Let's argue about Mike Brown!

Anybody gonna reply? To call me a blatant racist and then run away is a bit disrespectful. ;-) Reread my post and please tell me where it is racist. I'm stretching my mind but all I can come up with is the part about being a criminal the WHOLE day. I think maybe you guys are reading that because he is black that I assume he is a criminal, the actual intent is that when you commit a crime you remain a criminal.
 
No you're a idiot because Officer Wilson didn't even know of the crime before he approached Brown.

You know why he approached Brown, is because of Ferguson racist intended law at targeting people who supposedly didn't walk the right way, a law meant to be used sparingly to stop and ticket people for MONEY..

Also while Brown may have shoplifted it hardly showed he roughed up anyone!!

If you consider shoving someone also a crime, you should spend a day in high school, you be arresting all the jocks and bullies.  And if that justify the need for death by cop, I am one for saying its time to arm the nerds and those that are bullied every day.

LOL that you would be offended by people calling you a racist, when you spout total ignorance of reality.   Again a person die EVERY DAY at the hands of a police officer in America, thats a life lost every 24hours  in America at the hands of our gov't !!

And more than that are assaulted, harassed,  imprisoned for no crime then being in the wrong place at the wrong time and targeted by a militarized police force.

And in current news a FARKING WHITE Supremacist goes on a shooting rampage in Arizona, and cops took him down with a tazer, really I mean really !!...  White lives matter  #whitelivesmatter  #whitedeservebenefitofdoubt

And he's a guy with SEVEN felonies, that out on the street not to mention he's a WHITE supremacist, yet if you have pot you probably still be in prison...LOL  and guess who's usually thrown in jail for non violent drug use ... they definitely aren't the white people

And in Virginia police find the need to rough up a BLACK college student because he was a underage drinker trying to enter a bar...LOL 

Like white kids don't underage drink in college... REALLY !!!

Yup AmeriKKKa :) ....lol

 
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Finger_Shocker said:
No you're a idiot because Officer Wilson didn't even know of the crime before he approached Brown.

You know why he approached Brown, is because of Ferguson racist intended law at targeting people who supposedly didn't walk the right way, a law meant to be used sparingly to stop and ticket people for MONEY..

Also while Brown may have shoplifted it hardly showed he roughed up anyone!!

If you consider shoving someone also a crime, you should spend a day in high school, you be arresting all the jocks and bullies. And if that justify the need for death by cop, I am one for saying its time to arm the nerds and those that are bullied every day.

LOL that you would be offended by people calling you a racist, when you spout total ignorance of reality. Again a person die EVERY DAY at the hands of a police officer in America, thats a life lost every 24hours in America at the hands of our gov't !!

And more than that are assaulted, harassed, imprisoned for no crime then being in the wrong place at the wrong time and targeted by a militarized police force.

And in current news a FARKING WHITE Supremacist goes on a shooting rampage in Arizona, and cops took him down with a tazer, really I mean really !!... White lives matter #whitelivesmatter #whitedeservebenefitofdoubt

And he's a guy with SEVEN felonies, that out on the street not to mention he's a WHITE supremacist, yet if you have pot you probably still be in prison...LOL and guess who's usually thrown in jail for non violent drug use ... they definitely aren't the white people

And in Virginia police find the need to rough up a BLACK college student because he was a underage drinker trying to enter a bar...LOL

Like white kids don't underage drink in college... REALLY !!!

Yup AmeriKKKa :) ....lol
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Hehheeheheheheheee...right off with the insult. Note to self: make sure I have at least a fifth grade grasp of grammar and writing before calling someone "an" idiot. I never said Wilson knew of Brown's previous crime. He was walking in the middle of the street, but i guess if shoving someone is legal in your world than jaywalking is encouraged. Are you seriously going to defend what Brown did in that store? It sounds like he was raised by hot tempered criminal idiots who would beat up their own grandmother (I'm not making it up, check it out) and incite riots so the poor guy had little chance of not becoming a criminal. :wave: Brown knew he had committed a criminal act and that might have been what made him attack. Here's a little synopsis of the DOJ report:

Wilson neverthless had reason to believe that Brown, who was six feet, four inches tall and weighed nearly 300 pounds, meant him harm. Physical evidence and witness reports confirm that Brown punched Wilson in the face as the officer sat in his police SUV. Brown's DNA on Wilson's gun and the wound on Brown's thumb are consistent with Wilson's account that he drew his weapon in self-defense, that Brown grabbed it and tried to take control of it, and that Wilson fired at him during the struggle.

Brown took off at that point. Wilson could have let him go or waited for backup, but he testified that he believed Brown posed a threat to other officers and anyone else he might come across. Why Brown turned around after Wilson got out of his SUV remains hazy. But if Brown kept moving toward Wilson despite the officer's commands to stop, as Wilson and several other witnesses testified, it was reasonable for Wilson to worry what would happen after Brown closed the distance between them, even if Brown did not plan to renew his assault.

