Has Rockstar gone too far with 'Bully'?

Scrubking

Scrubking

CAGiversary!
The idea of playing a disturbed teen who beats on other kids for fun seems tasteless. What game will they come out with next? The rapist? Or the serial killer?

I don't mind violence and sex in games, but where do we draw the line? Beating up children for the hell of it seems to cross that line.
 
The article in Game informer seemed to hint at comedic violence; perhaps something along the same line as Problem Child, or Home Alone. Who knows, it may be a half way decent game if you give a chance.
 
[quote name='Scrubking']The idea of playing a disturbed teen who beats on other kids for fun seems tasteless. What game will they come out with next? The rapist? Or the serial killer?

I don't mind violence and sex in games, but where do we draw the line? Beating up children for the hell of it seems to cross that line.[/QUOTE]

it may be just me, but i think "the rapist" would be a little worse than a student beating up another student....you make it sound worse than it is when you say "teen" beating up "kids"...then you only add to that by saying "beating up children" at the end
 
[quote name='BigB']The article in Game informer seemed to hint at comedic violence; perhaps something along the same line as Problem Child, or Home Alone. Who knows, it may be a half way decent game if you give a chance.[/QUOTE]

i read that too and the game sounds fun to me...i'll definitely be picking it up (shocker)

if anything, i think Rockstar might be pushing the issue on making parents teach their kids "right from wrong"....so that way, when they play games like this and GTA, Manhunt, etc...they won't go and play out what they just saw in the video game
 
[quote name='Josef']I'm not interested in the game, but I don't think the premise is any worse than Manhunt or GTA3.[/QUOTE]

The premise of Manhunt was to kill people that were criminals trying to kill you.

From want the OP says, the point of this game is to beat up kids...

Even I find that concept a bit tasteless.
 
[quote name='Kayden']The premise of Manhunt was to kiss people that were criminals trying to kill you.

From want the OP says, the point of this game is to beat up kids...

Even I find that concept a bit tasteless.[/QUOTE]

kiss? :lol:
 
[quote name='The Successful Dropout']it may be just me, but i think "the rapist" would be a little worse than a student beating up another student....you make it sound worse than it is when you say "teen" beating up "kids"...then you only add to that by saying "beating up children" at the end[/QUOTE]

Of course the 'rapist' would be worse, but it looks like that is the direction R* is headed. They seem adamant on pushing the limits, and apparently love getting sued.

And how do I make it sound worse than it is? Beating up kids IS what the game is about. You play as a kid in school who goes around starting fights and flushing other kids heads down the toilet for fun.
 
[quote name='The Successful Dropout']kiss? :lol:[/QUOTE]

:rofl:

Thats what I get for posting within 5 minutes of waking up. :lol:
 
[quote name='Scrubking']Beating up kids IS what the game is about. You play as a kid in school who goes around starting fights and flushing other kids heads down the toilet for fun.[/QUOTE]

What the hell is wrong with that? Every grade school class has a bully, so why should they be shunned from video games?

[quote name='Scrubking']I don't mind violence and sex in games, but where do we draw the line? Beating up children for the hell of it seems to cross that line.[/QUOTE]

Then, by your logic:

Killing Civilians = :D
Pornography = :D
Blood and Gore = :D
Class Bully = :whistle2:#
 
[quote name='Scrubking']Of course the 'rapist' would be worse, but it looks like that is the direction R* is headed. They seem adamant on pushing the limits, and apparently love getting sued.

And how do I make it sound worse than it is? Beating up kids IS what the game is about. You play as a kid in school who goes around starting fights and flushing other kids heads down the toilet for fun.[/QUOTE]

It's a game. How is this any worse than Rumble Roses with their lockerroom "watch" mode. Why does Bully offend you but not that? That is obviously teaching the player that women are objects right? If it was an adult beating up kids maybe I'd more more inclined to agree with you. This game will likely get an M rating anyway, so it shouldn't be in the kids hands anyway. We know how well that works, right!? :lol:
 
Its supposed to be rated T. I understand your concern But I think rockstar is just throwing some Humor with violance without the blood. I wasnt even interested at first because I thought the game was just about violence and drinking and shit like that.

After reading the gameinformer article I realized this game is more about our teenage years. The game sounds funny like I would have a good time just messing around with the students. Although it says you can beat up kids I doubt I would do that cause I have other games for that . I am more interested in pulling prancks and such.


