For the love of god don't delete this!!!

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[quote name='Vampyre611']wow maybe i just take my writing ability for granted. I can't imagine 'forgetting' how to write an essay but i am an English major, and have been writing essays as long as i can remember (it seems)[/QUOTE]

Try not writing for a year (a little more actually). Then have to go to a class and write out a 2 page essay. It's even worse when you don't have the time to go back and start over. About halfway through I realize that my intro was horrendous, and the structure was poor. The biggest problem was some of the points made in the first paragraph were the same point, meaning I had to figure out a way to argue the same point in 2 or 3 paragraphs but attempt to differentiate it. All the test was was figuring out if you went straight to the normal freshman english, the remedial one (and then the regular one after), or the extremely basic course (then the remedial, or normal one, depending on how you do in that class). Like you, I couldn't believe that the writing test would be any issue whatsoever; I figured I'd bomb the math test. Oddly enough I did halfway decent on that one.

I'm not an english major, but I've always been able to write very well when I'm doing an essay or a report. In high school, and in college, I generally get A's on papers. When I do get a b or lower, it's because of the work itself, not the writing quality. I do have a strange way of wording things though, some professors seem to like it and some don't.
 
I could not stand not writting for a year... i love it. even essays... it's kinda sick and i'm pretty sure it should be some sort of disorder but...

and i can understand writing a crap essay when you are under time constraints and whatnot, i just did a midterm that was going so bad i actually did start over and vomit up a odd little four paragraph essay but when you have time....
 
[quote name='Vampyre611']I could not stand not writting for a year... i love it. even essays... it's kinda sick and i'm pretty sure it should be some sort of disorder but...

and i can understand writing a crap essay when you are under time constraints and whatnot, i just did a midterm that was going so bad i actually did start over and vomit up a odd little four paragraph essay but when you have time....[/QUOTE]
Indeed, I hate writing under a tight time constraint.
 
Do you guys realize that teachers in high school dont care about content? If you write the minimum amount of pages required and stay on topic you're pretty much guaranteed a C+.

That being said, essays are usually at least 3 opages long, more often they are 5 minumum.
 
[quote name='whiteboy']Do you guys realize that teachers in high school dont care about content? If you write the minimum amount of pages required and stay on topic you're pretty much guaranteed a C+.

That being said, essays are usually at least 3 opages long, more often they are 5 minumum.[/QUOTE]

C+ isn't a good grade. Technically C is average, but, in practice, B is average.
 
"B" is above average and an "A" is above and beyond and a "C" is average. anything below a "C" well then you just really suck.
 
[quote name='mr ryles']"B" is above average and an "A" is above and beyond and a "C" is average. anything below a "C" well then you just really suck.[/QUOTE]

Yes, technically. But in practice it's not. Recieving a C is a bad grade, that's how students look at it, and that's how colleges look at it. B is the "normal" grade.
 
[quote name='whiteboy']Do you guys realize that teachers in high school dont care about content? If you write the minimum amount of pages required and stay on topic you're pretty much guaranteed a C+.[/QUOTE]


Not my High School. at least not my teachers, you needed at least a well supported thesis for a C, well supported original thesis for a B and a superbly supported original thesis for an A
 
[quote name='Sleepkyng']goddamnit, let's clear this up once and for all.

It is not the 5 paragraph essay. It is simply the Essay form, also known as the Sonata Form Essay
http://www.mta.ca/faculty/arts-letters/music/academics/guides/styleguide/outline.html

The three "support" pieces are actually the culimation of one argument for the thesis by way of honing and focusing evidence into a simple statment. The "conclusion" is not anything of the sort, but is rather a restatment of the thesis, using the newfound structure of *gasp* the essay to bring out and refresh the initial idea.

Much like... A sonata!

Wiki for your convienence[/QUOTE]

Yes, I know... however, that isn't how many teachers (and a couple of lesson plans I've seen) teach it. Perhaps I'm underestimating the age of the average poster, but many new lesson plans for teaching the Sonata Form Essay call for having a teacher assign Mutiple 5 paragraph essays in a short period where the students are graded not only on content and properly citing, but also on adherence to the form.

Rather than throw out what could be the very vauge Sonata Method, which the others may or may not have heard of, I though out the rough diagram of it, hoping they'd be more likely to remember it (There are far few good english teachers that poor ones).

Your sarcasm and condescending tone are neither neccessary nor appreciated.
 
[quote name='JSweeney']Yes, I know... however, that isn't how many teachers (and a couple of lesson plans I've seen) teach it. Perhaps I'm underestimating the age of the average poster, but many new lesson plans for teaching the Sonata Form Essay call for having a teacher assign Mutiple 5 paragraph essays in a short period where the students are graded not only on content and properly citing, but also on adherence to the form.