While standing in the street, Wilson fired 10 rounds, at least five of which struck Brown (in addition to one of the two rounds that Wilson fired in the SUV). Were all of those shots justified? Several witnesses said Wilson fired only when Brown was moving toward him, which is consistent with the pauses that can be heard on the audio recording. Medical testimony heard by the grand jury established that it was possible for Brown to keep moving until the final, fatal shot to his head.

Wilson reported that Brown "charged" him, and several witnesses used the same word.

Furthermore, the witnesses the DOJ deemed most credible all agreed that Brown was moving toward Wilson when he was shot—a point confirmed by the location of his body when he fell, coupled with blood found in two other places on the road.

But the 86-page DOJ report persuasively argues that the witnesses who challenged Wilson's account the most were the least credible because their stories changed over time, did not jibe with the physical evidence, or were admittedly false. The report lists eight witnesses whose testimony was "materially consistent with prior statements, physical evidence, and other witnesses" and "who corroborate that Wilson acted in self-defense." It lists nine "witnesses who neither inculpate nor fully corroborate Wilson," plus 24 "whose accounts do not support a prosecution due to materially inconsistent prior statements, or inconsistencies with the physical and forensic evidence." According to the DOJ, there are no witnesses "who inculpate Wilson" and whose testimony is "consistent with prior statements, physical evidence, and other witnesses."

It also makes a strong case that Wilson shot Brown based on a reasonable fear of death or serious injury, which is the standard for self-defense under Missouri law.

Read the report and come back here to tell me your thoughts. As far as asshole racist cops? Sure they exist. But assuming that every case starts with that bias is as bad as racism itself. Get the facts before forming an opinion. Also check out your city's shoving laws. I think you will be surprised. ;)

 
Grammar police....  maybe you should also check yours beforehand too.

Maybe its time we start putting cops in high school, they can get themselves hard and wet , at arresting all those shoving and pushing bullies

As for racist a**hole cops, the Ferguson PD/city council/courts was filled with them, what did Officer Wilson do, he was part of the problem not the solution.

Of course he could of mention all that to the DOJ, but you know that blue wall of silence is..well you know...

 
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So according to right wing republican mentality, gov't should stay out of businesses affairs and businesses/marketplaces/private sectors actually can solve issues that gov't can't

But yet you as a right winger mock a company/business/marketplace for trying to fix something government have not

Can there be more reason to hate and despise right wing republicans as hypocrites and basically political scum who don't stand for anything they say ?

 
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Starbucks is not going to fix anything. If they as a company want to have an honest discussion about race let's do it, but that's not what is going to happen. It's going to be another one-sided lecture by the social justice crew. 

 
Finger_Shocker said:
So according to right wing republican mentality, gov't should stay out of businesses affairs and businesses/marketplaces/private sectors actually can solve issues that gov't can't

But yet you as a right winger mock a company/business/marketplace for trying to fix something government have not

Can there be more reason to hate and despise right wing republicans as hypocrites and basically political scum who don't stand for anything they say ?
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Lighten up, Francis.

Any comments on how the Michael Brown shooting was probably justified self defense according to the evidence and testimony of eye witnesses? Are you shocked that it was not racially motivated?

 
Spokker said:
Starbucks is not going to fix anything. If they as a company want to have an honest discussion about race let's do it, but that's not what is going to happen. It's going to be another one-sided lecture by the social justice crew.
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LOL... so much for the republican idea of letting the private sectors sort anything out.

Ohhh ... social justice is such a bad thing, I guess social justice only matters when its righties who get abused or targeted by the gov't ( like the IRS ) ...lol

Bunch of hypocrites, just admit it justice is only for the whites rights... and spare us the I love/accept/respect/have friends people of color blah blah

 
egofed said:
Lighten up, Francis.

Any comments on how the Michael Brown shooting was probably justified self defense according to the evidence and testimony of eye witnesses? Are you shocked that it was not racially motivated?
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Justified return of force ... possibly

Justified execution/death... NO

If unarmed fight can be met with deadly force, I think all bullies in school deserved to be gunned down then too I suppose with that logic of yours

In order for a right winger, possibly racist, conservative, tea nut, to ever believe racism was a factor:

there must be 101 witness + 1000 cameras + 11 microphones + 50 media reporters + 12 leprechauns + 5 unicorns with a Judge and jury on present scene that witnesses the person making the overt racist act. If all the following are met, a UFO must also appear with a alien that confirm all the witnesses + God and Jesus make a special appearance to confirm it and the Pope must be present to acknowledge God and Jesus present.