EDIT: ok so there might be some blood at just meant not as exagerated as in the GTA games.
 
[quote name='Scrubking']Of course the 'rapist' would be worse, but it looks like that is the direction R* is headed. They seem adamant on pushing the limits, and apparently love getting sued.

And how do I make it sound worse than it is? Beating up kids IS what the game is about. You play as a kid in school who goes around starting fights and flushing other kids heads down the toilet for fun.[/QUOTE]

As far as media is concerned, this is not unique. Literature, television, movies, and music have most certainly dealt with this topic already. I can only think of examples of music (within the Hardcore and perhaps Hip-Hop genres) in which bullying is treated as a right of passage or a positive characteristic, but it is possible that television has also done so (Bumfighting maybe? Professional Wrestling?) and I'm sure it's been treated similarly in literature (though no examples come to mind).

What is changing is the demographic of gamers; we're getting older, but children are also increasing as a group of people who play games. What should change is the attitudes of retailers and (most importantly) parents in recognizing this trend. Gaming is not for kids strictly anymore, although conventional attitudes make you think that such topics should not be broached in gaming. Why make gaming one of the only forms of media in which this is the case? Why not recognize that gaming is for adults as well, and that more and more games are strictly for that age range, regardless of how classy or violent that subject is (after all, nobody's clamoring to get Chuck Palahnuik (sp?) or Dean Koontz off your bookshelves)?

As a gamer, I've already had conversations with my wife about what to expose our child to. I have no intention of letting him/her play a GTA game until they're roughly 14 or 15, about the same time I'll let them watch R-Rated movies (with exceptions all around, of course). Why do I need to worry about how far Rockstar is pushing it when I can make those decisions as a consumer and (not quite yet, anyway) as a parent?

myke.
...scrub, you sound like Joe Libermann.
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the premise of the Bully was that you're the one picked on by bullies/teachers and you're just trying to get back at them in a sort of Home Alone/Problem Child kind of way. I personally find the GTA series distasteful and as a matter of principle avoid Rockstar games (though I do not advocate censorship at all) but I actually would consider getting this game depending on how it turns out.
 
As far as media is concerned, this is not unique. Literature, television, movies, and music have most certainly dealt with this topic already.
Click to expand...

Making a movie about a bully and making a game about being a bully are two diffrent things. It should be obvious, but I guess not. It's one thing to watch a story in the third person, and another to take on the role of a bully who goes around beating kids up for fun.

Anyway, I didn't make this topic as a "what is suitable for kids" issue. I'm speaking as an adult playing what will most likely be an adult game. The idea of playing a game whose idea of fun is to torture kids and terrorize a school is tasteless to me and crosses the line.
 
[quote name='Scrubking']Making a movie about a bully and making a game about being a bully are two diffrent things. It should be obvious, but I guess not. It's one thing to watch a story in the third person, and another to take on the role of a bully who goes around beating kids up for fun.

Anyway, I didn't make this topic as a "what is suitable for kids" issue. I'm speaking as an adult playing what will most likely be an adult game. The idea of playing a game whose idea of fun is to torture kids and terrorize a school is tasteless to me and crosses the line.[/QUOTE]

So don't buy it.

Movies and games are not that easily separable in terms of role identification. What makes you think that people identify more with Tommy Vercetti from Vice City than with Batman?
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought the premise of the Bully was that you're the one picked on by bullies/teachers and you're just trying to get back at them in a sort of Home Alone/Problem Child kind of way.
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[quote name='"PSM"'][You are] Jimmy Hopkins, a trouble maker since birth, who's been unable to sustain a full year at any other school... Jimmy will have to survive a year of school by beating and manipulating any student or teacher that gets in his way.[/quote]

No, you're not the victim in this game.

I'd also like to add that R* has said that the reason they don't have kids or animals in their GTA games is because they think it would be in poor taste. I guess they have changed their minds about kids in their games.
 
[quote name='Scrubking']No, you're not the victim in this game.[/QUOTE]

Awesome. I'm getting it, then. :D

EDIT:

[quote name='Scrubking']I'd also like to add that R* has said that the reason they don't have kids or animals in their GTA games is because they think its in poor taste. I guess they have changed their minds about kids in their games.[/QUOTE]


Yeah, but in this game you aren't shooting kids in the head with an uzi.
 
