the 1/8th i was on the way to buy. spooky eh? i dont smoke pot anymore (though not because of that incident, i actually paid for the tow and bought the pot anyway).[/QUOTE]

Sounds a lot like synchronicity.
 
[quote name='camoor']To believe that we will not only solve these contraditions but that we will know everything, using science, with 100% confidence, well that's nothing more then an article of faith.
[/QUOTE]

I think that's going to far. As I said earlier, I can accept that there are some things we'll simply never know/be able to explain.

And I'm fine with that. I'm not willing to take the easy way out and explain away the unexplainable with religion, mysticism, the supernatural etc.

I'll just write those off as things beyond the human intellect to figure out.
 
[quote name='camoor']Sounds a lot like synchronicity.[/QUOTE]

The situation doesn't really seem that unlikely really. Most people don't really pay attention to their spare tire until they get a flat, so it has a good chance of being flat itself when it's needed. And $50 seems about right for a tow to somewhere nearby (probably more than that now, I dunno how long ago that was).

So I dunno, seems reasonably likely to happen really.

Missed this one:

[quote name='Sarang01']I would be skeptical on a synthesized chemical and an herbal medicine really not having any difference.[/quote]

Well there would be differences if they're actually different substances. I just mean that chemicals are chemicals and are all created by chemical processes. Whether it's natural or not doesn't make it a different chemical.

[quote name='Sarang01']Also I'm sure some companies do testing but I frankly don't WANT herbal meds. to get testing under the FDA because they'll all end up getting defacto banned in the process, what with the fact they're in bed with Big Pharma. Herbal cures, REAL one's, are too much of a threat, are too cheap, unless they require a certain process or mixture you can patent to them, COUGHBayerAspirinCOUGH. So basically Big Pharma would use the FDA to sabotage all the studies, all the while making them look legitimate.[/quote]

I was just saying that pharmaceutical companies don't really care that herbal remedies exist - they sell them. There's no reason why they would really want them banned as long as they're making money. They would love if their shit didn't have to be tested now either, it would be a hell of a lot cheaper for them. Herbal medicines aren't that cheap either, depending on what you're looking for. Aspirin isn't patented in the US either.

[quote name='Sarang01']Look at all these Pharmaceutical drugs we see people getting sick from nowadays. You couldn't PAY me to take that crap. I'll grant you all those side effects have to be listed from the study if even ONE person has them. I'm extremely skeptical of Pharmaceutical and trust them as far as I can throw them. It's not the underlings but the CEO's as such.[/QUOTE]

I don't trust them either, that's why I want their medicines to be tested. I also don't trust somebody selling me herbal medicines and I'd like them to be tested as well. Snake oil doesn't require a big company my friend.
 
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Not now it's not patented but back in the 1800's I remember Bayer patenting the buffer process et al. That's why Aspirin is considered legitimate instead of quackery. Because Bayer made money hand over fist selling the buffered Aspirin.
 
[quote name='camoor']Sounds like you'd be a big fan of Hegel and Kant.

Just because we know more then we did yesterday doesn't mean that eventually we'll know everything. Today there are problems with trying to make sense of everything, even moreso only using one methodology. To a scientist such as yourself, I could point to Schrödinger's cat. To believe that we will not only solve these contraditions but that we will know everything, using science, with 100% confidence, well that's nothing more then an article of faith.



Sounds a lot like synchronicity.[/QUOTE]I'd call it gambling before i called it faith. Using historical trends to attempt to predict the future isn't an act of faith. I'm betting that based on progress made by science that someday we may be able to explain at least very nearly everything that can be explained. I do want you to keep in mind that when I said "given enough time" it could be a very, very, very long time.
 
[quote name='Clak']I'd love to ask them why in the next 40 years when he didn't in the last 40.[/QUOTE]

hes waiting for hoverboards to be invented of course
 
[quote name='Sporadic']I would argue that it would be because they were poorly raised over the lack of religion. If the only thing keeping you in check is the the threat of an all-watching boogeyman in the sky potentially sending you to a lake of fire when you die...your parents did a shitty job.[/QUOTE]

you fail to see what I am saying, you do not have to agree. I don't care what anyone believes, I am just thankful for the many that do believe, because I BELIEVE that we would be much worse off without religious beliefs.
 
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