Then just then a racist will possibly acknowledge a racist act has been committed otherwise its all heresy and bullshit and its all liberals fault, pushed by a radical muslim that was born under mysterious circumstances and raised by white folks like Clark Kent but he's black and he's likely mortal, and no superman or good guy ever comes in the non-white color.. blah blah blah

Right wing thinking and excuse :)

 
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Finger_Shocker said:
Justified return of force ... possibly

Justified execution/death... NO

If unarmed fight can be met with deadly force, I think all bullies in school deserved to be gunned down then too I suppose with that logic of yours

In order for a right winger, possibly racist, conservative, tea nut, to ever believe racism was a factor:
there must be 101 witness + 1000 cameras + 11 microphones + 50 media reporters + 12 leprechauns + 5 unicorns with a Judge and jury on present scene that witnesses the person making the overt racist act. If all the following are met, a UFO must also appear with a alien that confirm all the witnesses + God and Jesus make a special appearance to confirm it and the Pope must be present to acknowledge God and Jesus present.

Then just then a racist will possibly acknowledge a racist act has been committed otherwise its all heresy and bullshit and its all liberals fault, pushed by a radical muslim that was born under mysterious circumstances and raised by white folks like Clark Kent but he's black and he's likely mortal, and no superman or good guy ever comes in the non-white color.. blah blah blah

Right wing thinking and excuse :)
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You should never go full retard....
 
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/post-partisan/wp/2015/03/16/lesson-learned-from-the-shooting-of-michael-brown/

What DOJ found made me ill. Wilson knew about the theft of the cigarillos from the convenience store and had a description of the suspects. Brown fought with the officer and tried to take his gun. And the popular hands-up storyline, which isn’t corroborated by ballistic and DNA evidence and multiple witness statements, was perpetuated by Witness 101. In fact, just about everything said to the media by Witness 101, whom we all know as Dorian Johnson, the friend with Brown that day, was not supported by the evidence and other witness statements.

Now that black lives matter to everyone, it is imperative that we continue marching for and giving voice to those killed in racially charged incidents at the hands of police and others. But we must never allow ourselves to march under the banner of a false narrative on behalf of someone who would otherwise offend our sense of right and wrong. And when we discover that we have, we must acknowledge it, admit our error and keep on marching. That’s what I’ve done here.

If evidence and facts don't convince you, then I got nothing left.

 
The country is in an uproar over a single, unclear incident of possible racism when there's a plethora of well-supported scientific publications supporting the existence of racial bias and demonstrating its harmful effects. If people want to have a conversation about race, this is not the match to spark that fire. Social science findings should be.

There is no honest question about whether or not racism is still a problem in this country. It is. It's simply not the same racism from the 1960s and therefore it manifests differently.

The discussion should be about solving this well-documented problem, not arguing over individual instances that no one can truly weigh in on. At this point not even Darren Wilson can really say what influenced him in the moment over all of the fear, re-remembering, and gut reactions.

Focusing on examples like this stokes the flames on both sides and simply furthers polarization. It may make people more upset over racism but it supports racism too. I live on the other side of 270 from Ferguson and I've heard so many white people say horrible things about the situation Ferguson since this all began. Those with horrible views feel justified now...
 

I understand the rioting and the national media has downplayed the damage done by it, but I'm not sure how to de-escalate.

BTW: I would strongly recommend everyone read the DoJ's report.

 
Ego, the report found rampant systematic racism in Ferguson. Your response was to downplay it and compare it to taxation. Now you pretend to care.
 
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The only crutch the racists have is to blame Michael Brown for everything, especially the institutionalized racism that pervades American police departments and society.

Fine them all, if they can't pay the fine, go to jail. Bill them for the jail time. If they can't pay, jail 'em again.

 
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Question:

The DoJ obviously had no issue calling out Ferguson PD for a systematic and corrupt set of policies that target individuals of color. The DoJ didn't try to hide or sugarcoat anything, and the only way they could have been more clear is if they released a press release that said Ferguson PD is the modern day KKK or something.

...with that in mind, if Officer Wilson's actions were what some folks *still* believe, why did they clear him? The DoJ wasn't kind in their evaluation of Ferguson PD, so why shy away when it came to speaking the "truth" about Wilson's actions?
 
Reread this thread from the beginning. Let's see how many will come back and admit that they made an uninformed decision based on a false narrative and biased decision making. Better yet, let's see how many suffer from cognitive dissonance and will still say Wilson killed Brown in an unjustifiable shooting because he was black. My first post contained this sentence, "Anybody choosing sides yet, or are we all waiting for more facts?" Hopefully we will learn as a society from these cases. Get facts first, then protest/riot. :D/ Right now a lot of people should be hanging their heads low for supporting a thieving, violent, cop attacking piece of crap criminal. Aaaaahhhhh, it is nice to see the good guys win from time to time.....

 
The DoJ report actually explains where the false narratives about "execution" came from. The report refers to Dorian Johnson (Brown's friend) as Witness 101 and the source of it all. It goes over his inconsistent/false testimony and also describes some of what he did to help escalate this into what it's become, like how he gave media interviews spreading facts that he later contradicts when giving testimony (which was full of false information as well).

He ended up with a misdemeanor conviction for his dishonesty in it all (and I think that's only if they seek to pull that thread). Only a misdemeanor after spreading a false narrative that caused rioting and cost countless people their places of business and jobs! Awesome.