I like to see the change in the amount of censorship. Remember the NES days when "Spy Vs. Spy" was considered violent? Even "Rampage" had to be considered a teen title becuase of cartoon violence. Then when Contra frist came out. All hell broke loose, for its respective time. What I find amusing is when GTA and GTA2 were out. No one cared. I loved those games. But when PS2 hit and GTA3 came out it wa such a huge deal. Parents and censors have to get their ideals straight. If they cared about the "violence and the ideals it implants to a childs mind" is total bull. I think all they care about is how real it looks. If GTA3 was on the PSone there would have never been a problem. Just my 2 cents...
 
[quote name='Scrubking']Making a movie about a bully and making a game about being a bully are two diffrent things. It should be obvious, but I guess not. It's one thing to watch a story in the third person, and another to take on the role of a bully who goes around beating kids up for fun.

Anyway, I didn't make this topic as a "what is suitable for kids" issue. I'm speaking as an adult playing what will most likely be an adult game. The idea of playing a game whose idea of fun is to torture kids and terrorize a school is tasteless to me and crosses the line.[/QUOTE]

So, what is "the line," anyway? The line of decency? Who decides where this line is? You? Me? Mom and Dad? Government?

Where is the line?

It is important to talk about this as a matter of a children's issue; if you don't want to, fine. But what is the purpose of this topic, then? To gauge other adult gamer's interest in deciding if this title or Rockstar should "slow down" or something similar? I don't get what the issue is if it isn't about children. Why discuss "an adult matter," if you will, as one in which you need to focus on the culpability of the company making the game, instead of the people making the purchases?

Really, I find Hustler tasteless, and it certainly isn't for children. Why would I bother discussing if it "crosses the line" on a forum? I'd rather let you and everybody else decide if Hustler deserves a spot next to "Great Expectations" on your bookshelf.

myke.
...methinks I made a decent point, and all you can say is "it's not about that. nyeh!"
 
i dont see the big deal...everyone has/had a bully (or bullies) in their school....so it's something that everyone can identify with....not everyone has an uzi toting thug in their neighborhood....there is no blood in the game and it's supposed to be rated TEEN....in GTA, you could do almost ANYTHING except for anything involving kids or animals...then again, you also took the role of an adult, so it was adult vs adult....this is kid vs kid....the bottom line is that a lot of games have done worse and will do worse....if this came out before Manhunt, you'd be saying the same thing about Manhunt...."OMG, first Bully...but now this?" "OMG, the violence, OMG" I'm not certain that people are going to pick this up, beat kids up in the game and than say, "OMG, I've never thought about beating up kids before, this seems fun...I think I'll go beat up the next kid that I see"

Mario Kart Double Dash has Baby Mario and Baby Luigi....with no blood...do you feel bad when you blow up Baby Mario and Baby Luigi? OMG, what next?! Now people are going to start throwing turtle shells at babies. What will they let you do in the next Mario Kart? Rape Baby Princess? Nintendo is taking it too far.
 
Game Informer says this game is going to be rated "T For Teen" so it's probably the least violent Rockstar game in years.

If you don't like it, don't buy it. I hate when people try to force their values on other people.
 
[quote name='Haggar']Game Informer says this game is going to be rated "T For Teen" so it's probably the least violent Rockstar game in years.

If you don't like it, don't buy it. I hate when people try to force their values on other people.[/QUOTE]

How am I trying to force my values on you? I made a thread asking a question and expressing an opinion in order to discuss a topic. Did I tell you not to buy the game? Did I tell you think this or that about it? No, so shut the fuck up, idiot.

Some of you wackos hear a complaint about a game's theme and lose your minds. My point is that violence is okay, but kid on kid violence, GTA style, with no real point is questionable imo. And I will wait for the official rating.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']
Really, I find Hustler tasteless, and it certainly isn't for children. Why would I bother discussing if it "crosses the line" on a forum? I'd rather let you and everybody else decide if Hustler deserves a spot next to "Great Expectations" on your bookshelf.

[/QUOTE]

I've always hated the the great majority of the works of Dickens, Fitzgerald, and Twain. So Hustler and "Great Expectations" both get placed in the same file at my house... the round file. :D
 
[quote name='Scrubking']I don't mind violence and sex in games, but where do we draw the line? Beating up children for the hell of it seems to cross that line.[/QUOTE]What is this? A dictatorship? A totalitarian state? The gov't tells people what they can or can not play or watch?