Rather than throw out what could be the very vauge Sonata Method, which the others may or may not have heard of, I though out the rough diagram of it, hoping they'd be more likely to remember it (There are far few good english teachers that poor ones).

Your sarcasm and condescending tone are neither neccessary nor appreciated.[/QUOTE]

oh lighten up a little. No one's called it the Sonata Form essay for decades. Even if the sarcasm was intended towards you (which it wasn't, it was a jab at my MAT program) I would have assumed that the JSweeny would have had a little thicker skin than that ;)
 
[quote name='JSweeney']Your sarcasm and condescending tone are neither neccessary nor appreciated.[/QUOTE]

Yeah - sarcasm and condescending tone belongs to the VS boards, don't try and take it away! ;)
 
[quote name='Vampyre611']Too late. I am alarmed. What is the world coming to when university students can't connect paragraphs and coherently express their ideas?[/QUOTE]

You guys are being too hard on him. Even Supreme Court nominees have problems with writing (and this is not from the Onion, I swear!):

Court Nominee Is Asked to Redo Reply to Questions
WASHINGTON, Oct. 19 - The Supreme Court nomination of Harriet E. Miers suffered another setback on Wednesday when the Republican and Democratic leaders of the Senate Judiciary Committee asked her to resubmit parts of her judicial questionnaire, saying various members had found her responses "inadequate," "insufficient" and "insulting."
...
Veteran senators and aides said they could not recall another occasion when the committee had sent back a nominee's answers to a questionnaire because they were incomplete.
Click to expand...

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/20/politics/politicsspecial1/20confirm.html?hp&ex=1129780800&en=19c8ac980653a543&ei=5094&partner=homepage
 
[quote name='Sleepkyng']oh lighten up a little. No one's called it the Sonata Form essay for decades. Even if the sarcasm was intended towards you (which it wasn't, it was a jab at my MAT program) I would have assumed that the JSweeny would have had a little thicker skin than that ;)[/QUOTE]

Who is this JSweeny people keep talking about? I've never seen him around here. :lol:
 
[quote name='camoor']Yeah - sarcasm and condescending tone belongs to the VS boards, don't try and take it away! ;)[/QUOTE]

Well, the condescending tone, at least.
I'm not sure if most of the VS board posters can pull of the sarcasm part. ;)
 
[quote name='camoor']You guys are being too hard on him. Even Supreme Court nominees have problems with writing (and this is not from the Onion, I swear!):

[/QUOTE]


I think the problem is America is getting too lenient. Too soft. We're too worried to about offending people that we don't offer any real criticism. We offer this crappy point-out-two-good-things-for-every-bad type of criticism. We need to get back to the days where if you weren't any good at something people would tell you, and if you really wanted it you worked for it. Look at Lincoln he was a huge failure at politics, but he worked his face of for it. People told him he was bad, they told him he should give up, he didn't becuase he wanted it. [/rant]
 
Wow, do you guys get off on making fun of this fellow's assignment?

I'll admit I found this thread to be amusing, mostly because of the respondents' rush to make sure everyone knows how much harder their English class was.
 
It could be that this is just an overnight assignment and not suppose to be a couple pages in length having much if any thought put into it.

I had a teacher who liked to have us write smaller 'practice' essays of 2 or less paragraphs. However, those essays almost always turned into bigger papers.

OP - please review how to use pronouns such as that. Punctuation is also important.

I, like many others, have a difficult time believing this is for an honors class at a high school level. I haven't writen anything like that essay since 4th grade...although I still made some of the OP's mistakes up until 7th. (I know I still make them a lot when talking)

If he was looking for a barely passing grade, he most likely succeed. He does have the basics of an essay which should get him a minimum passing grade.
 
[quote name='Vampyre611']I think the problem is America is getting too lenient. Too soft. We're too worried to about offending people that we don't offer any real criticism. We offer this crappy point-out-two-good-things-for-every-bad type of criticism. We need to get back to the days where if you weren't any good at something people would tell you, and if you really wanted it you worked for it. Look at Lincoln he was a huge failure at politics, but he worked his face of for it. People told him he was bad, they told him he should give up, he didn't becuase he wanted it. [/rant][/QUOTE]

Word, until you get to the Lincoln part.

My essay about Lincoln:

Lincoln was the man - he learned the alphabet by writing the letters in dirt with a shovel! He also had a totally sweet stovetop pipe hat. For some reason they left the stovetop pipe hat off of his monument. His wife was into psychics, and he liked to dance. THE END
 
[quote name='camoor']Word, until you get to the Lincoln part.