 
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The culture of bias, hate, racism permeated the Ferguson PD, and to say that Wilson wasn't influence by such a culture is a LIE.

The DOJ made it clear that the whole PD, court system, city council , was conspiring in a criminal fashion to extort people of minorities.  It was basically a city runned by white racists milking the minorities base to support their lavish paychecks and city spending.   If this was a private institution, wouldn't the FBI raid them like a organized criminal syndicate?

Face it the DOJ may have wrote a bad report but they failed to hold anyone accountable.  These were not only serious civil right abuses, the whole county was basically a criminal syndicate runned by RACISTS and their power was maintain by a RACIST police force who had authority to protect that status quo.

If you killed a extortionist who extorted you daily, I'm pretty sure self-defense would come into play.  But what happen when the extortionist is a GOV'T, do you suddenly lose your right to fight back if need? 

Didn't we go to war with the British gov't to win our freedom?  from the same type of tyranny 

Resignation = I'm just going to get a job somewhere else.

You know what happens now with these racist pigs that resigned????..... they now get to find different jobs at different places to spread their hate.   Areas that probably have no issue of racism now may hire one of these racists and they soon will fall to these beliefs that were carried to them.  

Resignation is like a cancer they just spread these people to infect their sickness elsewhere.

 
Police aren't racist.... you sure could fool me..  This is a NATIONWIDE problem

http://www.cnn.com/2015/03/21/us/fort-lauderdale-police-officers/index.html

LOL at resignation, now these racist cops get to find jobs elsewhere, just spreading the cancer !!!!

Institutionalized racism will never go away, racism is part of the police, they are all bad apples some bad apples just get to be made examples of ( ie fired/resign ) , but it won't ever change the culture

 
Finger_Shocker said:
The culture of bias, hate, racism permeated the Ferguson PD, and to say that Wilson wasn't influence by such a culture is a LIE.

The DOJ made it clear that the whole PD, court system, city council , was conspiring in a criminal fashion to extort people of minorities. It was basically a city runned by white racists milking the minorities base to support their lavish paychecks and city spending. If this was a private institution, wouldn't the FBI raid them like a organized criminal syndicate?

Face it the DOJ may have wrote a bad report but they failed to hold anyone accountable. These were not only serious civil right abuses, the whole county was basically a criminal syndicate runned by RACISTS and their power was maintain by a RACIST police force who had authority to protect that status quo.

If you killed a extortionist who extorted you daily, I'm pretty sure self-defense would come into play. But what happen when the extortionist is a GOV'T, do you suddenly lose your right to fight back if need?

Didn't we go to war with the British gov't to win our freedom? from the same type of tyranny

Resignation = I'm just going to get a job somewhere else.

You know what happens now with these racist pigs that resigned????..... they now get to find different jobs at different places to spread their hate. Areas that probably have no issue of racism now may hire one of these racists and they soon will fall to these beliefs that were carried to them.

Resignation is like a cancer they just spread these people to infect their sickness elsewhere.
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Wow, Ok, you convinced me. I hope they get all new people to runned their city.....

 
Just as a general reminder:

Finger_Shocker has made outright racist statements in this thread, clumping together groups of people (specifically, whites, republicans, and LEOs) while condemning those who do the same thing.  He refuses to take responsibility for his own actions, and has pretty much admitted to being arrested in the past.  Due to this, he is blind to any reasoning.  Arguing with him is a waste of time.

I had to return to the thread just to remind everyone of this.  Carry on.

 
Fearia said:
Just as a general reminder:

Finger_Shocker has made outright racist statements in this thread, clumping together groups of people (specifically, whites, republicans, and LEOs) while condemning those who do the same thing. He refuses to take responsibility for his own actions, and has pretty much admitted to being arrested in the past. Due to this, he is blind to any reasoning. Arguing with him is a waste of time.

I had to return to the thread just to remind everyone of this. Carry on.
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LOLZ

Yeah, let's make this about Finger_Shocker instead of the issue. That way, we don't have to talk about how the DOJ basically called that police department racist along with the entire judicial system there. I'm so glad that you're focusing on the more important issue to you: Finger_Shocker's tone.

 
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[quote name="dohdough" post="12584931" timestamp="1427027409"]LOLZ

Yeah, let's make this about Finger_Shocker instead of the issue. That way, we don't have to talk about how the DOJ basically called that police department racist along with the entire judicial system there. I'm so glad that you're focusing on the more important issue to you: Finger_Shocker's tone.[/quote]
What else is there to say that the report didn't highlight? Just because the department has some serious issues, that does not invalidate the shooting. Hell, the report outright clears Wilson. You know, despite what Finger_Shocker has to rant about.

Now, because one department has some serious issues, all police are bad and racist? I buy that about as much as I buy similar statements that someone like rebelschs would say about certain races.
 
Fearia said:
What else is there to say that the report didn't highlight? Just because the department has some serious issues, that does not invalidate the shooting. Hell, the report outright clears Wilson. You know, despite what Finger_Shocker has to rant about.