BULL. There should be NO line to cross. i.e. No restriction. Last I checked it's a FREE country, and it's up to the *adult buyer* to decide, not you. (note I said adult... obvioulsy children/teens are not yet old enough to make their own decision). The only thing I would change, is upgrading the rating from "teen" to "mature".



I don't think we should place any limits on what Adults can play or watch. Let them decide for themselves. Let them be FREE.

troy
 
[quote name='Scrubking']Some of you wackos hear a complaint about a game's theme and lose your minds. My point is that violence is okay, but kid on kid violence, GTA style, with no real point is questionable imo. And I will wait for the official rating.[/quote]

But as was pointed out several times, it's not "GTA style." You're just a school bully. You won't be killing anyone and everything you do is something we've all probably seen when we went to school.
 
[quote name='Scrubking']How am I trying to force my values on you? [/QUOTE]Don't take it personally. I think the posters are just tired of certain Elitist Americans using the government to boss us around. Especially that "political correctness" bullshit. ----- They're tired of being told what they can or can not do. Who are these Elitist Americans to tell us what we can or can not say? What we can or can not watch?



For me, the final straw happened this past week - The Supreme Court decided that private property, is no longer private. Its now community property that can be taken from you, and used to build some rich guy's mall.

What's next? The Supreme Court walks into my home & takes my Grant Theft Auto, saying its "not acceptable for a home with children"???




They're not lashing out at you Scrubking. They're lashing out against many years of feeling their freedoms being taken away.

troy
 
[quote name='Scrubking']Did I tell you not to buy the game? Did I tell you think this or that about it? No, so shut the fuck up, idiot.
[/QUOTE]

Did you ever notice how it's they crazy ones who want to ban stuff and/or "protect" you from "harmful" things? Like art. Or literature?
 
[quote name='The Successful Dropout']
Mario Kart Double Dash has Baby Mario and Baby Luigi....with no blood...do you feel bad when you blow up Baby Mario and Baby Luigi? OMG, what next?! Now people are going to start throwing turtle shells at babies. What will they let you do in the next Mario Kart? Rape Baby Princess? Nintendo is taking it too far.[/QUOTE]

But that's "fantasy violence". It's so far removed from reality that even the weakest mind won't attempt to mimic it. Rockstars' games usually strive to be much more real than Mario Kart or Looney Tunes. I really don't see a big problem with Bully (though it is tasteless), but I do have a problem with the recent trend in gaming to release the most controversial game possible. As a gamer, my stereotypical response should be that children know that they are playing a game and that this is not reality, but as someone whose taken quite a few psychology classes (complete with stats and expirements) back in college , I do know that both television and video games can effect a child's behavior.
 
There's much more to Bully than just "kid on kid violence." Bully offers the whole experience of being a ne'er-do-well 15-year-old on his last chance school. You seem to focus on the violence like it's 95% of the game, when there's much more to it. Sports, games, and even missions will round out the game. Jimmy can even get beat up himself by jocks, nerds, or preps. The bullying isn't all that much of an issue to me, as there's much worse in games. I'm definitely interested as the premise seems very fun to me.
 
WTF are you talking about dude! If you read any of the previews of the game, you'll fiind out that all the violence is done in a comedic fashion. There is no blood or gore. I wouldn't be surprised if this game was only rated Teen instead of Mature.

I cannot believe your're comparing school yard bullies to rapists and murderers. Unbe-frigging-lievable man!
 
[quote name='Scrubking']
I don't mind violence and sex in games, but where do we draw the line? Beating up children for the hell of it seems to cross that line.[/QUOTE]


So you don't mind killing hooker's or just randomly killing people but beating up a child when you playing another child you have problems with that. I have no problem with that game. I think no matter what you say about it being bad we can keep going back and forth with what else is worse. Trust me there is worse in video games. But I don't care I play all games and have yet to find a game that makes me go oh my god thats so violent or to sexual or just plain wrong. IT's JUST A GAME it's made for fun not for you to go why you beating up kids thats wrong and crossing the line and violent. It's not influential at all cause it happens everyday in our schools. Play BMX XXX then tell me the game Bully is crossing the line.
 