My essay about Lincoln:

Lincoln was the man - he learned the alphabet by writing the letters in dirt with a shovel! He also had a totally sweet stovetop pipe hat. For some reason they left the stovetop pipe hat off of his monument. His wife was into psychics, and he liked to dance. THE END[/QUOTE]

A+ work! Good job! :applause:
 
[quote name='Vampyre611']I think the problem is America is getting too lenient. Too soft. We're too worried to about offending people that we don't offer any real criticism. We offer this crappy point-out-two-good-things-for-every-bad type of criticism. [/QUOTE]

The senate isn't pulling any punches with Miers, however. You'd think she'd have the wherewithal to at least cut-and-paste some articles from wikipedia.

Senate: Did you make any representations to any individuals or interest groups as to how you might rule as a justice if confirmed? Please describe and provide four copies of all communications by the Bush administration or individuals acting on behalf of the administration to any individuals or interest groups with respect to how you would rule if confirmed.

Miers: No
Click to expand...
W T F
 
i guess i should have clarified about lincoln... i did in my head.... i meant he was a failure BEFORE becomeing president... he lost numerous elections and buisnesses before he finally got the ball rolling and become one of the greatest men in american History... people told him to give up but he didn't. He taught himself law and worked his way into the whitehouse. that's the point, if you fail at something just work harder don't expect people to feel sorry for you because that's not your thing....... sorry for not being clear before
 
[quote name='Vampyre611']i guess i should have clarified about lincoln... i did in my head.... i meant he was a failure BEFORE becomeing president... he lost numerous elections and buisnesses before he finally got the ball rolling and become one of the greatest men in american History... people told him to give up but he didn't. He taught himself law and worked his way into the whitehouse. that's the point, if you fail at something just work harder don't expect people to feel sorry for you because that's not your thing....... sorry for not being clear before[/QUOTE]

Word, although I don't know. If George W. had given up after failing in multiple businesses, we'd all be better off. Maybe some people should be encouraged to give up ;)
 
[quote name='camoor']Word, although I don't know. If George W. had given up after failing in multiple businesses, we'd all be better off. Maybe some people should be encouraged to give up ;)[/QUOTE]

can't......resist......the.....urge....to make....smartass comment........
 
[quote name='Vampyre611']i guess i should have clarified about lincoln... i did in my head.... i meant he was a failure BEFORE becomeing president... he lost numerous elections and buisnesses before he finally got the ball rolling and become one of the greatest men in american History... people told him to give up but he didn't. He taught himself law and worked his way into the whitehouse. that's the point, if you fail at something just work harder don't expect people to feel sorry for you because that's not your thing....... sorry for not being clear before[/QUOTE]

And you could add all the parts about how he advocated deporting all blacks back to africa, that he strongly favored colonization (liberia being the ideal spot). Or how he believed that blacks were not equal in color, intellectual capacity, morality etc.. As his life neared its end, he seemed to be backing off of some of his more aggressive racist beliefs, and there's plenty of controversy over his opinions near the end of his life.
 
[quote name='camoor']Word, although I don't know. If George W. had given up after failing in multiple businesses, we'd all be better off. Maybe some people should be encouraged to give up ;)[/QUOTE]

Ah, but Bush was encouraged despite his failures while Lincoln was not.;)
 
[quote name='camoor']Word, although I don't know. If George W. had given up after failing in multiple businesses, we'd all be better off. Maybe some people should be encouraged to give up ;)[/QUOTE]

But i hear he got really good grades in college ;)
 
[quote name='dental_regurgitation']Wow, do you guys get off on making fun of this fellow's assignment?

I'll admit I found this thread to be amusing, mostly because of the respondents' rush to make sure everyone knows how much harder their English class was.[/QUOTE]he created a thread about it, but most of us are trying to help him out, even if we're being dicks about it.
 
[quote name='Vampyre611']wow maybe i just take my writing ability for granted. I can't imagine 'forgetting' how to write an essay but i am an English major, and have been writing essays as long as i can remember (it seems)[/QUOTE]


As an English major, you probably aren't stellar in math (usually works that way). Imagine how difficult it was for you to get through whatever highest math class it was you took. Then take a year off. Then take a test on it. I bet you'll sweat through it and not do very well.

That's how it is for people who aren't "English" people. And let me clarify, I was speaking of many HIGH SCHOOLS not teaching connectivity in writing. I've had many students who can't complete an adequate short essay in their intro comp class. They were getting As and Bs in high school. Scary stuff. And I don't think it's about 'getting soft' it's about that teachers are now mommy, daddy, counselor, provider of nutrition, the one with the emotional support, and oh yeah, they gotta teach something to the 30+ kids they have in a class.

I am now done spouting. Go about your business.
 
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