Now, because one department has some serious issues, all police are bad and racist? I buy that about as much as I buy similar statements that someone like rebelschs would say about certain races.
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Maybe for you to come out and say that the department is racist and fucked up would've been a good start. Like maybe that history has an effect on how certain parties act towards one another in certain situations. The fact that Wilson was cleared has nothing to do with his actions not being influenced by certain prejudices. He would've been cleared unless he was a known white supremacist or posting racial slurs and forwarding racist emails.

Having one department like this is one too many and I'd bet everything I own on it not being the only one or that it's merely a handful of departments like this.

 
dohdough said:
Maybe for you to come out and say that the department is racist and fucked up would've been a good start. Like maybe that history has an effect on how certain parties act towards one another in certain situations. The fact that Wilson was cleared has nothing to do with his actions not being influenced by certain prejudices. He would've been cleared unless he was a known white supremacist or posting racial slurs and forwarding racist emails.

Having one department like this is one too many and I'd bet everything I own on it not being the only one or that it's merely a handful of departments like this.
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Sorry, but I'm not here for lip service or to point out the obvious badness with that department.

The fact that Wilson was cleared has a lot to do with the fact that his actions were not seemingly influenced by certain prejudices. He was the center of the investigation. They looked over his record and previous interactions with a fine tooth comb. At the very least, they'd of brought him to trial if there was a doubt. But the fact is, Brown performed a strong armed robbery / assault just prior to the stop. He then attacked Wilson. Every piece of evidence supports this. Yet we still have people like Finger_Shocker saying "NOPE!". That was my original point.

I do find it odd though that despite the circumstances in Ferguson, it took the Department of Justice so long to make a case against Ferguson PD. There are organizations that deal exclusively with these sort of circumstances outside of the DOJ (like the NAACP) that are more than eager to look into these sort of allegations. What kept these groups from doing anything until the DOJ decided to get involved? The way the DOJ report comes off, every single person in the department was acting out of line non-stop. Wouldn't the case been easy for a group like the NAACP to profit off of then?

Either way, doesn't excuse those responsible, but it does leave me wondering.

 
Fearia said:
Sorry, but I'm not here for lip service or to point out the obvious badness with that department.

The fact that Wilson was cleared has a lot to do with the fact that his actions were not seemingly influenced by certain prejudices. He was the center of the investigation. They looked over his record and previous interactions with a fine tooth comb. At the very least, they'd of brought him to trial if there was a doubt. But the fact is, Brown performed a strong armed robbery / assault just prior to the stop. He then attacked Wilson. Every piece of evidence supports this. Yet we still have people like Finger_Shocker saying "NOPE!". That was my original point.

I do find it odd though that despite the circumstances in Ferguson, it took the Department of Justice so long to make a case against Ferguson PD. There are organizations that deal exclusively with these sort of circumstances outside of the DOJ (like the NAACP) that are more than eager to look into these sort of allegations. What kept these groups from doing anything until the DOJ decided to get involved? The way the DOJ report comes off, every single person in the department was acting out of line non-stop. Wouldn't the case been easy for a group like the NAACP to profit off of then?

Either way, doesn't excuse those responsible, but it does leave me wondering.
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The fact that Wilson was cleared means absolutely nothing. Did they bring ANY officers to court over civil rights violations? I rest my case.

The DOJ is notoriously slow and will only bring you to court if there's a 100% chance of you getting convicted. Even then, they don't always prosecute. Just look at their case against Joe Arpiao. Mountains of evidence of civil rights violations and corruption, but nada.

The Ferguson PD didn't operate in a vacuum: the judicial system and political apparatus were in collusion. An organization like the NAACP is impotent against that kind of power and can really only do grassroots organizing as they're organized around local chapters. No one really pays attention to them anyways and they're used as a right-wing boogeymen like ACORN was. There's nothing to wonder as they're not the ACLU.

 
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Fearia said:
What else is there to say that the report didn't highlight? Just because the department has some serious issues, that does not invalidate the shooting. Hell, the report outright clears Wilson. You know, despite what Finger_Shocker has to rant about.Now, because one department has some serious issues, all police are bad and racist? I buy that about as much as I buy similar statements that someone like rebelschs would say about certain races.
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I am sure more than one department would turn up the same or worse if investigated like that. Consider it a serious case study. Nice try misdirecting every one though.
 
Msut77 said:
I am sure more than one department would turn up the same or worse if investigated like that. Consider it a serious case study. Nice try misdirecting every one though.
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Biscuit, your reading comprehension is showing again. No misdirection was done. There's a big difference between "all cops are racist" and "there are problematic officers / departments". Nice try strawman-ing the argument though.

dohdough: I'm still a bit lost here. The NAACP or ACLU couldn't push for the DOJ to investigate Ferguson before, or come up with their own cases, because of local government collusion? I'd think that collusion would make it easier for civil rights violations to be apparent. Especially considering how blatant they were according to the DOJ report. In other cases, I've watched groups similar to these civil rights groups push forward lawsuits and win big time. It really throws me that this went unchecked as it was.