What will they do next?!!! A murder simulator?????!!! A crime simulator????!!! This has to be stopped before they get out of line.
 
I don't like the premise but I'm not going to tell R* to not do it. But I wonder who think this game is great would feel if R* put out a game where you were a Nazi and killed jews and americans. Kinda like a WW II game in reverse. Making that game would take balls.
 
[quote name='mykevermin']Why do I need to worry about how far Rockstar is pushing it when I can make those decisions as a consumer and (not quite yet, anyway) as a parent?[/QUOTE]
because this is america, so OBVIOUSLY youre too stupid to rase your own children.
 
before developing each game, rockstar must ask themselves, "what's a game premise thats controversial enough that we won't even have to pay for marketing?".
seriously, though, i'm all for an enforced rating system and very much opposed to videogame censorship, but it seems like rockstar is trying REALLY hard to be over the top. i'm afraid that its just gonna be a matter of time before someone wins a suit against a development studio, and then the floodgates will be opened...
 
[quote name='KingDox']I don't like the premise but I'm not going to tell R* to not do it. But I wonder who think this game is great would feel if R* put out a game where you were a Nazi and killed jews and americans. Kinda like a WW II game in reverse. Making that game would take balls.[/QUOTE]

yeah, cuz those are all great comparisons

though i must admit, i would play just about anything...nothing can really offend me
 
I'll have to see the final product before I can make an informed decision, but right now, I'm curious to see if Bully will allow me to see how "the other half lives." Needless to say, I never pointlessly picked on or purposefully created trouble with other kids when I was in grade school, but I did have a handful of worthless a-holes that did this to me.

I haven't read a lot on Bully, but I wonder what kind of age rating it will receive. (It would be funny if kids the same age as those portrayed in the game couldn't play due to age restrictions.) If the final product actually encourages real world juvenile delinquents to pick on other kids, I won't know what to think.
 
There's a difference between GTA and Bully. When GTA gets in the hands of kids, they're *very* unlikely to get access to guns and cars or take a job from a mob boss. These same kids could play Bully and get in the mindset that it's funny to beat up another kid at school, which it is clearly not.

There's a fundamental difference between violent activities against criminals or this Rumble Roses locker room thing that was mentioned and a kid beating up other kids for fun. One has adults that have chosen to be in that environment and the other is typically an act of violence against an innocent victim who has no choice but to be in the school.
 
[quote name='megashock5']

There's a fundamental difference between violent activities against criminals or this Rumble Roses locker room thing that was mentioned and a kid beating up other kids for fun. One has adults that have chosen to be in that environment and the other is typically an act of violence against an innocent victim who has no choice but to be in the school.[/QUOTE]

I actually posted about the Rumble Roses lockerroom mode. That mode still objectifies women, at least one of which who's character appears to be a teenage school girl, by letting you watch them in the lockerroom in various outfits. I don't see how this is OK and Bully is not. If a kid were to play this mode in RR, it's reasonable to assume that he would think that this type of voyeur (sp?) activity is OK, which in most cases it is not. Granted, RR is a M rated title and I am not saying that playing it will result in a bunch of wife beaters and sexual predators. I just don't get how people complain about one thing and look the other way on another when clearly both can have potentially negative effects.

As I and others have said....IT IS A GAME!!! There has been and will be worse than this.
 
[quote name='chickenhawk']I actually posted about the Rumble Roses lockerroom mode. That mode still objectifies women, at least one of which who's character appears to be a teenage school girl, by letting you watch them in the lockerroom in various outfits.[/QUOTE]

There's nothing wrong with admiring a beautiful body (either woman or man). That's not objectification.


Objectification is when you abuse a woman. Like taking her to a dance to "show off your trophy" and then locking her in a closet. Or forcing your wife to have sex, even if she says no. That's when you treat a person like an "object".


By admiring a beautiful body. No. That's just appreciating God's artistry.

troy
 
As I and others have said....IT IS A GAME!!!
Click to expand...

fuck it it's only a game!!!

Let's make a game called the pedophile where you get to go around and rape little kids for the fun of it. ITS ONLY A GAME!!!

:roll:
 
I seriously don't see the problem.....I've read articles about this game....your nuts Scrubking-- it's gonna be rated teen, it's gonna be in good humor, and this is the mildest R* game yet.
 
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