I would be curious to see a report on how that managed to happen so that it could be avoided again in the future.

 
Fearia said:
dohdough: I'm still a bit lost here. The NAACP or ACLU couldn't push for the DOJ to investigate Ferguson before, or come up with their own cases, because of local government collusion? I'd think that collusion would make it easier for civil rights violations to be apparent. Especially considering how blatant they were according to the DOJ report. In other cases, I've watched groups similar to these civil rights groups push forward lawsuits and win big time. It really throws me that this went unchecked as it was.

I would be curious to see a report on how that managed to happen so that it could be avoided again in the future.
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I'm sure the local NAACP chapter, if there was one, doesn't have the resources or network of the entire organization at their disposal at any given time. It would also depend on the local branch of the ACLU to allocate necessary resources to that case when they're working on other cases at the same time.

Winning large settlements from the city is one thing; having a feds step in and reform a department is another. Settlements are just the cost of business these days. You must have some seriously tinted glasses on if you're surprised at the report. I don't even know how many posts I've made to the effect of this department having major issues long before the report came out. Your reply to those posts? That they were not a sign of racism and they're just doing their job by going where most crimes are commited.

Dismiss Msut77 if you want, but he has very valid points about many departments having similar or worse issues and that you're directing a lot of your ire towards Finger_Shocker. Like I've said before, you could just as easily ignore F_S as you do rebel. It's not a stawman if you're doing exactly what he's saying you're doing and at no point did Msut77 make the argument you accusing him of.

That said, I agree that this needs to be further investigated. I'd imagine that most reasonable people would too. Chances of that happening are slim to none though. You can fill in the blanks as for the reasons why.

 
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Unlike Fearia and the rest of the right wing known racists,

Fearia accuses me of being painting a board stroke against police??? Considering not only has he condone numerous police misconduct he even defended some of them..  So the question is why would a person who supposedly claims he's a good guy defend and condone bad ones, because he is a BAD ONE too.  Which continues to prove my point that there is no good cop out there, they are all bad just some worst then the other.

So here is a good joke if not albeit true:  How do you know the cop you are dealing with is a good or bad one?....  It depends on the DAY... LOL

I will let the facts speak for themselves

Apparently racism isn't a nationwide police issue... Oh good farking me, these must be just those random out of the blue ( get it blue ( as in police blue ) .. )  "ISOLATED" cases.

http://abc7news.com/news/former-sfpd-officer-sentenced-for-conspiracy-fraud/531207/    ( so this guy was a racist and a corrupt cop to boot... wow you don't say ... looks like racism and corruption goes hand in hand )

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2015/03/17/393664771/more-sf-police-officers-accused-of-sending-racist-texts

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-racist-police-text-messages-review-20150317-story.html

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/22/cops-fired-racist-video_n_6918652.html

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/racist-sentenced-57-months-prison-slurs-false-arrest-beating-victim-article-1.1100861

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/23/nyregion/racist-posts-tied-to-west-indian-parade-bring-police-dept-discipline.html?_r=0

From a former cop POV:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/12/06/i-was-a-st-louis-cop-my-peers-were-racist-and-violent-and-theres-only-one-fix/

FBI report:   "Everyone is a LITTLE BIT racist"   .... would you be worried about that crazy white man down the street who make racist remarks or would you be WORRIED if the person who hold racist views wears a BADGE and have the power to TAKE AWAY YOUR LIFE?

http://www.thenation.com/blog/198009/fbi-director-police-violence-everyones-little-bit-racist

 
Finger_Shocker said:
Unlike Fearia and the rest of the right wing known racists,

Fearia accuses me of being painting a board stroke against police??? Considering not only has he condone numerous police misconduct he even defended some of them.. So the question is why would a person who supposedly claims he's a good guy defend and condone bad ones, because he is a BAD ONE too. Which continues to prove my point that there is no good cop out there, they are all bad just some worst then the other.

So here is a good joke if not albeit true: How do you know the cop you are dealing with is a good or bad one?.... It depends on the DAY... LOL

I will let the facts speak for themselves

Apparently racism isn't a nationwide police issue... Oh good farking me, these must be just those random out of the blue ( get it blue ( as in police blue ) .. ) "ISOLATED" cases.

http://abc7news.com/news/former-sfpd-officer-sentenced-for-conspiracy-fraud/531207/ ( so this guy was a racist and a corrupt cop to boot... wow you don't say ... looks like racism and corruption goes hand in hand )

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2015/03/17/393664771/more-sf-police-officers-accused-of-sending-racist-texts

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-racist-police-text-messages-review-20150317-story.html

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/22/cops-fired-racist-video_n_6918652.html

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/racist-sentenced-57-months-prison-slurs-false-arrest-beating-victim-article-1.1100861

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/23/nyregion/racist-posts-tied-to-west-indian-parade-bring-police-dept-discipline.html?_r=0

From a former cop POV:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/posteverything/wp/2014/12/06/i-was-a-st-louis-cop-my-peers-were-racist-and-violent-and-theres-only-one-fix/

FBI report: "Everyone is a LITTLE BIT racist" .... would you be worried about that crazy white man down the street who make racist remarks or would you be WORRIED if the person who hold racist views wears a BADGE and have the power to TAKE AWAY YOUR LIFE?

http://www.thenation.com/blog/198009/fbi-director-police-violence-everyones-little-bit-racist
Click to expand...
So, let's just get things straight:

I've defended the actions of LEOs who have later been cleared of any wrongdoing. And for that, I'm wrong? Wow. So, all LEOs are guilty untill proven not guilty . . . and then they're still guilty.

You're racist. Blatantly so. Talking about misdirection . . . the racist calling others racist!

Then, to illustrate your point, you post links to racist cops. No one is denying that they exist. But are the MAJORITY racist? Despite your claims, no.

Either way, it's time for me to duck out again and be a voyeur. Once again, I'm reminded that arguing with some people isn't worth the time.

 
egofed said:
Wow, Ok, you convinced me. I hope they get all new people to runned their city.....
Click to expand...
The reason the DOJ our gov't won't do the right thing and won't hold anyone accountable is because having a BAD RACIST gov't is better then having none.

Prime example is look at Iraq and Afghanistan, look at those corrupt leaders we installed, better to have bad leaders then to have no leaders right... Just like its better to have a bad and stable Saudi Arabia then to have no Saudi Arabia even tho they did sent us their 9/11 hijackers :)

Once you understand how our gov't works you will understand why Ferguson remains unchanged and won't change and why our gov't won't take the RIGHT steps to fix it .

The only way Ferguson will change their ways is if ISIS take a foothold, ISIS is a by-product of corrupt gov't, so Ferguson might be a good place for action before the gov't will take notice.

 
Excuse Fearia for not being up with current events these couple of days with all the racist cops is the news spanning from VA to FL to San Francisco 

 
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Fearia said:
So, let's just get things straight:

I've defended the actions of LEOs who have later been cleared of any wrongdoing. And for that, I'm wrong? Wow. So, all LEOs are guilty untill proven not guilty . . . and then they're still guilty.

You're racist. Blatantly so. Talking about misdirection . . . the racist calling others racist!

Then, to illustrate your point, you post links to racist cops. No one is denying that they exist. But are the MAJORITY racist? Despite your claims, no.

Either way, it's time for me to duck out again and be a voyeur. Once again, I'm reminded that arguing with some people isn't worth the time.
Click to expand...
I post link to ILLUSTRATE PROOF , something which you continue to harp that are just "isolated" issues. If you want to misdirect others with false statements, I have the right to dispute your false misleading statements with PROOF that contradict you.

You can't lie or deny or be blind against PROOF, if you want to misdirect others to believing cops are all good, I have every right to show PROOF all cops are bad, cops that turn a blind eye or won't report corruption are in fact corrupt.

There is a law on that it is called ACCESSORY

If you go into a store and your friend robs it and kill the owner you are held to the same responsibility as he/she is. No different then how I see a institution like that of the police.

And Fugerson PD was a corrupt organization the exact same as the MOB/Drug cartel/Organized gangs , yet the DOJ won't hold them the same... Cause its a LEO system protecting the LEO system. The DOJ won't dare go against a system of their own, and since they can't hold people individually accountable without hold the system as a whole, they chose not to hold anyone accountable.

 
The problems lie so much deeper then "the man" or "the system" being racist and it sickens me that those are the first lines of thought by so many as to why so many more struggle.

You can call me racist all you want, and I'll shrug it off, but the reality is many struggle with the simple concept of accountability and it appears that with each passing generation young men and women have less and less of it.

Throw out the statistics if you please (i.e. black men representing a fraction of the population but compromising the majority of those incarcerated for violent crimes) but you can't deny their are certain problems culturally within these communities.

And who is to blame? Is it the "white" "right" media that is pumping out stories and making black culture look violent? It seems to me that it is the black media and entertainment industry that likes to hype up this image for its own profit. If anything the "left" media does it's best to hide this.

And we can talk about racist police (more articles please /sarcasm) but racist police don't force black men to commit violent acts. They can harass and be racist all they want but they aren't forcing the rapes robberies and homicides. The legal system can tip the scales and hand out sentences that are more harsh but again----that is de facto.

The problem is everyone wants to ignore "the problem" after the fact and instead rally around a dozen or so events each year that fit their race baiting agenda and throw out straw mans like "Just because you're a felon/commit a crime doesn't mean you deserve to be killed trolololololololollolololololol"

I too dislike police. I would venture to say I've most likely got a longer criminal record than anyone posting on here and for a handful of years in my teens and early twenties I blamed everyone BUT myself for the trouble I got into and you know----that solved nothing.

I spend time in these communities and I work(ed) with people from these communities and it's not a problem that is unique to just one skin color but lets be honest, for the most part inner city poverty is VISIBLY a minority issue. Just like early day settlers migrated towards the ocean (i.e. port citys) modern day poor minorities migrate towards metropolitan areas (which is crazy within itself since these are statistically the most expensive places in the world to live---but let's be honest... they are hubs for left leaning politicians).

Finger_Shocker said:
Excuse Fearia for not being up with current events these couple of days with all the racist cops is the news spanning from VA to FL to San Francisco
Click to expand...
Let's ignore the fact that underage kids aren't suppose to be drinking let alone intoxicated and throw out more straw man like "doesn't mean you should get rufffffffffed up"----as if this same shit doesn't happen to hundreds if not THOUSANDS of white college kids every single weekend across college campuses.

And let's rally and be ignorant and storm out when like children when you're given an audience in what I consider to be a pretty reasonable time frame.

But what is your solution? Less cops? Less white cops? No cops?

 
Edit:

Finger_Shocker said:
I post link to ILLUSTRATE PROOF , something which you continue to harp that are just "isolated" issues. If you want to misdirect others with false statements, I have the right to dispute your false misleading statements with PROOF that contradict you.

You can't lie or deny or be blind against PROOF, if you want to misdirect others to believing cops are all good, I have every right to show PROOF all cops are bad, cops that turn a blind eye or won't report corruption are in fact corrupt.

There is a law on that it is called ACCESSORY

If you go into a store and your friend robs it and kill the owner you are held to the same responsibility as he/she is. No different then how I see a institution like that of the police.
Click to expand...
Absolutely full retard.

You saying "all cops are bad" (^it's there... don't deny it) shows your bias and lack of intellect. No one, not once, has said all cops are good.

Edit 2: Furthermore it is that type of attitude which is EXTREMELY dangerous to the youth as it is more and more prevalent today especially in the communities that should be leaning on the police for help. If you teach a kid, of any color, to distrust the police then they are more likely to act in defiance or the very least erratic as compared to normal behavior when questioned and that is going to put the police on edge. It's a very dangerous double edged sword.

But I'm going to guess you have a strong distrust for teachers, politicians, your boss (are you even employed?)---basically anyone with any type of authority or power.

 
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GBAstar said:
Edit:

Absolutely full retard.

You saying "all cops are bad" (^it's there... don't deny it) shows your bias and lack of intellect. No one, not once, has said all cops are good.
Click to expand...
LOL way to pick out part of my statement

I have every right to show PROOF all cops are bad, cops that turn a blind eye or won't report corruption are in fact corrupt.

Here is the full statement

Plus using the LAW in order to make such a argument

There is a law on that it is called ACCESSORY

If you go into a store and your friend robs it and kill the owner you are held to the same responsibility as he/she is. No different then how I see a institution like that of the police.

Leave it to a typical right winger conservative to pick and nitpick only certain things and not take the WHOLE argument and argue against that

If you argue the full argument you LOSE, if you want to argue over one word or part of a word you WIN.. I however won't stoop to the pathetic ways right conservative try to win their arguments on

 
^ Are you employed?

Is there any type of authority you respect?

Are there good cops? If so... give me a percentage that you think represent the interests of EVERYONE within the communities that they serve.

I'm tired of playing semantics with you. All you do is deflect, type out poorly constructed arguments, deflect some more, link to shitty articles, deflect again, dodge, and end with more deflection.

I didn't edit or take what you said out of context. You said that if he was trying to make all cops look good (which he nor anyone else had ever said in this thread) then you had every right to make every cop look bad. If you don't believe all cops are bad then go on record with saying such.

Or... in typical fashion you could rant out another half dozen barely coherent posts that don't address anything other then you're fucked up view on authority.

Then I look forward to a three sentence or less rabble rabble rabble from Mr. Passive Aggressive.

 
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ITT: Lots of goal post moving.

When it turns out that the DoJ clears Wilson, folks quickly act as it was never about him to begin with.
 
The DOJ did not clear Wilson ,  it merely stated that their was no evidence they would hold Wilson fully accountable..

People get away with murder all the time.

Of course to certain people Wilson is totally innocent because he was cleared by the DOJ, yet the same people will never accept the same verdict when its someone they dislike partisan wise...

Just hacks and more hacks

 
DOJ clears Wilson but excoriates Ferguson police


DOJ clears Darren Wilson in Michael Brown killing


Darren Wilson Cleared in Justice Department Probe


Officer Darren Wilson cleared by the Justice Department


Justice Department clears Darren Wilson in Michael Brown killing

Mind you "Clear" isn't full-on legal jargon, but I'd say everyone is pretty much in agreement here.

(by the way, those were the first five results in my Google search for "DOJ WILSON". You'll note that none of them are FOX, and even I'm a little surprised at the first one (which is the only one to mention the more important findings of the report in the title)..
 
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